What's been the hardest part about transitioning from the Military to Civilian employment?

2017-01-30T10:03:07-05:00

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 30 at 2017 10:07 AM

2017-01-30T10:07:09-05:00

The big problem is that no one is looking for people that brake things. It is so hard to cross your military experience over to the civilian work force. This is countered to an extent by the desire to hire a veteran but I would recommend you decide the field you wish to work in. Hopefully that is a field that makes you happy. Then get a certification in that field prior to leaving the service. Rewrite all of your experience in the word used in that industry and from that certification. Hardest thing is to get an interview so your resume has to make it at least look like you have experience.

Response by MAJ Andrew Ready made Jan 30 at 2017 10:11 AM

2017-01-30T10:11:07-05:00

Employers want to hire field grade officers with 20 plus years of experience and pay them as if they were specialists with 5 years of experience.

Response by MCPO Roger Collins made Jan 30 at 2017 10:18 AM

2017-01-30T10:18:41-05:00

Most issues I found during my second career were starting again proving your value. As with the military, those senior to you falsely believe they know more than the "newguy". You have to work your butt off to pass them up, while being promoted over them and becoming an impact player. As the old saying goes, "The harder I work, the luckier I get."

Response by SGT Dave Tracy made Jan 30 at 2017 10:19 AM

2017-01-30T10:19:48-05:00

Self-important employers with no perspective, who think mundane tasks are tantamount to life & death decisions.

Response by SFC Stephen King made Jan 30 at 2017 10:21 AM

2017-01-30T10:21:35-05:00

Great question, take into account a understanding on how to convey your qualifications in a way that is easily understood.

Response by Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen made Jan 30 at 2017 10:21 AM

2017-01-30T10:21:41-05:00

It's been a while for me, but it was hard for me to grasp how few civilian employees knew or cared about the overall mission of the company. They may be experts in their field but walk them a couple departments down and they become totally clueless. In the military you knew the unit mission inside and out and how your particular specialty fit into accomplishing the mission.

Response by CPT Nic Chang made Jan 30 at 2017 11:07 AM

2017-01-30T11:07:55-05:00

The hardest part is teaching companies the value that Veterans provide. As a member of the nation's premier military placement firm, I find the biggest hurdle being able to find a common understanding. If expectations are managed properly, you can build a lifelong relationship and pipeline for Veterans to land careers within a company.

Response by Sgt William Biggs made Jan 30 at 2017 11:30 AM

2017-01-30T11:30:10-05:00

Having experience that can relate to a job, but since it wasn't the same exact job, the recruiters overlook it

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 30 at 2017 11:37 AM

2017-01-30T11:37:46-05:00

Recognition of transitioning as a process that is slow and dependent on the field for which I seek to enter. The duration of the process differs across fields, industries, and public or private career paths. I envision transitioning as similar to a ruck march. The only way to finish is to put one foot in front of the other.

Response by SSG Angela Harris made Jan 30 at 2017 11:41 AM

2017-01-30T11:41:13-05:00

Hey Taylor just finding your true self again. FInd something that makes you happy and stick with it

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Jan 30 at 2017 11:55 AM

2017-01-30T11:55:13-05:00

Rethinking how the "pecking order" is determined. The most important thing in most businesses is turning a profit for the owners or shareholders. If you contribute to turning a profit, then you are considered a "good" employee and are well compensated. Further more, if you help grow the business by bringing in more customers and revenue, then you are a "very good" employee and rewarded, and often promoted.

Response by SGT Ben Keen made Jan 30 at 2017 12:14 PM

2017-01-30T12:14:48-05:00

Taylor Driesell - It's ironic that you bring up this topic on the same day I'm submitting a packet to the American Staffing Association to be a presenter their conference this year in Chicago.

The class I'm submitting talks to this and covers both sides of the coin. The issues Veterans face when transitioning are numerous and differ Veteran to Veteran. How to craft an effect, working resume is one challenge that many face. A lot of Veterans are unsure how to take everything they have done over 4, 6, 8, 10+ years and put it on paper. Some include their awards but fail to realize that most employers respect your service but honestly careless about the what and more so about the how. For example, if I put down I have X number of awards, but the better move is to look at my award write ups and pull out some examples that civilian employers can relate to.

