There is Only One Measuring Stick to Veteran Status

2017-08-24T09:40:26-04:00

I find it very sad when there are some veterans who say that they don’t feel like veterans - that they don’t feel as if they earned the title because of a lack of certain experiences, awards, or schools. I would like to come forward right now and explain why this entire idea is absolute bullshit.

First, and possibly the most detrimental of these make-believe qualifiers to “be a veteran”, is the idea that the title is only bestowed upon someone that has endured the hardship of deployment or combat. I would like to say that this is not so. If this were truly a largely held belief, then there would be hundreds or thousands of men and women that have honorably worn a uniform and served that would not be considered veterans. Combat is its very own beast.

There are periods of our nation’s history where there was no war for decades, but we still had to maintain a readily available force in order to defend ourselves and deter our enemies. These men and women are just as much veterans as the gruff Marine who has done five tours to the sandbox.

It is not someone’s personal choice that prevents him or her from experiencing the horrors of combat (although for some, they have had the choice and power to stay away from the ordeal). This is dictated by higher commands, ordered to be done by certain units at certain times, and for the young Soldier, Marine, Seaman, Airman, or Coastie, it is pretty much a luck of the draw and out of their control. I don’t know of a single branch manager that would give a crap about some lowly private requesting a particular assignment. Sorry kid, but the needs of that 16-year Sergeant First Class are way higher on the list of priorities.

Second, the idea that a lack of awards or professional recognition somehow makes you less deserving of the title of veteran. I often hear this come from friends of mine that happen to bring awards up in conversation; it doesn’t happen often, but it has happened. Namely with a close friend of mine that served in the Army Reserves. Not only did he never deploy, which of course makes him not claim his veteran status, but he also has remarked that even if he does allow himself to be a veteran, that he is somehow lesser than those of us who have a little more color on our chests. I say that this is possibly even more ridiculous than the combat crap.

Awards are a great way to tell where someone has been, what they have done, and where they stand in a kind of hierarchy when it comes to peer groups. They are a resume that can be worn on your uniform and nothing more. I can tell how far someone is in their professional development as an NCO by seeing how many Noncommissioned Officer Professional Development Ribbons someone has. I can use the information gathered by seeing someone’s campaign medals and overseas service ribbons to see how many times they have been to combat and perhaps if they have served in Germany. I had a friend that had a star on his Airborne Wings; he had participated in one of the only combat jumps into Iraq in the past decade or so. None of these make someone more qualified to be a veteran though. These are just things they have done since they came in; stories that they can tell other veterans while they sit at the VFW and tell their war stories. That is all.

Lastly, “I’m not a real veteran if I didn’t do something ‘cool’.” This one is what leads those poor, underappreciated kids to don their old ACUs, go grab some badges from the local army surplus store, and parade around telling everyone that they were Ranger SEAL Snipers. Everyone is a veteran who served in the US military - not just special forces... it takes all types.

The military does not work without us all. A scout cannot use his M3A3 if the mechanics don’t fix it everytime it breaks. The radios in my truck don’t work properly when I try to call for fire if the commo guys aren’t there to make sure retrains works and that the fill is properly encoded. That combat outpost will go black on water, food, ammunition, and fuel if the 88Ms don’t come rolling through every few days with LogPac. Not everyone can be the super cool Delta Force Operator, but everyone can play a small role in a very large picture. The machine fails if one portion of it fails. Everyone needs to remember that.

If you raised your right hand and took the oath, laced up your boots and put on your uniform. If you did two years and ETS’d or retired with 20 plus. If you were injured or broken somehow and received a medical discharge. If your DD214 says anything other than “Dishonorable” in block 24, you, my friend, are a veteran. You are my brother, my friend, and my family, and I don’t care what any other moron has to say about it.

Response by SGT Ben Keen made Aug 24 at 2017 9:56 AM

2017-08-24T09:56:49-04:00

Great article!

Response by SGT David T. made Aug 24 at 2017 10:23 AM

2017-08-24T10:23:14-04:00

Awesome article. I totally agree with everything you said.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 24 at 2017 10:29 AM

2017-08-24T10:29:55-04:00

On point brother and thank you!!!

Response by SGT Philip Roncari made Aug 24 at 2017 11:09 AM

2017-08-24T11:09:12-04:00

My take on this subject is once you say the words" I. - Do solemnly swear ...." You forever have the privilege of being a Veteran

Response by SMSgt Thor Merich made Aug 24 at 2017 11:10 AM

2017-08-24T11:10:31-04:00

Well said. I am troubled when I hear those that discount themselves because they served in peace time. We are all equal especially in today's world of an all volunteer military. Anyone who joins has the possibility of laying down their lives for this nation. That is good enough for me.

