Police officer charged with murder in South Carolina after shooting unarmed man in the back. What do you think of cases like this?

LTC Yinon Weiss — Tue, 07 Apr 2015 20:13:54 -0400

As if the act of murder wasn't bad enough, the end of the video shows him handcuffing the victim... who may have been still alive, and walking away. Watching how care free he was about the whole thing, including walking away at the end, leads me to believe that this isn't the kind of thing a good cop just did on a bad day. I imagine that this police officer has victimized people to various degrees throughout his entire career. How his peers on the force have not done anything about it is a little worrisome. Law enforcement do so much good in this country, it's so unfortunate to see this be how they are perceived by so many.

More on the story: http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/07/us/south-carolina-officer-charged-murder/index.html

Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXO3Ix_GIyI

Response by CW5 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2015 8:54 PM

CW5 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 07 Apr 2015 20:54:55 -0400

I suspect the police abuse their power quite often, LTC Yinon Weiss. I've seen it myself - not shots, but abuse of power and bullying - when it was completely unnecessary.

I am generally a fan of the police, but this video makes it difficult to continue being a fan. There's no denying that abuses occur. I hope they are rare, but I'm afraid they are not. Is it that we're more tuned in after the recent high profile cases? Or is it that there really are more and more cases of brutal police brutality? I hope it's the former. I fear it could be the latter.

Response by Capt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2015 9:05 PM

Capt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 07 Apr 2015 21:05:28 -0400

I do believe this is a rare case. I am always reluctant to judge based on a short video because one does not know what went on before. But, the fact the the officer is facing murder charges indicates this is real.

I could not vote it is rare so it is not a problem. It is certainly a problem in this case.

Response by MSgt Steve Miller made Apr 7 at 2015 9:29 PM

MSgt Steve Miller — Tue, 07 Apr 2015 21:29:40 -0400

Several of my old military buddies entered law enforcement. If this video is for real…..WOW. Yet, I have no problem with shooting the enemy in the back, so did the officer have lawful reason to do so? The video shows what occurred, but does not in anyway indicate what lead up to the shooting. It would seem the individual could have stopped. If you did nothing wrong….why are you running. I don’t buy the excuses that the police will shoot me anyway. Its crap to say the least!!! So, what really happened…..the whole story?

Response by CSM Michael J. Uhlig made Apr 7 at 2015 9:37 PM

CSM Michael J. Uhlig — Tue, 07 Apr 2015 21:37:40 -0400

This is clearly a murder (as evidenced from the video)!

The man (alleged criminal) had broken contact and was running AWAY from the Officer and did not look as if he posed a threat any longer....call for backup/tackle him or whatever, no need to shoot the man in the back.

In this case the Police Officer is charged for murder, good call.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2015 11:42 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 07 Apr 2015 23:42:44 -0400

Probably happens more than we think. If it wasn't for the video it would be another "self defense" shooting. If he broke the law, WHATEVER IT WAS, chase him, cuff him, arrest him, and its over. To shoot someone on the back show the coward he is.

Response by Cpl Tou Lee Yang made Apr 7 at 2015 11:59 PM

Cpl Tou Lee Yang — Tue, 07 Apr 2015 23:59:57 -0400

The police officer got caught. That's why some conservative states are creating laws to prevent the citizens from recording police officer in case something like this happen.

Response by SPC David S. made Apr 8 at 2015 12:11 AM

SPC David S. — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 00:11:15 -0400

The officer, 33 , didn't even try a foot pursuit of an overweight 50 year old man. From the report 5 shots landed and one was through the heart. This guy was going for center mass. Also looks like he staged the scene by placing his taser next to the victim. His behavior after is also troubling. No CRP, nothing.

Response by SPC David Boerst made Apr 8 at 2015 12:18 AM

SPC David Boerst — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 00:18:23 -0400

I hear all the time that police have a tough job and they have to make split second decisions but that shouldnt be an excuse. if they are able to make mistakes and not have any repercussions for making the wrong one, then the importance is lost. The sad thing is, i'm sure this has happened many times before. its just now that we have the right to film police we are seeing more videos like this. on a side note, please remember fleeing from an officer is not enough grounds for them to shoot you in the back.

If there wasnt this video footage, all the lies told in the report would have had this cop still working his job

Response by SSG Trevor S. made Apr 8 at 2015 12:19 AM

SSG Trevor S. — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 00:19:22 -0400

I have a hard time believing the video. If it wasn't staged its horrendous. But it seems to me that everyone involved is too calm and too half speed for it to be real.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 12:44 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 00:44:00 -0400

Im all for arresting and prosecuting, and self defense when warranted but this is muder

Response by Sgt Martin V. made Apr 8 at 2015 12:45 AM

Sgt Martin V. — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 00:45:33 -0400

I voted other as I don't wear a badge for a living and I really do not know the problems Officers face on a daily basis.

Did this Officer make a bad choice? Yes, in my eyes he did. Will he be held accountable for his actions? I'll have to follow the case and see what the court decides.
Again, do I know enough about what LEO's do day to day to vote for the other 3 choices? No, I don't and I feel as though they are too generalized (probably for debate purposes).

My .02, let the down votes flow...

Response by 2LT Charley Gibbs made Apr 8 at 2015 1:11 AM

2LT Charley Gibbs — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 01:11:54 -0400

Situations are difficult to fully understand by a video tape. That being said, it looks like a fleeing felon got shot. He did not appear to be a serious danger to the community. So why did this happen? I'm thankful cops are armed, however shoot/don't shoot training and rehearsal/reenactment practice must be thorough. The frequency of shootings and lethality indicates some lawmen have sadly become trigger happy or at least resistent to training, command, and community norms. The liability they pose is lamentably huge. Do we take their sidearms and hand out shotguns? Anyway, I doubt militarization is the main cause.

Response by Sgt Lauren Weigand made Apr 8 at 2015 1:14 AM

Sgt Lauren Weigand — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 01:14:29 -0400

Whether this police officer was right or wrong this video is going to rob him of his life. I can already see it coming.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 1:23 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 01:23:07 -0400

I am having a hard time believing this is real. Part of me doesn't want to believe my eyes.

Regardless of what may or may not have lead up to it, 2LT Charley Gibbs, you can't be a "felon" if you are not convicted of felony by a jury of your peers in a court of law. Also known as due process.

What, may I ask, leads you to assume a felon status? That is, unless you know something that I don't based on what we have been presented in this thread.

Response by SPC Mikki Ekanger made Apr 8 at 2015 2:09 AM

SPC Mikki Ekanger — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 02:09:14 -0400

This video is harder to tell than others, but I do know that not every time a cop pulls the trigger is murder. The court of public opinion has muddied the waters between good shoots and bad shoots. That being said, even if the cop is wrong, you can invoke your rights without fighting. He's the guy with the gun.

Response by SSG Clayton Blackwell made Apr 8 at 2015 3:09 AM

SSG Clayton Blackwell — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 03:09:13 -0400

I entered law enforcement after the service and still am after more than 16 years. I dont know the whole story here, but to me this looks like a bad shoot. The law changed more than 25 years ago that you cant shoot a fleeing felon unless you can show they are a danger to the community, ie already committed murder.
This is not something that happens often. Yes there are bad cops here and there, yes we are human and make mistakes, but it is not the spirit or way of LE as a system. All this call for reform because a few people think things are bad is ridiculous. Most agencies train hard and often, including shoot dont shoot scenarios. Half those calling for reform are criminals. Its not some huge conspiracy to kill people. But this one does look bad and he is being prosecuted.

I have personally arrested 4 cops and a CID agent in my career. When we do the wrong thing we should be held accountable, but lets not act like the 100s of thousands of LEOs in the country, that are doing it right everyday are all corrupt because of a few bad apples here and there. Are all soldiers wrong because a few kill innocents during combat? Do a few stock brokers embezzling money make them all criminals in need of more oversight? Most complaints on LE are bogus, but some are sustained and dealt with. But don't paint us all with a broad stroke and say we are out of control because of a few bad actors, that is the same thing racists do.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 6:58 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 06:58:03 -0400

bad cops like this put good cops in jeopardy that cop should have ran after that guy and tackled him shooting him was unnecessary

Response by LTC John Shaw made Apr 8 at 2015 7:55 AM

LTC John Shaw — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 07:55:02 -0400

Yinon,
This appears to be an act of homicide, I don't see how the officer or an objective observer can justify the use of force.
This demonstrates the URGENT need to develop, use and train police officers on non-lethal means needs to be protect the officer and the public.
The officer needs to be tried by jury and if found guilty, convicted.
This is a sad day for the family of the deceased caused by the officer who failed to follow any type of escalation of force rules.
The citizens of South Carolina should demand actions to prevent this type of action in the future.
This family needs to be compassionately responded to by the major or responsible civil authority.

