Should beards be allowed in the Marine Corps?

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 03:30:56 -0400

So, there is this connotation that beards are unprofessional. This may have been true at one point, but no one can really argue that this is true today: statistically, bearded men get paid more and are preferred for management. Now here is the issue: beards used to be common in the military, but now is the exception to the rule (as a religious factor- and that is only in the Army!) In other works, if you are Sikh and enlist in the USMC, good-bye facial hair- you are just like anyone else...

The entire purpose of the clean shave was to ensure you could get a good seal on your gas mask, which is why you look at history and see those glorious beards and mustaches. In the early 1900s, it was stated that this facial hair will kill you, because you cannot get a good seal on your gas mask... While recently (allegedly) it was proven (by the Army) to be a non-factor in getting a good seal- I cannot confirm nor deny that this happened- but it does beg the question: if facial hair is a non-issue as it pertains to warfare, then why is it an issue?

Although I approve of the current policy, I wonder- if an Army Sikh officer can get a good seal on a gas mask with a full beard, then why can't the rest of us? I mean, it's not exactly tradition to have a clean shave; just look at a list of the Commandants! So... is it really unprofessional to have a beard, or is it a matter of being hard to regulate? And if it is it a matter of regulation, is it simply a lack of empathy on the subject? Keep in mind I don't care either way; I will maintain a clean shave because I look weird if I don't, but when you cut out tradition, and history, and practicality... It just doesn't make sense. Your thoughts, ladies and gents...

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Apr 19 at 2016 3:38 AM

PO1 William "Chip" Nagel — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 03:38:25 -0400

Only saw one Marine try it and it looked so bad he shaved it off. That would be my Dad. I've tried growing one I think when I was in Adak, AK and came to the same conclusion. Just don't work for us.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 19 at 2016 5:16 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 05:16:34 -0400

I don't think beards were ever unprofessional. It's part of being a man, and it's unfortunate that military members are not allowed to grow a beard.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Apr 19 at 2016 6:21 AM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 06:21:14 -0400

Beards should be part of the military period. If we are going to be obsessed over people's ability to quickly don a mask, we might as well worry over their ability to quickly shoe a horse, because they're equally likely and/or relevant.

Response by PO3 David Fries made Apr 19 at 2016 6:47 AM

PO3 David Fries — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 06:47:24 -0400

Personally, I don't care what is on someone's face. There are bigger concerns.

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 19 at 2016 8:04 AM

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 08:04:13 -0400

Given I'm female, I don't have a preference on facial hair. If it's within regulations, I think you should be able to don anything you want; beard, mustache, goatee, etc. I read the article about that Army officer and if he's able to get a good seal with the hair he has on his face, then that proves it right there. While I understand uniformity in the military, but it wasn't like that in the beginning.

Response by SGT William Howell made Apr 19 at 2016 8:46 AM

SGT William Howell — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 08:46:36 -0400

Not only should you have beards, but everyone should be issued skinny jeans, and deep Vee t-shirts. There should be a barista training class in that ridiculously long bootcamp. Maybe cut out shooting and replace it with, "How to make the perfect lotta."

You realized that the Marines are the only branch left that actually are encouraged to kill the enemy. Why do you want to screw that up? Who the hell is going to go to Helmand if the Marines get as soft as the Air Force? What if they start demanding PXs and living suites all because you wanted to grow facial hair!

Response by Capt Tom Brown made Apr 19 at 2016 9:19 AM

Capt Tom Brown — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 09:19:44 -0400

I just love this particular issue, just a few thoughts: Imagine NCOs trying to enforce a 'beard policy'; send people who want beards into a room filled with toxic gas to see if they get a good seal over their beard, if so they get to keep their beard if not, too bad; when was the last time US troops were gassed in combat? No one knows. There seem to be some exceptions already amongst the Special Operators who all seem to have beards and dress to resemble local people. "Pvt when was the last time you washed that beard?"

Response by GySgt Carl Rumbolo made Apr 19 at 2016 10:12 AM

GySgt Carl Rumbolo — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 10:12:53 -0400

You state "statistically, bearded men get paid more and are preferred for management" - would you care to provide some factual data to back that assertion up? Not your personal belief or anecdotal reference but actual surveys by reputable polling organizations? Because your statement is at odds with facts on the ground - look at business leaders today...

As for your question - was there an actual point? Regulations are what they are, grooming regulations change and evolve.

Response by SGT Richard H. made Apr 19 at 2016 10:20 AM

SGT Richard H. — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 10:20:55 -0400

There have been a ton of arguments for and against beards, like the gas mask thing, etc., but I would hang my hat on this one:

u·ni·form
ˈyo͞onəˌfôrm/
adjective
adjective: uniform
1. not changing in form or character; remaining the same in all cases and at all times.

Response by Cpl Shaun Wormsley made Apr 19 at 2016 10:25 AM

Cpl Shaun Wormsley — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 10:25:11 -0400

I feel that the clean shaven rule is the only way to go. After I got off of active duty I did some Haz Mat work and we had to wear the Scott airpack and dress in genuine firefighters gear. People tried to use the Scott SCBA and they couldn't get a good seal with a beard or a goatee! So the Plant where I worked said that no facial hair other than mustaches were allowed because of that reason. I think everyone should abide by the same rules no matter what branch of service you are in. People join the military knowing what the rules and regulations are! If you don't like the rules and regulations don't enlist. For example I read about service men saying they didn't want to fight in the wars but that is what the military is for. They joined knowing full well that they could go to war and possible be shot. My point is if it isn't broken don't try to fix it.

Response by MCPO Roger Collins made Apr 19 at 2016 10:39 AM

MCPO Roger Collins — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 10:39:04 -0400

Is there a problem with uniformity and hygiene? That is my primary consideration. The question should be why do we have uniformity in the military, in general. During the years I served on submarines, there were many that wore beards, even though you were in danger of a plethora of gasses that could be deadly. We practices with gas type masks on nearly a daily basis with no ill effects with misfit masks. If it were up to me, there would be no beards, but it is not and the regulations are what they are.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 19 at 2016 11:53 AM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 11:53:10 -0400

Beards should not be allowed in the Marine Corps. Do you want to trust your life to "allegedly" you can get a good seal on a gas mask? Here is a report from MoneyWatch:

(MoneyWatch) COMMENTARY If you look at pictures of Fortune 500 CEOs, you might be in for a surprise. Very few have facial hair. In fact, hardly any do. The same is true of American political leaders.

Why is that? What's the big hairy problem with leaders having facial hair? Clearly, it bucks the societal trend. Stubble, mustaches and beards of all kinds have been the rage for years. It's definitely cool to have facial hair. Just not if you're an executive or business leader.

There are exceptions, of course. Steve Jobs grew a beard relatively late in life. Oracle CEO Larry Ellison has one. So do Marc Benioff of Salesforce.com, Reed Hastings of Netflix and Richard Branson of Virgin Group. But they're all founders of their companies. There's a different standard for successful entrepreneurs.

Of recent note is former SAP and Hewlett-Packard CEO Leo Apotheker. He has a beard. At least he did when he was fired from both companies. The same is true of Scott Thompson, who was shown the door after just four months as Yahoo's CEO. Wonder what we can infer from that?

Response by LCpl Ronnie Padgett made Apr 19 at 2016 11:57 AM

LCpl Ronnie Padgett — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 11:57:30 -0400

We are different, we stand alone, the few, the proud, why would we want to dumb down.

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Apr 19 at 2016 12:07 PM

Capt Richard I P. — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 12:07:15 -0400

I wrote some detailed thoughts on this topic here:
https://www.rallypoint.com/answers/do-you-believe-we-should-be-allowed-to-grow-beards-in-a-deployed-environment

Do you believe we should be allowed to grow beards in a deployed environment? | RallyPoint

So, just something I thought would be an interesting topic. Both funny and to see what people really have to say about it. But seriously, combat beards are awesome. Everyone's thoughts? Serious or not it's all welcome. http://www.duffelblog.com/2012/04/pentagon-study-finds-beards-directly-proportional-to-combat-effectiveness/

Response by 1LT William Clardy made Apr 19 at 2016 8:09 PM

1LT William Clardy — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 20:09:32 -0400

I see no reason why Marines should not be allowed to grow beards as long as their facial hair remains shorter than the hair on their scalp...

Response by SSgt GG-15 RET Jim Lint made Apr 19 at 2016 8:54 PM

SSgt GG-15 RET Jim Lint — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 20:54:56 -0400

I think there are more issues in the military that need focus besides beards.
Or maybe we could say when the wars are all won, you can have beards until the next war. :)

Response by Cpl Luke Smith made Apr 20 at 2016 9:39 AM

Cpl Luke Smith — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 09:39:45 -0400

No I don't think beards should be allowed in the Corps. The Marines hold a different standard to every other military branch, if you see a platoon gathered, not even marching you can't pick out an individual ... that is even if there are women in that platoon. If you were to allow facial hair then why not change the regulations on getting hair cuts too? You are now getting into an area that would convolute the Marine Corps and turn it from a single "entity" to individuality. How would you

Also, as someone who has been out of the Corps for over 10 years an in a civilian management position; Your comment about more and more management having beards, there are approximately 50 people in a management position at the company I work for and last time I checked, I'm the only one who has a beard. On job hiring boards I see questions posed all the time about is it professional to have a beard and would a hiring manager hire someone with a beard. Now, I have a very short and cleanly trimmed beard, which I attribute to my time served as keeping some of that discipline and keeping my beard from getting out of control.

