Should I stay in the Army or go civilian as a 25B?

SGT Laura Delgadillo — Fri, 08 Apr 2016 23:23:53 -0400

I'm 6 years in as a 25B, I am wondering if it would be a smarter idea to stay in and re-class (25B points are too high) or get out and try the civilian world. I'm not sure how many job opportunities are available out there that pay the same or more (including benefits)

I'm currently Sec+ and A+ certified and will have my CCENT next month. However, no college degree.
What are your opinions?

Response by LTC Stephen F. made Apr 8 at 2016 11:29 PM

LTC Stephen F. — Fri, 08 Apr 2016 23:29:12 -0400

That is an interesting question SGT Laura Delgadillo. I think it would make sense for you to looking into how many college credits your military career would provide right now and then see if the military would help you finish a degree while you think about a potential career change.

Response by CPL Evan Garrison made Apr 8 at 2016 11:30 PM

CPL Evan Garrison — Fri, 08 Apr 2016 23:30:23 -0400

There are a lot of IT jobs. The type and availability may depend on location. You have internationally recognized certifications. I can not speak to the current Army bring the better choice. Ultimately you need to decide which option is going to fit your life.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2016 11:38 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Apr 2016 23:38:54 -0400

When you decide to make the transition, remember you will start mostly at the bottom. When I started my CIV IT career after 4 years 25b it took me a few months to start out with 37k/year. I began with A+ Net+ Sec+. Keep in mind Military does not translate into experience as well as certs do. Just my 2c

Response by MSG Willis A. made Apr 8 at 2016 11:55 PM

MSG Willis A. — Fri, 08 Apr 2016 23:55:33 -0400

In all honesty, I would stay in, get college knocked out. Being 25B I would also look at reclass to 25D or 17 series. That is where the skill set is leading and where the needs of the army are heading.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2016 12:05 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 00:05:59 -0400

Have you considered a reclass to 17C or going to the "dark side". I'm currently a 25B working on my 17C packet and finishing out my InfoSec Bachelors. The cyber side could really springboard you further then just the IT side of the army.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2016 12:18 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 00:18:01 -0400

I would say weigh your options carfuly. But with your experience and training, you should be able to find a decent job. I have the same training but no experience and I can't find a job with a degree and those certs. So experience is the game changer.

Response by PO2 Tom Belcher made Apr 9 at 2016 12:24 AM

PO2 Tom Belcher — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 00:24:18 -0400

Follow your heart...

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2016 12:55 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 00:55:40 -0400

If you become WO, are there positions for joint army/air force at NORAD in Colorado?

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2016 1:51 AM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 01:51:33 -0400

SGT Laura Delgadillo Being in a job that you love is the most important consideration. Obtaining your degree should also be high on your list. I know that you will make the correct decision, so I will wish you the best on your future endeavours.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2016 2:33 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 02:33:08 -0400

Speaking from personal experience. Just like what SGT Romero said it can be hard to find a job right away if all you are going with is that you are a 25B. I have been on both sides of the table before coming back in the military as a 25B I have worked numerous IT jobs. And that is the big difference. An IT job in the civilian world is different from being a 25B in the military. Our MOS only gets you somewhat prepared, especially since so many bases have civilians that do a lot of the work we should be doing. Unless you are planning on going government or specializing in a certain field. You really should be well rounded. Understand all aspects of the IT field. You could become a manager or supervisor of an IT department and that will require you to be able to deal with everything from mobile devices, telecom, networking, security, repairs and so many more things. You might not have to do any of the work yourself but will be expected to have an understanding of it so you can relay it those that you are supervising. As for your education. You are on the right path and should continue on that path. Get as many certifications as you can. But make sure you stay current on them and how the industry changes. It's also not too late to start taking a class or two now. The college part hurts when it comes to negotiating your pay but if you can show your experience and sale your abilities your pay will come as well. I never went to school for anything computer related until I was back in the military or took a college class until this year and was able to beat out other candidates because of my experience and knowledge. A few of the places I have been able to work for with just my experience and being able to interview well are IBM, Department of HUD, Pentagon, Navy Annex, A nuclear company, an international law frim and a construction company in the DC area. I say this just to show you that it is possible to get a good job at this point in your career. You have to also take in account the location you would get out and go back to live and work. How big is the IT field there? How much of a demand is there in that area? What colleges you have in that area and the IT related programs they have at those schools. You will be in competition with recent graduates, seasoned IT professionals and those everyday computer people out there if you go private and not government. With government you can get a preference. Also if you are within 18 months of your ETS date it may not be a bad idea to go to your SFL-TAP briefings. With all this said it is going to come down to want you really want. Is there another MOS you really want to do so you can stay in the military and move up in rank and do 20yrs? How much longer you really want to be in the Army and do all the things that is required of us. If you have a family then you have to think about how it would affect them. Also check out ArmyReenlistment.com for options as it pertains to other MOS's and also make sure you are reading the bottom of your LES. there is always some good information posted on them. This past one had information about a possible change to the medic field for those interested. I think you have been given a lot of good advice from everyone on here but I wanted to talk to you from my personal experience. I am getting out next year and I had the same dilemma in front of me. You have to make the decision that is best for you.

