What's the main reason AD soldiers hate the national guard?

SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 18 Jan 2017 20:48:39 -0500

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 18 at 2017 9:02 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 18 Jan 2017 21:02:23 -0500

Not all Active Duty hate the Guard and Reserve.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 18 at 2017 9:16 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 18 Jan 2017 21:16:21 -0500

There is a perception of laxity that hangs over the part time Soldier's head. Some of this is justified, but it is what it is. I have seen it myself..and made many On The Spot Corretions near my reserve center. Soldiers with long hair, unkempt uniforms, and a body condition that must be the result of a lack of self-discipline to engage in some sort of physical fitness.

There is, more unfairly, an idea that the Part time Soldier is not as prepared or well trained to do the job of the military. I challenge this perception based on the units I have been in. Maybe I have been lucky, but we work our asses off during the weekends training to maintain our craft. With the switch from Strategic Reserve Forces to Operational Reserve Force, more and more of us will be call on to deploy and take on world wide missions, directly and in support of active duty missions.

Response by CSM Michael J. Uhlig made Jan 18 at 2017 9:19 PM

CSM Michael J. Uhlig — Wed, 18 Jan 2017 21:19:32 -0500

Active Duty Soldiers do not hate reserve component (Reserve/National Guard) Soldiers, they might envy them that some have the opportunity to live in/around a familiar community. There are many with an elitist façade that one is better then the other however, those of us that are seasoned enough understand the value of each facet within these components and it is up to us to learn the rest!

While those on active duty might have particular strengths in one field/area, those in our reserve component bring an equal strength in their own right and often have specialized areas spanning multiple fields, whether it be the business, educational, science or technical industries it goes to strengthen our overall force and makes us more capable and a better force...don't get caught up in thinking that one hates the other, each brings their own strengths to make the whole better than its parts.

Response by MSG Steve Wiersgalla made Jan 18 at 2017 9:32 PM

MSG Steve Wiersgalla — Wed, 18 Jan 2017 21:32:32 -0500

Mainly because of a stupid stereotype! I have served on both sides of the fence. The one thing Active Soldiers don't understand is that the same rules and regs apply for the most part, except the National Guard has a whole lot less time to maintain the same standards and levels of readiness. The training plans for Guard units can become very overwhelming. When I first went into the Guard from Active Duty I had a chip on my shoulder thinking I was something better, but I very quickly changed my mind as I could see all the heart and soul that the soldiers put in. There are a defined amount of training hours allotted per year and training plans have to be packed tight.

With the current level of the Active Army the National Guard has become a regular part of the deployment cycles. Of course the "sexy" missions are usually reserve for the Active units. But my thoughts are we are all doing necessary missions. Of course soldiers don't always understand that. The unit that I was part of recently did a Gunnery cycle then NTC train up and Gunnery then NTC rotation and are now slotted for deployment to Europe. all in three years. Very ambitious schedule for a bunch of "Nasty Girls"

Response by CPT Jim Schwebach made Jan 18 at 2017 10:30 PM

CPT Jim Schwebach — Wed, 18 Jan 2017 22:30:48 -0500

In the unlikely event that they do, it's because they are ill-informed or need to have their headspace adjusted.

Response by SGT Christopher Hayden made Jan 19 at 2017 1:36 AM

SGT Christopher Hayden — Thu, 19 Jan 2017 01:36:56 -0500

I never "hated" the National Guard. However, I think some of them tend to forget that while they may hold the same MOS, rank, TIS, etc, they aren't equals to Active Duty in the grand scheme of things. Active Duty troops eat, sleep, and live the Army 24/7, whereas the NGs don't (obviously). If you're meeting once a month for a couple of days, how are you going to ever gain the same experience as someone doing it the entire month? You can't. Not their fault, but that's how it goes.

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Jan 19 at 2017 6:44 AM

SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth — Thu, 19 Jan 2017 06:44:43 -0500

Last I had heard was because the Guards doesn't have to rely on the Fed's for money for equipment, and Guardsmen didn't have to pay for the clothing issue.

Response by SFC Dennis A. made Jan 19 at 2017 8:27 AM

SFC Dennis A. — Thu, 19 Jan 2017 08:27:31 -0500

I don't think that most active duty soldier's hate the Guard and Reserve as much as there is a misunderstanding of differences in the three systems. I work with a young man who is in the National Guard, on occasion he'll tell me about having to do something within the NG system and he could just as well be speaking to me in Greek. The forms are different, the names are different, procedures are different. We are all the same just a little different.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 19 at 2017 9:04 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 19 Jan 2017 09:04:06 -0500

The Guard units that I've been in have outperformed the AD units that we've operated with or under. In most cases the Guard units made the AD units look like the stereotype of a Guard unit. On my first deployment there was a little bit of hate received from the AD unit that we replaced. Beyond that any negative comments that I've witnessed have come from keyboard warriors...usually from the Infancy.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 19 at 2017 10:55 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 19 Jan 2017 10:55:59 -0500

SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member I don't hate NG Soldiers, I have seen shit Soldiers that fit the mold of what you would expect from a "weekend warrior" on AD many times (Fat, no haircut, uniform looking like shit, etc)

Response by CSM Thomas McGarry made Jan 19 at 2017 11:05 AM

CSM Thomas McGarry — Thu, 19 Jan 2017 11:05:24 -0500

Not sure if this is true! When I left active duty I then served in both the NYANG and Army Reserves as a Medical NCO to 1st SGT. Some of the discipline was a little more lax in both Guard and Reserves but when we were activated and deployed we had soldiers including Doctors who seem to have more clinical and hands on expertise than their Active duty counterparts-that may have caused some resentment.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 19 at 2017 6:40 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 19 Jan 2017 18:40:19 -0500

Because here in the Regular Army we're better than you, and we know it!

Joking aside, I think a lot of it stems form the "Us vs. Them" mentality that pervades a lot of organizations. They are "the others". I don't know what they do, but they are part-timers-there's no way they are as squared away as we are. A lot of us in the Signal community know better-those Reserve and Guard units are usually miles ahead of us on a technical level because can apply their skills every day in their civilian jobs while our training is diluted by a thousand other requirements.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 20 at 2017 1:08 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 20 Jan 2017 13:08:55 -0500

until I recently served with some NG guys, I thought they were all turds and dirtbags like the ones I had seen in public a few times. But after having a bunch of them attached to my unit I saw that their standards aren't lower than ours, they have just as many squared away soldiers as we do (percentage wise). The reason you always only see dirtbags, is they are the ones that keep their uniforms on after drill and go out places.

Response by SSG Brian Kresge made Jan 22 at 2017 8:25 PM

SSG Brian Kresge — Sun, 22 Jan 2017 20:25:35 -0500

It's mostly just a variant of chauvinism, like when I sneer at legs.

I enjoyed my Active Duty time tremendously. In fact, one of my first experiences at Fort Campbell was when our unit was responsible for assessing TPUs for a unit from the Indiana National Guard during their annual training. What was a PFC from the Rakkasans going to tell a 30-year SFC platoon sergeant in the Guard infantry? Not much. But I ate, slept, and breathed fieldcraft, with the 101st and with 1/501 PIR in Alaska, and the differences were stark when I went to Guard LRSD and later the Guard Stryker Brigade.
PT failures and height/weight failures were more likely. And then, interestingly, I observed the same sort of chauvinism, only this time with Guard infantry looking down on Guard combat service and support. Having, for instance, an overweight Guardsman who deployed once--with the Guard--call me a "pogue" after I changed to CS after 20 years a paratrooper and lightfighter...there's always a hierarchy to it.

I love the Guard, and fully recognize that I'm not in the peak shape or trigger pulling capability I was 20 years ago. But 20 years ago, I couldn't both have a lucrative civilian career AND leverage the experience and capabilities garnered there in my role in the military. And I do things, such as responding to disasters in my state and community and a myriad of other roles that Title 10 soldiers cannot by reasons of law. We compliment each other.

I'll weather AD looking down on me just fine. Mature soldiers know the deal. I'm just so grateful to be able to still have the opportunity to serve and still have a life away from the military until necessary.

Response by TSgt Denise Moody made Jan 22 at 2017 9:24 PM

TSgt Denise Moody — Sun, 22 Jan 2017 21:24:14 -0500

I don't know if any AD hate the Guard. But, we used to. Yes, when I was active duty we thought the Guard was a joke. Why? Because when we had to work with them on their two weeks active (hospital) they were lame. Then fast forward a few years. I had gotten out of active and like some of my friends decided I didn't want to totally give up the uniform so I joined the ANG.

That was a time of transformation in the ANG, at least that was my experience. The Guard, who had never been inspected before, were going to be inspected. Wow. It certainly helped units to had prior actives. By the time I got to Headquarters we were starting to do our own inspections. The Guard was having to meet the same standards.

By the time Desert Storm was over the attitude toward the guard was much different.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 23 at 2017 2:55 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 23 Jan 2017 02:55:02 -0500

My guard units old CCMSgt said it best, the "active duty is the big brother, the reserves is the little brother trying to be the big brother, and the guard is the middle brother that does not give a fuck". What he was meaning is that in his experience and mine as well, the reserves has a lot of people that over use the authority they have in the military to make up for the lack of authority in their day to day life. While the guard has a few of those, they seem to get their perverbial Pee-pee slapped for acting that way.
While preparing to deploy, my UDM got an email from the unit that we were replacing and he insinuated that because we were guard that we would be ineligible for certain jobs over there. We were deploying as in a law enforcement capacity, two of the people on the deployment team were and are civilian cops, wouldn't it make sense to utilize our training and experience from both years of military law enforcement as well as civilian? That's the benifit the active duty gets when a reserve/guard unit is activated, the troop not only has military experience but civilan as well.

