What are your views on the rank of Corporal in the Army? Useful or unnecessary? Why do you think so?

2015-02-06T13:27:32-05:00

My CSM is wanting to pin me CPL next month and I am not sure how I feel about it. I have seen the disdain that Line units have for CPLs, but I also understand that in certain places and times, the rank has its uses. So what do y'all think?

Response by PO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 1:30 PM

2015-02-06T13:30:23-05:00

That is so odd to hear disdain in line units for a Corporal? Unheard of in the Navy (PO3) and Marine Corps. Why would there be disdain for an NCO?

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 1:41 PM

2015-02-06T13:41:43-05:00

I wasn't in the Army but the Corps and my experience working with the Army in Djibouti Africa was a lack of respect for rank. Calling a SSGT a Sergeant really got under ny nerves and the fact they never stood in parade rest did as well. Given they were reservists but I told them acter speaking with there Staff Sergeant how to be respectful and not look like a pile of manure to others that don't them. I did meet on Corporal in the Army while there and he was the onky one that didn't act like an e1 To me army ranks carry no weight just like the navy. Or that's how I feel after working with a few of them. I think the Army needs rank structure and for the sake of the service delete specialist as a rank.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Feb 6 at 2015 1:44 PM

2015-02-06T13:44:25-05:00

I don't understand why there are Specialists & Corporals.

My father & mother were both Air Force, and my dad once explained why they got rid of the "Buck" Sergeant (E4) / Airman 1st Class thing. (or is it Senior Airman, I can't keep it straight)

His take was, why should they both be getting paid the same, when one has more responsibility?

That said, I was a Corporal. Wouldn't have traded it for the world.

But if your CSM thinks making you an NCO would be a good role, why the heck not take him up on it? Why worry about what anyone else thinks.

Response by 1SG Steven Stankovich made Feb 6 at 2015 1:51 PM

2015-02-06T13:51:22-05:00

I believe that CPL is an important rank depending on your MOS. Let me explain. As an Infantryman, Scout, or other Combat Arms MOS (I say this based on my background and my experience as a 19D CPL many moons ago), your Chain of Command feel that you possess the qualities that are required to lead other Soldiers. While you may not have enough points to be promoted to SGT, they believe that you are there. You may be placed in a Team Leader position where you are in charge of two or three other Soldiers. Those stripes carry weight that SPCs do not have. I believe that is a great honor and with it comes a lot or responsibility.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 1:56 PM

2015-02-06T13:56:29-05:00

If you have seen disdain for some CPL's then those CPL's probably weren't very good. But, if your CSM wants to give you CPL, then he sees something great in you. Take those 2 stripes and do them and your CSM proper justice and do the job the best you can. Chances are, you will have Soldiers under you when that happens, so just make sure you take care of your Soldiers as best as you can, and your Soldiers will take care of you.

Response by MSgt Michael Durkee made Feb 6 at 2015 1:59 PM

2015-02-06T13:59:48-05:00

I dealt with basically the same issue, SrA vs. Sgt, but that was resolved...6 months shy of transitioning from SrA to Sgt, the Air Force did away with it. Cue sad trombone sound.
But yes, I really do wonder about having a same pay grade with increased responsibility, looking over the table at a friend that was a Specialist and now a Corporal...ugh.

Response by WO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 2:06 PM

2015-02-06T14:06:48-05:00

I wore CPL for around 3 months. The biggest thing on making a CPL is a supporting NCO channel. It was hard at first since most of the SPC I was in charge had more TIG/TIS. But a quick boot in the rear from the PLT SGT on them understanding the new leadership and ensuring that I knew the responsibility of the rank. Its very difficult at first, but it showed me a lot before pinning SGT. Take it as an honor that your chain has decided to make you an NCO. Don't think of it as becoming a CPL, but becoming and NCO. When in charge, be in charge.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 2:19 PM

2015-02-06T14:19:03-05:00

I'm a bit confused over the situation where you are being pinned CPL but are not yet a SPC. CPL is a lateral promotion so I can only assume you are being made a SPC then being appointed as a CPL because you are fulfilling a Team Leader/2 level position that currently no SGT is holding. Is that the case? Alternatively perhaps you are required to sign documents that require a NCO's signature? The only issue I've ever had with the CPL rank itself is that depending on the unit, the requirements to obtain it renders it an incredibly temporary 'promotion' that is usually replaced within a month or two with SGT.