Response by CW3 Dylan E. Raymond, PHR made Apr 9 at 2016 2:33 AM

CW3 Dylan E. Raymond, PHR — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 02:33:45 -0400

I am a fortune 500 military recruiter and my recommendation is that you test the waters while you are still active duty. What do you mean? I am glad you asked. The best time to look for work is while you are working. So why not attend a SFL-TAP class, learn how to build a resume, create one and start applying for roles and even go on interviews/ How will you benefit:

1) Know what your value is in the civilian marketplace
2) You will get practice interviewing
3) You will build confident

I would not worry so much about NOT having a degree which may be important but focus on your skillset and how you add value to an organization. I personally know someone that is in IT field no degree, work from home and earning close to 70k. But again the best time to test the waters are when you are working that is what you can use your leave for. If you dont take care of yourself you cant expect no one else to take care of you.

Response by TSgt Anthony White made Apr 9 at 2016 6:35 AM

TSgt Anthony White — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 06:35:42 -0400

There are jobs out there, I have an IT degree but didn't get this particular job because of no experience. I have the certs and the degree, just no experience. I found out this place hired a gentleman with no college, a couple of certs but had 10 yrs experience.
So, there are jobs out there, and your military experience will definitely help you.

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made Apr 9 at 2016 6:50 AM

CPT Mark Gonzalez — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 06:50:26 -0400

I would only say evaluate your situation and move quickly. Have multiple coa's. You are about to run up against your rcp and the options on the active side will end. Good luck.

Response by Capt Tom Brown made Apr 9 at 2016 10:29 AM

Capt Tom Brown — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 10:29:24 -0400

You could do a lot worse by getting out than staying in. A job/career in hand is worth two somewhere down-range. The best thing you have going for you at present is your age at which you have a lot of possibilities open to try. Best wishes..

Response by 1SG Terry Gibbens made Apr 9 at 2016 10:42 AM

1SG Terry Gibbens — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 10:42:21 -0400

I retired as the Information Chief as a 25B50. Have your certifications converted to college credits get your degree apply for warrant officer one option. The area you get out is another issue in large metropolitan your chances are better landing a job. I know this decision is hard but I also know you had more place on your plate than people your age coming out of college therefore get a good resume and try the waters.

Response by LTC Jason Mackay made Apr 9 at 2016 12:52 PM

LTC Jason Mackay — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 12:52:48 -0400

You have got some great advice so far from SGT Private RallyPoint Member and 1SG Terry Gibbens and many others. My two cents is look before you leap. I would recommend clearance jobs.com. If you have an active clearance you are more marketable for government or government contractors...but if you go away from the mothership, this may not mean as much. Look hard at where you would go to ensure those jobs are in demand and you have access to education, support networks, and VA benefits (as they apply to you). Check out the VA benefits for vocational training to gain more certifications. Degrees are like an entrance requirement, but certs seem to be the discriminator as I trawl clearance jobs.com, state job postings, and usajobs. Colorado Springs has a bunch of IT type jobs in public and private sectors, as an example.

Response by CPT Joseph K Murdock made Apr 9 at 2016 1:54 PM

CPT Joseph K Murdock — Sat, 09 Apr 2016 13:54:10 -0400

In 14 years you can get $1500-2500 for the rest of your life, and you will still be young.

