Survey: Is basic training now easier than when you were there?

1SG James L Vetter — Mon, 08 Dec 2014 20:13:42 -0500

Read more: http://www.duffelblog.com/2014/11/military-basic-training-boot-camp/#

I don't remember handing out stress cards to anyone... I am sure we just stressed them out and made them better soldiers... What do you think?

Basic Training Today Is Easier Than In Your Day

Basic has been a joke since shortly after you attended, a new study shows.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 8 at 2014 11:15 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 08 Dec 2014 23:15:34 -0500

1SG James L Vetter Good Duffleblog article. A lot of tongue and cheek, but it's probably true in many ways. When a recruit can get on their cell phone and get on Facebook to talk about how easy it is, there's a problem. Usually SoulSnatchers or U.S. Army WTF Moments will call them out for a deserved smoking.
Bottom line - They're too connected to the outside world during initial training.

Response by LTC Stephen C. made Dec 8 at 2014 11:22 PM

LTC Stephen C. — Mon, 08 Dec 2014 23:22:50 -0500

I reported to the reception station at Fort Jackson, SC on 28OCT69. BCT with D-3-1 on Tank Hill from 11NOV69 to 16JAN70. I don't even want to speculate as to how much BCT has changed from then to now.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 10 at 2014 5:46 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 10 Dec 2014 17:46:31 -0500

I don't either. I think that's the problem with today's young Soldiers. They can't take being yelled and screamed at like we did coming up through the ranks.

Response by SGT William Lint made Jan 30 at 2015 11:44 PM

SGT William Lint — Fri, 30 Jan 2015 23:44:34 -0500

The whole idea in basic is to put the soldier into stressful positions that their eventual training will kick in. Stress is one of the many ways the military weeds out the people who can handle stress and those who can't. I myself went thru Marine basic training in 1985 on Parris Island, SC. We started with 80 recruits and graduated 29 of the original 80. Sure some got rolled back for weight or PT tests, but the majority just couldn't handle the stress we were put under. Now how do you think those that couldn't handle the stress of being yelled at and being put under NON LETHAL stress and situations would handle ACTUAL combat? Where life and death decisions are made in milliseconds? There is a method to their madness!!

Response by MAJ David Vermillion made Jan 31 at 2015 1:49 PM

MAJ David Vermillion — Sat, 31 Jan 2015 13:49:12 -0500

I would say if you took a poll of 100 men and women, they would all agree that boot camp gets easier and easier as the years go by.

Response by MSgt Michael Durkee made Jan 31 at 2015 1:58 PM

MSgt Michael Durkee — Sat, 31 Jan 2015 13:58:58 -0500

I'm sure I would do fine, but I would have to say that Basic Training has definitely ramped up since I attended in the 80's. Our TI told us the only reason we had to do the obstacle course was so we could escape and come back to reestablish the base infrastructure(yep, he said infrastructure).
In the many years since, they've introduced a field week and more combat oriented skills. Still not as aggressive and appropriate as the other Services, but getting there.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 31 at 2015 2:40 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 31 Jan 2015 14:40:48 -0500

Privates, I mean warriors (wouldn't want to violate 350-6), are getting babied these days. Some units are doing it right or as right as they can. Others have a choke chain put on them by the CoC. I can't even make this up, but I had a "warrior" write a letter to my 1SG claiming EO and hazing, even citing the regulation. All of this because he demanded that he be put in bed rest. When told no he wanted to go to the ER.

Response by SPC James Mcneil made Jan 31 at 2015 2:52 PM

SPC James Mcneil — Sat, 31 Jan 2015 14:52:09 -0500

Basic training was easier on me than when my squad leaders, platoon sergeants, etc. went through it. I'm sure it's gotten even easier since 1999 when I went through it.

Response by SGM Mikel Dawson made Feb 1 at 2015 11:13 PM

SGM Mikel Dawson — Sun, 01 Feb 2015 23:13:16 -0500

I went through basic in 1983. I did what I was told, when I was told and how I was told. I hit Ft Know in April of that year, just come from cross country skiing all winter in the mountains of Idaho. I was great physical shape, I was older (26) so I had some life under my belt. There were a few times when our platoon was in the PT pit after evening chow beating our faces I had no idea why, but other than that, basic was ok. I think my up bringing helped a bit and the environment I was raised in made a difference. There were 17,18 year old kids in my platoon who'd never HAD to do anything in their lives until this time, so it was a little tough on them.

