What is the likelihood of an SF soldier being able to become a Drill Sergeant?

2018-09-19T07:58:29-04:00

I aspire to someday earn both the Green Beret and the Drill Sergeant's Campaign Hat. I specifically want to go down the SF route first so I have plenty of experience, both in what I am teaching and in the nature of teaching itself. My question, more specifically, is: would SF duties always take more priority over DS duties? I've asked an SOF recruiter and was essentially told "needs of the Army," which makes sense, but do any of you have personal experience with this? Thanks for any help.

Response by 1SG Frank Boynton made Sep 19 at 2018 8:04 AM

2018-09-19T08:04:22-04:00

Very likely. My best friend was SF during my trail time. Vietnam veteran and highly decorated. I knew if 5 others in other companies in my battalion that were SF.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 8:06 AM

2018-09-19T08:06:31-04:00

I knew a couple while I was a DS at Benning (2011-2013.)

Response by SGM Gregory Tarancon IV made Sep 19 at 2018 8:53 AM

2018-09-19T08:53:46-04:00

SPC Elijah Zaporteza, I understand the logic behind Special Forces experience or background enhancing the ability to become a great drill sergeant. In practice however, I would like to provide you with some perspective -

The Special Forces Career track CMF18- involves assessment and selection for Special Forces duty and depending on which CMF18 MOS the completion of the SF pipeline. Which could take between 24-36 months depending on language and other required schools. Once you pass all these gates then you are assigned to and SF Group an put on an Operational Detachment for a number of years. Where there is more schooling and numerous deployments. Throughout this time expect to get promoted, remember the lowest ranking individual on and SF ODA is SSG/E6.

If after all that you decide that you still wish to become a Drill Sergeant and leave Group, here is what you will be giving up -

1. Jump Pay - $150 per month
2. Demo Pay - $225 per month
3. Special Duty Pay - $450 per month
4. Language Pay - $100-400 per month
5. Halo Pay - $250 per month
6. Dive Pay - $250 per month

You would potentially take $1500 cut in pay, in addition your security clearance would be down graded from a Top Secret to a secret. Since, Drill Sergeant Duty does not require a Top Secret Clearance.

Just food for through!

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 9:12 AM

2018-09-19T09:12:51-04:00

I went to Drill Sergeant School in 2012 and we had one in our class. He was going to be working at Bragg for the whole 18X pipeline. Not sure if they still do that or not but he definetly had a long tab and was an active duty green beret. He was sent from JFKSWCS to Drill Sergeant School.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 9:18 AM

2018-09-19T09:18:36-04:00

If you go to SF, the branch has a certain percentage of people who are allowed to be away and on different assignments like going to DLI for a language. Those allocations are always under filled. You would just ask your branch to release you, first with the blessing of your Team SGT, Company SGM, and CSM. They will want you to have your 48 months of team time, or however many it will be at that time.

Response by MSG Dan Castaneda made Sep 19 at 2018 9:59 AM

2018-09-19T09:59:08-04:00

I know SF guys that are former Drill Sergeants. While we have the 18X program, we will continue to provide SF Drill Sergeants to Fort Benning. This is only because they train our SF babies. Once the program goes away, we will no longer have the requirement. This however is not likely anytime soon.

Response by SPC David S. made Sep 19 at 2018 11:18 AM

2018-09-19T11:18:39-04:00

Regardless of possibilities - way to set the bar high. Best of Luck!

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 21 at 2018 10:34 AM

2018-09-21T10:34:36-04:00

SF will take priority over being a DS, but you can always request to go to DSS and after serving your required time on an ODA you can put in a packet to transfer to being a DS

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 24 at 2018 9:11 PM

2018-09-24T21:11:33-04:00

Not only can you volunteer for Drill SGT after you have been SF, you can be ordered to it. While I was at 5th Group we had a guy volunteer after OIF 1 and made it back for OIF 5. And we had a guy receive orders for Drill School, but he got out of it by applying for 180A. SF does not get out of big Army requirements like Drill, Recruiting, Instructor or ROTC duty. It's just luck of the draw. But if you do one, you cannot be directed to do another, usually.

