School gun clubs were common in our schools in the 1950's. Should we bring them back and familiarize youths with the discipline of shooting?

2015-11-17T21:32:00-05:00

Are we doing our youths any favors by insulating them from the often violent world that surrounds them? Or does it make more sense to teach them the discipline of the gun?
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/338167/gun-clubs-school-charles-c-w-cooke

Gun Clubs at School

The notion of schools as “gun-free zones” flies in the face of history.

Response by SGM Steve Wettstein made Nov 17 at 2015 9:37 PM

2015-11-17T21:37:01-05:00

SSG Gerhard S. Brother that will not happen. The US is getting to wussified and PC for something like that.

Response by COL Sam Russell made Nov 17 at 2015 9:44 PM

2015-11-17T21:44:03-05:00

My first experience with the NRA was learning to fire a 22 cal. at Boy Scout summer camp. I then was able to hone my firing skills with air rifle marksmanship at JROTC my senior year of high school. My favorite rifle to fire, ever, was the M14 in college at VMI. Recently re-sighted the scope on my 30-30 and didn't enjoy it half as much as that M14.

Response by SSgt Alex Robinson made Nov 17 at 2015 9:59 PM

2015-11-17T21:59:18-05:00

We should bring that gun clubs even if it's just to teach firearm safety.

Response by Capt Seid Waddell made Nov 18 at 2015 12:33 AM

2015-11-18T00:33:45-05:00

We should teach marksmanship and encourage competitive shooting sports in schools. The kids will learn safety at the same time they gain skill and confidence with firearms.

If you think that firearm education is expensive, consider that the cost of firearm ignorance is paid for in blood.

Response by SP5 Michael Rathbun made Nov 18 at 2015 1:36 AM

2015-11-18T01:36:51-05:00

OK, I'm going with Door #2, "familiarize", because it is the most different from the two "have you stopped beating your wife?" options.

I am a cradle gun nut. As a kid, if I couldn't get a toy gun as a gift I would make my own out of tinker toys. One of my top favorite TV shows was "The Rifleman". My dad gave me a Daisy and set up a range in the basement where I could actually tell whether I had hit anything, and also retrieve at least 90% of the BBs. I got real good at that.

When I went to 4H summer camp around the age of 14 there was a mandatory firearms training thing you did; riding the horses was optional. Valuable.

Then NDCC in high school, when I qualified on the M1 (had the thumb to prove it). (Honk if you know what "M1 Thumb" is/was.) There was a single hole in the target after three rounds. Could still field strip one blindfolded (as long as there isn't a friendly joker dropping .50 cal parts into the mix).

And of course I shot Expert on M16 at Fort Lewis on my way to warmer climes.

Firearms are a reality in today's America. The way we stabilize the situation is not to undertake confiscation (although both of Australia's ventures into that were productive) but to treat firearms as potently destructive tools, just like automobiles, aircraft, or anything else you need to be trained and certified on. (We could do a better job of training drivers of automobiles in my not even slightly humble opinion.)

But we can't have J. Random Civilian wandering about with as much visible firepower as an entire rifle platoon in the Civil War but with no idea of appropriate use, trigger discipline...

I really miss the NRA that I remember from the '50s and '60s.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Nov 18 at 2015 2:03 AM

2015-11-18T02:03:44-05:00

Yes, yes, yes, yes...
I plan on teaching my own child to shoot in a couple of years. I've already got my eye on a few different .22lr plinking rifles for just that purpose!

Response by COL Mikel J. Burroughs made Nov 18 at 2015 7:45 AM

2015-11-18T07:45:39-05:00

SSG Gerhard S. I think it is a good idea, but our country has changed so much since some of the senseless shootings by troubled youth I doubt they would endorse such a move. I think it is important to understand everything there is about guns at an early age. My Grandfather taught me in the woods behind his house how to respect, handle, and use them safely. Something that satyed with me for my entire life. Just my opinion!

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 18 at 2015 11:05 AM

2015-11-18T11:05:51-05:00

My high school JROTC had an indoor shooting range. My instructors were fierce on weapon safety before we even walked into that range.

Response by Col Joseph Lenertz made Nov 18 at 2015 12:17 PM

2015-11-18T12:17:07-05:00

My first exposure was a Firearms Safety course my dad took me to before I was allowed to participate in family hunting trips. It was a great way to start.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 18 at 2015 6:05 PM

2015-11-18T18:05:28-05:00

While were are at it we should also go ahead reinstate segregation and take woman out of the workforce.

Response by SSG Gerhard S. made Nov 19 at 2015 10:12 AM

2015-11-19T10:12:16-05:00

http://www.redicecreations.com/article.php?id=34752

6 Time Felon Killed In Shootout By 13 Year Old During Home Invasion

Red Ice Creations

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 24 at 2015 6:47 PM

2015-11-24T18:47:35-05:00

Yes knowledge is power the more people know about how to use firearms the better. Firearms safety is a good thing responsible use and training of weapons is great. If people know more about weapons they will hopefully have more respect for them and less fear.