Response by MSgt Michael Durkee made Apr 8 at 2015 8:33 AM

MSgt Michael Durkee — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 08:33:08 -0400

This incident is shocking and disgusting, it happened in a location that I drive through daily to get to work. The area is known as a high crime area and there is a significant police officer patrol presence, when the story first broke in the local newspaper I had a gut feeling that there was something wrong with the officer's statement.

Throughout North Charleston most traffic stops that I've witnessed had a minimum of two police cars, sometimes as many as four. Why there weren't more officers present for backup is a bit baffling, but ultimately, as we can see from the video...this officer chose to shoot an unarmed man in the back while he was fleeing. Pathetic.

Response by Maj Chris Nelson made Apr 8 at 2015 9:18 AM

Maj Chris Nelson — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 09:18:01 -0400

I have to go with OTHER for my choice. A clip of video is no different then a conversation, book, the Bible, etc. It can be taken in context or out of context. Preachers do it all the time from church pulpits...they cherry pick the phrase they want without the "just before" or "just after" to give it full context. Someone walking into a conversation mid stream may pick up on a phrase or statement that sounds awful....however, in full context, may make sense. Video clips are the same way..... what is the back story? What is the story going forward? While the video clip is disturbing, I have no FACTS to back up the officer OR the runner/victim. I will reserve judgment until AFTER the facts become known. I hope that the officer gets a fair trial. With that being said, if the officer acted correctly and in accordance to policy, he should be commended. If the officer was wrong, throw the book at him. DO IT WITH FACTS, INVESTIGATION, and as needed, PROVE he was wrong (always innocent until proven guilty is how our legal system is SUPPOSED to work).

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 9:27 AM

Maj Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 09:27:39 -0400

This guy is a bad seed and makes a tough job even tougher for a ton of great cops out there. I think police need to get regular training on the continuum of force and embrace the steps to deEscalate potentially violent situations. Some departments do this exceptionally well but not all; and once the gun is drawn the only thing left to do is shoot. I suspect that pistol generally needs to stay holstered a lot longer in many cases. These opinions are my own.

Response by SGT Ben Keen made Apr 8 at 2015 9:44 AM

SGT Ben Keen — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 09:44:51 -0400

What makes this even worse is the number of shots the officer took. Granted, the video only shows a few minutes of the interaction between the man who appears to be unarmed the entire time and the officer. Not once do you hear the officer request the man to stop running, nor does he try to use his less-then-lethal weapons system. With someone that close, with that many people around, the officer just blinds discharges over 6 round of which it appears that 2 hit their mark. We all know bullets continue to fly until they run out of energy so if those other bullets did miss their mark who's to say this guy didn't injury someone else as well?

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 9:46 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 09:46:05 -0400

I am often accused of being extremely right wing. I disagree, of course. I try to be objective. In this case, I see a murder. I also see a "capital murder".

If I was this officer, I wouldnt be concerned about the jail time, I would be concerned about the death penalty. If the roles were reversed here, there would be a death penalty cry. This appears to be an execution.

For a tail light? Jeez.

Response by SMSgt Thomas V. made Apr 8 at 2015 10:05 AM

SMSgt Thomas V. — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 10:05:54 -0400

This is a tragic incident! The charges however are wrong. The problem with these incidents is misinformation. Though the video is damning it is not the full story. The prosecutor in my opinion is acting improperly here as well however is justified with the hanious Video he has been presented and the emotional scene it presents. Law Enforcement encounters such as this are weighted against "legal precedent" not emotion. When the media hype mellows, investigators will look at the totality of the circumstances surrounding this incident. It will be properly be "Monday morning quarterbacked" by professionals. What the general public doesn't understand is law enforcement encounters are weighed against the 4th amendment as "seizures". Police officers do not kill people, they seize them. The question that will be asked and answered in the courtroom not the court of public opinion is "Was the officer justified in seizing this individual" undoubtedly the answer will be yes. The suspect was wanted on judge ordered warrant and the officer was bound by law to seize him and bring him to a judge. The video shows only part of the encounter, we are judging the actions using individual filters instead of applying SC and Federal Law. What you or I would do doesn't apply. The implication of racial overtones makes this incident even worst. The political correctness shown here by the prosecutor will only further damage race and law enforcement relations. As this case is examined more evidence will come to light. The "slam dunk" many think this is May not come to what many expect. These cases are wrongly displayed in the media where the "court of public opinion" is usually wrong and we all scratch our heads as to how anyone could see anything different than a "racist cop" killing an unarmed man. I am sad the man was fatally wounded as is the officer and everyone involved, but in the end I do not expect a charge of murder or homicide and either should anyone else and history proves that. The reason is steeped in state and federal law on seizure and if the officer is guilty of anything its violation of the individuals 4th amendment rights. When a good law enforcement lawyer defends this and the incident is taken to court "reasonable doubt" will be in all our minds. Shamefully it will be racially unacceptable and riots will occur further damaging the fabric of what makes our nation great. Be responsible and reserve judgement when all the facts are in, you are still presumed innocent until proven guilty in this country.

Response by SMSgt Thomas V. made Apr 8 at 2015 10:12 AM

SMSgt Thomas V. — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 10:12:32 -0400

See my response in this thread

Response by SMSgt Thomas V. made Apr 8 at 2015 10:13 AM

SMSgt Thomas V. — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 10:13:06 -0400

see my response in this thread

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 10:27 AM

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 10:27:54 -0400

As a Navy Master-at-Arms 1st Class (security forces specialist), I see a clear and blatant violation of all justifications of use of deadly force in this instance. While a man was escaping, he was not posing imminent danger to the cop or any other being around. With or without video, bullet imprints in the back would indicate a high likelihood of excessive use of force. To add more drama to the case, a white cop attacking a black man.

According to Tennessee v. Garner, 471 U.S. 1 (1985), the US Supreme Court held that under the Fourth Amendment, when a law enforcement officer is pursuing a fleeing suspect, he or she may not use deadly force to prevent escape unless the officer has probable cause to believe that the suspect poses a significant threat of death or serious physical injury to the officer or others.

So what was going through officer's mind at that instance may hold the same answer as to how many licks does it take to the tootsie roll center of the tootsie pop.

Response by MSG Brad Sand made Apr 8 at 2015 10:33 AM

MSG Brad Sand — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 10:33:18 -0400

As to cuffing the victim (in this case), that is standard procedure. We do not see what happened before or even after. It appears really bad, but this officer was in trouble before the video, according to at least one of the news stories, and we can not know anything more about the officer other than what we see for 46 seconds.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 10:36 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 10:36:48 -0400

This is a major issue that Law Enforcement struggles with. There are bad cops out there. There are not many but those few make it really hard for everyone else. I was a cop for about 3 years. I enjoyed it but not the constant battles you would have with some people for issues that you had not control over. It is just really eerie how he reacted. He just shoot him down like it was a common chore. I have read a bit on this and it upsets me that this happens. This one, former officer, just made it harder for every other officer in the United States.

Response by SSG Paul Lanciault made Apr 8 at 2015 10:54 AM

SSG Paul Lanciault — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 10:54:22 -0400

I've seen good cops and "not so good cops". We have no idea what went on prior to the video. We can just imagine whats going to happen after. There are lots of questions still; drugs, etoh, assault, priors, threats, weapons, etc. Why is he running? Is he running away, towords someone? Why did the officer shoot so many times? How far away is back up? That officer will have to justify why he fired on an unarmed man, or could he and back up chased him down. I pray for the families of the victim and the officer. I pray the system works.

Response by SSG Tim Everett made Apr 8 at 2015 11:13 AM

SSG Tim Everett — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 11:13:27 -0400

I'm going with "other" because I'm not going to armchair general law enforcement in general. I am, however, going to call this out as being an obvious case of murder, and I hope that the City of Charleston is prosecuting because it was the right thing to do, not because it wouldn't go over well to ignore it or sweep it under the rug.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 11:14 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 11:14:46 -0400

Based on my own experience as a civilian LEO, this is a rare instance. As with any occupation, there are bad apples. Perhaps this is not a bad apple, but a case of poor decision-making? Either way it is murder.

