Veterans losing gun rights because of VA reporting... What exactly is the truth and what do you think?

LCpl Brett McMeans — Sat, 25 Apr 2015 15:48:33 -0400

http://www.military.com/daily-news/2015/04/17/senator-veterans-still-losing-gun-rights-because-of-va-reporting.html

Senator: Veterans Still Losing Gun Rights Because of VA Reporting

Debate whether vets who can't manage their benefits should be considered "mentally defective" and barred from buying guns resumes.

Response by SPC David Shaffer made Apr 22 at 2015 2:03 PM

SPC David Shaffer — Wed, 22 Apr 2015 14:03:06 -0400

I have already lost mine. If I would not have signed mine away, I would have been denied benefits.

Response by CW2 Joseph Evans made Apr 25 at 2015 4:11 PM

CW2 Joseph Evans — Sat, 25 Apr 2015 16:11:06 -0400

This type of propaganda only does two things, increase gun sales among veterans and cuts VA costs by ensuring a lot of Veterans don't seek help. Neither of which is good for Veterans, especially when taken in tandem.

I do tend to think this is rarer than the media tends to make it, but I also know what kind of damage a single individual with access to a mailing list can do, or worse, someone who writes policy.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Apr 25 at 2015 4:11 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Sat, 25 Apr 2015 16:11:51 -0400

Managing benefits is a poor litmus test and is not appropriate because there are no correlations to gun ownership most of the time. The military, VA, and possibly SS often put vets in a financial bind. That is a false test.

Response by Sgt Jay Jones made Apr 25 at 2015 4:54 PM

Sgt Jay Jones — Sat, 25 Apr 2015 16:54:54 -0400

Well, I'm in this situation. VA told me I was incompetent to handle my affairs. I cannot make financial decisions over $50.00. I had to sell my Colt Python 357 Magnum with it's 2 1/2 inch barrel. I have Dementia, knowing that my mind can snap at any moment. I decided my family's safety was more importantly than my 2nd Amendment rights.

Response by SPC David Shaffer made Apr 25 at 2015 6:13 PM

SPC David Shaffer — Sat, 25 Apr 2015 18:13:48 -0400

If you are decided unfit to handle your money, you are also forced to sign your gun ownership rights aways. If you do not then you won't get paid. I know for a fact this is true.

David Shaffer

Response by Sgt Charles A Vroman Jr made Apr 25 at 2015 6:30 PM

Sgt Charles A Vroman Jr — Sat, 25 Apr 2015 18:30:11 -0400

I've seen this happen to a couple of Brothers. The whole idea behind this, in my opinion, is/was to reduce the severity/chance of an armed insurrection. Again, that is my opinion. Maybe they had good intentions, but as we all know, the road to Hell is paved with good intentions. However, I do believe that it is highly unconstitutional to relieve someone of their constitutionally protected rights via loopholes and bureaucracy. The idea, to me, that the government, in any capacity, could possibly NOT mismanage a Veteran's benefits is like trying to smell the color 9.

Response by SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. made Apr 25 at 2015 8:40 PM

SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. — Sat, 25 Apr 2015 20:40:49 -0400

I guess this needs to be hashed out again ...

These people have (rightly or wrongly) been adjudicated as incompetent.
Incompetent people have their civil rights removed by legal action.
You know what? They can't vote either.
That's the whole story folks.
It's not a 2nd Amendment issue because these people no longer have the right(s).
If anything it is a 4th Amendment issue as a "due process" issue.
Now that's something that is discussable.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Apr 25 at 2015 8:52 PM

Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS — Sat, 25 Apr 2015 20:52:01 -0400

A friend of mine had this happen to her. She received a letter one day, saying her affairs were being shifted, et al. That's a scary letter considering all the implications. Took 6 months to get the rescinding notice, and over a year to get everything really cleared up.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 25 at 2015 11:41 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 25 Apr 2015 23:41:13 -0400

I think it's un-Constitutional no due process to remove the Right to bear arms, only a simple correlation between it and a VA ruling of care. All administrative law is on shaky Constitutional ground in my eyes, there is no separation of power, they create their own laws then enforce them and then adjudicate with very limited actual judicial review.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 26 at 2015 10:42 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 26 Apr 2015 10:42:37 -0400

Holder doesn't care. He is as corrupt as they come.

Response by SPC Carl K. made Apr 26 at 2015 11:25 AM

SPC Carl K. — Sun, 26 Apr 2015 11:25:09 -0400

I believe it was Senator Diane Feinstein who suggested that all veterans returning from combat theaters should be labeled as having PTSD, and therefore lose their Second Amendment rights based on psychological grounds. Perhaps the VA is working to carry out her plan.

I, personally, would never utilize the VA for any kind of psychological treatment for this reason and several others. To be honest, my experience with the VA medical service has been sub-par, and I would have to suspect that the psychological department is likely as bad or worse.

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 26 at 2015 1:08 PM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 26 Apr 2015 13:08:55 -0400

I think the VA, and all medical providers, have a responsibility to report via the appropriate channels if they feel someone is a danger to themselves or others.

I'm sorry to say this but I don't want a manic depressive with homicidal or suicidal thoughts running around my town with weapons, regardless of their military status. God forbid something "really bad" (and I mean "really bad") happens......then everyone would be demanding to know why concerns were not reported.

The Medical Field does have a responsibility to its patients to provide the best care possible and protect their privacy, but they also have a responsibility to the general public to report and prevent threats to the community.

For example....if you go for an eye exam and are found to be clinically blind the doctor is required to report this to the DMV so that your driving privileges can be addressed.

Anyway my point is this.....the current system may not be perfect, but just like with eyesight there are mechanisms in place to fight the doctor's recommendation if you do not agree with it and have privileges restored.

Does the process need to be addressed and clarified.......HELL YES IT DOES......but we need to accept that these policies are in place to protect the greater good.....not punish the individual.

Response by CPL Brian Clouser made Apr 26 at 2015 1:58 PM

CPL Brian Clouser — Sun, 26 Apr 2015 13:58:23 -0400

I use the V.A. since 2008 and I haven't been ask if I have and guns at home or not. Nor have I heard of anyone being ask that. With today climate I have no doubt that somewhere there are V.A. that are stepping on a brother( and sister) 2nd amendment right. By the way, if I'm ever ask I'll make one phone call and there would not guns or ammo at my home

"The right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." Its does not say unless V.A. deem one's unfit.

Response by SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. made Apr 28 at 2015 2:25 PM

SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. — Tue, 28 Apr 2015 14:25:39 -0400

COL Ted Mc and I have been having a discussion down in one of the threads about how exactly the VA can get someone judged incompetent and how this impacts a veterans civil right (to include the 2nd amendment).

So I did some digging and this is what I found.
I hope this sheds some light on this "process"

http://www.benefits.va.gov/fiduciary/beneficiary.asp
and
http://helpdesk.vetsfirst.org/index.php?pg=kb.page&id=2033

The folks at TAH have done a pretty good job at reducing the legal jargon
http://thisainthell.us/blog/?p=34265

I hope this helps.

Beneficiary - Fiduciary

beneficiary

Response by PO1 John Miller made May 2 at 2015 7:26 AM

PO1 John Miller — Sat, 02 May 2015 07:26:03 -0400

They haven't come to take my guns and they haven't asked if I own any. When I have been asked about firearm ownership (by other "authorities" such as my kid's pediatrician) my answer is "none of your business."

Response by Sgt Jay Jones made May 6 at 2015 10:52 PM

Sgt Jay Jones — Wed, 06 May 2015 22:52:28 -0400