Employers also have a hard time with the military to civilian transition. They love our skills and whatnot but find it hard to understand things like exact what a DD214 is saying and how someone's skills on the battle field can and do relate to their company.

In the class that I am proposing, I look to work to bridge some of these gaps and empower recruiters like you with even more skills to be an even bigger asset to Veterans.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 30 at 2017 12:26 PM

2017-01-30T12:26:27-05:00

You have to break stereotypes to potential employers about the military. It takes work and hustle in finding a good job. Also keep expectations realistic your skills and experience are special but, got to make sure to be marketable. Also remember you're the newbie don't expect the same pay and respect. You got to go back to earning those things again.

Response by 1LT Vance Titus made Jan 30 at 2017 12:31 PM

2017-01-30T12:31:47-05:00

Resentment. I have always been proud of my service. I have always put it on resumes and job applications. I rarely spoke about it in interviews unless asked. I actually had a prospective employer tell me that there was nothing that the military does to train for civilian employment...I got up and walked out of that interview.

Response by MSG Jerald J. made Jan 30 at 2017 12:50 PM

2017-01-30T12:50:34-05:00

My biggest issue has been the lack of a common goal or as I call it, competing agendas. After 20+ years of heading in the same direction and working to achieve the same goals, working in an environment where everyone is doing their own things, undermining the higher ups in some cases and a blatant "me first" mentality, yeah I get pretty disgusted about it.

Response by CW4 Anthoney Lowry made Jan 30 at 2017 1:45 PM

2017-01-30T13:45:25-05:00

For me it was doing a job interview over the phone. I would much rather talk to someone in person even if I have to walk somewhere to do it. The first phone interview I did was horrible and I did not get a call back. a few more over the following months and I was finally flown from Alabama to seattle for an in person interview and eventually hired. Took a lot of failures to succeed but now I am very happy where I am at.

Response by SFC J Fullerton made Jan 30 at 2017 1:56 PM

2017-01-30T13:56:46-05:00

That most recruiters and hiring managers only select people to interview with "specific industry experience" for the position they are filling, and military experience doesn't qualify.

Response by SFC Dennis A. made Jan 30 at 2017 2:43 PM

2017-01-30T14:43:08-05:00

Lack of Team Work, after many years I've found a company and a position that our daily missions is team work and working for the greater good of all employees. We still have people out there that are still out for number 1 but the group I'm with now is all about the team.

Response by PO3 Donald Murphy made Jan 30 at 2017 3:16 PM

2017-01-30T15:16:28-05:00

I would have liked to have transitioned. Due to the end of the Cold War, I was just thrown out along with everyone else they could get rid of. It was a numbers game to see how fast they could reduce manning. I would have loved someone to have sat me down and gone over what I had done/learned and how it would equate to a civilian "job." As a result, I was thrown in to the deep end and had to sink or swim on my own. So - here's what I found...

1. You are entering a different quota system. Your local big city corporation gets kick backs and other "stuff" from the local big city colleges. So its a circle of life, and you're the wart hog dancing slowly. You have to compete with that college. So make sure you have a certifications or college degree when applying to that company. Stay away from people claiming to "convert your military experience to college credits." It rarely works. If ever.

2. Company's that build the stuff you shot, played with, flew, drove, etc, are your best/main bet for vet hiring. Oh...not cuz they love you... They want you because they get a government kick-back for hiring you. So while you're driving your tank in jagaram or flying your plane over the joo joo gulf, look at the brand names around you. "Harris radio," "Colt gun," etc. So seek out those companies when you get out. By the same token, don't use Gerber knives in the Army, get hired by Gerber and think you're going to be telling them how to build/use their knives... You'll probably be in another department. Probably won't even see a knife...

3. Admit you're a virgin. You're former military. Joe college kid has more street smarts than you. Go to your local job center and sign on with the VETERAN COORDINATOR. They do nothing all day but but look for jobs for people like you. They'll help you dress, write your resume, etc. Plus, he/she was in so they were probably in your unit and you guys can swap stories over a beer or two.

4. Most military (especially Navy) will have SECRET clearances. It takes an act of God to get one now in the civilian world. CAPITALIZE ON THAT. No, you may not want to be a health care administrator at a hospital or medical insurance company, but having a SECRET clearance they will hire you NOW and the salary will be A LOT BETTER than what you plan on getting as a civilian equivalent of what you were doing active duty.

