What’s the difference between being a US Navy Department Head or an Officer in Charge?

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 May 2018 12:36:32 -0400

I’m interesting to learn what’s the difference between being a Department Head in the Navy and an Officer in Charge (OIC)? It’s my understanding that Naval Officers don’t have the opportunity to command until the O-5 Level, where as Army and Marine Officers first command at the O-3 Level. In the Army Medical Department we have Branch and Division Chiefs which we value above those positions simply titled Officer in Charge. So many AMEDD officers seek Chief positions when not in command or when not serving as a primary BN or BDD staff officer. Any Navy folks out there that are willing to provide some insight into the differences and day to day duties of a Department or Division Head?

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2018 1:07 PM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 May 2018 13:07:59 -0400

A 'Department Head' is a position almost entirely exclusive to a ship. You are the officer that is the head of a particular department-- Operations, Engineering, Supply, etc. Different sized ships have different numbers (and ranks) of DH's. The very largest ships (the Aircraft Carriers) have O6, post-command officers as Department Heads for some departments. Most of the smaller ships DH's are O3-O4.

On shore commands, the people who do the exact same level of job as a Department Head on a ship are referred to as 'directorate heads' or something similar to that. We affectionately refer to ourselves as 'bubbas' most of the time.

Your levels of officers on a ship are Division Officers, Department Heads, then XO then CO.
Your basic levels of officers on staff duty are 'Action Officers', 'Directorate heads', and OICs (with some Chiefs of Staff, deputy OIC, other randomness thrown in depending on the staff.)

An OIC is a 'boss' that isn't a 'Commanding Officer'. Not exactly tied to only ships, but predominantly ships and fleets, a 'Commanding Officer' is (wait for it) in command of something. Most shore units don't have 'Commanding Officers'... they have 'Officers in Charge' or OIC's which do the exact same thing as CO's, but are 'in charge' of something rather than 'in command' of something. It is as semantic an argument as it can get with some potential ramifications regarding what types and levels of punishment can be wielded by an OIC vs. a CO... For all practical purposes-- the difference is semantic.

As to your specific question: differentiating between Department heads and OICs...
Apples and Oranges as one applies to sea duty and the other only applies to shore duty.
Depending on the size of the department or shore command-- ranks can vary across the board. I've seen everything from O6 Department Heads to O2 OIC (usually in charge of 'detachments' of small craft).

If none of this makes anything any more clear, and instead only leads to more confusion, please take comfort in the fact that you are a member of a very, very large club. I think the Navy does it on purpose... Just like we can't do rank like everyone else.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2018 1:31 PM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 May 2018 13:31:58 -0400

Hmmm-Well, I'm not aware of any restriction on an O3 (of the LINE) having command (or an O1 for that matter under extremis LOL!). I believe some O3's still command PCs (if they're still being used?), and I'm pretty sure an O3 can hold a DH billet, depending on the command/unit. I don't think any O4's command anything larger (such as a DDG)...but I'm basing that on experience, not hard data.

When I held my OIC billet, it was shoreside, in a reserve mobilization feeder unit...I've always presumed "OIC" in the Navy was a billet for a detachment, or an ashore unit not directly connected to an afloat command or squadron.

In general (and I'm open for correction), it was always my sense that the Army concerned itself more with such distinctions; the afloat Navy really simplifying (in broad terms) the COC as DIVO (O1-O2), DH (O3-O4), XO (O4-O5) and CO (O5-O6). As I recall, the NAV on a ship (other than a carrier) is usually an O3 and a DH, the OPSO normally an O4, and also a DH. As the Air DIVO (second tour) on an Amphib, there was a period where I was acting Air DH...until the new "AirBoss" arrived...so there's yet another "weird" one; an O2 holding the "titles" of "MiniBoss", Air DIVO, Acting Air DH and acting "Air Boss". In Afghanistan, I was the S-3 as an O3, but we didn't have sufficient manning for much more than a "heavy division", so no DIVOs or DHs.