Response by LCpl Mark Lefler made Nov 24 at 2015 9:13 PM

2015-11-24T21:13:16-05:00

I love how all the choices are completely bias, cute.

Response by SSG Robert Webster made Jan 5 at 2016 11:20 AM

2016-01-05T11:20:41-05:00

We should bring them back.

Response by ENS Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 15 at 2016 12:40 AM

2016-10-15T00:40:10-04:00

Not only do I agree, I think it would tackle a major problem we have in this country. Many people are absolutely terrified of weapons, because they've never seen them, handled them, or heard of them outside of what has been shown on the news. They hear the word "gun" and they shiver. Introducing weapons to our children at a young age, starting with props and focusing on safety and the core rules will help mitigate our problems and demonization of these great resources. As our children age, introducing them into shooting courses and further stressing safety and perhaps the force continuum would be even more beneficial. The 1950s were onto something great. Imagine a nation of RESPONSIBLE gun owners. A generation of people who were able to safety handle a weapon, knew how to responsibly use it, and were able to protect not only themselves, but their nation if need be. This is the America I want to live in. Start with weapon safety and responsibility. Work into the force continuum, weapon familiarization, and finally shooting with accuracy. Perhaps towards the end of their highschool "career" add shooting under stress (with supervision). I'd imagine this would do our children, and our country a great deal of good.

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made Oct 15 at 2016 1:20 AM

2016-10-15T01:20:31-04:00

I see the question and choices obtained the predicted answer. We MILs understand more than others the historical importance, the rights, and the proper place and use for firearms. It seems obvious. However if you were to poll other demographics, the answer would be different. The AMA, generally more left leaning folk, etc. would go for the first answer and gripe about we're not doing a good enough job of just making all guns go away. The third option is awkward and self opposing although the liberal response is great for police and if you take all the guns away, there wouldn't be any for the criminals to use. The ability and resources to do that somehow can't enter the discussion.

I spend time in Europe every summer refereeing soccer tournaments. I have a lot of friends there who would be considered uber liberal here but just normally liberal there. They go apoplectic when I tell them guns are around, a normal tool, carry one all the time, you name it. They're evil, they make people evil, how can you possibly be responsible? I'm not responsible enough to own a firearm. The latter is telling and is a result of the propaganda that's been pounded into their heads from birth. I made a friend spit up her sushi when I said my small town is on the ISIS hit list and it'd be interesting if they tried to shoot up our church. We figure the pastor would get the first shots off being best able to see the door. What we have is a large society that is incapable of conceptualizing the notion of firearms. My sushi spitter says she doesn't want to come to the States because everybody is shooting everybody. Irrational doesn't begin to describe it. She's still twitching when I let her know I named my 460 Mag after her.

Be careful what freedoms you give away as they surely will not return. You just need to look at the helpless sheep elsewhere. BTW, the Swedes are an exception overall. Ex MIL Brits have a hard time getting a permit because they know how to use them, seriously that's the reason typically given.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Oct 15 at 2016 4:48 AM

2016-10-15T04:48:45-04:00

In PA, it was an authorized absence to miss the week of deer season. Guns in every truck, and not a single gun related incident.

Response by SFC Jerry Humphries made Oct 15 at 2016 11:24 AM

2016-10-15T11:24:14-04:00

When I was in high school in the 70's some students hunted on the way home from school and kept their long guns in the guidence counselor office during the school day. You woul never believe that was in upstate New York.

Response by SFC George Smith made Oct 15 at 2016 11:53 AM

2016-10-15T11:53:00-04:00

it would not work... because most of the Kids today are so Brainwashed...

Response by SFC Charles Temm made Oct 16 at 2016 11:53 AM

2016-10-16T11:53:48-04:00

Was in my high school's gun club. Enjoyed it but it was just additional range time for me as I was also a competing member of my town's shooting club!

Response by CSM Richard StCyr made Oct 17 at 2016 10:00 AM

2016-10-17T10:00:06-04:00

I grew up around guns, Dad taught us very young about safety and shooting. My Mother did trick and fancy shooting and up into her 60s could make a Marine cry with some of the shots she could make. In Scouting we participated in NRA sponsored ranges and competitions for marksmanship badges as well as Merit Badges.
In the 70's NH adopted an NRA safe hunter program that pretty much all of us attended and there were very few hunting accidents. Later in High School nearly everyone hunted after school so you would look out across the parking lot and see Rifles and Shotguns in the gun racks of damn near every pick up truck. Nearly everyone had a pocket knife also.
We had some knock down, drag out fist fights and never once did anyone feel compelled to gun up and sling rounds at each other or knife anyone.
So ya shooting sports and clubs would probably be a nice thing to bring back to school aged children but with the constant demonization of guns and owners by the media I don't see it happening.