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Aug 24 at 2017 11:27 AM

2017-08-24T11:27:27-04:00

SGT Joseph Gunderson -- thank you! Very well said. As a Cold War veteran, I have run up against the prejudices you describe. I wholeheartedly agree: if you have a DD214 showing honorable service, you are a veteran. You should take pride in your service! Veterans with long and distinguished service records, combat stars on their EIB or a "V" device on their Air Medal, deserve special respect. The rest of us may have few exciting or interesting experiences or stories, but we did our part, stood our watch, and contributed to defending the Constitution and our Nation.

Response by PO1 Brian Austin made Aug 24 at 2017 11:36 AM

2017-08-24T11:36:08-04:00

Nailed it!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 24 at 2017 11:42 AM

2017-08-24T11:42:08-04:00

When we've been at war for 16 years and there are people who have been in for more than 8-10 years with a fuzzy right sleeve, there's something wrong there. I find it hard to believe that their luck could be that good.

Response by PO3 Michael James made Aug 24 at 2017 11:52 AM

2017-08-24T11:52:55-04:00

SGT Gunderson, Sir; Thank You.. Very, Very well written article.. Thank you for sharing.. Very uplifting and encouraging .. Often thought of wearing a vest with patches (awards) showing the medical operations Awards that I have.. Maybe I would feel like more of a decorated Veteran !! I Thank you again.. With Respect... Mike

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 24 at 2017 12:14 PM

2017-08-24T12:14:52-04:00

SGT Joseph Gunderson Great words. Even if you are in the land of that pretend bird that wears pilgrim shoes - the Jayhawk (MIZ!!!). Truer words are rarely spoken. I am a veteran, but received a medical discharge before ever even going on a TDY. I served between Desert Storm & 9/11. Do I regret not serving longer? Yes. Do I consider myself a part of a group of special folks that were willing to sacrifice a portion of their life so that they could do something greater than themselves? Also Yes.

Response by Sgt Martin Querin made Aug 24 at 2017 12:21 PM

2017-08-24T12:21:54-04:00

Thanks for a well-written and thoughtful post. Hooah Sergeant...semper fi.

Response by SGT Todd Miller made Aug 24 at 2017 12:47 PM

2017-08-24T12:47:03-04:00

Thanks for posting this article. I served through Grenada, Panama, and Desert Storm. I was in the reserves by the time Desert Storm happened. My unit was activated and I had less than 24 hours to pack. As a citizen soldier, I walked out on my job, apartment, girlfriend, college, and family. When my car broke down on the way to the drill center, I watched as two Vietnam vets towed it away. I was going to war. Another sergeant came and got me. I was valuable to the unit as I had a military license to drive or operate anything our reserve unit had. That was January-February 1991. We waited on the flight line at Rickenbecker AFB for our turn to go. The government chose to send a different unit out of Chicago instead. That was as close as I got to being in combat. We were told to stand down in March and I returned home. Over the years the American Legion approached me three times for membership. I didn't join because I didn't think myself as deserving. Somebody somewhere knew who I was. I finally joined to take advantage of the USAA credit card and it's lower interest rate. I was surprised that I had already been approved by congress to join AL. I didn't realize that I could have also joined SAL because my father was a Navy vet during the Cuban Missile blockade and he was also a legionnaire for a short period of time. I don't bother the VFW guys. I feel that combat vets need their place too. It's nice that they will allow me to have a drink at their table occasionally though. It's an honor and privilege to be accepted into AL. I keep my card up to date and try to pay my CC off on time because of the people who stand behind those things. My son also qualifies for SAL now. My grandfather was a vet of the battle of Leyte Gulf in WWII. I've visited Manila, and spent two months at Ft. Clayton, Panama. Being brave and standing up for our country runs in my family. All three of us, my grandfather, father, and myself are like the unsung, work a day soldiers and sailors that nobody pays much attention too. We're the cogs in the wheel so to speak. I have met and worked with some fantastic people who had great military careers but I'm okay with just being another boot. We can't all be heroes. I just really enjoyed being a part of it all. Regards.

Response by Capt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 24 at 2017 2:21 PM

2017-08-24T14:21:05-04:00

Well said SGT Joseph Gunderson

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 24 at 2017 3:24 PM

2017-08-24T15:24:59-04:00

Outfreakinstanding article. I almost had to go to blows with my oldest daughters middle school teacher years ago. She asked the kids who's parents were Veterans. My daughter raised her hand and then was asked what war did I fight in. My daughter honestly said that I did not see combat as I served between ODS and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. She is then berated in front of everyone that unless I served in combat I was not "really" a Veteran. Needless to say she came home crying when she told me this story. Some phone calls and letters wound up with my family and I in a room with the teacher, the principal and the chairman of the school board to have the teacher give my daughter and I a personal apology.

Response by PO3 Jacob Jenkins made Aug 24 at 2017 4:21 PM

2017-08-24T16:21:32-04:00

SGT Joseph Gunderson These are words that need to spoken more often!!! People forget too easily what it really means to be a veteran! everyone who joined signed a blank check give up to and including their lives.. some were just lucky enough to not have to cash it.