Response by LCpl Kenneth Heath made Apr 20 at 2016 9:41 AM

LCpl Kenneth Heath — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 09:41:53 -0400

Not everyone can grow a beard, and not everyone looks good in a beard... No beards in the Marine Corps! If you want to look scruffy and unkempt, beautify my Corps by staying a civilian!

Response by SSgt Dan Montague made Apr 20 at 2016 9:55 AM

SSgt Dan Montague — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 09:55:25 -0400

I think we should throw the "man bun" in the mix now

Response by CWO2 Shelby DuBois made Apr 20 at 2016 9:59 AM

CWO2 Shelby DuBois — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 09:59:40 -0400

Individualism vs Marine Corps philosophy that it's the mission, the team, the Corps and Country that come first?We begin Boot Camp by everyone being equalized...shaved heads..no facial hair... baby faced, mush heads. This brings up sleeve tattoos in the Marine Corps. Our leadership seems to have forgotten that we are not individualists. Today they are more interested in social engineering...'it's part of our culture. We have had battles go on for years over Sam Brown Belts, Aiguillettes, and other uniform items that allow some degree of individualism, and it's more often than not, denied. Allowing hair and facial hair, tattoos and anything else that detracts from from the 'oneness' of the Corps I think is a mistake.

Response by Pvt Kenneth Mayberry made Apr 20 at 2016 10:22 AM

Pvt Kenneth Mayberry — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 10:22:32 -0400

Sir if they are properly maintained like mustaches are Sir.

Response by LTC Paul Labrador made Apr 20 at 2016 10:31 AM

LTC Paul Labrador — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 10:31:05 -0400

There are many different reasons for being cleanly shaven. Some are practical (good mask seal, field hygiene, cultural camouflage) and some are purely arbitrary (uniformity). I think we need to look at whether the reasons not to shave outweigh the reasons to shave.

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 20 at 2016 4:56 PM

Maj Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 16:56:01 -0400

What a stupid question!

Response by LtCol Mac McCarty made Apr 20 at 2016 5:14 PM

LtCol Mac McCarty — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 17:14:40 -0400

Traditionally, beards were for the Navy and mustaches were for the Marine Corps. A practical reason for no beards is cleanliness in the field. In my company in Vietnam, we shaved every day to avoid getting gook sores. Also, why give the bad guy something else to grab onto while you are killing him?

Response by GySgt Charles O'Connell made Apr 20 at 2016 6:12 PM

GySgt Charles O'Connell — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 18:12:37 -0400

Uniform and grooming standards exist so that a neat military appearance is maintained. Beards?? What next.... long hair, facial tattoo's, self expression in the wear of uniforms? No, grooming standards are there for good reason.

Response by Cpl Rc Layne made Apr 20 at 2016 6:49 PM

Cpl Rc Layne — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 18:49:34 -0400

Personally, in uniform, it looks unprofessional. It removes uniformity and detracts from a neat appearance. And it violates the OSHA standards on proper wearing of protective masks, which I saw happen several times while working in corrections. As far as the religious issue, I don't agree with the exemption for it on the above reasons, for anyone.

Response by Sgt Mark Jennings made Apr 20 at 2016 7:11 PM

Sgt Mark Jennings — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 19:11:03 -0400

OAF.

Response by SSgt Frank Perron made Apr 20 at 2016 11:03 PM

SSgt Frank Perron — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 23:03:57 -0400

Not disagreeing with what you stated in your article, but if a person wants to have a beard don't join the military. When you join the military on your own free will, (not drafted) you know what goes along with the job. Just like if you want to have long hair don't join the military, if you want to smoke marijuana don't join the military. If you join the military accept that certain things are not allowed, and if you can't accept the rules do not join the military. The present job I have right now, stated when I was first hired that I would work on the weekends. I accepted. Now when we hire new people and I hear them complain about working the weekends, my response is there is the door. Nobody made you accept the job, if you don't like the rules leave. So therefore if you want to have a beard stay a civilian.

Response by GySgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 21 at 2016 12:19 AM

GySgt Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 21 Apr 2016 00:19:28 -0400

By definition it is unprofessional within this profession, as much as not getting a regulation haircut.

Response by Sgt Carlos Perez made Apr 21 at 2016 1:04 AM

Sgt Carlos Perez — Thu, 21 Apr 2016 01:04:31 -0400

No the marine Corp, should never change its policy to please another persons view, in the marine corps we are all one.

Response by SSG John Jensen made Apr 21 at 2016 2:33 AM

SSG John Jensen — Thu, 21 Apr 2016 02:33:54 -0400

the only reason the US Military started the short hair thing was for lice control in WWI - if you go to history warriors never cut their hair 'cause it was a symbol of their virility ( see Samson) the only people that had short hair were slaves (no virility)

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 21 at 2016 3:56 AM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 21 Apr 2016 03:56:42 -0400

If one can wear a beard and\or head gear in uniform to reflect their religious beliefs, the military is no longer uniform.

Response by Cpl Jeff Ruffing made Apr 21 at 2016 8:30 AM

Cpl Jeff Ruffing — Thu, 21 Apr 2016 08:30:16 -0400

Simple response. No. Had a Gunnery Sargent who took a newbie Doc, who had an attitude problem. His problem was, he didn't want to be with the Marines, he wanted to be working in the hospital. We were on Alpha increment at the time. Gunney called the Doc out and had him uncover, then had us all in formation uncover. He then asked that doc if he noticed any difference. The newbie said yes, those are Marines, and I am Navy. Gunny then said, Exactly. And that is what anybody who wants to kill us is gonna see as well. They want to knock out anything that is not the same first. Hopefully it's the officers, commo, MEDICAL, .... I don't remember what else Gunny said, all I know is the Doc had a hi n tight for the next formation and from that point on was stract to the point were you couldn't tell he was a doc unless if you knew him. So beards, no. It takes away from the aura of the Marines. Army bends to those request, and it gives them the appearance of being weak and undisciplined. Marines are not weak, nor are they undisciplined.

Response by Cpl Caleb Johnson made Apr 21 at 2016 9:47 AM

Cpl Caleb Johnson — Thu, 21 Apr 2016 09:47:27 -0400

Traditions and history should not be the only reasons for maintaining any policy or practice anywhere under any circumstances. Any organization's policies and practices should be in place and remain in place, first and foremost, because they work. Period. I was sold that bill of goods in the 80s....you know...the one where we had to shave for the sake of a good seal with our masks? I sort of thought then, and am a fervent believer now that, the seal scenario may be partially true but, it's more a case of some asswipe who couldn't or wouldn't grow a beard, being in a position to influence policy.

I don't want to be the only non-demographer in the room to bring this up but, there's something like 3/4 of a million Hasidic Jews in Israel who don't shave and they don't seem to have a problem with their field protective masks and they are surrounded by a shit ton of people who are willing to use chemical or biological weapons on them. So, what's the deal? I believe a scientific, independent (read: NOT some military flunky whose career will be made or broken by complying with policy) study ought to be done, at least so I can arrive at an informed opinion.

Response by Sgt Carlos Barrera made Apr 21 at 2016 12:49 PM

Sgt Carlos Barrera — Thu, 21 Apr 2016 12:49:28 -0400

If you want to beard, get out, Marines are known by their discipline and their grooming standards. Simple want facial hair, get out!!!

Response by SCPO Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 21 at 2016 3:06 PM

SCPO Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 21 Apr 2016 15:06:31 -0400

Your female Marines certainly are allowed much longer hair than their male counterparts. Why? The reasoning is purely cultural and traditional, the same in every service. They don't get "shaved" in boot camp. So, what makes beards truly any different, other than traditions and the will and whim of the Pentagon? There's a big debate raging now about the open door created by letting the Sikhs wear beards and their turbans. Underneath those turbans is very long hair, by the way. Both are centuries-old aspects of their religion. Having studied the Sikhs at length some years back, I know this: that long hair and those beards make Sampson look like a wimp. The Sikh warrior has proven himself over the span of those centuries as being a fighter of unparalleled ferocity and loyalty. I'd be very hard-pressed to choose between a company of bearded Marines and a company of Sikhs. Does it matter, the male Marine, bearded or not, the female Marine, shorn or not? It's simply about American societal norms and military uniformity and traditions. If there are appropriately applied grooming standards, give it a whirl. My man, Elmo Zumwalt, did in 1971. It never cost us an ounce of combat readiness or loss in command authority. If anything, it boasted morale 1000% across the board in the Navy. Too bad subsequent Brass hasn't realized that...

