What is everyone’s take on the new ADSO for aviation?

CW3 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 07 Jun 2020 19:12:04 -0400

The Army is making those who want to go through flight school incur a 10 year active duty service obligation (ADSO) as it’s “fix” for pilot retention. This of course will do nothing to fix the problem of toxic leaders, poor assignment choices, or any of the other issues. Thoughts anyone?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 7 at 2020 7:46 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 07 Jun 2020 19:46:12 -0400

I knew this was coming out so I pulled my packet before this last board. That will put me over 20 years. Not interested

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Jun 7 at 2020 8:25 PM

SGM Bill Frazer — Sun, 07 Jun 2020 20:25:32 -0400

Ouch and damn!

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 7 at 2020 9:19 PM

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 07 Jun 2020 21:19:34 -0400

I don't see that being an effective solution long term, but what do I know?

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 7 at 2020 10:47 PM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 07 Jun 2020 22:47:27 -0400

Great question. I think is great! You want to volunteer to be an aviator in the U.S. Army at $0 cost to you? Then you better be willing to pay that back with 10 years of service. Way too many people use the Army to get a “free” pilot’s license then go on a different route to do other things which I’m not against that. It’s just the Army’s way to keep you in. Most people get a student loan to pay for their education which it will take them about a decade to pay off depending on the amount of course. So, either get a loan or join the Army and be ready to pay 10 years of service, if you are already in the service dont let that 10 year obligation scare you away if flying is what you really want to do.

Response by CW2 Jalistair B made Jun 7 at 2020 11:07 PM

CW2 Jalistair B — Sun, 07 Jun 2020 23:07:30 -0400

If someone is really interested in aviation then ten years is no big deal.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 7 at 2020 11:36 PM

CW3 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 07 Jun 2020 23:36:56 -0400

I think people will still put in flight packets, it’s still the best job I’ve ever had. I wouldn’t like the feeling of being trapped for 10 years and I don’t think it counts as a form of retention. Retention to me is when you commitment is up and you choose to stay longer. Better training and equipment, bonuses, better command climates would all work help with retention.

Response by MAJ Matthew Arnold made Jun 8 at 2020 12:44 AM

MAJ Matthew Arnold — Mon, 08 Jun 2020 00:44:07 -0400

I was an army aviator for 20 years. I knew a lot of aviators. Very few of them would even flinch at a 10 year obligation, "where do I sign", I think they all would have said. Flying is a boys dream that men get to fulfill in the services and very few if any are going to deny that dream because of a 10 year obligation. I would even guess that most flyboys would ask, "can I sign up for 20."

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 8 at 2020 2:38 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 08 Jun 2020 02:38:38 -0400

Honestly, I doubt it will slow packets down one bit. Aviation is always accessing more people than it has applicants. Now, if you had asked this about the HR Tech, SF, or Boat Movement Warrants where there are not enough qualified applicants, I would call it a death knell. But, aviation will always sound cool and is synonymous with pilot in the Army. I would bet that there will still be more qualified applicants than accessions in future WOCS boards which means they were successful.

Response by WO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 8 at 2020 9:14 AM

WO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 08 Jun 2020 09:14:15 -0400

I’m still going through with my flight packet. Hopefully I can get picked up

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 8 at 2020 6:07 PM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 08 Jun 2020 18:07:17 -0400

Personally, I think it will do more harm than good in the long run because (afaik) this is a pilot retention issue they are trying to address. Not a "we paid all this money for you to be a Pilot, now pay your dues!" issue, because if that was the case the ADSO most certainly would have been more than 6 years. So if a group of big wigs out there decided way back when that 6 years makes up for that cost in training, how does upping the ADSO make any sense? You want higher retention, give better incentives.

I do agree with SFC Boyd that it "probably" won't slow down the number of packets getting submitted, but the soldiers out there with a lot more TIS will definitely reconsider if they have already been in for 10 or more years. I know quite a few guys that have already mentioned they would have reconsidered if the 10 year ADSO applied to them, even one that is street-to-seat. 10 years is a long commitment to make.

Response by MAJ Byron Oyler made Jun 8 at 2020 7:40 PM

MAJ Byron Oyler — Mon, 08 Jun 2020 19:40:51 -0400

I am about to hit 20yrs nurse corps, would take a cut to CPT or even 1LT to fly in the Army for ten years. Probably even warrant as I retire as an O-4.

Response by LtCol Robert Quinter made Jun 11 at 2020 7:40 AM

LtCol Robert Quinter — Thu, 11 Jun 2020 07:40:41 -0400

First, when a program is created to fill a specific objective, i.e. pilot shortage, all of the detractors you cited are not their problem. They are there to get bodies.
Second, we used to say the only thing consistent in the DOD is inconsistency. If you desire to retire before the 10 year obligation is fulfilled, you submit the application for retirement including a waiver of the remaining years on your obligation. Good possibility the pilot shortage will have been eased by then, or other situations will have arisen that will support excusing the time.

Response by Maj Alwyn Walton made Sep 16 at 2020 6:08 PM

Maj Alwyn Walton — Wed, 16 Sep 2020 18:08:01 -0400

Smart move for the Army with NO financial investment. Even IF the numbers of S2S applicants decline, the Army has one saving grace. It's the only service that allow HS/GED graduates to pilot aircraft. Since the majority of Army pilots come from the enlisted ranks of any service, there will never be a shortage of WOFT volunteers. There are more than enough qualified CAREER enlisted wanting out of their MOS, not necessarily for the love of flying but for more money for the family, being an Officer, and dealing with less Army BS. 10 years plus flight training will take them to their retirement years.

And that what the Army wants, more time in the pilot seat. Max 8 years TIS for WOFT. Should lower it 6 or even 5 years.