We (LEOs) are all trained in standing laws regarding fleeing felon & when deadly force is authorized in such cases - ONLY when the fleeing suspect poses an immediate threat to others. This suspect does not appear to be carrying anything while fleeing.

I do not think that this is a prevalent issue with LEOs. Due to recent media coverage it appears that it is rampant & that is what the uninformed will believe because that is what is presented to them. We must remember, there are only 2 things that sell in the news: sex & death.

Response by Capt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 11:31 AM

Capt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 11:31:31 -0400

Only one thing troubles me. The officer is said to have used a tasser. And the it seems the man fleeing had the tasser from all appearances it seems murder. Just would like to see what happened.

Response by WO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 11:33 AM

WO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 11:33:36 -0400

Even though I believe an overwhelming majority of LEO's are doing great work, I had to vote other. Either because of social media, or because it's not as rare as I would hope, stories like this are in the media every week. So just as the military sometimes has to react to issues, SHARP and Suicide Prevention, there are enough people who perceive there is an issue with Law Enforcement that they have to do something.
I've had very few dealings personally with Police Officers. As a NYC resident I've been 'stop and frisked' over a half dozen times, four times in one month once. And only one of those were the Officers rude, and after all of them I was let go without an issue.
Public perception of the Police is bad because instead of seeing them as people who Serve and Protect, people see them as a ticketing agency. Add on top of it these race, and violence issues, and something has to change.

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Apr 8 at 2015 11:36 AM

Capt Richard I P. — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 11:36:06 -0400

Looks like a bad shoot.

Response by BG David Fleming III made Apr 8 at 2015 12:09 PM

BG David Fleming III — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:09:01 -0400

As a strong advocate for Law enforcement, I want to wait until all the facts are presented before making any judgement call. While the video is compelling, it doesn't tell the stress, the atmosphere, or the surroundings the officer faced prior to the shooting. I'll wait!

Response by SSG Robert Burns made Apr 8 at 2015 12:16 PM

SSG Robert Burns — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:16:25 -0400

What takes the cake is that later in the video you see him "planting" the tazer next to the guy while he was laying dead on the ground. I turns my stomach to think of what woulda happened had this not been on video.
Also he stated that he gave the guy CPR while waiting which is another lie as evident in the video. The only time he touches the guy is to cuff him.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 12:19 PM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:19:33 -0400

There are some officers that are not fit the job as an LEO. It really does not matter if it is PTSD or not because it is the public that pays the cost, one way or another.

Response by SSG John Erny made Apr 8 at 2015 12:39 PM

SSG John Erny — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 12:39:54 -0400

Let us look at our own profession, most service members serve with honorable distinction; but we have all seen or read about those who leave a stain on our uniforms. I am sure that all of you can come up with your own examples or those listed here on RP. The same is true for the law enforcement community; they too have bad actors that make them all look bad.

I think most of us have dealt with members of the law enforcement community that left a bad impression. They are taught to use a command voice and always be in charge of any situation or contact with the public. Sound familiar NCO's: Command voice, being in charge, taking control? I have heard the term C.O.P. used, or contempt of police. Think disrespect to a non commissioned officer, in the civilian world that is not a crime. Wrong in my opinion, but not a crime.

The government entity which employs LEO's is also to blame be it local, county, state, or federal. In some cases they are essentially the armed version of the revenue service. Fines help finance operating costs and wages or what ever else the money is used for. Then we have politicians who run the various law enforcement entities and they do not do a good job of policing their own. We in the military would call it good order and discipline.

The vast majority of people in law enforcement are fine and honorable people who serve us well. This bad actor will get his day in court and the Judge and Jury will decide his fate.

Response by CMC Robert Young made Apr 8 at 2015 1:28 PM

CMC Robert Young — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 13:28:05 -0400

As somebody who has spent 35 years in civilian and military law enforcement, I have a couple of observations about not only the video, but how situations like this in general. For that reason, I choose other because the first three options are not adequate for such a complex issue.

First, the video is inflammatory and damning; however, it is without context. We (the royal we) should have grave concerns, and we should demand answers, but we simply don't know (and we won't know until there is a thorough comprehensive investigation) all of the facts surrounding the event.

I'm not saying the police officer is right; or that he is wrong. I'm saying let the process take place, and the actual entire truth will eventually come out; not the mere seconds of video, but the whole unadulterated truth. Despite the widely publicized failures in the system, if we are patient enough to set aside our emotion and take a more intelligent approach, most times the system/process works just like it should. During the course of my career, I have been associated with a number of police officers who have been party to deadly enforce encounters. Those who did what they should were exonerated. Those who did not suffered the consequences including jail sentences.

Remember, none of us swore an oath to protect an individual. We all swore an oath to protect and defend the US Constitution. That Constitution provides for an exhaustive deliberate process by which we as society bring forth justice. Let's honor our oath. Let's be smart enough to let the process work. The whole truth will come out.

Second, what makes this so shocking is that it doesn't happen every day. If the police were wild renegade crazy people shooting whoever they pleased and this happened daily, we would just come to expect it. The media's 24 hour a day cable news cycle seeking sensational stories to drive rating colors our judgment, but the actual facts don't support a nation oppressed by police. Quite the contrary. I read recently that there are 600,000 to 700,000 law enforcement officer in America today. How many of those officers very professionally without anyone noticing resolved their calls for service; investigated potential criminal suspects; arrested those suspected of committing offenses; completed traffic stops having either issued a summons or a warning; or interacted in a hundred other ways with the society that pays their salary without a hint of violence? And how many were involved in some behavior that dishonored their oath? We think about the exception; not the rule.

Third, to say this happens on regular basis is unsupportable by the facts. It simply doesn't and anybody willing to purge themselves of the emotion attached to this issue and truly study the facts will find such clear cut evidence to that end. Almost everybody I've ever talked to about police misconduct has no idea what they're saying. When questioned carefully, suddenly they know a guy who knows a guy who was actually there; or they don't understand how/why police officers do what they do, and subsequently chalk it up as misconduct.

To say that police make tough decisions and there shouldn't be consequences for those decisions is not fair to society or the police for that matter. From failure, comes improvement. When the police don't do as well as we expect, then there has to be a careful examination of the circumstances, and steps taken to mitigate any such event from occurring later.

To say that because it rarely happens is to say that it's not a problem isn't fair to society or the police either. Society asks much of it police, and it should expect their best effort every day. Bad police officers make it hard on good police officer because the 24 hour a day media will beat this horse until far beyond its death without ever acknowledging the success stories that happen every day without notice because we don't celebrate quiet successes in this country anymore. We ruminate on the failures of others because that sells advertising.

A final thought. I'm continually amazed at the number of people with whom I have contact who with no training, experience, education or insight are perfectly comfortable telling me how poorly I do my job; or even how to do my job. How many of those people would take the same approach with the doctor treating them for cancer? Or the dentist filling their tooth? Or their lawyer pursuing correction a legal wrong? Or for that matter the plumber unclogging their drain? Food for thought.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 1:32 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 13:32:38 -0400

Unsure of how this has anything to do with the military since this was a local police event, but I'll bite.

On a personal level, I think this looks really bad for the officer. I think the investigation needs to occur and go to trial. I personally believe he acted inappropriately purely based on the video and will probably go to jail for murder....but until he's proven guilty, he's innocent.

Response by COL Jean (John) F. B. made Apr 8 at 2015 1:43 PM

COL Jean (John) F. B. — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 13:43:21 -0400

It certainly looks bad for the officer.

There are bad apples in every profession. All police should not be judged by the inappropriate/criminal actions of a few.

This will simply give the race-baiters like Obama, Holder, Winfrey, Jackson and Sharpton more ammunition to preach their racist hatred.

Response by Col Joseph Lenertz made Apr 8 at 2015 1:49 PM

Col Joseph Lenertz — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 13:49:49 -0400

The answers available didn't cover the spectrum. Murder by police is rare, but it doesn't mean it's not really a problem. This is one of those topics where the right answer is zero...as in, it can NEVER be allowed to happen.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 2:07 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 14:07:13 -0400

Oh Looky. Here's another officer whose life was in danger...