Response by SFC Francisco Rosario made Nov 12 at 2018 2:35 PM

2018-11-12T14:35:55-05:00

Many years ago i remember seeing a former SF Soldier at Ft. Sam Houston working as a Drill Sergeant. I asked him how he was able to do so. He said that he wanted to make SGM, and in order to do so, he would have to move out of the ODA community and go back to the regular army. He said that they move up to MSG very fast, but the stagnate there and only a few get to make SGM.

So i guess you would have to do your "TEAM TIME" (about 3 years) and then request to revert to your previous MOS and then apply to Drill Sergeant School. If anyone on RP has any better advise please let us know.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 13 at 2018 12:29 AM

2018-11-13T00:29:58-05:00

You may want to think about SF instructor rather than DS. I understand the prestige of the brown round but that would be a step backwards in your career pipeline. D'S is usually a broadening assignment to help you get promoted to the next rank. With the SF you will not need that type of assignment

Response by PFC Charles Sanders made Nov 22 at 2018 7:00 AM

2018-11-22T07:00:51-05:00

The army likes to make their best soldiers drill sergeants, and as a result makes still sergeants out of a lot of SF soldiers. One of mine was former delta. So yes, it’s possible.

Response by SPC Elijah J. Henry, MBA made Nov 22 at 2018 8:05 AM

2018-11-22T08:05:36-05:00

There was an E-7 DS with an SF Tab in my OSUT Company. He was very displeased at having been assigned as a DS. Everyone has to get instructor time.

Response by George Oldroyd made Nov 26 at 2018 5:08 AM

2018-11-26T05:08:34-05:00

Given what Uncle Sugar invests in each spec ops shooter, it's unlikely that they will let you go from an SF MOS to a Drill Instructor MOS unless an injury makes you unsuited to continued special operations service. In that case, you'd make a hell of a DI, but chances are good if you get a Purple Heart scary enough to take you out of SF, it'll earn you a medical discharge to go with it.

You'll have many opportunities to act as cadre and as a teacher to newer troops while an SF soldier, so while you may not earn the badge, you'll have a very satisfying experience as a teacher.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 3 at 2018 12:30 AM

2018-12-03T00:30:45-05:00

SWCS

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 4 at 2018 4:14 PM

2018-12-04T16:14:33-05:00

Good on you for your ambition. Keep that mentality. But also, remember your 50 meter targets. Try to focus on one thing at a time and make sure that that’s what you really want to do. Once you decide what you want, you can accomplish that task, then move onto the next. I.E., if you want to go SF, then focus on that. If you get selected and finish the q-course, then concentrate on how to be the best ODA team member and best at your job. After a few years of team time, you can then think about drill sergeant, SWC instructor, ROTC instructor or whatever. As for the drill sergeant question.. Bottom line, SF guys can get drill sergeant duty. Whether they volunteer or are told to go. It’s usually a 3 year duty and once you complete it you can go back to group. It’s like any other instructor assignment that you have to do during your career. You will not lose your clearance (once you have a TS clearance it’s good for 5 years), however, you will lose your special duty pays. But you will receive drill pay. And it will help you get promoted, just like any other instructor position.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 18 at 2018 3:13 PM

2018-12-18T15:13:53-05:00

It’s a broadening assignment. You could do that instead of SWIC or SF recruiting. It actually looks really good to make 8.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 18 at 2018 3:23 PM

2018-12-18T15:23:03-05:00

By the way pro pay is $375 and you will not get dive or halo pay unless you are on a dive or halo team. You can’t be on both. They have open slots every year so just volunteer after u do your team time.

Response by LTC James McElreath made Dec 19 at 2018 2:19 PM

2018-12-19T14:19:54-05:00

I went to basic in March of 1974. We had two active duty Drills SFC Block and I want to say SFC Russell. They were apparently attending some school but wanted to be plugged in for drill duties while there. These two NCO's switched places due to scheduling conflict. But anyway to make a long story longer we later had drills from the California ARNG. For some reason we were allowed to play basket ball. All in the green weenie uniform, the 2 NG Drills started playing (in the COA's court) They removed their wigs and their long hair down. But anyway the NG Drills never came back to the unit AO. We were told later the NG Drills got an Article 15 and were sent home. The AD Drills were tough as nails but very well respected by everyone. The NG Drills were really liked too for the short time with us.

