Single soldier barracks...do we still need them?

SSG Robert Burns — Thu, 12 Dec 2013 16:54:57 -0500

What are the pros and cons of still having barracks as opposed to giving single soldiers BAH to live off post?  Do we really believe that their barracks quarters are equivalent to the amount they would receive in BAH?<div>Most of them would get a roommate anyway and be splitting the rent on a 2 bedroom apt. </div><div>What do you think?</div>

Response by SFC Rocky Gannon made Dec 12 at 2013 5:00 PM

SFC Rocky Gannon — Thu, 12 Dec 2013 17:00:50 -0500

SSG Burns, if you look at the without dependents rate, I believe you would find that the Army could same money. I think what would happen is we would have a lot of homeless single soldiers as they would use the money in other ways. To do it we would need to have all soldiers go to budgeting class and have a budget approved and that would be another training that is mandated. I could see it both ways, if a solder wants to try it with a room mate I believe they should be given the chance.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 12 at 2013 5:01 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Dec 2013 17:01:45 -0500

SSG Burns, I think in some instances the barracks are a necessity, not because of any BAH equivalent, but bc some Soldiers don't have transportation, some Soldiers have financial mismanagement issues, and some just NEED to be in the barracks. So that being said, yes I think SSB should still be "offered" to E5 and below.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 12 at 2013 5:51 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Dec 2013 17:51:54 -0500

I think if you are looking at it from a budget point of veiw it makes sense to have them in the barracks. like you said the BAH is more than what they get in the barracks. if we let every Soldier live on the economy the amount of money spent would be crazy. The other responses made good points also. I just had to metion the money. Looking at it from a Big Army aspect I think it saves us money.

Response by SPC Michael Martinez made Apr 4 at 2014 6:26 PM

SPC Michael Martinez — Fri, 04 Apr 2014 18:26:59 -0400

Pros:<div>Unit Cohesion</div><div>Cost to the Taxpayers</div><div>Mission Response</div><div>Cons:</div><div>Lack of Independence</div><div>Poor Implementation of Oversight of occupants (some folks need to be watched more than others)</div><div>All in all the use of barracks should be implemented because of overall cost to taxpayers and Mission Response. Discipline should be instilled when the commander orders his unit to be on duty.</div>

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 7 at 2014 7:03 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 07 May 2014 19:03:56 -0400

I don't think NCOs should have to reside in the barracks. It is laughable to make a 30s-40s NCOs live amongst a bunch of teenagers/20 somethings.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 23 at 2015 9:04 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 23 Jan 2015 09:04:47 -0500

I believe Soldiers need to live in the barracks for many reasons. my number 1 reason is most of the junior enlisted including Sergeants have never live on their own before joining the army and need the stucture given by living in the barracks. Truthfully most barracks today are better than most apartments you could fine to live in. I remember when i lived in the barracks and you had four Soldiers in a two man room, now Soldiers have their own barracks to themselves. You also have to think about the BAS if all Soldiers recieved BAH they would also recieve BAS, and Chow halls are funded by the BAS from the Soldiers who live in the barracks hence if you no longer have barracks you would no longer be able to fund the chow halls on post. While i was stationed in Alaska they actually had to close down the chow hall due to lack of funds because to many Soldier were receiving BAS.

Response by PO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 1 at 2015 3:56 PM

PO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 01 Feb 2015 15:56:42 -0500

SSG Robert Burns, when I was in the Navy ('96-'02), because we were a bit short on barracks rooms at SUBASE NLON (and because I was on Submarines, overflow to the boat wasn't really an option) the policy was that unmarried E-4 and above (E-4 are NCOs in the Navy) could submit a request to live out in town and draw BAH w/o dependents.

Unfortunately, there was no public transportation and most of the apartments that junior sailors could afford weren't near the base.

I think that, from a purely budgetary point of view, having barracks makes more sense. If you factor in other benefits to living near others in your unit, such as unit cohesion, barracks is just the right way to go.

Response by 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 1 at 2015 4:03 PM

2LT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 01 Feb 2015 16:03:51 -0500

I believe barracks are a joke. So, you can lose your life for your country at 17-18, but you can't be trusted to live on your own? And getting married, having a child or commissioning all of the sudden makes you mature enough? No, no and no.

Response by SPC Larry Boutwell made Jun 11 at 2015 1:00 PM

SPC Larry Boutwell — Thu, 11 Jun 2015 13:00:04 -0400

Single soldier barracks cost the aemy way less than if they where to give every one bah.....i mean lets think about it for a moment.....$1000+ per soldier for bah....... Or barracks which costs nothing monthly????and soldiers maintain it.......no brainer for the army pocket book.....

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 13 at 2015 10:16 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 13 Jun 2015 22:16:32 -0400

The Army doesn't trust lower ranking soldiers to be financially responsible. I've seen multiple times when a soldier runs out of money before payday and is late on a bill or doesn't have gas to go anywhere. As long as they have a barracks room and a meal card they will be able to sustain till payday. I partially agree with it but I don't think it allows a soldier to grow as an adult.