Response by Jerry Rivas made Jan 23 at 2017 7:44 AM

Jerry Rivas — Mon, 23 Jan 2017 07:44:55 -0500

Ignorance?

Response by MSgt Carl Stokes made Jan 23 at 2017 6:25 PM

MSgt Carl Stokes — Mon, 23 Jan 2017 18:25:13 -0500

The truth of the matter is AD has to stay in the suck where NG get to go to FT Living-room, But the largest part of NG/Reserves are prior service and know when the shit gets real to be squared away.

Response by SGT Jason Keefer made Jan 23 at 2017 11:54 PM

SGT Jason Keefer — Mon, 23 Jan 2017 23:54:18 -0500

When I was deployed to Camp Beurhring, the Guard was in charge of the Camp. They ran all aspects of the Camp. While the Active soldiers slept in 50 man tents, the Guard lived in 2 to a room trailers. They wore civilian clothes to the gym. They drove HMMVs as personal vehicles, out of uniform and generally acted like they were on vacation. Naturally, we developed a distaste.

Response by LTC John Paul Cook made Jan 24 at 2017 8:53 AM

LTC John Paul Cook — Tue, 24 Jan 2017 08:53:57 -0500

As many have pointed out, much of the lingering bias within the Active Component (AC) toward their Reserve Component (RC) (Guard & Reserve) stems from the Cold War (Pre-Gulf War) days when the RC's role was largely strategic and domestic in nature.

The RC quickly learned from the hiccups experienced during the Gulf War and further refined themselves during the deployments of the 1990s. The RC (particularly Guard) response to the attacks of 9/11 was impressive and has only improved. Recommendations by the Commission on National Guard and Reserve (CNGR), Army Initiative 4 (AI4), and the Total Force Policy institutionalized the Operational Reserve as a critical component of the National Security/Defense capability.

The duel role of the Guard (Title 10 (Federal) and Title 32 (State)) enables the Guard to competently support both the Defense and Homeland Security Departments ... a unique capability recognized by the Chief receiving a 4th Star and seat at the "Joint" table with the other Service Chiefs.

As the nature of 21st Century warfare continues to be defined, what is certain is the Guard is certainly part of it. As the first line Homeland Defense Force they will continue being a critical part of local, state and regional security response. As the AC realigns its Force Structure the Guard is well suited to assume capabilities that maintain legacy deterrence value while the AC adapts to focus on effectively defeating emerging threats.

Although I could easily go on at length (if any one wants to continue off-line feel free to reach out directly) I will wrap up with this thought. Today, the preponderance of AC members recognize the professionalism of the RC and respect them accordingly. They acknowledge that any disparities associated with part-time service is quickly overcome after mobilization. Those that harbor bias, do so more out of envy (duel career competency of RC members) and fear (transition of Force Structure). Gratefully, through the Continuum of Service (COS) opportunities, most AC members are afforded ample opportunities to continue servicing by experiencing the RC lifestyle for themselves.

Response by SPC Douglas Hemmingway made Jan 24 at 2017 2:22 PM

SPC Douglas Hemmingway — Tue, 24 Jan 2017 14:22:00 -0500

I have wondered this myself.

Response by LTC Erik Spike Thiesmeyer, Sr. made Jan 25 at 2017 12:50 AM

LTC Erik Spike Thiesmeyer, Sr. — Wed, 25 Jan 2017 00:50:25 -0500

Ignorance. Plain and simple. They don't know how hard it can be to maintain the exact same standards as the active duty, yet at a fraction of the time. And fraction of the pay! I served on AD first and heard the jokes; "nasty guard", etc. But then when I joined the guard myself I found a wealth of experience and professionalism that was missing from the AD. In the guard, officers and NCOs and had been doing their jobs for years, decades even. In the warrant officer corps, most were Viet Nam veterans. Not Viet Nam era, actual combat veterans. Sure they were older, but they were extremely seasoned and knowledgable. In the guard and reserve aviation units I served in, every aviator was a professional pilot in the civilian world; law enforcement, ems, and of course the airlines. They had ten-fold the flight experience as their AD counterparts. One thing that bothered me was the Aviation Career Incentive Pay. Active Duty, Guard and Reserve aviators have to maintain the exact same standards for flight time, sim time, check rides, physicals, everything. Yet, the guard/reserve pilot get 1/30th of his ACIP for each day he works. Not the full amount as the AD pilot gets. We do the exact same job, spend the same amount of time in the air risking our butts and get a fraction of the incentive . 8 years after retirement and I am still bothered by it. And lets not forget that guard/reserve personnel have to wait until age 60 to draw their retirement. But I digress.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made May 18 at 2017 1:51 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 18 May 2017 13:51:06 -0400

Observed lack of proficiency and professionalism.

That's what I personally observed and experienced with in the reserve after having been in active duty.

Inability to get anything done. Can't train a soldier when their AGR training NCO sets up a drill to have formations, power point presentations on SHARP, EO, and suicide prevention which seemingly have become the main event and oftentimes only training I've observed for drill periods.

Lest anyone asks, if I had the authority to change it, I would.

Response by SPC Roger D. Pemberton Jr. made May 18 at 2017 6:00 PM

SPC Roger D. Pemberton Jr. — Thu, 18 May 2017 18:00:20 -0400

Coming from both sides of the fence as well I would generally tend to agree. I would also agree that that opinion needs to go by the way side because it is based on an old image. The National Guard has the same mandatory training as active duty to fit into 1 weekend a month plus 2 weeks out of the year. The unit I was in before I was medically retired was a very tight knit group. Those of us that had been around for awhile did go by first names for the most part. It wasn't for a lack of respect in fact there was probably more. The NCO's didn't have to rely on their rank for respect, they were respected because of the people they were. To me that's more important than rank. Of course not to mention the fact we were a much more diverse group because we were civilian police and skilled trades to everything in between. We were attached to the 82nd in Iraq in 03 and they didn't want to let us go home when it was time. We must not have been too bad.

Response by SPC Frank Novosel made May 18 at 2017 6:49 PM

SPC Frank Novosel — Thu, 18 May 2017 18:49:23 -0400

Personally I liked the change to national guard when I left active I did not have to jump to parade rest or attention all the fucking time or say Sargent ten thousand times per day I think active duty can learn a thing or two from the guard you can still train and get you job done without haveing to act brain washed it's ok to be human you know

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made May 18 at 2017 7:55 PM

CPL Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 18 May 2017 19:55:21 -0400

I'll never forget our field training exercise in ait thinking "I really hope no ones life ever depends on this person" and 9/10 they were national guard. They're unmotivated, satisfied with average, and they're usually ate up. Active duty takes their job a little more serious. NG has their place and I'm happy they get s real life and college, but they need to realize who's superior. AD

Response by PO3 Todd Spencer made May 19 at 2017 1:39 AM

PO3 Todd Spencer — Fri, 19 May 2017 01:39:53 -0400

Having seen both sides, I can say being Active is much easier than being a Guard or Reservist. Being Active you only have to worry about active things. I mean yes you have family, and loved ones and I am in no way taking away from that at all. However as a Guardsman or Reservist you worry about military readiness yes, but also family, civilian jobs, income, housing, and for most you worry about benefits and remaining deploy-able (That may be different from state to state.) I know the law is supposed to protect a reservists job, but that usually means employers just find another reason to let you go. I know pre-9/11, There was a lot of concern about reservists not having the right mindset, Being in a civilian atmosphere most of the time, thinking like a family man or woman and not a soldier. That was blown out of the water. It is true... there was a time when the Guard or Reserve sat around and drank beer and were very informal in places. That wasn't all of them, and again you can find good and bad in any organization. I miss both. I still wake up on Saturday mornings expecting a 5988 to be shoved in my face. Neither is better or worse. BUT they are different. To go back and do it again... I would choose active all the way. They kept me busy 24/7 and I never had time to worry about if my dentist is going to accept my HMO or that I had to miss my appointment due to last minute orders for hurricane relief, or if my job will take my word until my paperwork comes in from a deployment or if my rent will get paid because I am missing time at work during an AT with a pay problem, or any number of other things when too many people try to capitalize on your time. However I do agree that there was that reputation from Active to Reserve but I think that has gone away except by a few.

Response by LCpl Folsom White made May 19 at 2017 10:39 AM

LCpl Folsom White — Fri, 19 May 2017 10:39:19 -0400

I spent 4 years active duty marine corps, and have no combat experience, 79-83. My experience with guard and reserve are those I have met in the civilian work place. I've met some who were overweight and out of shape, I've met those who whined and cried every time their training week end approached. But I can honestly say, the majority of the guardsmen and reservists that I have met and worked with, considered themselves professional soldiers, sailors, marines, airmen, and guardians. Their attitude towards maintaining good discipline and their military bearing reflected in their civilian jobs.

Response by CPL David Bartlett made May 19 at 2017 12:48 PM

CPL David Bartlett — Fri, 19 May 2017 12:48:01 -0400

Ng and Reserve units were called up in Vietnam to increase the troop strength, guys joined up thinking they wouldn't go to Vietnam. Then the draft was revised then eliminated. 'US' was the draftee designation for a soldier and they were the backbone really.NG and Reserve guys deserve some respect as they help maintain troop strength. Btw draftees were assigned a reserve unit after service and could be recalled for years after if the need arose. Be glad you have bullets after the last WH jerk !