Look, I understand the need to convince people that not all cops are bad, but in this instance, this cop absolutely was. So Go Ahead and vote me down SMSgt Vote down, because I have an opinion that differs from you.

The video CLEARLY shows what happened. I mean, sure he tried to run after being pulled over. Looks like they were having a conversation when he chose to run again. I didn't see him reach for anything. I hear the officer may have dropped a gun next to his feet, I can't see clearly to reach that conclusion either. But what I can see is that this officer fired 8 shots to the back of a fleeing 50 year old.

That is Over-Kill! Absolutely.

He sure didn't look frightened for his life... He calmly aimed at and shot 8 times. Not that this young 33 year old buck couldn't take down this 50 year old. His own attorney dropped him after this video came out. He didn't get arrested and thrown in jail until after the video came out. What that tells me, is that he was lying or telling half truths until this video was seen.

What happened to like shooting the knee cap out or something to that effect? Why are these bad apples just shooting to kill?? He had no prior Aggravated Assault charges or anything. I will never understand these situations.

Response by LCDR Rabbah Rona Matlow made Apr 8 at 2015 3:09 PM

LCDR Rabbah Rona Matlow — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 15:09:39 -0400

There are far more incidents of police shooting black men than of police shooting other minorities or whites. Some of these are justified. Statistics show black men are arrested at a rate over 10x that of whites. Some of it is legitimate, some of it is pure prejudice.

An example of the latter: a rich white man with some powder coke, no biggie, a black man with a small rock of crack - 20 years...

In this case, the dead man is alleged to have taken the cops stun gun in the scuffle. That is ADW and resisting arrest pure and simple, even if the man was not guilty of a crime prior to that. That being said, when the man is running away, he is no longer a threat.

I agree that this cop needs to be prosecuted - this is far more blatant than any other recent case. The thing is, though, that I don't think the charge should be murder. Why? The adrenaline response, which causes severe tunnel vision. Any vet who has been in a fire fight knows about this.

The appropriate charge in this case, imho, should be manslaughter. I suspect that SC is pushing state murder charges to avoid the riots that have happened in other places. I don't think the charge is justified.

Another thing to consider. If the prosecutor does not include all lesser charges, it's very likely this cop will be acquitted. I'm not a lawyer, but I just don't think they can prove murder here, because of the adrenaline response.

I hope that calm will prevail.

A friend of mine, a retired USAF SMSGt, who is also now clergy, and who at one time worked as a corrections officer, suggested that all beat cops should be COs first. Why? COs don't get guns. They have to learn how to control situations with their brains, their voice and if need be their body. I understand that the Los Angeles Sherrifs office requires all deputies to work two years as COs before becoming beat cops. If all departments through the country could do this, there would be far fewer gun incidents, because cops would know how to handle things.

Also, the "kinder-gentler" way of teaching cops, I think, has hurt them. In olden days cops rarely shot people because they knew, right or wrong, how to subdue suspects. These days, with ACLU lawsuits, cameras everywhere, etc., cops are afraid to take action until it's too late. That isn't the case in every shooting incident (cf Cincinnati where the rookie cop, who had been fired from another department, fired as soon as he exited the patrol car, even though there was no threat), but it is, I am sure, always in the cops' mind.

In general, I am opposed to prosecuting cops and soldiers, because the fear factor of being prosecuted for doing your duty can cause people to hesitate and get killed in action.

In cases where soldiers are already suffering PTSD when they commit crimes (Russell and Bales) they should not have been prosecuted for murder, since they were in no way in "their right mind". I think the attorneys in both cases failed in their duties, because the Army, as a rule, refuses to properly deal with PTSD, and these cases are the result...

Response by SSG Dwight Amey MSA, MSL, BS, AS made Apr 8 at 2015 3:16 PM

SSG Dwight Amey MSA, MSL, BS, AS — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 15:16:17 -0400

This officer showed a textbook reason why we had the Fleeing Felon Act back in the 1960's. I believe it was repealed. If so, he probably felt a little justified. If so.. I can see shooting another taser if he had another one available (escalation of force kind of thing).

We need to focus our attention on the fact that he is a police officer and not a white police officer shooting and killing a black unarmed man as is evident to see.

No, we need to look at the police department's rules of engagement specifically in the area of discretion on when to use lethal force. Discretion is a slippery slope for police administrators.

Here is my take: in the military we have rules of engagement cards that change on each deployment to adjust to the changing political conditions. I kind of felt more pressure not to fire as i returned on the following deployments.

Police work hard and put their lives on the line for many innocent. In this case, based off the video evidence it appears they either get numb to the humanity of criminal behavior, or need assistance with coping with the stress of the job. There is no excuse and he should be charged with murder. This appears to go farther than excessive force. Clearly. I just cannot in absolute fact determine what went through his mind about the victim while he was unloading his clip. I suspect he will never tell either.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 4:40 PM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 16:40:18 -0400

As a police officer of 18 years and a supervisor of 8, I have worked in many different units within my PD. Patrol, street crimes, narcotics, and detective bureau. I work in a diverse city with housing projects. I have had encounters where I have drawn my gun numerous times, fortunately I have never fired it at a person. This video is extremely disturbing. The officer appeared to have no remorse. Im guessing he was probably was in shock... I can't understand why he didn't just run after him and tackle him. They were in a park like setting in broad daylight and Mr. Scott did not appear to be a track star. He looked kind of slow and frail. This is a black eye to police everywhere. It fosters disrespect for police across the country. It's ashame that a man is dead and another going to jail. Besides the two of them... Two families are destroyed. There is a lot of collateral damage.. The officer is to blame and the whole thing is sad.

Response by Capt Brandon Charters made Apr 8 at 2015 5:24 PM

Capt Brandon Charters — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 17:24:12 -0400

I agree that this is indeed a murder case. I'm also weary of convicting someone when you can only see part of this story. I find it interesting that the video suddenly starts when the suspect ends the struggle and runs away, and before you can see what all he has reached for. I've seen other videos with similar one sided videos. The body cameras seem to be a good cross-reference is situations like this. This officer made a terrible decision. I just hope we don't continue to incriminate all officers because of a few that broke strict ROEs. Just like the military, we all get a bad name when one stray decides to not follow the rules.

Response by SGT Craig Northacker made Apr 8 at 2015 7:38 PM

SGT Craig Northacker — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 19:38:12 -0400

Shooting anyone in the back is bad news if they are not someone trying to kill you and you got the drop first. Shooting an unarmed guy in the back and killing him with 8 shots - what happened to the warning shot? One thing I learned extremely well in the military is how much discipline it takes to not take out the wrong person, and also when you should pull the trigger or not, at what, and so on. I was invited to a training of martial arts for a police department. I was horrified that these cops were as poorly trained as they were-because this puts them in the worst position of not being able to execute the moves properly but thinking they can. I brought this up to the sponsor of the event who agreed, but it underscores how much of a load is placed on our cops to begin with. There are a tremendous amount of great cops out there doing a good job, and often under difficult circumstances, but the ones that snap like this guy did make it a tragedy all the way around.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 7:58 PM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 19:58:42 -0400

I do not know all the exenuauting circumstances, it appears this man was a major threat to society, and could not be let free. (From a police perspective) power corrupts, absolute power, absolutely corrupts.

What I don't understand is this: why in a fleeing criminal scenario, do officers not fire at the legs, feet or knees, clearly in this case, he was no longer a threat.

This is a white cop killing a black man and this cop will never have a fair trial in many states, in my opinion.

Just like any profession, there are good doctors, attorneys, mechanics, baristas, and there are probably just as many bad ones as well.
Call me a cynic, I've been called worse.

Do I think it was murder? It sure as hell looked ominious, and whatever he did with his tazer seems a bit devious. I could have been the man on the ground, face down, I'd want justice as well, if it were me. Guess you're no longer safe to run from the police.

