Regardless of what regulations may or may not say regarding the issue of shaving, does being unshaven reflect an unprofessional appearance?

2014-03-30T16:59:59-04:00

Just curious as to popular opinion especially in light of the argument that not shaving is unprofessional.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Mar 30 at 2014 5:03 PM

2014-03-30T17:03:33-04:00

Nope.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 30 at 2014 5:07 PM

2014-03-30T17:07:32-04:00

Sir,

It can, much like haircuts it is something that would need to be maintained. I for one feel like beards can be very professional. However strict guidelines would have to be put into place to ensure Soldiers don't grow faddish beards or sideburns. Give them and inch...

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Mar 30 at 2014 5:46 PM

2014-03-30T17:46:42-04:00

Sir, I can't really grow a lot of facial hair so a beard-off with you will not end in me being a victor lol. As long as the SM is clean shaven while in uniform I think that is fine. If you are at home grilling shrimp on the bar-b-q, working on your car, or chopping wood I think you are just fine.

Response by SPC Christopher Smith made Mar 30 at 2014 5:49 PM

2014-03-30T17:49:26-04:00

My personal belief is there is nothing unprofessional about a bread or mustache. I have a feeling that someone at some point in time said they didn't like them, had the power to change things and it has been passed down since. 

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 30 at 2014 5:56 PM

2014-03-30T17:56:33-04:00

This question should be ask to this Soldier/Colonel.

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 30 at 2014 6:40 PM

2014-03-30T18:40:52-04:00

Scare the enemy off with a bunch of bald headed, bearded, tattooed guys! That would be great until the enemy gassed them and no ones protective mask would seal. But seriously, I would rock some mutton chops.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 30 at 2014 9:54 PM

2014-03-30T21:54:17-04:00

Absolutely not.  General Lee, General Grant, the SOF operators who won the initial ground war in OEF all were bearded.  The no beard nonsense came from the 1950s when men took their hats off inside, let women enter vehicles first and leave last, basically the leave it to beaver era.<br><br>There's no logical reasoning, other than CSMisms of I don't like it (AKA un-professionalism) to prevent a nice trimmed beard.  Sikhs have proven the gas mask reason as not true.<br>

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 31 at 2014 6:57 PM

2014-03-31T18:57:51-04:00

I don't believe not shaving looks unprofessional if maintained and trimmed. Nothing against the Duck Dynasty guys (love the show and definitely going to take some time off shaving when I retire) but I think just letting it go doesn't lend to a professional look. As for in the military, if I'm not mistaken, the issue of shaving has nothing to do with looking professional. It has to do with interfering with your pro mask sealing properly.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Apr 1 at 2014 12:02 AM

2014-04-01T00:02:34-04:00

Generally you hear the gas mask argument, but really, that's as simple as "don't have a beard in an NBC environment". There's no reason why some obscure, likely never going to happen scenario should impact your day to day life. I mean, we COULD have to use our masks, sure,  but we also COULD have to fight off alien land sharks..

Response by SPC David Dunn made Apr 1 at 2014 1:47 AM

2014-04-01T01:47:19-04:00

It should be allowed in a daily uniform as long as it is neatly trimmed and kept.

Mandatory to shave while wearing a dress uniform? That would would reasonable.

We would have to shave in the field/deployment where running water or bathrooms weren't available. I'm medical so I'll take this stance: Voluntarily introducing fresh cuts and pathways to enter the body in a environment less than hygienic invites the possibility and susceptibility to infection and/or disease. Shaving should be discouraged in these environments.

In a daily garrison setting, let them grow it out, neatly, unless they are attending any function where a dress uniform will be worn.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Apr 1 at 2014 7:41 AM

2014-04-01T07:41:35-04:00

We might be able to grow beards if we were fighting zombie hoardes.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2014 8:02 AM

2014-04-01T08:02:06-04:00

Sir, I will say that in my opinion not shaving does not create an unprofessional appearance. However, the inability and lack of discipline to follow a simple order displays unprofessional actions!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2014 11:02 AM

2014-04-01T11:02:17-04:00

For your regular rank and file military i feel that they should be shaven on duty. I view being unshaven as being unprofessional. Off duty is have no issues with people growning out their beards. I understand personel have shaving profiles, and I have no issues with that ether.