Response by TSgt Private RallyPoint Member made May 19 at 2017 5:31 PM

TSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 19 May 2017 17:31:29 -0400

military sucks

Response by Col Private RallyPoint Member made May 19 at 2017 7:11 PM

Col Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 19 May 2017 19:11:17 -0400

1. They walk into legislative offices at will while the AD can't. 2. The officer training is unprofessional and the officers are not held to the same standards. They walk around in public, shopping, overweight and no cover on their craniums. 3. They're not ready for the combat zone. Many have to be retrained or spend a lot of time at the Dental Clinic or Hospital getting treatment. 4. They're completely political. If you rose to Lt. Col. you probably did so through some form of political favor. 5. They give out one-star promotions on their last day and the individual actually believes they're generals. You can't throw a rock without hitting a Guard general who probably was an 05 on their last day. 6. They're not subject to the UCMJ. 7. 3% of the Reserve is full-time AGR while 33% of the Guard is full-time AGR...and they never have to move! 8. NAUGUS lobbies against the AD in front of Congress and Congress, who considers the Guard their pets, do whatever they say. And that money comes from the AD revenue stream. 8. Read the series of articles that USA Today did on about 25 Adjutants General. Criminal behavior. 9. There are 54 States and Territories with Guard units. Each one of those couldn't care less about the other 53...their State is their world so their scope is tiny. 10. Their governors and congressmen protect them.

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made May 19 at 2017 10:17 PM

PO2 Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 19 May 2017 22:17:35 -0400

I've served in the regular army and now I've been in the national Guard for 11 years. The thing that stands out the most to be is the proper Military bearing between senior and lower ranking soldiers and the fact that a lot of national Guard soldiers don't know how to do their job efficiently because you can't learn a job in 34 days a year unlike active duty over 300 days a year

Response by PVT Private RallyPoint Member made May 20 at 2017 2:28 AM

PVT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 20 May 2017 02:28:55 -0400

Me being a private JORTC and a 4th generation vet I can proudly proclaim that the reason they hate it is Because things never work out they aren't told or informed about much of anything

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 20 at 2017 4:46 AM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 20 May 2017 04:46:02 -0400

I've had this discussion with a few buddies of mine that are in the guard. From they're perspective, they say they do much more work and how they hate waking up so early, having to shave, etc. what I always say is, you only do that what? 1 weekend per month and 2 weeks per year? That's to easy. I do that every day, for the past 3 years. Plus, being in the infantry it's more physically demanding. I wouldn't say that I hate people in the guard, I would say that I hate when they complain about their job being so hard.

Response by CPL Jose Bautista made May 20 at 2017 1:48 PM

CPL Jose Bautista — Sat, 20 May 2017 13:48:33 -0400

I agree 100% with MSG Steve Wiersgalla! I served on all 3 components of the Army. However, I must add that the discipline is different in my experience. What Guard lacks in common military discipline and education they more than make up in higher education. Sometimes the enlisted are more educated than the officers.

Response by SGT Dane Checolinski made May 20 at 2017 3:01 PM

SGT Dane Checolinski — Sat, 20 May 2017 15:01:05 -0400

I was an army reservist. The active duty loved national guard and reservist construction engineer units. Many of us worked full time in the trades (carpentry, electrician, etcc...). Everywhere we want in Afghanistan the combat units were excited to see us because when we built shelters, maintencs sheds or anything... it was quality, we didn't screw around and didn't need to wait for orders to start building. We just did it. I can speak for all MOSs but as far as construction goes. It was clear AD preferred vertical engineering units from the NG or reserve over other AD.

Response by Sgt Jim Dunn made May 20 at 2017 6:00 PM

Sgt Jim Dunn — Sat, 20 May 2017 18:00:24 -0400

In my time all they did was dress up and play soldiers 2 weeks a year. Then they went home to their families. They would show up with shaggy hair and complain constantly about how hot it was. A buch of babies.

Response by Chris Cornwall made May 20 at 2017 7:37 PM

Chris Cornwall — Sat, 20 May 2017 19:37:00 -0400

To me active duty and national guard are one in the save, they are both US Army, they are both all they can be. National guard started out as a militia way back in the day. Active duty men and women has no right to hate another when they been around just as long.

Response by SSgt Al Allen made May 20 at 2017 9:23 PM

SSgt Al Allen — Sat, 20 May 2017 21:23:34 -0400

Maybe because they have the best of both worlds !

Response by SPC Chris Ashman made May 20 at 2017 9:39 PM

SPC Chris Ashman — Sat, 20 May 2017 21:39:01 -0400

I dont know, I was both? I disliked the National Guard because it seemed Ate Up since it was an every day gig. However many NG guys could spit out plenty AD guys as well.

Response by COL Robert Davidson made May 21 at 2017 9:55 AM

COL Robert Davidson — Sun, 21 May 2017 09:55:13 -0400

For the haters out there, especially those who served from 03 on; without the ARNG, the RA could not have reset itself for ARFORGEN. No reset, would have meant more frequent deployments and other affects to PCS and schools schedules. Are there differences, sure! But, the ARNG units I was exposed to learned quickly and performed well, especially CO and below. One concern I saw come to life was senior leader C4ISR skill sets. It's hard to build and maintain these particular skills given their limited training time. As unit CDRs, they are focused on their units readiness and not their own. It's a mistake to think we can build a 25 year experienced BDE CDR on a weekend a month and two weeks a year.

Response by SGT Sam Zimmerman made May 21 at 2017 11:14 AM

SGT Sam Zimmerman — Sun, 21 May 2017 11:14:26 -0400

My unimportant opinion goes from my experience with RA (regular army) NG (National Guard) and AR (Army Reserve). I noticed in Basic that these categories were different, and most were holding jobs or going to school as well as doing the Army thing. It was a good deal, but the active duty guys looked at the "Weekend Warriors" more or less as support, or not taken too seriously. They took a lot of crap for us guys on active duty, but really, most were good guys that were trying to get a leg up in life. Which, in turn, made for a bit of jealous feelings from the troops that were not going home after BCT/AIT. Salute to all Veterans

Response by CW4 Dennis Busch made May 21 at 2017 12:28 PM

CW4 Dennis Busch — Sun, 21 May 2017 12:28:20 -0400

Not one single reason, and it's certainly not "hate". But there are some inequalities...in aviation anyway. A young WO1 gets through flight school, and it's usually a career of on advanced aircraft and a speciality (instructor, maintenance officer, etc)

Most friends in the NG that I know, 1. Male rank quicker 2. Spend a LOT of money at Ft Rucker! ( I have friends with Chinook transition, Blackhawk, Transition, Fixed Wing School, Instructor Pilot Schools in three aircraft, maintenance pilot course in three aircraft, etc etc etc). 3. Have priority for dates AT Ft Rucker with the reason "my state is paying for it".

Response by MCPO Dennis Bullock made May 21 at 2017 12:38 PM

MCPO Dennis Bullock — Sun, 21 May 2017 12:38:04 -0400

Lack of military bearing

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 21 at 2017 2:44 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 21 May 2017 14:44:44 -0400

I've seen many posts about how AG/NR has changed since "back in the day". I'm AD and have been around AG/NR since '09 in various environments. To this day, I have met only ONE person (they're NR) that did not treat AD like we're lowly subjects or act like they were owed something for giving up their 1 and 2. Is that to say they're all like that? No, but at 8 years (and counting), it's not a great track record either.

Response by SGT Scott Stancik made May 21 at 2017 4:37 PM

SGT Scott Stancik — Sun, 21 May 2017 16:37:11 -0400

Not so much "hate" and many NG guys (or women) used to be RA. But yes, a good number of Active Duty guys will , maybe even subconsciously look down on people who just did NG as in, they haven't had to experience the "life" of an active duty soldier....having people bang on your barracks door on Sunday morning because Joe beat his wife up last night, ......stopped multiple suicide attempts while on CQ, talked down men with severe PTSD, had your barracks room robbed of pretty much everything while you were at the gym, talking to CID about a male on male rape in the barracks, or,just life in general as a young soldier you don't "go home" to your life and family after a drill weekend, you come out of 12 days of FTX during a brutal Ft. Drum weekend, get back to your noisy crowded barracks, dead tired, to only face a barracks inspection or some other dumb shit. 3 days later, get a call from the Champion NY police that one of your Joes passed out in a mini mart......."home"? My home was conditions an inmate in prison would balk at, and this was after coming back from a year overseas in the suck..I couldn't even find a place to beat my dick..let alone relax or unwind mentally, these NG dudes drill and then it's back to normal life..my life at Ft Drum was a frenetic slow decline into severe mental illness and despair, I saw more stuff on CQ alone, that would have most people on meds ....I'm an ex-11B,Active Duty, was stationed at Ft. Drum and left part of my soul there, along with my hopes and dreams :) so yes, I guess I can say, if you haven't endured the Active Duty life at some point I'm going to have an internal bias against you, I'm sorry, I can't change that. When guys tell me they were NG 88M's who deployed to Kuwait and their life sucks because they have to do 2 weeks at Ft Pickett this Summer, deep inside I'm rolling my eyes......