Response by PFC Lisa McDonald made Aug 24 at 2017 5:12 PM

2017-08-24T17:12:23-04:00

I believe every life lost in a training accident is a valuable as one lost in combat.

Response by Cpl Justin Goolsby made Aug 24 at 2017 5:41 PM

2017-08-24T17:41:27-04:00

Nicely put. This is a conversation I've had with a lot of my Junior Marines. I get it. We're all trained killers ready to kick down doors and fight the enemy. So it's pretty easy for young troops to not see the value in their day to day occupation.

My MOS most people look at like it's a joke. They think all I do is reset computer passwords. They don't realize I'm one of the authorities that helps designate an aircraft safe to fly. Every time I hear of an aircraft going down, I hold my breath and wonder if it's one of mine. I wonder if I made a mistake in my calculations. Did I miss something?

I tell my Marines that every time an aircraft takes off and lands safely, that's a victory for us. Because pilots and other Marines lives are in our hands.

Sometimes that makes them appreciate our contribution to the fight at large. Other times they'd still rather kick down doors.

Response by PO2 Kevin LaCroix made Aug 24 at 2017 5:54 PM

2017-08-24T17:54:44-04:00

I discussed this question with my father a few years ago. He did not consider himself a veteran because he "only" served stateside in the guard(Vietnam era). Funny to think I enlisted only 9 years after vietnam was over.

Response by SGT Beau Thomas made Aug 24 at 2017 7:49 PM

2017-08-24T19:49:57-04:00

The only thing with vet status that drives me crazy are a couple people I know who try to claim vet status who didn't really serve. I know one guy who insists he is a vet because according to him, he enlisted but was discharged 3 hours later at MEPS. I know another guy who was separated in Basic because of failure to adapt. He also claims he is a vet. They drive me bonkers.

Response by SSG Michael Needham made Aug 24 at 2017 10:13 PM

2017-08-24T22:13:48-04:00

I have to say this , I appreciate Sgt Gunderson's point of view but having been the recipient of the crappy reception at San Francisco airport in 1971 and the "You ain't sh## " stare down by fellow Nam vets during my last ride to Rolling Thunder because I didn't have a CIB or some sort of combat experience ..Yeah I feel like second best , when my own peers look down on me and others because we were "REMF " .

Response by SPC Crystal Sandercock made Aug 24 at 2017 10:23 PM

2017-08-24T22:23:11-04:00

well said....and thanks from one of "those" veterans.

Response by SFC William Farrell made Aug 24 at 2017 11:56 PM

2017-08-24T23:56:19-04:00

Well said SGT Joseph Gunderson

Response by SPC Molly Kumpula made Aug 25 at 2017 4:22 AM

2017-08-25T04:22:07-04:00

I was in 14 yrs...the first 10 as a fire fighter then the last 4 in a medical unit. I was treated very unfairly, the unit discharged me honorably when my ETS date came (might I add I did not want out just a different unit) then they said to my face you can transfer when you find a new unit next thing I know they discharged me...that's a whole other crappy story lol...I had a tough ride especially when I went to the medical unit but either way I never got the opportunity to deploy which I would have gladly taken...since out I am not considered a veteran which is heartbreaking for me. I am trying to get back in so fingers crossed.

Response by SFC William Stephens A. Jr., 3 MSM, JSCM made Aug 25 at 2017 9:40 AM

2017-08-25T09:40:35-04:00

I have to add my two cents here because yes I am a veterans but part of my demons make me feel forgotten as a warrior because for years I have been fighting this BSM award packet and for saving and bringing a fellow soldier off the battle field and watching a 1SG get a Silver star for bringing in a MEDVAC under no combat condition because of the ROE, yes the people were throwing rocks but not bullets at us. SO I've been working with the navy the past few months who I work for to shuffle my BSM packet through the channels to the JCOS GEN Dempsey (ARMY) because he was a 2 Star Gen when this situation happen in Iraq in 2003, If he saw this packet he would remember this, Reason why I live with these demons is because I was awards not a military award I was awarded a freaking belt buckle for my hard work as a soldiers risking my life for this soldiers, sometimes I think why did I ever stand in formation with my brothers and that 1SG who all got BSM and 1 Silver Star and I was put out to be made fun of because of situation that happen to me in the past. Just because your a combat warrior and you bust your ass in all you do for your self and your country don't expect anything back for your hard work. I think maybe I was but I did put my life on the line and I was there when I was needed and I just don't think the demons won't go away until I get a solid answer from the man himself. Waiting still.......

Response by SSgt Christopher "TEX" F. made Aug 26 at 2017 12:22 AM

2017-08-26T00:22:13-04:00

Nicely stated!

My [direct] family lineage, Which is also our direct military lineage, has been traced back to 910 AD. We have 6 different knights (so far discovered), in my lineage. Every generation has militaristically served.

