Off Base In Uniform Hours After Close of Business (COB)? Epidemic?

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 00:00:39 -0500

After coming back from deployment I don't know if I am being too harsh or if I have just become overly military minded but, everywhere I go I am seeing soldiers, lower enlisted to senior enlisted and officer grades alike, everywhere in their uniforms. At first seeing people at Wal-Mart and at fast food restaurants wasn't a big deal but, I have started to see soldiers at the mall (20-30min drive from post) and even a few coming out of the movie theaters!? The soldier in me wants me to pull that person aside and ask why they are still in uniform regardless of rank but, so far I have left it alone mainly because most are with family or multiple people and calling them out feels a little over the top. Is this a big problem where you are stationed? What do you think should be said to these soldiers if anything? <div><br><div>If you feel that this is a good/reasonable post please vote it up and give me your honest opinions thanks!</div><div>***UPDATE*** Made my first correction tonight!!! With great TACT may I add.</div><div>This took place at the Wal-Mart off of Wilma Rudolph around 2130.</div><div><br></div><div>I walked past this sergeant (E-5) and knew I had to say something, I asked him if he was off duty and he said yes he was, soo I said, okay well I work at Division and we are not allowed to wear our uniforms after duty hours, I don't know your situation but it is almost 2200 and I do not believe this is authorized.</div><div>He smirked and kind of chuckled and said well I need a few groceries then I am headed to the house. I said roger that sergeant I didn't know if you were new to Campbell or something so this was just a professional courtesy have a good night and he didn't reply. </div><div><br></div><div>Then I walked off and snapped this picture</div></div>

Response by SSG Alexander Hoffman made Feb 22 at 2014 12:06 AM

SSG Alexander Hoffman — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 00:06:27 -0500

I think we need an Army-wide regulation or message addressing this issue. You ask if it's a big problem where we are stationed, but many posts have little to no regulation on off-post wear of utility or PT uniform. I think the LONG overdue update of Army Reg 670-1 should address this and many other topics usually covered in local policy.

Response by SPC Dan Goforth made Feb 22 at 2014 12:28 AM

SPC Dan Goforth — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 00:28:16 -0500

SSG Hoffman said it well.  AR 670-1 covers some situations, but is pretty vague about others.  When I was last at Carson, it was put out not to wear your uniform to off-post businesses after duty hours, except for any quick errands en route home (gas station, loaf of bread, etc.)  Things that were a matter of in, out and gone.  I still live by that rule, even though the only official word for Presidio of Monterey is that ASUs are mandatory for Phase V IET soldiers going off post.  I see no reason to wear my work clothes after work for extended hours.  

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2014 12:35 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 00:35:32 -0500

I worked all three shifts each 7 days, so I wonder if I would have went off-base that that would be wrong? Of course I am old. So old that I was there when the first dinosaur began cutting teeth. So old I have a scrapbook of the Big Bang.

Response by SSgt Gregory Guina made Feb 22 at 2014 1:07 AM

SSgt Gregory Guina — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 01:07:06 -0500

Can always rock it like the Marines.  No Cammies anywhere off base (maybe getting gas is OK) at any time.<br>

Response by SFC Randy Purham made Feb 22 at 2014 1:17 AM

SFC Randy Purham — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 01:17:06 -0500

I personally don't see an issue with wearing the uniform anytime after duty hours. I got it what the reg says, but to me t boils down to 2 things: 1) Having pride in wearing the uniform. No need in rushing home to change your uniform just to go grocery shopping, to me its silly. 2) Perk of the uniform - meaning, how many places you have gone and gotten recognition or discounts for just being in uniform? A lot of people take advantage of this as cost saving mechanisms for their budget. Whether its wrong or not, I really don't have an opinion on that. It is what it is. So, in summary, no. wearing the uniform after duty hours should not be an issue nor should it be addressed. Different strokes for different folks and circumstances vary in every case.

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2014 2:11 AM

SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 02:11:05 -0500

As a general rule, I try not to wear it after hours. Then again, I live close enough that swinging home is pretty convenient for me. (and always keep a change of clothes in the car) I remember the shooting at the Frankfurt airport and the sweeping changes that hit USAREUR as a result. We were not allowed to commute to and from work in uniform and had to remove all installation decals and obvious military affiliation decals, stickers and such from our vehicles.

Though a bit off topic, is also worth mentioning that even here in the States, there are people targeting us. From my own experience: Not too long ago, I was traveling in a GOV along the highway when another vehicle tried to get me to pull over. He even flashed an ID card. Eventually he ran me off the road and tried to demand my TC and I exit the vehicle. Obviously that didn't happen. Upon getting back on the roadway, he followed me for over 50 miles until we were able to link up with the CHP. Why were we targeted? Because we had military plates. Sometimes, its our own out to get us.

Regardless of right or wrong, OPSEC is key.

Response by SGT Timothy Coleman made Feb 22 at 2014 2:57 AM

SGT Timothy Coleman — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 02:57:26 -0500

<span style="color: rgb(77, 77, 77); font-size: 12px;">I personally believe that the camo uniform in any branch should not be worn off post unless you are getting gas at the bank, at the ER, or going home. That's just me though. I actually have corrected soldiers on this issue.</span>

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2014 4:07 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 04:07:59 -0500

There are regulations published on many things, perhaps on almost everything! We cannot expect our every move to be dictated or prescribed via regulation! There are leaders in place for a reason, therefore an inherent responsibility for leaders at every level to enforce regulation, make policy in the form of written and verbal notifications/correspondence, etc. There is a leadership aspect involved and there are interpretations to be made as well. Leaders don't need the regulation to point out every detail in text. Nor should anyone want that to happen! That is asinine. Also, there is an element of personal responsibility. Not everyone in the military values leadership, nor does everyone have the same level of rank, responsibility. Point being that it all depends on character and what everyone else is wiling to allow!

Yes, people are wrong and should be called on there actions when they are clearly not upholding the regulation or bringing discredit upon the uniform. A great example would be---At Wal-Mart at 1900 hours in uniform, sitting with your boots and shock removed while getting a pedicure with your cart full of groceries standing near by the nail salon. Could it not wait? Where you just itching to get your toes done? Was your home too far away to drive to change clothes? Could you have not brought your change of clothes with you? ----countless questions could be drawn and feelings could get hurt. (This could apply to any gender or rank!)

Maybe this isn't the best example, however let's pretend that the person at Wal-Mart had a bad day and their supervisor told them they need to leave directly after duty with instructions to take care of their business and then go home to relax. They have kids and they need food to feed them of course! So they head over to Wal-Mart to get the groceries, however they really feel passionate about trying to calm their nerves. So they say, "I need 15-20 minutes to myself before I go back into the fire at home!" If a leader or anyone for that matter approaches them without striking up a conversation. What will happen? Will they embarrass them? Will they be willing to listen? Will they make the situation worse and cause more stress to occur?

It could have all been prevented by having the correct systems in place and leaders that care enough about a service member for them to know that they shouldn't have been doing that in uniform in the first place! So who is really to blame?

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2014 8:37 AM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 08:37:45 -0500

SPC Gamble,<div><br></div><div>Fort Campbell Blue Book dated 2012 states-</div><div><br></div><div>ACUs will not be worn in off post establishments (shopping malls, WalMart, etc.) after normal duty hours (1900) unless the duty day has been extended by special duty. Quick stops can be made after completion of duty for necessity stops only.</div><div><br></div><div>I encourage you as a concerned Soldier to stop and address the issue when you see it. Get their names and their unit. Gives the info to your 1SG or CSM. I know they will act on the information. Stopping in Walmart to get some items are ok but movie theater? HELL NO! That is pure laziness and unprofessional!</div>

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2014 10:16 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 10:16:19 -0500

SPC Gamble, you are a future Sr. NCO in the making.  This is an epidemic that most Soldier's don't see/nor understand.  On top of what you stated this is also an OPSEC concern.  We should all be cognizant and ensure our Soldier's are doing the right thing.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2014 10:28 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 10:28:01 -0500

This is so wrong, my last duty station Ft Hood had courtesy patrol just for these Soldiers. You should get off work and go home and change if you are going to the movies. I can understand going to get food for the family or gas, and Wal-Mart is a little far for me since most of us don't just go in Wal-Mart to get a few things we end up spending some time in there. I suggest that the next time you see this you stop and use tact and inform them that they are out of regulation and if needed get their unit and 1SG name.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2014 3:33 PM

CSM Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Feb 2014 15:33:11 -0500

Most installations have some sort of Blue Book or standards.  Drum, Wainwright, etc after 1900 you are wrong.  I stopped one here in Alaska last night and kicked him out of a jewelry store at 2030.  Some just don't know because they didn't read the book, their leadership doesn't tell them, or in the case of the SGT last night, he knew, but did it anyways, because his anniversary was today.  I told him he knew 365 days in advance that his anniversary was the next day, and it was not a valid excuse.  But regardless of the published rules, there are those out there who will not be in compliance for one reason or another.  If you grab a name and unit, I guarantee you, a Sergeant Major will hem them up. 

Response by GySgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 23 at 2014 4:09 AM

GySgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 04:09:39 -0500

I am glad the Corps does not allow it, I think wearing utilities out in public doent look good, dress and service uniforms, yes. Knowing you all can go out in your camis and grab chow and I cant, I always ask "bring me back some chow!"

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 23 at 2014 9:00 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 09:00:09 -0500

A lot of you have different takes on this, but I encourage you if you are going to make the correction to make it tactfully. I love nothing more than a SPC who tries to correct me when they are off duty and I am still working. Normally because the lower enlisted Soldier approaches me with this "let me correct the senior NCO attitude" in front of his buddies and normally I make him look like an idiot for not knowing that as a recruiter I am not always afforded the luxury of working 9-5 Monday through Friday. I spend a lot of my time in ACUs and ASUs in a lot of different places, obviously not ones that primarily sell alcohol because one I can't recruit people who are drunk and two I prefer drinking in the comforts of my living room. By being a professional in my uniform at all times at places I frequent, people know that when they want to talk about the Army, then they need to find me. <div><br></div><div>For that one if you that wants to talk about how when you were a recruiter, you were always in Class A/B uniform, the times have changed. We wear different uniforms for different functions, but the ACU is the primary duty uniform.</div><div><br></div><div>So tread lightly when you do on the spot corrections and make sure you are armed with the information to correctly make the correction without embarrassing yourself. Because just as quickly as you are to correct me and ask what unit I am part of, I will do the same to you and inform your superiors of your tact or lack thereof.</div>

Response by MSG Gene Potocki made Feb 23 at 2014 11:04 PM

MSG Gene Potocki — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 23:04:57 -0500

When MG William Hartzog was the CG of Fort Riley / 1st ID (91-93) he encouraged the wear of the uniform off post to create an environment of we are all one. Not us verse them in the local communities surrounding Fort Riley. This was also the time when Riley was trying to expand. Later CG's Robles, House continued this policy.