Response by SSG Rick Burrell made May 21 at 2017 7:56 PM

SSG Rick Burrell — Sun, 21 May 2017 19:56:33 -0400

Back in the 80's the Natl Guard didn't go anywhere. You could go your whole career without leaving the states. Not the case nowadays

Response by SFC Pedro Pena made May 21 at 2017 11:26 PM

SFC Pedro Pena — Sun, 21 May 2017 23:26:32 -0400

Because they live by the good old boy way, to much favoritism they don't always take their training serious, I saw it first hand and also trained them need to do more serious training and less crying about the training they get need to be as real as possible the enemy you face will not give you a break

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made May 22 at 2017 1:05 PM

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 May 2017 13:05:43 -0400

NG learns more in a weekend then a whole month

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 22 at 2017 1:19 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 May 2017 13:19:42 -0400

I have no problem with actual Guardsmen. The NG is there for a reason and they serve their purpose well. National Guard Recruiters though.... I might have some hate in my heart for those guys.

As an AD and Reserve Recruiter, I get at least 7 or 8 Guardsmen in the office a month trying to go active or reserve because their NG recruiters weren't exactly 100% truthful.

Response by LCpl Michael Gilbert made May 22 at 2017 1:20 PM

LCpl Michael Gilbert — Mon, 22 May 2017 13:20:37 -0400

As a Marine i didnt deal a whole lot (almost at all truthfully) qith the ANG, but we DID have Marine Reservists. I will preface this with the fact that i was in Iraq with some great super squared away hard charging reservists. However, the overwhelming majority never maintained grooming standards except during drill (i dont care if they're allowed to do it or not- thats negative points against them), several had to be retrained on their jobs EVERY TIME THEY DRILLED. They usually ended up wearing the uniform wrong which makes ALL of us look bad, and knew several who spent their time in their reserve unit, and did literally nothing but train for 38 days a year and then run around spouting about being veterans and deserving respect for their "service". Sorry. You did nothing. You do not deserve respect for your "service" to yourself. I will grant that they deserve respect for taking that chance, but its not the same.

Response by SGT Michael Klein made May 22 at 2017 3:08 PM

SGT Michael Klein — Mon, 22 May 2017 15:08:57 -0400

I served in a National Guard Combat Engineer Unit. We had our share of knuckleheads in our company, but I will say this, we trained our butts off in the little time we had on the weekends and at summer camp.

Some weekends I would work a full shift in my civilian job on Friday, go to formation Friday afternoon, load up and convoy across state to our training center. Set up Saturday morning, train all day get a few hours of sleep Saturday night, tear down, head back home Sunday afternoon, clean and stow our gear and then get up for work then next Monday.

Think of the National Guard doing 50 to 75% of the training active duty units do but in one tenth the time.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 22 at 2017 3:35 PM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 May 2017 15:35:01 -0400

As a 89B Ammuntion Specialist; Honestly it's just in some case we have to stop everything we are doing to teach them what they should have learned in AIT which slows everything down and lot of time we have to pick up the slack or fix the mistakes.

Response by LTC Silviu Bora made May 22 at 2017 3:37 PM

LTC Silviu Bora — Mon, 22 May 2017 15:37:15 -0400

I spent 9.5 years Active and 12.5 in the reserves. The biggest difference is that Active Duty get paid to train Full time and the ARNG or Reserves have to do the same or more in significantly less time. So of course there is a difference. AD gets 24 hours a day 7 days a week to train. ARNG gets 12 x 2 + 14. 48 days minimum and as an aviator you maintain the same standards as AD Aviator but you have to do it while you work a full time job. So kiss my you know what if you disrespect your Bro.

Response by TSgt Julie Miller made May 22 at 2017 3:53 PM

TSgt Julie Miller — Mon, 22 May 2017 15:53:50 -0400

The problem is not always Active Duty vs National Guard.... but more in line with how each individual represents themselves. I've worked side by side throughout my entire career with Active, Guard and Reserves. What I've learned is while one person fully and totally represents the best part of being a team member, another one can't figure it out.
I worked with the Nat'l Guard in Hawaii and loved dealing with the section chief of the section I routinely did business with, yet his subordinate treated the job like a paycheck only... not only could he not do any part of the job, but goofed off every chance he had....
While deployed to the Desert, I worked with some really awesome soldiers..... many of them guard and a few reserve... as well as a lot of active duty... the problem I kept running into with the some of the guard/reserves was their in ability to work within regulations... Too many of them tried to run their units like they ran their civilian offices and shops back home.....
The long and the short of it is this.... regardless of duty status, each person who elects to wear that uniform needs to understand they are and always be part of the team and the whole mission.... otherwise, get out and work for yourself.....

To All my brothers and sisters in uniform past, present and future.... Thank you for being part of my family.

Response by LT Louis McKellar made May 22 at 2017 4:05 PM

LT Louis McKellar — Mon, 22 May 2017 16:05:51 -0400

As an AFRES NCO and a Navy TAR (training and administration of reserves), I've seen both sides. I served as a department head on three Navy ships, one of them forward deployed during Desert Storm. I got to the ship without knowing who was the reservist and who was active duty. In most instances, the SELRES brought additional skills to the equation.

As a reserve center CO, I had medical officers who would be extended on ACDUTRA to teach latest procedures to military doctors. In my last duty station before I retired, had an O6 who would go over to the UK to stand in for the CSO of CINCUSNAVEUR when he wanted to take leave. Also had an O6 who was recalled to active duty to assume command of a Navy ship to transit from Charleston to Naples.

Response by MAJ Kevin Miller made May 22 at 2017 4:58 PM

MAJ Kevin Miller — Mon, 22 May 2017 16:58:47 -0400

Because they have never been a part of a good guard unit. There are good units and there are dirtbag units in all sectors: guard, reserve, and active. Every time my unit went to annual training at an active base we out performed and out produced the active units there. Guard units train just a weekend a month and two weeks annually, but they may do that in the same unit over many years so in effect we raise our own up through the ranks and build our team from the bottom up and the top down working together over many years.

Response by Capt Glen Biddle made May 22 at 2017 5:08 PM

Capt Glen Biddle — Mon, 22 May 2017 17:08:48 -0400

In the Air Guard, I was in Security Forces squadron. We had state police, county police officers that had tons of LE experience that ran rings around the active duty. In fact our leadership ran the AD guys while deployed because they were so ate up.

Response by SSG Grant Hansen made May 22 at 2017 6:09 PM

SSG Grant Hansen — Mon, 22 May 2017 18:09:34 -0400

Active component has a misguided idea that because the Guard and Reserve often call each other by name and not rank, that they are somehow lacking in military knowledge, skill or professionalism.

What they don't realize is that quite often these soldiers are friends from grade school, related or both. A lowly E-4 might own a business and his Pat Ldr might be his employee. They also don't often realize that E-5 with 17 years in service hasn't been promoted because nobody above him has left or been promoted in the last 8 years, so he can't be promoted. It's not that he's an idiot or unworthy of promotion, he just can't be promoted because there aren't any slots open.

Finally, due to the limited nature of training time, a lot of the time wasting BS you see in the active military just isn't tolerated in the Guard and Reserve.

All of this makes for an atmosphere that the active military is confused by and they equate with unprofessional and unorthodox behavior.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made May 22 at 2017 6:35 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 May 2017 18:35:59 -0400

Is this still a thing?

I honestly don't care, and those who make this an issue evidently have "adequacy" issues. Phallus minimus is not a good thing.

Response by SFC Mark Pfeiffer made May 22 at 2017 6:50 PM

SFC Mark Pfeiffer — Mon, 22 May 2017 18:50:53 -0400

I've been on both sides of the fence. Active personnel usually don't understand the reasons each component exists. To sum it up in short...
The active component exists to handle emergent situations. In the case the emergent situation grows, the active components' job is to hold the line until the reserve components can be mobilized.
The reserve components' job is to support the active component. In the case the active component is fully involved and more help is needed, the reserve components' job is to help hold the line until the nation can be mobilized.

SFC, USA/R (ret)

Response by SCPO John-florida Killin made May 22 at 2017 7:47 PM

SCPO John-florida Killin — Mon, 22 May 2017 19:47:25 -0400

AS a Naval reservist, I spent most of my reserve time, 1971 to 1982, aboard NRF ships that were manned 60 percent active and 40 percent reserve, give or take a few. We used to get it from the active duty side and had to pretty much prove ourselves every time we got a new Ops officer, CO, XO, etc., but that was easy to do because most of us had just come off 4 years of sea duty and worked in our ratings. Never-the-less, active vs reserve crap sure got old. During much of this time, the Navy was struggling with drug abuse, and most of the ship's druggies were active duty sailors. When the subject came up, I always pointed out that if the reservists wanted to smoke dope or do other things, they could just do it at home...didn't have to risk getting caught bringing it on to a military base or Navy ship. I don't recall one single reservist getting caught with marijuana or hard drugs during this period. Then the Navy started these big drug and alcohol rehab programs and guess where the graduates of those programs came when they were certified as "clean and sober?" You got it, the NRFs (reserve ships). And as we've come to learn, rehab generally does not work for most. Thank God Admiral Hayward came along when he did in 1981, and shuttered the drug rehab commands and booted out all the dopers and alcoholics.