My grandfather, on my dad's side, retired, from the Army, as a Full Bird Col. He served in WWII, as well as Korea. He was an ambulance battalion Commander in the Korean War and , was in command of the emergency and radiology departments at Darnell Army Hospital, Fort Hood, TX.

My grandfather, on my mom's side was, also, retired Army. He was an MP. He fought in WWII. He also served directly under General Wainwright, during WWII (I have photos of him with Gen. Wainwright). He [eventually] retired as a CSM. He then retired from the VA, Temple, TX.

My dad is a retired (old school Marine) Gunny. He went in as a personnelist, then went into sniping. He fought in Vietnam, as a sniper. I have pics of him, over there, in his suit, with his rifle. He won't talk about it, at all.

I was going to go into the Marines, like my dad, but I was 26, when I enlisted, so I decided to go into the Air Force. I was a Combat Loadmaster, on C 17s. I have, just shy of, 2,500 total flight hrs. A little over 1,000 hrs of those are combat flight hours. Now, I'm not talking these "just flying over the combat zone", combat hours. I have real, [actual], bullet holes in the aircraft...shot at with mortars, ground fire and SAM/MANPAD combat hours. I was launched on, by a SAM, 30 min West of Balad, Iraq, in October of 2005...during a combat run. I was thrown down, while wearing my body armor; a 65 lb chute; survival vest and my sidearm. I was folded in half like a taco and blew four discs (ruptured) out of my back...thought I was paralyzed, for a while. This injury put an end to a 10 year career. I am medically retired, as a SSgt.

I have ALWAYS been proud of my service, as is my dad. My son now flies the very same aircraft I did. My brother also went into the Air Force, because of me. My nephew, also, just entered the Air Force, a year ago, because of me.

Sometimes...I [unjustly] question the choice I made, by going into the Air Force, even though my dad has told me he is glad I made the decision I did, because my quality of life was better (his words). I question it because I have heard SO many times the Air Force being referred to as the "Chair Force", or the "Air Farce", or the "Chair Farce". Now, I know a lot of that is simple inter service rivalry....and I can and do appreciate, and enjoy that. However, I have [also] been the recipient of A LOT of VERY serious comments, from other services members, who [genuinely] believe the Air Force should not be a military service and that Air Force should not be considered Veterans and that the small percentage of us Airmen, who actually see/saw [real] combat time, are not even real veterans...simply because we are members of the Air Force. Their stance basically dismisses the 1,000+ hrs of officially documented combat time I have accumulated and the hundreds of officially documented combat missions I have flown. They dismiss the countless times I have been shot at. They dismiss the five (total) years I spent (300+ days every year), between Afghanistan and Iraq...away from my wife and kids. They dismiss my war injuries...my incurred [permanent] illnesses (burn pits; heavy metals and silicates in the powdery sands (I have [frequent] upper respiratory infections)) and a myriad of other illnesses.

My apologies, for the rant, but I grow tired of [repeatedly] having to defend my and those like me [completely documented and verifiable (through public records and official mission histories...minus the SEC and TS non-disclosures)] combat service...which, to many of those people, is not real, because (again) I'm Air Force.

I ALWAYS tried to ingrain, into my troops, that ALL service members are EQUALLY important...regardless of branch, job, or rank...war time, or peace time service. I taught them the people that clean the planes out are just as important as the people that fly the planes; the E-1 troop is just as important as the 0-10 officer and ALL should be treated with equal respect.

Ok...rant over. Apologies, for the length. I hope I [articulately] got my point across.

Response by Sgt Neil Klein made Aug 26 at 2017 2:32 PM

2017-08-26T14:32:34-04:00

To those who feel like they did not deserve Veteran Status, you do. You might not of served in a combat role or even left stateside but your contribution was appreciated from the Clerk to the Food Service Tech. To vehicle Maintenance. I am an Air Force Veteran who served Overseas in a combat area but without the supply people, logistics and Intel and Drone Operators I would not be here. So thank you and always be proud of your Service to this Country and all Volunteer Armed Forces.

Response by SPC Henry Knight made Aug 26 at 2017 5:29 PM

2017-08-26T17:29:58-04:00

What is your meassuring stick to c if I qualify or are you just judging to see if I got your standards or whatever other reasons ? 1983 May 10th entered Active duty ECHO company Fort Benning Georgia HARMONY CHURCH E-9-2 45 th Company Airborne School ! I was a member of the First Cohesive unit that the Infantry put together after Nam 18 months together from basic AIT JUMP SCHOOL ,THEN TOGETHER Until the 18 months together was completed my company was the First to jump into Fort Bragg From AIRBORNE SCHOOL Since 1975 if I remember right 82nd AIRBORNE Division 2/325 Charlie company , CHARLIE COBRAS LETS GO IS OUR BATTALIONS MOTO NEED ANY ADDITIONAL INFO I CAN GIVE YOU 53 OTHERS THAT MADE TGAT SAME TRIP INCLUDING MY SQUAD LEADER SSG WILLIAM FRAZIER HE IS GETTING MARRIED THIS WEEK SO CUT HIM SOME SLACK ON RESPONSE TIME !!! BET THAT , ALL THE WAY AIRBORNE EVERY FUCKING DAY EVEN STILL TO DAY I PUT MY COMBAT BOOTS ON EVERY DAY AGAINST DOCTORS ORDERS I, I CAN ONLY be that which I am ,ok if u need additional info you let me know !