Response by SPC Tiffany Ivanov made Jun 29 at 2015 8:07 PM

SPC Tiffany Ivanov — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 20:07:07 -0400

I think that is problematic for a couple of reasons. There would have to rules established and that presents another problem altogether.
In my opinion, it would have to be strictly for E5 and above. NCOs have earned their rank by time in grade, time in service, experience, etc. They (usually) have enough sense to pay their bills AMD don't do anything that will hinder you getting PT on time.
Privates don't have that level of discipline, experience, or responsibility most of the time. Barracks living is a great checks and balances system. Room inspections ensure they aren't living in deplorable conditions. Accountability is so much easier. And it is a great transition for the young soldiers fresh out of mom's house.
They may not be up to the standards a BAH paid for apt would be, but the pros far outweigh the cons. With just the E5 population, living off post Will make accountability worse for some of them and it wouldn't be very long until you began typing up weekly counseling statements because of it.

Response by COL Ted Mc made Jul 1 at 2015 2:05 AM

COL Ted Mc — Wed, 01 Jul 2015 02:05:27 -0400

SSG Robert Burns - Staff; An interesting question and one that seems to be provoking some heartfelt responses.

HOWEVER, the fact of the matter is that some just barely old enough recruit who married his knocked-up sixteen year old sweetie the day before shipping probably isn't going to be able to manage living independently on what the military pays him once he completes Basic.

Paying ALL soldiers BAH so that they can "live off base" is going to mean that many of them are going to be living in substandard accommodations and paying them all BAS is going to mean that many of them are going to be poorly nourished.

I admit to being a bit biased in this matter (since, when I joined, you had to actually get permission from your CO to get married and the unwritten law was "Lieutenants should not marry, Captains may marry, and Majors must marry.", so please forgive me if I still believe that 90+% of junior enlisted ought to be living on post and single. (Having seen the deterioration in the levels of social responsibility and education that has affected society for the past 50 years does NOT make me think that the average recruit of today is more capable of living independently than the average recruit in the 1960s was [which does not mean that there aren't some who are {and permission to do that could well be regarded as an "earned - but revocable - privilege"].)

PS - It might also help to stabilize the situation somewhat if persons REQUIRED to live on base NOT be entitled to any "Dependants' Benefits" UNLESS they had those dependants when they first applied to join.

Response by PO1 Barbara Jackson made Nov 7 at 2017 6:14 AM

PO1 Barbara Jackson — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 06:14:22 -0500

A barracks room is still needed for many single soldier because soon are very young and if they do not have a car off base housing would make it harder to get to their duty station. As a young sailor, many years ago, I not only did not have a car to get around I was also just out of high school and as It was my first time (boot camp in Bsinbridge MD not withstanding) away from home I was far too immature to live on my own. Granted not all soldiers or sailors fit that category a barracks room should be provided for those who need or wants one. Those mature enough could opt for a room or BAH.

Response by SGM Erik Marquez made Nov 7 at 2017 7:59 AM

SGM Erik Marquez — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 07:59:38 -0500

Funding is likely a primary reason to retain on post single SM housing... cost to house in barracks vice cost to supply BAH.
And then wasted supervisor man hours, training detractors chasing after thousands of younger, typically less mature, and less experienced living on their own with the trial and tribulations that come with that.
Plus issues with transportation, reliable transportation, which would include possession, registration, maintenance and insurance would be need to now be a "mandatory" requirement to entering service...
"Oh you want to Join the Army, yes, sit down here, let’s check to see if you are in the less than 1% that even meet the qualifications for service in the US Military.. ..Ok good you made it, now, may I see your vehicle title or lease contract for your vehicle, certified ASE technician vehicle condition report, Registration and valid insurance please?"

I Joined the Army at 19 years of age, I had lived on my own a few years at that point and I LOVED
the BENEFITS single SM housing gave me...
10 man rooms, shower rooms down the hall, FREE FOOD down the road at least three times a day, no need to maintain my 'house" other than the room itself.... Always having a buddy or 10 to keep me straight....so you can’t forget the next time or place you were supposed to be, borrow a pair of socks if my last clean set went missing, borrow some boot polish (not that a SM in the last 15 years would know what that stiff is...lol), having someone be look out when we repelled out the third floor window (Sorry 1SG Keast, Im still not saying who was in that room with me)
The benefits and freedom, no worries about paying for and maintaining a domicile, no transportation worries, no food worries means a younger SM learning the way of Military life, and life on their own in general, vastly out-way any perceived benefits of turning lose a few hounded thousand junior enlisted.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2017 1:14 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 13:14:24 -0500

At Riley, at least in the Sustainment BDE, there are NCO barracks. Once the Soldier promotes to SGT, then they are relocated to those barracks with other NCOs. If the Soldier promotes to SSG, they are authorized to collect BAH and live off post

Response by CW2 Ernest Krutzsch made Nov 7 at 2017 3:05 PM

CW2 Ernest Krutzsch — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 15:05:20 -0500

I think the barracks in today's Army and the one I left serve no useful purpose. I retired 20 years ago this month. My first duty station was in Baumholder Germany with the 1/39th Infantry. I lived in the barracks as an E3 to E5. No issues. Everyday Bed made, locker ready, Shoes placed where SOP said, Laundry bag tied to bunk. Fast forward to 1992. CW2 living at home, SDO...go into barracks, FILTHY! Garbage everywhere, No SOP no order, no NOTHING. I told a troop to take out the trash, was informed by Battalion, that I was not allowed to tell people to clean up, I can just imagine what is is like today. If I had my way........

