The REAL reason Veterans commit suicide...another perspective

2015-03-14T01:43:09-04:00

A recent article puts a different slant on why our veterans are commuting suicide. This rips the covers off...The final words...I love my country, but my country does not love me rips my soul from my body.(reminds me of what many of our Vietnam Vets had to look forward to)

If you have a moving story about suicide and how it impacted you, please share. Maybe it will help someone, maybe it will prevent just one, and that one will grow to two, then three.

What are we doing, not doing, standing by, marking time, resting, observing, how can we sit idly by....doing nothing, saying nothing, doing something, not doing enough...

This is powerfully emotional for me...post your comments, thoughts, bitches, complaints, let it all out brothers and sister....this shit has got to stop. We are losing too many.1 a day is too many, 22 or 23 is way, way too many.

I had a family.
I had a job.
I had a life.
I loved my country. I volunteered. I went to war. I did all the things a good man does. I was gone for six months. Then eight months. Then fourteen. I got a letter, “I’m not happy,” she said. “I’m not either,” I thought. “At least you are not getting shot at.”

I came home. To an empty house. My boots echoed on the hardwood floors. No banners. No flag. Not even the hum of a refrigerator. The court battles. The kids gone for six months. Then eight months. Then fourteen. I got a letter, “Daddy, don u love us anymore?” she said. “I love you more than life itself,” I thought. “At least your Mommy gets to see you.”

The economy crapped out. So did my job. I could not make the child support. I got behind in the payments. First six months. Then eight months. Then fourteen. I got a letter, “We regret to inform you…” it said. “I’m going to prison,” I thought. “Oh hell no I am not.”

Not all suicides are due to ‘traditional’ PTSD or traumatic brain injury.

There have been discussions that our soldiers of today just aren’t as ‘strong’ as soldiers of previous wars. That soldiers of previous wars didn't talk about what happened, they pulled themselves up by the bootstraps and ‘soldiered’ through it. As this video illustrates very effectively, maybe the strength of the soldier has not changed, but the family dynamic has. Soldiers from previous eras had loyal wives to come home to, they had jobs to come home to, they had actually been allowed by their government to “WIN” the war, not just the battles. They came home to a country where Jesus, GOD, Christ…had not been banned. They came home to a strong foundation of GOD, family, country. They came home to America, not a place that is very quickly turning into the ‘battlefield’ they left behind. And the VA that is supposed to help them are laughing at them behind their backs, by employees like Robin Paul.

http://dcgazette.com/watch-the-real-reason-for-veterans-suicides-nauseating-and-heartbreaking/

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 14 at 2015 1:47 AM

2015-03-14T01:47:16-04:00

Purple Heart's Final Beat - A Soldier Suicide Story: https://youtu.be/0_StCzStBy0

Response by CPT Richard Riley made Mar 14 at 2015 7:53 AM

2015-03-14T07:53:12-04:00

Difficult, but honest. Thanks for the perspective.

Response by CH (MAJ) William Beaver made Mar 14 at 2015 7:58 AM

2015-03-14T07:58:33-04:00

Fantastic perspective. Yes, the entire family 'goes to war.' It's a systemic issue to which we must find systemic solutions.

Response by CSM Michael J. Uhlig made Mar 14 at 2015 8:49 AM

2015-03-14T08:49:00-04:00

Thanks for bringing this forward!

Bottom Line Up Front:

You will never really know what and how I feel.....we must try to be there for each other because most of society will never understand what we've experienced, NEVER!

Response by 1LT William Clardy made Mar 14 at 2015 8:56 AM

2015-03-14T08:56:56-04:00

A very strong message, SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member, but I can't help questioning some of the "facts" presented at the end of the film -- especially after learning that a significant portion of the epidemic of veteran suicides has been composed of WWII veterans making irrevocable choices about their quality of life:

Is the divorce rate among OIF veterans *really* 90 percent within 5 years?

Does that figure jive with the first-hand observations of folks here?

And what defines the "fair treatment" that the filmmaker claims 98.5 percent of veterans don't get?