Response by MAJ Glenn Lasater made May 22 at 2017 8:03 PM

MAJ Glenn Lasater — Mon, 22 May 2017 20:03:13 -0400

Back in the day -- read Vietnam -- the hatred started in Boot Camp where, upon graduation the NG went home and the US/RA went to Vietnam. This caused hard feelings, sometimes caused by the NG boots bragging and laughing about going home and implying that RA/US boots were stupid for getting "caught" by Uncle Sam. In some cases, special guards had to be posted to insure the safety, and survival, of the NG boots. It was easy to identify the NG boots from the chow sheet at the mess hall; RA=Regular Army, AR=Army Reserve, US=Draftees, and NG=National Guard. Our usual phonetic for NG was "Nob Gobblers" and most of us considered them to be draft dodgers.

President Lyndon Johnson never wanted to call up the Guard: Sending those units to war could turn the public against what the White House and Pentagon — in the early days — hoped would be a short conflict. After the draft ended in 1973, the Army had little choice. Gen. Creighton Abrams, who commanded U.S. forces in Vietnam from 1968 to 1972, wanted to ensure the guard was not sidelined in future conflicts. He felt that one of the great failings of the Vietnam War was that the National Guard was never called up, and the nation was never engaged. So the Pentagon began to knit the guard with the active-duty military; key specialties like combat engineering or air refueling were built into guard units.

As a matter of record, only a few thousand NG troops were deloyed to Vietnam. One unit, Company D, 151st Infantry, Indiana National Guard was one of the most decorated of the war: Its soldiers earned 19 Silver Stars.

Later, as a sponsor of a NG unit in California in the mid-70's, we weren't comfortable with the casual atmosphere between the ranks. Our battalion commander was Colonel or Sir, theirs was Jim. The discipline seemed lax compared to our standards, the maintenance frankly sucked and not too many of the NG officers or NCO's seemed to care. Generally, getting assigned as a NG Unit Adviser was a kiss of death for your career.

In our most recent wars, the guard and reserve made up nearly half the forces in Iraq and Afghanistan. In my humble opinion, Guard members and their families suffered additional hardships above and beyond the regular components. Imagine yourself deployed, losing your civilian income and reverting to active pay, struggling to keep up with the bills you assumed while making three, four, or five times the money you're getting from Uncle Sam. Although protected by the Soldiers and Sailors Relief Act, many Guard and Reserve members and their families suffered financial hardship because of their service.

On the other side of the coin, members of the National Guard work for the state's Governors and are often called up to deal with civil disturbances and natural disasters, augmenting the local emergency personnel. In many instances Guardsmen are putting themselves in harm's way as surely as deployment into theater.

The Guard has earned the respect of active and reserve forces, their communities, and a grateful nation.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 22 at 2017 8:10 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 May 2017 20:10:13 -0400

I switched from active to weekend warrior... I still don't claim this shit.. So many excuses! Most ppl are usually late.. and the NCOs are weak mentally and physically.. and then you have us prior active guys that are just. Dumbfounded.. that shit can get even more stupid.. outside of active duty.." and then to top it all off! You have some high up telling ppl that they are better then active duty! Because they can flip burgers as well as being a soldier... shit is a fucking joke.. I don't feel pride in being a soldier anymore

Response by SGT Kiley Anderson made May 22 at 2017 8:30 PM

SGT Kiley Anderson — Mon, 22 May 2017 20:30:23 -0400

I was in the Louisiana Guard from 1992-1998. We were an 11M company my entire time there. We had many AD soldiers in the unit as well as many LEOs. The AD guys were a mix of Army and Marines. They knew a lot and taught us a lot but they also learned that we were real soldiers. I heard stories from the old timers about barbecues and bear bashes in the woods in the early 80's but after Desert Storm it seems like they really started to take things a lot more seriously. I enjoyed my time in. We are always doing something. NTC train-up, annual training at Ft. Hood. Once a year we'd train with the state police for riot control. I was in college so I took every bit of extra duty I could get because E-5 pay was better than my minimum wage job. I'm proud of my service and proud of the men I served with.

Response by SFC Tom Caldwell made May 22 at 2017 8:35 PM

SFC Tom Caldwell — Mon, 22 May 2017 20:35:40 -0400

Been on both sides.

The guard unit I was with was much more ready than any active duty component that I was with.

Never had a problem serving with either.

Response by MSG Michael McEleney made May 22 at 2017 9:08 PM

MSG Michael McEleney — Mon, 22 May 2017 21:08:53 -0400

Had to educate a young Officer, when he complained about the NG , pointed to the Army flag with all the streamers, and reminded him that every streamer from the a Revolution thru the Civil War were earned primarily by what would be later known as NG units. That it was a NG unit that captured San Juan Hill, and that the 82nd Division was originally a reserve division.

Response by SSG Eric Mathewson made May 22 at 2017 9:11 PM

SSG Eric Mathewson — Mon, 22 May 2017 21:11:25 -0400

Served in both as well. Was activated to Fort Knox for 9-11. You could see the ammount of maturity in the NG Soldiers that wasnt there for the active. Mostly because these people owned businesses, attended college or was also maintaining a job. So imagine an infantry soldier that is also a police officer or a medic that's a registered nurse. Over qualified and under paid to Guard a Base and get disrespected by the people housing us. How about the same circumstances while deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan. Heart Doctors with a practice setting aside time to Serve. We had our sprinkling of douchebags throughout every rank so I'll give a little room for criticisms. I remember seeing active douchebags with too much rank and less maturity. So we both have strengths and weaknesses.

Response by SGT Linda Moss made May 22 at 2017 9:14 PM

SGT Linda Moss — Mon, 22 May 2017 21:14:30 -0400

I do not think they do .. if the do they are fools.. I can not say if it still true but when I was in the majority i where war time veterans. They had the skills and experience. I told a AD one time what they where doing we had to do but we also had to hold regular jobs as well.. May be do not do thing the same way but we get the job done ..

Response by SGT Charles Weaver made May 22 at 2017 9:29 PM

SGT Charles Weaver — Mon, 22 May 2017 21:29:29 -0400

I think it's just a stereotype. I, myself was surprised with the guard when I joined up in 2007 and deployed in 2010 to complete over 1,700 missions in one deployment. That number was quite unheard of and AD troops were very quick to call me a liar and say I was full of shit. At the same time the 117th of Ft. Sill (AD) were confined to the camp and QRF. They generally didn't do much of anything and at first, thought they were in Iraq (We were in Afghanistan). So, basically what I learned from my time in is this; your experience may vary. Regardless of what branch you joined and regardless if it's active or reserve. You will be assigned what to do and you will do it. It's as simple as that.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made May 22 at 2017 9:42 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 May 2017 21:42:43 -0400

I said at the beginning of OEF a d OIF; the difference now between active and reserve units was what they did between deployments.

Response by LTJG Rodger Morris made May 22 at 2017 9:47 PM

LTJG Rodger Morris — Mon, 22 May 2017 21:47:01 -0400

"In peacetime the regulars are happy,
Yes, in peacetime, they're happy to serve,
But just let them get into trouble,
And they'll call out the Goddamned Reserves!" - Folk song circa World War II

Response by SGT Justin Lamb made May 22 at 2017 10:29 PM

SGT Justin Lamb — Mon, 22 May 2017 22:29:11 -0400

I hate the NG... Wait I am one now.... Soooo I hate myself... and I got AD time... hmmmm I'm still part of the Army..... That's cute... We on the same team! Get over it... I mean... please get over it for the kinder squishy part of the AD. Don't want to offend the snowflakes...

Response by SP5 Dave Westbury made May 22 at 2017 10:56 PM

SP5 Dave Westbury — Mon, 22 May 2017 22:56:14 -0400

I never hated them.

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made May 22 at 2017 11:22 PM

CPL Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 May 2017 23:22:07 -0400

I'm AD now and have been but in 2010 when I first went to my guard unit. I remember getting dirty looks and nasty shit said to me simply because I asked if we went to the ball in dress uniform?. If looks could kill I would have died that day from 30 people. Some came up to me and actually botched me out because they couldn't fit in their dress uniform and how dare I ask such a thing... just think how many of us can't even fit in our dress uniform said probably 5-6 different people.
Seriously like it's my fault they haven't seen their feet or other things in years without a camera or mirror being used. Had one male soldier actually have the largest ACU top you can get only able to barely get the center Velcro together nothing else. That fat terd cut in line once crying he was starving and pulled a knife on me sticking it in my back. I spun around grabbed his hand with my hand over his and told him if he ever tripped me again and cut In line to chow the whole time saying he was starving I was going to use his own knife while in his hand and slice him from his belly up to his ribs.
Not one of the many Sergeants said anything to me when fatty turned and cried to them. Only response he got wa maybe you should trip pepper and cut in line!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 6:59 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 06:59:34 -0400

When I retired from the Army, I went to work for a government contractor as a NETT Instructor teaching the AFATDS (Advanced Field Artillery Tactical Data Systems)to active, USAR and NG units. The course was 21 days to make competent operators. Most USAR and NG units could only muster the 14 days of annual Training to complete the 21 day course. Active Duty Soldiers would attend class with the attitude that this is my place of duty for the next 21 days guess it beats being in the Motor Pool. Most NG and USAR troops showed up with the attitude I only have 14 days to learn a 21 day course. Over the 2 years I taught, I found the NG Soldiers the most dedicated to learning the tasks required out of all three components. They did not take what was taught at face value they questioned stayed after the training schedule to practice and grasp the material in the limited time given. The first unit that was "Certified" to fire using AFATDS was the Field Artillery Brigade out of Wisconsin that completed all tasks during their 3 day FTX at the end of training with 100% accuracy.
Sure the "Weekend Warriors" show up 1 weekend a month and 2 weeks in the summer. That's what they signed up for, But The "Weekend Warriors" of the 80s have evolved from a contingency force of the 80's into an operational force of the 2000's after 9/11.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 7:08 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 07:08:46 -0400

I've been on both sides and I think the biggest thing is experience. In the 82nd you didn't get respect in the infantry without a deployment. In my guard unit I know people who made E6 without a deployment. That's very hard to respect when come from a place where privates have more combat experience

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 8:37 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 08:37:38 -0400

I've worked with NG units before. Some are... let's say not so good. Others you would've thought they are regular soldiers doing a gunnery. So I guess it depends on the unit.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 8:57 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 08:57:51 -0400

I served in the AD Army in 1989-1992.
Media during that time painted a bad picture of the National Guard. I joined the Army National Guard when I got out. There where more soldier in the Guard that were willing to fight for their country. Many National Guard are former AD.