5. Remember that CIVLANT (civilian fleet) is run by civilians. They don't have bosses/commanding officers. They have share holders. If they can outsource you to save 1/17th of a cent (yup - had that done...by 'poor' disney no less...) in order to look good to share holders, they will. So while uncle Jay can get you a job at xx where he works, do your Charles Schwab research and find out how "good" /solvent/stable that company is. I got outsourced from Disney of all people...

6. Ignore your family. You may have to work a night shift job. Or a weekend job. Deal with it. It may be all you can get. In addition with number (5) above, most of your jobs are going to come from networking. "Not what you know but who you know..." By getting your feet in the door, you can move on to other careers.

7. Keep your uniform at home. You're not in the military anymore. Don't critisize your coworkers for baggy pants, no socks, t-shirts un-tucked in, etc. Yes...I see that. Constantly. It gets old after a while. Yes. We know you have standards, etc. But really...no one cares. Trust me, they all know you're a vet. On vets day your company CEO will send out a pat letter "thanking our veterans, yada yada." Why...you may even get a free pair of tickets to a hockey game. "But I don't like hockey..." Take them. Shake their hand. Pray for their death...

8. Rethink your college. Go back to number (5). All about money babe. They want people cheap. Research a company you want. Look for a career there. Then use your GI Bill benefits to get you certifications in that area. Don't get the whole degree. Just the certs. I'm in I.T. - a degree is worthless. The protocols and tech change daily. But network certifications will make you look delicious without scaring them. Same with computer security certs. So use your GI Bill to enhance what you already have. To make you look desirable but not expensive. You have "experience" that kids won't have, but kids have the college. So having some college puts you ahead of them without making me the HR guy, think that you're going to want millions for salary.

9. Retirees only. Your pay may not be a lot but remember that civilians pay for their medical care at a much higher rate than you do. So mention that to the employer during your interview. I tell them I'm retired and usually get a few dollars per hour more.

Response by SPC Sheila Lewis made Jan 30 at 2017 3:42 PM

2017-01-30T15:42:34-05:00

No cool people to work with.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 30 at 2017 4:10 PM

2017-01-30T16:10:44-05:00

Difference in work ethic. Difference in mannerisms when dealing with supervisors. Keeping a stronger control on your tongue and thought process.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 30 at 2017 4:35 PM

2017-01-30T16:35:36-05:00

Problem with civilian work is getting one. Especially if they give you one of those personality test. We seen and done stuff they would not sream of. So we think differently. So those personality test are useless

Response by SPC Patrick Ansburg made Jan 30 at 2017 5:08 PM

2017-01-30T17:08:38-05:00

Finding proper employment

Response by LCpl Stephen Arnold made Jan 30 at 2017 5:15 PM

2017-01-30T17:15:25-05:00

I keep getting taco sauce in my beard, and it now hits my stomach when it used to hit the floor when I was on active. Also, I shoot much better now that I'm allowed to enjoy it. Having to wear a hat because my hair is messed up is kind of a bummer as well, and I sure as hell miss the sweet smell of KIWI in the morning!

Response by GySgt Melissa Gravila made Jan 30 at 2017 7:59 PM

2017-01-30T19:59:13-05:00

The hardest part for me was multi-fold
1. Civilians version of integrity and mine aren't the same (still haven't figured that out)
2. "Selling myself" without feeling like I'm bragging- it seems civilians have no problems whatsoever with this
3. I am way too straight forward, and a woman- therefore I'm an unapproachable bitch. I have been told I'm rough on the furniture, I need to be nicer, when I was with DOC I was even told by a mass murderer that I scared him! (I took that as a compliment actually)

Response by Lt Col James "Norm" Peterson made Jan 30 at 2017 10:21 PM

2017-01-30T22:21:40-05:00

Cultural stuff mostly.
1. Learning to "approach from curious." Instead of simply pointing out how something won't work, "Can you help me understand..." Civilian sensibilities are too fragile for a fighter pilot style debrief. One must learn to temper direct feedback.
2. Relationships matter more than performance. Not that connections couldn't help in the military, but if you were good it counted. Plenty of jerks got promoted because they were extremely effective. Network network network.
3. Get used to people overlooking your past experience or not realizing how concepts learned in the military can apply to many civilian situations. Learn to speak in concepts they can understand without using the military jargon.
And that's just to start...

