Should companies like Hobby Lobby have the religious freedom to opose elements of ObamaCare?

1SG Larry Everly — Wed, 25 Jun 2014 10:06:04 -0400

Response by CW2 Joseph Evans made Jun 25 at 2014 10:20 AM

CW2 Joseph Evans — Wed, 25 Jun 2014 10:20:24 -0400

Corporations are not people.
They are not allowed exceptions to the law because of the beliefs held by a select few in their organizations.
Furthermore, the hypocrisy of their position, considering they are deeply involved in the perpetuation of human rights violations by virtue of their suppliers, makes their stance rather pathetic. If they want to claim exception based on principle, that principle should be expressed through the entirety of their business model, not just when it is convenient.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 25 at 2014 10:20 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 25 Jun 2014 10:20:41 -0400

I actually think so. The employes of hobby lobby have been working there knowing what health care benefits that the company is willing to provide. If they didn't like it then they have been completely free to seek employment elsewhere or get additional insurance on their own. The company was founded on certain beliefs and while IMO they haven't pushed them on anyone, they shouldn't be forced to change how they do things. Whether I agree or disagree with their beliefs, I don't feel it is right to force the values of Obama care on them as it is in direct conflict of theirs.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 30 at 2014 11:02 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 30 Jun 2014 11:02:17 -0400

The Supreme Court says yes. And I agree.

Supreme Court rules ObamaCare provision can't force some employers to cover contraception

The decision was one of two final rulings to come down on Monday, as the justices wrapped up their work for the session.

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 30 at 2014 10:59 PM

Maj Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 30 Jun 2014 22:59:00 -0400

Yes, 1SG. However, I would go further and truncate the word "religious."

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 30 at 2014 11:46 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 30 Jun 2014 23:46:07 -0400

Yes, of course otherwise our values mean nothing. The Constitution means nothing. If the government, which is restricted by the Constitution, is allowed to force people to violate their values then where does that lead us. The sad thing is this has been so politicized and demonized it's ridiculous. And they continue to LIE about Hobby Lobby. They DO provide coverage for some contraception just not the abortifacients.

http://youngcons.com/facts-liberals-dont-want-you-to-hear-hobby-lobby-actually-provides-their-employees-with-16-different-types-of-contraception/

Facts liberals don't want you to hear: Hobby Lobby actually provides their employees with 16...

What’s that? Hobby Lobby actually provides their employees with 16 out of 20 different types of contraception? But that would make Sandra Fluke a liar. It can’t be true! Supreme Court rules that bosses can deny employees coverage of birth control. #HobbyLobby #NotMyBossBusiness — Sandra Fluke (@SandraFluke) June 30, 2014 From our friend Katie Pavlich …

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2014 12:12 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 00:12:31 -0400

Here's the most disturbing part of this whole fiasco. The vile and hatefulness is so disgusting. Wanting to burn down a business??? I'm sorry but while I have disagreed with some businesses in the past, I surely don't want anyone hurt let alone the business to burn down. That's just not right!!!

http://youngcons.com/liberals-are-losing-their-minds-over-the-hobby-lobby-victory/

Liberals are LOSING THEIR MINDS over the Hobby Lobby victory - Young Conservatives

So now these crazy people who scream expletives on Twitter claim they will never go to Hobby Lobby again. For every sane American, that greatly increases our shopping experience there. And let’s be honest, we all know 99.99% of you have never been to Hobby Lobby before anyways. Reid on #HobbyLobby: It’s time that five …

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Jul 1 at 2014 12:28 AM

PO1 William "Chip" Nagel — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 00:28:27 -0400

If they weren't buying cheap products from China which opposes everthing they are supposedly standing for, I might agree with their religious freedom argument. As it sits. All I see hyporcisy and lies hiding behind religion.

Response by Cpl Ray Fernandez made Jul 1 at 2014 2:45 AM

Cpl Ray Fernandez — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 02:45:08 -0400

Yes, the decision clearly stated small businesses and corporations where the ownership is concentrated in 5 owners or less have the right to protect their freedom of religion. The decision also did not allow them to not provide contraceptive coverage, just the ones that would terminate a pregnancy. The freedom works two ways, first the employer can choose what to offer employees, and the employees in their decision making capability in the pursuit of employment can decide if they want to be a part of that type of organization. Things work best without the government trying to get involved.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2014 6:49 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 06:49:38 -0400

Here's another question - should muslim owned businesses be able to refuse to pay taxes if any of those taxes go to support the pork industry? How about Quakers (who are pacifists) refusing to pay taxes because 50% goes to the military? Medicare/medicaid, that we all pay, provides access to both contraception and abortions. At what point do we no longer get to pick and choose what we pay into for the overall societal good?

Response by SFC Gary Fox made Jul 1 at 2014 12:53 PM

SFC Gary Fox — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 12:53:50 -0400

At one time, employers didn't offer employees health insurance. That was a benefit many large companies began doing shortly after WWII to attract qualified people to work for them. It's why many companies do it today. It was something the government did not force upon employers at that time.

The problem we have today is a large part of society who believe the government should be more intrusive into our lives, something the Founding Fathers opposed. These same people believe they have a right to health insurance from their employers. There is nothing in the Constitution that guarantees that, but the left who support a growing nanny state say otherwise.

A lot of people on the left and many of the elected Democratic members of Congress falsely claim the Constitution states, "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." News flash; that's not from the Constitution, but the Declaration of Independence.

