What do you do when a soldier files an IG complaint against you?

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:25:19 -0500

A soldier goes to ig on you after him being in your shop for 5 weeks. He receives a counseling for disrespecting a senior NCO and one for disobeying a lawful order. He is an e4 and the NCO is an e6. What happens?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 12:28 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:28:36 -0500

My first question would be: Did he follow his chain of command? IE (PSG/1SG/CO). In my experience if he hasn't done that the IG will tell him he needs to do that first and allow the unit an opportunity to correct the issue.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 12:28 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:28:41 -0500

Spell my name right.

I know its only 3 letters, but dont humiliate yourself if you cant do that.

Just have your counselings tight and you got nothing to worrie about. Brushed off like a bad dandruff day... Sounds like we need harder PT!!!

Response by SSG Glen Krinsky made Jan 8 at 2016 12:28 PM

SSG Glen Krinsky — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:28:53 -0500

Let it play out. If you take action, it will not end well for you. If your documentation is in line, you have nothing to worry about.

Response by CMSgt Mark Schubert made Jan 8 at 2016 12:29 PM

CMSgt Mark Schubert — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:29:24 -0500

Nothing - you cannot fix stupid sometimes and you have to let it happen. The other thing you need to do is not worry about anything assuming you have nothing to worry about! :-)

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 12:31 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:31:31 -0500

Nothing, it is his right. Continue operations as normal. Any change in your current routine could be perceived and an attack against him for going to IG. Speak to your 1sg about moving him to another section if you think it is necessary.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 12:32 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:32:35 -0500

Let the IG conduct their investigation and the truth will unfold. If you have done nothing wrong then there should be nothing to worry about.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 12:35 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:35:53 -0500

Sounds like a butt hurt SPC. IG won't waste much time on this one.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 12:39 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:39:43 -0500

Get a lawyer

Response by SSG Randall P. made Jan 8 at 2016 12:41 PM

SSG Randall P. — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:41:10 -0500

I've seen a lot about keeping your counseling's strait. Make sure you close out the previous month. Not insulting your intelligence, SSG, I just know that it is important.

Response by SSG Byron Hewett made Jan 8 at 2016 12:48 PM

SSG Byron Hewett — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:48:00 -0500

make sure you have all incidents well documented just remember C.Y.A. (cover your ass) document, document, document.

Response by SFC Pete Kain made Jan 8 at 2016 12:54 PM

SFC Pete Kain — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:54:31 -0500

There are latrines to be cleaned and trash to be hauled. Glad you found a volunteer.

Response by SSG Audwin Scott made Jan 8 at 2016 12:55 PM

SSG Audwin Scott — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 12:55:25 -0500

Just make sure all your ducks are in order i.e counseling statements etc.

Response by MSG Jason Sikes made Jan 8 at 2016 1:20 PM

MSG Jason Sikes — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 13:20:19 -0500

Being an IG, any Soldiers can come talk with the IG. We will then ask, "have you talked with the chain of command." Ultimately the command team can fix the problem. There is no need for lawyers, at this point. Once all facts are compiled the IG will advise the command i.e: 15-6, commanders inquirer. But the commander has UCMJ authority, not IG. Hope this helps.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 1:39 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 13:39:54 -0500

All the IG does is ensure that the regulations are followed and advise the commander when a different course of action is warranted.
So for the NCO, nothing unless he was wrong. At which point, he gets corrected and moves out smartly.
For the Soldier, by bringing this to a higher level, he is probably going to draw some scrutiny that he doesn't want if he is in the wrong. If he's right and some injustice occurred, then it'll be addressed by the commander.

But over a counseling statement? Really?
Sounds like a tempest in a teapot to me.