Response by SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2016 1:55 AM

SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 10 Apr 2016 01:55:38 -0400

Coming from someone in IT in the civilian sector, certifications are nice, but not needed. Especially vendor specific ones. What companies are looking for is a good background, references and that you can actually do your job. I've spent 0 hours in a college classroom (honestly, don't plan on it either) but busted my butt off learning from senior leveled engineers. I would skip the CCENT and use that time to learn something new.

Response by SCPO Joshua I made Apr 10 at 2016 11:27 AM

SCPO Joshua I — Sun, 10 Apr 2016 11:27:25 -0400

Recommend you get your CISSP before you try to find a civilian job. It will open a lot of doors for you - your current quals are help desk level, CISSP would possibly get you out of that mold if that's what you're looking for.

Response by LCDR Rabbah Rona Matlow made Apr 10 at 2016 11:53 AM

LCDR Rabbah Rona Matlow — Sun, 10 Apr 2016 11:53:04 -0400

Being Navy and out for over 15 years, I have no clue what your MOS means. However, I have seen people make it quite well with things like MCSE and no degrees, and others who have BS/BA degrees and can't get work. It really depends on where you want to work. There are huge $$ to be made in Aerospace engineering. Boeing can never get enough engineers and now Airbus is building planes in the US as well. Not to mention the various defense contractors building new warplanes. So that's something to look into.

With six years in and only an E-4 I can imagine you are frustrated. I don't know anything about promotion rates in the Army, but that does seem a bit stagnant. IF your MOS is overmanned that could be a huge thing.

You ultimately have to decide if you like being in the Army or not. If you like it, and can move to a more critical MOS, that's probably a smart move.

On the other hand, especially if you've been in combat and are dealing with any of the myriad maladies that combat vets face, filing for a PEB and getting out might be the better choice.

In the end you have to listen to your heart, your gut, your mind, and those closest to you...

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2016 2:10 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 10 Apr 2016 14:10:08 -0400

Reclass 25D

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2016 2:10 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 10 Apr 2016 14:10:49 -0400

Or go warrant or green to gold.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 11 at 2016 11:41 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 11 Apr 2016 11:41:13 -0400

Go to RobertHalf.com. they are an IT placement service. Nationwide. This will give you an idea of demand and salary. They are highly recommended to use if you choose to. Also check into Warrant program. We are in great need for 255 and a new 170 series warrants.

Response by SPC Stephen Miller made Apr 12 at 2016 10:12 AM

SPC Stephen Miller — Tue, 12 Apr 2016 10:12:14 -0400

Civilian sector wants degrees, the feds are a lot looser and more willing to accept experience in lieu of degrees or even certs (depending on which branch ).

<--Former 25B current CO and alternate computer services specialist for the DoJ.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 14 at 2016 1:20 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Apr 2016 13:20:27 -0400

So here is what I recommend provided you get out.
1. Join the Reserves (Benefits for your family is about 330 a month your entire drill pay and civilian insurance doesn't even come close and you can negotiate for more pay/double up on insurance for you).
2. Use Tuition Assistance to attend college. (at minimum get a degree)
3. Sort your resume out. Keep in mind 90% of your next job is dependant on your resume. So get lots of eyes on it have it submitted 3 months prior.
3. Find a MSP (Managed Service Provider) they manage anywhere from 20 companies to 10k companies. (Smaller the company the better) (Work there 1 year.)
4. If you have a hard time finding work you can use the Reserves to supplement your pay.
5. School is not the most important but keep in mind without it you will have issues getting into management.

Like I said before if you have any questions I am always available and have been through it all.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 15 at 2016 12:02 PM

SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 15 Apr 2016 12:02:49 -0400

You have a lot to consider Soldier, If you still enjoy your time in the military, I would recommend re-classing, once you have fulfilled your initial commitment to the Army as 25B, most commanders will allow you to re-class even if it's potentially out of their unit. Note that this may not be as easy as it sounds, you'll have to figure out what you would like to do, find a unit that has a "will train" position in that MOS, then get that commands blessing before starting any transfer paperwork. I would recommend working with your retention NCO. Secondly if your leaning on getting out of the AC, consider the Reserves or NG, you keep your affiliation with the military and there might be more promotion opportunities on that side of the house and you can pursue your civilian side of your career as well.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 18 at 2016 3:10 AM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 18 Apr 2016 03:10:41 -0400