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Aug 27 at 2017 1:46 PM

2017-08-27T13:46:17-04:00

Depends on who you talk to. The American Legion requires a DD 214, the VFW supposedly requires wartime experience. Vietnam Veterans floored me when they included "Era Veterans". Seems everyone has their own criteria which starts with them and their friends.

Response by PO2 Michael Berry made Aug 27 at 2017 11:05 PM

2017-08-27T23:05:33-04:00

I agree 100%. You are a veteran no matter what you did or did not do, as long as you wore the uniform with honor.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 28 at 2017 3:42 PM

2017-08-28T15:42:11-04:00

This is a great perspective SGT Gunderson. I have felt this way for many years but now have a new outlook on this. Thank You for your opinion!!

Response by Bill Husztek made Aug 29 at 2017 8:54 PM

2017-08-29T20:54:35-04:00

I agree. But stop and consider this. The Politically Correct Mob is redefining our deal.

The Vet's blood, pain and life were acceptable sacrifices to the military in service to his Nation. He served honorably at home or abroad and was discharged with honor at the end of his service.
As an honorably discharged Vet, he was entitled to respect and a package of benefits, which included burial in a National cemetary.
Now come the revisionist politicians playing to the Politically Correct mob who renege on that contract. They add a post service cancellation clause.
Its all okay as long as he/she doesn't get convicted of murder or rape in his post military life! If he does he can't be buried in hallowed ground!

I for one protest!

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 2 at 2017 9:14 AM

2017-09-02T09:14:02-04:00

I have never deployed and always wanted to. My husband always says it isn't as great as you might think. To that I say this: It's not about fun. It's about feeling like I actually served the purpose I originally joined for. If I cannot do that, why am I here?

Response by Capt Cotesworth H. made Sep 3 at 2017 4:09 PM

2017-09-03T16:09:08-04:00

this is great. you're amazing

Response by SrA Richard Birdsong made Sep 6 at 2017 12:05 AM

2017-09-06T00:05:34-04:00

I have a sweat shirt that says it best. I'm a Cold Warrior. And proud of it.

Response by PFC Tara Tacker made Sep 7 at 2017 10:16 PM

2017-09-07T22:16:48-04:00

It doesn't help when a combat Veteran tells another Veteran that they are just a prior service member because they didn't see action.

Response by SSgt Jerrol Olson made Sep 8 at 2017 7:54 AM

2017-09-08T07:54:09-04:00

Yea, they can have their pound back.

Beers on me!

Response by SrA Derrek Cherry made Sep 8 at 2017 10:44 PM

2017-09-08T22:44:18-04:00

I mostly agree. The thing I hate though is I have an acquaintance who fought the VA to get him veteran benefits. When he finally won he was thrilled to be considered a veteran. The fact is he never graduated from Basic Training! If you never finished basic how can you be considered a veteran!

Response by PFC Timothy Heuer made Sep 12 at 2017 11:57 AM

2017-09-12T11:57:02-04:00

Thank you SGT. I needed this today.

Response by AN Eric Braun made Sep 12 at 2017 6:05 PM

2017-09-12T18:05:06-04:00

Agreed. Sometimes those whom have participated in black ops that have little to no credit given because it doesn't fall under certain parameters. Some have only 2&1/2 months on a ship, yet flew everywhere they needed to go or were helo'd out, stripped of their american ID's, dog tags, left with nothing but the geneva conventions card alongside CIA operatives, and told if caught "we don't know you, but we will use back channels to retrieve you." That sort of shit is infuriating when you have civilians whom believe they can find everything on google about you trying to discredit you. It is not as bad as what the vietnam vets went through when they returned, but in reality, it hits just as hard. I know my Father Tech Sargent Vietnam Vet AirForce Vet is one of them whom went to Loas, and experienced this. I too have had similar travels and experiences, as once I got back, Civilians, and even other Veterans whom were part-timers and never left INCONUS Status, tried to imply about myself, and my Father. It will bring a man/ veteran OCONUS to get real nasty real quick.

Response by CPO Nate S. made Sep 13 at 2017 3:34 PM

2017-09-13T15:34:44-04:00

Roger that! It takes all of us to succeed. Unless a man or women had "DISHONORED" themselves or their nation and the DD214 is positive, then regardless if you served chow or did HALO jumps out of perfectly good aircraft you served and that honorable service earned you the title - VETERAN!!!

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 13 at 2017 6:45 PM

2017-09-13T18:45:30-04:00

SGT Joseph Gunderson My best friend died at Gander in 1985. He was not a "combat" veteran, but I dare any person to say he was not a Veteran.

