What advice do you have when a squad leader and team leader are not on the same page?

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 14:13:34 -0500

What to do when a SL and TL cant seem to have cohesion, have huge different views on things, and can't see eye to eye? Ik some solutions but would like some extra guidance on the matter. Also on what to do when your SL cannot uphold the same standard as you do as a team leader?

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 2 at 2020 2:15 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 14:15:55 -0500

So is the SL just big headed and not doing things to standard/doctrine? An “example” would help.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 2 at 2020 2:18 PM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 14:18:37 -0500

Honestly depends on the situation, but examples would definitely help.

Response by MSG Danny Mathers made Feb 2 at 2020 2:42 PM

MSG Danny Mathers — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 14:42:52 -0500

Just drive on and never lower your standards to anyone. I went through the same experience several lifetimes ago. I out soldiered my SL and got promoted. He was moved to another company within the battalion with a low efficient report. He was a generation older than me and retired as a SSG. I became promotable SSG (P) before he left for CONUS

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 2 at 2020 2:46 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 14:46:47 -0500

Continue to practice and express the Army Values, and do not complain to subordinates and peers - simply ask for their advise and input (like this thread). Two leaders not on the same page can create a disturbed atmosphere where all members are just counting hours and minutes until COB. Considering the SL is in a position of greater responsibility, remain tactful at all times. However, do not be afraid to give your opinion, execute orders with precision, and lead by example. If the SL’s decisions are unethical, immoral and puts someone’s’ life at risk, then immediately stand in. Your chain of command will support you. If the SL is just inexperienced and immature, then guide him/her in the right direction (others will notice). However, they will also notice if you purposefully let him/her fail. If you have presented yourself as a true leader, those behind you will follow suit and back you up. Now, if the SL and TL just don’t see eye to eye on some matters, remember he/she is in a position of authority and you will have to execute given orders. Voice your concerns using facts and supporting information that’s displays an alternate decision/action will be better for the group or Soldiers. Don’t simply go against decisions just because you would attack a problem set a different way. I would always approach it in a ‘Rule of Three’ manner. If I don’t agree with a decision, I would approach a leader with supporting information on how we could address a situation a different way three times always using safety, security, ethics, and morals, sprinkled with doctrine, policy, and regulation. This can work in any setting. If the SL wants to drive-on with the initial plan, then make the best of it. Try not to insult or degrade the plan in front of others, but simple ask your subordinates and peers how could it be better and then give examples. One on one disagreements can go sour with a superior, however, if presented by a group, the SL or any leader will be more open to change.

Hope this helps.

Response by Maj John Bell made Feb 2 at 2020 4:04 PM

Maj John Bell — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 16:04:55 -0500

As a subordinate, you do the best you are able with the soldiers under your command. Unless the Squad Leader gives direction that is illegal, against command policy, or counter to the commander's intent the Squad Leader is the problem of the Plt Sgt and the Plt Ldr.

Response by LTC Jason Mackay made Feb 2 at 2020 5:09 PM

LTC Jason Mackay — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 17:09:12 -0500

Great news! Unless it’s illegal immoral dangerous or just plain stupid, SL wins everytime. Army of the Potomac Poker rules apply.

Otherwise need some examples.

Response by SFC James Welch made Feb 2 at 2020 5:28 PM

SFC James Welch — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 17:28:51 -0500

A squad Leader is the Platoon Sgts problem!

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 2 at 2020 5:31 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 17:31:07 -0500

Squad Leader has more stripes, so tact is needed.
Best approach is to make your team rock solid and competent. It helps him, it helps you, it helps the unit. Some times you can talk to each other about what works and what doesn't; sometimes you can't. But results speak volumes.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Feb 2 at 2020 6:12 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Sun, 02 Feb 2020 18:12:36 -0500

What exactly is causing this friction?

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 3 at 2020 7:29 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 03 Feb 2020 19:29:46 -0500

Be adults and find a common ground depending on the situation

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 3 at 2020 11:19 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 03 Feb 2020 23:19:38 -0500

Is your standard the benchmark, or is the Army Standard? It is an important distinction. Influencing a leader from a subordinate position is an art, but first, know that "following" is the foundation of Leadership. Most conflict that I see in young leaders is that they approach the relationship from an adversarial perspective, rather than a cooperative perspective. Try being the best "six" that a leader can have, even if the current Squad Leader does not appreciate you having his/her back, others will see it. It may take a while, or never happen. The only control that you have is over yourself, outside of that, you only have varying degrees of influence.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 5 at 2020 12:31 PM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 05 Feb 2020 12:31:44 -0500

as annoying as it may be, if the orders are lawful "Roger Sarn't" is really your only option. If he's failing as a SL, do your best to protect your fire team and work within the orders of SL.
If platoon and company leadership is on point, a shitty Squad leader wont last long.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 7 at 2020 1:24 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 07 Feb 2020 13:24:32 -0500

What I would do is have a serious heart to heart with the young Squad Leader. Inform him or her that their behavior, flippant attitude and especially the fratenerazation with other members of the Platoon or Company will not be tolerated. Let this be a "come to Jesus" warning and inform them that if the behavior continues, they will be reading about it in a counseling recommending them for an Article 15.

Response by SFC Casey O'Mally made Feb 7 at 2020 1:53 PM

SFC Casey O'Mally — Fri, 07 Feb 2020 13:53:47 -0500

I assume you are the TL in question, and the SL is your SL. In that case, lawful orders are lawful orders. That doesn't mean you can't go above and beyond with your team. And if it becomes an insurmoutable obstacle, try sitting down with SL behind closed doors and hashing out differences, as well as communicating expectations. It is perfectly OK for you to have and communicate expectations of your leaders... As long as you do so tactfully and respectfully. The leader has no requirement to MEET those expectations, but sometimes letting your senior know you expect more from them lights the proverbial fire under the 4th point.

Response by 1SG Roy Evans made Feb 12 at 2020 11:42 PM

1SG Roy Evans — Wed, 12 Feb 2020 23:42:14 -0500

First of all you have stated that you are a team leader so you need to lead a team under the squad leader directive and stay at your level on the command you may make thing real difficult by making it seem your leader is not compentet

Response by 1SG Rick Seekman made Mar 27 at 2020 7:43 PM

1SG Rick Seekman — Fri, 27 Mar 2020 19:43:18 -0400

SL wins!

Response by 1SG David Hoogendorn made Apr 22 at 2020 12:04 AM

1SG David Hoogendorn — Wed, 22 Apr 2020 00:04:50 -0400

Request from him/her a sit down and start over fresh. If you are the subordinate to the Squad leader in question then his/her goals and priorities are yours as well as long as they are moral and ethical and in line with tdd he unit. If that doesn't work request a meeting with the PSG to work out the issues.

To answer your second question, it's not your job to judge your superior's performance. If you are upholding Army and unit standards then simply continue to and the rest will eventually work itself out. Good luck.

Response by SGM Jeff Bullard made Sep 15 at 2020 11:03 PM

SGM Jeff Bullard — Tue, 15 Sep 2020 23:03:37 -0400

No matter the situation the SL wins due to rank and general military authority. When trying to get a point across to your SL you must use tact. Always be professional and never talk negatively about your SL especially to your Soldiers.

Response by 1SG Rick Seekman made Sep 20 at 2020 5:34 AM

1SG Rick Seekman — Sun, 20 Sep 2020 05:34:42 -0400

definitely consult the PSG if you're not able to work this out..