Response by SSG Joseph VanDyck made Nov 7 at 2017 3:41 PM

SSG Joseph VanDyck — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 15:41:49 -0500

SSG Schmidt, BAH and SEP RATS, would be less expensive in the long run if the US Army would do away with DFAC's and associated personnel. They would also be able tobdo away with the barracks and all associated civilian and military personnel. The savings would be minimal. It would also do away with barracks inspections, which I always unfairly believed targeted young un married soldiers.

Response by MSgt Keith Hebert made Nov 7 at 2017 5:29 PM

MSgt Keith Hebert — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 17:29:12 -0500

If was active and a single nco/snco I would would live in nco barracks. Just give me a sep rats and I save the rest of the money

Response by SPC Richard Skeen made Nov 7 at 2017 5:34 PM

SPC Richard Skeen — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 17:34:19 -0500

When I was in at fort hood. 1985 to 1987. We had NCO “s that lived in the barracks. But they was at the end of the hallway away from us. It was pretty neat. In 1st Cav Division

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2017 5:41 PM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 17:41:09 -0500

I don't have a problem with big boy rules, if they're TRULY big boy rules across the board. So sure, let everyone get BAH and live off post if they choose. So just like the private sector, leaders can FIRE subordinates for substandard performance.

So sure PVT, here's your housing and food allowances. Figure it out. But don't show up late three times or fail your PT test, or you're fired--on the spot--three days to make final preparations with HR.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Nov 7 at 2017 5:48 PM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 17:48:17 -0500

I think it's time to Privatize them, and treat them as an extension of on post housing...

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2017 6:44 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 18:44:31 -0500

My 2 cents is that ALL E-5s and higher live in housing/post.

1) NCOs are responsible right? They don’t need to be babysat in the barracks anymore

2) As some testified, some places allow or even force E5s out of the barracks. It costs a bit of money to furnish even a 1BR apartment. Then when that Soldier PCSs to another duty station and is forced back into the barracks, then he/she must either store all their stuff or sell/get rid of it.

I think it’s time to standardize barracks policy across the Army, whatever it may be.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2017 10:31 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 22:31:48 -0500

I am not totally against living in the barracks as it has held me out financially so I can pay off my student loans & not worry about rent. However, for the younger soldiers the pros of living in the barracks are:
Being close to work; save money on gas as you walk downstairs; never worry about missing rent payment; housing security, water & electricity are paid for. I am sure the list is endless.
Do I think everyone should be required to live in the barracks? No, not at all. I lived on my own for 8 years before joining the Army & I understand that probably a large percentage of my fellow soldiers have little to no knowledge of what it's like to be fully independent. At the same time, I am a firm believer that rank does not automatically make you more responsible. I have seen my share of NCO's & even officers run into money issues.

Response by 1LT James Teener made Nov 7 at 2017 10:46 PM

1LT James Teener — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 22:46:39 -0500

Given the cost of off base housing at many, especially urban, locations around the US, barracks are often the most economic choice.

Response by SFC Christopher Taggart made Nov 7 at 2017 11:26 PM

SFC Christopher Taggart — Tue, 07 Nov 2017 23:26:50 -0500

"Single soldier barracks...do we still need them?"...I say yes, because where are we going to put the dumb-ass married soldier who beats up his family?...other than jail?

Response by SSG Will Phillips made Nov 8 at 2017 1:33 AM

SSG Will Phillips — Wed, 08 Nov 2017 01:33:07 -0500

In the late 70's and early 80's, an E5/E6 could choose to live with their troops or live off post. As an NCO I did both off and on. In my unit we did have NCO rooms that had their own latrine with shower. It is always good to have a few NCO's living amongst the heathens so things do not get too far out of hand. I say this as a semi-civilized heathen myself.

Response by SPC Leo Van Groll made Nov 8 at 2017 5:46 AM

SPC Leo Van Groll — Wed, 08 Nov 2017 05:46:42 -0500

I don't think we need to "civilianize" the military more than it is. Then again, I am still upset that my MOS was discontinued(94b).

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 8 at 2017 9:00 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Nov 2017 21:00:40 -0500

Great comment. No body asked the 30 to 40 year old to enlist in the Army late. Soldiers living in the Barracks need Order,and discipline. If the 30 to 40 year old living in Barracks can't handle the frustration. What makes you think he can handle an even larger responsibility in Combat? That's the problem with to many of these NCOs in the Barracks now, crying and whining about being there. Quality of life is ten times better than it was in 1999 And they still don't understand the concept of what "Right Looks Like" there rooms are normally the dirtiest and they get the come to Jesus moment with their PSG. I've lived in the Barracks. Everyone has. Tell the 30 to 40 yr old to suck it the fuck up. BAH? Really. Back in the old days it didn't have a damn thing to do with BAH and a person's age as a crutch for them not wanting to accept responsibility for their soldiers. Somebody has to do it.