Past unit requirement was that only SPC (P) individuals were allowed be CPLs. Once they became SPC (P), and were sitting in a Team Leader position, these individuals were usually in low cut-off score MOS. No sooner did you do the paperwork to give them CPL, the Soldier was now a SGT.

Response by WO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 2:39 PM

2015-02-06T14:39:44-05:00

Side note: I may have asked this already but what is a PFC (P)?.....

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 3:07 PM

2015-02-06T15:07:30-05:00

If you are getting placed in a leadership position then yes I like the corporal rank. Unfortunately, in my experience from being non combat arms, 99.9% of the corporals I have seen is either a consolation prize for not being able to get the points for SGT or just for no reason at all

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 3:34 PM

2015-02-06T15:34:13-05:00

Take it. It can't hurt you any to have an NCOER as an E4 rather than a SPC Evaluation. and heres an interesting tidbit for the rest of us:

On 1 July 1955, three grades of Specialist were established: Specialist Three (E-4), Specialist Two (E-5), and Specialist One (E-6). In 1958 the DoD added three additional pay grades to give enlisted soldiers more opportunities to progress to a full career with additional opportunities for promotion. Thus the recognition was changed to six specialist ranks, and the paygrade was tied into the rank designation: Specialist Four (E-4), Specialist Five (E-5), Specialist Six (E-6), and Master Specialists (E-7), (E-8) and (E-9) [3]. In 1968 when the Army added the rank of Command Sergeant Major, the specialist ranks at E-8 and E-9 were abolished without anyone ever being promoted to those levels. In 1978 the specialist rank at E-7 was discontinued and in 1985, the specialist ranks at E-5 and E-6 were discontinued.

Having been a SPC myself, I can only imagine the shamming that went on as Master Specialist....

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Feb 6 at 2015 3:34 PM

2015-02-06T15:34:16-05:00

Corporal is a blessing and a curse. Depending on your MOS, those hard stripes are a God send for CSM's caught in a tight spot. They get to use you in an NCO slot and possibly free up another NCO for a greater position of responsibility, instead of bringing in a new player and possibly disrupting a great cohesive unit. It is also a trial by fire position for the Corporal. You will be part of an exclusive membership of used and abused fellow members. All the responsibilities, all of the duties, all of the "good fun ribbing". It does make the transition easier to wearing those hard stripes. I just never knew of someone to go from PFC directly to Corporal before now.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 6:00 PM

2015-02-06T18:00:38-05:00

It's an honer, it says you stand out from your peers and clearly demonstrate leadership qualities.

Response by CW5 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 6 at 2015 6:37 PM

2015-02-06T18:37:24-05:00

I see the rank of Corporal as an honor, SPC Private RallyPoint Member. I assume you'll be in a leadership position as a Corporal, right? Again, things must have changed since I was in, because back in my day being a Corporal was something people sought after. I would have loved the opportunity. Plus, if your CSM wants to promote you to Corporal ... Well, I say go for it!

Response by SPC(P) Jay Heenan made Feb 6 at 2015 8:10 PM

2015-02-06T20:10:19-05:00

Strange, it is still 'my day' and I have never heard of a PFC going directly to a Corporal. A Corporal isn't something that gets pinned. You become a Specialist, and once you are ready to be a Sergeant (typically after going to the promotion board), then they do a 4187 to laterally promote you to Corporal. It is not actually a promotion. A Corporal is actually considered a NCO, they are in a leadership role and just waiting to pin on their '5'. This is typically a Company level move...

That all being the same, you don't have any Specialists in your Platoon or are you just that much better than all of them? Not trying to be a jerk, just trying to understand.

But hey, what do I know...