Response by SFC Jim Ruether made Sep 13 at 2017 7:05 PM

2017-09-13T19:05:30-04:00

The Ruskies never pulled anything during the Cold War when I was in so I believe it was the Roosevelt Diplomatic policy of "Walk Softly and Carry a Big Stick" and Pvt. Ruether walking guard duty around the Howitzer lot during Basic Training that swayed them all into submission!

Response by PV2 Duane Schlender made Sep 15 at 2017 10:17 AM

2017-09-15T10:17:26-04:00

While indo understand your ponts and agree with you, i can not help but feel i am a failure and not good enough to be called a proper veteran.
I know its a personal feeling. I just cant shake it. I should have been in iraq with my brethren in arms. That failure feels like i let my family down and can never repair the shame done. I ask myself frequently "who might be alive today, who might be more physically whole if i had been there or exchanged places with on th death list".
I will always feel this way because the army was my family, and i truly bekieve i failed them by getting injured in my tank accident and being unable to stay in.
Its that simple.

Response by SGT Charles H. Hawes made Sep 15 at 2017 12:05 PM

2017-09-15T12:05:00-04:00

Absolutely right! Anyone who has taken the oath to serve this nation in any of the armed forces and did that job is my brother or sister!

Response by CW4 Jesse Stacy made Sep 16 at 2017 3:57 PM

2017-09-16T15:57:04-04:00

When you leave service and go back to civilian life you will find many do not understand the military life and the many experiences you have had. I did have those experiences of people not understanding, but then joined the American Legion and immediately felt that I was once again among family who understood. Branch of service made no differences. We found so many common grounds of experiences. I also like the fact the Legion is giving back to veterans and their families. It feels good to still be serving.

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Sep 20 at 2017 8:36 PM

2017-09-20T20:36:54-04:00

X Files told us "the truth is out there" I doubt it. So many "veterans" tell the same story that they have become accepted. I've gotten to the point I don't believe anyone. But then again I don't really care. You want to be a veteran, get a leg shot off, then again it could just as easily been diabetes.

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 21 at 2017 7:28 AM

2017-09-21T07:28:54-04:00

I agree

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 23 at 2017 2:28 AM

2017-09-23T02:28:46-04:00

Very beautifully said. Some of my battle buddies have hard time understanding this

Response by SSgt Arthur Hoover made Oct 1 at 2017 5:56 PM

2017-10-01T17:56:11-04:00

You talked about a much needed topic and said it well, by the way.
I was not drafted, I enlisted in the USAF, at the Induction Center in Los Angeles on September 19, 1972.
There were a number of us, whom had a slight problem, with being called a Veteran when we separated from service in 1980. While still going through filling out all the separation paper work at McGuire AF, NJ, there were some actual combat Veterans that took the time to explained the Veteran status to us. They left no questions unanswered for us, so therefore, we are, I am a Veteran and I was good with it all then.

Response by SPC Scott Kreis made Oct 2 at 2017 12:08 AM

2017-10-02T00:08:18-04:00

Nicely written article. As a former 11B in the 101st Airborne (Air Assault), I can remember plenty of dick measuring, even prior to OIF and OEF regarding related to scare badges, and chest candy. It seems to only have gotten worse when you add combat tour counts to the equation.

If I may add one other caveat to your last paragraph it would be this. the title veteran needs to be bestowed on ALL members of the armed services who have faithfully and honorably served this country. By this, I'm specifically referring to the National Guard. My career started in the National Guard and later transitioned to active duty Army after high school and AIT. My wife, however, chose to make her six-year enlistment with the Wisconsin Army National Guard. As a result, when my wife was hired to work for the Department of Veterans' Affairs, her service wasn't recognized. I'm not talking about her time in service not counting towards seniority, I'm talking about the Federal Government not even recognizing her as a veteran of the U.S. Army because she "didn't serve in a combat zone for six months or longer or served on active duty for more than 12 months for purposes other than training". Last time I checked, it said "U.S. Army" on the left breast tape of her BDUs the same as it did mine.

Response by PFC Robert Rice made Oct 2 at 2017 1:16 AM

2017-10-02T01:16:50-04:00

I know there was a time that I felt that way and maybe I still do. I had the thought in the back of my head that because I did not participate In the Iraq War that somehow I had failed my brothers and sisters in arms. That I was less of a soldier than I once was. I was Honorably discharged after my term in service and was diagnosed with Type 1 Diabetes 3 months later. When the call came for me to return to service I was denied the ability to serve anymore because of my condition. It hit me pretty hard and I still have these thoughts from time to time. Especially with me being an 11B Infantryman.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 9 at 2017 11:19 PM

2017-10-09T23:19:22-04:00

Thank you for sharing this information with us. Over the past 45 plus years I’ve ran into Veterans that basically said the samething but I informed them what a veteran is. These media folks got everyone and their brothers talking about who is a veteran and who is a hero. Our society today is all screwed up. I’m just glad that you brought this up to everyone who needs it. Semper Fi.