As for the SF types, they are still professonals even though they sport combat beards downrange. Thats SF, If you want to grow a beard in uniform, go talk to the local SF recruiter.

Many employers require their people to be clean shaven. You don't see a lot of police officers with beards do you?

Response by CPL Stephen Kirt made Apr 1 at 2014 12:22 PM

2014-04-01T12:22:06-04:00

The best idea I have seen regarding facial hair is to enforce a standard quite similar to a shaving profile, except for letting soldiers line it up so it's straight and even.

Response by Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 5 at 2014 4:40 PM

2014-07-05T16:40:57-04:00

I think a certain level of grooming is necessary to maintain a professional appearance.

This is what I would call an unacceptable beard: http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/736x/bc/39/0d/bc390d388a3bdd7298d82b0d3bf32b80.jpg

This is what I would call an acceptable beard: http://trekcore.com/gallery/albums/will_riker/thehunted034.jpg

The former is rather--ratty. It's a mess. The latter is well-groomed and taken care of. And who doesn't love Commander Riker from ST: Next Gen?

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 6 at 2014 9:40 AM

2014-12-06T09:40:45-05:00

I think being unshaven could present a look of unprofessionalism if not maintained properly. Yes obviously there are parts of the military where it is ok when deployed down range to grow them. But in my opinion if we are stateside we should be clean shaven.

Response by LCDR Doug Nordman made Dec 6 at 2014 11:36 AM

2014-12-06T11:36:18-05:00

I think "professional" is judged by how well you carry out a mission, not by how pretty you look when you're doing it.

Being a submariner inport was a constant uniform-appearance hassle. But when you were underway you wore coveralls, motivational t-shirts, comfy sneakers, and (at least) a two-day growth. If you wanted to go longer than a week then you paid the MWR Committee $5 to grow your beard. You'd even go 90+ days between haircuts. It was all part of the Das Boot image of being a steely-eyed killer of the deep.

We viewed the debate about face seals and air-fed masks as self-correcting during the next casualty. If you had to wear a mask for six hours on watch (atmosphere control problem or high airborne radioactivity in the engineroom) then you shaved and used baby powder just to minimize the skin irritation (acne, ingrown hairs) from the rubber seal.

One day we'll all be out of the military. When that happens, you'll either grow a beard or shave just often enough to keep it from getting itchy. Twice a week is about right...

Response by PO2 Corey Ferretti made Dec 6 at 2014 4:21 PM

2014-12-06T16:21:48-05:00

I do not think it shows unprofessionalism now that i am out i do not shave but i do have it neatly trimmed so that when i am at a clients barn don't look homeless. I know they like to say that facial hair will stop a seal on the gas mask but how is that possible when operators are unshaven im sure if this was the fact they would not be allowed to have beards. Look at old photos there was a time you could have a beard in the military you had to run a chit. Look at the Civil war Facial hair is a common denominator in those photos. Look at WW2 photos service members had a head full of hair now it is considered not good order and discipline unless you have a high and tight. I guarantee that no senior enlisted member would say they were unprofessional back in that time frame.

Response by SSG Roger Ayscue made May 24 at 2016 8:56 PM

2016-05-24T20:56:18-04:00

Not in my opinion, because the US Army allows some Soldiers to Not shave while forcing most soldiers to shave. IF ONE can not shave because He does not want to, then I should not have to shave because I do not want to.

