What happens during a team, squad, and platoon live fire?

2018-10-17T12:09:11-04:00

I recently reclassed to 11B, and I got to my unit as they were preparing for deployment, so they have these live fire events going on within a few weeks and I know nothing about what supposed to take place during these events, so I wanted to know if anyone could give me info on it so I could prepare for it. I’m a Sgt and nobody at my company knows that I reclassed, so they kinda expect me to know a lot at this point.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2018 12:36 PM

2018-10-17T12:36:31-04:00

Get with the Training NCO and ask for a copy of the Training Schedule. It should have the tasks and references listed for you. Once you get that: STUDY UP!!!

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2018 12:36 PM

2018-10-17T12:36:43-04:00

I'm not Infantry but my gut instinct is to tell you that you need to talk with your Troops and your higher NCOs to let them know you're a reclass and to get trained up FAST.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2018 2:10 PM

2018-10-17T14:10:36-04:00

This is the exact situation where you need to let people know that you lack experience. You'll be firing live rounds and mistakes get people killed. A buddy of mine got shot in the face in a shoot house during a live fire. No one will respect you less for your inexperience, but you'll lose all your respect if you get someone killed. Set aside your ego and go talk to your squad leader and your team. You will need to practice dry runs with them before you set foot on the live fire range.

Response by SSG Harry Outcalt made Oct 17 at 2018 2:44 PM

2018-10-17T14:44:13-04:00

PLATOON SARGENT , answer to all your questions , don't forget to K.I.S.S. him as a thank you after ... Uuummm, not literally just , keep it simple stupid k.i.s.s.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2018 3:17 PM

2018-10-17T15:17:04-04:00

During the live fire you will conduct a minimum of 4 iterations of the live fire exercise with the size of the element that’s being tested. The first 2 iterations are during the day first is blank then live and if the senior person at the event seems you fit to move on to night shooting without additional training then you wait for the night to come out and the marathon is halfway over. The two night iterations will take place while insuring that no one still has live ammo mixed in with the blank ammo so as not to shoot opfor, in case there are any, then it should run just as smoothly in the night time, or better, as it was in the daytime.

Response by CPT Lawrence Cable made Oct 17 at 2018 4:08 PM

2018-10-17T16:08:39-04:00

OK, if you are a fire team leader, hit your squad leader and Platoon Leader up and be up front about being lost. They get paid to make sure you are trained. Live fires are usually events that have had a substantial train up before committing to troops to the range, so if you weren't there, ask for help. You just entered a world where you have to trust and depend on your teammates, not being straight about your abilities can get people killed.
Go to the training NCO and get a copy of FM3-21.8 The Infantry Platoon and Squad and it's always handy to have a Ranger Handbook (TC3-21.76). The old Infantry Handbook was handy too, but I haven't seen a recent one.

Response by SPC Adam Swineford made Oct 17 at 2018 4:10 PM

2018-10-17T16:10:41-04:00

You definitely need to get involved with your new group and let them know what your experience is and where you lack. I was deployed as an Infantryman, but was originally an MP. Especially other NCOs. I learned a lot in the first few weeks after my reclass and eventually stuck with the brotherhood and learned a new appreciation for combat classes. Talk with them and learn everything you can. They will respect you much more for it later.

Response by MSG Frank Kapaun made Oct 17 at 2018 4:22 PM

2018-10-17T16:22:51-04:00

A whole lot of hurry up and wait followed by a heaping helping of boring, mind numbing safety briefs.

Response by SFC Ralph E Kelley made Oct 17 at 2018 4:40 PM

2018-10-17T16:40:21-04:00

Ask your PSG - I bet he knows ways to help you. Particular focus should be on practical exercises and rehearsal.
Practical exerises are where you present a scenario to your soldiers and have them describe their positions, duties and actions on the objective.
Rehearsals are where you and your soldiers first do a table top rehearsal, then a tape house walkthrough and then a full rehearsal in either the live fire area or in a detailed mockup. The mockup also can be tape house but better if the mock-up is 3D.
Definitely ask for help to perpare yourself.
Watch out for the war-story singers - they will just side track you.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2018 6:12 PM

2018-10-17T18:12:24-04:00

There will be rehearsals before the live fire exercise (LFX). There might be a blank-fire iteration (possibly more than one). The scale and complexity of the LFX will depend on the range itself. Once you go to live rounds, there could be preparatory bombardment, possibly a breach with live explosives, possibly the use of live fragmentation grenades, certainly quite a bit of live small arms fire. As an Infantryman, you will probably be moving across the objective (unless you are support-by-fire). It is important to be where you are supposed to be when you are supposed to be there at every point in the LFX. But again, there should be rehearsal after rehearsal. As a fire-team leader, you will have a squad-leader who should be making sure you understand what's going on.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2018 6:52 PM

2018-10-17T18:52:52-04:00

As a team leader you will need to focus on controlling your teams IMTs, control rates of fire, communicate with squad leader about what is going on. If you have time draw weapons and go out in the woods and practice walking in a wedge and reacting to contact and getting "on line" in a lazy W. Talk to your squad leader about integrating the other team into a full blown battle drill rehearsal.
While you are doing the live fire you will have a safety behind you and they will ensure you don't kill anyone. As long as mistakes wont kill anyone, make them, it's a chance to learn.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2018 6:58 PM

2018-10-17T18:58:43-04:00

Get help w experienced Fire team leaders within your platoon/squad as an former Infantryman we trainee everyone to the same sheet of music. No one will think less, get the FM 3-21.8 Infantry rifle Platoon and squad this will help you a lot!
In the Infantry world the training that you receive is a direct reflection of your Fire team leaders, Squad leaders and Latin Sergeants, they will not lead you astray. I myself am currently trying to get back to the Infantry world. Good luck you will enjoy these “Live Fires” Drills.