That statement means each of us has the right to live, be free, and pursue those things that make us happy. We are free to pursue our own occupation, whether it be working for someone else or owning our own business. It does not mean we have the right to demand our employer or our government to pay or provide our health care.

Response by CPT Dave Shephard made Jul 1 at 2014 1:10 PM

CPT Dave Shephard — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 13:10:43 -0400

Religious freedom is a good thing, a necessary thing even. But the challenge going forward will be where to draw the line between individual freedoms and corporate freedom. I suspect that numerous companies will try to use this ruling to expand their power and protection against civil authority.

Justice Ginsburg in her dissenting opinion referenced that particular argument -

"The court’s decision is bound to have untoward effect in other settings. The court’s expansive notion of corporate personhood invites for-profit entities to seek religion-based exemptions from regulations they deem offensive to their faiths.”

Response by Maj Ahron Oddman made Jul 1 at 2014 1:23 PM

Maj Ahron Oddman — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 13:23:32 -0400

This case, like few others in my generation's lifetime (Gen Y) shows how all three branches interact to shape union, and how important it is to VOTE. The next President may get to appoint (and Congress may get to approve/reject) 2 new justices. It's unfortunate that heavy partisan politics determines who our 9 Supreme jurors will be, but I'll take the Supreme Court over the Supreme Leader.

As a side note, I presume our community tends to practice democracy (vote) at a pretty high rate. Perhaps higher than our civilian counterparts?

Response by SSG Robin Rushlo made Jul 1 at 2014 1:46 PM

SSG Robin Rushlo — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 13:46:01 -0400

Obama CARE should be removed. I will get insurance when and if I feel I need it and government should not tell me what kind and how much I should have and if I do not get it the fine me for not having it.

Response by LCpl Steve Wininger made Jul 1 at 2014 3:14 PM

LCpl Steve Wininger — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 15:14:27 -0400

Absolutely. The key word in your question "religious freedom" should give companies the right to oppose any part of the health care law that is against it's religious beliefs. Although Hobby Lobby is a corporation, it still values the religious beliefs of its founders and these are echoed in their policies. To tell a company it has to do something that is against it's owners beliefs is wrong.

Response by SSG Robin Rushlo made Jul 1 at 2014 3:19 PM

SSG Robin Rushlo — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 15:19:36 -0400

Obama Care should be like CAR insurance. I can buy what ever where ever I want or need noth at Age 60 plus OB GYN for babycare as my wife and I are not having another child.

Response by Sgt John H. made Jul 1 at 2014 3:28 PM

Sgt John H. — Tue, 01 Jul 2014 15:28:20 -0400

The Government needs to stay out of the healthcare business. They have done a poor job setting up the system, rolling it out and will do an awful job administering it. Forcing companies to carry the Government brand of insurance and stepping on the constitutionally guaranteed freedoms illustrates how far the Executive branch is willing to over reach and meddle into it's citizens lives. If the government violates its own guidelines by stepping on this basic freedom, what comes next.

Response by CSM Chris McKeown made Jul 2 at 2014 12:14 PM

CSM Chris McKeown — Wed, 02 Jul 2014 12:14:32 -0400

Yes, Obamacare imposes on peoples liberty, freedom of choice and religion. If a person chooses not to be covered for something due to their religion or moral belief why should they foot the bill for someone that opposes their belief just because they think they are entitled to it?

Hobby Lobby is a privately owned company, they pay for contraception just not abortion pills better known as the day after pills. Many people view abortions as nothing more than murder and they do not want to pay to murder someone or a fetus.

All this entitlement crap is just that, CRAP! You want socialism or communism then move your butts to China, Cuba or where ever they have it and let America stand as it always have for freedom. Work for what you need and want and stop looking for handouts.

Response by SP5 Tom Carlson made Jul 2 at 2014 6:47 PM

SP5 Tom Carlson — Wed, 02 Jul 2014 18:47:23 -0400

Yes

Response by SP5 Tom Carlson made Jul 2 at 2014 6:49 PM

SP5 Tom Carlson — Wed, 02 Jul 2014 18:49:41 -0400

And the fact they offer16 of the 20 pills of birthcontrol,, they only opposed the 4 pills that caus a fetus to die and abort

Response by PFC Stephen Eric Serati made Jul 9 at 2014 9:54 PM

PFC Stephen Eric Serati — Wed, 09 Jul 2014 21:54:10 -0400

No, corporations are in a unique position to control employees lives at work and away from work. This just gives them more power. Religion and politics has no roll in the work force. Women should have the opportunity and insurance coverage to regulate their own bodies and they should have the tools to aid them in that endeavor. The Supreme Court is stacked with 6 men and 3 females a little uneven wouldn't you say.

Response by SMSgt Walter Hornbaker made Jul 20 at 2014 11:53 AM

SMSgt Walter Hornbaker — Sun, 20 Jul 2014 11:53:13 -0400

Religious freedom is a right we all have. If a family owned company with religious values and there religion prohibits them from practicing in a certain medical procedure they should be exempt from providing that service for their employees.

Response by COL Jean (John) F. B. made Oct 31 at 2014 11:08 AM

COL Jean (John) F. B. — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 11:08:12 -0400

Absolutely... Employees choose to work there and they do so with an understanding of the rules, pay, benefits, etc. Nobody forces them to work there and people have died for their right to quit, if they want.

The government has no business in this ... plain and simple overreach by an out of control government.