Don't know if this was good or bad idea as I had just come from 3/75. Where you went from the unit to your off-post quarters with no stop except for gas if needed.

They also had BRO time (Big Red One) early release from duty on Thursdays.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 23 at 2014 11:16 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 23 Feb 2014 23:16:54 -0500

SPC Gamble, as cheesy as it sounds, you are the future of the Army and NCO Corps. You should say something if it is wrong using tact and keeping your military bearing. Letting things like this go on knowing it's wrong is what builds toxic leadership. I dont know the regs for Campbell, but here in USARAK, our blue book states 1900 is the cut off for the class c uniform off post. However, you still see Soldiers in PTs, ACUs, ASUs off post on weekends, 2100, and in McDonalds. Why attract more attention to yourself then needed? I understand getting essential items or gas, but wearing your uniform for no reason at the movies, or the club, etc is just and epidemic. It's a problem here in Alaska that we as leaders enforce all over, however still is an issue as Im sure it is for many different post.

My personal opinion is this....going off post for lunch, or after COB to get a few things is acceptable in my book. However, cruising the mall, going to the movies, dining in Applebee's of other restaurants in uniform after the cut off time is just asking for attention that isn't needed. That uniform you wear, you represent yourself and the U.S. Army as a whole however the public just see's "Soldiers" are out of control when something happens instead of the individual. This problem can be stopped with the great influence of leadership, mentoring, and guidance because your Soldiers are a direct reflection of their leadership. So if leaders are informing there Soldiers that it's wrong and setting the example, than hopefully the Soldier will see this an reflect off of it. Again this is just my opinion.

Response by MSG Gene Potocki made Feb 24 at 2014 10:04 AM

MSG Gene Potocki — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 10:04:42 -0500

I've read a lot of the responses. Back prior to 9/11 this may have been a big issue. Nowadays how many Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, or Marines do you see traveling through the airports of this great nation going on leave from "Basic" or on mid-tour leave. Very rarely do you see a service member wearing dress uniform when traveling.<div><br></div><div>some people are throwing the "OPSEC" card. Really if they wanted to target service members they would just have to watch the normal everyday activities in any town located next to a base to determine the best possible "target" to attack the service members</div><div><br></div><div>It's not about the wearing of the uniform you should worry about. It's should be how your "people" conduct themselves in public when the are off-post. if they act an ass  weather in uniform or not it's still going to carry the same weight with the locals all service members are "asses" or "role models". </div>

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 24 at 2014 10:05 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 10:05:22 -0500

Although I do not like wearing my uniform when I get off, sometimes the wife will call and ask to meet for dinner, a quick trip to the mall, or such. Even though you do not like there is nothing against regs to say I have to be in civilians to go off base.

Response by SPC Christopher Smith made Feb 24 at 2014 10:55 AM

SPC Christopher Smith — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 10:55:12 -0500

I do not see anything wrong with wearing the "work" uniform (ACU, cammies, etc) for the purpose of pride and depending on where you are stationed. Currently I am stationed at Ft Detrick, one of the Army's hidden gems, it does not have a chow hall, and only a small PX with Subway, and Burger King, include the Commensarry and those are your food options. Personnel up and down the rank structure here go off post for lunch, and because we have many 24 hour locations dinner in their "work" uniform. The better part of this is Ft. Detrick also houses Navy, Marines, Air Force. They all go eat off post in uniform as well. No one is attempting to get free stuff, no one is attempting to be a bad ass. Everyone is attempting to get something to eat and get back to work as quickly as possible.

After hours (CoB) I see the masses say it is wrong. Unless someone is just doing wrong, why is it unprofessional that we are not hard nosed killers all the time? I have not done it, but if i went to the movies and dinner with my family, it shows I have pride in what i do, and I am a caring family man. To those preaching OPSEC, trust me, if someone wanted to follow because they thought you were a valid target they'd follow you from base.

Response by SFC Stephen P. made Feb 24 at 2014 11:24 AM

SFC Stephen P. — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 11:24:35 -0500

I've seen no regulation applicable to me that prohibits wear of the ACU after COB. In fact, all the guidance I have received encourages wear of the uniform. Do yourself a favor and check the SSI before you make any on the spot corrections; command policies do not apply outside the command.

Before I can consider it a widespread problem, you'll first have to convince me that it is a problem at all. It doesn't make economic or ecological sense to spend an extra hour driving home, changing clothes, then driving back to the store when I could just swing by on the way out. The OPSEC concern is quite insignificant CONUS. The only reason I can see for such a prohibition to be issued is if the commander is embarrassed by his troops.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 24 at 2014 11:25 AM

SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 11:25:02 -0500

<p>Ladies and Gentlemen, </p><p> </p><p>I think it is a big deal, but I don't think that "on the spot correction (OTSC)" will work. If you were to do OTSC, you would be making them everyday for days on in. It begins with the Command. Just like SHARP, EO, and other programs, and standard implementation, it needs to brought to the commands attention first. I say that to say, you have Company Commanders, and Senior NCO's of strong influence commiting these acts. It is sad to say but, if it is not on the radar of Senior Command (Installation Commanders and Command Sergeant Majors) then there will be no effort to enforce that standard.</p>

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 24 at 2014 12:36 PM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 12:36:32 -0500

Personally I don't see a huge issue with being in uniform to go to Walmart after work to pick up a few quick qrocery items on the way home or even having a bite to eat at a restaurant with family after work, but I have a problem with people going to the movies in uniform or walking around the mall. That's not to say I have never done so. I have picked up some jewelry at the mall for my girlfriend's birthday, but it was paid for in advance so my stop was quick.

It's a hard decision to make when it comes to approaching the person you see in uniform. I have always looked at it like this: Are they acting the fool or in a manner that would embarrass the Armed Forces? If yes then say something. If no and they're just minding their own business then let them be. There is a good chance that approaching them in a public place about your disagreement with them being in uniform will lead to a not so friendly encounter which could then escalate into an embarrassing moment for all involved.

Response by SGT Ben Keen made Feb 24 at 2014 12:38 PM

SGT Ben Keen — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 12:38:02 -0500

One would think that between all the training, deployments and everything going on when you have no other choice but to wear your uniform that service members would be looking for an excuse to not be wearing their uniform. While I agree you should have pride in your uniform but just like texting in the movies; there is a proper time and place for you to wear your uniform and the movie theater just isn't one of them.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Feb 24 at 2014 12:48 PM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 12:48:37 -0500

Alright, well, easy fix. No more civilian attire. The only authorized attire for off duty time is Service A's/ASU's! =)

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 24 at 2014 4:56 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 16:56:30 -0500

SPC Gamble, as far as the ACU is concerned, AR670-1 doesnt necessarily prohibit wearing it outside of duty hours.

3–3. Occasions for wear

a. Soldiers may wear BDUs on duty when prescribed by the commander. Soldiers may wear BDUs off post unless

prohibited by the commander. They may not wear BDUs for commercial travel, unless authorized by para 1–10c of this

regulation. Personnel may not wear BDUs in establishments that primarily sell alcohol. If the establishment sells

alcohol and food, soldiers may not wear utility uniforms if their activities in the establishment center on drinking

alcohol only.

b. Utility uniforms are not normally considered appropriate for social or official functions off the installation, such

as memorial services and funerals. These uniforms are issued as utility, field, training, or combat uniforms and are not

intended for wear as all-purpose uniforms when other uniforms are more appropriate.

I would think that movie theaters would be considered a social function, so I don t think anyone would have given you flak for correcting them. However, just remember the Army has eyes everywhere. You never know when CSM will pop out from behind a corner and do an on the spot correction.

Just remember, stay in your lane, correct your battle buddy, and do what your rank can afford.

Response by MAJ Dick Blair made Feb 24 at 2014 9:43 PM

MAJ Dick Blair — Mon, 24 Feb 2014 21:43:52 -0500

There was a time when my command did not want us to wear our uniforms off post, but that changed and they encouraged us to travel in our uniform in part to better relations with the public. It that's what they wanted me to do, I did it. If they would have changed their minds and ask us not to, then I would have no qualms doing it either.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 25 at 2014 3:57 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 25 Feb 2014 03:57:05 -0500

Yes, it's allowed. However, it's in poor taste. I change when off duty at the first possible moment.

Response by CMC Robert Young made Feb 25 at 2014 1:12 PM

CMC Robert Young — Tue, 25 Feb 2014 13:12:03 -0500

SPC Gamble, I'm not certain of the current Army regulations, but when dad (God rest him) was still serving, the only uniforms authorized off base were dress uniforms, and then not for making your monthly grocery run.

The Coast Guard I joined required us to transit to and from work in our Trops (summer dress) or Bravos (winter dress) and utilities were worn only on base or when underway. The rules have been relaxed to allow stops for gas, fast food and the like, but people started "expanding" the number of acceptable locations from the very beginning. Personally, I like to see all of us go the US Marine standards; utilizes are never worn off the base. There is never any question about their professionalism.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2014 2:55 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 27 Feb 2014 02:55:44 -0500

Hey Battle, you're spot on to make those corrections.
Having that "Monterey Mindset" that was engraved into each of us, the primary concern I think of is OPSEC. But it opens the door for all kinds of mischief.
Definitely understand some stops being necessary, But like you pointed out the movie theater and leisure stops is just flat out lazy, and creates an unprofessional light for the Uniform to be seen in.

Again, Spot on.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2014 11:25 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 27 Feb 2014 11:25:52 -0500

Before we jump to conclusions, we do not know this person and he could possibly be on a soft shoe profile. He does have on the right socks and his pants are bloused.

Response by WO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2014 2:30 PM

WO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 27 Feb 2014 14:30:22 -0500

SPC Gamble, and fellow Service Members, the biggest thing is professionalism.

I come from a weird part of the Military world, a Reservist in NYC. I always try to travel in civillian clothes; but like most people travelling around NYC I use mass transit. So for me, my uniform, boots, and any other things I need for the day are in a backpack. My commute was 2 hours, through 4 boros, a bus, 3 trains and another bus, with some walking at both ends. And I was usually on orders, so MON-FRI, and Drill/Battle Assembly weekends. I did a lot of commutting.

I bring up my history, because I see a lot of what all of you are bringing up in your stories and examples, and it comes down to professionalism. Like some other posters, there is no real place for Service Members to eat during the day where I work, everybody goes to lunch, out in NYC in uniform. But if my section has plans to eat out after work, we usually all have a change of clothes. In my mass transit travels I see service members travel in and out of uniform. Most of the time, neither is a problem they are travelling to and from work, but occasionally, you get people half in uniform or doing something they're not supposed to, and we need to step in and make an on the spot correction. But I seen Service Members who have made the on the spot correction, who are worse than the Service Member they are correcting. Yelling, drawing attention to both themselves and the SM they are attempting to correct. If it needs to be done, it should be tactful and professional, not yelling out the window of a moving vehilce at a SM waiting at a bus stop.