Response by LTC Jason Strickland made Mar 14 at 2015 9:07 AM

2015-03-14T09:07:03-04:00

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member thanks for sharing this. Powerful video - and revealing.
At Project Sanctuary (http://www.projectsanctuary.us) we are addressing many of the causes of divorce, family separation, depression, etc. The claims captured in this documentary are accurate - and are just some of the many reasons why our veterans and active duty service members are losing their lives to suicide.
As I regularly mention, please send anyone our way who may need help!

cc: CH (MAJ) William Beaver CPT Richard Riley CSM Michael J. Uhlig

Home - Project Sanctuary

Home page for the Project Sanctuary website

Response by SrA Matthew Knight made Mar 14 at 2015 9:14 AM

2015-03-14T09:14:20-04:00

It is unfortunate that we live in a society now where getting divorced is something that many don't care about. A society where even when you are married you or your spouse can break it off as easily as breaking up with your high school crush and move to the next person. People take their relation ships about as seriously as a Michael Bay movie. At first glance it looks awesome and it maybe is the first time through, then it gets old and you throw it in the corner and resent it. My brother went through a marriage like this. His had nothing to do with military service. Rather, he married and got pregnant a woman that wasn't in it because she was in love like him. She was in it for the money which he didn't realize until it was too late. It's issues like this that make me wary of marriage because to many people, both men and women think that it is like a used car. If you don't like it you can just take it back and find another.

Now, I can't say that I personally relate to the high suicide rates in the military. I haven't been deployed, am not in a very stressful job. I am single and live in the dorms where my only bills are my car, internet and food. Despite this I can definitely say that suicide is a huge problem with service members and one that we should focus more attention on. Maybe instead of focusing so much on SAPR/SARC (which don't get me wrong is still important) we need to help our brothers and sisters in arms find help when they need it. And I am not talking send them to mental health wear they are treated like a nut case only to be discharged either. I have never been to mental health but based on what I hear I can honestly say it is the last place I would be willing to go with my problems. It shouldn't be that way though. It should be a place where we do our best to help people recover. A place where people can come back to reality and hopefully find enjoyment in their life again.

Maybe I am going on a rant that doesn't make sense to most.

TLDR: We need to focus on helping people rather than pushing them to the side.

Response by Sgt Spencer Sikder made Mar 14 at 2015 11:36 AM

2015-03-14T11:36:14-04:00

Wow, powerful! Made my eyeballs sweat.

It caused me to wonder once again, why my late Sailor brother-in-law sought to take this avenue. Too many times when people hear others "joke" about not being on this earth or life's not worth this effort they laugh and don't take it serious. Not since my late brother-in-law have I saw a joke. I don't care to highlight it during suicide prevention month by wearing an orange ribbon. I feel it just reminds people that there are options. I know in my heart of hearts the intention is to let people know there are others who care and to reach out for the help, but I just can't shake the thought.

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Mar 14 at 2015 1:33 PM

2015-03-14T13:33:12-04:00

Powerful.

Suicide is the worst embodiment of what we teach our Servicemembers, Decisive reaction to situations, inflicting violence to solve challenges, placing blame on ourselves first. It isn't as illogical as it seems, it is the application of training to situations that we don't want it applied to.

We need to help each-other.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 14 at 2015 1:39 PM

2015-03-14T13:39:12-04:00

Devastatingly familiar.
We can preach resilience all we want. Without a good foundation, even the strongest Soldiers crumble.
Believe me.
I know.

Response by PV2 Abbott Shaull made Mar 14 at 2015 2:30 PM

2015-03-14T14:30:07-04:00

Yes, it very difficult when at every turn you get mix tune, of people who support you, and those who think you just freak, who goes out and enjoy leaving a trail of destruction of death behind you.

Then those of who have disabilities connected to Service Injuries, people from both sides, can be pretty harsh, in their opinions about us trying to get our help. Even those working for the V.A. don't help at times. Then again there are those of us that get little angry, (I include myself, btdt) and take it out on the people who just trying to do their job. On the other hand, people need to understand, we get told to sign up for this and that, as we bounce from one place to another, they claim they can't help you to only send you back to where you came from.

They put everything off until too late, and there never enough to sit and listen to you to get to know the root cause why you are being seen. You can't find out everything in 15 to 30 minute window of time. Or the fact that like at this time, there are so many seeking mental help, they are so under staff, it not even funny. So it can take weeks to get in-take done, and even then it may take awhile to be seen. Hurry up and wait, when one of us really needs the help, their no one available to provide the help they so much are in need for.

When a Vet is having Suicidal thoughts is the time when the 'hurry up' stops, and when everyone should stop and listen, and take time to pray for their fellow man/woman.