Response by SPC Evan Slaughter made May 23 at 2017 9:02 AM

SPC Evan Slaughter — Tue, 23 May 2017 09:02:24 -0400

because a civilian cannot tell a difference in an active duty infantryman or a national gaurd wheel mechanic. i hate seeing national gaurd members that are "infantry" get deployed and post photos of their time over seas..we all know what you really did..serve a bunch of water to active duty infantryman..or clean up the trash around KAF..(if you don't know what KAF is you are national guard or you have not been to Afghanistan). But if you put a combat vet infantryman next to a non deployed national guardsmen, the civilans will see them as the same. they get credit where credit is not due. can't stand them..join active duty or just don't join..or, at least take away the opportunity to join a combat MOS as national gaurd..

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 9:20 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 09:20:28 -0400

In my experience in aviation maintenance units the Guard out performs the Active duty. Mostly because the maintainers are full time federal technicians and have usually 10 more years of experience on the AD maintainers. Also the AD always has extra nonsense they have to do besides their jobs while in garrison. Maybe this is why they hate them so much. They can't compete with the part time solider.

Response by FN Charles Willis made May 23 at 2017 9:34 AM

FN Charles Willis — Tue, 23 May 2017 09:34:18 -0400

My thoughts are they may not see the same commitment that they are putting in. I was in the ANG and in bootcamp they called me a FANG. It didnt bother me. I went into the Navy after that.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 9:53 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 09:53:11 -0400

In the day, considered draft dodgers. Worse than the folks who went to Canada.

Response by CMSgt Ed Cates made May 23 at 2017 10:34 AM

CMSgt Ed Cates — Tue, 23 May 2017 10:34:04 -0400

Hate is way to strong a word! I started in a NG Engineer unit in my home town and quickly discovered it was not what I wanted as a career with the military. Went to Air Force and had a great 30 year career that included being "Jump" qualified, did 30 jumps with SF and other SO units, Halo, HAHO and other High Altitude Ops. Trained Gaurd and Reserve alongside Regular and found that in the Air Force, Reserve Flying units were as good or better than Regulars.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 11:12 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 11:12:33 -0400

In my personal experience, transitioning from active duty to national guard (for college), I think I can narrow it down to these reasons.

1: The fact that national guardsman are able to maintain their social lives and free time so easily, and the army demands very little of their time outside of drill. Active duty does not afford such time or freedom. We love to have it, but the NG guys take it for granted and complain anyway.

2: The skills and training that are required to merely meet the standard on active duty are somehow special skills in the NG. Something as simple as knowing which forms are used to PMCS a vehicle is rare to all but the AGR.

3: The lack of discipline and respect for rank/experience is not universally enforced. An active duty soldier spends his life automatically going to parade rest before addressing most NCO's except when told otherwise, and it's difficult to understand how a NG unit could be so laid back (which is not necessarily bad, it's just difficult for us to get used to)

4: Fitness and soldier knowledge are immediately identifiable in the unit because only the gung-ho self made soldiers possess them. Due to the limited training time, units are not able to monitor or enforce the soldiers fitness outside of drill which means soldiers who don't discipline themselves l, become failures and fatties. Training is hardly ever pre-prepared by skilled instructors which leads to improper and inaccurate training. Consequently, the unit is left with over/underweight soldiers who don't have the discipline or skill to carry out tasks on demand, and former active duty soldiers are often left to pick up the slack or hip pocket the training instead of taking care of other tasks.

National guard soldiers demonstrate the same willingness to sacrifice and deserve the same respect as any other patriot. The environment is just too far different from active duty. We just don't blend we'll because we don't understand each other perfectly.

Response by SPC Christine Ventre made May 23 at 2017 11:27 AM

SPC Christine Ventre — Tue, 23 May 2017 11:27:11 -0400

The difference in discipline level of some guard soldiers.

Response by SSgt Albert Childress made May 23 at 2017 11:27 AM

SSgt Albert Childress — Tue, 23 May 2017 11:27:31 -0400

In my opinion, as with anyones on here, is that AD do their job day in day out, and as some pointed out, you train in NG. So, as most of your post go to 9/11 and Afghanistan, my experience with the NG dates back to Gulf War in '91. And, yes after 9/11 NG units have served several rotations over to Afghanistan, but after Gulf War, not so much. And, the NG unit out of Ohio that we had to serve with, hated being there, and whining about the money they were losing at their regular job, and that the NG shouldnt even be in theater. Of which i wholeheartedly agreed. Training has its advantages, but dont try to tell me 1 weekend a month and two weeks out of the year is more experienced than active duty. Out of that 44 man team though, two had been active duty before going guard, and both were vietnam vets, so at least they had actual first hand experience away from some training facility, so i gave them props. The rest i didnt want to be around. And as time went on, in the other conficts from Enduring Freedom to Iraqi Freedom, more and more NG units are getting sent over, and a lot had active duty experience, but still not the numbers that AD will always fill. So, i dont hate the NG, just much rather deal with AD.

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 11:46 AM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 11:46:20 -0400

Only because that's how their peers tell them to feel. And everyone likes to feel like their better than someone else.

Response by SPC Rick LaBonte made May 23 at 2017 11:59 AM

SPC Rick LaBonte — Tue, 23 May 2017 11:59:51 -0400

Since Desert Storm the National Guard has been just as likely to see combat, prior to that date they hadn't been deployed for decades. In Basic in 1989, Drill Sergeants referred to them as "No Go's". Desert Storm was a surprise and it was discovered that many NG units were"good ole boy" clubs with many non fit remaining on the roster long after physical deficiency. Regs were more tightly enforced and oversight improved. However, old stereotypes die hard.

Response by SPC Allen Eriksen made May 23 at 2017 12:00 PM

SPC Allen Eriksen — Tue, 23 May 2017 12:00:55 -0400

The first time I saw a National Guard unit in the field was in 1984 on Ft Hood. I was in the Active Army, or Regular Army as it was known then. We drove by a NG unit that had volleyball nets up, big screen TV, out, nothing under cammo nets, and ice chests all over out in the open. When my motor Sgt saw us staring, he just said, "National Guardsmen". From then on, NGs were the butt of the jokes in our Artillery battalion.

Things changed between then and when I deployed to the Gulf in 1990. The NG companies got things done! When it was time to be professional, they were!

Response by MAJ Keith FitzPatrick, CPIM, CSCP made May 23 at 2017 12:05 PM

MAJ Keith FitzPatrick, CPIM, CSCP — Tue, 23 May 2017 12:05:49 -0400

I was in the Guard for a couple of years in the mid-80s after completing an active duty tour. What a sorry excuse for soldiers! Went back on active duty and was in Kuwait prior to the invasion of Iraq. A light brigade from Florida showed up to provide security and then went into a Iraq as part of the invasion. That Guard unit was a completely different animal. They were completely professional and couldn't tell they weren't RA if it wasn't for the patch on their sleeves.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 12:30 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 12:30:28 -0400

They think that they are just like active duty and believe that just because they do 2 weeks a month that they are just as good as us

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 1:11 PM

CPL Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 13:11:21 -0400

They don't embrace the suck as much as we do. We go out to the field every week and train. We're simply better at our jobs and every field exercise I've done with the guard we have to hold their hands through the whole process. Every class I've had with the guard they all show up jacked up and late. Before the I enlisted one of my friends was in the guard and he had a beard and out of regs hair all the time. They are simply part-time soldiers who experience real army only once per year.