Response by CPT Jeff Robinette made Dec 23 at 2018 7:45 PM

2018-12-23T19:45:17-05:00

I went to BCT at Ft Knox in June of 1975. In bad an E-7 Drill Sergeant that wore a SF Combat Patch. Granted that was just after Saigon fell to the North. The Army was in flux at that time.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 11 at 2019 7:15 PM

2019-01-11T19:15:14-05:00

My $0.02 as a former Drill Sergeant and a retiring Special Forces Team Sergeant would be to keep busting your butt and become the best soldier that you can be. At the appropriate time volunteer for DS duty and then following those 2 years apply to SFAS. This is IF both of these are equal goals for you. Feel free to reach out and I can explain my thought process and why I suggest this route.

Response by CPL Chris Palmberg made Jan 11 at 2019 8:55 PM

2019-01-11T20:55:22-05:00

Bust your jump physical...

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 12 at 2019 8:06 AM

2019-01-12T08:06:15-05:00

While I was active duty SF, I saw NCOs volunteer for DS, and I saw NCOs get levied (involuntary ordered) for DS. It happens every year.

Response by MSG Donald Sampler made Jan 12 at 2019 10:00 PM

2019-01-12T22:00:41-05:00

I enlisted as an 05-B (radio operator) and went on to become an 18E and 18f (SF radio operator, and eventually an Operations Sergeant on an A-team).
Most guys who make teams don't go back to the regular army. The freedom and respect given to NCOs in Special Forces is unmatched anywhere else. if there is a "flow" between the regular army and SF, its in the other direction: Guys who made good Drill Sergeants, or who had good tours with the Ranger Regiment, etc. often apply for and are accepted into SF (presuming they pass SFAS and the Q Course.

Another point: SF guys are (typically) prized for their independence and ability to make-it-up-on-the-fly. This isn't typically a skill that's welcomed (or even tolerated) in a lot of the more conventional school houses. I had the honor to serve on an ODA that taught at Camp Natural Bridge (West Point Cadets, after their Plebe year). You'd think USMA would welcome and respect the experiences of the team members, but no; we were quite explicitly told to teach from the USMA lesson plans, without embellishment or deviation.
I suspect you'd find a similar atmosphere were you to join a BTB as a Drill.

But good on ya' for your ambition, and good luck with your career!

DOL

Response by SP5 Lewis Shinstine made Jan 13 at 2019 12:10 PM

2019-01-13T12:10:59-05:00

Those who have served in Spec. Ops. are normally of above average IQ can think outside the box and generally make some of the best teachers and leaders of men (Men used as an all inclusive noun). They also are generally great examples to emulate in any walk of life from Business to politics.

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 16 at 2019 12:05 PM

2019-01-16T12:05:20-05:00

Never

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 20 at 2019 7:21 PM

2019-01-20T19:21:26-05:00

You can become a DS if you want to, while being a long tabber. I know someone who's done this but dropped rank to do so, he just really wanted to be a DS. Finished his ds time and went back to being a long tab.

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 20 at 2019 7:24 PM

2019-01-20T19:24:48-05:00

Don't forget that you will almost definitely have a tour at SWC schoolhouse of your MOS if you progress in the 18 series.

Response by SSG David Shifflett made Jan 22 at 2019 3:22 PM

2019-01-22T15:22:48-05:00

Vietnam and post Vietnam there were a few drill Sargents that were SOF. I went through Fort Leonardwood Missouri. Both of my DI's were Green Beret's and severed 2 tours in Vietnam. Not sure when they made those changes for SOF folks.

Response by SFC David Pope, MBA made Jan 22 at 2019 6:00 PM

2019-01-22T18:00:50-05:00

The Delta medic that was featured in the book and movie "Black Hawk Down" was one of my daughters DS. You never know what turns your military career will take you. My advice is to make contingency plans incase things don't go exactly the way you thought they would. And never give up when things don't quite go your way. Mine changed directions multiple times, and I ended up on a great military path, until injuries forced me to retire. No regrets!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 22 at 2019 7:35 PM

2019-01-22T19:35:55-05:00

I had two in my class this last year. The likely hood these days is high. We need Drills badly.

