Should there be a national Voter ID law?

2017-11-09T22:48:11-05:00

Do you think there should be national Voter ID law? Meaning should you be required to show an in-state license in order to vote? Why or why not? It's not racist, nor does it target a specific group of persons. Any adult that drives, applies for job, buys tobacco, etc needs to have an ID, so why not when they vote? Even if there isn't wide spread voter fraud as some have suggested, what could it hurt?

Response by SFC Christopher Taggart made Nov 9 at 2017 11:02 PM

2017-11-09T23:02:25-05:00

Sure, why not. Just as you said, "Any adult that drives, applies for job, buys tobacco, etc needs to have an ID." A responsible adult won't have a problem showing ID, it's just to verify your name, address, and age.

Response by Capt Gregory Prickett made Nov 9 at 2017 11:24 PM

2017-11-09T23:24:36-05:00

Sure, that way it will be much easier when you pull up to the checkpoints, for the nice man to say "Ich bin bei der Landespolizei. Deine Papiere, bitte."

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 9 at 2017 11:45 PM

2017-11-09T23:45:04-05:00

Yes there needs to be an ID to save our nation. I believe in a secret election. That being said, one should be able to identify they are part of the family allowed to decide their faith, that's the only "fair thing to do".

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 9 at 2017 11:50 PM

2017-11-09T23:50:57-05:00

11% of the voting age population do not have a photo ID. There is a real expense that can be incurred to get an ID. In many states, just getting to an office where you can get an official ID is a long process. Take Texas, for example. Many folk in rural regions find them selves travelling more then 150 miles just to get to an office. This is an unreasonable burden and is a solution looking for a problem

Response by AA Joseph Moody made Nov 9 at 2017 11:54 PM

2017-11-09T23:54:42-05:00

I keep finding myself asking one question whenever this topic comes up, who the hell is unable to get ID here in the states? I mean seriously how many people are there out there without ID here in the states? MAybe the question we should be asking is how can we ensure that all citizens have access to some form of ID.

Response by SPC Casey Ashfield made Nov 10 at 2017 12:27 AM

2017-11-10T00:27:58-05:00

Yes. It should be law to show an ID to vote. An ID is needed for darn near everything else. It makes sense to have an idea when selecting representatives at all the levels of government.

Response by SGT Anna Kleinschmidt made Nov 10 at 2017 12:37 AM

2017-11-10T00:37:06-05:00

Well here is my problem. I don't have a drivers license because I have epilepsy and my military ID has always been used. So to get a state issued id I need my birth certificate. I tried to get one from my state but it never came. I am going to have to travel to get it, that's money and time I don't have. So I called and the election commission said my military ID will be fine. But I got there to vote and they said I couldn't use it, that I had to have a drivers licence or a state ID. Luckily I was still able to vote because you can't intimidate me like that. I had a friend that they wouldn't let her vote because she was wearing shorts!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 10 at 2017 12:50 AM

2017-11-10T00:50:08-05:00

I don't mind the idea from the perspective of attempting to ensure only verified U.S. Citizens are physically allowed to take part in the voting process. However, in doing so, I would also place the burden and accountability on the State to ensure every citizen of their State is legitimately provided the IDs, at no cost or inconvenience to the citizen.

I have a question for you, pertaining to your usage of Driving, Employment, and Tobacco Purchase as rationalization tools to support your argument for National IDs on Voting. How are those items weighted against each other in the U.S. Constitution?

Response by SGT Jim Ramge, MBA made Nov 10 at 2017 1:25 AM

2017-11-10T01:25:55-05:00

Yes - and any necessary explanation is idiotic!

Response by SSgt Christopher Brose made Nov 10 at 2017 3:57 AM

2017-11-10T03:57:18-05:00

I'd like to see a constitutional amendment requiring photo ID and proof of citizenship for Presidential elections, requiring the use of paper ballots, and requiring those ballots to be signed and for those signatures to match what's on the photo ID.