Response by SSG Dave Weider made Oct 12 at 2017 9:26 PM

2017-10-12T21:26:09-04:00

If you left honorably you have my respect. No matter if you were an 11 series or a 98 series or anybody in between.

Response by PV2 Andrew Schauf- Anderson made Oct 13 at 2017 12:08 AM

2017-10-13T00:08:58-04:00

Honestly, this made my day! I was honorable discharged and didn't receive disability until later. Everytime I see someone in uniform it gets to me because I don't consider myself to be a veteran since I wasn't deployed. My brother (who is a Marine) also brings me down because of my disability.

Response by SSG Kelly Melton made Oct 14 at 2017 4:07 PM

2017-10-14T16:07:04-04:00

I gave 13 yrs to the US Army from 1982 till 1995 from '90 to '95 was in the reserve WE ALL ARE VETERANS ALL THE WAY

Response by SPC Jeremy Gwilliam made Oct 14 at 2017 5:26 PM

2017-10-14T17:26:44-04:00

As an 11B in the early 80's with 2/16 1st ID I never saw actual combat. At the time the Soviet Union was the enemy. We trained to fight them every day. In Reforger 84 we were expected to slow down an enemy outnumbering us 10 to 1 until larger forces could be brought on line. We were told by our NCO's that we would surely die doing this but only after we took 10 Communists before that. Accepting that you would die and still being willing to continue your job makes you a Veteran. I give great Props to those who were under fire in recent Wars and know the damage both physical/mental/emotional that happens due to combat but ANY COMBAT ARMS SOLDIER/MARINE, willing to knowingly lay down their life for their Buddy's first and Nation next is a Veteran in my eyes. Once a Soldier Always a Soldier.

Response by LCpl Donald Faucett made Oct 25 at 2017 11:45 AM

2017-10-25T11:45:58-04:00

I understand it, because you feel cheated out getting to do what you've trained so hard for. Marines job is to kill or be killed.

Response by A1C John Weiss made Oct 30 at 2017 2:49 PM

2017-10-30T14:49:08-04:00

I agree totally with your take on this. Raised your right hand, wrote the check. Served honorably, you are a veteran.

Response by SPC Brett Curry made Nov 3 at 2017 10:34 AM

2017-11-03T10:34:48-04:00

Every single person is a cog in the best machine in the world, the US military. Guess what happens when one of the cogs break!!?? Combat teams, direct support teams, Combat support team, down to the cook and the px 88m driver that brings the px to the FOB's..we are all soldiers first.
And now a days a 88m job can be just as dangerous as any other job in the military. Road side IED's suck...
Everyone signed the same dotted line giving your mind and body over to the US government becoming government property. My first tattoo I got a article 15 for defacing government property.
We are all Veteran's.

Response by SP5 Joel O'Brien made Nov 19 at 2017 7:19 PM

2017-11-19T19:19:10-05:00

Fine article, thanks for posting it!
My Dad and Mom were both in service during WWII however neither left the states.
I did just under four years but saw no combat, for which I am thankful.
You can't foresee what will be when you raise your hand.
A vet is a vet.

Response by SPC David Harrington made Nov 21 at 2017 10:44 PM

2017-11-21T22:44:26-05:00

Veterans are not the rare breed they were 10 years ago. I remember hearing my recruiter tell me that less than 1% of eligible Americans would ever serve. That's no longer the case, and I am glad to call these new service members my brothers and sisters.

Response by SSgt Harvey "Skip" Porter made Nov 22 at 2017 9:24 PM

2017-11-22T21:24:19-05:00

What being a Veteran means to me. I am so thankful and grateful!

I have written to so many Congressmen and Senators all regarding issues facing Veterans. I am not selfish I am 100% Total and Permanent so I could just say forget it and no longer be concerned but I am not made up like that. I want what's right and fair for all Veterans.

I am thankful for my time in the military and the friends I made I am grateful for the Veterans Service Officer an Army Retired SFC that help me with my claims and get awarded 100% based on my injuries that occurred on active duty so I feel indebted to Veterans causes for the rest of my life it's in my heart.

I am Thankful that at 50 years old I was able to retire from a job as a Mid level Manager after 22 years with full medical benefits for me and my wife. Despite being rated 100% I can still work. Then was able to get another Mid level Management job with another government agency. The reason why there is so much thanks given because both of the jobs I got because I was a Veteran. So I am one to say I have much pride as Veteran and I care for Veteran causes. I often go on the base to the PX , Commissary, Gym and Library near where I live so I can see people in uniform and be around a military environment. It may sound of corny but that's the type of guy I am.

Peace!

