What is your perception of for profit colleges and universities?

PO2 Orlando Sims, MPA — Sat, 21 Dec 2013 20:29:09 -0500

Are they diploma mills or do they provide the same type of quality education as nonprofit university's and colleges with regional accreditation?

Response by SPC Rachel Stubbs made Dec 21 at 2013 8:36 PM

SPC Rachel Stubbs — Sat, 21 Dec 2013 20:36:27 -0500

I have had a professor that once taught at a for profit college. He said that it was easy money and that the college its self really did not care about the education that they were teaching, as long as the students were paying their tuition that it was all they cared about. Now I have never been to a for profit college but I know in my state the credits for the for profit colleges do not transfer as well as traditional not for profit college credits.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 12:09 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 22 Dec 2013 00:09:13 -0500

I was slow to weigh in because I held a leadership position at a traditional bricks and mortar research university for 15 years before I joined the military, and that gives me a very strong bias against this mushrooming population of for-profit colleges. The description that SPC Stubbs gives is almost always what I hear too.

What are your goals? If you just want points for civilian education, and you do not care if you actually get a degree and/or you don't plan to actually use the degree as anything other than a credential, there is probably little distinction. Understand that you are not really getting a college education.

I caution that this is shortsighted. I met with quite a few transitioning service members who were very disappointed to find that there is no academic credit for "life experience" or that they cannot count their 15X AIT toward a degree in accounting, even if some other for-profit said they would accept it. Moreover, credit "earned" at many of these for-profit schools will not transfer and you cannot use their degrees toward starting a Master's program at a traditional non-profit. In short, you may start out thinking, "I just want the promotion points," but if you change your mind, you won't have as many options.

I never attended a for profit school, but when one of my Soldier's had a problem with a course while we were down range I accompanied him to the school's office on Camp Liberty. While, yes, I wanted to eat at the good DFAC, I also knew I could speak the academic lingo and get the situation straightened out. For months the "school" harassed me to agree to teach for them. I kept trying to explain that we've got this war going on and I had a couple things on my mind. They kept trying to reassure me how easy it would be and what little time I would really have to put into it. Ridiculous.

I would stay away. There are enough fully recognized, properly accredited, online programs given by traditional non-profit schools, that you can get a degree from a school with an established reputation and strong alumni program, etc.

I absolutely do not mean to offend people who have chosen to get a degree from a for-profit program and who feel they were well served. If that is your experience, good on you.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 12:30 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 22 Dec 2013 00:30:31 -0500

I am not sure of how to assess if colleges are teaching what students need because we are not even sue what that technology might look like and how do we exploit that to create job. The key I think, is preparing students better out of high school.

I remember a Professor at USC saying that even many AP students had to take remedial English just to qualify for college. There are not prepared because we are busy with stuff that doesn't matter.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 12:40 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 22 Dec 2013 00:40:01 -0500

I guess if you want quality you have to pay for it. You can't spend money are far-flung projects when students cannot read or write. Secondly is the issue of respect and how we are failing our students by letting poor behavior become some disruptive that we are forgetting the students who are really trying.

Joe Clark had the right idea. Discipline. We get the students who are passed on and whose behavior problems stem from a lack of reasonable expectations. Goals that challenge conventional wisdom. Not pining for debates just to debate for the sake of it.

Thirdly students need to stop encouraging the kind of narcissism of winning American Idol. High School and Middle School students need to be treated like young adults and privilege ends when you come of age.

These prep concerns are the building bocks. The Maslow's Hierarchal Device for success. It is like giving students the answers or teaching them how to make the best choice.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 3 at 2014 12:17 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 03 Sep 2014 12:17:28 -0400

First of the distinction between for profit and non profit is tax designation. Second, all universities are different. My personal favorite for the first year or two are always! The community colleges. Best bang for the money, no question about it. Second choice for four year colleges, instate tuition for state universities. Graduate schools are somewhat different, and many will tell you that you get what you pay for. My question is, do you really know what medical school your doctor went to? However, none of the Supreme Court Justices went too a state school. But.. How many jobs openings are there at the Supreme Court.
You must also keep in mind that college education is an investment, and as such, how long will it take you to recoup your investment?

Response by PO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 9 at 2014 1:10 AM

PO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 09 Sep 2014 01:10:01 -0400

http://www.takepart.com/video/2014/09/08/student-loan-debt?cmpid=tp-fb

Worth the 16 minutes to watch. SPECIFICALLY around the 11:40 mark.

Comedian John Oliver Goes After For-Profit Colleges in Epic Rant

For-profit colleges in America—such as DeVry, ITT Tech, and others that buy ad time on late-night television—only educate about 13 percent of America's college students, yet those institutions account for more than a third of student loan debt nationwide.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 3 at 2014 4:32 PM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 03 Dec 2014 16:32:04 -0500

I just finished up at University of Phoenix which is regarded as a for-profit. I did the online courses and do feel like I learned many things, especially terms of things that are regarded as management level activities. The only thing that I think is off about the money that was paid (used GI Bill), is that some of it felt rushed. Many classes could have been better suited as 6-8 week class which in my experience is still faster than typical classroom college classes, but would have led to greater depth and understanding than the five week courses that they offer. For example I had to take two programming classes, both I had no knowledge of at the time, I did not truly start to "get" until week three or four. By then we're winding down and starting our final projects and the discussion tended to dry up, which then made it even more strange for the learning environment.