Response by PV2 Duane Schlender made Nov 9 at 2017 6:22 PM

PV2 Duane Schlender — Thu, 09 Nov 2017 18:22:34 -0500

And I suppose your going to say next that we deserve separate fox holes too?

Its importabt to have the tried and true aged NCO's with the younger ones. Try delving I to history to see why. Those older NCO's have knowlesge and wisdom to pass on. This isnt an argument that parallels individuality or parent-child, its about being part of a team and helping eachother keep the links of the team chain strong.
I can write about this until the end if time.. However, the simple truth is that you need the older NCO's around. They help turn those rugrat younger NCO's into steonger more durable team playing soldiers.

So go ahead.. Laugh me off and demand that separate foxhole like a spoiled brat and individual.

Response by SSG Chris Cherry made Nov 10 at 2017 2:23 AM

SSG Chris Cherry — Fri, 10 Nov 2017 02:23:04 -0500

I was in the Bs for the duration of the time I was in the Army, was a ghost rider at a few different points. Reasons for doing so are because
1) Barracks inspections are a pain. If I damage a room through neglect/misuse/etc then take it out of my pay. I've signed for the room, it's my responsibility.
2) As an NCO, I did have my own room (on Bragg, 4th PSYOP Group) but the space was still somewhat limited.
3) Our barracks banned any sort of heating device. No hotplates, coffee makers, space heaters (By the way, heat and a/c would frequently go out) due to fire concerns in a 100% brick and steel building. It's a bit degrading to be told that, at 25+ you're not trustworthy enough to operate an everyday household kitchen appliance.
4) At the age of 27 I had a 25 year old SSG hem me up for having too much alcohol in my freezer. I never had any alcohol related issues, I just like my whiskey. Was forced to get rid of a few hundred dollars of scotch.

Overall, I felt like single soldiers, generally, received unfair treatment. BOSS was a joke (at least when i was there). Can't tell you the number of times all the single guys got pulled for a detail to set up FRG stuff after COB. >> "The rest of us have to go home and get our kids/wives, you don't" is what I was told once. I promptly responded with something along the lines of "the girls down at Secrets needed to be taken care of too." It didn't go over well.

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 14 at 2018 1:51 AM

SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 14 Jan 2018 01:51:47 -0500

Question soldier comes in at 33. Is a 36 year old specialist. Has a roomate who is under 21.
I wish i could have my own room but for ncos to complain to not live in the barracks or want to live off post.
Try imagine having your own place prior to joining not having a roommate then being forced because of regulations.
But i do think it is unwise for them to pair two people with such a huge age gap. Its just the way the army is if anyone wants it changed bring it to the lawmakers or those who change the rules.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Jan 14 at 2018 11:04 AM

SGM Bill Frazer — Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:04:16 -0500

1. Once the barracks are built they last for 30- yrs and therefor cheaper than paying BAH. 2. Having belonged to many units that were 1st deployable units, (ready to leave in 14 hrs or less) having all my people off- post would have been a nightmare of epic proportions, 3. Around most post's the landlords are only interested in the cash, and we inspected many apartments/trailers/etc. that were unfit for most living conditions. 4. If all were allowed off post, then you might as well close the Mess halls, MWR facilities, etc cause here would be damn little reason for being on post.

Response by SrA Michael Risney made Feb 18 at 2018 4:08 PM

SrA Michael Risney — Sun, 18 Feb 2018 16:08:22 -0500

The majority of E3's and below are like kids.....
Need to keep a close eye on what is going on.
3 or 4 years in the dorm teaches a lot about learning to deal with others. Not a time for individualism.

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Mar 17 at 2018 12:02 PM

Lt Col Jim Coe — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 12:02:44 -0400

My answer is "it depends." OCONUS barracks allow the younger troops to have good housing they couldn't otherwise afford downtown. It also puts them close to dining facilities, shopping, and places of duty that would be a lot less conveniently available if they lived on the economy. In some places, just getting transportation from downtown locations to military bases is difficult at best. I'm thinking about places like Tokyo, Seoul, Okinawa. In other areas, such as Kuwait and Afghanistan, it's a matter of security. Large groups of young Americans living downtown might make an excellent target for terrorists or hostile forces in some locations.

In CONUS is a different situation. Could the local economy provide the type of housing young un-married Service Members need is the first question I can think of. Some places it might not be a problem. In other areas, it could be an issue. Then we need to look at the cost trade-off. Is the life-cycle cost of the barracks equal to or less than that of paying BAH to service members? If it's cheaper to keep the existing barracks, then the DoD is right to do so until it becomes no longer economically viable. The family housing model of contracting out could be applied to the barracks, a.k.a., low-rent apartment buildings. This might cut the DoD cost while providing better living facilities to the service members.