Response by SFC Victor Goetting made May 23 at 2017 1:15 PM

SFC Victor Goetting — Tue, 23 May 2017 13:15:42 -0400

Having attended many schools where both NG and AD were present, I found that NG soldiers almost always out performed their AD counterparts. Any hate red is probably bases on inferior performance. Superior AD soldiers had nothing but respect for NG and that respect was returned.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 1:41 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 13:41:23 -0400

Sadly the stereotype is there because it was at one time commonplace in Reserve or NG units to sit around an armory drinking beer calling each other by their first names, albeit slow, that stigma is changing. I have served in all reserve, NG and RA......in fact I started my career in King 1-3 ACR and E 1/43 Ada as Active duty, then I did a small stint in Wyo NG, 2 years as TPU in a Reserve unit, and then another 2 years RA last after a compassionate reassignment I did 10 years Agr....it's a fact the Reserve and NG as a whole, lack discipline....... that's an undeniable fact, but they make up for it quickly in morale, talent, and the ability to think outside the box. The Res and NG maintenance and supply programs far exceed AD programs. Soldiers in the NG or Reserves get more done, they are generally happier and even though they are less disciplined they are more likely to be successful and combat effective.... except for some senior leadership, some not all senior leadership in the reserves and NG is very toxic and it is very noticeable that they are only in this for personal gain, which makes Res and NG soldiers even more admirable they succeed despite the pile of shit sitting in his/ her office trying to get their next rocker by screwing their battle buddy.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 2:47 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 14:47:55 -0400

When I was a private in OIF 1, I remember seeing 40 and 50 year old E-5 that were grossly over weight and barely knew which end of the gun to hold. Later on in the deployment a member of the Alabama national guard almost shot a general in the face while hunting stray dogs. In Afghanistan our unit took over a FOB the Washington State national guard was in charge of, 300 vehicles from Humers to dump trucks were all completely deadlined and not a single one was reported to. If it's not reported the theatre command won't allot resources to fix it. The NG drove them until they broke then jumped in a different one to do the same. It's more of a lack respect as soldiers then a hatred. The equipment operators however, were way better at using their equipment since most did the same job as a civilian. Things have started to change as more active duty soldiers switched to the guard but it was still hard to respect combat arms NG due to the early examples many of us saw. Of course now I'm a civilian so they are all more bad ass then me.

Response by SFC Scotty Anderson made May 23 at 2017 2:52 PM

SFC Scotty Anderson — Tue, 23 May 2017 14:52:28 -0400

Somebody hit the nail on the head.....maturity.

Response by CPL Michael Headrick made May 23 at 2017 2:57 PM

CPL Michael Headrick — Tue, 23 May 2017 14:57:56 -0400

I think t is a carry over from basic training. When I went through Harmony Church in '87 we would send the NG's on procurement missions for banned items. They would come back with the goods everytime and we felt like they didn't have as much to lose since they were not going active.

Response by MAJ Glenn Woodson made May 23 at 2017 3:41 PM

MAJ Glenn Woodson — Tue, 23 May 2017 15:41:01 -0400

This topic will NEVER go away. It was there when I was commissioned in 1990, was there when I deployed as an engineer Reservist, was there when in Bosnia in Civil Affairs, and was there in OIF 06-08/OEF 10-11 when the DoD threw the NGB 100% into the fray replacing almost every AC BDE in Iraq and AFGH for a tour to reconstitute the AC. As a supervisor told me early in my civilian career, you can either be a great professional engineer or a great Soldier. You cannot be both. At some point you have to sacrifice time and energy to balance the two. I hate how he used it at performance review time but he was 100% right. Doesn't mean you can't do both very well but the military is a profession just as a manager, a public safety officer, teacher, accountant, lawyer, etc.

Bottom line is no component (AC, USAR, ANG), until they deploy together, really know the strengths and weaknesses of the others. They know what their environment is. Every time they get a chance to work together the walls get shorter. It is incumbent on the leaders, the veterans, to shut comments down and with less opportunities now to work together, the more important those lessons become.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 3:49 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 15:49:59 -0400

Honestly, my reason for disliking them is new. I've been a tanker for 10 years and have been out on recruiting duty for a year now. In ten years of service I have rarely had an issue with the National Guard. Of course you have the stupid stereotypes, but at the least I have given them all the benefit of the doubt. That was until I came out on recruiting and saw their recruiters and their Soldiers in action. Didn't know the National Guard was the only branch that could provide 100% tuition? Didn't know that the basic combat load one Infantry Guardsmen who now recruits was upwards of 2,500 rounds? Want to go active duty after your time in the Guard, easy as a simple white lie!!! I spend about 45% of my week cleaning up the image of the US Army because of what this particular states Guards continuous effort has been to tarnish it. It wouldn't bother me if we had different uniforms. Change the name tag, do something please! Again, to try and be civil, this is one state and one experience. Not all 50 states I'm sure are like this, maybe they are. Just doesn't give me a great image. Clearly a difference Army Values if you want to pull that card.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 4:04 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 16:04:24 -0400

Think about all the time you spent on active hiding and not doing shit. Now eliminate that time and think about all the actual training and eliminate the bullshit. The guard does that every month plus balances a full time job (ideally).

Response by SFC Edward Spurgeon made May 23 at 2017 4:13 PM

SFC Edward Spurgeon — Tue, 23 May 2017 16:13:26 -0400

I NEVER SAW OR HAD ANY RESENTMENT FOR NAT GUARD OR RESERVES...THEY ARE WEARING THE SAME UNIFORM...TAKING THE SAME RISKS..

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 4:16 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 16:16:58 -0400

a guardsman takes pride in out work,,RA thinks they are the best because they are , on duty all the time, where as the guardsmans doesn't take for granted, we plan, we study , we prepare, for our jobs more thourly than any RA,, gues this is why our scores always beat the RA,, We also have to train for our STATE training , we are supporting our state , along with supporting our nation .

Response by PO1 Aaron Baltosser made May 23 at 2017 4:17 PM

PO1 Aaron Baltosser — Tue, 23 May 2017 16:17:46 -0400

As a Reserve Liaison at Great Lakes Naval Hospital I disliked them tremendously because they would do weasel things regularly. Calling to 'inquire' if that AT opening to Landstuhl, Germany was still open despite the fact they were assigned to our area, and NO possibility existed they would get that plum assignment unless they were assigned to the unit that supported that detail. A 3rd Class calling in to the office using the rank Ensign Select, with my Commander. She asked the best way to handle it, and I told her "The same way you did with the LCDR Select earlier today." That call was priceless funny to have on conference phone. Trying to get out of some of the required stuff that was supposed to support the hospital they were assigned to. It did not paint a great picture. Thankfully, those were small portions of the population, and the ADSW guys dropped in some serious hours to support the command really making it work despite a doctor shortage in our area then.

Response by Jerry Rivas made May 23 at 2017 4:25 PM

Jerry Rivas — Tue, 23 May 2017 16:25:11 -0400

I joined the national guard as a 17 year old kid in 1974. I was MOS 19E (M48/M60 armor crewman) In my unit there were many Korean war/Viet nam war veterans. There was a club house and AFTER duty there was some beer drinking. But what we also had, were a lot of highly qualified former AD soldiers who gave an education to us young guys. When Ft. Riley Kansas first opened their driving tank gunnery range. It had been in operation for almost 1 year, and the Army had failed to have even 1 tank crew qualify. Troop E 114 cav, KANG however, Qualified ALL of our crews who went through it one weekend. I'll never forget it, I was one of the gunners who shot a perfect score. All you M1 jockeys have a damn fine tank.....But with the old 105MM gun on an M60, I can hit the computer screen you're looking at @ 3300 meters.........If you are reading this on a cell phone, I might need to shoot at you twice. God bless our men and women no matter how they serve. I can not legally call myself a veteran, and I dont. I get NO VA benefits and I'm fine with that. But I'm proud of my 6 years with the Kansas Army National Guard, And I still dream of commanding an M60-A3 in battle. Just an old guys 2 cents.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 4:40 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 16:40:45 -0400

Well for one we national guard soldiers are allotted more freedoms during deployments. Most RA soldiers never had a job in the real world as such dont have the experiences of knowing how to act in some situations. Take time off for instance. Guard guys know how to be off because we are not full time soldiers and know how to drink and party properly (: We also dont freak out around hot chicks because we see them on a daily basis. RA guys freak the fuck out when they see a hot chick and get boners and such. On that note Guard guys dont prematurely ejaculate like RA dudes either. Our wives are hotter than RA guys wives are because they take the first chick they see hanging outside the base that wants to get to the PX. Usually big fat bloated bitches with warts and farts all the time. Love u brothers!

Response by CW4 James Speller made May 23 at 2017 5:31 PM

CW4 James Speller — Tue, 23 May 2017 17:31:14 -0400

Active duty never could understand the strength of reserve and guard units who have stability in the ranks. Many have trained And served together for years. Most active service members are together for 6 months to a year before they move on.

Response by Cpl Carl Nobis made May 23 at 2017 5:55 PM

Cpl Carl Nobis — Tue, 23 May 2017 17:55:49 -0400

I've been in the VA Hospital 2 times for PTSD I found regardless of how they served they still served I have respect for all my brothers and sisters that have served after I did so few stand up and put the uniform of our country on so if you truly understand we're strong as we stand together respect one another

Response by SSG Cliff Karolak made May 23 at 2017 6:22 PM

SSG Cliff Karolak — Tue, 23 May 2017 18:22:54 -0400

I've been retired now a long time 1 Nov 1993. But in the 70,s and 80,s. The RA type's weren't real crazy about ER or NG type's. In those days for good reason. But you started to see the change pretty quick in late 1984. By the time of Desert Shield Desert Storm. I think the attitude changed. Mostly to the fact that a lot Reserve And Guard unit's where deployed before Active Army unit's.

Response by SPC Charles Hensler Jr. made May 23 at 2017 6:33 PM

SPC Charles Hensler Jr. — Tue, 23 May 2017 18:33:40 -0400

AD Soldiers feel NG Soldiers are unprofessional part time warriors and resent the fact that the UCMJ does not apply to NG soldiers the same way it does AD and AR soldiers.

Response by SGT John C. made May 23 at 2017 7:15 PM

SGT John C. — Tue, 23 May 2017 19:15:02 -0400

In my experience with both AD and ARNG the perception of the early "versions" of the ARNG was well deserved. The era of the 70's and 80's ARNG has long since passed as has the era of the "Weekend Warrior". That image is fast fading.