Response by Sgt William Barr made Apr 22 at 2016 2:39 PM

Sgt William Barr — Fri, 22 Apr 2016 14:39:57 -0400

so now my sgt can come to work in a dress and have a beard and us the ladies room. Is there any way we can mess it up any more. The people who are doing this to the military are trying to shit on my Marine Corps

Response by LCpl Ronnie Padgett made Apr 27 at 2016 10:55 PM

LCpl Ronnie Padgett — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 22:55:12 -0400

The 1st time I shaved by force was in boot camp. I cut my face, never had to shave again, 43 no beard, or mustache it just wont grow. I loved being a clean cut Marine Corp Grunt

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 28 at 2016 12:34 AM

CSM Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 28 Apr 2016 00:34:08 -0400

As long as it meet the standards for mission I have no problem giving a thumbs up.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 28 at 2016 1:32 PM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 28 Apr 2016 13:32:48 -0400

Wow, a lot of mudslinging going on in this comments section. At no point did the OP say he wanted a beard. And the argument that beards decrease combat effectiveness is just bogus, look at our operators. How about some logical discussion instead of cussing out the OP. Marines in my units may joke with each other but we don't honestly berate each other like kids on the playground. Must not be the same corps wide...

Response by Sgt Donald Chalfy made May 20 at 2016 2:38 PM

Sgt Donald Chalfy — Fri, 20 May 2016 14:38:28 -0400

NO! The only exception is MARSOC operators working in areas where they have to do their best to blend in. Just like SEALS, Green Beret, etc. I see enough policies being scrutinized and dumbed down to reflect the ever so tender feelings of policy makers in positions of authority in Washington DC. It drives me to distraction. Leave well enough alone and do not compromise the appearance of the Marine Corps. There are too many other issues that require attention.

Response by PFC Pamala (Hall) Foster made Aug 11 at 2017 1:10 PM

PFC Pamala (Hall) Foster — Fri, 11 Aug 2017 13:10:40 -0400

I am one for NO facial hair in uniform!!! UNLESS circumstances make shaving impossible. As a female, I learned fast that having hair too long made proper head gear fit virtually impossible and heat was bad enough. Guys-SHAVE! Ladies-go for SHORTER hair and play it smart.

Response by SGT Jody Beach made Aug 11 at 2017 1:43 PM

SGT Jody Beach — Fri, 11 Aug 2017 13:43:27 -0400

I think in respect to the military no matter what branch, clean shaven & short hair. I do not care what your religion is. You should be clean shaven. You want to look like a lumber jack then go be a lumber jack. You say your religion requires you to grow a beard while then dont join the service.
We keep trying to change the military standards. Should only be one. If a woman wants to try out for Special Forces or Ranger school I have no problem with that... One set of rules......
I mean really what is next if we allow these changes to keep happening? Long hair because short hair really has no reason other than looking like a professional? Wearing what ever you want to wear instead of a combat uniform?
I mean why take the tank when we could just jump in the back of our pick up trucks with guns.....
WE ARE THE UNITED STATES MILITARY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
WE ARE THE BEST FIGHTING MACHINE AROUND!!!!!!
ACT LIKE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 11 at 2017 3:51 PM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 11 Aug 2017 15:51:33 -0400

In short.... No, because not everyone can grow a beard. Could you imagine how ate up your formation would look if some had beards and some didn't? Again, nothing against beards. We either all have them or we all don't and not all of us can grow one. Furthermore, your CRBN mask would not seal correctly to your face if you had a beard.

Response by PO3 Scot Fahey made Aug 11 at 2017 4:46 PM

PO3 Scot Fahey — Fri, 11 Aug 2017 16:46:37 -0400

Beards have a place, when you have to enlist the support of some cultures. recent years time in the real world , have shown a tactical necessity, to having a beard in some parts of the world.

Response by Sgt William Margeson made Aug 11 at 2017 4:55 PM

Sgt William Margeson — Fri, 11 Aug 2017 16:55:49 -0400

No, once you cut standards, it becomes much more that will effect gorder and decipline

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 11 at 2017 9:42 PM

CPL Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 11 Aug 2017 21:42:34 -0400

I had an uncle that was a Navy Chief, salty, very salty and wearing red stripes, who would go to sea clean shaven and come home with a beard. That being said, that was the 70s and the Navy must have allowed Chiefs to grow beards. That being said, I think the Marines ought to maintain their traditions, and never ever get soft or feel like they need to conform to modern fashion.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 11 at 2017 11:58 PM

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 11 Aug 2017 23:58:12 -0400

This issue is honestly going to go back and forth between hardcore traditional Marines and Marines that want to see the Core adapt with time if the Core allowed beards within certain guidlines it would not make us an in affective fighting force it has nothing to do with the performance of the individual Marine or the battalion I personally feel like people get wound up over the subject for no reason I bet Marines would lose their mind if full sleeves became within regs and tattoos are way more unprofessional in appearance than a well groomed beard

Response by PO1 Edward Pate made Aug 12 at 2017 3:44 AM

PO1 Edward Pate — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 03:44:26 -0400

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 12 at 2017 8:03 AM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 08:03:59 -0400

No. Why would we? So someone can better "self-identify? Newsflash, we are not individuals, we are members of a unit. A unit that prides itself on mission accomplishment, discipline, and maintaining high standards of appearance and military bearing. If someone needs to wear a beard for religious reasons, join another unit. If operators need to wear a beard to blend in, that is an operational consideration i.e blending in, and is legit. Otherwise it's just an attempt to put another chink in our armor and make us "like everyone else". We aren't like everyone else.

Response by GySgt Charles O'Connell made Aug 14 at 2017 3:16 PM

GySgt Charles O'Connell — Mon, 14 Aug 2017 15:16:01 -0400

The "whole reason" for not allowing beards is that they do not present a neat military appearance. A one time they were allowed, and back then they did not present a neat military appearance. Beards, eccentric hair cuts or coloring, facial tattoos, etc... are not allowed. Good seal when donning a gas mask, yeah that's a factor, but so is hygiene in the field. The individual changes to meet the standards of the military, not the other way around.

Response by PO2 Nick Burke made Jun 22 at 2018 3:11 PM

PO2 Nick Burke — Fri, 22 Jun 2018 15:11:03 -0400

Navy had them for e-4 and up until January 1 1985. I never had an issue with my gas mask or OBA seal.

Response by SFC Wade Adams made Aug 23 at 2018 3:30 PM

SFC Wade Adams — Thu, 23 Aug 2018 15:30:06 -0400

I agree with you Devil Dogs! You all are the only ones that kept discipline. I admire that. As a platoon sergeant in the army, I spent way too much wasted time in the IGs office, the 1SG ‘s office, and eventually the CSM’s office asking me to, “tone down my Drill Sargent “ mentality. My platoon was the only one that came back without injury or fatalities!

Response by SSgt Christophe Murphy made Aug 23 at 2018 5:17 PM

SSgt Christophe Murphy — Thu, 23 Aug 2018 17:17:03 -0400

You used gas masks as an example of needing to shave but used examples of previous CMC’s that predated the use of gas in warfare.

Close cropped hair to include being clean shaven has more than to do with gas masks. It is also meant to reduce the chance of lice and other critters one encounters in the field.

Sure we all wanted beards while in but want isn’t really a good reason. Yes there are less than 10 religious exemptions on the books within the DOD that allot beards. Not a lot to base your argument on.

Response by SFC Glenn Kozak made Aug 23 at 2018 10:36 PM

SFC Glenn Kozak — Thu, 23 Aug 2018 22:36:35 -0400

No military branch should allow beards. Especially, the Marines!!’

Response by Sgt Charles St John made Aug 24 at 2018 12:09 AM

Sgt Charles St John — Fri, 24 Aug 2018 00:09:15 -0400

Not every one can grow a great professional looking beard. Those who can’t may not be suitable. So, who decides? I say no beards unless it’s mission specific.

Response by Cpl Greg Swiertz made Aug 24 at 2018 1:02 AM

Cpl Greg Swiertz — Fri, 24 Aug 2018 01:02:24 -0400

Stick with tradition,enough of being politically correct that’s why the world is as screwed up as it is!

Response by LCpl Jonathan McCurry made Aug 24 at 2018 9:08 AM

LCpl Jonathan McCurry — Fri, 24 Aug 2018 09:08:19 -0400

We are Marines. No beards!!!

Response by Cpl Michael Guerin made Aug 24 at 2018 8:49 PM

Cpl Michael Guerin — Fri, 24 Aug 2018 20:49:34 -0400

IMO, Not in my Corps! Clean cut, clean shaven, ready for war or any cerenony thrown our way. Damn this was a non-existant conversation 20 years ago when I was active

Response by Capt Merl Miller made Aug 25 at 2018 3:48 AM

Capt Merl Miller — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 03:48:37 -0400

I’ve had a beard for over 30 years but I can’t imagine a active duty Marine having one. High and tight with a clean shave just feels right. I under that there circumstances where that might not be practical.
Semper Fi

Response by SGT Sean Moore made Aug 25 at 2018 10:52 AM

SGT Sean Moore — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 10:52:12 -0400

I’m not USMC... I’m Army, but I’m “old school” Army. I’m in total agreement with you Devil Dogs. No beards! I’m medically retired with 17 years under my belt. In my day they didn’t even tinker with the idea of beards unless you were a spec ops type and it was under certain operative deployment circumstances. It kills me to hear this is even an issue in any branch of our Armed Forces.