Response by SGT Patrick Reno made Oct 18 at 2016 1:25 PM

2016-10-18T13:25:40-04:00

I know of one 4-H youth gun club here in North Idaho.

Response by SFC Charles Temm made Nov 25 at 2016 10:45 AM

2016-11-25T10:45:17-05:00

A good idea overall but impossible in today's political and legal environment. If you think football is expensive to get insurance policies for, think what it would cost to get a policy to allow shooting.

Never mind the pols/progs screaming bloody murder that kids were being taught to kill

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 3 at 2017 7:56 PM

2017-01-03T19:56:54-05:00

It's a great idea for children to learn about firearms and firearm safety. But a better idea is for people to QUIT LOOKING TO THE GOVERNMENT to solve our problem.

You want your kids to be familiar with firearms? Teach them yourself. You want them to know about your religion, or lack thereof? Teach them yourself.

Every time we look to the government to do what we can do ourselves, we create another wasteful, expensive government bureaucracy, headed up by a czar making a 6-figure income.

Response by LCpl Stephen Arnold made Mar 30 at 2017 3:26 PM

2017-03-30T15:26:04-04:00

I'm torn on this one. I'm a gun guy (you may have caught that from my profile pic). I know there are many out there (probably not here so much, you magnificent bastards) who are not, which is fine.

My point to them is; WHAT IF the child you've raised to hate, fear, ignore guns comes across one, or has a friend who does? Depending on the age of the child, some of them do not possess the wherewithal to deny their curiosity, and now we have a problem.

I like the idea of every kid being taught to handle one IF they come across one; I don't think, however, that it should be made mandatory. As you can see I'm all over the map but this is a tough topic.

Response by SSgt Boyd Welch made Oct 30 at 2017 12:42 PM

2017-10-30T12:42:54-04:00

I think it should be taught to any student with an interest. My first lesson was with my dad who took me into the woods with a handgun (38 revolver) at five years old. I could barely pull the trigger. He had me shoot a watermelon. He wanted me to see the destruction that the bullet caused so I would carry that mental image. In high school, students had rifles and shotguns in their pickups in the parking lot. No one was ever shot. Gun safety is an important tenet of firearms training. How, when, when not, and why you shoot.

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Feb 16 at 2018 6:32 PM

2018-02-16T18:32:05-05:00

How many children need to die because you need an AR-15 to go potty

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Feb 16 at 2018 7:56 PM

2018-02-16T19:56:30-05:00

My fiancée's

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Feb 16 at 2018 8:59 PM

2018-02-16T20:59:17-05:00

I never saw any "Gun Clubs" in the 50s. Not going to believe the City of Philadelphia wanted people armed. Even those pop guns shown were illegal there. Not much diversity in that group

Response by Assert Saum made Feb 17 at 2018 8:09 AM

2018-02-17T08:09:47-05:00

Fuck yes!

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2018 12:07 PM

2018-02-28T12:07:19-05:00

While I’m all for gun clubs, gun discipline and safety, etc., and am pro-2nd Amendment...... we are at a point in society where students...and adults...are ill equipped for not only that responsibility, but any responsibility. While the vast majority would do well, it just takes one bullied or “alternate” student and it could come crash down.
A return to morality, values, and ethical standards, personal accountability, citizenship, responsibility to American society, personal discipline and self-control, kindness/courtesy, respect, etc. are needed before firearm safety.
Train the mind before the hands, train the heart before the mind.
Just my thoughts as a chaplain and school teacher from the Deep South.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2018 2:06 PM

2018-02-28T14:06:45-05:00

If a school has the qualified personnel to teach it and offer it as an elective, fine. But not a mandatory class no. Also don't have it on campus anywhere. You'd also have to seriously vet all the kids who want to be in it.

Response by SPC David Willis made Feb 28 at 2018 2:58 PM

2018-02-28T14:58:41-05:00

I think its a financial impossibility to make this happen, and if it does happen I would want it to either be every public school in the state does it or everyone doesn't. This is not a class that should only be given to wealthier communities public schools.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2018 10:32 PM

2018-02-28T22:32:26-05:00

Sounds good, boy scouts had BB gun shooting events too.

Response by Capt Tom Brown made Mar 1 at 2018 11:58 AM

2018-03-01T11:58:34-05:00

I somehow missed out on all this. Don't recall ever having one in the grade school I went to.. In this day and age it might present somewhat of a risk to other students and staff if one of the kids should injure someone. A lot of potential liability there for today's weak-sisters.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 1 at 2018 12:23 PM

2018-03-01T12:23:06-05:00

Let's bring back blacksmith classes too. Or maybe candlemaking. Good grief. People long for a different time but only remember certain parts of it. Want to buy little Jimmy a Cowboy Carbine? But should we still let him go out and pretend he is killing Indians with it? Take a look at the Sears catalogs from those days with the ads for toy cavalry soldiers complete with toy Indians for them to kill!