Response by LTC Kevin B. made Nov 10 at 2017 5:27 AM

2017-11-10T05:27:58-05:00

Until the government is willing to conveniently offer free ID cards to any eligible voter, I won't support this. I view it as a solution looking for a problem (scant evidence of voter impersonation), and I think it is nothing more than an attempt to influence elections. Make them easy to obtain, and make them free (both directly and indirectly), and maybe then I'll be supportive. Until then, no way.

https://www.brennancenter.org/analysis/research-and-publications-voter-id

Research on Voter ID | Brennan Center for Justice

A comprehensive list of social science research on the impact of voter identification restrictions, which make it harder for some citizens to vote.

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Nov 10 at 2017 5:29 AM

2017-11-10T05:29:41-05:00

See no reason why they shouldn't show some valid form of I.D. even an I.D. card with picture would be fine, there are a lot of people that don't drive for one reason or another.

Response by SCPO Jason McLaughlin made Nov 10 at 2017 6:41 AM

2017-11-10T06:41:31-05:00

To all the people who are so incredulous about people not having State ID's, you do understand that it is more than walking into the DMV, plunking down $50 -100, and getting your picture taken. You have to have ID to get ID. Birth Certificate, Proof of Residency, many require some sort of Federal ID.

You people realize that there are many people in this country that do not have Birth Certificates, especially poor, rural, elderly, and minority. So let's heap more expense on those least able to bear the burden just so they can exercise a right, but we aren't trying to suppress any demographic.....please, sell it to the Air Force!

Response by SPC Kevin Ford made Nov 10 at 2017 6:47 AM

2017-11-10T06:47:48-05:00

I’ve read a lot of, “if it’s not a problem for me so I don’t understand why it’s a problem for anyone else” posts on this thread. I’m not elderly, with no money and without transportation in a nursing home so I don’t understand how anyone else could be, etc.

Here is an interesting story of an elderly man whose name was changed when he was a child by his mother and can’t find documentation of it. He could pay to have the documentation made but it is too expensive for him. There are lots of reasons why something like this may happen.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/getting-a-photo-id-so-you-can-vote-is-easy-unless-youre-poor-black-latino-or-elderly/2016/05/23/8d5474ec-20f0-11e6-8690-f14ca9de2972_story.html?utm_term=.cc90cbfa29b1

Could some scheme be made where national ID’s were free, and highly available everywhere with free help to make sure the required documentation is there? Sure, it could happen. Will it happen? No. Why?

-Because it is an expensive way to deal with a problem that we don’t know is large enough to spend a lot of money on when we have other known large problems
-Because the politicians pushing for these laws and telling people it is a big problem without evidence are not interested in dealing with voter fraud. They are interested in suppressing the ability to vote of people likely to vote for the other party. Any scheme that doesn’t do that isn’t meeting the reason they are making such noise about it in the first place.

Getting a photo ID so you can vote is easy. Unless you’re poor, black, Latino or elderly.

Eleven states are requiring a photo ID to vote in a presidential election for the first time.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 10 at 2017 6:54 AM

2017-11-10T06:54:08-05:00

I used to think that way until my parents got into their eighties and my dad died. My mom was confined to a wheelchair since she was 65. So guess what? She was an adult who didn't drive, or buy alcohol or tabacco, or apply for a job. She lived in an assisted living facility where she required daily medical attention. Her drivers license expired decades ago. So she had no official ID that would meet the strict requirements of some of the states that added voter ID laws. So while all the staff and residents in her facility knew her, and they even set up a voting location in her facility on Election Day, in those states she wouldn't be eligible to exercise her right to vote.

Now, let's say she had to get one of the new acceptable IDs that almost all require submitting a certified copy of her birth certificate. First, since my dad died five years before my mom, and he took care of paperwork stuff in his own unique way, just her finding a copy of her birth certificate would be a huge challenge. Second, she had no idea how to use a computer, so she couldn't simply google the address for requesting one in her home state. And even if she got one, she had no way to get to a DMV to get the ID card. While the facility had a van for weekly trips that could accommodate a wheelchair, they don't run errands like that where they wait for you.

Fortunately, if my mom actually needed to do all that, my brother was there to help her, to get on a computer for her, to drive her, etc. and my mom could afford the $25 or $50 some states charge for certified birth certificates. So it would have gotten done.