Response by Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth made Jan 8 at 2016 2:26 PM

Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 14:26:15 -0500

DO NOT RETALIATE! Just don't go looking for any reason to discipline...and especially don't mention the IG. If you do even in passing and you discipline whether righteous or not, the two can be linked together. If I had a dime for every time a complaint was filed in my chain of command...I could finance a campaign. If you did what you did and it was all legal, the IG will dismiss it as they see this type of stuff all the time and can filter it out pretty good. But you cannot even the score for him going to the IG, it is his legal right...they will work it out.
However, you can and should (it is your responsibility) continue to discipline if it is a continued behavior and is prejudicial to good order and discipline of the unit. Others will see that you aren't disciplining, looking the other way and it will go south real quick.Start over, let the IG visit go but maintain that good order and discipline. Keep it to the facts, document, and follow up.

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made Jan 8 at 2016 3:25 PM

CPT Mark Gonzalez — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 15:25:51 -0500

If you are being impartial and enforcing standards you will have IG complaints filed against you sometimes. It is sad to say, but in my opinion it proves you are doing your job as an NCO to hurt someone's feelings when necessary.

Anyone can go to IG and the IG may contact you or your supervisors to gain initial information. This does not mean you are under investigation. You will be notified formally if so and you will be formally notified of the outcome. Just ensure future actions could not be misconstrued as reprisal and do your job.

Response by CPT Pedro Meza made Jan 8 at 2016 4:37 PM

CPT Pedro Meza — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 16:37:09 -0500

The only thing that you can do is be honest with the IG when they come asking, and always have witness when you deal with this soldier, because most times it is a case of perception and left be honest we do have soldiers with mental issues and NCOes too.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 5:17 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 17:17:43 -0500

Thanks everyone for the input. Paperwork is good. Everything is good to go. Never ever even came close to a situation like this but one guy comes along and takes it up the chain. And he did not go up his chain of command he went straight to IG. Did not even tell the E5 that is his first line supervisor. I do believe he will eventually get out of his current assignment

Response by PO1 John Miller made Jan 8 at 2016 5:29 PM

PO1 John Miller — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 17:29:47 -0500

Sounds to me like this Soldier doesn't want to be in the Army anymore.

Response by CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 6:57 PM

CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 18:57:06 -0500

Proceed on with normal activity. The turds always float to the top of the punchbowl.

Response by SCPO Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2016 10:03 PM

SCPO Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 22:03:49 -0500

Five weeks? Don't ever turn your back on him again.

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made Jan 8 at 2016 11:25 PM

CAPT Kevin B. — Fri, 08 Jan 2016 23:25:01 -0500

Great responses regarding letting it ride. I'll add you should be aware of what an IG is, their duties, and their limitations. First, they have no line authority. If they're making an inquiry, it's on behalf of the front office because it is their duty to report if the CoC isn't conducting itself within regulations. Second, if you look at what IGs get in their in box, about 30% are whiners, 30% are confused, and 30% gets a second look. All cases of fraud, waste, and abuse get at least one filtering with the IG, legal, head contracting officer, front office as needed to see if it passes the sniff test. At that point, if there's reason to proceed, the "who" that does the investigation depends. IGs are busy handling the normal getting ready, getting slammed with, or responding for years after whatever the last Command Inspection was. So stuff gets pulled for "Administrative Investigation" or in some cases JAGMAN. Those are done outside of the IG who should be staying arms length away. Discipline is not under the purview of the IG because they have no line authority.

My most interesting IG experience was as an O-2, I had 100% failure on a HQMC IG because I wasn't following their facilities maintenance instruction at all. I didn't suffer because I had an old letter signed by CMC directing MCAB Weatern Area to operate under Navy facilities regulations, which we were. Needless to say, there was significant constipation at Code LFF over it. I just heard rumors there was something political going on in the Annex with the LFF folk getting their buns in a wad because we were different. Typical post Nam REMF mentality.

Response by SSG Clarence Blackburn made Jan 9 at 2016 12:11 AM

SSG Clarence Blackburn — Sat, 09 Jan 2016 00:11:53 -0500

Sounds like this E4 is trying to ruffle your feathers. Don't let him get under your skin, let IG do there thing. If you have dotted your I's and crossed your T's, and have documented all there is nothing to worry about.

Response by SSG Leo Bell made Jan 9 at 2016 6:51 AM

SSG Leo Bell — Sat, 09 Jan 2016 06:51:29 -0500

The E6 was right when he wrote him up. He put it on paper and that is his proof. Then he has another NCO as a witness. So he is covered if the IG wants to ask any questions. As long as they have a copy of the paper work they will be okay.

