What has been your experience with Army PSYOPs?

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 12:26:48 -0400

I know many of you have worked with some PSYOPers or have at least experienced some sort of contact with them. What did you think of them? Professional or competent? Or no? Did you understand what they were doing? I am just curious because I’ve heard a lot of different stories from across the force.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 12 at 2018 12:31 PM

CSM Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 12:31:47 -0400

They are a useful asset to any combatant commander who understands how to use them correctly. They are as professional and competent as any other MOS. There are, like all SM’s in the Army, turds and exceptional Soldiers and Officers.

Response by SSgt GG-15 RET Jim Lint made Jul 12 at 2018 12:33 PM

SSgt GG-15 RET Jim Lint — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 12:33:03 -0400

Many were reservists who needed more time to understand target country culture.

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Jul 12 at 2018 12:38 PM

SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 12:38:02 -0400

Haven't dealt with them in years, but the ones I met were pretty professional.

Response by PV2 M B made Jul 12 at 2018 12:53 PM

PV2 M B — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 12:53:41 -0400

I had one that was responsible for a large area of operations and he ended up staying with us for most of our tour. He was very helpful and advised me and my LT with some great options that worked when used and didn't work when denied.
We also had 2 JTACs, 2 EOD, 2 SIGnit, 2 60mm mortarmen, 1 PRT, 2 FET and 2 combat camera. All attached to our rifle platoon.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 12 at 2018 12:53 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 12:53:51 -0400

LTG Luckey posted this on his Facebook page when he went to visit them in Canada during Operation Maple Resolve last May.

I spent 3 weeks in Canada working alongside a US psyop E6 and a psyop Major. Both were very professional and high-speed. All of their people were very professional and high speed.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 12 at 2018 1:14 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 13:14:30 -0400

I have worked with both the AC and RC folks. For the most part I have been impressed with them.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 12 at 2018 1:26 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 13:26:41 -0400

As with anyone you meet in the Army, you will encounter great ones and others who are less so.
I have found that in many operational environments, PSYOP elements are handcuffed by restrictions on messaging coming from senior leaders in DoD and DoS. Many ambassadors simply won't allow any product PSYOPS might generate to be deployed in their areas, for fear of upsetting the locals.
This is very unfortunate, as well-planned and integrated IO and MILDEC messaging has a key role in setting and shaping conditions on the ground.

Response by LTC Stephen C. made Jul 12 at 2018 4:23 PM

LTC Stephen C. — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 16:23:49 -0400

CPT Private RallyPoint Member, I was a psychological operations officer in the early to mid-eighties. Back then, believe it or not, the MOS was 48B, which was part of the Foreign Area Officer functional area. I've been retired for a long time, so I don't think I can offer anything that might help you.
However, LTC Eric Udouj, should be a good resource for you and by way of this prompt I hope that he'll give you some guidance.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 12 at 2018 4:59 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 16:59:10 -0400

I personally have worked with a few PSYOPS Officers in the Army Reserve. They were all good officers that I have worked with.

Unfortunately, the Army Reserve (as a whole) doesn't understand how to properly employ PSYOPS (or even FA57 Simulation Operations Officers, or any Functional Area Officer) or other Branches/FAs because they don't track fully with what the Active Army is doing with the Branch. The Functional Active Guard Reserve (AGR) folks they do have are so focused on Administrative tasks for their unit- they don't have much time to stay up on all things their Branch wants them to know.

The Army Reserve doesn't train as many days as the Active Duty does- so they are not up to speed on the latest doctrine, TTPs. etc. In order for Reserve/National Guard Soldiers to come up to speed as their Active brethren, they need more training, schools and development.

Unfortunately, there's not enough training dollars to bring reservists on for extended time for training other than professional military education or basic & functional schools. That is just my opinion.

Response by CW2 Louis Melendez made Jul 12 at 2018 9:21 PM

CW2 Louis Melendez — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 21:21:27 -0400

Like any branch or MOS in the Army. You will find turds and solid performers in the PSYOPS community. I've been in SOF for 6+ years and my opinion about PSYOPS and SOF in general is that it could be a great experience as long as the right people (i.e. SF, Rangers, CA, PSYOPS, and Support personnel) comes to the community. Sometimes people come to SOF with some false expectations or the wrong mentality and this hurts the community. If you want to make the transition to SOF make sure that you have the right attitude and mentality and everything will be fine. Take care Sir!