Response by SMSgt Lawrence McCarter made Mar 17 at 2018 12:05 PM

SMSgt Lawrence McCarter — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 12:05:02 -0400

I lived in the barracks as a single member in My early days, It didn't hurt and also We always found things to do and Your friends and guys You worked with were right there. Not everyone was responsible enough to handle their money at that point but they did have roof over their heads and with a meal card were always going to eat. Its still a place to learn and grow up. The living conditions in the barracks have improved a lot. When I got to be an NCO and was still single then I lived in Bachelor NCO quarters when stationed at Lowry AFB, CO and We had maid service there to clean our room and make our beds. The Airman quarters of course didn't, they had Bay Orderly to clean and in their room inspections by the 1st Sergeant, both when they were at work and once in a while standby Inspections where they had to be there during the inspection. It had a purpose to teach You how to take care of things Yourselves which also helped prepare You for life. Some young people needed that guidance. I learned from that and I think many others did also not that i'd want to repeat it though. Shown in this picture are current Airman Dorms at Hanscom AFB, MA, they have individual rooms each which has two full size closets, wall to wall carpets,central air conditioning, plug in for computers and cable TV their own vanity and sink a bathroom shared with only one other person. A kitchen is available for their use. There is a day room with a large screen TV and also a room with a pool table. Notice the 2nd picture that shows the decks off one of the common areas of the dorm. Outside also are picnic tables and barbecue pits. Picture 3 other dorms and picture 4 one of many areas of Military family housing on Base which even single NCOs can live in.

Response by Sgt Wayne Wood made Mar 17 at 2018 12:13 PM

Sgt Wayne Wood — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 12:13:59 -0400

Barracks are cheaper that BAH... and in the event of an alert/mobilization all the kiddies get the word.

Response by Maj John Bell made Mar 17 at 2018 1:37 PM

Maj John Bell — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 13:37:20 -0400

My how things have changed.

In my day, there was no BEQ for junior NCO's and below. All Sergeants and junior in a platoon maintained a rack in the squad bay, regardless of marital status. This cubicle was expected to contain all their permanent and temporary issue, inspection ready. Corporals and Sergeants had one-man cubicles formed by those temporary 54" high partitions, and there was an NCO seating area, isolated with more partitions, with a two sofas and 19 inch TV, (which got crap reception). What was watched on TV was determined by vote. Sergeants got two votes each and Corporals got one vote each. Ties were settled by the senior Sergeant.

There was no seating area, TV, or music for Lance Corporals and junior in the squad bay. They had the E Club when it was open and outdoor picnic benches when it was not. Even though they maintained a squad bay rack, married personnel lived in the MEQ or got BAH and lived off-base. BAH was never enough to cover the actual expense of living off-base (rent, utilities, garbage collection, and the cost of commuting)

There was no BEQ until you made Staff Sergeant.

Single Lieutenants had no choice, if there was an open BOQ room when they checked in, then they lived on base...period. There was no personalization of BOQ rooms except two framed pictures, not to exceed 5"x7" on the desk. Frames were to be black, or natural wood tones; without ornamentation. All personal items (TV, Radio, books, magazines, etc. were to be stowed in the provided wall lockers when the room was not occupied.) Even linens and blankets were issue. Rooms were inspected randomly but not less than once per week. Inspection reports were forwarded to the Lieutenant's reporting senior.

Off-base housing was not an option for officers unless you were married and only if there was no MOQ in your rank bracket.

Response by Cpl Jeff N. made Mar 17 at 2018 3:17 PM

Cpl Jeff N. — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 15:17:32 -0400

I maintained a barracks room the entire 4 years I was on active duty. I lived in the barracks about 3 of the 4 years. The other year another NCO and I moved off base and received no BEQ or other funds. We had to do it with our base pay, period. Still had a barracks room/squad bay area and kept a wall locker inspection ready and all of my deuce year etc.

Barracks are less expensive, keep better control of folks, allow those with no transportation a way to function etc. Putting non rates off base will not make them more mature or save the military money. It would likely lead to more issues with missed payments, evictions, poor living conditions, missed movements, late arrivals to the appointed place daily etc.

While I was not a fan of barracks life, if you want to go out in town, do it on your own nickel.

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Mar 17 at 2018 4:13 PM

SSG Edward Tilton — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 16:13:37 -0400

Sounds great if you never get deployed.

Response by SSG Keith Amacher made Mar 17 at 2018 4:33 PM

SSG Keith Amacher — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 16:33:09 -0400

I as an E6 SSG at Ft Hood had both an Off Post Residence and a Barracks room I shared with another NCO where I could shower or sleep if I was working long hours overnight.. and that made sense since I worked all hours in Intel...

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 17 at 2018 5:04 PM

COL Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 17:04:32 -0400

And where are people going to stay when you’re on lock down? Just have one big locker room? Like if you work for some corporation? This isn’t Google your working for.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Mar 17 at 2018 5:22 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 17:22:45 -0400

I emphatically say yes.