Response by LTC Ray Morris made Jan 22 at 2019 8:13 PM

2019-01-22T20:13:23-05:00

I was a BAR instructor for a basic Inf Company, and then a few years later, a company commander for one. But that's as close as I got to being a Drill Sgt. As for being a Green Beret. I earned one, and served in Special Forces as both enlisted and an officer, for about eighteen years, So I have some experience in that area. I've also been to Ranger and Recondo school, but Special Forces training remains some of the hardest in the world. Bare in mind that only a small percentage of participants ever graduate. That should be your first objective, and believe me, that will require your 100% participation and effort, or you are doomed for failure from the beginning. I find that being a Green Beret soldier closer to a calling, than just wanting to wear the chic little green hat. Those who go into it with less than that attitude, rarely make it through - especially if it's only to "check the boxes" and obtain a couple of hats. But, that aside, if you do make it through selection, and actually get into the training and become one of the most specialized warriors in the world, why would you want to trade that for a Drill Sgt's hat?

Response by SPC Donald Moore made Feb 16 at 2019 8:15 PM

2019-02-16T20:15:42-05:00

SGT Private RallyPoint Member , If you think you want to be a Drill Sergeant, you need to do that first because that is a "Regular" Army assignment. Then you can go SF after. Once you go SF, you never go back to the "Regular" Army, unless you are injured, which would probably prevent you from doing Drill Sergeant also.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 24 at 2019 8:19 PM

2019-02-24T20:19:32-05:00

I went to the Drill Sergeant Academy in 2016 and there was a green beret attending the school 2 classes behind me. So yes, you can do both.

Response by 1SG Ernest Stull made Mar 24 at 2019 9:16 AM

2019-03-24T09:16:31-04:00

If you want to be both go to Drill SGT. school first and then SF. You would have more flexibility in getting past the SF. selection then becoming a SF first and then leaving SF to go to Drill SGT. school both are Volunteer" positions.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 5 at 2019 7:27 PM

2019-04-05T19:27:05-04:00

It happens- but focus should be on 25m target. If you make it in SF or not, DS is there and always will be.
What’s best for you, your career, and family are the first questions. Drop a DS packet once it seems best for you. All things being even, DS May come around anyway. Stay safe, healthy, and alive- all else reveals itself in due time. Whatever you do, do it to the best of your ability.

Good luck!

This We’ll Defend!

Response by SFC George Smith made Apr 6 at 2019 1:01 AM

2019-04-06T01:01:33-04:00

From Watching Many Of My Friends Go Down The Drill Stg Trail... Less Than 3 or 4 stayed the entire tour... More Than A Dozen Came Back... Now The Better Rout as Going To Drill Sgt. School And Upon Completion Then Going SF... The SF And Ranger Assignments Have A Way To Remold Your Mind Set...

Response by SFC Manuel Sandino made Apr 27 at 2019 12:09 PM

2019-04-27T12:09:27-04:00

I can't say I ever met an SF soldier that would want to pull duty as a Drill Sergeant, there may be some out there. I don't think it would make sense going out of the community if you want to get promoted. The only SF guy I know was an officer who worked as the commander for SF recruiting, I believe all SF recruiters are non- SF but I could be wrong. After about 5 to 6 years more or less, of been in an ODA, guys would come down on orders to go work as cadre at the Special Warfare School or assessment and Selection for a period of three years, this counts as DS duty if you will, you are rated by other SF guys, this would not be so as a Drill Sergeant, which could put you at a disadvantage for promotion. Now if like the idea of becoming a green beret and a Drill Sergeant and don't care about promotion, go for it, it may work well or not but you did it your way and that is part of been a green beret. Good luck.

Response by CW4 Craig Urban made Apr 27 at 2019 1:11 PM

2019-04-27T13:11:08-04:00

Stay special forces.

Response by 1SG Daniel Bellina made Apr 30 at 2019 2:46 PM

2019-04-30T14:46:54-04:00

no not good drill sgt different mindsets

Response by SGT Charles Bartell made May 1 at 2019 12:39 PM

2019-05-01T12:39:58-04:00

When I went thure Basic at Ft. Benning back in Jan 1984 two of my Drill SGT's had been S.F.
But take into acount that was back in the day when basic traing had no real hard rules about laying out a shit bag trianee. If the Drill sgt took some one arund the corner of in the latren. There was a ass beating coming.
None of us rated out the drill sgt because we knew if they had to do it.
you could not trust that guy to cover your ass if you go to combat.
To bad that is not the way these days.
But yes it does come down to needs of the ARMY.