Response by SSG Gerhard S. made Apr 8 at 2015 8:24 PM

SSG Gerhard S. — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 20:24:27 -0400

I don't know how often this happens, but I do know that officers who act in this manner deserve to be treated the same as anybody else who is caught, charged, tried and convicted of the same actions.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 8:53 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 20:53:36 -0400

What I don't understand is how American lives are expendable. Why can police shoot unarmed civilians and then use the excuse that their life was in danger.. I'm no hero but I have been deployed a hell of a lot I have seen and been in my fair share of gun fights and never have I been in a position where the use of deadly force was authorized against unarmed civilians. Do bystanders get in the way and sometimes struck by gunfire.. Yes but to intentionally shoot a person in the back that was not actively assaulting you or trying to harm you is Murder and this isn't the first time... this is bigger than this current situation, this is a system problem.. maybe its time to take the gun away and issue billy clubs.. I bet we would see a change in the attitude in law enforcement and how they deal with people

Response by Cpl Karl Gleason made Apr 8 at 2015 9:06 PM

Cpl Karl Gleason — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 21:06:49 -0400

Very bad press for Law Enforcement lately..........sad. I'm not seeing the 3 controlling factors being utilized.

Response by CPT Ahmed Faried made Apr 8 at 2015 9:25 PM

CPT Ahmed Faried — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 21:25:25 -0400

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2015/04/07/3644189/everything-police-said-walter-scotts-death-video-showed-really-happened/

Everything The Police Said About Walter Scott’s Death Before A Video Showed What Really Happened

A unique opportunity to observe how one police officer sought to avoid accountability for his actions.

Response by 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2015 9:29 PM

2LT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 21:29:46 -0400

Imagine what would happen if there weren't any footage. Maybe now people will start to believe not all shootings were justified and not all victims were guilty. Unnecessary but RIP sailor.

Response by COL Charles Williams made Apr 8 at 2015 10:13 PM

COL Charles Williams — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 22:13:03 -0400

I don't think this happens on regular basis, but I think the media want us to believe that. As a career Soldier and law enforcement professional, I can tell you all police officers (military and civilian) know the rules, and know they alone have to be able explain their own actions when they decide to employ deadly force.

Based on what I saw on the news (which, we all know is biased one way or the other), this Officer was clearly wrong shooting at a subject who was fleeing and appeared to pose no imminent threat to him or anyone else. Hence, he should have been charged.

But, this video is only part of the story. It looks bad.

Take Ferguson for example... What the media told us all, and what actually happened there were quite a bit different.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Apr 8 at 2015 10:29 PM

SFC Mark Merino — Wed, 08 Apr 2015 22:29:27 -0400

My OCD demands I make a comment and put this to 75 comments.....

Response by GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad made Apr 9 at 2015 2:11 AM

GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 02:11:25 -0400

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/a-look-at-key-players-in-fatal-shooting-by-police-officer/ar-AAaBAK0

A look at key players in fatal shooting by police officer

NORTH CHARLESTON, S.C. — A look at some of the main people involved in the fatal shooting of a black man by a white police officer in North Charleston.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2015 2:12 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 02:12:41 -0400

There is a lot that this video does not show I don't know what lead up to that. It does not look very good for the officer but there are a lot of details missing from the video so I will hold my judgment of was this right or wrong until I have more facts.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2015 6:43 AM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 06:43:49 -0400

The kind of thing (Murder) that i expect to see in a Movie or third world country. Only thing is , it happens all the time to one degree or another as anybody can confirm by watching a You-Tube video on almost any given day.
American Police are being trained by Instructors that were trained by Killers , could be a friendly , so called Ally providing the seminars / class room indoctrination (ISRAEL).
We stop this by condemning the Police Brass and destroying them any way possible with in the LAW. Other wise you get this crazy show (Murder) and the freak show that follows with the Police Brass suddenly jumping up and demanding the individual Officer be hung.
American Society is in danger and it will trigger a backlash.

Response by PV2 Violet Case made Apr 9 at 2015 6:53 AM

PV2 Violet Case — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 06:53:28 -0400

IN the one shooting that caused the riots I feel in my heart that police officer had the right to shoot that boy had a record a mile long and had a weapon. In this case this was a set up, this man did not take that taser it shows that and it was planted next to the body. I do bet this colored man has been harassed in the past and possibly hurt before and ran in fear. But this gives no office rights to shot in the back. If there are no weapons involved the person is not in arms length either to cause bodily harm that officer needs to wait for back up. But yet wait the back up??? was there and not helping to administer first aide. IF it would not have been caught on video to prove what happened would the city still say and feel the same way because maybe this guy has gotten away with it before and figured he could again. I have seen some be harassed to no end and this must stop. Not only to citizens but our veterans as well. He needs to have his badge taken permanently the aiding policeman needs to be suspended for aiding in this murder and doing nothing. So aiding officer is just as guilty for helping it look as tho the taser was with the guy shot. So why is that office not being charged for a cover up?

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Apr 9 at 2015 7:07 AM

MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 07:07:52 -0400

Kind of a combination of the choices. I think this kind of stuff does happen - not often but it does happen and this guy got caught red handed.

Based on the video this guy crossed over to the dark side BIG TIME. IF the suspect grabbed his taser then ran, when was the officer's life in danger?? and then what looks like a plant after the subject was cuffed - awfully suspicious! What is shocking and disturbing is that the officer is calm and collective like he's on a pistol range.

Now with everything shown thus far I think its premature to throw the race card. its unfortunate that a difference in race in a police/suspect shooting is an automatic trigger for a racial issue.

Response by SPC Daniel Edwards made Apr 9 at 2015 7:59 AM

SPC Daniel Edwards — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 07:59:36 -0400

I am wondering if they are taught not to shoot someone that is moving away from them. In combat arms, we are taught to not engage an enemy if they are not facing us and if they are not posing a threat to anyone else. This guy was running away. I personally would not have shot him unless I knew for sure he was an immediate threat.

Response by CPT Zachary Brooks made Apr 9 at 2015 9:04 AM

CPT Zachary Brooks — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 09:04:15 -0400

It appears the officer failed to warn the suspect before firing, according to an eye witness.

http://news.yahoo.com/protest-planned-white-sc-officer-charged-murder-092432016.html

Response by MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P made Apr 9 at 2015 12:32 PM

MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 12:32:15 -0400

As a former LEO myself, from what I see of the situation, this was a bad shoot. Video notwithstanding, it would appear the officer's own statement would be grounds to prosecute him for murder (probably 2nd degree or manslaughter). It's very difficult to prove self-defense when the suspect is facing AWAY from you and all your rounds strike him/her in the back.

Hopefully the DA and IAB do their jobs correctly. If charges are appropriate, then he should be subject to the full weight of the judicial system.

Response by SSG John Erny made Apr 9 at 2015 12:47 PM

SSG John Erny — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 12:47:10 -0400

That is cold blooded murder.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2015 1:28 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 13:28:57 -0400

I believe it is important to let the investigation into the entire event run its course before jumping to wild conclusions. Obviously what is seen on the video is bad for the Officer but doesn't account for what happened prior to the shooting - and yes - 8 rounds fired to is excessive.

If the Officer is in the wrong - yes try him for murder. If the facts prove otherwise then obviously a different path will be taken.

Response by MSgt Charles Johnson made Apr 9 at 2015 2:31 PM

MSgt Charles Johnson — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 14:31:22 -0400

The ballistics would have shown (if there were no videos) that he shot him in the back, approx distance, and the body position when the bullets hit. The officer would have been investigated regardless. As to the situation, certainly looks like a bad call. I wonder, what in the heck the officer was thinking. Was he thinking, the guy grabbed my taser, I warded him off, he still has it (note I think its on the ground) so I can't let him escape. Or was he thinking murder. The officer has the duty to restrain the individual. Do other video's (they say they have) show that the officer was injured and incapable of chasing him down? Most officers will tell you they do not let anyone who attacks an Officer escape...no matter what...because if you attack an Officer, you certainly will attack anyone else you come across during your escape. Interesting case here. I'm not liking that video, but, withhold judgement until the court shows more evidence. I did notice that after the Officer shot him, he glanced directly into the camera. Interesting reaction on his part after seeing it (if he saw it.).

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2015 2:32 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 14:32:04 -0400

Even if 99% of police are good, there are still going to be thousands of bad cops. Thousands of bad cops out there is a serious problem, at the same time we need to remember that the vast majority put their lives on the line for us day in and day out... and they deserve our gratitude and respect.

Response by MSgt Garrick Hill made Apr 9 at 2015 4:35 PM

MSgt Garrick Hill — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 16:35:59 -0400

It is a shame that this idiot with a gun and a badge did this. This action by one individual will be spun up so much and further put a black eye on the reputation of the 99.999% of those in law enforcement who are morale and just in their actions.

Response by Capt Brandon Charters made Apr 9 at 2015 7:35 PM

Capt Brandon Charters — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 19:35:03 -0400

Officer Slager's dash cam footage was just released.