Response by SP5 Jose Santini Sr made Dec 4 at 2017 12:04 AM

2017-12-04T00:04:04-05:00

DAMN that was well said, thank you

Response by 1SG Ernest Schmidt made Dec 4 at 2017 1:36 AM

2017-12-04T01:36:38-05:00

sir this is great article you put it right!! I agree 100% with you.

Response by Maj Marty Hogan made Dec 7 at 2017 10:20 PM

2017-12-07T22:20:58-05:00

Spot on and your last sentence could have been your full post. Great answer SGT Joseph Gunderson

Response by CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 28 at 2017 6:25 PM

2017-12-28T18:25:57-05:00

Amen My Brother. Outstanding article

Response by SFC Jim Ruether made Dec 28 at 2017 6:44 PM

2017-12-28T18:44:42-05:00

Sergeant Gunderson your letter was very succinct and to the point. I was a cold war soldier with many thousands more out there and have at time felt bad or wondered what I did to serve my country. Then I had an epiphany when I realized the Russians never pulled anything, nor the Chicoms, Middle East, or North Koreans while we served. Gee we must have scared the living crap out of those guys to make em behave so well for so many years! Thanks for telling it the way you did and making a believer out of so many of us who felt we just filled boots.

Response by SFC Greg Bruorton made Dec 28 at 2017 6:55 PM

2017-12-28T18:55:26-05:00

Joseph, you wrapped up the topic nicely; so well, that you presented all the aspects of doubts from those not feeling their self-worth and to those who may have held a little uncertainty in their individual status as a true veteran. Your narrative explains well why some readily steal valor while hiding behind scads of ribbons, medals, and badges.

Your ability to express yourself on topics that interest this forum is evident, but I wouldn't be surprised if you hadn't already written some works in other genres worthy of publication.

I enjoy your messages expressed through the craft of writing.

Greg

Response by SPC(P) Mark Newman made Jan 11 at 2018 10:25 PM

2018-01-11T22:25:58-05:00

Thanks, Joseph. I do know I'm a veteran. But I also consider combat vets to be something special; more special. I'm proud of what I did. I really am. But I'm prouder of my Brothers and Sisters who deployed.

Response by Sgt Werner Cottrill made Jan 13 at 2018 6:27 PM

2018-01-13T18:27:55-05:00

Agree 100 %

Response by SSG David Palomarez made Jan 14 at 2018 11:20 AM

2018-01-14T11:20:42-05:00

OK so I am a Veteran. Yes I have have been to Combat. Which would make a me a Combat Veteran. Now with that said that doesn't change anything then the fact I have been to combat. Their are so many people that would of gone to combat if they could of. They earn the right to be called a Veteran when they finished Basic and AIT and been to unit it for the first six months. Now that is my opinion that you should have to finish at least six month in your first unit. Just because you go to basic and you don't make it yes you get a DD214. Now I feel that is wrong yes you tried but did you really? Within the first 6months of being at your first unit you can be put out on failure to adapt. Which still show you didn't try to me. But a Veteran and a Combat Veteran still are the same and should be shown the same respect.

Response by SGT James Young made May 8 at 2018 10:30 PM

2018-05-08T22:30:08-04:00

Great read!

Response by SFC Arthur Morgan made Oct 19 at 2020 10:04 PM

2020-10-19T22:04:06-04:00

An Awesome Essay on the whole 'veteran' question (nonsense) brought up usually, by unlearned. Thank you and Well Said!

Response by 1stSgt Michael Shafer made Nov 4 at 2020 1:25 AM

2020-11-04T01:25:22-05:00

Well said brother!

Response by CPL Christopher Trafnik made Dec 23 at 2020 8:05 AM

2020-12-23T08:05:16-05:00

I feel the same way.

Response by SSG Greg Miech made Jan 18 at 2021 3:46 PM

2021-01-18T15:46:51-05:00

It takes 5-6 soldiers to support one Infantry Soldier. Those 5-6 soldiers, airmen, sailors and such make where the modern infantry can perform their job. Each are Veterans in war and peace time. The ones in country are the Combat Veterans. Some foreign units use less or none at all but unusual like the legion. I think it also hits on a subject even for the Combat Veterans they feel something is missing they could of done better, achieved or regretted not accomplishing like schools, awards and such. Think about the ones in convoys that were killed and even one that was captured in the first Gulf War. They are veterans as well.

Response by SPC Greg Cunningham made Feb 21 at 2021 11:34 PM

2021-02-21T23:34:33-05:00

We recognized the uniform they wore while serving, (and they did wear the uniform, putting theirs uniform on with the same pride and concern, trepidation of the unknown what fate had in-store for them. Yet now there are those that choose to spit hairs, try to demean others who service our country. Why not have their back! If they served, they did serve! They should be just as much your brother now as before Departing military service. Honor all who honorable and to the best of their abilities served. After service is a very tough time for all Veteran’s! maybe if instead of picking at them, you let them know they are still your brothers regardless branch of serve or MOS or rank or locations that they served, it might make a big difference to those with badly beaten self esteem.