The bigger thing I see, is people in bars and clubs in uniform, which I want to ask my Service Members of other Branches about. I've seen many Marines and Sailors in clubs in dress uniforms. And someone has told me if it is for an event, i.e. birthday then it's okay. To me seeing any SM at a club, in any uniform, is worse than seeing them at a grocery store, mall, restaurant, or even movie theatre.

Response by SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA made Feb 28 at 2014 2:19 AM

SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA — Fri, 28 Feb 2014 02:19:39 -0500

Per current Fort Drum Blue Book:

8. a. 1. The utility uniforms may be worn off post unrestricted at the discretion of the Soldier. If worn off-post, uniforms will be clean, serviceable and worn IAW AR 670-1

It is common to see soldiers in ACUs at pretty much all times of the day and night off-post.

New York state has strange business hours for their local government offices and to add insult to injury Fort Drum is not close to the City and County seat town, so long drives are somewhat normal. So whenever there is personal business to be conducted, it is often at odd times of the day, or as a result of a long drive, thus not allowing us enough time to either change/drive or go home/change/drive.

You could say we are a "special case". Bottom line is, soldiers in ACU are a normal, and I would say even "expected", sight in our towns.</div>

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 1 at 2014 11:47 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 01 Mar 2014 11:47:42 -0500

Great discussion. I think the bottom line is that Soldiers must familiarize themselves, not just with AR 670-1, but the ALARACTS from G1 that come out from time to time that provide updates to the wear and appearance of the uniform. Also, the Post/Installation Blue Books and policies vary from place to place. What goes at Fort Drum may not go at Fort Belvoir. For our Junior Enlisted Soldiers and Junior NCOs -Stay away from the "barracks lawyers" and educate yourselves on what right is, then educate your troops. To become a successful NCO you should know what the regulations and post policies are.

Response by SGT Chris Hill made Mar 1 at 2014 12:11 PM

SGT Chris Hill — Sat, 01 Mar 2014 12:11:14 -0500

I think you're out of line. It's annoying when people turn minor issues into major ones. Do you follow all regs completely? I don't recall you saying if you went to parade rest for this NCO, I think that you're allowing working for division to get to your head. I'm very certain that if you were constantly observed on a daily basis, you'd be found guilty on disobeying some regs yourself. I bet your ass if it was a CSM in uniform you wouldn't have said a damn thing, so before you feel almighty for making a unnecessary on the spot correction, check yourself first. Next time you decide to make a correction, ask yourself if you'd make the same correction of it were a CSM or division commander.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 1 at 2014 2:22 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 01 Mar 2014 14:22:03 -0500

FLW has a 1900 policy for uniforms out in town unless stopping for gas or convenience items in said gas station. Not the greatest policy in my own opinion, however, it mitigates the potential of incidents that could shed an immediate bad light on the military. You definitely need to go ahead and change out to civilians if it late, especially if there is a written policy in effect, those are te marching orders and there is a large number of NCOs lately that har been way too lax on subordinates or just shunning written policy. If you don't like it, get promoted to that level and rewrite the policy or just get over it and drive on.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 1 at 2014 3:07 PM

CSM Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 01 Mar 2014 15:07:30 -0500

Still don't see why folks do it. I have not read a single argument to justify why you are shopping off post in ACUs after 1900. It makes no sense. I know I have always managed to figure out a way to get changed and do what I needed to do in Civies and not my uniforms.

Response by SGT Paul Courtemanche made Mar 1 at 2014 4:15 PM

SGT Paul Courtemanche — Sat, 01 Mar 2014 16:15:14 -0500

Some of the ones your seeing might be NG or Reservist who stopped in to a mall or the store after a drill before heading home which in some places might be an hour place drive

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 2 at 2014 6:56 AM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Mar 2014 06:56:19 -0500

What about the reserve side? How does the regulations on this issue affect us? I mean, I understand the going to the movies theaters is wrong. I would agree with that, but there are nights that I get out of drill and my family and I go immediately to dinner. I do not have time to change.

Just curious of your thoughts on this.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 2 at 2014 4:37 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Mar 2014 16:37:37 -0500

Bottom line. If you are going to approach someone about wearing of ACUs in a store or during commercial travel, be sure you do it tactfully. In many cases mentioned here, people are making assumptions as to why they see someone in uniform off-post and after COB. They could be picking up diapers and baby formula for their child after working late. Some people have more than a hour commute to their duty station or live a long distance from a store (many National Guard techs commute across their state daily). They could be returning from leave and passing through the airport or picking up flowers at the store to surprise their spouse. Or they work a duty shift outside of what you consider normal hours. In the case of Ft. Gordon, AIT students have to wear ACUs off post on the weekends (which may explain why you might see them coming out of a movie theatre). Know your surroundings and how the military plays into the local community. If the SMs are making a scene in the airport or store, address it. If they look jacked, address it. If they are simply picking up a few things, you may be over reacting.

Response by SSG Willis Baker made Mar 2 at 2014 5:17 PM

SSG Willis Baker — Sun, 02 Mar 2014 17:17:09 -0500

What is the problem here? This policy has been in exsistence since Christ was a Corporal. Every command has their own policy on this issue. For those of you who have been challenging those whom seem to be in the wrong place at the wrong time in Utilities and PT uniforms, Great Job, keep up the good work. If you think about, you are saving that soldier extra duty from the 1ST and/or ART-15 from the Commander. Actually, the soldier in question should think about it.

Response by 1SG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 2 at 2014 5:34 PM

1SG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Mar 2014 17:34:45 -0500

Well, Guess its time for my 2 cents. I work at the National Guard Professional Education Center (PEC) in Little Rock, AR. And let me tell you. You think correcting a SGT to a SFC is anything. Try correcting LTC to BG.. That's who I run into. Standing out side with there cover off. Hands in there pockets, cell phone and walking. But we must do this... Its bad out there right now, and we need to keep making the corrections..

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 2 at 2014 8:47 PM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Mar 2014 20:47:57 -0500

I am a Marine and we don't have that problem. We are not allowed to wear cammies off base no matter what. I have seen many soldiers out in their cammies and I start twitching every time I see them. I even saw a PFC at a concert a couple weeks ago. If it was a Marine, I would have lit his butt up. It is a combat uniform. There is no place for it in the civilian world.

Response by SPC David Solotky made Mar 3 at 2014 7:17 PM

SPC David Solotky — Mon, 03 Mar 2014 19:17:49 -0500

That actually brings up a question of my own. As a civilian now, I may occasionally go for a run in some pt shorts that I still have. Or hunting season comes about and an old pair of my acus (stripped of course) works perfect for the sagebrush areas in Idaho. What are the takes on that?

Response by MSG Joseph Dutton made Mar 3 at 2014 10:47 PM

MSG Joseph Dutton — Mon, 03 Mar 2014 22:47:24 -0500

For quick stops here and there it's not an issue. Lunch and during normal business hours lets say 0800 through 1700 should not be an issue. I understand you may not work those norms there again quick stops should not be an issue. Hanging out in Uniform is a no go.

Response by SGT Paul Courtemanche made Mar 4 at 2014 9:40 AM

SGT Paul Courtemanche — Tue, 04 Mar 2014 09:40:37 -0500

The fun part is walking up to someone to correct them and find out there no longer in and through on there acus to go out hunting or play a little paintball

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 4 at 2014 9:52 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 04 Mar 2014 09:52:34 -0500

I know AR 670-1 doesn't prohibit the wear of ACUs off post, instead it gives the decision to the commander, but, in the Marine Corps they are absolutely not allowed anywhere off post in their duty uniform. It makes it difficult sometimes when I want to grab a bite to eat at lunch with some of my coworkers, but they are always prepared as they generally always bring a change of clothes for when they get released for the day. It may just be me but I believe that all the branches should have a similar policy.

Response by SFC William Swartz Jr made Mar 4 at 2014 10:05 AM

SFC William Swartz Jr — Tue, 04 Mar 2014 10:05:51 -0500

Outside of a quick stop at a convenience store or gas station to or from work, I never went out in public in BDUs/DCUs/ACUs at all. Class A's or Dress Blues was only on my way to a function of some sort....used to be that these post policies were enforced, but I have seen so many differing policies around different bases I know not what to think any more....used to be you could not be in the PX/Commissary/Shopette after 0900 in PT uniform, but I am guessing that is no longer the case around Benning, because it amazes me the number of Soldiers I see there at all hours of operation in the IPFUs....now it may be authorized, I have not researched it, just simply stating what used to was....

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Mar 4 at 2014 11:43 AM

SSG (ret) William Martin — Tue, 04 Mar 2014 11:43:45 -0500

I assume when the OP speaks of the movie theater he speaking of the ones off post. We have a large theater on Fort Bliss, TX and there are many soldiers who frequent that place while in ACUs.

Response by Cpl Bernie Stanaway made Mar 22 at 2014 8:42 AM

Cpl Bernie Stanaway — Sat, 22 Mar 2014 08:42:31 -0400

Being in the Marine Corps many moons ago! We were not allowed off base unless we were in a dress uniform. And then there were regulations with that also. I live in a town with a big National Guard presence and it drives me nuts! How hard is it to just change before going to walmart? I have seen people everywhere in BDUs.

Response by SGT Craig Northacker made May 6 at 2014 12:34 AM

SGT Craig Northacker — Tue, 06 May 2014 00:34:40 -0400

Anybody off post in fatigues could be put on report when I was in.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 10 at 2015 3:30 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 10 Nov 2015 03:30:02 -0500

According to the reg, active duty military members can wear their uniform anytime except in a situation that would put disgrace to the uniform. However some commands may limit wear of the field/combat uniform off base (ACU, ABU, NWU, etc.)

Response by SSG Sylvester Cook made Jul 3 at 2017 4:15 AM

SSG Sylvester Cook — Mon, 03 Jul 2017 04:15:18 -0400

When I was in, they had things called PX's and commissaries. Did they do away with those conveniences?

Response by PO3 J.W. Nelson made Oct 5 at 2017 6:56 PM

PO3 J.W. Nelson — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 18:56:14 -0400

In 1967 while stationed in San Miguel, PI, you were not allowed off base in blue denim uniforms at any time, no excuses !! Dress whites or dress blues only, depending on the season !!

Response by PFC Bradley Campbell made Oct 5 at 2017 7:37 PM

PFC Bradley Campbell — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 19:37:40 -0400

they are also making themselves terrorist targets. be like CCW holders......keep people guessing. on another note....if you love the fit buy some surplus or new ones in colors we dont use. or an allied nation's surplus unis. make an effort people !!

Response by Cpl Paul Chastain made Oct 5 at 2017 8:00 PM

Cpl Paul Chastain — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 20:00:10 -0400

As a Marine thats been off active duty for 24 years this is the one thing that still makes me want to scream. I hate the sight of it cause most look like a bag of shit anyway. I had a first sergeant that didnt approve of my civilian wear one day. He had me get into my Alphas abd then inspected me and drove me to town. He said in the "old corps" this is how you went on liberty and represented his Marine Corps. His favorite saying was "you joined us. We didn't join you."