Another possible "difference", again, based on my experience only...is that the Navy seems to regard grade as being "equal", regardless of billet. In other words, if an O3 is an OIC of a detachment, they are not "junior" to an O3 holding a DH billet in another command. Even when in the same COC, an XO who's an O4 and a DH level O4 are "peers"; though when it comes down to it, the XO "outweighs" the DH in terms of who "wins" an argument :)

It's probably more of a distinction between line and FSS grades.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2018 1:38 PM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 May 2018 13:38:47 -0400

In the Navy OICs are designated because the job is not significant enough to warrant a CO. For instance as an O-3 I had orders to San Antonio MEPS as the OIC. I would be in charge and have two other officers reporting to me AF, USA to round out the group of URL needed to swear in new recruits. Yet there are still "early command" opportunities where you can be a CO prior to reaching O-5. Big difference is some Title 10 stuff and NJP.

Response by MCPO Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2018 1:42 PM

MCPO Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 May 2018 13:42:01 -0400

I’m not in the Navy, nor have I ever been attached to the Navy. So please take this with the grain of salt that it is. In the interest of getting this discussion started, the Coast Guard does have very similar practices to that of the Navy. To clear the air a bit, an Officer in Charge (OIC) is a term used more at the Senior Enlisted levels. Some Senior Enlisted (in the Coast Guard) have their own commands. These are usually very small shore units. The Coast Guard’s smaller cutters, for example, can have an E-7 to E-9 in command of that boat and crew. Even Ensigns (O-1), usually CG Academy graduates, can be in command of that vessel on their first assignment post-graduation. Regardless of the pay grade (Senior Enlisted or Commissioned Officer) when in charge of cutter they are known as the “Commanding Officer” (CO).
Larger units, both at shore or sea, have Commissioned Officers in charge as the CO, usually O-5 or above. Department Heads or Division Branch Chiefs are leadership positions that are below both the “Commanding Officer” and “Officer-in-Charge” levels but affords these members a professional growth opportunity before they move up into the Executive Officer (XO) or Executive Petty Officer (XPO), depending of the CO’s pay grade and unit size. The pay grade assigned to Department Heads varies usually by unit size and number of personnel but in the Medical field it will almost always be a Commissioned Officer no lower than an O-4 or a Chief Warrant Officer (CWO).
I know this was more of a Navy question but I felt like writing something today. I hope it was useful.

Response by MCPO Roger Collins made May 29 at 2018 4:14 PM

MCPO Roger Collins — Tue, 29 May 2018 16:14:24 -0400

As an E-8, I replaced a CWO-4 as OIC NAVCOMMU Message Center, Cheltenham, MD. On board ship/submarine, despite being a Master Chief Petty Officer, the closest I could be to a Commissioned Officer status was a boatload of “O” Collateral duties.

Response by CWO4 Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2018 5:49 PM

CWO4 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 May 2018 17:49:08 -0400

Coast Guard OIC's are E7's - E9's and command SAR stations and Cutters. Department heads Are usually at the O4 or W2-4 levels.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2018 8:11 PM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 May 2018 20:11:30 -0400

The easy way to tell whether someone has been a CO or an OIC is by the little pin they wear-- about the size of a nickel. COs have a star, and OICs have a Trident. It is placed above the warfare pin while an officer is actively in the CO or OIC billet but moved below the warfare pin after they have completed the CO or OIC tour.

Response by SFC Ralph E Kelley made May 29 at 2018 9:10 PM

SFC Ralph E Kelley — Tue, 29 May 2018 21:10:49 -0400

Heads have to be cleaned often and OICs make sure by doing inspections? :D I really don't know since I was Army.

Response by LtCol Robert Quinter made May 29 at 2018 9:49 PM

LtCol Robert Quinter — Tue, 29 May 2018 21:49:04 -0400

An Officer in Charge has Article 15 authority while a Department Head must submit a complaint against on of his charges to the Commanding Officer.
Just to be picky, any officer in the Marine Corps may be the Commanding Officer of a designated unit if appointed by competent authority or through succession when the designated commanding officer is incapable of performing his duties or killed.
Referring to a Commanding Officer of the unit below the USMC Division or Wing level the commander is not traditionally correct since the term Commander is reserved for those in command of a unit normally led by a General Officer.