Response by MSG John Duchesneau made Mar 17 at 2018 10:40 PM

MSG John Duchesneau — Sat, 17 Mar 2018 22:40:34 -0400

I am old school but I think there is a loss of discipline and cohesion if junior enlisteds are allowed to live off post. I'm also so radical I think they should not allow E-4s and below to marry.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 18 at 2018 4:50 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 18 Mar 2018 04:50:32 -0400

Yes, still need them, in jump school 1972 we were housed in WWI wooden barracks. Take the people out of the building, and it's just a building.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 18 at 2018 2:08 PM

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 18 Mar 2018 14:08:43 -0400

I believe at all boils down to cost. COLA in most areas would balloon a budget quicker than on-base billeting. The housing costs in HI, CA and DC's surrounding areas would skyrocket if developers knew the military was going to subsidize mortgages and leases. I disagree with off-base housing for single SM's and in some cases married w/o children.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 22 at 2018 10:20 AM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 22 Mar 2018 10:20:02 -0400

Yes. If you've seen posts here on RP about folks in town refusing to answer phone or not wanting to be disturbed "after-hours", that's why. Imagine a unit recall with nobody living on base. All have to be reached and need to draw weapons. Not realistic at all.

Response by Maj John Bell made Jun 21 at 2018 8:39 AM

Maj John Bell — Thu, 21 Jun 2018 08:39:26 -0400

Nothing, absolutely nothing happens in a vacuum. Having served in situations where large blocks of junior enlisted bachelor housing became suddenly unavailable for the foreseeable future, stand by...

#1 The civilian market will not be able to absorb the increase in demand. The Law of Supply and Demand will kick into play. The price of Housing will sky rocket for housing appropriate to junior military AND low income young civilian families. Typically, the price of off-base quarters does not drop once the construction trade is able to catch up on the increased demand on appropriate affordable housing, which takes years.

#2 Lanlord's absolutely do not care about your deployment schedules or PCS orders. They already have to account for that for married service members (SM's). To account for their increased risks of renting, and the cost of attracting new tenants to fill vacancies. Once again the price of housing will jump to accommodate the risks.

#3 Many young SM's have not lived in their own housing, without Mom and Dad's supervision. A significant minority of the young immature SM's (Officer and enlisted, both) in the past have not taken good care of the landlord's property. Security deposits will increase substantially. How many junior enlisted hitting their first "permanent" duty station will have the pocket cash for first and last months rent, plus substantial security deposits. Many jurisdictions limit the amount landlord's may demand as a security deposit. All it takes is one good party with a few drunk idiots; the security deposit is gone and the landlord is left to try and use small claims court to recover thousand's in damage. (that's why I stopped buying rental properties in military towns unless I was way out of the price range of three single service members grouping together to rent a home.)

#4 The Zoning board has given third notice that you are out of compliance with zoning standards for maintenance (grass height, weeds, unauthorized vehicles in reserved parking, etc. etc. etc.) and you now have a $300 fine to pay in 30 days or less. additional fines will be levied weekly until the situation is resolved. But you PCS'd two months ago, your name is on the lease and your house former buddies are jerks.

#5 Very often "mostly junior military" enclaves develop. These enclaves tend to turn into less desirable places to live. Nuisance complaints to the police will increase substantially in those areas. Law enforcement will need to staff up to accommodate demand for more road officers, and property taxes will rise. This tends to increase tension between the military presence and non-base related civilian populaces.

#6 Disciplinary issues increase, particularly missing formation and short-term (less than 24 hour) unauthorized absences.

#7 The increase in BAH and BAS, NEVER, never never, matched the actual cost of living off-base. Living off-base sounds great, until you are on your fourth day of eating generic mac and cheese with the thermostat set at 55 in February, hoping the checks you kited don't hit the bank before payday or any automatic withdrawals. Then you get in your unreliable clunker on bald tires and pray that you have the gas to get you to base, in time for formation, halfway there you realize you forgot your wallet and ID, or your cover, etc. etc. etc.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 21 at 2018 11:20 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 21 Jun 2018 11:20:27 -0400

I agree that some soldiers can’t manage to live on their own. But I think at a certain point time in service time and grade need to be factored in. I also noticed that’s soldiers who don’t live in the barracks treat certain barracks situations as if it’s a jail and the soldiers are inmates which is why I was very active in the barracks to be that buffer. But I’m 30 years old been in the Army 9 years. I was in the barracks at my last duty station, and it was a nightmare. If I get put in the barracks at my next assignment I’m renting an apartment with my own money.

Response by A1C Ronald Harris made Jun 21 at 2018 11:35 AM

A1C Ronald Harris — Thu, 21 Jun 2018 11:35:59 -0400

I cant speak for other Branches, but If I was single, I'd be in a barracks oops I mean Dorm. I mean, who wouldn't want to live there. We had our own dining facility that served hot meals even late at night for us night shifters. We had a sweet day room with a big TV and lots of movies and games. We had a fully stocked bar, Gym and all your buddies to hang out with.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 21 at 2018 11:36 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 21 Jun 2018 11:36:05 -0400

Personally, I think green NCOs and those with financial issues should still reside in the barracks. BAH is considerably more than what it costs to house a SM in the barracks, so from a budget standpoint its a win for the Army.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 21 at 2018 3:01 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 21 Jun 2018 15:01:21 -0400

It may seem like a good idea to let them live away from the work area, but this will lead to soldiers being called at home to come back to work to handle last minute "Hey You" details at all hours. At least if they are in the barracks, all you have to do is key their door and tell them to gwt back in uniform.