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 31 at 2017 4:42 AM

2017-01-31T04:42:14-05:00

Taylor Driesell I have not transitioned out of the military yet, but for the transition from full-time civilian employment to full-time military it is a matter of change of lifestyle and getting used to the new process. I am assuming that it will be more difficult after doing 20 years to go to another profession that does not have the same "language" and different norms and structure.

Response by SPC Matthew Birkinbine made Jan 31 at 2017 5:40 AM

2017-01-31T05:40:39-05:00

As a mechanic, gaining a steady income so that my family and I can settle. I've never been paid by the job/car before. I can't guarantee my income so my family and I still aren't settled, over six months later. My household goods are in storage with the movers, and that storage has now converted to our expense, because we had NO idea the amount of problems we'd have settling, and I'm not going to allow the movers to just drop shipment into a storage unit so that we can't file a claim for anything broken when we do get our own place.

Response by SFC Jim Ruether made Feb 1 at 2017 6:24 PM

2017-02-01T18:24:32-05:00

I would guess not waking up to Reveille in the morning?

Response by MSgt Carl Stokes made Feb 1 at 2017 8:58 PM

2017-02-01T20:58:16-05:00

Dealing with shitvillions who have no idea what core values are, other that tag marks on a company letterhead. Ethics, leadership, seam to be foriegn in the civilian world its dog eat dog with team work serving as a catch phrase. I just struggle with the mentality of most civilians.

Response by SFC Carlos Prillwitz made Feb 1 at 2017 9:28 PM

2017-02-01T21:28:12-05:00

The hardest part about transitioning from the Military to civilian life is dealing with the civilians. It took a lot for me not to go off on some civilian for being a dumb ass. I worked at a job for about 9 months before I left and decided to go back to college. Another issue I had was when I was looking for work when I first retired. My resume was very detailed as to what I did in the Army and despite the fact that I had 14 years of experience in Logistics and I could probably do the job, these businesses would not hire me because I did not have a degree. It was quite disheartening to be told that even though you seem qualified to do the job, you do not have a degree. Hence, why I decided to use my benefits and go back to college and get my Business degree. I am shooting for my Masters in Business.

Response by SFC Richard Logue made Feb 1 at 2017 9:37 PM

2017-02-01T21:37:51-05:00

The lack of any camaraderie, the backstabbing, I could go on but it wasn't a pleasant experience. I became self employed in sales, and well, going from surveyor to sales is like night and day. Surveying was in transition to robotics, so no need for surveyors. Finding a skill or job that is in demand is required. The idea of you liking the job has no bearing when you have a family and bills. Finding a job you like is a pipe dream that very few people get to taste. Getting a job and doing the best you can is all you can ask for. Read "Gig Economy" that will help. As for finances realize that over 50% of retirees will declare bankruptcy with in 10 years of leaving the service. The pay differences are that great.

Response by SGT Cynthia Barnard made Feb 1 at 2017 11:58 PM

2017-02-01T23:58:58-05:00

No one seemed understand where they fit in the organization while in the military you have a clear chain of command and everybody knows what their job is in the civilian world no one seems to know what Lane they belong in

Response by MAJ Michael Sjostrom made Feb 2 at 2017 2:29 PM

2017-02-02T14:29:48-05:00

1. Culture change. In the military, we are one team moving in the same direction and everyone knows their place in the organization. No one feels slighted using the terms subordinates or ranks. Rank is earned and subordinates means you are part of a team with someone responsible for directing your professional development. Those terms are anathema in the civilian world.
2. Getting chewed out in the military is just part of life...it is never personal, and always professional. We learn to admit mistakes and work to fix them. In the civilian world, not so much.
3. Big financial change. Do not expect to be paid at the same level you were when you left service, especially if you stayed until retirement. Companies want experience, but do not want to pay for it - they are in business to make money and will always attempt to pay you as little as they can get away with. Oh, and you will pay for almost every benefit you get.
4. Civilians do not understand leadership; they confuse management with leadership. We all know there is a big difference.

Response by MSG John Duchesneau made Feb 15 at 2018 10:05 PM

2018-02-15T22:05:05-05:00

Gee.... I don't know.....maybe......GETTING A FREAKN JOB!!!