You're good. Depending on what state you go to the jobs can be plentiful or scarce. Im in California and you would have no problem snagging a good position with great starting pay. Just make sure your resume is squared. In the IT field the certs are a real big deal. A degree while good isnt as required if you have job experience. Active certs are everything

Response by CW3(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 20 at 2016 12:01 AM

CW3(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 00:01:08 -0400

Depends where you're planning to live. San Antonio does have jobs with your skill sets and there is a Cyber unit if you want to join the reserves. Contact me for info if interested.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 20 at 2016 4:42 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 04:42:49 -0400

I noticed you said you have some college and I'm not sure if anyone else mentioned it but you might want to look into OCS. I'm doing that right now in the Guard. I will say that going to dark side has opened a lot of doors for me. A lot of recruiters in the civilian world hear officer and will stack you higher than as enlisted. That's not always the case but it seems to be a lot of the time. It's good you have A+ and Sec+ but those are now seen as entry level now at days. You need to be looking at the higher certs such as CCNP and CISSP or even some of the more cyber ones such as GCIH and such. It can progress your career in either the military or civilian world. Use your GI Bill to pay for those too. Hope that helps.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 25 at 2016 10:32 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 25 Apr 2016 22:32:39 -0400

Complete your CCNA and get out I too was a 25B and got out joined the reserves it took me 2 months to find a Network Engineering position once your in the door your good. Know your stuff and be confident.

Response by Capt Tom Brown made Apr 29 at 2016 3:00 PM

Capt Tom Brown — Fri, 29 Apr 2016 15:00:17 -0400

SGT Laura Delgadillo Hows that decision coming? How close are you to decision time? Hope you got a lot of good suggestions from RP..

Response by SPC Audra Nava made Jun 6 at 2016 3:09 PM

SPC Audra Nava — Mon, 06 Jun 2016 15:09:20 -0400

Well from my experience I am glad I got out. I was a 25B for 6 years as well. I think with getting out as any MOS is having a good resume and interviewing skills as well as have multiple plans for when things go wrong. I had a job already before I got out, but it took them a while to get my SCI updated for some reason. So I was without a job for a couple months. I had saved up and still had my terminal leave pay as well. I also kept looking for jobs while I was waiting for that to come back just in case it didnt come back by the time my last plan was used. It also depends on where you want to live. For me I moved to where the jobs are. I did alot of research before I chose where I wanted to live and between crime, housing cost, job market, and schools for me Colorado Springs and Denver Colorado was the best. But that doesn't mean it will work for everyone. I have had a couple different positions since being here but I got here starting out making around 50K a year, and I have moved up to making in the 70k a year range. I do agree with some poeple that you should try to specialize in something. Servers and systems administrator work is better paying and there is plenty of it (here in colorado springs) IA(Cyber) is a very well paying job too and they are in need of people. If you ever want to ask me questions fill free to message me or even email me. I have helped many people get out and be successful. Its all about your plans, your resume and if you are really ready to make that jump. People might say that the job market is bad but that really depends on where you go because it different from state to state and city to city. I worked with many people on my resume and interviewing skills before I got out which helped me a lot. So again if you would like to message me feel free.

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2016 4:35 PM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 16:35:42 -0400

I have to echo almost everything I have read in the answers provided. There is GREAT upward mobility for 25D and 17C currently. Being on the Army Reserve side and the contractor side, I see both sides of the coin. If you are contractor side, you must be DODI 8570 compliant (as in, CISSP or CASP). CISSP hold more weight and will get you paid more in the long run. Cert up as much as you can/need to. Some employers require certs/some don't. Just be sure and do you homework when looking at the holistic picture of this and where you want to be.
Regions pay differently. DC pays more, but it takes a lot to live there. CO Springs is decent I hear and it is not too expensive. I live in Huntsville, AL and the pay is awesome and cost of living is low.
If you decide to get out, immediately go Guard or Reserve. They are both standing up/currently have Cyber Teams (all sorts, different flavors) that NEED 25D and 17Cs, so you will find a spot-and it looks really good on a resume, you can get Army to help you get certs/experience, etc.
And if you can, try and land with a good company that will pay for your education. That is what I did. Get the schooling-it only makes you stronger. And look into the SOCAD 2 and 4 year colleges to have your skills transfer to college credits. That is what I did for my Associate's.