Response by SGT Andrew Sherman made Oct 19 at 2017 1:35 PM

2017-10-19T13:35:07-04:00

Professionalism is about actions, not appearance. If insurgents had to attack a group of soldiers, either one that was baby faced, no tattoos, and short hair, or one with bearded, long haired, tattooed up, Viking looking berserkers, which one would they pick? I'd reckon they'd steer clear of the latter. Intimidation and striking fear in the enemy isn't just having bigger better guns. Basically, I'm saying beards could save lives and win wars.

Response by SPC John Decker made Oct 19 at 2017 1:58 PM

2017-10-19T13:58:01-04:00

I've read some of the other responses. I agree with most. My thinking goes to the uniformity issue. You'll always have that one guy, who can't grow a beard, who complains. Also, in my thinking, we surrender our individuality when we sign up. The military should be a uniform organization

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 19 at 2017 2:07 PM

2017-10-19T14:07:12-04:00

You can have neatly groomed facial hair that is completely professional. It's just like keeping the hair on your head within regulations.

Being overseas on a deployment, yeah sure I could see making someone shave just in case. However, as for those that are still back state side, I don't see the point. We have more important things to worry about than Jim, Joe, Bob having a neatly trimmed beard.

Response by PVT Jesse Young made Oct 19 at 2017 2:41 PM

2017-10-19T14:41:50-04:00

It’s not about professionalism it’s about readiness. Any environment can become an NBC environment at near fatal speed. Will you have time for a shave?

Response by CPL Nicholas Vitale made Oct 19 at 2017 5:32 PM

2017-10-19T17:32:01-04:00

Should be allowed to grow out facial hair during deployment as the gas mask theory was proven false. While State side clean cut to be precentable. I think that's fair enough.

Response by 1SG John B. Enlow made Oct 19 at 2017 6:42 PM

2017-10-19T18:42:51-04:00

Yes. It reflects an unprofessional appearance and an undisciplined military.

Response by SSgt Tim Fink made Oct 19 at 2017 9:06 PM

2017-10-19T21:06:41-04:00

I agree. You read alot of profiles say that is debunked. I’d love to test that theory. Is anyone who makes that claim willing to don a pro-mask over there beard and walk into a room with Sarin or Mustard gas?

Response by CPT Nick Bryan made Oct 20 at 2017 9:27 AM

2017-10-20T09:27:36-04:00

I think they aren't going to allow mostly because it's difficult to regulate. Define neatly trimmed, that can get very subjective. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a beard during Drill weekends. Shaving it every month sucks.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made May 31 at 2020 4:28 PM

2020-05-31T16:28:33-04:00

Many European and middle eastern nations allow beards. They maintain a standard (from what I’ve seen) and it looks quite professional. In fact, if you travel a lot in Europe and the Middle East as a US service member you stick out like a sore thumb thanks to the haircut and lack of facial hair. I think that there should be a discussion about facial hair in the military. As others have pointed out it was the norm for almost a century until WW1 as the fear of gas attacks at the time. It kind of feels like daily shaving in 2020 is in place simply because that’s how we’ve always done it.

Response by Sgt Dale Briggs made May 31 at 2021 7:07 PM

2021-05-31T19:07:31-04:00

Too many instances of past warriors who wore beards and their hair long, perfumed as well. SF guys are the epitome of the best of the best. I’d guess tradition, and nothing makes Top happier than a head buzzed so close it’s turned red.

Response by Cpl Christopher Bishop made May 31 at 2022 6:52 PM

2022-05-31T18:52:31-04:00

I think the very term “professional looking” has lost its intended meaning.

All it really means is “whaddya do for money, Honey” and Im pretty sure there are plenty of street hookers who have their own version in mind. Meanwhile some of the biggest crooks wear a knot in a piece of cloth dangling from their necks.

Perhaps the requirement should only apply to the non-camouflage uniforms. Perhaps a 1/2 length rule for all facial hair could be in place, just to stop some of the “deadweight SNCOs” from fussing over morning stubble right before PT...when you’re about to be sweating head to toes anyways. And “so is your gut” should be an acceptable response to my being told I am out of uniform due to my facial stubble.