Response by Cpl Christofer Baines made Aug 25 at 2018 12:06 PM

Cpl Christofer Baines — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 12:06:55 -0400

I am pro beard. I figure it’d make the the average infantryman look less like he just graduated high school.

Response by Cpl Rc Layne made Aug 25 at 2018 4:56 PM

Cpl Rc Layne — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 16:56:28 -0400

The overlooked topic is OSHA standards. There is a OSHA standard about masks and how they seal. I dont remember it word for word, but its there.

Response by MAJ Steve Daugherty made Aug 25 at 2018 5:34 PM

MAJ Steve Daugherty — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 17:34:33 -0400

I was in the Army and we had another exemption: Afro- Americans who who get pseudo folliculitis an uncomfortable skin condition, They had to stay trimmed to 1/8 “. The Roman Legion didn’t like beards or long hair because your enemy could grab your hair in hand to hand combat. But the military likes uniformity and beards are harder to regulate than clean shaves

Response by MSgt Dollar Bill Rutledge made Aug 25 at 2018 7:49 PM

MSgt Dollar Bill Rutledge — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 19:49:43 -0400

Hey there SGT William Howell, you probably don’t think your shit don’t stink if you think the Air Force is soft as you put it. I can assure you that in Aircraft maintenance in B-52’s working 12 to 18 hours in either butt deep snow to a tall Indian or heat hot enough to melt your headsets with grease up to your elbows, well that’s not my idea of soft. Just remember this, I joined the Air Force because I scored high enough to have a choice. We all served and you don’t know what the other services went through so keep comments like that to yourself.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 25 at 2018 8:49 PM

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 20:49:55 -0400

Historically throughout the world, the ability to grow a beard has been a sign of manhood and masculinity. In most places in the world, that is still the case, but less celebrated. Grow’em if you can.

Response by SrA David Frenette made Aug 25 at 2018 9:20 PM

SrA David Frenette — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 21:20:34 -0400

https://youtu.be/scSvZSxs45o

So, the USAF doesn't kill the enemy? I think you should check your facts.

U.S. airstrikes hit ISIS convoys

Coalition airstrikes targeted two ISIS convoys leaving Falluja over two days, destroying about 175 vehicles carrying militants out of the city. CNN's Barbara...

Response by PO1 Michael Turnbeaugh made Aug 25 at 2018 10:01 PM

PO1 Michael Turnbeaugh — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 22:01:23 -0400

In the 70's we were allowed to have beards in the Navy. The same caveat applied back then -- you had to be able to get a deal with a mask. While some are pointing out that the military hasn't been glasses in a long time, this still was an issue for is on submarines because we had emergency breathing apparatus and oxygen breathing apparatus that were broken out on a regular basis. My first submarine also had a diver division with their masks. I point this out to say that we had a few people with beards and this caused no issues. We had one guy who couldn't get a deal and had to shave his off. It wasn't a big deal. And to the point of being uniform, people have different hair styles and/or hair colors so we're not that uniform anyway.

Personally I don't care because I can't grow a beard. And I never had anyone working for me that wanted to grow one so that was never an issue. Marines would look kind of stupid with beards and their high & right haircuts so, simply on that basis, I don't think the Marines should have beards.

Response by SSG Miguel Rivera made Aug 26 at 2018 9:04 AM

SSG Miguel Rivera — Sun, 26 Aug 2018 09:04:47 -0400

A beard to a man is what a mane is to a lion. The reason that beards will never be allowed is that some of the senior leaders can't fully grow one and thier faces would just wind up looking like a jolly rancher that fell on the carpet. Beards will never fully be allowed because the Seniors don't want to be embarassed by a Private who has a full manly beard while thier faces look patchy. They also don't want to be embarrassed by any females, who through no fault of thier own can grow thicker facial hair than them without even trying. It all boils down to image.

Response by SSG Roger Roess made Aug 26 at 2018 11:33 AM

SSG Roger Roess — Sun, 26 Aug 2018 11:33:46 -0400

If your gas mask leaks you are in for a bad time

Response by SSG Steven Kelley made Aug 26 at 2018 12:51 PM

SSG Steven Kelley — Sun, 26 Aug 2018 12:51:34 -0400

Well Although I am not a marine, I did come up in the old school military. A good seal on the pro mask, is not the only reason why regulations were made with a standard for short hair and facial hair. Hair is fairly flammable, go find a hipster and light up his man bun to prove it. Yes beards were common in the military over a hundred years ago but; since WWI, modern warfare has progressively created nastier ways. Try a phosphorus grenade igniting near you, it’s not only burning down under your skin but also sets your beard on fire. Think about it.

Response by SPC Charlie Robinson made Aug 26 at 2018 4:14 PM

SPC Charlie Robinson — Sun, 26 Aug 2018 16:14:36 -0400

Shave!

Response by GySgt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 26 at 2018 7:11 PM

GySgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 26 Aug 2018 19:11:29 -0400

That is not the whole definition. Try again.

u·ni·form
ˈyo͞onəˌfôrm/Submit
adjective
1.
not changing in form or character; remaining the same in all cases and at all times.
"blocks of stone of uniform size"
synonyms: constant, consistent, steady, invariable, unvarying, unfluctuating, unchanging, stable, static, regular, fixed, even, equal More
2.
denoting a garment forming part of a person's uniform.
"black uniform jackets"
noun
1.
the distinctive clothing worn by members of the same organization or body or by children attending certain schools.
"airline pilots in dark blue uniforms"
synonyms: costume, livery, regalia, suit, ensemble, outfit; More
2.
a code word representing the letter U, used in radio communication.
verb
1.
make uniform.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 27 at 2018 12:08 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 00:08:55 -0400

Dang, I posted this 2 years ago and now my notifications are blowing up... Well done, RP.

Response by Sgt Richard Sprague made Aug 27 at 2018 4:55 AM

Sgt Richard Sprague — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 04:55:41 -0400

SrA David Frenette, the Air Force does not kill the enemy close up and face to face like infantry. The Air Force kill from a distance and rarely see their enemy.

Response by PO1 William Ewing made Aug 27 at 2018 5:23 AM

PO1 William Ewing — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 05:23:41 -0400

The gas mask story has always been a lie to cover the real reason. Uniform boards are stuck in the 50s, and think beards are for hippies and druggies. Set standards, and have those with beards fit test monthly. Done.

Response by Cpl Lester Anderson made Aug 27 at 2018 10:58 AM

Cpl Lester Anderson — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 10:58:39 -0400

When in Garrison duty, when there is no need for NBC gear, I think beard wearage should be an individual choice. However, the length and borders of the beard should conform to a regulation, just like mustashes do.

In a combat zone where possible NBC exposure is imminent, I would not want to be the Staff NCO or Officer who had to tell some poor schmucks family he died because he refused to shave his beard. No beards in combat.

Response by CPL Freddy Travaglia made Aug 27 at 2018 12:35 PM

CPL Freddy Travaglia — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 12:35:07 -0400

clean shave for me.

Response by Sgt James Breslin made Aug 27 at 2018 1:57 PM

Sgt James Breslin — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 13:57:07 -0400

Marines are, I believe set apart from other branches of the military. Hope it doesn’t happen here. SEMPER FI

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 27 at 2018 3:13 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 15:13:44 -0400

Marine Corps has the strictest policies of all the branches on tattoos, why would they allow beards! I am sure down the road the military will allow beards as it has become kinder and gentler.

Response by Sgt David Brose made Aug 27 at 2018 5:16 PM

Sgt David Brose — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 17:16:32 -0400

No beards

Response by PO3 Daniel Bishop made Aug 27 at 2018 5:50 PM

PO3 Daniel Bishop — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 17:50:53 -0400

Can you imagine those eighteen or nineteen year olds with the patchy beards?

Response by SSgt Danny Holland made Aug 27 at 2018 5:55 PM

SSgt Danny Holland — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 17:55:36 -0400

No beards!!

Response by CSM Lynn Chrisman made Aug 27 at 2018 6:56 PM

CSM Lynn Chrisman — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 18:56:43 -0400

Response by PFC Elijah Rose made Aug 27 at 2018 7:54 PM

PFC Elijah Rose — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 19:54:00 -0400

Back in the 19th century and before soldiers were allowed beards as long as they kept them neat and trimmed. Look no than Civil War photos and you'll see that groomed mustaches and whiskers were a way of showing individuality.

That changed during WWI, when it was found that facial hair interfered with the seal on gas masks so orders were that everyone shaved. After soldiers came home all uniform and clean shaven that became the fashon of the 20th century incivilian and military life.

In modern times trimmed beards are in style, but soldiers shave... because that's what soldiers do. There is no reason we do it, other than social conventions and complicity.