Response by SPC Jonathan Fleck made Jun 16 at 2016 9:49 PM

SPC Jonathan Fleck — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 21:49:02 -0400

You have to make that choice on your own honestly. I'm a 25B myself and work for comcast as a technician. I don't have any certs yet and no college degree either. But still making decent money. There are jobs out there that will take you based on experience and how you portray yourself.

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 27 at 2016 2:15 PM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 27 Jun 2016 14:15:37 -0400

If you want to do help desk, or build/repair computers for a computer store, then what you have is fine.

With the drawdown from deployments, contractors are flooding the market, with 4-year degrees and years of experience at much higher levels. If you want in that group, you need to get your degree and a higher level cert, like CASSP, CCNA, CEH, or something else in demand.

Response by CPL(P) Kevin Koch made Jul 11 at 2016 12:10 PM

CPL(P) Kevin Koch — Mon, 11 Jul 2016 12:10:01 -0400

I looked you up on GAL, sending you an email. Hopefully I will be able to answer a great majority of your questions and concerns. You seem to be exactly where I was 5 years ago.

Response by SFC Jim Ruether made Mar 1 at 2017 5:40 PM

SFC Jim Ruether — Wed, 01 Mar 2017 17:40:02 -0500

If you are a SPC in the Army right now and unsure if you want to get out or not. Stay in, get promoted. Sergeant Stripes are looked at as a management position and those individuals tend to get hired first. Plus the additional experience is priceless. If you get out I agree with SSG Beavers that you should go Army Reserve or NG and have that paycheck coming in plus you may discover new leads for civilian employment from other reservists working with you that you may not find in your civilian search for employment. I hope that helps you SPC Delgadillo. The very best of luck to you!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 30 at 2017 3:43 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 30 Mar 2017 15:43:47 -0400

I would say that life in the military is a much easier thing than being a civilian in the IT World. I was a 31R (25Q) when I ETS'd from active duty. I had a few job offers, but no real plan to go to work. I finally pulled a job down and a place called Parker Hannifin making hydraulic flight controls. This obviously has nothing to do with the Signal World unless you count post Air force history. I got really bored on the outside not moving around and finally walked into a Guard recruiters office and told him to put me in the first unit that was deploying...Civilian workforce is very dog eat dog. Earned my Associates in IT while there, and was able to pull an entry level Help-desk position which was not a good place for someone with kids to be (pay sucks). Decided to go back to school and finished my Bachelor's in Computer forensics, and a Master's in Information Security (GI Bill paid for all but $3000). Have a Security + cert as well. Finally got a good paying job but again the civilian workforce there was knowledge is power and they would not even help me to learn my job because they thought if I knew it then they would be obsolete. I finally left an $80,000 per year job to put a uniform back on full time with 25U/B MOSs... Granted SFC pay is not bad w/ BAH, but still less than that. I look forward to the retirement in 5 years is going to be great.

What I am driving at with my story is that without the degree you will have issues getting your foot in the door for the interview. Once your degree helps you get the interview then your certificates and experience get you the job. You also need to remember that even though you are a sysadmin on a DoD network, you are very limited by what it is you are able to do and most everything is now scripted. If you ETS look into the Guard or reserves promotions come a little bit easier there and it is a good way to network with other communications Soldiers and might help you get your foot in the door. Best of luck to you and it will always come down to being what is best for you...Make sure you have a plan for life after the Army.

Response by SSG Steven Borders made Mar 14 at 2018 8:20 PM

SSG Steven Borders — Wed, 14 Mar 2018 20:20:05 -0400

SGT Laura Delgadillo I have been struggling with this for awhile myself. I was active for 7 years as a 91D. I got out and went to the reserve. Now, having reclassed as a 25B. I am now having thoughts of just letting out again and returning back to civilian life.

Response by SSG Calvin Grant made Apr 23 at 2019 3:05 PM

SSG Calvin Grant — Tue, 23 Apr 2019 15:05:26 -0400

If you're window is open and your undecided you have some of the right credentials for a good transition into the civilian world. Just make sure all your certs are up to date and you are sure that's what you want to do.

If you stay I would stay 25B maybe start doing some courses in cyber security, start/finish a degree then transition. Either way thanks for serving and good luck.