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made Jul 12 at 2018 10:56 PM

CAPT Kevin B. — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 22:56:14 -0400

My take is they can be good, if they've been immersed. I presume those who talk about the Reserve side might be pointing out the limited time and exposure might not have the immersion level that's effective. Look, my PsyOps affiliation was somewhat limited. We were working on getting the last of the Khmer Rouge out of the jungle in the mid '90s. Since it's officially a RCAF show, the PsyOps liaison had some limits on what buttons could be pushed and how. Nonetheless, we did finally get Pol Pot out. What people forget is the tail end. What do you do with them if they hang it up? If you don't care for them well enough, make them believe they have a future, etc. they'd undefect and head back into the jungle. That's why the Khmer Rouge defector camps I was putting into the Oral Mountains were at a level of support that wouldn't encourage taking a hike. So many of the former Khmer Rouge became RCAF MIL types. And, like the rest of the RCAF who was underpaid because their drug lord Generals skimmed, they'd resort to other means of income earning. If we built a nice section of road, the RCAF would blow holes in it to slow the cars down enough so they could shake them down for "tolls". It'll still take awhile. First thing we did was force a paymaster system on the RCAF to isolate the pay.

Response by MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P made Jul 12 at 2018 11:02 PM

MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P — Thu, 12 Jul 2018 23:02:17 -0400

CPT Private RallyPoint Member - Worked with a few of the Soldiers from 4POG when I was in an Information Warfare unit several years ago. IO as a discipline was still very young in the Air Force in those days. The troops we coordinated with were some of the best at what they do. Every now and then one would go "Off the Reservation" but no more so than any other MOS. How effective they are depends largely on the guidance and restrictions placed on them by the Combatant Commander and DoD senior staff.

Response by LTC Eric Udouj made Jul 17 at 2018 11:48 PM

LTC Eric Udouj — Tue, 17 Jul 2018 23:48:42 -0400

Some of the very best and the brightest men and women in the Armed Forces on the Active and the Reserve sides of the house. As with any branch - you always get a 5% who should not be there - but there is always those who are the exception to the rule despite the best efforts and how long it takes to get them departed.
So professional or competent as a question is something have to wonder what angle you are asking that from LT Fahey. Is it from Hollywood you seek answers or is it from history? Want to know more - take a long read of http://www.psywarrior.com/ . You will learn more there than you will from elsewhere and it is a long and proud history we have in PSYOP. (also PSYOPS is NATO - not US)
You have to be a 1LT (P) to request transfer to 37. Different worlds of what is next between the AC and the RC - but we do the same thing in the end - just supporting different folks is all. Perception shaping, narratives, themes and messages.... and alot of target audience analysis.
As a CPT in PSYOP - you are working either with a BDE CDR and his staff - or a Joint Element - a SOF element - or perhaps a US Ambassador. Chances are your also working hand-in-hand with a foreign military as well. Your experienced in Army and Joint planning, and your probably the closest thing anyone has to being an expert on the culture of where ever your at. (And it takes long hours of reading and studies to get to that point). You have to understand how your enemy thinks - and know the enemy by his or her names... and you know the population in ways to far to describe. Your soldiers are some of the smartest in the Army... many with degrees... and I have had junior NCOs with Masters degrees. I have seen CPLs advising levels that would require COLs in other units. They know their jobs very well and are highly effective when employed correctly. A SSG will often advise a BN CDR... or higher and be the key planner for PSYOP... or they may be doing the same for a Navy CAPT. Its hardest working with either Officer cultured services or foreign forces .. and how you succeed is part of the lore of lessons learned and the experience NCOs have gained in getting the job and having seen it before. No better professionals have I ever served with than PSYOP NCOs because of that.. and why they are often so trusted by a commander after only a short while with the expertise they bring to the table.
So I hope I answered your question. We have the right people - its our system and approval process that is 20 years behind the times and limits PSYOP effectiveness. We are still suffering from two items - first is that the US forces totally missed the revolution in communications that occurred around 2006-2010 in which the way people interact itself changed. The 2d is the "Good Fairy Idea" to split AC and RC PSYOP... which must be fixed if we are not to lose the Long War.

PSYOP PSYOPS PSYWAR Psychological Operations Psychological Warfare

Psychological Operations (PSYOP) and Psychological Warfare (PSYWAR), these words generate thoughts of North Vietnam's "Hanoi Hanna", Japan's "Tokyo Rose" and more recently the Iraq's infamous "Baghdad Betty" of Desert Storm. To others the words psychological operations and psychological warfare conjure up images of our military playing mind games with the enemy. PSYOP is all this and much more, for you see there are essentially two great...

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2018 9:30 PM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 03 Aug 2018 21:30:01 -0400

I think the biggest misconception is that we do nothing but “leaflets and loudspeakers”. We’re beginning to focus on being “effects based planners” which is a more applicable to today’s fight and where we fit in the lineup.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Aug 3 at 2018 11:08 PM

SGM Bill Frazer — Fri, 03 Aug 2018 23:08:34 -0400

Ask the 1,00's of Iraqi's who surrendered in GF1 with their leaflets in their hands.

Response by SSG Lyle O'Rorke made Dec 19 at 2018 10:16 PM

SSG Lyle O'Rorke — Wed, 19 Dec 2018 22:16:02 -0500

I worked with them in 8th Army IO. They were not in the group at the time but as far as professionalism goes like all jobs we had some that were real professional and some not so. They like to play a lot of I am better than you games. Worked with them in supporting some subordinate units they did educate us on what they were doing.