Response by Cpl Christopher Hancock made Aug 27 at 2018 8:09 PM

Cpl Christopher Hancock — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 20:09:42 -0400

They can't get a good deal, guaranteed! I have done many fit tests for SCBA's, and I'll tell you, if you have facial hair that extends to the seal of your mask, your mask will not seal, period, end of story. If you're in a situation relying on you gas mask to live, you will die!

Response by GySgt Lee Smart made Aug 27 at 2018 8:40 PM

GySgt Lee Smart — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 20:40:36 -0400

No beards....unprofessional....cant get a gas mask to seal....unsanitary in filthy condotions of combat.....takes away from uniformity.....Lee Smart, GySgt, Usmc, retired

Response by SFC Jerry Florey made Aug 27 at 2018 8:47 PM

SFC Jerry Florey — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 20:47:05 -0400

I was in the Chem Corp trained pvts at Ft McClellan and other soldiers while in the Army and I stay with clean shaven gives you a better seal.

Response by SgtMaj Glenn Woods made Aug 27 at 2018 9:15 PM

SgtMaj Glenn Woods — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 21:15:23 -0400

Won't even waste my breath!

Response by Sgt Daniel J. Daly made Aug 27 at 2018 9:16 PM

Sgt Daniel J. Daly — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 21:16:51 -0400

You know I never really though about it. I remember my father shaved everyday before going to work. When I was 11 I had facial hair and my father showed me how to shave. When Ivwent into the Marine Corps no one in the Platoon had a beard prior to forming up. The DI’s showed us how they wanted us to shave. From the base of the ear and all over the face and front of neck. It was regulation to be clean shaven. Don’t even remember anyone with a religious wavier. I think it would be hard to regulate as to who’s beard is to long. Anyway I don’t know where they get this Idea that bearded men get supervisor jobs more than clean shaven people. All the jobs I had the supervisors were clean shaven. Myself I don’t like it. After one day it starts to itch.

Response by SN Dan Swisher made Aug 27 at 2018 9:26 PM

SN Dan Swisher — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 21:26:02 -0400

I'm a traditionalist,clean shave.Comply or go somewhere else.

Response by PFC Randy Harrington made Aug 27 at 2018 9:43 PM

PFC Randy Harrington — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 21:43:22 -0400

He can’t he gets a religious exemption and must sign a waiver .

Response by SSG Roy Wilson made Aug 27 at 2018 11:26 PM

SSG Roy Wilson — Mon, 27 Aug 2018 23:26:20 -0400

I think politicians lawyers and idiot judges should stick to the civilian side and quit trying to civilianize the Military. The Military is about Discipline Standards and Professionalism not special treatment like we have been seeing over the last few yrs.

Response by Cpl Jeffrey Walker made Aug 28 at 2018 12:13 AM

Cpl Jeffrey Walker — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 00:13:26 -0400

Religious exemption is fine, medical is fine. Otherwise f--k no. Honestly, I think female Marine hair and beard standards should be the same as male Marines. I've seen a lot of female Marines that make a High and Tight look good!

Response by LCpl Jason C. Willis made Aug 28 at 2018 12:57 AM

LCpl Jason C. Willis — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 00:57:03 -0400

i prefer this good clean seal on this gas mask...i'll shave, thanks

Response by SPC Josh Little made Aug 28 at 2018 1:21 AM

SPC Josh Little — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 01:21:23 -0400

The gas masks that the military uses now is completely different than when that rule was written. I worked in the prison system we use those same masks and as long as you trim it right a beard will absolutely not interfere at all.

Response by Cpl Thomas Smith made Aug 28 at 2018 1:28 AM

Cpl Thomas Smith — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 01:28:59 -0400

No beards!! Jarheads need something to look forward to!! Seriously, Marines are NOT individuals. They have enough choice in how short or not to cut their hair... Beards are just UNSAT.

Response by CSM Andrew Perrault made Aug 28 at 2018 5:44 AM

CSM Andrew Perrault — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 05:44:05 -0400

Not a Marine, but spent 30 years in the Army, having been in combat and lack of shower for many days having hair on your face or head becomes a hygiene issue. In addition a Marine clean cut and with a high and tight in dress uniform looks sharp! Having a beard would certainly in my opinion degrade that image. Don't fix it if it ain't broke! Semper Fi brothers...….

Response by Cpl Randy Pitman made Aug 28 at 2018 10:38 AM

Cpl Randy Pitman — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 10:38:33 -0400

they dont even want to get me started on dropping our stamdards to fit these pansies. wants.

Response by SPC Rick LaBonte made Aug 28 at 2018 11:43 AM

SPC Rick LaBonte — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 11:43:16 -0400

I don’t care which branch you are, facial hair shouldn’t be because of the possibility of having to wear the NBC mask

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 28 at 2018 11:44 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 11:44:43 -0400

As was stated, tradition falls further on the side of allowing facial hair than not. When I was in the Reserves, I shaved twice a month, on drill days and have worn a beard since getting out. It does not affect my professionalism or detract any from my conservativism. I don't have any desires to cut off my ear or drink latte.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 28 at 2018 11:46 AM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 11:46:57 -0400

Pro beards: Having a beard does not degrade a marines effectiveness in combat. Marines will not suddenly lose discipline and forget misfire procedures because of a new uniform regulation. At the very least, meeting in the middle and allowing marines to just grow beards in the field and on deployment(in combat zones) would suffice.

Response by SN Peter Stella made Aug 28 at 2018 1:30 PM

SN Peter Stella — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 13:30:12 -0400

I believe the gas mask argument to be pretty much Bullshit- the real reason is a grooming standard. what the military needs to do is develops acceptable standards, and also policy. policy should include commitment- that is you are growing a beard or not- etc, I think there is an old marine MOH that had a beard way way way back. quite frankly Navy should allow long hair for men as it is traditionally correct.

Response by PO3 Richard Jones made Aug 28 at 2018 5:44 PM

PO3 Richard Jones — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 17:44:44 -0400

I was in the Navy from 69 - 74, we were permitted beards when I had my tour overseas. When I got back state side it had to go. Shortly after that all hands were permitted to wear facial hair, within reason. I guess that went by the wayside since my time

Response by Sgt William Margeson made Aug 28 at 2018 6:09 PM

Sgt William Margeson — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 18:09:08 -0400

Not only a good seal on gas mask, body hair attracts vermin. Not only that, it goes to good Grooming , but " Against good order and discipline ".

Response by Sgt John Nichols made Aug 28 at 2018 6:45 PM

Sgt John Nichols — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 18:45:56 -0400

hell no...no beards..it seems that to be a man now you have to have a beard. bullshit.

Response by Cpl Frank Doss made Aug 28 at 2018 6:53 PM

Cpl Frank Doss — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 18:53:01 -0400

I can't get a seal with my CPAP and 2 day's growth. I wonder if that would correlate to a gas mask and a full beard???

Response by Sgt Dale Briggs made Aug 28 at 2018 8:45 PM

Sgt Dale Briggs — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 20:45:52 -0400

I grew a beard forever when I hit my EAS, but that's a hell of a long time ago. Beards while in? No I don't think so, that's for the Navy guys. Nice to see tradition retained, don't like it don't join, theres other branches. Marines are direct combat just like the Army, you know that when you join , given the mission growing a beard shouldn't even be in the equation. But you can grow one hell of a Caterpillar.

Response by SSgt Jim Gilmore made Aug 28 at 2018 9:04 PM

SSgt Jim Gilmore — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 21:04:19 -0400

Beards were allowed at a time when things were much harsher in the US. In the days of the Revolutionary War and Civil War, beards were not as much a fashion statement as they were a means of protecting the face in harsh weather. Fast forward a few decades and you have beards disappearing across the board with few exceptions...the medical waiver and the Submarine Service. The medical waiver is a no brainer. The submariners were allowed to have beards in the interest of saving on board water supplies. But know too that as soon as the boat was able to stay on the surface, gone were the beards too.

This brings us to modern day. Beards have all but been abolished across the board with possible exception of the Navy and the medical waiver. CNO Adm. Elmo Zumwalt allowed beards for naval personnel back in the 60s & 70s but to my knowledge (and have not kept up on regs) beards are an across the board, NO!

I'd like to read your research where bearded men are given preference for managerial posts and are paid more because of it.

The bottom line from this Wing Nut is the USMC has been the most "stable" in terms of discipline, dress and appearance over the years. Why screw with something that works? Hell, my USAF can't make up its collective mind what the bloody uniforms should look like from year to year. If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

Response by SSG James Mills made Aug 28 at 2018 9:14 PM

SSG James Mills — Tue, 28 Aug 2018 21:14:11 -0400

No it should not be allowed

Response by SPC Garth Boehmlehner made Aug 29 at 2018 12:18 AM

SPC Garth Boehmlehner — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 00:18:57 -0400

I guess technically Marines could wear camo tutus over their pants, do we want this can of worms opened, I think there is enough shit* going on with regulations, keep it classy.

Response by Cpl Robbie Penn made Aug 29 at 2018 8:57 AM

Cpl Robbie Penn — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 08:57:42 -0400

Beards are unsanitary. It's been proven that beards and facial hair in general contain more bacteria than a public toilet seat. The reason the early commandant's all had beards was because 1) hygiene was much more difficult in the field back then and 2) most men grew facial hair because it was the style. Today we have norelcos and razors and water everywhere in no real short supply. Don't like not having a beard? Do t enlist! Plain and simple.