Yes it has to stops, but hey we went into this War 13 years ago with an unprepared Military to sustained the fight for that long, and the Government through it excellent Leadership and Brilliance left the Veteran Administration as unprepared for the walking wounded leaving the Military. As they say, repeating one actions time after time, and expecting different result will cause insanity.

Response by SP5 Michael Rathbun made Mar 14 at 2015 3:05 PM

2015-03-14T15:05:31-04:00

"There have been discussions that our soldiers of today just aren’t as ‘strong’ as soldiers of previous wars. That soldiers of previous wars didn't talk about what happened, they pulled themselves up by the bootstraps and ‘soldiered’ through it."

Near-total BS. There are many things in life that you can "soldier through". There are a lot of other things you can't, even when your friends, family and society insist that you do.

We're not talking personal strength or weakness here, we are talking the laws of physics and the way the human neurological system works.

My wife got me through the "active" suicidal ideation a while back. I'm still fighting all the rest after all these years.

I am always happy* to talk to a fellow sufferer.

* perhaps "happy" isn't quite the right word.

Response by MAJ Emma Toops made Mar 14 at 2015 4:21 PM

2015-03-14T16:21:23-04:00

As a recently retired Veteran, I have come to realize how very far removed many Civilians are from the life we live as service members. When I tell my transition story or describe my career, it amazes me how surprised people are at what I did while in service. When I tell of the challenges that Veterans face upon leaving the military, the first thing they think of are those associated with combat-related conditions (i.e. Wounded Warriors / PTSD). Why? Because that is what is primarily portrayed in the news and media.

The challenges of finding employment due to a Veteran/Civilian culture gap, trying to regain that feeling that we serve/work for a meaningful purpose, reintegrating into a supportive society/community, legal and family concerns, etc are not what they know or understand, unless told a story by someone willing to share.

My experience with Casualty Notification while I served (4 families notified; 2 of the deaths were suicide) and losing friends to suicide are additional reasons why I do what I do in my current career. People need to Know Us. It is our responsibility to help them understand by talking to them - they will not know unless they've lived it themselves or are told/shown in the media.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 14 at 2015 6:00 PM

2015-03-14T18:00:26-04:00

It's unfortunate but what I see that drives a lot of veteran suicide is the loss of community when the soldier finally ETS. While deployed we as service members see and do things that can cause deep emotional wounding but most manage to continue on through service surrounded by those that they suffered through with. Even after PCS with a new group of soldiers you can find many who have gone through the same. A lot of times it's an unspoken connection that keeps us going.

But after ets even though the soldier may have family, it isn't the same. A possible solution I find would be encouraging VFW to work diligently to build community and should be informed or something once a soldier moves into a new VFW district.

But that wouldn't be a sure fix. I think to curb this troubling suicide rate needs to be an all personal effort. Even if it's just reaching out to soldiers over the web who are out

Just my thoughts on the matter though.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Mar 14 at 2015 6:12 PM

2015-03-14T18:12:48-04:00

I had a girlfriend who sent me a Dear John before I finished Infantry School. We got engaged. She sent me a second Dear John before I finished a tour of duty in Vietnam. We got married. Can you guess the ending?

One child dead.

The other child estranged.

What do you call me?

Don't worry. It's nothing I haven't called myself.

It is the arrogance of many men and many soldiers that their love is strong enough for two. It is hubris to believe that love can conquer all.

Maybe we should fall back on the old adage that if the Army wanted you to have a wife, they would have issued you one.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 14 at 2015 8:10 PM

2015-03-14T20:10:54-04:00

Well not only that but many veterans are afraid of the VA. If you feel as if it is a crime to be suicidal would you feel better or worse? As I have stated on more than one occasion they have panic buttons in case a veteran gets too upset. But what is that? Really? And why?

These guys come back and the government is cutting benefits and the list goes on and on and on.

Response by SFC Collin McMillion made Mar 14 at 2015 11:39 PM

2015-03-14T23:39:07-04:00

I came home on day, walked into my house and, damn. Evan the curtain rods, soap, toilet paper, everything was gone, and I MEAN EVERYTHING!! I sat down in the floor took out my 40cal and said to my self, this is it, no wife, no kids, no nothing.....no more life. Suddenly out of nowhere I realized that it wasn't just me and her, I had a child that loved and depended on me. They were my life, she was replaceable if I needed and I needed that type of companionship, my kids were not. It was a long hard, emotional road back, but I made it with help from my God and my friends. You are never truly alone, just take the moment to say who and where do I find this help, believe me it's out there, and I am speaking from experience not some flyer that was handed out. Taking your own life is the easy way for you, but what about those who are left behind telling themselves if only you would have called they would have been there for you. Remember you will be gone, but they will have to live with it!