But really, it's ridiculous to think that with all the things our schools have already had to quit teaching due to budget cuts, that classes on guns or marksmanship are needed. Plus, given the sophistication of today's video and virtual reality games, with all the shooting you could want, plus gore and death to boot, does anyone really believe a kid today will be enthralled with shooting holes in a piece of paper for long?

Response by MSgt Michael Bischoff made Mar 1 at 2018 4:31 PM

2018-03-01T16:31:22-05:00

The Jenie is out of the bottle about the destruction that some guns bring on people.
Teaching kids about guns safety is good. But the problem is incompetent parents with guns not protecting the youth from there stupidity.

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made May 31 at 2018 11:07 AM

2018-05-31T11:07:07-04:00

I think our culture right now is divided and broken, and until it gets turned around we will not be able to fix things like gun safety. A large majority of people on both sides of the political fence are not willing to compromise and progress. We are currently a nation of my way or no way. I think gun safety is a great way to start teaching kids at young ages the value of not only safety but life. I grew up in a house hold where we shot skeet for fun and shot .306 with a high powered scope for family competition. It also taught me that if I pull that trigger I better be prepared for the consequences. Knowledge is truly power. We have to teach our youth.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made May 31 at 2018 11:37 AM

2018-05-31T11:37:36-04:00

The obvious answer is a resounding "yes"...but it would require a complete change in how our society views ethics, responsibility and traditional roles within our culture.

In my opinion, we've created the "worst case scenario"...a society that is saturated with violence, brutality and desensitized to the consequences-but completely lacking in the moral fiber to funnel aggression into protection, rather than oppression.

So long as youths view weapons as exponents of power...rather than tools to ensure survival, the "how" and the "why" will never make sense.

Response by Thunder O'Meara made May 31 at 2018 12:38 PM

2018-05-31T12:38:40-04:00

My school already tried to do this, i was in support of it, but it "magically" got canceled.

Response by LTC Eugene Chu made Jul 20 at 2018 8:27 AM

2018-07-20T08:27:17-04:00

The answers are loaded and biased.

I personally would not object to a gun club in a school. Issue is that guns and ammo are purchased too easily under legal means for nefarious purposes along with some owners not taking responsibility to keep their guns from being misappropriated.

Response by SSgt Daniel d'Errico made Jul 27 at 2018 3:12 AM

2018-07-27T03:12:47-04:00

Yes

Response by SSG Paul Headlee made Sep 1 at 2020 9:28 PM

2020-09-01T21:28:57-04:00

Thats a steep climb to get to a situation with school kids and guns like we had before hippies, Viet Nam war protestors, love of socialism, hatred of law enforcement officials, romanticization of anarchy...

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 2 at 2020 2:04 PM

2020-09-02T14:04:11-04:00

When I was in Army ROTC in college, the ROTC building had an indoor range in the basement. We had to use the .22cal converters for our M-16s, but at least we got to practice marksmanship. Firearms are tools, just like a hammer (that statistically, is used more often than a rifle to murder people). It is not the tool that is the problem, but the user of the tool and the intent of that user.

Response by MSgt Neil Greenfield made Sep 2 at 2020 7:12 PM

2020-09-02T19:12:06-04:00

I like the idea as long as it's kept free from politics. Unfortunately, I don't think that will ever happen, except as an extracurricular activity. I went through such a program, outside of school, that I really enjoyed. My dad took me and my younger brother to learn about guns and safety. I still have the .22 target rifle he got for me (and my brother also got one). It's a piece of art. It was through a local rod and gun club. I actually thought about competing professionally. It teaches discipline. Yes, it was a NRA program, and I still have my NRA badges after all these years. But I dislike the NRA of today.

Response by SFC Melvin Brandenburg made Jan 29 at 2021 11:48 PM

2021-01-29T23:48:39-05:00

I know there are other clubs such as mock trial. But, in case of a conviction in the mock trial, is there another club called mock firing squad?

Response by A1C Justin Turnbow made Feb 15 at 2021 5:30 PM

2021-02-15T17:30:46-05:00

I'd wonder how prevalent these clubs were. If I was to take a guess, it would he that the majority would be found in more rural areas, which had the demographics that they had at the time. I have a hard time imagining urban schools having such things or even being able to have the proper space/facilities/equipment for it. This is just my own theory though.

Response by SSG Robert Perrotto made Feb 23 at 2021 3:23 PM

2021-02-23T15:23:53-05:00

I was taught sidearm and rifle basics, safety, and advanced marksmanship by my father and brothers starting with Daisy air rifles and sidearms at age 6, and while my school did not have a gun club, my town and county did have them.