Dash Cam Footage From Michael Slager's Patrol Car

Police released footage from officer Michael Slager's patrol car showing when he pulled over Walter Scott. Click here to get more: http://nydn.us/1Doje6X Sub...

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2015 7:38 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 19:38:06 -0400

I'm no SME on LE regulations but I am pretty sure shooting someone in the back is wrong. They are no longer a threat, just like you can shoot an intruder leaving your property. The justice system will continue to work, as it's been in similar cases.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2015 10:43 PM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Apr 2015 22:43:15 -0400

Response by CW4 Larry Curtis made Apr 10 at 2015 12:23 AM

CW4 Larry Curtis — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 00:23:53 -0400

Ok, if we are to base our decisions on this video alone, there is only one obvious conclusion you can reach. It pains me so much to say it, too, because I have had friends in Law Enforcement and I hate the beatings that our Law Enforcers have been taking lately in the arena of public opinion and the national media. These guys are in a constant state of combat readiness due to the nature of their jobs, except there are seldom any clear battle lines drawn for them or any clearly defined mission plans drawn up, other than to be alive and well at the end of their shift. I think there has been too much liberty taken on passing judgement by people who weren't there on the scene with them, let alone having ever walked in their shoes, so I am very slow and deliberate when it comes to calling foul on them. From my position in my armchair, however, I have to ask, like so many others, why the officer in this case felt it necessary to shoot at the man. If he had the means to ID him, I think he could have been apprehended again with more assistance. And based on that, I must agree with SSG Clayton Blackwell that this was most likely a bad shoot. This is further confounded by the fact that this is another case of a white cop vs black victim and we simply don't need anymore of this. And I feel certain the sentiment is the same down at the station and is probably being hammered into everyone as often as anyone thinks about it.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Apr 10 at 2015 1:30 AM

PO1 John Miller — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 01:30:54 -0400

This is another case of the cops thinking they're above the law and having a distinct lack of training. "Oh no, my suspect is running away. I'd better endanger the entire community and fire 8 bullets at him, because I'm too lazy to chase after him and take him down."

Response by SFC Jeff Stevenson made Apr 10 at 2015 4:47 AM

SFC Jeff Stevenson — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 04:47:20 -0400

The officer was wrong, and just my view after viewing the view, from pull over, to fleeing, and the eventual shooting. The officer was very calm, did not seem to be in any danger and when and if the perp tried to gain possession of his tazer, then he could have used deadly force. However, it was dropped as he attempted to flee, thereby ending his need for lethal force. He had the vehicle, he had the drivers information, and the fleeing just amounted to more charges. My view, and mine alone, the dept. was correct for dismissing and charging him with homicide, also adding to it was his attempt to stage the scene by laying the tazer closer to the body. He has no honor and has made all police officers look suspect.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2015 6:34 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 06:34:19 -0400

Police should all wear body cameras.

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2015 8:14 AM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 08:14:41 -0400

Sadly, from looking at what has been released this was probably a bad shoot.......of course the best way to not get by shoot by a police office is to not break the law or if you get pulled over follow directions and not run away.....but again this at least superficially to be a bad shoot.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2015 8:21 AM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 08:21:32 -0400

If anyone doubts that this was murder, please look for the longer version of this specific video and the additional videos out there. The NY Times has it, plus 2 other videos. Unfortunately the officers mic does not record what happens after the officer catches up with the victim.

This encounter originated as a traffic stop for a bad 3rd brake light. The victim was a deadbeat dad with a warrant for failure to pay child support and eventually fled the traffic stop on foot. The officer radioed for backup and you can hear sirens in the background of the video. The officer caught up to the victim in the park. Witnesses said the victim ran from the officer (again) in the park to avoid being Tasered by the officer in retaliation for making the officer chase him. It is unclear is the victim tried to hit the Taser out of the officer's hand before running away, but the officer pulls his weapon and fires into the victim's back as he ran away.

Immediately after shooting the officer radios in (on this video) that the victim took his Taser to create evidence to justify the shooting. After this video cuts off the officer jogs back to his Taser. A second officer arrives and the shooting officer drops the Taser next to the victim to create a crime scene that would justify the shooting. When the supervisor arrived on scene the shooting officer claimed the victim took the Taser and tried to use the Taser on the officer.

Response by MSG Robert Mills made Apr 10 at 2015 12:51 PM

MSG Robert Mills — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 12:51:39 -0400

This is definitely a bad result for all involved, did the guy deserve to be shot, maybe, maybe not? I suppose that depends on if he was actually fighting or attempting to resist arrest to an extreme that the officer felt threatened. Although shooting people in the back is not the social norm or considered acceptable in most circumstances it is however authorized in instances where the public is endanger or to save life. As for this unarmed arguement, well let me put this into terms that everyone should understand, if you are a 120lb female police officer trying to wrestle a 300lb coked up criminal well he poses a signifigant threat to her life just by size and strenth and not that thats justification for this particular incident, Im a 215lb male and would choose not to engage in a physical altercation with anyone that could potentially cause me harm so your chances of being engaged alternately are increased right away. As I said this is a bad thing for all invovled, but to demonize the entire Law Enforcement community is really a bad idea. There is other potential problems with media and cameras and everyone thinking just because they have a camera on they are able to do whatever they want because they have a video of it. If you want to take video of things I have no problem with that, however that video should be used both ways, and if it should show that the person taking said video is breaking laws they should be held accountable as well. I for one am tired of the unarmed arguement- and I am tired of the percieved race arguements and cries for reform because lots of people are shot and you only here about certain ones all the time for months and months, move on people because everyone is armed and has potential for violence.

Response by SGM Mikel Dawson made Apr 10 at 2015 1:15 PM

SGM Mikel Dawson — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 13:15:03 -0400

What pisses me off about this case and so many others this past year is how CNN and other new medias will talk to "witnesses", get their statements on air and go from there. What happened to the process of justice. In this case the mayor and police chief had taken the right steps, yet news medias want more and more and they present personal statements which shouldn't be aired, but taints public opinions. People like race baiting Al Sharpton continue to stick their nose in places it doesn't belong. From what I've seen and hear, the authorities are doing the right thing, so let justice take it's course.

Response by LCpl Mark Lefler made Apr 10 at 2015 1:31 PM

LCpl Mark Lefler — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 13:31:33 -0400

there was no reason for this level of force.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2015 1:54 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 13:54:21 -0400

This is how I see it.

It was bad decisions made all the way around. I respect police, I understand they are just doing their job and they also want to go home to their families. I also understand they are regular people with regular issues and opinions like everyone else.

This officer was dead wrong to shoot this man. I could even justify his actions if he shot the guy once in the leg but I dont understand how taking a taser equals to shooting someone EIGHT times in the back. This officer committed murder plain and simple. Lying on his police report to cover it up.

Now as a black man in America i say this. I tell my sons and younger friends and family and Soldiers to control a situation do not escalate it. It starts by respecting each other. Me respecting the police and that they have a job to do and the police to respect me as an American citizen.
When police pull me over, i dont argue with the police officer. I speak to them accordingly and give them the paperwork they ask for. I personally dont have time to argue and complain and video record a cop pulling me over. You dont know what's on that officers mind. I dont know if he is a bigot, racist, homicidal, depressed, or suicidal so Im not giving an officer ANY reason to shoot, tase, or arrest me. Its quicker for me to do what he tells me to and continue on with my day. If i have a problem with that officer ill get his badge number and go down and speak to a supervisor. Because if something happens to you, it might not be anyone there to record or make a video.

When i saw that man run (or jog, thats what it looked to me) from the officer i really thought he must have some type of murder warrant out on him. He ran because he had a child support warrant on him. If he was my family member and i could speak to him from the dead i would say "why did you run because of a child support?" Ok he wouldve went to jail BUT he would be alive. Just bad decisions on made on both sides.

Like i stated earlier. That cop knew exactly what he was doing and im glad he will be brought to justice and I hope he is in jail for a long time. Dudes like him make it harder for other GOOD cops to conduct their jobs safely now.

Response by SPC Johnny Velazquez, PhD made Apr 10 at 2015 3:14 PM

SPC Johnny Velazquez, PhD — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 15:14:34 -0400

No one is above the law. A few bad apples on the Police Force may think so, but their day of reckoning will come. In all walks of life, you have those who were probably bullies as youngsters, and have continued on this negative path through adult life. Let's face it. Thugs who don't want change, will continue to be as such. So sad that these malevolent individuals feel entitled. Blessings.