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 7 at 2015 7:42 AM

2015-02-07T07:42:18-05:00

I personally am not a fan of the corporal. They usually do not truly break away from their peers like a sergeant (at least the sergeant should). They hang out and are buddies with their Soldiers and then when they try and exert their authority the Soldiers don't give them any respect. Other NCOs don't usually treat the corporal as an NCO which is a big cause of the last point I made.

I had my battalion commander hold the authority for appointing corporals at his level. The 1SG and PSG would come to me with the 4187 and we would discuss it. The basic standard was completion of SSD 1, attendance to the board and recommendation for promotion.

Don't get me wrong I have seen some very good corporals and if you are truly dedicated to being a NCO it's a step in the right direction.

Response by SGT Jim Z. made Feb 7 at 2015 7:48 AM

2015-02-07T07:48:25-05:00

Reading a question and the answers in this topic is one of the reasons I joined RallyPoint. There is history involved, comments about pros and cons that will help young PFC (P)Intalino Pietrantonio

Response by SSG Aubrey Smith made Feb 7 at 2015 8:02 AM

2015-02-07T08:02:38-05:00

He wants you their because you display leadership quality, and when you have someone with that kind of experience, take in the knowledge and start molding your troops into high speed soldiers. And remember there's know such thing as a stupid question, not asking is stupid.

Response by CPL Rick Stasny made Feb 7 at 2015 11:51 AM

2015-02-07T11:51:16-05:00

Take on those stripes with pride, it's just another step towards your future. Still not sure? Look at it this way, Hitler was a Corporal and he destroyed most of Europe. How much damage could you possibly do. Lol

Response by SSG Dennis Mackey made Jul 26 at 2017 8:51 AM

2017-07-26T08:51:18-04:00

Technically your not getting promoted your getting a title but your chain of command feels you stand out among your peers and that is a leadership position more responsibility but when you go to the promotion board and a sp4 goes you have a little edge considering if your in a team leader slot and been performing as a team leader

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 19 at 2017 10:39 AM

2017-08-19T10:39:59-04:00

I think the rank is very useful and a good management tool. It should not be treated as some prize or privilege, but rather because the person adequately fills an NCO position. If the slot isn't on the MTOE, you ain't getting it. On the other hand, you also don't need to go to a board. It's a lateral appointment, not a promotion.

I also disagree with the people who think its a curse of some kind; you're probably already doing the job that goes with it. If you're on the ass-to-seat roster as a TC/VC or a team leader, you are there. We are all working a position ahead these days. The corporal rank gives competent E4's the legal authority of the NCO.

Response by SGT Aric Lier made Nov 24 at 2017 10:05 AM

2017-11-24T10:05:29-05:00

I was laterally promoted to cpl by Gen taylor and Im pretty proud of that.... sure made my 5 pretty fast after but Its a compliment to you. csm is saying we trust you to do the job now.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 18 at 2018 7:26 PM

2018-04-18T19:26:40-04:00

Yeah, brother. See it as an opportunity to shine and get tasks completed your way. I have a corporal as one of my team leaders and his along with my other team leader's (SPC(P)) higher maturity levels compared to the others are noticeable and show the reason why they are in that position. Putting on those stripes is a way of making your authority ''official'' so that others take you seriously when telling them what to do. You are a first line supervisor that should push the tasks down from what your squad leader issued out and then supervise those tasks while the squad leader is the overall supervisor. The only way you will be overloaded as a corporal is if you have a lazy squad leader who wants to push all his work on you. I'm 38 and I'm in the grind with everybody else as much as I can.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Apr 18 at 2018 10:55 PM

2018-04-18T22:55:21-04:00

Look, the reasons is twofold- 1, It means that they think you should be an NCO, something that SPC's are NOT. 2. It is a lateral transfer- to have 2 choices- do will and make SGT, do poorly and get busted to SPC- no loss of pay. I never looked down at CPL's case it meant the 1SG/CSM convinced the Commander that they had a live one. You are the junior NCO- lowest of the low- but it gives you and the unit a chance to see what you are made of before making a serious mistake with you.