Was there ever a time when PEBD was determined upon contracting into ROTC?

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 06 Aug 2020 12:24:13 -0400

I have a friend who commissioned in 2009, contracted with ROTC in 2006. The story goes that when he first commissioned, he noticed his PEBD was his contracting date rather than commissioning date. The DFAS folks at the time told him that was accurate. Now, 10 years later, someone at HRC picked up on the "error" and he owes over $30,000 back pay. I don't know if it's relevant, but he has been USAR this whole time and is now a MAJ. The result of his pay being withheld while still being taxed as if he were getting paid fully is that he now ends up paying money each month to go to drill.

To me, it doesn't sound like there is a whole lot he can do about it, but I wanted to do my due diligence to see if anyone in the community has experienced something similar or knows something that might help him out. That's a pretty massive debt.

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 6 at 2020 12:34 PM

COL Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 06 Aug 2020 12:34:37 -0400

That seems to be an unusually large debt for a PEBD difference. I don’t know if ROTC contract date was ever used for PEBD, though I know it was (and may still be) used for “DIEMS” (Date Initially Entered Military Service) for non-prior service folks for purposes of which retirement system/calculation applies.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 6 at 2020 12:45 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 06 Aug 2020 12:45:20 -0400

The contracting date is the PEBD only when the Soldier participated in Simultaneous Membership Program.

Unfortunately, this error is extremely common and not usually discovered till retirement. Fortunately, it’s common enough that there is a simple fix to it. Have the Soldier contact DFAS in order to submit the request to waive the debt. It’s a fairly straight forward process that DFAS approves all the time. However, the law is that they cannot do it automatically, the Soldier must make the request.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 6 at 2020 2:48 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 06 Aug 2020 14:48:26 -0400

Educate me here. Why does it matter what the PBED date is relative to Commissioning Date? PBED is entry date in the Army pay system regardless of how much one get's paid, correct? It's just that date at which they are able to start incurring payments from. I "enlisted" and my PBED date is my enlistment date. From that period until my commissioning date I was paid as enlisted. Then 4 years later I commissioned. So PBED and Commission Date do not match.

Was the MAJ of this topic paid as an LT in the period between his contract date of 2006 and his commission date of 2009? Why is the basis of owing $30K not having matching dates? Was that number reached by pulling pay history deposited into the SM's account and comparing it against this Cadet grade at the time?

I generally think this shouldn't impact me, and I have nothing to worry about, but technically my PBED date is 4 years prior to my commission date, and well, the Army is the Army, and I don't put anything past it.

*****
I spent 2+ years going over monthly financial pay numbers for my soldiers every month, and put my name on it vouching for it. The report was complete gibberish. I'm only comparing it against my 20 years in finance and MBA/CFA. It was on par with a General Ledger and thousands of numbers. What am I supposed to do with that mess?

Could I have potentially caught something to protect my ROTC cadets from this future nonsense? Even myself, and fellow officers?

Response by CPT Carolyn Andrews made Aug 6 at 2020 6:02 PM

CPT Carolyn Andrews — Thu, 06 Aug 2020 18:02:34 -0400

Wow
That's terrible. Who assigned him to the contacting date vs commission date should be the one countable and not him.
I did early entry; after a year my early entry date became my pay date, PEBD.
I would make the person who told me that was right, to pay the amount.

Response by LTC John Griscom made Aug 6 at 2020 11:09 PM

LTC John Griscom — Thu, 06 Aug 2020 23:09:37 -0400

Didn't apply when I was commissioned in 1964 and I contracted in 1962.
He needs to get such good advice from the JAG and start a dialog with DFAS. If they are taking back money he paid taxes on, there needs to be some review and adjustments.
Just my opinion, but he should not be paying for someone else's screwup.

Response by CPT Lawrence Cichelli made Aug 7 at 2020 10:57 AM

CPT Lawrence Cichelli — Fri, 07 Aug 2020 10:57:37 -0400

Nope. ROTC time does NOT count, PEBD starts when you get commissioned. ROTC Cadets are not subject to UCMJ and other legal matters, contracted or not. If he collected pay based on years of service because of the wrong PEBD, that could explain why he owes this money. He also has only himself to blame by not investigating this. You are responsible for your own career.

Response by LTC John Griscom made Aug 7 at 2020 1:42 PM

LTC John Griscom — Fri, 07 Aug 2020 13:42:30 -0400

He is not the one who entered the date in his records. Some finance cleck had to have entered it in the records. It would be interesting to see if the same thing happened to people who entered at the same time and location.