The mythical Private Second Class!

SFC Michael Hasbun — Tue, 03 Jun 2014 13:03:41 -0400

I'm sure we've all heard it, generally at promotion ceremonies. A Soldier rising in grade from E-1 to E-2 being announced as promoted to "Private Second Class".

I just wanted to address this as someone brought it up today at work. Gentlemen and Ladies, there is no such thing as a Private Second class. They are Privates. Personnel in pay grade E-1 are Privates, abbreviated PVT. Personnel in pay grade E-2 are also Privates, abbreviated PV2. Only the abbreviation changes, not the rank or form of address.

Until promoted to Private First Class, the correct rank/form of address is Private. Let's kill this purple unicorn.

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2014 1:24 PM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 03 Jun 2014 13:24:34 -0400

That is good information to have. Coming from a sister service, I have both seen and heard people say Private Second Class on more than one occassion and thought that that is what it was supposed to be.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2014 1:27 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 03 Jun 2014 13:27:24 -0400

Just for kicks and giggles would a PV1 be a private 3rd class??? I get it though who wouldn't want their rank to sound fancy??

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2014 3:35 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 03 Jun 2014 15:35:05 -0400

I can honestly say I have never in my career heard of "Private Second Class." N oI have heard them say "Private: E2." This falls along the lines of drill sergeant school no longer saying to call E1-E3 Privates due to that name being "degrading" and they now stress calling them Warriors. Um no, your rank is Private and until they change the name that is what you are going to be called.

Source. Office partner just got back from DS school a few weeks ago.

Response by 1SG Michael Blount made Jun 3 at 2014 4:48 PM

1SG Michael Blount — Tue, 03 Jun 2014 16:48:54 -0400

SSG - I believe a correction is in order. Progression from E1-E4, I believe is classified as an "advancement". I'm guessing because they're pretty much automatic unless you've murdered somebody. Unless something's changed, one's first "promotion" is from SPC/CPL to SGT.

Response by 1SG Michael Blount made Jun 3 at 2014 8:26 PM

1SG Michael Blount — Tue, 03 Jun 2014 20:26:59 -0400

Of course, I did see a huge typo on somebody's 1059 coming out of PLDC (now called WLC)..a student's rank was typed in as "SFC" instead of "SPC" I remember thinking to myself, "that's somebody on a fast career track"

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Jun 4 at 2014 3:13 PM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Wed, 04 Jun 2014 15:13:57 -0400

It's happened again! This time it was Stars and Stripes. In the article they use the "Private Second Class" rank... I hope this isnt an omen..

http://www.stripes.com/news/army/female-soldier-testifies-about-recruitment-in-fort-hood-prostitution-ring-case-1.286895

Female soldier testifies about recruitment in Fort Hood prostitution ring case

The charges against Sgt. 1st Class Gregory McQueen and another sergeant convicted last year in the Fort Hood prostitution ring case helped spur a push to revamp the military’s rules on prosecuting sexual assault cases.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 23 at 2014 12:59 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 23 Aug 2014 00:59:52 -0400

Someone needs to fix that. We really need to not have two pay grades with the same exact name.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 23 at 2014 11:49 AM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 23 Aug 2014 11:49:39 -0400

This is why I can't take seriously the Army's snide comments about the Navy's enlisted rank system (three sets of three... tough stuff there). They'll promote you from Private to Private, change a pup tent into a rocker on advancement, and refuse to give you a stripe when you go from E-8 to E-9.

Response by WO1(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 28 at 2014 3:59 PM

WO1(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 28 Aug 2014 15:59:30 -0400

Anyone who says that rank during a promotion ceremony is not only mistaken, but is also a soup sandwich football bat squared away like a circle moron. Don't be dumb sparky, don't be dumb.

Response by PFC Zanie Young made Aug 31 at 2014 8:44 AM

PFC Zanie Young — Sun, 31 Aug 2014 08:44:03 -0400

No such animal, and I wore the rank. I was a private regardless. Anyone who thinks otherwise is an idiot (no offense to servicemembers). I would rather been called "Private" than anything else.

Response by SPC Robert Wagner made Aug 31 at 2014 6:23 PM

SPC Robert Wagner — Sun, 31 Aug 2014 18:23:00 -0400

E-Fuzzy and Mosquito Wings?

Response by LCpl Joe Clayton made Mar 25 at 2015 2:31 PM

LCpl Joe Clayton — Wed, 25 Mar 2015 14:31:00 -0400

Can't say I've ever heard this term used. We did have another affectionate term used for the non rate class. Senior pvt or senior lance. Sr. Pvt was used both for pvt and pfc

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 8 at 2016 3:01 PM

CPL Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 08 Feb 2016 15:01:33 -0500

My understanding is that it was in fact called a private second class, historically, thus the abbreviation. I suppose that over the course of many years the term fell out of popular usage and all that remained was the formal abbreviation with seemingly no explanation to the modern soldier. However, when the need arises to distinguish between an E-1 and E-2, I greatly prefer the term private second class to actually referring to them by the abbreviation, as if they're the sequel to PV1: PV2, more PVier.

Some references to the history of "classes" in Army rank structure:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_enlisted_rank_insignia#1920.E2.80.931942

United States Army enlisted rank insignia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This chart represents the United States Army enlisted rank insignia with seniority increasing left-to-right inside a given pay grade. All enlisted ranks of corporal and higher are considered non-commissioned officers (NCOs).

Response by LTC Dallas Powell made Sep 22 at 2020 9:45 AM

LTC Dallas Powell — Tue, 22 Sep 2020 09:45:36 -0400

I call bullshit.
I was promoted to Private Second Class in 1989. Not only did my little Army handbook call it that, but so did my orders.

Response by LTC Dallas Powell made Sep 22 at 2020 10:09 AM

LTC Dallas Powell — Tue, 22 Sep 2020 10:09:11 -0400

Technically, according to AR 600-20, no one should ever address a PFC as "Private First Class."

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