What exactly does it mean when a Soldier checks the "I disagree with the information above" on a DA 4856?

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Aug 2015 22:57:13 -0400

While this question has been asked before on RallyPoint, that query was met with differing replies. I am hoping to obtain a clear answer based on regulation. I have searched numerous regulations, including FM 6-22 and FM 7-21.13, but to no avail. A senior NCO once told me that the "disagree" block refers only to admin errors. I have also heard a SSG say that it means that you disagree with the "plan of action" based on the factual information presented under "Key Points of Discussion." However, neither NCO could substantiate their personal belief by Army regulation. Can anyone on RP provide a good answer to this question? Thank you very much!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 22 at 2015 11:18 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 22 Aug 2015 23:18:33 -0400

Exactly as mentioned above. It is written above the boxes. The Soldier chooses whether to agree or disagree with the plan of action and chooses to say why. A Soldier may also request a copy of this counseling for their own records. I have seen Soldiers take their counselings to higher Echelon's via the open door policy or jag. If your plan of action had a time frame and a endstate that will benefit the Soldier in a way that relates to the the infraction you have no worries what he does with it.

Response by LTC John Shaw made Aug 22 at 2015 11:28 PM

LTC John Shaw — Sat, 22 Aug 2015 23:28:28 -0400

CPT Private RallyPoint Member The answers provided by SSG Private RallyPoint Member and SSG James J. Palmer IV aka "JP4" are on point.

Response by SMSgt Tony Barnes made Aug 23 at 2015 12:20 AM

SMSgt Tony Barnes — Sun, 23 Aug 2015 00:20:53 -0400

What's a DA 4856? AF minds want to know.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 23 at 2015 12:24 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 23 Aug 2015 00:24:50 -0400

The others have nailed it. They may challenge the factual information on it. But they should make a statement as to why. It also can be used to challenge the play of action. What I do to avoid this I make them create the plan of action with some help. That way if they fail to adhere to it they can't say it wasn't fair. They made it and they should have known what the expectations were. Sometimes they may not know how to do one so you may have to be more engaged with them.

Some think they don't have to sign it so it is not official. It is a old E4 mafia tale. It doesn't work that way. It is far worse. I will let them that of the repercussions of that. They will usually sign it. I try not to let them get to a point where they are hostile in the situation. If it is I will stop and give them a break to cool down and finish after that.

Response by SFC John Birks made Aug 23 at 2015 12:40 AM

SFC John Birks — Sun, 23 Aug 2015 00:40:54 -0400

Yes Ma'am, they disagree with the plan of action. That's it.. Everything else on the NCOER should be fact and not open for debate. I hope this helps. If not, years ago I found a book at the PX that was like a NCOER for dummies book, ( not that you're a dummy) but it explains stuff like that in plain English.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 23 at 2015 8:03 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 23 Aug 2015 08:03:53 -0400

CPT Private RallyPoint Member Without exhaustively reading the other replies, here's my two cents Ma'am. A DA 4856 is a written paper copy of a spoken conversation. The key points of discussion in part III should include enough room to write key points that are discussed as they are touched on. Not a detailed script of what the counselor is going to verbatim say to the counseled individual. The plan of action should also be a collaborative effort. The counseling is developmental; so how can we expect an individual to develop if we don't include them in making decisions that will affect them.

Therefor, there should be no reason for a counseled individual to check that they do not agree. However, if they do, they are still required to sign. The signature denotes that they affirm the conversation took place. If they disagree with what was written in to the form as the conversation unfolded, they have space to add in comments. The point is that if the counseling is done properly, there should be no reason that box should ever be checked.

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made Jan 28 at 2016 9:48 PM

CPT Mark Gonzalez — Thu, 28 Jan 2016 21:48:30 -0500

I would always recommend keeping event oriented counselings short and factual. Less for them to disagree with.

Response by SSG Brian G. made Jun 28 at 2019 8:26 PM

SSG Brian G. — Fri, 28 Jun 2019 20:26:43 -0400

It LITERALLY just means that the SM disagrees with what you the counselor have thus far put on the counseling form as either the cause of the counseling, your findings or your plan of action for them if there is one. By checking the box "disagree" it means they do not agree with you, and nothing else. It holds literally no weight at all. The counseling still stands, the plan of action still stands, the reason FOR the counseling still stands. Them checking the box does not invalidate a thing and does not trigger a review by any command authority and cannot get you the counselor in trouble in any way.