Response by CPT Bob Moore made Jan 9 at 2016 1:58 PM

CPT Bob Moore — Sat, 09 Jan 2016 13:58:36 -0500

During my time in the military, in the private sector, and in education, I have told people this many times:
If you are doing the right thing, you don't have anything to worry about.

That goes in this case as well. If you are doing the right thing, setting and expecting all soldier to meet appropriate expectations, and acting consistently and within the UCMJ, regulations, Army Values, etc., you shouldn't have much to worry about.

I agree with some of the others that this isn't a time to "pass the trash". One of my greatest accomplishments during my time as an NCO was taking a problem" soldier and helping him turn into a better soldier. Keep him, develop him, hold him to a high standard and help him meet those standard. If the Army isn't the right place for him, be honest about that as well, but do everything you can to help him make a contribution while he is still in.

Response by CW5 Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 9 at 2016 3:53 PM

CW5 Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 09 Jan 2016 15:53:15 -0500

Well, you do nothing but sit back, give whatever facts you are asked about and then drive on. In the end nothing may happen or you may learn something.

Response by PO2 Jeffery Marcussen Sr made Jan 9 at 2016 4:49 PM

PO2 Jeffery Marcussen Sr — Sat, 09 Jan 2016 16:49:18 -0500

i have a question as i never heard of an ig. what is an ig and if the charge is unfounded what does the ig do with the person making an unfounded accusation?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 11 at 2016 6:15 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 11 Jan 2016 18:15:45 -0500

If you did nothing wrong just continue as normal. The IG will decide if there is a case and will conduct the investigation of the is one. E4 better not be playing games.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 12 at 2016 9:57 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 12 Jan 2016 09:57:22 -0500

As long as the punishment fit the crime I don't think you have anything to worry about. Does SM have a history? That should be a thing IG consider

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 12 at 2016 11:57 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 12 Jan 2016 11:57:33 -0500

If you did nothing wrong then don't sweat it. IG will do their job accordingly. Anyone can discuss anything with IG if they feel they have a valid complaint. If not the IG will decide if it is valid or has been handled properly.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 14 at 2016 2:19 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Jan 2016 02:19:13 -0500

The IG should tell the Soldier to go back to his chain of command and NCO support channel to try to resolve the issue. If they feel the Soldier has done everything possible with them, IG may decide to act. Let it go. If you didn't ask the Soldier to do anything illegal, immoral, or unethical, you should be fine.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 25 at 2016 5:46 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 25 Jan 2016 17:46:10 -0500

Stop any and all personal conversation with him, insure someone is around every time communication is going on. Keep a paper trail, and get article 15 happy. Screw the company grades, just give him a summarized each and every time he violated the UCMJ with his conduct. Just make sure you keep a good paper trail after you have created a pattern of misconduct. Summarized are much easier to do, and JAG usually wont help with summarized.

Make sure you close out the counseling and you fill out the leaders responsibilities, after about 2 summarized switch it up. Invite him to dinner, act like your concerned and you want to help him. Chance are he may straightened out if you punish him, than take special care.

Response by SSG Jose Padillajimenez made Feb 7 at 2016 5:31 PM

SSG Jose Padillajimenez — Sun, 07 Feb 2016 17:31:52 -0500

As long as everything is in writing the NCO should be ok something like that happen to me but I had everything on counseling statements and I make notes of everything that happens in my unit for things like this even now that I am out

Response by LTC Paul Heinlein made Apr 14 at 2018 2:45 PM

LTC Paul Heinlein — Sat, 14 Apr 2018 14:45:21 -0400

Enjoy the ride! As long as what you do is legal, ethical, and morally correct you can sleep easy.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Apr 15 at 2018 11:00 AM

SGM Bill Frazer — Sun, 15 Apr 2018 11:00:15 -0400

The IG makes it's investigation, if not proven, the EM can be turned over to command for making a false statement. If proven you will be turned over to the command for counseling or punishment