But then I started thinking about the elderly like my mom who each month choose between buying their medication or food. Who have disabilities and haven't been outside in months. Who don't have anyone who can get on the computer for them. Whose children, also struggling in poverty, can't afford to take an unpaid day off to go to DMV, or don't have a car that accommodates a wheelchair. There are hundreds of thousands of elderly and disabled people in situations just like that. In fact, they DON'T need a certified ID to live their lives day to day. They have been doing that for years. But these new restrictive voter ID laws make it very difficult to get such an ID and do, in fact, make it impossible for them to vote, after many have been casting votes for 60 plus years.

Those people are the real targets of these voter ID laws, because they tend to vote more democratic than republican. The republicans are more than happy to make it difficult to impossible for hundred of thousands of Americans to vote, and use the often disproved boogeyman of voter fraud to do it.

I would suggest to those who simply cannot imagine how it could be so difficult for some to get a certified copy of a birth certificate and get down to the DMV and get an ID and afford to pay for it, that you may not have really thought through what daily life is like at the existence level of poverty or the limitations and isolation of those who live alone and are disabled. It is not at all the simple task you envision.

Response by SP5 Mark Kuzinski made Nov 10 at 2017 7:54 AM

2017-11-10T07:54:37-05:00

I can't agree more!

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 10 at 2017 8:44 AM

2017-11-10T08:44:43-05:00

It seems like we have this conversation monthly and nothing ever changes. LTC Kevin B. provides the most succinct analysis of this problem on this thread.

There is a whole camp of people here who are of the mindset that since it isn't a problem for them, it shouldn't be a problem for anyone else, when that is simply not the case. When they are given facts as to why it is a burden, they simply ignore it, which doesn't help have any meaningful conversation about the problem.

If this was truly a case of vote integrity then we would have reasonable legislation that offered help to people in obtaining these forms of ID, but it's not, so we don't.

People say, "It's not that expensive". If the government requires you to do something that costs money in order to vote, it could be seen as an unconstitutional poll-tax. That is why it needs to be free.

Response by MSG Stan Hutchison made Nov 10 at 2017 10:05 AM

2017-11-10T10:05:01-05:00

It is obvious that some miss the hypocrisy of this by the conservatives (those are who are advocating for this). They constantly complain about "too much government" but turn around and ask (demand?) more.

As posted below, it is solution looking for a problem.

Also, I agree with the premise of : Papiere bitte.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Nov 10 at 2017 10:30 AM

2017-11-10T10:30:13-05:00

We don't require ID to pay our taxes, something far more intrusive. You literally fill out a form, place a unique identifier on it (SSN) and send it in. The government then sends you a check if applicable.

If the SSN shows as "non-unique" (two people file the same one), the IRS investigates.

Why can't we use something similar?

Response by MCPO Roger Collins made Nov 10 at 2017 10:45 AM

2017-11-10T10:45:05-05:00

We have one, unfortunately it can not be used as an ID Card. Although, most businesses use the last four as a security measure.

Response by SGT Anna Kleinschmidt made Nov 10 at 2017 11:52 AM

2017-11-10T11:52:52-05:00

Here is an article to add to The one SPC Kevin Ford posted.
[https://www.thenation.com/article/a-90-year-old-woman-whos-voted-since-1948-was-disenfranchised-by-wisconsins-voter-id-law/]

Response by LCpl Donald Faucett made Nov 10 at 2017 2:28 PM

2017-11-10T14:28:12-05:00

What happened voter registration cards along with picture ID? It only makes sense.

Response by Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 11 at 2017 8:31 AM

2017-11-11T08:31:27-05:00

If someone shows me the evidence of voter fraud, than I will gladly support a national ID requirement. Until then, it sounds like voter suppression to me. I think with out voter turnouts, we should be encouraging voter registration, not discouraging it.

Response by SPC David Harrington made Nov 21 at 2017 8:09 PM

2017-11-21T20:09:06-05:00

I don't think that everyone should be allowed to vote just because they have an ID. As long as government is in the business of wealth redistribution, only tax payers should be able to vote for things that cost tax dollars. No taxation without representation, but no representation without taxation. You should have skin in the game. There are many different ways to accomplish this, but the principle is a valid one.