I can't comment on Basic today, only what I read and hear. I do know when I became a Drill, our hands were more tied than then I was in Basic, so I can just imagine what it is like today.

Response by 1SG Cameron M. Wesson made Feb 1 at 2015 11:42 PM

1SG Cameron M. Wesson — Sun, 01 Feb 2015 23:42:48 -0500

1SG James L Vetter and RP Team!

I think that this survey is questionable at best. At Fortress Benning in 1983... We were less than pathetic! Didn't know what tough was! We were soft and pathetic... Charlie would destroy us!

I'm sure the centurions of the Roman Legions had the same challenges and complaints in 600BC.

But we did well in Central America... And then along comes 1991... circa the first Desert Games... And we did well again!

Then we were asked to change up in the Balkans... And we did well again in a new environment!

Then again 9\11! We did great! I admit that this is pride speaking... But facts are facts. We did more mission with less resources... And we lost less people than in past events.

My submission is simply this! Times change and so do people... and the recruits we get. I had soldiers in 2004 that understood world politics and the operational environment better than most officers did in 1985... and NCOs.

Easier? In what respect? Physical and Mental? Let's do an analytical study of content... Then speak from a position of fact... Not opinion. Fact.. Physical training standards are higher today than 1987. Basic training has more tasks taught than what we had in 1983. Fact: in my OSUT class alone almost 60% had to go to mandatory GED classes at night. We heap more leadership on a soldier now than when I was a CPL... and to all ranks. And amazingly enough... Most rise to the challenge and excel!

Let's wave a red card on this! Let's agree that its different. Why? Be cause we, the Army, evolves! Not quickly... But quicker than most companies that bankrupt... Or species that become extinct. Why... Because of the NCO Corps! And the Officer Corps!

I've been retired ten years. I'm proud of the soldiers I see...everyday.

Now leaders... Ask this... Are those soldiers proud of what they see? Do they respect those that see them as less? That say their soft.

The answer might shock you. I didn't in 1985-1986. I dont think they do either. I didn't like a lot of what I saw during that time... I changed what I could when I could... And left the rest for those that come after. It probably will always be like that.

"And the Army goes rolling along!"

My 2 cents

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 1 at 2015 11:54 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 01 Feb 2015 23:54:12 -0500

I went through Basic Training at Fort Leonard Wood in 2013. There, we were not issued stress cards. I did not hear about others getting them until after my IET was complete. I have always been matured and disciplined growing up and I knew that Basic was not supposed to be easy. So I went in with that mindset. I did what I was told, I did not take anything personally and I tried my best. At the end, I enjoyed it. Does that mean it was too easy? No, but I will say that it likely was too easy. I know I could handle harder, but many privates came through training that had obvious attitude problems but TRADOC rules would not allow them to be kicked out. So they were pushed through. They showed disrespect and caused pain for those that did listen. If Basic was more challenging and DS's able to correct such problems, those soldiers would either choose to quit or would change into soldiers.

Response by SSgt Jay Dee made Feb 2 at 2015 2:12 AM

SSgt Jay Dee — Mon, 02 Feb 2015 02:12:40 -0500

First, the "duffelblog" is entirely a joke. It's all made up. Anyway, I am only speaking for the Marine Corps side of the house but I left the MCRD San Diego about a year ago and still know many of the people down there. I can assure you that there is no such thing as a stress card, recruits NEVER use a computer, NEVER have access to a cell phone (unless his SDI has a legitimate reason for it, i.e. family emergency), they mostly only get one phone call and it's them reading off of a piece of paper and hanging the phone up. There may be occasions, case by case, where they may get a 5 min phone call at some point throughout the three months of initial training. Other than that, they only communicate through good old fashion mail. But even mail is regulated. They basically have about an hour a night to read/write letters. If caught during the day, they will deal with the consequences. I had a recruit sneak a phone call once when he was supposed to be at medical. He was NJP'd in front of the company.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 2 at 2015 2:22 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 02 Feb 2015 14:22:57 -0500

Define easier? Like in what aspects?