Response by SFC Marcus Belt made Mar 15 at 2016 9:25 PM

2016-03-15T21:25:22-04:00

I've lost three friends in the last three years and I'm F****** tired of it man!

The most recent was less than a month ago and here's the really worrisome part: another buddy comes up and says "Hey man did you hear about 'Joe'(not a real name)?"

And I say "He killed himself?"

It's not even a freakin' surprise anymore. Matter of fact, it's two in the last six months!

I used to think that we'd be paying for OIF/OEF long after they were over. Not anymore.

Because OIF/OEF vets are doing themselves in.

Sorry for the rant. I added literally nothing to this topic.

Response by SGT C Mendez made Jul 7 at 2016 3:02 PM

2016-07-07T15:02:36-04:00

SSG, you post is very powerful. Thank you for sharing. I agree with you. Sometimes its not about the PTSD. Sometimes its about the load. How much can one person take before they just can't carry anything anymore? Once upon a time, I relied on the VA to fight and care for me....not so much anymore. I'm sure that there are great people that work and represent the VA but there comes a time that you just accept the fact that eventually, you will get screwed. Now I treat the VA like a business and cover my 6. I make them work for me. There are no warm fuzzies when you walk into a VA hospital or clinic. Its "Last name, last four...ok have a seat."

There are way too many chefs with their hands in the pot and they are playing with our lives. Its bureaucratic, too much like a cold business that does not care about what happens as long as they get their budget approved. This type of mentality has to stop. We are not in the military anymore but we deserve the care we are ENTITLED to....and yes we are entitled to this care. It's simple, step up, do your job and help take care of and support those that need help before its too late.

Response by LTC Sonya Friday made Jul 26 at 2016 3:48 PM

2016-07-26T15:48:54-04:00

I have lost a Soldier to suicide and a friend to suicide while on active duty and I concur that not all suicides committed by Soldiers are related to PTSD. My unit investigated a case where a Soldier hung himself after his wife said she was leaving him, another shot himself and died six months later over a pending divorce. Yes it is truly sad and disheartening that we are losing Soldiers in this way. I was always taught as a kid that "suicide is a long term solution to a short term problem" so don't do it. That saying has stayed with me to this day and I have see a lot. Not sure how we go about helping but I know its a complicated issues and the military lacks the resources to deal with it and a band-aide is not the answer.

Response by Debbie Gray made Jun 27 at 2019 11:31 PM

2019-06-27T23:31:00-04:00

More reasons!! YES!!! Extramarital AFFAIRS...”Truth”!...This is destroying families...
To the point of Suicide! Officers having affairs with enlisted...fatal attraction...threats...no one wants to face this type of issue ... even when command is aware of!!! This MUST STOP! Y’all know that have spent times of separation from your spouses! Moral issues !
This is real my friends...& must never go unaddressed , as in my horrific & devastating loss of my husband.
Respectfully & Sincerely,
Debbie
Surviving Spouse
USAF VET
DECEASED/SUICIDE , age 42!

Response by PO3 Aaron Hassay made Jul 31 at 2020 1:32 AM

2020-07-31T01:32:45-04:00

Ill state as the son of a Vietnam vet infantry Army 1966-68 I got to breathe. bit to write this.

I was gone with my mom who had to leave do his violent or chaotic ways..possibly a thousand reasons

regardless I would be reunited with him after my own odd navy story. and he was found in VA Care with a fiduciary

I did not know he was a soldier when I joined the Navy
I joined the Navy to take his spot the big guy of the house

regardless good ideas

when we were reunited well the story goes that I did get to know my father..this great guy with a real heart who did have anger and sadness that he lost his family and my mom had you know taken us without much like questioning...but when he followed us to San Diego...more threats etc...I mean it got deep..regarldess no one knew then he was a soldier...suffering from psych issues...

I can only imagine what it is like to be in his shoes and lose all that is dear your own family due a mental health issue directly related to his military story...