Response by SSgt Gerald Davis Jr made Aug 29 at 2018 10:17 AM

SSgt Gerald Davis Jr — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 10:17:26 -0400

The most important reason no service can have beards is that the gas mask will not seal.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 29 at 2018 10:17 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 10:17:29 -0400

clean shaven should be the only standard. some soldiers look like absolute ass and get away with it because of their shaving profile. im all for necessary profiles be neat amd tidy shoukd always be enforced. beards enable extra sloppiness. look crisp in that uniform.

Response by HA Jace Gallagher made Aug 29 at 2018 12:12 PM

HA Jace Gallagher — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 12:12:22 -0400

The Marines are the only true fighting force we have left. If their regs change, we are screwed as a country. Tradition instills discipline which instills bravery in combat.

Response by SCPO Anthony Wingers made Aug 29 at 2018 12:25 PM

SCPO Anthony Wingers — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 12:25:46 -0400

I was in during the zoomy years in the Navy, and watched good order and discipline go straight to hell during that period. The beards and longer hair were not the problem, but the attitude that usually went with them. Suddenly there was little difference between an e2 and an e4, when there had been a complete difference previously. Many took to first naming their seniors and many of them allowed it. Post zoomy, the new CNO told us to take a 180 and march smartly forward. Sadly, it would never be quite the same Navy. Some said that was a good thing. I think there was good and bad, but as to the Marine Corps, if it works, don't fix it.

Response by Matt Nelson made Aug 29 at 2018 12:30 PM

Matt Nelson — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 12:30:57 -0400

Ain’t nothing wrong with a properly executed military beard...

Response by LCpl Allen Luze made Aug 29 at 2018 2:07 PM

LCpl Allen Luze — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 14:07:46 -0400

Shortly after I was discharged I let my hair and beard grow out. Fast forward 2 years, I took a job with an asbestos removal company. After 1 day of fighting with the mask to keep it sealed, took my facial hair back to Marine Corps standards (kept the mustache but trimmed that down also). I no longer have a need to wear any type of mask but if the need ever comes up again, the beard will be the first thing to go.

Response by CPL Mike Parker. made Aug 29 at 2018 3:48 PM

CPL Mike Parker. — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 15:48:03 -0400

Response by GySgt William Sabin made Aug 29 at 2018 4:10 PM

GySgt William Sabin — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 16:10:11 -0400

It isn't just the gas mask issue, it also has to do with unaformity and discipline - especially in the Marines. It also has to do with hygiene as a person may become infested with fleas, lice and other insects when not properly shaven. Yes, the Marines do believe in tradition but that tradition today is to be clean shaven as time and knowledge has evolved

Response by Maj Frank Thomas made Aug 29 at 2018 4:22 PM

Maj Frank Thomas — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 16:22:04 -0400

It aint uniform

Response by SSG Lance Wendling made Aug 29 at 2018 5:46 PM

SSG Lance Wendling — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 17:46:51 -0400

Soldiers and marines should not have beards unless they are assigned special duty. It looks unprofessional, and the argument that bearded men statistically earn more is ridiculous, because warfighting is not their job.

As far as airmen and sailors, that's another topic.

Response by MSG William Hesser made Aug 29 at 2018 6:23 PM

MSG William Hesser — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 18:23:35 -0400

Back in the day in the early years of our great Republic, many people in the military had beards, as it was the normal. However, with the development of better quality shaving devices it became easier to keep yourself clean shaven.
When in the field, it becomes more of a hygiene issue. and with beards and long hair it was obvious that the enemy couuld use it as a weapon against you by grabbing your hair or beard in hand to hand.
The other issue is what your mission entails. Normal combat mission, you should, conserving water of course, should keep yourself shaved avery two or three days in the field. If your mission is such that you must be with the local people, you must take into account the 'Mores' and Means' of the area and must blend in, as we had to do in the SF.
In garrison, it is up to the commander and what the usual dress code entails, usually nothing more than a well groomed mustache.
I found, however, it was more of a problem and time consuming to maintain a beard or mustache than to just keep yourself clean shaven.
We had a guy in my unit who had shrapnel scar on his lip and had permission to have a mustache to cover it up. Other than that, we usually kept ourselves clean shaven.
.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 29 at 2018 7:15 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 19:15:43 -0400

these dumb comments. The men who actually go out and do the fighting all have beards..... the “few and proud” are just a dog and pony show who last attempt to be apart of the ones who actually fight made raiders and are still the smelly kids in gym class. Stop trying to fight for your non worth

Response by TSgt F Mendez made Aug 29 at 2018 8:19 PM

TSgt F Mendez — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 20:19:03 -0400

I think we should be able to wear a different uniform while deployed, like shorts & sleeveless tops. I always gave the Danish troops the stink eye when I saw them walking around base with camo shorts and beards ( and they curved their fucking mustaches like one of those beard competitions) wtf why can't we do that, it makes more sense. Desert heat sucks & if we get shot it don't matter if we are wearing shorts or long pants, beards.

Response by 1SG Leon Espe made Aug 29 at 2018 10:19 PM

1SG Leon Espe — Wed, 29 Aug 2018 22:19:44 -0400

Crab lice reside in human pubic hair including eyebrows and mustache and sometimes beards. Head lice prefer long hair over short hair. That's why they practically shaved our heads in Basic Training. When I enlisted in 1948 we were bunked in large rooms with up to 50 double bunks or a capacity for 100 men. Even regular units after Basic had similar sleeping accommodations. If ONE man got a case of the "crabs" all 100 men usually had to take measures for prevention dosing themselves with crab powder or "Blue Ointment" every day for at least a week just to prevent infestation. The barracks had to be fumigated. Daily showers were the order of the day and woe to the guy that neglected that chore. There was good reason to forbid beards back then and with similar situations it may for the better today also.

Response by SPC Korey Kilburn made Aug 30 at 2018 3:34 AM

SPC Korey Kilburn — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 03:34:52 -0400

The Sikh are a major component of theIndian Military and as such I’m sure India developed a mask to accommodate their beards. That said the Army had a shortage of physicians and the American Sikh community were willing to help fill the void and serve their new country with honor. TheUS Army accommodates as the mask technology is there. I knew several guys while I served that constantly had shaving profiles. They still served but had to maintain a short clip to their facial hair. My opinion make a grooming standard for beards in all branches and allow them once out of training. My nephew had a long beard while deployed to Afghanistan. As he was part of a Delta Team in Afghani Dress to blend into the country.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 30 at 2018 4:55 AM

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 04:55:36 -0400

Response by MGySgt Steve Reep made Aug 30 at 2018 7:16 AM

MGySgt Steve Reep — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 07:16:15 -0400

It also cause horrible scaring when hit in 5he face. Hairs also cut exposed nerves like a scalpel.

Response by SPC Dustin Dodge made Aug 30 at 2018 8:24 AM

SPC Dustin Dodge — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 08:24:38 -0400

Man looking at some of these vets and current service members commenting on this may be a mistake and all but ahit happens. As a previously enlisted soldier now out and I myself have grown quite the magnificent beard, I also understand where y'all come from with keep the clean shave alive and such. Now I know I ain't a marine but I was in the Army so I figured I'd drop a bit of knowledge and see how many rage comments and I can get from this. Back in the day and I mean way back, beards, long hair, tattoos and etc. we're actually a sign of being a warrior and a damn good one at that. Now dont get me wrong I ain't got no issues with the clean shaved look, but if your ass is fighting in a war and you somehow for some reason get close enough for the enemy to even see you, do you really think they give a shit about how well groomed you are? I mean c'mon now, especially in jobs such as infantry and other combat arms the job is to be feared, to get the message across of don't fuck with us or our country, not how about a business date over some tea. Just saying, I mean why not try and see if the gas mask does get a good seal if that's your concern, but simply keeping tradition because it's just how it's been since shit started doesn't mean it's the only effective way. Remember, adapt and overcome. Don't be a narrow minded civi subject to the word of others. Even a soldier needs a mind of their own somtimes. Hooah, and be safe brothers even if you ain't active.

Response by CW3 Harvey K. made Aug 30 at 2018 10:00 AM

CW3 Harvey K. — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 10:00:21 -0400

IIRC the "no beard policy" was rumored to have originated with Alexander the Great, who had a scant, scraggly beard, shaved it, and required all his troops to share in his beardless state so that he would not be the only one to appear "boyish".
There was also the practical justification that a troop's beard might be grabbed by an enemy in the close combat of that era, and be used as a weapon against him.
What would prevent the Corps from establishing a uniform beard regulation, that would set the standards for an acceptable form and amount of facial hair?
I recall my brother growing a mustache, permitted under regs for those at E-6 and higher, as soon as he made Staff Sergeant in the Corps (at age 20) to look older. Perhaps beards should be reserved for the higher ranks, not from E-3 up as the Navy once permitted.