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 4 at 2015 2:46 PM

PO2 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 14:46:47 -0500

I just went to my brother's graduation in October from the Navy, and I couldn't believe the things he told me. There is only a 6 yrs difference between him and me; its not like comparing stories to my dad's. Anyways, the had book bags to carry their stuff; if we couldn't hold it or stuff it in our raincoats, we weren't bringing it. Also, they had real water bottles, not those nasty re-bleached canteens we had. However, the most crazy thing he told was that his RDC's didn't want to IT him and so he was never IT'ed! Can you believe that, never IT'ed. Oh, and then he finished battle stations early, which is understandable, but he was on the phone, computer, walking around base like it was nothing! So, then I told my best friend who is in the Air Force and she told me about those stress cards. Man, you better suck that right up! If you can't handle it, well then you would get kicked out. She also told me how the Air Force got to keep their phones and then use them on the weekends. Finally, I went to my brother's graduation of course and he told us we could see him off at the airport and to bring some of his stuff, and I didn't believe him. I couldn't wait to tell him how wrong he was. Nope, we saw him off...

Yes, I think boot-camp is much easier, and don't necessarily agree with it. What doesn't kill you, makes you stronger.

Response by GySgt Joe Strong made Jun 6 at 2015 2:11 AM

GySgt Joe Strong — Sat, 06 Jun 2015 02:11:48 -0400

Did you actually base a real-world question on a Duffleblog article?

Response by SGT Philip Roncari made Feb 9 at 2016 6:15 PM

SGT Philip Roncari — Tue, 09 Feb 2016 18:15:12 -0500

I know this an old survey on Rallypoint but I have just come on board recently and this brings back some memories I would like to share .I did my basic and all other training at Fort Lewis Wa.we were building up the 4th Div.for its eventual trip to Vietnam.the year was 1965 and as we got off the buses it was like the scene from "Full metal Jacket" crazy. Sergeants screaming and only got worse from there.We did PT and runs in boots no sneakers did Strac drills running up and down flights of stairs constantly changing uniform of the day between runs dry shaves in formation doing monkey bars as the admission to the mess hall and other tortures too numerous to mention so that was my basic training and I am glad it's over

Response by SSG Karl Fowler made Jan 12 at 2018 6:14 PM

SSG Karl Fowler — Fri, 12 Jan 2018 18:14:03 -0500

All of us went thru basic and all of us think they went thru the toughest basic. I went thru in 1973 got my but knocked down by my DS during pugil stick training. Last time I ever volunteer for anything in the army. But we all came away with a new attitude and proud of what we just finished

Response by SFC Christopher Taggart made Jan 12 at 2018 6:28 PM

SFC Christopher Taggart — Fri, 12 Jan 2018 18:28:11 -0500

From what I hear...it's tougher today, because YOU get your cell phones taken away in Basic!! OMG!...NOT the cell phone Drill Sergeant! LOL

Response by CSM Thomas McGarry made Mar 1 at 2018 11:01 AM

CSM Thomas McGarry — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 11:01:11 -0500

I'm sure anyone who graduated from Basic Training thinks so!

Response by PO2 Rev. Frederick C. Mullis, AFI, CFM made Mar 1 at 2018 11:34 AM

PO2 Rev. Frederick C. Mullis, AFI, CFM — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 11:34:16 -0500

Boot Camp is a lawn party. I went to San Diego, Woke up it was below freezing and by noon it was over 100 degrees. All Marching was outside. nothing inside like the Great Lakes is now. Started out on Worm Island, and if you completed your basics then you moved to the Advanced side. Grinder party's at 2100 hrs. for those screw ups of the day were run by the SEALS from Coronado. I would go just to try and cut a few extra pounds and build up my upper body. Doing push ups while balancing on the stacking clip and the toe of your 1903 Springfield was a trick. I doubt if they even do physical training with their pieces any more. Then when the Company had the Trouble Shooters come in (by mistake) and we carried our bunks and marched to Georgia. It would kill half the boots these days. Then there was the day when our marshmallow decided he was not happy and crawled under a sink with his track II razor trying to cut his wrists. Our CC (Company Commander) pulled the 8" buck knife off his hip and tossed it in his lap and said "Here do it right, Cut Vertically" and then walked away Naaaaa they would not even allow him to train Boots these days.
I so loved Boot Camp! being second generation NAVY, I knew what to expect, and was ready for it.

Response by SGT James Clark made Mar 1 at 2018 12:09 PM

SGT James Clark — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 12:09:42 -0500

It is but there is a reason for it, the Drill Sgt's are not allowed to train nowadays like they did back in the day.