Response by SPC Donn Sinclair made Oct 5 at 2017 8:17 PM

SPC Donn Sinclair — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 20:17:39 -0400

I've been out a while, 1971 to be precise. Back then, a soldier didn't leave post in fatigues, (BDU's these days), unless he was on a detail or lived off post. If he did live off post, straight home, no stops. Seeing someone in BDU's or flight coveralls coming out of Wal-Mart is something I'm still not used to.

Response by CW4 Angel C. made Oct 5 at 2017 8:55 PM

CW4 Angel C. — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 20:55:16 -0400

BLUF it’s OPSEC. In Bragg the Division and Corps blue books say you can make a quick stop to get a few needed items like groceries after duty hours. Hanging out at the mall or movie theaters is a big no-go. Then again in one of my units it was acceptable to go to off-post hail and fairwells in duty uniform if you came straight from work but in another unit it was totally unacceptable. How to deal with it? Introduce yourself and pull them to the side and make them aware or refresh their mind about the policy.

Response by SFC Jim Ruether made Oct 5 at 2017 9:34 PM

SFC Jim Ruether — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 21:34:06 -0400

You rocked it Sgt. Gamble thanks for being the NCO you needed to be in this instance. This NCO has not brought any pride or honor to his unit or the NCO Corps but you did! I salute you! Hooah!

Response by SFC Don Ward made Oct 5 at 2017 10:36 PM

SFC Don Ward — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 22:36:24 -0400

So, let's adopt the Marine Corps regulation on off duty dress - they are very strict about what is proper.

Response by TSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 5 at 2017 10:42 PM

TSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 22:42:08 -0400

I'm a recruiter. I'm generally out of the uniform as soon as possible but sometimes I find myself in places one normally wouldn't go during the duty day. I've always been interested in how that conversation would go.

Response by TSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 5 at 2017 10:43 PM

TSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 22:43:00 -0400

Also--you snapping the picture was out of line.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 5 at 2017 10:57 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 22:57:15 -0400

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 6 at 2017 2:11 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 06 Oct 2017 02:11:17 -0400

Like many have said, every base has its own rules with this and the regulation has no specifics on not to wear it off-base. I get concerned because soldiers are not following guidance put out at the unit and army level. Just take the wear of ID Tags. Ask anyone walking around in uniform to see their ID Tags. You'll catch a lot of soldiers without them.

Response by SSgt Scott Rose made Oct 6 at 2017 3:18 AM

SSgt Scott Rose — Fri, 06 Oct 2017 03:18:23 -0400

There was a time in military that all you wore was your uniform. It seems that the services no longer take pride in their members wearing their uniforms. No wonder a lot of the younger servicemen and women no longer take pride in servicing. It’s been over thirty years since I put on a set of fatigues, pressed fatigues and spit shined boots. But then again our commanders were always happy to see us in our uniforms representing our service. Oh, and to snap a photo of from behind the back of this serviceman shows me cowardice. If believe they are in the wrong then you correct them right there, and you take that photograph while you’re looking them in the eye. That’s the mark of a leader.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 6 at 2017 3:49 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 06 Oct 2017 03:49:34 -0400

This is a great point, but look towards the root cause... We need to fix the attitude to fix the belief. Our entire organization as an overall military force has gotten weak on upholding standards. I am in a war zone and Soldiers, Airmen, and Marines think that it is ok to run around in civilian clothes. They think that being spread across a small post that received IDF makes them deserving of CAB's. We are breeding weakness with our own lack of discipline.

Response by PFC Josiah Schmid made Oct 6 at 2017 11:18 PM

PFC Josiah Schmid — Fri, 06 Oct 2017 23:18:48 -0400

No, usually the towns around post

Response by SPC Corbin Doades made Oct 7 at 2017 1:19 AM

SPC Corbin Doades — Sat, 07 Oct 2017 01:19:56 -0400

Even though I was not active duty, I was pulled aside at a restaurant by an E-5 Drill Instructor for wearing my APFTs. I had just returned home from drill and my family was at a local pizza house. The APFT uniform was the Uniform of the Day. T-shirt and long pants. Drive time from the Armory to my house was about an hour.

Response by LTC Russ Smith made Oct 7 at 2017 2:41 PM

LTC Russ Smith — Sat, 07 Oct 2017 14:41:41 -0400

How is this a problem? Soldiers in uniform are showing the flag and reminding civilian communities who they are. I say wear the uniform everywhere and be proud of it.

Response by 1stSgt Rick Bushgen made Oct 7 at 2017 3:11 PM

1stSgt Rick Bushgen — Sat, 07 Oct 2017 15:11:03 -0400

The base should have a policy, every so often it needs to be posted as a reminder to everyone!

Response by LTC John Griscom made Oct 8 at 2017 11:48 AM

LTC John Griscom — Sun, 08 Oct 2017 11:48:33 -0400

Usually, the local commander sets the policy for off base/off duty of the uniform. Part off that policy should define stopping enroute to and from work.

Response by SPC Christopher Renkel made Nov 1 at 2018 9:33 PM

SPC Christopher Renkel — Thu, 01 Nov 2018 21:33:32 -0400

Be nice if there was a regulation on COB. I would have difficulty maintaining my tact if someone jumped my hind end for being in uniform at 2000 somewhere. My response would simply be I haven’t even gotten home yet.

Response by CPT Jeff Robinette made Nov 1 at 2018 10:09 PM

CPT Jeff Robinette — Thu, 01 Nov 2018 22:09:27 -0400

When I was on Active Duty in Germany It was a big deal to me at first. But as I saw more and more of it on the economy there it began to piss me off.
If you were stopping for gas on the way home that was not an issue. But when you were at a gasthaus that was a different story.

Response by 1SG Rob Smith made Nov 2 at 2018 5:24 PM

1SG Rob Smith — Fri, 02 Nov 2018 17:24:04 -0400

I have to agree with anyone and the Army policy. Quick stops, gas but thats it. And even thats limited. Whatever happened to prior planning. Get your stuff at the shopette. No sales tax. Wearing it off base is just lazy. Get names and Unit. With family or not just be tactful. And correct the individual regardless of rank
Senior to you should know better. And one more thing. If you are retired it wouldnt hurt to share a on the spot correction either.

Response by CH (CPT) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 2 at 2018 10:42 PM

CH (CPT) Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 02 Nov 2018 22:42:15 -0400

Recently, I stopped by Starbucks at 0200 to get some Americano before welcoming troops home from deployment in ACU. We stopped at McDonalds two days ago in uniform at 0100 and I did not know who paid for my meal. Thanks to that person for your kindness. I am proud to wear uniform.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 3 at 2018 7:31 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 03 Nov 2018 07:31:24 -0400

I went to Walmart last night in Uniform we are in the field and our chaplain forgot his hygiene bag and everything on Post was closed. Are you going to be uniform police at the PX and Commissary? Some of us are active duty are nowhere near a military post guess what I stop sometimes to grab something on the way home. As a security issue I always have a concealed carry. Yes we are authorized in uniform to conceal in Arizona.

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 3 at 2018 8:43 AM

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 03 Nov 2018 08:43:01 -0400

I am in the Navy and we have the same problem. I remember one time a group of us were getting ready for deployment and were still on duty and went off base to get something to eat because everything on base was closed. Someone came up to us and started chastising us about being in uniform eating off base after duty hours. We tried explaining to him that we were still on duty and just getting something to eat. Another guy whisked that guy away and went outside with him for a conversation. Turns out the guy that was chastising us was a butter bar, and the guy that took him away was a master chief (E9).

Response by SrA Branon Lamphere made Nov 3 at 2018 5:31 PM

SrA Branon Lamphere — Sat, 03 Nov 2018 17:31:03 -0400

This is a force protection issue. Wearing the uniform off base puts you, your family, and your unit at great risk. If you can wear civies in, change at work, then after change back into civies, hide your uniform in a bag and go home.

Response by MAJ Christopher Daily made Nov 3 at 2018 6:10 PM

MAJ Christopher Daily — Sat, 03 Nov 2018 18:10:13 -0400

A couple of thoughts here for this post man. First off we don't say Lower Enlisted, we say Junior Enlisted. I will preface my comments with this, you will never know the situation unless you ask. Soldier in uniform at the theater might have been picking up a friend or family member. That being said, as an Officer I work a ton of hours and will sometimes meet my family for dinner and head right back to work. Additionally I will meet my wife at the store when I have a few minutes to help out and head right back to work or head to the house with her after. Not all Soldiers have a Horn to Horn position and take advantage of a routine trip to the store to spend time with a family member and to help out with the kids for the sake of sanity. Now private snuffy picking up chicks with his awesome new uniform is the other end of the spectrum in the mall drinking Orange Julius and shopping at Spencer's instead of heading back to the barracks first. You will never go wrong enforcing the standard but do it with respect and to develop the individual. I will leave you with one of my favorite stories I read in FM22-100, yes I read FMs, when I was at PLDC at fort Bragg years ago.
The K Company Visit
1LT Harold Leinbaugh, commander of K Company, 333d Infantry Regiment, 84th Division,related
this experience from the ETO in January,1945, during the coldest winter in Europe in nearly 50 years:
On a front-line visit, the battalion commander criticized 1LT Leinbaugh and CPT Jay Prophet, the
A Company Commander, for their own and their men’s appearance. He said it looked like no one had
shaved for a week. 1LT Leinbaugh replied that there was no hot water. Sensing a teaching moment,
the colonel responded: “Now if you men would save some of your morning coffee it could be used for
shaving.” Stepping over to a snowbank, 1LT Leinbaugh picked up a five-gallon GI [general issue]
coffee can brought up that morning, and shook it in the colonel’s face. The frozen coffee produced a
thunk. 1LT Leinbaugh shook it again.
“That’s enough,” said the colonel,“…I can hear.”
A leader takes time to see the situation fully.
My two cents.

Response by SN John Weigel made Nov 3 at 2018 10:19 PM

SN John Weigel — Sat, 03 Nov 2018 22:19:23 -0400

23 yrs ago came out with the Blue book or Ft. Campbell regs.
One of those regs was no BDUs at Walmart, gas station was fine, also put in the no PT uniform at the PX.
But the soldiers still said screw it because the double standards. So if not leading by example that is what happens.