Response by SSgt Bob Mobbs made Jun 23 at 2018 10:12 PM

SSgt Bob Mobbs — Sat, 23 Jun 2018 22:12:12 -0400

I think that having barracks (at least for lower enlisted ranks) is beneficial. Many of us were away from home for the first time like I was. Having the camaraderie of others made the transition a little easier. The drawback was they would always invade the barracks whenever they needed a detail filled. I got stuck riding shotgun on a garbage truck at Kunsan, Korea because I was foolish enough to answer the phone on a Saturday.

Response by MSgt Jerry Lillie made Jul 2 at 2018 5:50 PM

MSgt Jerry Lillie — Mon, 02 Jul 2018 17:50:45 -0400

Because not all single soldiers are responsible enough

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 2 at 2018 4:55 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Sep 2018 16:55:09 -0400

I disagree, barracks are crucial! The reason we see let’s friendship, bonds and suicides is lack of things like barracks and officer/NCO clubs. I remember my first deployment, there was zero internet only playing cards.

Response by SMSgt Lawrence McCarter made Mar 18 at 2019 2:56 AM

SMSgt Lawrence McCarter — Mon, 18 Mar 2019 02:56:36 -0400

These are current barracks. Picture(1) for single Airmen at Hanscom AFB, MA, each individual has His own room, there is wall to wall carpeting, central air conditioning a bathroom (shower and toilet) they share only with one other. The have their own vanity sink. Each room has its own computer hookup and cable TV ports. There is also a day room with a large screen Cable TV. There is a full kitchen for use on each floor with decks as You can see in picture (2) Outside there are picnic tables and grilles areas for their use. Most that live here are E4 and below. E5s may live off base but some are able to move into Military family housing on Base. The Base does have a large Commissary, a large Exchange Main store, mini mall, shops, service station etc , There are clubs, Theater, bowling ally, Base pool, Golf course a large gym that is open 24/7, Aero club and a few other things.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2019 8:15 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 06 Apr 2019 08:15:06 -0400

I served with a guy who was single and no dependents who paid for off-post housing because he didn't want to live in the barracks. In the end, he was court martialed and thrown out of the army. He had ulterior motives for not living in the barracks.

Our barracks were actually pretty nice for 1979 with cable TV and we had our own refrigerators. I even had a hamster in the room and I was surprised it never caused any problems during inspections. That was a party barracks and co-ed. They even found civilians living there.

Why waste money off post for an overpriced apartment? You know the landlords see dollar signs when a GI wants to rent an apartment.

Response by SSG Brian G. made May 13 at 2019 1:13 AM

SSG Brian G. — Mon, 13 May 2019 01:13:18 -0400

Without knowing the standard makeup of a company in terms of how many of what grade I will break it down like this:
A given company consists of 5 platoons of 60 personnel each. Not counted in that is the Platoon Sergeant and Platoon Leader. The company is led by a Commander, an Executive Officer and A First Sergeant. That is 313 personnel.

Out of this 313 personnel there is 1 O-3, 6 O-1 to O-2, 1 E-7 with the possibility of 5 additional E-7's, 20 E-6, 40 E-5, and the remainder are 240 E-1 to E-4.

73 of these are mandated to have housing either on post (non barracks) or off post.

Adding in 240 that means that even if they double up on a house that just for ONE company sized Unit there would need to be 120 extra houses somewhere. With the restriction that soldiers must be able to respond to mobilization alert in 30 minutes to an hour this places a HUGE burden on the existing economy, in term of housing, transportation and support. This grows exponentially the larger the post is as there will undoubtedly be more units, thus more soldiers.

BAH is a constant monthly draw upon resources whereas Barracks, once built are static with the only cost to them being water, electricity and the rarity of gas as SM's pay for their own phone and cable in most cases.

In most cases E-1 to E-4's are 17-20 somethings that are barely out of OSUT and hardly mature enough to handle living on their own, let alone juggling the responsibilities of that life IE Maintaining a place of their own, buying food, paying for phone, water, electricity, gas etc. Most have never lived on their own and the Army is the first experience away from the nest.

Look at just what the barracks gives them: A roof over their head, a bed to sleep in, furniture for said room as well as linens. A bathroom with the normal amenities ie toilet, sink, shower. The SM's do not have to maintain these barracks aside from general sweep, mop, and clean and issues are reported to be dealt with. Whereas an apartment comes with its own unique problems and these are subject to often less than agreeable landlords.

Response by CW4 Craig Urban made May 13 at 2019 5:49 AM

CW4 Craig Urban — Mon, 13 May 2019 05:49:08 -0400

Once you make E5 it should be up to the soldier

Response by SFC Gene Estep made Jul 20 at 2019 10:40 PM

SFC Gene Estep — Sat, 20 Jul 2019 22:40:23 -0400

I got out just bc of this , I was the only single NCO E5 at Drum when it was re --opened! I had an asswipe CO who would not let me stop babysitting Cohorts , we just gained from the newly formed 10th, Airborne, Air Assualt, so I got the fuck out

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Aug 9 at 2019 12:39 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Fri, 09 Aug 2019 12:39:21 -0400

Utilizing the barracks saves the government money.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 13 at 2019 3:51 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 13 Dec 2019 15:51:26 -0500