Response by LTJG Richard Bruce made May 29 at 2018 10:57 PM

LTJG Richard Bruce — Tue, 29 May 2018 22:57:52 -0400

USCGC Sockeye (WPB-87337) homeported in Bodega Bay, CA. Location where the movies, "The Fog" and "The Birds", were filmed. Officer-in-Charge is a Master Chief Petty Officer (E-9). There are 71 WPB's active in the fleet.

The Coast Guard Cutter SOCKEYE was built in September 2001 in Lockport, LA to replace the aging 82’ Pt. Chico. The Marine Protector Class WPBs feature a stern launched Rigid Hull Inflatable Boat (RHIB) used to assist in the cutter's various missions. The RHIB is a 17’ Zodiac Hurricane ® with a Hamilton jet drive. The stern launch system allows for quick launch and recovery of the RHIB, as well as improved crew safety.
Collocated with Station Bodega Bay in Bodega Bay, California, the SOCKEYE’s area of responsibility stretches from Mendocino County to the north, to Pt. Sur to the south, out to 200 nautical miles (NM) offshore. This expansive area includes the busy San Francisco Bay and Port of Oakland. The SOCKEYE is an 87’Coastal Patrol Boat providing multi-mission capability. Our missions include Search and Rescue (SAR), Law Enforcement (LE), Environmental Protection, and Homeland Security. USCGC SOCKEYE is part of Coast Guard Sector San Francisco, District 11, Pacific Area.
http://pacificsouthwest.coastguard.dodlive.mil/2013/07/11/riders-on-the-storm-patrolling-and-protecting-the-seas/

Riders on The Storm – Patrolling and protecting the seas « Coast Guard Pacific Southwest

Coast Guard units throughout the country are “located” within the communities they serve. Nowhere is that more true than on Doran Beach State Park in Bodega Bay, Calif. Because of its location, the Coast Guard Cutter Sockeye is what some in the service call a “hidden gem.”

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made May 30 at 2018 11:36 AM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 30 May 2018 11:36:33 -0400

Lots of great info on the structure of navy organization. And the Coast Guard is similar, but at the same time wildly different.
You could think of it as Division=Platoon, Department=Company, Ship (destroyer, SSN)= Battalion, ship (cruiser, carrier)=regiment/brigade. I think I recall that a Battalion CDR has legal responsibilities and rights that a company CDR doesn’t have. Just as a Battalion (theoretically) is a self-sustaining Unit, so to is a ship, whereas a company is dedicated (infantry, signal, etc) and therefore not self-sustaining, neither is a Department (admin, ops).
Course, the bigger the ship, the bigger the departments, which necessitate a higher rank.

An OIC is in Command, but doesn’t have the same authority under the law as a CO. Court martial authority being one. I confess I know little of it, as a Chaplain it’s not something I’ll likely have. Navy Chaplain corps only has one CO (the schoolhouse, and that was only to match the army and USAF schoolhouse CDRs when they merged). There is at least one chaplain OIC, maybe two. And most chaplains are Department heads in their Command.

https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/navy/dept-cvn-72.htm
This link has the departments on the USS Nimitz, and the Divisions within them. Example: Combat Systems is a Department, while within that department are divisions such as radar, fire control, and comms.

Again, add this to what the others have said for a more complete picture. Remember, a lot of how we are organized is from the days of sail. And a lot of how USCG is organized is from days of rescue/lifesaving service of isolated posts. Neat (to this history nerd) to learn the whys of why we’re so different.

Nimitz-class CVN - Departments & Divisions

Administration is one of the more diverse departments, claiming many ratings which add up to a group of experts on everything from personnel records to radio and television, education services to career counseling. Most aspects of administration amount to "customer service." The Administration Office implements the Plan of the Day and oversees the administrative functions of the ship. The Captain's Office is the administrative liaison for...