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 4 at 2018 3:00 PM

CPL Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 04 Nov 2018 15:00:31 -0500

So your argument and the csm below is your uniform should never be worn in public between the hours of 1900 and I'm guessing 0600 regardless of the situation.
It's your kids birthday and you taking them out for pizza and a movie. You leave work with plenty of time to get home, change your clothes and get them to the pizza joint. On your way home a semi catches fire and shuts down the freeway. By the time the fire is out and the freeway reopened you only have enough time to meet at the theater. So you choose to go the theater and watch a movie with your small child that you were away from for 18 months missing their birth and their first birthday. Someone thinks you are wrong for putting your family first and calls you out on it. How do you feel about that?
Or the example of the soldier going to the nail salon on her way home while in uniform. Nevermind the fact she is a very private person who does not share her feelings with her co-workers. And she has had a shit week getting home on Monday to learn her husband left her for a 20 something, finding out Tuesday that she not only has an std from her cheating husband but also has cervical cancer (brought to light by the std), and then Thursday learns her best friend from childhood was killed in a car wreck. She is vulnerable and contemplating ending her life, thinks maybe a mani-pedi will get her back in her right mind. Then you come up with your chest puffed out and scold her for it, demand her name and unit so the can properly punish her (article 15 maybe). She stops on her way home and leaps off a bridge to her death because you just pushed over the edge.
Be careful with your words for they can sometimes be just as deadly as the round fired from your issued weapon.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 4 at 2018 3:32 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 04 Nov 2018 15:32:09 -0500

It’s seems to be a huge epidemic since who the hell knows when. Each base has a Bluebook or some policy stating this, pretty much any base I’ve been to, as MSG Quackenbush references, it always says the same thing at ever base but yet most of us drive home, hang up our uniform, put civilians on and go do whatever it is we are going to do. The same thing happened in 98 on through the rest of my time and correcting these people usually gets you in hot water cus there is a Senior floating around doing the same thing, so when you go to correct someone, because your in the right and upholding a standard you end up getting your ars jumped by someone else who doesn’t up hold policy. But by the picture I’m not sure if it’s the fact that it’s way past your base policy or the fact the this Soldeir is wearing which appears to be a soft shoe profile, and their fleece. I know when I look at that pic I am like wow, still hasn’t changed. Keep going down your path the fact that this bothers you is a good sign that one day you’ll be assisting the division General with a new policy with consequences.

Just a little side story for ya! There I was 1998 Watertown NY Mall, 2000hrs, Mall covered with BDU’s and a little short guy yelled like the world was coming to the end. It just happened to be one of our BDE CSM’s and by the time he was done yelling, all you saw was green running in all direction out of the mall lol! It was the best time I’ve ever had inside a mall food court. So, the standard is their, just who upholds it? And how as a lower enlisted do you address a situation without getting your ars in a sling?

Maybe one day this will actually be enforced or no policy at all since it seems to be a waste of paper.

Good Luck!!

Response by GySgt Mike Wils made Nov 4 at 2018 6:02 PM

GySgt Mike Wils — Sun, 04 Nov 2018 18:02:51 -0500

During my time in the Marine Corp the utility or cammy uniform was not allowed to be worn off base. If you want to show you uniform in town, put on your alphas.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 7:49 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 05 Nov 2018 07:49:33 -0500

I say rime to mind uour business, and let people be. Uou don't know peoples individual situation. It is hard enough being in the military, without individuals making it harder than it needs to be. In San Diego and throughout California , there are so many bases that you see service members at all types of hours. Let sleeping dogs lie.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 10:30 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 05 Nov 2018 22:30:42 -0500

It bothers me to when I was at fort Meade I would always see the national guard at the mall in uniform on weekends. It pissed me off i refuse to wear my uniform off post unless I have no other choice.

Response by HA Jace Gallagher made Nov 5 at 2018 10:53 PM

HA Jace Gallagher — Mon, 05 Nov 2018 22:53:25 -0500

In the Navy and Marine Corps we could not wear our digitalis off base except during lunch if we were going somewhere for lunch and coming back. Technically if we lived off base we could wear the uniform in transit to home, but we always just had a change of civvies and put them on when we got off duty. I don't think ANY uniform should be worn off base except in certain cases because it makes you vulnerable to attack and/or manipulation

Response by PO2 Thomas Tutton made Nov 6 at 2018 5:51 AM

PO2 Thomas Tutton — Tue, 06 Nov 2018 05:51:19 -0500

Stationed in St Pete Fla with the Navy we would drive home at the end of a work day and stop to get a bite to eat or go shopping and have our work uniforms on. It was encouraged to do so by command as it showed a Naval precence in St Pete (two Naval minesweepers. We were also reminded that we represented the U.S. Navy. This means you better be 4.0 if you did it. If not you go straight home

Response by SSG Paul Newman made Nov 6 at 2018 7:00 AM

SSG Paul Newman — Tue, 06 Nov 2018 07:00:09 -0500

Not all soldiers get the 9 to 5 go is as this working at division real soldiers might be on their way home at any hour of the day or night. Some work night shifts like medics and cops

Response by PO1 Michael Moe made Nov 6 at 2018 2:16 PM

PO1 Michael Moe — Tue, 06 Nov 2018 14:16:39 -0500

In this day and age I don’t care or that is to say the rules should be changed so that soldiers, sailors, airmen, Marines and Coast Guard should all be able to wear their uniforms to and from work if that means stopping and pumping gas or getting a few groceries that’s fine but sitting at a bar and drinking all night that’s another story .

Response by SPC Paul Todd made Nov 6 at 2018 6:23 PM

SPC Paul Todd — Tue, 06 Nov 2018 18:23:56 -0500

Idk about now days, but when I was in I didn't want to make myself a soft target. I may have stopped at a convienence store for gas, but I changed as soon as I could. Also I wanted to shed the uniform and get the day out of my head before I did anything else. The reason for changing into civies was two fold for me

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 6 at 2018 7:36 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 06 Nov 2018 19:36:42 -0500

I went to see “fury” at the movie theater a couple years ago and a CSM had the audacity to call me out there for wearing my uniform to a war movie. That’s like calling out a former nfl star from attending a football game in his jersey. Dumb. Remarks complete.

Response by SPC Garth Boehmlehner made Nov 6 at 2018 8:05 PM

SPC Garth Boehmlehner — Tue, 06 Nov 2018 20:05:33 -0500

Your being a little wack, when I finally get released at 6 and need to get groceries for the kids does it make sense to shower and change first to get groceries, calm down super hooah

Response by SFC Jerry Florey made Nov 7 at 2018 6:28 AM

SFC Jerry Florey — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 06:28:05 -0500

If they are “in uniform” I think it is ok, too many times I see them w/o head gear and that always bothered me especially before I retired.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2018 7:38 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 07:38:32 -0500

So my two cents... not really worth much, but MY take on it.

Make it an absolute requirement under regulation with company grade repricussions; All soldiers are approved to wear the service uniform to off post establishments that are not considered bars or night-clubs. The wear of field or duty uniforms off post outside of specific duty is punishable by NJP for the first two offenses. This regulation takes effect 30 minutes after COB as set by Division Commanders and Sergeants Major.

End it all there.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2018 7:48 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 07:48:10 -0500

Not nearly as much of an epidemic as how many Soldiers (junior, senior, enlisted, commissioned, warrant) that are blatantly overweight. AR 600-9 states you must maintain a Soldierly appearance, not a retired appearance.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2018 10:23 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 10:23:26 -0500

Only catch me in very few places with the uniform on.mostly when in transit from home to my reseve center, no need for it otherwise. When i used to stay in hotels for drill, id change before going anywhere.
Shopping is quick in and out. Besides, in the picture, I'd have asked that Soldier/NCO whats up with the sneakers.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2018 1:17 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 13:17:57 -0500

Regardless of regs... I don't understand it.. it's almost like a plee for hand outs or something.. the uniform represents pride and integrity... I don't see any of that when they're buying their Cheetos and soda...good post

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2018 1:34 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 13:34:15 -0500

Stopping to get gas or food/dinner for the family at the grocery store after work IMO. Stopping to go to the movie theater, mall, or a bar on the way home is a no go...

Response by A1C Susanna Jones made Nov 7 at 2018 4:09 PM

A1C Susanna Jones — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 16:09:31 -0500

When I was in the Air Force, we were allowed to stop at the store or get gas on our way home while in uniform, but were not allowed to go farther than our home or be out for long periods of time (like a movie).

Response by SSG Willie Equila made Nov 7 at 2018 5:18 PM

SSG Willie Equila — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 17:18:08 -0500

I as stationed here in Hawaii at 25 ID Scofield Barracks In 86 to 90. We were told not to wear our work uniform in all of the Malls only allowed are classA and class B uniform. Nowadays I see every men in different services in their work uniform at the Malls some wearing their headgears inside. No more discipline among our services.

Response by Capt Joseph Schvimmer made Nov 7 at 2018 6:41 PM

Capt Joseph Schvimmer — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 18:41:15 -0500

When i was in it was class a only off post.

Response by SSG William Lammott made Nov 7 at 2018 7:14 PM

SSG William Lammott — Wed, 07 Nov 2018 19:14:27 -0500

I always introduced myself and shook hands with the soldier and kindly engaged in talk about what unit he was with and his/her name then I said to them “thank you for your service” and walked away. The next day I call that company’s 1sg and inform him of the person and let that units command decide.

Response by SrA Kevin Piatek made Nov 8 at 2018 6:55 AM

SrA Kevin Piatek — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 06:55:14 -0500

Short stops like getting or fast food on the way home is usually fine. But something like the wal-Mart or the mall call them out. Some do it actully as a test to see if they do called out on it.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 8 at 2018 10:15 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 10:15:34 -0500

I have to agree with you. We must enforce standards. While on active duty I would always correct issues. I would pull out my I.D. introduce myself and then point out the infraction. I believe it is every NCO's responsibility. I feel if we don't enforce the little things, then we will look the other way on large things. 1SG Wheaton

Response by SGT Travis Arbogast made Nov 8 at 2018 10:21 AM

SGT Travis Arbogast — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 10:21:03 -0500

I never understood this. I always went straight home after duty to change immediately. I didnt like wearing it any longer than I had to.

Response by SGT Leslie Robinson made Nov 8 at 2018 12:26 PM

SGT Leslie Robinson — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 12:26:58 -0500

whatever happened to minding your own fucking business...damn

Response by SSG Steven Kelley made Nov 8 at 2018 1:01 PM

SSG Steven Kelley — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 13:01:47 -0500

All I can say is find a hobby. First off, you are a Soldier, therefore you are never off duty if your AD. Just go get in trouble in Clarksville some Saturday night when you are “off duty” in civis, you will still be on the blotter and have a number of meetings with the CoC. Worry about yourself and those who you are responsible for. If you were really taken aback, why was it a peer rank and not a Bird Col.

Response by SSG Jason Clark made Nov 8 at 2018 5:13 PM

SSG Jason Clark — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 17:13:35 -0500

And... he’s apparently a Profile Ranger! Haha

Response by SSG Max Goodman made Nov 8 at 2018 5:26 PM

SSG Max Goodman — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 17:26:47 -0500

I was stationed there back in 89 and this was a no no we have gone to soft on enforcing the regulations

Response by CW5 Roger Jacobs made Nov 8 at 2018 6:00 PM

CW5 Roger Jacobs — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 18:00:19 -0500

My last duty post was in Germany. You couldn't go anywhere off post in uniform. There it was both a force protection and professional appearance issue. Our work uniforms are just that. They are for work. Only exceptions made were class A or Dress uniforms for official functions. The absolute worst are the soldiers who take off their blouse and walk into businesses in their t-shirts.