Response by Cpl Dave Nichols Sr made Aug 30 at 2018 11:02 AM

Cpl Dave Nichols Sr — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 11:02:30 -0400

We are supposed to be uniform in our appearance. People expect a certain look when they see Marines in uniform. Put that aside a minute. Can you imagine how bad some of these beards would look? I see way too many civilians with scraggly beards that have bare spaces all over their faces. Yeah. Wouldn't that look sharp on a Marine in his blues?

Response by Cpl Dwight Hardy made Aug 30 at 2018 12:13 PM

Cpl Dwight Hardy — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 12:13:43 -0400

Full beard seal.....try that with a nerve agent and see how good the seal was....id rather not risk my Marines lives.

Response by SgtMaj Anthony Goss made Aug 30 at 2018 2:52 PM

SgtMaj Anthony Goss — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 14:52:06 -0400

I think we'll enough should be left alone. Those that choose to wear a mustache are normally given the "why are you wearing that look". I kmow I did for the 30 yrs I was in. There was two occasions I didn't which was very highly discourage (told no) on the drill field and once when I messed it up. The originator of this post stated to take a look at the earlier Commandants which is true about the beard. However, if you look back through history, you could also see the chage in haircuts. For whatever reason it changed in the past, until you research it and find out why it changed it should stay as is.

Response by PO2 Hauke Powers made Aug 30 at 2018 5:03 PM

PO2 Hauke Powers — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 17:03:13 -0400

As open-minded as I usually am to ALL services...the USMC has always been my gold standard for military excellence as per trooper/sailor/airman/...my answer is a resounding NO...The USMC has always had it's very own standers for EVERYTHING they wear, use, and do in their daily lives. A beard or facial hair would be the beginning of the weakening of the CORE VALUES that the CORPS relies on to maintain their traditions of over 200 years . The USMC, being the so-called smallest branch of our military, has shown time and again how the discipline has served the Corps AND this country in times of peace and conflict. What I state is not to knock down ANY of the other brances. This is just MY PERSONAL viewpoint...I honor, respect, lift up in full fevor ALL OF THE BRANCHES...God bless all of you and hope you see and respect this old sailor's viewpoint..!!!!

Response by A1C Lexas Granger made Aug 30 at 2018 7:48 PM

A1C Lexas Granger — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 19:48:39 -0400

Why is this even a question? Unless you’re some SF mofo who literally can break every uniform rule because he bleeds for us stateside, then no uniformed military personnel should be allowed a beard according to the standards set. I’m not one who knows all the regs, but just fucking do you job and quit asking stupid questions.

Response by SPC David James made Aug 30 at 2018 9:17 PM

SPC David James — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 21:17:07 -0400

If you want to wear a beard join an elite unit like Army SF or the SEALs

Response by SGT Brad Baier made Aug 30 at 2018 9:17 PM

SGT Brad Baier — Thu, 30 Aug 2018 21:17:23 -0400

I'd really like to see an example of a protective mask sealing with a beard. Be sure to test it with something quite painful so the person that doesn't get a good seal remembers he screwed up.

Response by LCDR Tim McKenzie made Aug 31 at 2018 6:00 AM

LCDR Tim McKenzie — Fri, 31 Aug 2018 06:00:08 -0400

Why not man buns, or dreadlocks for all men.

Response by SSgt Bill Lappin made Aug 31 at 2018 3:49 PM

SSgt Bill Lappin — Fri, 31 Aug 2018 15:49:18 -0400

David,
A good seal on a gas mask, was not the only reason the Marines didn’t have beards. Uniformity, and hygiene.
Leave the Marine Corps alone. If some millennial little puke wants a beard, let him join the Navy!

Response by Sgt Matt Owens made Aug 31 at 2018 6:44 PM

Sgt Matt Owens — Fri, 31 Aug 2018 18:44:26 -0400

If you cut out tradition, history, and practicality, it's no longer the Marine Corps.

Response by CPO Dennis Laurion made Aug 31 at 2018 7:25 PM

CPO Dennis Laurion — Fri, 31 Aug 2018 19:25:43 -0400

The Navy allowed beards about 1970 to 1974. The Coast Guard followed suit about 1970 to 1982. Prior to gas mask training, our Marine instructors told us to shave the night before. The fresh-shaved skin burned while we took off the masks and refitted them.

Response by Cpl Michael O'Rourke made Aug 31 at 2018 11:04 PM

Cpl Michael O'Rourke — Fri, 31 Aug 2018 23:04:11 -0400

Stay squared away bunch of dirtbags.

Response by SPC Larry Kivi made Sep 1 at 2018 3:09 AM

SPC Larry Kivi — Sat, 01 Sep 2018 03:09:14 -0400

You know as I sit here and read the lets say, colorful comment about the PROTECTIVE MASKS. I just wonder how many got the fopaw about the MASKS. As I was once told the mask are to keep out the gas hence the name PROTECTIVE MASKS not keep the gas in as would be the case with gas masks. Heck i never had a beard when i was in the army it was unheard of and against the regs also. Everybody have a great Holliday on monday.

Response by Charlie Huffman made Sep 1 at 2018 11:39 AM

Charlie Huffman — Sat, 01 Sep 2018 11:39:16 -0400

Should stay as always...does the core not stand for perfection? Being not only saves ur ass but helps keep that reputation of perfection where it belongs

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 1 at 2018 2:44 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 01 Sep 2018 14:44:48 -0400

Insert the word “negros” or “women” and lets the morons on here make the same arguments against

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 1 at 2018 2:50 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 01 Sep 2018 14:50:07 -0400

The no bears policy is relatively new,
Civil war had beards
Spanish American war had beards
War of 1812 had beards

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 1 at 2018 2:50 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 01 Sep 2018 14:50:38 -0400

Picture from 1834 of marine with beard

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 1 at 2018 2:51 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 01 Sep 2018 14:51:04 -0400

1864

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 1 at 2018 5:37 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 01 Sep 2018 17:37:32 -0400

Bring back the beard!!!

Response by SPC Jeffrey Stone made Sep 1 at 2018 8:04 PM

SPC Jeffrey Stone — Sat, 01 Sep 2018 20:04:16 -0400

The ARMY is stupid to allow special head gear and beards. This PC crap needs to end.

Response by SGT Tomas "Huey" Husted made Sep 1 at 2018 8:19 PM

SGT Tomas "Huey" Husted — Sat, 01 Sep 2018 20:19:21 -0400

Beside the protective seal ( which was the indoctrination I received), I believe uniformity may be an issue, that and the self-disiplin of hygiene.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 3 at 2018 5:35 PM

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 03 Sep 2018 17:35:51 -0400

Beards would be nice, shaving is a pain

Response by SGT Tj Casiano made Sep 3 at 2018 9:20 PM

SGT Tj Casiano — Mon, 03 Sep 2018 21:20:13 -0400

The only people who should be able to have beards are Special Forces, and human intelligence gatherers, and I should only be if they are deploying, or getting ready to deploy.

Response by PO2 Nasser Montes made Sep 4 at 2018 1:40 PM

PO2 Nasser Montes — Tue, 04 Sep 2018 13:40:52 -0400

Back in 1985, when I was in “A” School for my machinist mate’s training, we were going over OXYGEN BREATHING APPARATUS (OBA) which we used to fight fire on board ship. Our instructor was a Navy Veteran who served during Vietnam Era into the late 1970s. This is important because he was part of the Navy that brought back beards. The beards he told us were supposed to be a certain length, no more than 1/2 an inch and thickness that covered the face “neatly and smartly”. The beard should not interfere with any safety equipment that needed to be worn on the face, like the OBA.

Now the instructor mentioned that the face mask on the OBA, was supposed to give a tight seal on your face.

When a fire broke on deck of his ship, he donned his OBA to fight the fire. While the mask sat snuggly on his face it was wasn’t tight because of his beard. This caused his to intake smoke when trying to fight the fire. He ended up in the hospital for two weeks.

He said it was his incident and many others who could get a tight seal on their OBA masks that made the Navy reassess their beard policy, only allowing those to wear a beard if they get medical clearance.

Response by PO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 4 at 2018 5:30 PM

PO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 04 Sep 2018 17:30:59 -0400

There is nothing wrong with beards as long as they look nice and the gas mask thing is bullshit

Response by Cpl David McLeod made Sep 4 at 2018 10:38 PM

Cpl David McLeod — Tue, 04 Sep 2018 22:38:57 -0400

No they should not and you can NOT get a good seal.( 30 years of fighting fires in Detroit) with a beard.

Response by Jeffrey Skibenes made Sep 6 at 2018 2:43 PM

Jeffrey Skibenes — Thu, 06 Sep 2018 14:43:46 -0400

Beards are unprofessional in their appearance period. They do NOT look good in a uniform. Why allow the most elite fighting force on the planet to be further sullied and less respected?

Response by SSG Brian G. made Sep 10 at 2018 1:08 AM

SSG Brian G. — Mon, 10 Sep 2018 01:08:05 -0400

Beards are and remain to be unprofessional. Add to this that a warfighter with a beard reduces his survivability in the event chemical weapons are employed as to date there is no gas mask that seals with a beard on. There are efforts to create and test one that seals to the neck rather than the traditional method but so far no go.