Response by SPC Lee Burner made Apr 10 at 2015 5:19 PM

SPC Lee Burner — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 17:19:00 -0400

Clearly a murder by the officer. It's unfortunate cause there are plenty of good cops out there but the media eats this stuff up and fans the flame making it seem like this occurs every time someone is stopped by the police which is just not true.

Response by SFC Stephen Hester made Apr 10 at 2015 5:32 PM

SFC Stephen Hester — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 17:32:38 -0400

I don't know the entire story or his motivation to shoot but it was clearly a bad decision.

Response by GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad made Apr 10 at 2015 7:46 PM

GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 19:46:58 -0400

If the police can't police themselves ...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2015/04/10/the-police-cant-police-themselves-and-now-the-public-is-too-scared-to-cooperate-with-them/?tid=HP_posteverything

The police can’t police themselves. And now the public is too scared to cooperate with them.

The citizen who recorded Walter Scott's killing was too afraid of the police to turn in his video.

Response by SFC Emerson "Zeus" Hazzard made Apr 10 at 2015 8:07 PM

SFC Emerson "Zeus" Hazzard — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 20:07:40 -0400

I think you are dealing with several issues here that are converging to create a perfect storm of police brutality. First of all you have a segment of the force that only wanted a badge because they were nerds and outcast in school and figured if I get a badge the “cool kids” will have to respect me. The problem with that is even with a badge you are still a coward and instead of “manning up” and taking a criminal to the ground by force you reach for your pistol because just like in 5th grade you are still a scared little kid ready to wet his pants. Secondly you have some police officers that are truly tough guys that have seen it all and are willing to do it all. The problem with that is you end up like me with Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. You may not shoot the criminal but if he pisses you off you may just beat him to death with your bare hands. If not for counseling I know without a doubt that many cut throat political types I ran into during my career would have been introduced to the business end of a back fist. Luckily because of my deep training in psychology I knew when I was about to explode and I went to get some counseling. I am going to take a wild guess that at least 80 percent of the police force suffers from some form of PTSD and oh by the way many officers were once soldiers who served in combat. Thirdly many young black males do not realize that many of the policemen that stop them are either suffering from PTSD or terrified. If they knew that they should act accordingly by following instructions and not trying to run. They should know that the cop is afraid to engage you physically so you can expect to get shot. Two of the most dangerous people you can cross in society are a coward and a person with untreated PTSD. I have no doubt that had my PTSD gone untreated there would be no less than 15 people, no longer with us. Young black man if you are reading this, this is what is walking up to your car window asking you for license and registration. Those are the quote unquote “good police officers” Now add to that a racist coward or a racist officer with PTSD and you might as well start making funeral arrangements. I do not for one minute think all police are bad but you will not convince me for one second that you can deal with killers, rapist, pedophiles and organized criminals without developing PTSD. As far as I am concerned I do not care if you kill me because you are a coward, have untreated PTSD or are a racist. Either way I won’t be celebrating Christmas this year. The solution is multipronged. First the police department needs to have an ongoing program to treat PTSD among its ranks. Secondly the police need to weed cowards out. Thirdly young black males need to recognize and understand that when you are encountering a law officer your life is in the balance for any one; or several reasons. By the way I am from South Carolina and have dealt with cops that fit all the qualities described above. I knew from the jump my life was in danger but I never understood why until I studied psychology and organizational behavior.

Response by Capt Mark Strobl made Apr 10 at 2015 8:21 PM

Capt Mark Strobl — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 20:21:35 -0400

From the video, the poor guy doesn't look like he is imposing ANY threat to the officer --or anyone else for that matter. What the video doesn't show is what happened leading up to this. Regardless, the suspect was attempting to disengage and the officer busts a few caps. In this case, there is NO way I could support/justify the use of deadly force. Additionally, the "supporting" reports filed by his fellow officers (as reported by most of the "biggies") seem to be fraudulently written as well. I smell a lot more than one skunk in the woodpile here. Glad I won't draw jury duty on this one: IMO, the video evidence supports the ensuing murder charges.

To all of you men (and women) who wear a badge and walk that thin blue line, I support you. You've got a downright crappy job --sorting out the criminals from those who just wanna-be-thugs. I'll never understand the personality who can yield a weapon in one arm while giving a hug with the other. Like our fellow service-members, you're a special breed.

Carry On!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2015 8:36 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 20:36:49 -0400

The police officer made a terrible decision in this case. He was clearly running away and unarmed. He should be charged and prosecuted. However I will say this, STOP RUNNING FROM THE POLICE!!!!! He shouldn't have ran and put himself in that spot to begin with, he didn't deserve to lose his life, but he shouldn't have ran.

Response by Cpl Peter Martuneac made Apr 10 at 2015 10:19 PM

Cpl Peter Martuneac — Fri, 10 Apr 2015 22:19:27 -0400

This only seems like a trend because they don't report on the tens of thousands of good officers who make hundreds of thousands of good decisions every day. But yes, this guy was totally in the wrong and should be hit with 3rd degree murder.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 11 at 2015 12:21 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 11 Apr 2015 00:21:52 -0400

Dumb ass cop. Handcuffing him was useless, because forensics would've shown him CLEARLY shooting the man in the back. Not only that, but putting cuffs on him means you shot a 'CUFFED' man in the back, who was EVEN LESS of a 'threat'.

Dummy.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 11 at 2015 3:23 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 11 Apr 2015 03:23:37 -0400

I think that split second decisions are made everyday by police officers and sometimes those decisions are right and sometimes they are wrong. Everyone is going to react different to the same situation that is human nature, but from I gather from the new reports I have seen and read this officer made the wrong decision. It is always said that you can start with a higher level of force and decrease it as the situation dictates, and this officer for whatever reason choose to use deadly force to stop the individual. We can sit here all day long and debate on how the situation should of been handled, but unless you were there then you will never know what was going through that officers mind. In this society where technology is everywhere and with the spotlight on the police like it has been for awhile all your choices are going to be scrutinized.

Response by GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad made Apr 11 at 2015 10:12 AM

GySgt Wayne A. Ekblad — Sat, 11 Apr 2015 10:12:02 -0400

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2015/04/10/south-carolina-investigators-say-they-thought-fatal-police-shooting-was-suspicious-before-video-emerged/?tid=hpModule_4697cf50-868d-11e2-9d71-f0feafdd1394&hpid=z13

S.C. investigators say they thought fatal police shooting was suspicious before video emerged

Many have wondered what would have happened in the case had the graphic video of the shooting not emerged.

Response by Capt Jeff S. made Apr 11 at 2015 10:24 AM

Capt Jeff S. — Sat, 11 Apr 2015 10:24:13 -0400

I don't think it is common, nor do I think it is rare. It disturbs me that we are militarizing our police force and it is changing how they view and handle the public. A militarized police force views the public as the enemy. I'm concerned that our police have had their jobs morph from being public servants whose motto was "to serve and protect" to public sector employees tasked with putting the FORCE into law enforcement. They seem to have forgotten who pays their salaries and far too many view the public they serve as perps needing to be arrested for every minor infraction of the law. In their defense, they have to deal with an increasingly lawless public that makes their jobs both difficult and dangerous.

What disturbs me most about this particular incident is that the police escalated a situation that could have been handled differently and then tried to cover up the wrongdoing.

Response by Maj Mike Sciales made Apr 11 at 2015 1:30 PM

Maj Mike Sciales — Sat, 11 Apr 2015 13:30:09 -0400

I went to 2 police academies, worked as a cop for 7 years, worked as a prosecutor and defense counsel. I've developed and taught "use of force" for decades, been a firearms instructor and generalist investigator. This is a straight up murder which might be compounded by him flaking the deceased. I do not know of any person I ever worked with who would watch this tape and see it as a "good shoot." I also knew people who became cops because they were bullied in school and went on to become a bully. I knew cops who were too stupid to understand what the elements of a crime were (and their importance in making an arrest). I knew cops who were afraid of black people just because they were black some cops hate them for that reason as well. I knew cops who dreamed of "thumping" people and kicking somebody's ass on a daily basis. These were in the clear minority -- but they were there and they were offensive. These fully unqualified people make life so hard for everybody: citizens, other cops, the legal system. We need a national police standards and qualification process -- one that can transfer unilaterally across the US (much like the UK) and we need to develop professional police administrators, not simply promote cops up through the ranks. We need to ramp up training and accountability. Every time a police officer discharges a weapon it needs to be reported and tracked. This is way too frequent a story in this country.