Response by Sgt Mike Jacobi made Nov 8 at 2018 9:36 PM

Sgt Mike Jacobi — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 21:36:19 -0500

I was in the military during Vietnam. In those days you didn’t leave base unless in class A or your khakis with tie (summertime). But you were allowed to wear those uniforms off base anywhere. It just wasn’t a good idea given the level of hostility toward members of the military. If we were foolish enough to leave base in fatigues, we could count on being brought up short by any NCO we met.

Response by SFC Matthew Wagner made Nov 8 at 2018 11:48 PM

SFC Matthew Wagner — Thu, 08 Nov 2018 23:48:29 -0500

This was one of those regs that was relaxed post 9/11 it's one of the few I agree with bringing back online. I'm still pissed about having to travel to counter-IED conferences in uniform post 9/11 in direct violation of counter terrorism doctrine and common sense. However, I will say this always showed which CSM was not doing his job. The one that wasn't doing his job was the one out looking for infractions.

Response by 1SG Mark Reed made Nov 9 at 2018 12:11 AM

1SG Mark Reed — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 00:11:07 -0500

Really, how hard is it to pack a small bag with a change of clothes? I've been retired since 99 while serving I was in the US Army Rec command, we were always required to wear are class b's for recruiting duty. Now I see recruiters running around in their BDUs, not sure I think that's a good idea either.

Response by SFC Bryan Clark made Nov 9 at 2018 7:13 AM

SFC Bryan Clark — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 07:13:29 -0500

There was a courtesy patrol, the SDO and a Sr NCO in class A/B that would go to the mall and other places to specifically correct soldiers still in uniform after duty hours, this was a Campbell in 1993-1996, may need to bring it back

Response by CW4 Robert Augur made Nov 9 at 2018 8:45 AM

CW4 Robert Augur — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 08:45:45 -0500

1974 Ft Campbell Ky.: No uniform off post unless on official duty or in transit. Not strictly enforced but not widely abused.
1975/1978 Korea: No uniform off post unless on official duty or in transit, via military or private vehicle, to housing or between posts.
1977 Ft Ord Ca.: No uniform off post unless on official duty or in transit. No uniform in PX, Commisarry, during duty hours. Strictly enforced.
1979 Ft Hood Tx.: Uniform ok off post. Necessity shopping only.
1980-1984 Ft Riley Ks. No uniform off post! Strickly enforced
1984-1988 25th ID Hi.: No uniform off post unless on official duty or in transit. (who wants to run around Hawaii wearing a uniform anyway?)
1988-1992 Ft Hood Tx.: Uniform off post ok. Necessity shopping only.
1992-1996 USAREUR: No uniform off post unless on official duty or in transit. Not Strickly enforced but not widely abused.

The issue you raised is not new and dependent on the local command. I would suggest you take this up with your local command through your chain of command.

My feelings. No self respecting soldier would run around off post in their duty uniform when off duty.

Response by PFC James Stone made Nov 9 at 2018 9:21 AM

PFC James Stone — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 09:21:45 -0500

Sounds like someone has a problem

Response by SSgt Boyd Herrst made Nov 9 at 2018 4:54 PM

SSgt Boyd Herrst — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 16:54:53 -0500

Mess’g With another NCO a paygrade up?
You were right but I think you’re putting your life at risk, SGT. Not saying retribution will be speedy.. and at least you didn’t do a rip and take name n number.. that might be your lifesaver. I know some like to live dangerously and you are taking baby steps.. so what is your next NCO, a SFC or maybe even a CSM?... a heck of a way to make brownie points... prob’ly with St. Pete...

Response by SPC Russell T. Andrews made Nov 10 at 2018 9:25 AM

SPC Russell T. Andrews — Sat, 10 Nov 2018 09:25:45 -0500

I think it's a personal peeve of yours.Is a soldier not a soldier after hours ?

Response by CPL Jason Mclees made Nov 10 at 2018 2:16 PM

CPL Jason Mclees — Sat, 10 Nov 2018 14:16:09 -0500

Omg. How about lightening up a little bit. Nothing is more annoying than someone whatever their rank feeling the need to "correct" everything. You don't know what someone has going on. What if their car broke down and they had to hump it 10 miles to the store to get what they need? Do you really think corrective action about their uniform is really what they need? In my experience people that go around with the need to correct others all the time has something lacking in their own lives so they have to do something to make them feel better about themselves.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 10 at 2018 8:59 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 10 Nov 2018 20:59:50 -0500

Discount

Response by SGT Marc Riordan made Nov 11 at 2018 9:38 AM

SGT Marc Riordan — Sun, 11 Nov 2018 09:38:51 -0500

Bruh, get a damn life.

Response by SFC Craig Vaughn made Nov 11 at 2018 8:37 PM

SFC Craig Vaughn — Sun, 11 Nov 2018 20:37:10 -0500

Not everyone works a straight day schedule, some of these people may be picking up food for their shift.

Response by SFC Michael Robison made Nov 11 at 2018 9:26 PM

SFC Michael Robison — Sun, 11 Nov 2018 21:26:45 -0500

We also need Senior NCO’s to stop leading by “do as I Say, not as I do”... becaus I think all Senior NCO’s and Officers I’m any MOS need to be passing the New Army’s PT standard at a 70% or better... REGUARDLESS of MOS...

Lead from the Front!!!

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 12 at 2018 2:37 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 12 Nov 2018 02:37:58 -0500

I always thought a soldier is a soldier even after duty hours , this regulation makes me think the ARMY has become a 9-5 occupation .. Nothing wrong to wear the Uniform as long is properly wear with pride.. My humble opinion

Response by Sgt Van Livingston made Nov 12 at 2018 9:00 AM

Sgt Van Livingston — Mon, 12 Nov 2018 09:00:46 -0500

I've been curious about this for a while now. In my day, we were fatigues, by army regs you could only wear the duty uniform to and from home with only brief stops i.e. gas. We were not even allowed to go off post for lunch except through a drive thru. Now that I'm retired, we travel a lot and I have seen men and women out eating dinner, shopping etc. So one night I was in a walking mart and I saw a staff sergeant, his wife and 2 boys clothes shopping. I approached him and asked if the regs had been changed. His reply was that they had been changed about 5 years ago. But it didn't seem correct the way he said it. But to answer your question, don't hesitate to correct anyone violating regs.

Response by SFC Terry Chamberlin made Nov 12 at 2018 12:29 PM

SFC Terry Chamberlin — Mon, 12 Nov 2018 12:29:33 -0500

Was at the movies , 7 p.m. , and there was a soldier in battle uniform. After the movie went out to eat and another soldier was in uniform. Nowadays see soldiers everywhere in PT uniform. Army sure has changed.

Response by 1LT Stephen Estopinal made Nov 12 at 2018 9:07 PM

1LT Stephen Estopinal — Mon, 12 Nov 2018 21:07:48 -0500

In my day, signing out on pass required you to be in uniform. The “AWOL” bag came about to sneak civilian clothes out so you could change.

Response by SSG Lance Wendling made Nov 12 at 2018 10:23 PM

SSG Lance Wendling — Mon, 12 Nov 2018 22:23:00 -0500

My advice is to at ease that stuff. You can find plenty wrong with this current US Army to beef about, but this really should be waaaaay at the bottom. You're stressing yourself and military life is already stressful enough. And remember... there really is no such thing as "after duty hours" because when we enlisted, it was for every second of every minute.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 12 at 2018 10:37 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 12 Nov 2018 22:37:18 -0500

I look at it as free advertising for the Army.

Response by SPC William Walker made Nov 13 at 2018 5:00 AM

SPC William Walker — Tue, 13 Nov 2018 05:00:53 -0500

When I was at Hohensfel Germany they took you standard uniform and issues a all black duty uniform which was FORBIDDEN wear off post. It's lazy to not change out of your duty uniform and even though I'm no longer able to wear the uniform it set my blood boiling to be so unprofessional.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 13 at 2018 10:04 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 13 Nov 2018 10:04:36 -0500

Just my two cents: I think it’s situation dependent. I certainly recognize that it’s generally against regulation to be off base in uniform, but there are caveats written in for a reason. All of you non-TRADOC active duty types would have conniptions if you came to my area of the military, and here’s why:

1) We are a National Guard base. When we are in a duty status, we get down time, but no off-duty time. Further, resources on base are considerably more limited than the typical active duty base; often we HAVE to go off base for necessities or even nice-to-haves, or things like doing laundry. We are not generally authorized to wear civilian clothes while in a duty status, so it is very common to see people in uniform out and about in this town.

As far as the TRADOC stuff is concerned, about 45 minutes away there is an active duty TRADOC post. There are a TON of AIT students (A-school for the non-Army students), most of who don’t have civilian clothes with them, or are not authorized to wear them. It’s not uncommon to see instructors and students alike out and about, either for the rare pass to go to the mall like five minutes off base (in Class B uniform usually), or for quick stops for food and stuff like that (instructors or others stationed there usually).

So, while I generally encourage Soldiers to help others adhere to regulations, I also encourage you to use your head. AR 670-1 allows for some wiggle room to be off base in uniform, probably precisely for reasons such as the two I listed.

Response by LCpl Jeff Moore made Nov 13 at 2018 5:12 PM

LCpl Jeff Moore — Tue, 13 Nov 2018 17:12:47 -0500

the worst is the full bird colonel flying his family to Disneyword and wearing his cammies for a shot at a free upgrade and advance seating. I seen AF Staff NCO walking towards a movie theater in cammies with no head cover on and I called him out on it.

seems the Marines are the only ones I never catch doing this.

Response by LCpl Jeff Moore made Nov 13 at 2018 5:15 PM

LCpl Jeff Moore — Tue, 13 Nov 2018 17:15:25 -0500

Also in that above photo at wallmart are you sure he in the army, and not a stolen valor?

Response by SFC Michael Tolbert made Nov 13 at 2018 8:28 PM

SFC Michael Tolbert — Tue, 13 Nov 2018 20:28:34 -0500

Back in the 90’s Ft. Campbell used to do a “courtesy patrol”. An NCO and a EM used to walk the Governor Square mall in class B’s and issue citations to soldiers in uniform after 1800. It only lasted maybe a year then they did away with it.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 14 at 2018 12:07 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 14 Nov 2018 00:07:00 -0500

Can we ever get a topic that doesn't center around AR 670-1, or is everyone so braindead and hopelessly inept as leaders that we think sniping your buddy actually ensures good standards, order, and discipline? The OP is actually proud as hell that he called out a higher rank in public for something very arbitrary and to be honest, not at all important, and is seeking kudos. If this doesn't epitomize the complete breakdown of leadership, emphasize toxic leadership, and point to the core issue of lack of mentorship, I don't know what does. I long for the day when a soldier's loyalty was to taking care of/squaring away his buddy, instead of trying to become internet famous on Rally Point or US Army WTF moments. Leaders- you all need to do a hell of a lot better.