Response by CSM Michael Bolton made Sep 12 at 2018 4:52 PM

CSM Michael Bolton — Wed, 12 Sep 2018 16:52:15 -0400

Beards are not professional looking

Response by 1SG Donald Elmore made Sep 12 at 2018 7:15 PM

1SG Donald Elmore — Wed, 12 Sep 2018 19:15:08 -0400

Absolutely not. Beards have been shown to contain feces, bacteria and fungi.
It is not hygienic at all. Same reason long hair is not permitted.

Response by SGM Ronald Cheatom made Sep 16 at 2018 4:30 PM

SGM Ronald Cheatom — Sun, 16 Sep 2018 16:30:08 -0400

Unless it is tactically neccessary, beards should not be allowed, period.

Response by 1SG Dale Cantrell made Sep 23 at 2018 9:29 PM

1SG Dale Cantrell — Sun, 23 Sep 2018 21:29:41 -0400

My opinion, no beards in any US Service, my experience that men change mannerisms, with long hair or beards, they go from TEAM work , to me and mine .

Response by CWO4 Doug Davis made Sep 25 at 2018 3:37 PM

CWO4 Doug Davis — Tue, 25 Sep 2018 15:37:40 -0400

NO unless they are in spec. ops. and on spec. missions.

Response by Sgt Charles Welling made Sep 28 at 2018 9:22 AM

Sgt Charles Welling — Fri, 28 Sep 2018 09:22:33 -0400

I can't believe a Marine wrote this. I am an engineer, mechanical. I can guarantee you, in the presence of a wiry matter between two sealing surfaces will be the high propensity for leakage. When poisonous gas is the fluid being sealed out, the risk is too high and I don't give a damn what an Army test showed. Besides that, tradition is enough. Square away!!!

Response by SPC Phillip Anderson made Sep 28 at 2018 11:01 AM

SPC Phillip Anderson — Fri, 28 Sep 2018 11:01:19 -0400

My knee-jerk reaction is No. I knew many NCOs who shaved off their mustaches for their DoD photos for fear they would look out of regs and count against them for new jobs or promotions. Now imagine the regulations that would cover full facial hair.
Regulations have changed regarding certain tattoos.
I think it should be rank specific, something that is earned with time in service.

Response by Cpl Bobbylee Dominguez made Sep 30 at 2018 7:32 PM

Cpl Bobbylee Dominguez — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 19:32:44 -0400

Tradition is the key word otherwise we loose the image of being different. It is just laziness in part of new recruits. Not able to endure what other generations have. Too many mom's boys anymore.

Response by Ian Pearce made Oct 9 at 2018 8:52 PM

Ian Pearce — Tue, 09 Oct 2018 20:52:34 -0400

I think the Marines, should not allow beards. Even if it’s a religious thing, a tight seal on a gas mask is needed. Think about this, take a Suction cup And put it on you window now try to pull it off. Now take a pop circle stick, and put it under half of it. It will not seal, like your gas mask when you have a beard. It’s kinda common sense, this rule was put in place for a reason.

Response by PV2 Glen Lewis made Oct 12 at 2018 2:48 PM

PV2 Glen Lewis — Fri, 12 Oct 2018 14:48:14 -0400

How many times is this question going to be posed? No; not for any branch of the military

Response by SSG Mark Franzen made Oct 19 at 2018 8:45 PM

SSG Mark Franzen — Fri, 19 Oct 2018 20:45:18 -0400

THERE IS NO BRANCH OF SERVICE ALLOWED TO HAVE BEARDS SO WHY WOULD IT BE DIFFERENT THEN OTHER BRANCHES.
SSG MARK FRANZEN
USA COLD WAR VET

Response by SSgt Kerry Dillon made Oct 21 at 2018 1:21 PM

SSgt Kerry Dillon — Sun, 21 Oct 2018 13:21:07 -0400

Yes some the Comnadants had beards back in the day but that was before chemical warfare and the need of gas masks. If beards were to be allowed then we would also have to look at what is the purpose of having high and tights or (regulation) hair cuts?

Response by MSgt Jim Bain made Oct 21 at 2018 7:42 PM

MSgt Jim Bain — Sun, 21 Oct 2018 19:42:26 -0400

The men of the USMC, are the most squared away group of people on the face of the earth, why screw with perfection. I was in the Navy for 6, and the Air Guard for 16. I have been to A school, and served with the Marines, on ship, and shore, they really are the best, …..beards, out of the question.

Response by SFC Ronald Hebert made Oct 30 at 2018 9:44 AM

SFC Ronald Hebert — Tue, 30 Oct 2018 09:44:14 -0400

Modern times require changes, yes Marines should be allowed to have groomed beards with regulated standards.

Response by TSgt John Bonnar made Nov 4 at 2018 8:34 PM

TSgt John Bonnar — Sun, 04 Nov 2018 20:34:18 -0500

Most other country's allow them. To be PC now days, why not?

Response by MSgt Thomas Welch made Nov 17 at 2018 9:34 PM

MSgt Thomas Welch — Sat, 17 Nov 2018 21:34:44 -0500

this makes a lot of points not all coherent. Do the Sikh army use the exact same protective mask? What regulations on beards do they have? then you have hygiene issues, long hair requires more cleaning than short, or no beard at all. unless you are activating a return to 1900 sanitary standards.As for men with beards getting more pay than those without, you do not receive pay for personal hygiene or lack there of.

Response by CPO John Brownlee made Nov 21 at 2018 5:37 PM

CPO John Brownlee — Wed, 21 Nov 2018 17:37:31 -0500

No Beards!!

Response by GySgt Lawrence OSullivan made Nov 25 at 2018 12:25 PM

GySgt Lawrence OSullivan — Sun, 25 Nov 2018 12:25:00 -0500

No Beards unless you are on a spec ops mission where you need it to assimilate into your surroundings.

Response by SGT Larry Reed made Jul 20 at 2019 10:08 PM

SGT Larry Reed — Sat, 20 Jul 2019 22:08:04 -0400

I agree with all you have said. I believe Navy Seals are professional some have beards.

Response by PO3 Jerry Armstrong made Feb 11 at 2020 5:10 PM

PO3 Jerry Armstrong — Tue, 11 Feb 2020 17:10:00 -0500

Beards were allowed in the U.S. Navy until 1984 for Petty Officers and higher ranks.

Response by PFC Kenneth Anderson made Feb 11 at 2020 5:18 PM

PFC Kenneth Anderson — Tue, 11 Feb 2020 17:18:24 -0500

I could care less, What them Damn Jarheads Do!

Response by PO2 Tony Divito made Feb 11 at 2020 5:54 PM

PO2 Tony Divito — Tue, 11 Feb 2020 17:54:11 -0500

Master Gunnery Sgt. Leland Diamond had a beard. WW1, Inter-War Shanghai, & WW2 Guadalcanal. Constantly went AWOL from the hospital to rejoin his unit. He didn't give a crap about uniform regs but was always iching for a fight. He was 52 in Guadalcanal.

Response by SP5 Gary Smith made Feb 11 at 2020 7:37 PM

SP5 Gary Smith — Tue, 11 Feb 2020 19:37:41 -0500

Beards attract dirt, fleas and homos.

Response by PVT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 12 at 2020 3:03 AM

PVT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 12 Feb 2020 03:03:54 -0500

It should stay the same.

Response by SGT Reginald Tyler made Feb 12 at 2020 3:42 PM

SGT Reginald Tyler — Wed, 12 Feb 2020 15:42:49 -0500

A lot of black men deal with ingrown hairs because of our skin, I went thru two years of testing at the dermatology clinic in Germany before I received a permanent shaving profile, this became an issue because people felt I should have to shave for some the same reasons you stated. I never had a problem completing and and all task I need to , range, nbc training ( to include wearing your gear for six hours in any Temperature) Some commander’s had a problem with it and stopped my promotion just based on that, but never had a problem with my job performance. I completed 26 years Army and this was the negative thing they held against me. You take a soldier for the soldiers they are and do not just judge just based on their appearance. I went as far as a E-5 running a Battalion S-4 and holding down an E-7 Supply Sergeant spot in Korea. But because I had a beard ( well groomed) I could not get promoted. Also never had any UCMJ actions taken against me just stood my ground and knew what AR-670-1 said.

Response by 1LT William Clardy made Nov 2 at 2020 3:26 PM

1LT William Clardy — Mon, 02 Nov 2020 15:26:10 -0500

I know I'm coming late to the party, but for some reason this is making me visualize a Marine Corps Mullet: high cut tight, low left long...

Response by Sgt Dale Briggs made Dec 25 at 2020 10:47 PM

Sgt Dale Briggs — Fri, 25 Dec 2020 22:47:07 -0500

Eh, elite SF guys have beards and scruff, might wear jeans, a baseball hat. They're there to kill the enemy, a beard neither helps nor hurts. Discipline is keeping your weapon clean, your ammo and magazines clean, all your gear in first order, and knowing your job.