Response by SSG Joseph VanDyck made May 7 at 2019 6:32 PM

2019-05-07T18:32:28-04:00

Let me get this correct, you want to become a green beret (with all the time, training and expense that is invested in each individual SF member) which would put you in line with JFKSWC, SOCOM and JSOC then turn around and go back to big Army and become a DS with you becoming a member of TRADOC? I do not foresee any career counselor, like your branch manager, telling you that this is a good idea. You pick one and stay the course. That is what I believe any recruiter would tell you.

Response by 1SG Michael Blount made May 10 at 2019 7:40 PM

2019-05-10T19:40:19-04:00

I am not sure you're going to want to be a Drill Sergeant after all the schooling SOF requires.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 10 at 2019 10:35 PM

2019-05-10T22:35:18-04:00

Had SF drill in B-134

Response by SSG Sapper Greg made May 12 at 2019 5:38 PM

2019-05-12T17:38:44-04:00

Anything is possible if you want it. One of the biggest regrets of my careers is that I was too scared to go to DS School, flight school or Green To Gold which I wanted to do at one point or another but always talked myself out of because of “family”. Well, there was no family to come to after Iraq and I ended up not doing any of it.

Response by SSG James Johnson made May 12 at 2019 9:56 PM

2019-05-12T21:56:13-04:00

I was Airborne Infantry in 60s. After receiving 2 Purple hearts and a return to the states from Vietnam, I was assigned to Fort Ord and became a drill sergeant. Not a problem if you are serious and determined.

Response by CPT Don Kemp made May 12 at 2019 10:28 PM

2019-05-12T22:28:20-04:00

I served with two SF qualified NCO’s when I was a Drill Sergeant. Then again, the trainees that made a 30 year career of the Army have been retired for 10 years now.

Response by SN Herman Lee made May 13 at 2019 8:21 AM

2019-05-13T08:21:43-04:00

My response from my time in the U.S. Navy was that Naval Special Forces personnel were rotated to recruit training for physical readness and so on. I would assume they were given this rotation based on their security clearance and to statisfy any shore duty componants.

Response by CPT Brad Wilson made May 13 at 2019 9:21 AM

2019-05-13T09:21:47-04:00

Should be possible. When I was at ROTC Advanced Camp my TAC NCO had an SF Tab Ranger and Diver

Response by SPC Seany Weaver made May 13 at 2019 3:52 PM

2019-05-13T15:52:49-04:00

Lilly hood is damn great. As one of my Drill Sargents was SF tabbed. Drill sargent Block. And he was awsome. Later after getting off the trail he went back to SF and became 1st Sargent Block over 5th group out of Ft. Campbell. So why this question

Response by SGT Felicia King made May 18 at 2019 7:14 PM

2019-05-18T19:14:33-04:00

Obviously it would be more reasonable to do DS first, prior to SF. You gain a wealth of knowledge from leaders you currently have, as well as your own experience and knowledge. Shoot, General Schoomaker is Jumpmaster, Ranger, SF, and Delta Force. Pretty sure he went in that order and accomplished each in stages as they got harder.

Response by SGT Felicia King made May 18 at 2019 7:16 PM

2019-05-18T19:16:38-04:00

And remember, you can pass selection and not get selected. I think it’s back to 10%

Response by SGT Mustafa Stokely made Jun 16 at 2019 2:15 PM

2019-06-16T14:15:49-04:00

"There is no substitute for experience," as the old saying goes and I think it is highly beneficial to have combat experienced DI's. (All but one of my DI's back in 1981 served in Vietnam.) I do wonder, however, if there is a point of diminishing returns when it comes to using highly specialized personnel? (Also, wouldn't that highly specialized training be better utilized teaching younger SF soldiers?)

Response by SFC Tracy Scott made Jul 6 at 2019 12:13 AM

2019-07-06T00:13:10-04:00

Well, it's not a common occurrence, but every once in awhile a person will leave the associated Group and volunteer, normally as a senior drill.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 21 at 2020 12:36 AM

2020-03-21T00:36:50-04:00

My NCO Academy at Ft Lewis had a tabbed Drill Sergeant. I had to do some pushups for him. Guess maybe the Ranger squad/SF group needs good leaders too.