Response by SGT Robert Cupp made Oct 17 at 2018 7:51 PM

2018-10-17T19:51:10-04:00

We went through several lanes before we deployed. The main one was practicing battle drill 1. First we did it with nothing, then blanks, and then we fired real bullets at targets while the other squads maneuvered. It’s nothing you don’t do 100 times as an infantryman already. We also fired at targets at night while using nvg’s. It’s nothing too complicated.

Response by SrA John Monette made Oct 17 at 2018 8:02 PM

2018-10-17T20:02:17-04:00

WTF???? why haven't you told them you are a reclass???? pull your head out and tell your higher ups that you don't know what youre doing. I'm sure they would appreciate that info ASAP.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 17 at 2018 10:16 PM

2018-10-17T22:16:49-04:00

Before you get someone killed, talk with your SL and PSG. You need to train with your men before you even do blank runs. You need to do rehearsals prior to leaving for the LFX

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 19 at 2018 12:56 AM

2018-10-19T00:56:08-04:00

Oh boy, this is a LIVE FIRE!!!! You need to tell them. You'll be ok, I did a LFX right after Recruiting Duty, first time as a SL, I feel your pain. But seriously let your SL and PSG know.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 19 at 2018 2:37 PM

2018-10-19T14:37:02-04:00

This is a question that you should have already asked yourself before getting to an infantry unit after reclassing. Depending on what MOS you reclassed from will depend on your level of experience with leading a team during live fire exercises. I am not saying that other MOS’s are not good at their job, but infantry units are a different world. Most NCO’s you see in your unit started out as privates straight out of IBCT enhancing their skills over the years before they are granted to go to a promotion board to excel into a leadership position. You will most likely have Soldier’s in your unit that have been there for years (PFC’s, SPC’s etc.) who are itching to take over a team and become an NCO. Which means they will most likely be praying on weakness (knowledge, ability to lead etc.)

To answer your question, what happens during a team, squad, and platoon live fire one of the biggest issues is not looking into your publications (which are free by the way) and in most cases are probably around your CP or even holding up someone’s couch in their barracks room. You can ask your squad leader or platoon sergeant or even another team leader. However, this is an icy area, because like I said most of these Soldier/NCO’s were, as I like to stay “Born in the infantry” they have been doing this for years and can most likely conduct a live fire with their eyes closed. Most important thing is to work with your team!!

Here is a start:
*** FM 3-21.8 (Formerly known as FM 7-8) Infantry Rifle Platoon and Squad
TC 7-9 Infantry Live Fire
TC-3-21-76 (Ranger Handbook)

Those are just a few you can start with to get your knowledge base (soft skills) up and running. But in all actuality, it is putting all that information into action. Meaning your Soldiers into actions. If they have a basic knowledge of what their roll is in the team/squad then they will look to you to fill in gaps as a infantry team leader, if you cannot do that then they will look to their squad leader.

1. Get your team together, find out about their strengths and weaknesses (Start with counseling packets)
2. Find out what the live fire consists of i.e. Squad attack/Platoon attack etc. Most likely it will be inline with whatever your deployment consists of (mission).
3. As SFC Boyd stated, do as many dry runs as possible with your new team, it is not so much worrying about what the other team will be doing (which you still need to know) it is about making sure you have control of your team, weapon systems, and how to implement them. The squad leader will handle maneuvering the squad.
4. Remember you are these Soldier’s first line-leader in a long line of leadership (big brother) everything that team does or fails to do is on you so, get up to speed as fast as possible, live fires can be very dangerous, if you do not know what is expected of you or your team it can go side-ways very quickly.

Once you get through all that, don’t stop asking questions, reading, implementing, taking information from your squad leader on what he/she wants to train on look at your training schedule over the next few months find out what other things are coming your way and brush up on the knowledge of what is coming up in the future.

Be pro-active, not reactive that's the best advice I can give you. Your team may despise you for being eager to train but you do not get paid to be liked, you get paid to lead!

Hope it all works out.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 19 at 2018 3:38 PM

2018-10-19T15:38:48-04:00

Be honest with your SL and train. You can't be told what to do, you have to practice it.

Response by CPL Fabian Sanchez made Oct 20 at 2018 2:33 AM

2018-10-20T02:33:25-04:00

Your unit needs to know what you are capable of,it does not make sense to let a newbie,cherry,or nfg,join a platoon,if you don't know wtf you are doing,good luck.

Response by CSM Lynn Chrisman made Oct 20 at 2018 9:52 PM

2018-10-20T21:52:14-04:00

Let your first line leader know asap