Even if single soldiers were assigned roommates and got 1/2 bah to spend on rent even if it’s on post housing the morale of units skyrocket no doubt in my mind. Living in the barracks is nothing short of depressing. You can’t paint the room you can’t really do much to it except hang things on the walls now if it were e1 & e2’s in the barracks and maybe even e3s make it a favorable action if you’ve got a squared away high speed soldier why would you keep them in a prison. Now soldiers prone to art15, prolonged flags, and just your avg soup sandwich no shave shows up late caught sleeping in their room on duty hours soldier make them live in the B’s your soldiers whom never have issues ie. the guys/gals who pass mos certs, volunteer, the joes coming in everyday on time police calling without being told by SGM those soldier should get the privilege to get an apartment And I personally think 2LTs should have to live in the barracks for at least a year upon arriving to their first duty station. I also think that you should be able to decline BAS or just do away with the dfacs all together I guarantee that 60% of soldiers should decline it cause the food is that bad and I’ve been to 10+ dfacs in the last year and all of them were sub par. The system is broken but the people in charge of it continue to brush it off and say it’ll be fine. You want higher retention rates? Listen to the joes. Make the soldiers lives better and they’ll make your life easier. You can’t expect a private to get shit on everyday all the way from his battalion command down to his team leader every day and expect him to reenlist.

Response by PO3 Scot Fahey made Dec 14 at 2019 8:38 PM

PO3 Scot Fahey — Sat, 14 Dec 2019 20:38:31 -0500

Our detachment was on Pearl Harbor Naval station. (1978) All personal were assisted in finding housing off base soon after arriving. The small Detachment had no housing or chow hall. Married or single, BAH approved as quick as you could sign a lease. When we did visit the award-winning Submarine Chow hall for lunch, we would just pay cash.

Response by SPC John Decker made Dec 14 at 2019 10:44 PM

SPC John Decker — Sat, 14 Dec 2019 22:44:49 -0500

Barracks allows for a faster re-call, when needed. Barracks helps to maintain the military discipline that an Army requires.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 15 at 2019 4:27 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 15 Dec 2019 04:27:40 -0500

If i was king for a day i would give all Soldiers BAH and only deduct the market value of their Barracks room. That would need to be based on comparison of their room to an efficiency appartment. If you share the room or a bathroom the cost should be significantly less. The intent is so troops pocket the difference, troops want to be in the Barracks and they are not financially incentivized to marry someone they don't know just to get off post.

Response by LTC Jason Mackay made Dec 29 at 2019 8:36 PM

LTC Jason Mackay — Sun, 29 Dec 2019 20:36:29 -0500

The single soldier barracks is to protect them, both physically and economically. It's to ensure that on their salary they have three hots, a cot, and requisite shelter. Can you imagine all the trouble Chains of Command would have to sort out if we pushed people off post to go find their own roommate? A non-DOD roommate? This assumes there is adequate inventory of suitable apartments for the junior enlisted on the economy. Most posts have a hyper inflated real estate market, this will only intensify that. I envision lots of irresponsible spending, predatory slumlords, homeless soldiers and a negative impact to readiness.

Response by PO3 Scot Fahey made Dec 20 at 2020 7:06 PM

PO3 Scot Fahey — Sun, 20 Dec 2020 19:06:07 -0500

My Command was a Detachment, so we lived on the economy. Our Detachment owned no housing or chow hall

Response by SGT Donald Croswhite made Dec 21 at 2020 3:31 AM

SGT Donald Croswhite — Mon, 21 Dec 2020 03:31:38 -0500

You do not want single soldiers living off base. This would be a disaster. Single young soldiers are idiots. We need them in one concentrated area to be controlled. Young soldiers fresh off mom's tit, with a bi-monthly check is a recipe for retardation. Plus mishaps on post cause less fires than ones on post. Don't kid yourself. Nobody got more mature over the last 15 years.

Response by 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 25 at 2020 4:36 AM

2LT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 25 Dec 2020 04:36:31 -0500

There should be modification made to accommodate 3 things:

Age
Time in Service
And Rank

I believe if someone is over 25, an NCO and with three years of service should be able to live off post BAH w/o dependents.

This accommodates for their level of maturity and the necessary freedom to develop their adult life i.e. lifestyle management, relationships, and exercise financial discipline. One should not have to be married to do this because it has the adverse effect of creating a force of pre-mature relationships just to get out of the barracks. Furthermore, it infantilizes full-grown adults who do not need the extra disruption of living in the college dorm-like environment. Give Soldiers the freedom to exercise maturity and independence and stop making marriage the mark of responsibility. This is archaic thinking.

Response by TSgt Timothy Backstrom made Dec 21 at 2021 1:22 PM

TSgt Timothy Backstrom — Tue, 21 Dec 2021 13:22:47 -0500

I look back on when I was an Airman living in the dorm at my first duty station as a key development stage of integrating in to the 'military lifestyle' that I would've missed living off-base.

Response by SPC Eileen Keller made Dec 21 at 2021 9:37 PM

SPC Eileen Keller — Tue, 21 Dec 2021 21:37:32 -0500

Really? Barracks are about mustering quickly. Then there is discipline, training and esprit de corps