Response by SPC Douglas Kroon made Nov 14 at 2018 8:45 PM

SPC Douglas Kroon — Wed, 14 Nov 2018 20:45:29 -0500

AR670-1 dictates how to properly wear the uniform. Post Commander dictates when and where and which uniforms may be worn. Ignorance of Command policies is no excuse.

Response by SPC Dan Goforth made Nov 14 at 2018 10:37 PM

SPC Dan Goforth — Wed, 14 Nov 2018 22:37:10 -0500

It was to my understanding that a quick “loaf of bread and gallon of milk” type of stop, immediately after COB, was authorized under AR 670-1, but nothing further. When I was in Colorado Springs immediately after ETS, however, to my chagrin, I saw NCOs and officers of all ranks in grocery stores well after hours on a regular basis. It is a problem, especially since I saw multiple leaders not in proper uniform (pt caps and the like). I wasn’t the greatest example of abiding by the standards while I was in, but I took my uniform seriously when I was out in public. Leaders need to start setting a better example.

Response by A1C Lexas Granger made Nov 14 at 2018 10:54 PM

A1C Lexas Granger — Wed, 14 Nov 2018 22:54:36 -0500

Some service men see their camos as pajamas. In which we all used them as such at some point or another. It’s how I felt about mine when I wasn’t on duty.

Response by Sgt Richard Sprague made Nov 14 at 2018 11:02 PM

Sgt Richard Sprague — Wed, 14 Nov 2018 23:02:05 -0500

During my military days during the ice age, one could only wear their uniforms directly to base and home, no stops in between. It seems after the invasion of Afghanistan off base wear of the uniform went lax.

Response by SSG James Mills made Nov 15 at 2018 9:31 AM

SSG James Mills — Thu, 15 Nov 2018 09:31:55 -0500

Laziness is all it is!!!

Response by LCpl Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 15 at 2018 2:07 PM

LCpl Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 15 Nov 2018 14:07:00 -0500

To me that seems way off. Being a Marine we cant wear get out of our vehicle when in uniform off base unless it is an emergency. So I personally see where you're coming from

Response by SPC Vincenzo Minano made Nov 15 at 2018 4:24 PM

SPC Vincenzo Minano — Thu, 15 Nov 2018 16:24:46 -0500

When I was in, we couldn't wait! to get out of uniform! These kids are begging for attention. Quite sad really.

Response by SSG Gh Sebastian made Nov 15 at 2018 7:03 PM

SSG Gh Sebastian — Thu, 15 Nov 2018 19:03:06 -0500

Why dont we just say no uniform at all off base. Extend the workday to include time to change into and out of uniform. Problem solved. Or you could actually worry about something that matters.

Response by CPT J B made Nov 15 at 2018 7:05 PM

CPT J B — Thu, 15 Nov 2018 19:05:14 -0500

The wearing of ACUs have gotten out of control. The main point of the rule is that the ACUs are a utility uniform ("fatigues" in the old days) and they aren't really supposed to be seen off post unless going to or from work.The intent of them in garrison is that soldiers have something practical durable and comfortable to wear to work while they're around their own people. Active duty soldiers may wear their service uniforms while off duty if they choose, within reason (no bars, strip clubs or while endorsing something or representing something). Of course, that made more sense back in the days when civilian men all wore suits.

Response by SFC Bob Arnold made Nov 15 at 2018 9:30 PM

SFC Bob Arnold — Thu, 15 Nov 2018 21:30:44 -0500

Off post uniform wear is the discretion of the command, not by reg.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 15 at 2018 10:40 PM

CSM Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 15 Nov 2018 22:40:38 -0500

As a Retired CSM I would even approach someone doing that. It is unprofessional and any NCO or Senior knows better. Not to give the Junior Enlisted a brake but they see what Seniors do and follow suit. Call them out but as you said do with tact and professional tutoring of the Regs!!

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 16 at 2018 9:35 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 16 Nov 2018 09:35:28 -0500

I'm sure Fort Campbell has reasons for not allowing uniforms off base, but does it make sense? I'm retired and I know it's a big deal for civilians to see our Armed forces in uniform. One of the things the Army likes to preach is keeping the "working inform" clean and presentable. That's because they want to present that professional appearance to the public. There is no real reason at all soldiers should be barred from life because they are in a well presented uniform. It's not Opsec, when everyone knows the large percentage of the base is going to have soldiers. You can tell a young soldier even without the uniform.
Maybe this particular base has a separate issue, of soldiers wearing the uniform incorrectly or sloppy. That should be addressed every morning at formation, and I think that's what is not happening anymore. So to alleve officers and ncos from doing morning inspections, cause they all got excuses that they are busy, they started no uniforms off base. Which in my opinion is just pure laziness and mass punishment

Response by MSG John McDevitt made Nov 16 at 2018 10:55 AM

MSG John McDevitt — Fri, 16 Nov 2018 10:55:07 -0500

This is an old rule. I believe military personnel in ANY uniform lets our citizens know America is safe! Just don't go out to drinking establishment and get drunk in any uniform would be my rule. MSG (Ret)

Response by SSG Thomas Hosfelt made Nov 16 at 2018 12:41 PM

SSG Thomas Hosfelt — Fri, 16 Nov 2018 12:41:33 -0500

So glad I’m retired from petty bullshit.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 16 at 2018 9:01 PM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 16 Nov 2018 21:01:52 -0500

I've said stuff especially at home depot or stores like Walmart shopping for plants I feel like they do it for attention

Response by Sgt Phil Quintana made Nov 17 at 2018 2:36 AM

Sgt Phil Quintana — Sat, 17 Nov 2018 02:36:04 -0500

The Marine Corps has a very simple answer. NO utilities off base, period.

Response by SP5 Dennis Peterson made Nov 17 at 2018 7:53 AM

SP5 Dennis Peterson — Sat, 17 Nov 2018 07:53:10 -0500

This was commonplace in the 70s when I was stationed at Ft. Hood.
We lived off base for a while and would often shop on the easy home. I don’t see a problem with that. The only thing I would take issue with is if they were in partial uniform.

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 17 at 2018 8:26 AM

Maj Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 17 Nov 2018 08:26:55 -0500

I’m certain someone’s already pointed it out, but the Navy/Marine/Coast Guard solution is: no working uniforms off-base, period, except for a gas station or ATM. The Army/Air Force hates it, but the problem was solved more than a half-century ago.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 17 at 2018 10:42 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 17 Nov 2018 10:42:22 -0500

We had a huge problem with this at Fort Carson. You'd see soldiers in uniform at a restaurant with their spouses and or family. That's a good way to out a target on your back even if you weren't already!

Response by PO1 Charles Fletcher made Nov 17 at 2018 11:00 AM

PO1 Charles Fletcher — Sat, 17 Nov 2018 11:00:05 -0500

I have always wondered why people in the Army wear their uniforms at all sorts of crazy times and locations. I once saw a kid in his ACU’s at a heavy metal concert off post at 2200. Maybe it’s just a Navy and Marine Corps thing, but we usually try to get out of uniform once on liberty, so we don’t look like “that guy” that looks like a goober. You don’t need an cammoflauge to have a smoothie at the mall and shop. Plan ahead and change your uniform leaving base.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 17 at 2018 12:15 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 17 Nov 2018 12:15:54 -0500

Exception To Policy for Recruiting

Response by SSG Jess Peters made Nov 17 at 2018 1:04 PM

SSG Jess Peters — Sat, 17 Nov 2018 13:04:15 -0500

During my time in service, 65 to 85 it was acceptable to drop at a gas station or a grocery store on your way home..other than that only class A or class B (for those that remember them) were authorized to wear off best. It was strictly enforced. It gives a more professional appearance as well. I always thought doing away with the khaki class B uniform was a bad idea. They especially looked good with blouse boots, and we're as comfortable as the work uniform, and looked better too. Great to wear when traveling between stations as well.along with pinks and greens, they should again be brought back to the Army.

Response by CH (1LT) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 17 at 2018 7:51 PM

CH (1LT) Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 17 Nov 2018 19:51:16 -0500

Realizing this post is more than a year old....just want throw this thought out there: My first question, even before asking about relevant regulations and command policies, is intention. What are trying to accomplish with the on the spot correction? Intent stems from an underlying goal and determines how you will approach the situation.

In this scenario, intent is key because I need to know if you are trying to correct the NCO as a "gotcha" moment (which is to say to bring attention to your "greatness") or for the improvement of the soldier or even for the sake of protecting the image of Army (i.e. someone doing something in uniform that brings discredit to the armed services as is against regulation).

Correction may vary well be warranted in the circumstance at hand, but the need for correction does not erode your responsibility to adhere to military bearing and to let the SM explain why they are currently dressed in uniform. At Benning, for example, soldiers in uniform are everywhere on and off duty hours. They're not uniform because they just woke up this morning and wanted to be - they are required to be while out on pass from one of the multiple schools here or in between training phases. Likewise, you have no idea if a soldier is coming off a CQ rotation, is a National Guard soldier going to Walmart at night to get something for the unit (something every reservist on here will understand and has probably done at least once), works an odd hour shift (the core functions of the base don't just shut down because it's after 1700), or any number of scenarios.

Lastly, before confronting someone, it's always a good idea to be able to cite the exact regulation they are breaking. I had an NCO once who thought I was out of uniform for wearing the CH Candidate insignia. I had to show him where the insignia was added to the latest edition of AR 670-1 as a requirement for my MOS.

So in summary:

1) Start by checking your ego at the door and ask whether you should confront another soldier.

2) Make sure you actually know the reg you are about to cite so as to not lose credibility.

3) Maintain military courtesies and bearing when confronting said soldier. (I.e. don't do what I saw earlier this week where a private cussed at a CSM for not following a command issued to trainees...before having his life flash before him when he realized he was talking to the CSM.)

Response by A1C Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 18 at 2018 1:54 AM

A1C Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 18 Nov 2018 01:54:29 -0500

I am stationed in Germany and we are not allowed wear our uniform of base unless driving straight home with no stops. I also think it's interesting to note his shoe choice, His uniform appears to be abu's yet he is in tennis shoes. Maybe he has a waiver tho so I cant say for sure that is out of regs

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 18 at 2018 9:37 AM

COL Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 18 Nov 2018 09:37:38 -0500

The problem for the Army is that they made the ACU the new “all purpose” uniform. There is no longer a distinction between a field uniform and garrison. There was a time when the uniform appropriate to the context was the soldier’s only clothing.

Response by SFC Lawrence Born made Nov 18 at 2018 12:20 PM

SFC Lawrence Born — Sun, 18 Nov 2018 12:20:52 -0500

If they are wearing the uniform correctly and not athe a bar what is the issue? Heaven forbid we make Joe''s life any easier by being abl ed to get groceries or eat dinner on the way home. Arbitrary policies like this are what is soul crushing about the regular Army. Like not walking on the grass FFS!!!