Response by SPC Casey Ashfield made Apr 11 at 2015 2:03 PM

SPC Casey Ashfield — Sat, 11 Apr 2015 14:03:17 -0400

There is some ambiguity in the poll options so I will add my own thoughts here.

This is straight up murder. Unlike previous "celebrity" police interactions like the Wilson shoot in Ferguson, there is no visible threat to the officer or community in this case.

I would like to believe "bad guy with a badge" incidents like this are relatively rare. And for the moment I still do believe that. The typical outlook lately is that every police officer is a bad guy with a badge/gun and there is no such thing as a good police officer. In my experience I have many friends who are police officers or other members of the law enforcement community. And I hope to be one as well after my military service.

Response by LTC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2015 12:26 PM

LTC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 12 Apr 2015 12:26:16 -0400

I am glad that the officer is under investigation and has been fired. The video evidence is brief (more has been released since), but it is certainly damning. I am very sorry for the victim and his family and quite frankly, I feel for the family of the officer as well. From what I can see, the police department is handling this properly, has refused to allow this to be politicized and this guy will receive justice (Lord willing). I suppose some more evidence could come to light which might change my perspective on this incident, but I have a hard time conceiving of what that could be.

I'm not willing to make broad generalizations about LEOs in general based on one man's incredibly stupid decision. Police officers are human beings with a very tough job and sometimes they make mistakes. And yes, there are bad LEOs who abuse their position, but I don't think that characterizes all or even most of them. Nor do I think this is a training issue. I'm not in law enforcement, but I'm pretty sure most police officers are trained not to shoot an unarmed 50 year old who is running away from you.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2015 4:46 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 12 Apr 2015 16:46:14 -0400

I think the whole situation is a basket of shit.

What upsets me, are your own personal words. "the end of the video shows him handcuffing the victim… who may have still been alive, and walking away."

1) That's how I was trained in the Police Academy. You handcuff the person you shot. The theory is all about securing the scene. Making it safe for EMT's to get in and get them out. If they can move freely and grab for potential weapons, the scene is not safe for EMT's or Fire.

2a) Walking away. Another thing trained. You walk away from the incident, even if it's a few feet, to decompress. To calm down. If available, to call your FOP/Union and get Legal Representation.

2b) Walking away. Until just this week, I've had to pay out of pocket and on my own time, for any sort of Medical Training, since my ETS. Depending on Agency Size and the response time of Fire or EMS, Agencies may actually discourage Officers from getting any medical training. It's really not that uncommon for a Law Enforcement Officer to not be medically trained.

Response by SPC David Shaffer made Apr 12 at 2015 7:59 PM

SPC David Shaffer — Sun, 12 Apr 2015 19:59:23 -0400

Looks like the officer took a bad shot. I will never let a few stories blown up by the media decide my opinion. I have nothing but respect for Officers of the law. They have a hard job that has recently been made a lot harder because of these incidents.

Response by SPC Angel Guma made Apr 13 at 2015 1:27 AM

SPC Angel Guma — Mon, 13 Apr 2015 01:27:34 -0400

But if we're going to extend a critical eye, lets extend it to all people hiding behind their professions and creeds.

1. Policing murdering people and hiding behind their badge
2. Race rioters that murder innocent shopkeepers and bystanders
3. Clergy that steal church funds for gambling
4. Politicians that lie.
5. Lawyers that throw innocent men behind bars and guilty men free.
...

And name other tricksters I haven't thought of. Blame the police, but blame other people just as vitriolically.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 13 at 2015 1:33 AM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 13 Apr 2015 01:33:17 -0400

Not to be devil's advocate, but wasn't the guy initially trying to flee because he didn't want to go to jail for unpaid child support?

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made May 20 at 2015 9:36 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 20 May 2015 09:36:55 -0400

I was on the police's side on the cases of Michael Brown, Eric Garner and even 12 y/o Tamir Rice. Police officers have difficult split-second decisions to make and their job is extremely dangerous. It basically boils down to this: be a law-abiding citizen, obey police commands (even if you think you're right) and don't be waving toy guns at police. Now, shooting someone in the back 8 times won't get you sympathy from anyone. That is murder; there's no better way to put it.

Response by CPT Ahmed Faried made Jun 2 at 2015 12:10 PM

CPT Ahmed Faried — Tue, 02 Jun 2015 12:10:09 -0400

Down-voted because " If we keep talking about the issues how will they go away"

Response by SSG Roger Ayscue made Jun 21 at 2015 8:05 PM

SSG Roger Ayscue — Sun, 21 Jun 2015 20:05:59 -0400

I see why people are up in arms over this. I think a TASER would be sufficient, BUT NOT a single one of us was on the scene. Not one of us knows what happened or what led the officer to be going after him in the first place. Not one of us knows why the man who was shot refused to comply with the officer's directions.
In nearly every one of the Police Shooting videos I have ever seen, the shooting could have been avoided IF the individuals involved with officers had simply done as the officer instructed. Stop, Put down the --whatever, hands up, all not really tough requests.

I understand that in some of the minority communities, there is way way more Police on civilian incidents. There is way more interaction between inhabitants and Police because the police get called to those neighborhoods way way more times than they get called to my neighborhood. There is no one on my street selling drugs and normally anyone that breaks into a house out in the boonies where I live, well the homeowners normally shoot the bad guys themselves. But there is also, in those neighborhoods more likelihood of resistance, armed, and unarmed to the direction of Police.

I hate to say it, but, in most of the videos that I have seen, had the individual that ended up shot or beaten just SHUT UP and done what the officer told them to do, allowed the Officer to gain control of the situation, and then worked it out, they would still be alive today. There is no denying that some officers go too far too fast and have a god complex, but that is not the case in every one of them.

Response by Maj Mike Sciales made Jun 22 at 2015 12:44 PM

Maj Mike Sciales — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 12:44:32 -0400

This is just a murder, plain and simple. Zero justification under any rule of force analysis. I went to 2 police academies and one law school. I used to advise on "use of Force" issues. This is just wrong and I know it happens way more than is reported. If 500 Americans are already dead this year at the hands of the police and this is news as you read the words, tells me we have a huge problem. It all starts with recruitment and selection. We need to fix this in an era when Departments don't have the resources to hire or train the very best. Maybe a national curriculum taught at regional academies. Might make good fiscal sense as well and provide cops who can transfer to any state or city. Like the Brits.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jun 22 at 2015 2:05 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 14:05:07 -0400

It's very disturbing to think that the correct course of action for the police against unarmed people is to shoot them.

Response by SPC George Rudenko made Jun 25 at 2015 4:49 PM

SPC George Rudenko — Thu, 25 Jun 2015 16:49:43 -0400

Murder is murder. That said many departments have a policy (fed included) that all arrestees must be cuffed including those injured or shot. DHS has that policy

Response by CDR Michael Goldschmidt made Sep 29 at 2016 1:48 PM

CDR Michael Goldschmidt — Thu, 29 Sep 2016 13:48:27 -0400

Power corrupts.

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Jan 24 at 2018 1:08 PM

SSG Edward Tilton — Wed, 24 Jan 2018 13:08:20 -0500

What was the underlying offense?
Did this offender pose a risk to others if not stopped?

Response by SPC David Willis made Jan 24 at 2018 1:56 PM

SPC David Willis — Wed, 24 Jan 2018 13:56:32 -0500

Whats even more disturbing than the actual killing is the fact that the officers can hide behind anonymity, faces blurred and names withheld. They get full benefit of the doubt and have countless people telling others condescendingly they "don't know what its like to be in that situation" (ironically 90% of the folks who make that comment have never been in that situation either). People make snide remarks like "play stupid games win stupid prizes". The victim on the other hand gets no such treatment their name is released instantly and hours later their entire life is on display for the public to dissect. They are instantly found guilty in the court of public opinion and cant defend themselves because the side of the brain that can make cognitive arguments is dripping out the back of their skull. That bar fight you got in at age 22? That makes you a violent offender... That suspended license from accumulated points? That makes you an individual who has a "pattern of breaking the rules"... He smoked weed??? Hang him now!!!