Response by SSG Joseph VanDyck made Nov 18 at 2018 6:31 PM

SSG Joseph VanDyck — Sun, 18 Nov 2018 18:31:13 -0500

It is a severe issue. Pisses me off also(glad I am out). Problem is, 95% of soldiers(my percentage) treat the US Army as just another 9 to 5 profession. You don't see this issue with the USMC. They police their own. We (US Army) don't.

Response by MSgt Thomas Welch made Nov 18 at 2018 8:47 PM

MSgt Thomas Welch — Sun, 18 Nov 2018 20:47:11 -0500

I been there was tdy in AK and at a bar when I saw a Maj. there in uniform, I called him on it and was told to shove off(polite edit). he did tell me his unit so I let him be till the next day called his first shirt got a call from his CO bad day for maj.

Response by PVT Mark Zehner made Nov 19 at 2018 9:21 PM

PVT Mark Zehner — Mon, 19 Nov 2018 21:21:24 -0500

I noticed a guy that was over 2 hours away from the closest base and wondered if regulations have changed?

Response by SPC Chris Ison made Dec 2 at 2018 6:20 PM

SPC Chris Ison — Sun, 02 Dec 2018 18:20:27 -0500

Why is he wearing Tennis Shoes?

Response by SGT Xenophon Garcia made Dec 5 at 2018 8:41 AM

SGT Xenophon Garcia — Wed, 05 Dec 2018 08:41:48 -0500

I don't know about the rest of them, but I was always in uniform. I didn't think of my uniform as "work clothes." Uniforms WERE my clothes. We just didn't wear BDU's in public. Is this no longer the norm?

Response by SSG K Johnson made Dec 6 at 2018 12:37 AM

SSG K Johnson — Thu, 06 Dec 2018 00:37:18 -0500

I might wear an old field jacket here and there but I'm out and my uniforms have been phased out for years but when I was in I went straight home to change before anything. Especially in Europe.

Response by SPC Brian Mason made Dec 30 at 2018 10:33 PM

SPC Brian Mason — Sun, 30 Dec 2018 22:33:10 -0500

I'm not in anymore but unless me and the then-wife were going somewhere after I got off, I made no move to dress in any military uniform outside of work hours. It would be a waste of time for many since a lot of people don't live near or on post. Unless someone is caught abusing it then I see nothing wrong with it.
Ex: Stationed at Ft. Drum, NY(says enough) for my first assignment. Sometimes final formation would be after 5 pm or even closer to 7 depending on the day. To maximize our time, we'd do errands or go out to eat on occasion. I don't think it makes sense for there to be some police group following us around to make sure we changed out of them after the end of every day.

Response by A1C Michael Beal made Dec 31 at 2018 12:31 PM

A1C Michael Beal — Mon, 31 Dec 2018 12:31:44 -0500

This was strictly enforced while I was in the Philippines. Off-duty = out of uniform. No exceptions.

Response by SFC William Ewing made Feb 28 at 2020 4:19 PM

SFC William Ewing — Fri, 28 Feb 2020 16:19:08 -0500

At Ft Knox I wasn't allowed into the PX area after 1800 back in 70 had to be in class A or B uniform no fatugues were allowed.
MPs took my I'd and I had to report to my commander to get it back.
Military liaison at the airport would write you up for getting off a flight from overseas if they saw your tie was not correct. Had to fly in A or B uniform when under orders.
Now never see a soldier in anything but field uniform. Marines are always sharp when in public. Other service's look like they slept in theirs for a week.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 29 at 2020 3:38 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 29 Feb 2020 15:38:34 -0500

AR 670-1 says that the uniform is not authorized to be worn off post unless authorized by post commander.

Response by PFC Charles Sanders made Mar 1 at 2020 1:57 PM

PFC Charles Sanders — Sun, 01 Mar 2020 13:57:39 -0500

I wouldn’t worry much about a sergeant picking up groceries on his way home from work. The ones coming out of the theater I might say something, but let’s be honest, the whole “no utilities off post” rule is ridiculous to begin with. It started during the Vietnam era because of all the protests, and we don’t have to deal that now. Now they tell us it’s about PR, but utility uniforms don’t give folks a poor view of the military. As far as the whole OPSEC argument goes, if your spy can’t pick out a bunch of SMs in a military town without uniforms, they aren’t gonna make it long in espionage.

Response by Capt Ralph Moerschbacher made Mar 1 at 2020 7:06 PM

Capt Ralph Moerschbacher — Sun, 01 Mar 2020 19:06:17 -0500

It’s ridiculous. In today’s environment someone may not like the military and take it out on you and that’s why when I was a police officer I never wore my uniform to or from work

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 2 at 2020 1:56 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 02 Mar 2020 13:56:05 -0500

A quick stop, no issue. Actual shopping, bad idea.

Response by SSG Rick Austin made Mar 2 at 2020 5:23 PM

SSG Rick Austin — Mon, 02 Mar 2020 17:23:24 -0500

I think after deployment, where you wore it 24/7, 365 days , it might just be a natural instinct to not take it off..I mean we are never really Off Duty....what ticks me off more is people, on Post/Base who don't get out of their cars at 5:00 when Retreat is played...come on..have some Honor.

Response by CPL Chuck Fuller made Mar 2 at 2020 5:27 PM

CPL Chuck Fuller — Mon, 02 Mar 2020 17:27:53 -0500

Leave if go - go on the front lines and fight the enemy instead of bothering your fellow soldiers

Response by SGT Kyle Bickley made Mar 2 at 2020 8:37 PM

SGT Kyle Bickley — Mon, 02 Mar 2020 20:37:08 -0500

What ever the commanding general order is, is what must be followed! Your off duty remove the fatigues! As for the E-5 that you talk to for him to blow you off, and the commanding general said no! That's disobeying direct orders! If that infraction occurs at that level what else would they challenge you on. With out discipline, following orders, units break down! Paying attention to detail is Paramount! It saves lives! Following orders with out being told is self discipline. We are not civilians in uniform, we follow different rules for a reason! You see this dumbass again, tighten him up!

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 3 at 2020 5:34 PM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 03 Mar 2020 17:34:34 -0500

I usually only wear mine after hours if I just got off work and my wife picks me up and has to go to the store for something. I have also seen like higher ranking officials wearing it and me being a PFC should not just blantly call them out because what if they are doing the same thing I'm doing. I'd feel pretty stupid then. I agree with you though.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 3 at 2020 8:13 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 03 Mar 2020 20:13:19 -0500

Jesus christ no one cares except for uptight asshats. Most of us can't wait to get this shit off but we have things to do. Just because we're in doesnt mean we struggle less than civ counterparts in the consumer bullshit world we live in. Managing a family and/or a home takes time and when we work all goddamned day for inept sons of bitches that are overly aggressive cunts, we need to get some shit or do something and go home for good. Not to change and go back out. Not to carry a giant bag with PT's and a change if clothes and occasionally extra uniform pieces, etc. every day. The only ones I'd say we need to guide and teach to get out of uniform a bit faster are the barracks dwellers. They're getting fairly lazy and generally neglecting regular customs and courtesies. Just showed up to fort lee va sunday 1 march, and immediately ran into a gaggle fuck of privates in AIT that if you consider this a spot check, were a total bag of dicks. Shoes untied, earrings, fairly shaved, mixed uniforms (pt's[wtf]), mean mugging the NCO trying to actually help them not get hemmed up by a Drill. Goddamn near whipped knife hand out and went apeshit. I was in civvies. I made it known I'm an NCO. Turns out a Marine Boot had corrected them 2 seconds before I walked up. They basically said fuck you to that guy and I just happened to notice 1st the one dude with his pt cap rolled up and the guy with an unauthorized chain outside his pt shirt. Start from the bottom, train em right and dont be afraid to kick motherfuckers out. Quality over quantity. We are warfighters not fucking anything else. Be nice, until it's time not to be nice and then be nice again.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 5 at 2020 7:43 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 05 Mar 2020 19:43:51 -0500

Not sure what date this pic was taken but ACU wear out date was Sept 2019. Guy in sneakers and outdated uniform most likely not still in service.

Response by SCPO Frank Carson made Mar 6 at 2020 5:34 AM

SCPO Frank Carson — Fri, 06 Mar 2020 05:34:09 -0500

Over the top.

Response by SGT Michael McKeown made Mar 6 at 2020 10:37 PM

SGT Michael McKeown — Fri, 06 Mar 2020 22:37:40 -0500

He is not even in proper uniform. Running shoes?

Response by SPC Jon Bubar made Mar 7 at 2020 2:58 PM

SPC Jon Bubar — Sat, 07 Mar 2020 14:58:20 -0500

Fully agree I am '80s Army and more than a few words would be said to such. Also all traveling was in class A exclusively.

Response by SR Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 8 at 2020 3:01 AM

SR Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 08 Mar 2020 03:01:07 -0400

After reading the comments The navy is the same thing I saw a ship mate in his blue cammos in the mall me and my friend just looked and said what’s s- bag getting a few things in a store on your way back home is fine

Response by SFC Greg Rhoads made Mar 8 at 2020 8:55 PM

SFC Greg Rhoads — Sun, 08 Mar 2020 20:55:45 -0400

What’s with the running shoes?

Response by SFC Greg Rhoads made Mar 8 at 2020 9:06 PM

SFC Greg Rhoads — Sun, 08 Mar 2020 21:06:27 -0400

I retired in 1995. At the time you could only wear BDU’s to and from your quarters if residing off post. Prior to that, you wouldn’t dare be caught dead in Fatigues or (Hospital Whites) off post. I was surprised when I started to see service members in combat uniforms in flight status, surprising kids/spouses/family members, and/or doing any type of civilian establishment visits. Times change but the soldier in the picture was wearing running shoes, camo pants and don’t know what the jacket was. I’d called him out as well. If your in public, please be proud and wear your uniform correctly as befits the situation. Thank you

Response by 1LT Stephen Estopinal made Mar 8 at 2020 10:57 PM

1LT Stephen Estopinal — Sun, 08 Mar 2020 22:57:35 -0400

We were required to be in uniform and in possession of a pass at all times of base. I guess times have changed

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Jan 19 at 2022 12:05 PM

Lt Col Jim Coe — Wed, 19 Jan 2022 12:05:18 -0500

We need to check the Service and local directives before we question a service member wearing their uniform off duty in the local community. Things have changed a lot in the last 40 years. It appears wearing a work/combat uniform outside of the installation for shopping or other off duty activities is okay. I don’t like it but if the uniform is properly worn there’s no grounds for comment or objection.

This change has been progressive since the 1970s. When I was a LT in 1970 we could wear work uniforms off base only to commute to/from work. By 1980 we were allowed to make short stops for fuel, food, dry cleaning, etc in uniform on our way to/from work. Service uniform was okay for wear in the civilian community off duty, but not in establishments of Ill repute (bars, gentlemen’s clubs, etc). When we invaded Afghanistan all the Services Started allowing office workers to wear work/combat uniforms for daily duty. They also loosened up the rules about wearing these uniforms into the civilian communities. So today I very seldom see a service member in the Service uniform anywhere.