I deployed to Afghanistan in 2004 with my ARNG Infantry unit. It was the first major deployment to a combat zone for my ARNG Infantry Division since WW2 and I was proud to be a part of it. We were divided into 2 platoons and tasked with manning the Herat PRT/FOB and building the new Farah PRT/FOB. Our troops handled it as well as any AD troops would have. I have since been a part of a CBRN unit that was tasked with the CERF mission. No "Weekend Warrior" missions in that unit. Not only did we have to maintain our main tasking but we were also tasked as a DECON and SAR unit for CERF. Our typical yearly training was usually 1 week for our "regular" ARNG mission and 2 weeks or more for the CERF mission and multiple 3, 4 and 5 day "weekends" to maintain all aspects of our 2 missions. I am now part of a unit that recently returned from a month long vacation to the lovely Ft Irwin aka NTC last year and now preparing for multiple missions to various parts of this planet. Fortunately none are combat zones but as with the Army and ARNG that can change.

The days of the "Weekend Warrior" have long since passed and the days of multiple training missions and scenarios for the ARNG are here. This means more time training and even less time for personal/family time due to the ARNG, work and everything else that encompasses our daily lives. The ARNG has to juggle a civilian life as well as their responsibilities to the military. We have to be prepared for anything from Mother Nature to full on combat and we miss birthdays, anniversaries and special times with our kids and family probably as much as the AD. If I had to do it all over again I'd not change a damn thing because I've experienced the best of both worlds having served on AD and in the ARNG.

Response by LTC Alan Murphy made May 23 at 2017 7:22 PM

LTC Alan Murphy — Tue, 23 May 2017 19:22:00 -0400

I served Active duty, National Guard and Army Reserves 32 years total.....I started out enlisted and then an officer....first serving National Guard avionics mechanic, then ordnance officer, then going active duty as an engineer officer and then leaving active duty to join Army reserves as an engineer officer and then Logistics officer...Yes there are bad NG and USAR units just like there are bad active duty units with toxic leadership. Problem with active duty I saw was you never were able to establish real trusting working relationship due to short 3 year tours wasn't enough time to really do that....Active duty guys had a system down....and if are or were career active duty you know what I'm talking about...(waste 6 month inprocessing then do your job and then by the end of their 3 year tour waste 6 month outprocessing, throw in your 30 day leave each year and you only get one year and ten month of real work from soldiers)....If you found a good NG or USAR unit the world was your oyster...if you were infantry or any branch coming off active duty and in your town there was no infantry units as long as you were willing to do correspondence courses or the unit can send you off to school to change your branch...plus NG and USAR units were a great place to network for jobs coming off active duty...and NG and USAR has the AGR program Active Guard Reserve where you can be full time active duty serving at NG and USAR units..As a engineer commander in the USAR I had solders who were surveyors, electricians, welders, plumbers, draftsmen, civil engineers, environmentalists, bulldozer operators, carpenters who had the same jobs in the private sector....many times at summer camps our solders trained active duty engineers units....In the USAR we had lawyers, business owners, engineers, bankers, nurses, and even a Senator was in our unit....As USAR we knew our job and when mobilized for active duty we didn't play the active duty games..we had no patience with degrading our soldiers to perform do menial jobs to occupy their time...Our soldiers were all adults and didn't need to do stupid tasks to occupy their time..As our commander said to the active duty if you don't like what we do or you don't have anything for us to do send us home...NG and USAR soldiers are older and promotions are slower......but they are much more rounded and mature.....the active duty mentality of back stabbers and shit starters doesn't fly in the NG and USAR either....those types don't last long and are found out quickly....we had soldiers come in the NG and USAR with anywhere from 3 years up to 15 years active duty time....I worked for 14 generals over the years in the USAR and 6 of those were my contemporaries who obtained the general rank.......

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 7:35 PM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 19:35:48 -0400

There is no place for this in current force structure. Everyone maintains the same proficiency standards - and those who deny this are ignoring the evaluators. The Guard does everything, and more, that AD asks. However, too many people believe that only "a real soldier" can do a task. Welcome to reality....

Response by 1SG John Highfill made May 23 at 2017 7:51 PM

1SG John Highfill — Tue, 23 May 2017 19:51:30 -0400

A lack of understanding by the AD Soldiers

Response by PVT Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 8:21 PM

PVT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 20:21:06 -0400

I hate NG soldiers who leave AIT and go home and start sharing FB pics about special forces, infantry deployments, life long brotherhood bonds, like dude you're barely a soldier. You went home to Fort Couch to sit on your ass and continue regular life while the real army don't get to go home to our families or a nice house. Don't tell me they're the same.

Response by SGT Jim Filey made May 23 at 2017 8:39 PM

SGT Jim Filey — Tue, 23 May 2017 20:39:42 -0400

What some AD troops fail to understand, RES/NG unit are made up in part by ex AD . We hosted a NG unit for its summer training, come to find out most were all ex AD vets, with combat experience, this was pre desert storm. Needless to say, in the field ops, the AD got schooled. Which came in handy in 91.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 10:01 PM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 22:01:47 -0400

A lot of the responses seem to have an anti-AD perspective. Can we step outside the party line for a moment and consider that any dislike for reserve components might come from something about the reserve and NG components, rather than a fault with active Soldiers?

It's just as wrong to assume that it's always the regulars who are at fault as it is to assume it's always the reservists and NG. It's just more politically acceptable in today's culture.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 10:02 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 22:02:52 -0400

We get just as many deployments as Active duty if not more state side and over seas

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 10:03 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 22:03:41 -0400

I'm active guard so I guess I have the best of both worlds

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 10:09 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 22:09:49 -0400

One team one fight, that's how its supposed to be but sadly its not the case. I'm in the reserves and have always been a reservist. I agree with the earlier comments about how the active duty couldn't fulfill its missions without the Reserve or the Guard. I recall on my last deployment when we were assigned to an Active duty Battalion. They openly called us dirty rotten reservist. That really put a bad taste in my mouth on the subject. If some active duty jackass thinks he or she is better than they can kiss my ass. Without us they are dead in the water.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 23 at 2017 10:28 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 May 2017 22:28:23 -0400

Part of it is definitely the untrained, ate-up, "weekend warrior stereotype", but I'm also willing to say a large part is jealousy. Not having people constantly try to micromanage your personal life and what not, but you're still a soldier? Yes, jealous.

Response by MSgt Cayle Harris made May 23 at 2017 10:53 PM

MSgt Cayle Harris — Tue, 23 May 2017 22:53:16 -0400

As an active duty EOD tech, I did Route Clearance with the Puerto Rican NG, and a mix of Tennessee/Vermont NGs. All very professional and great at what they do.
I have to admit, I was a bit sceptical asset first...I guess I bought into the stereotype.

Response by SSgt Stewart Perry made May 24 at 2017 1:59 AM

SSgt Stewart Perry — Wed, 24 May 2017 01:59:41 -0400

You can't do the job part time period.

Response by TSgt Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2017 8:06 AM

TSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 May 2017 08:06:17 -0400

A lot of the stereotyping of the national guard that I had first rubbed elbows with was in basic training. The drill sergeants would say, "Oh, you are with the guards? Does that NG mean No Go?" The misconceptions, I believe, were started in that environment of confusion and stress. After leaving the active duty and joining the guards, I actually found that being in the guards is one of the toughest commitments there is. You have your civilian job and a boss that needs to be kept happy. Plus, you have your oath of enlistment you have to maintain.

Response by CH (LTC) Grant Speece made May 24 at 2017 8:27 AM

CH (LTC) Grant Speece — Wed, 24 May 2017 08:27:25 -0400

I was once participating in some training in which there were students from each of the components. One guy started to razz me about being National Guard. He didn't say anything more after I mentioned that I had a patch on my right shoulder and he didn't.

Response by Maj John Prince made May 24 at 2017 8:35 AM

Maj John Prince — Wed, 24 May 2017 08:35:52 -0400

Easier duty

Response by SGT Mark Cassidy made May 24 at 2017 8:37 AM

SGT Mark Cassidy — Wed, 24 May 2017 08:37:40 -0400

The "hate" seems to have subsided since Desert Storm. I deployed with the CT ANG, and worked with many AD units. No problems at all. With so many Guard units deployed then and now, the workload is being shared, and the skill of the Guard units has come way up. A vet is still a vet, and we all are proud to serve.

Response by SPC StevieKevin Taylor made May 24 at 2017 10:04 AM

SPC StevieKevin Taylor — Wed, 24 May 2017 10:04:04 -0400

We train harder each year everything active duty soldiers learn in one year we cram into two weeks

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2017 10:50 AM

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 May 2017 10:50:38 -0400

I have seen it every AT and even at the prison where I work; it just gives me incentive to be a better soldier, Mechanic and Corrections officer.

Response by Cadet CPL Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2017 11:01 AM

Cadet CPL Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 May 2017 11:01:38 -0400

I started my miltary career back in 2010 as a Blackhawk mechanic in the California NG, now I'm close to graduating from West Point in about a month. Having seen both sides of the fence each has their own benefits and pitfalls but in the end we're all one Army team.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2017 11:07 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 May 2017 11:07:59 -0400

Currently I am serving as an OC/T in a AC/RC unit based out of Camp Shelby, MS. My job for the last two years has been to help train and observe multiple NG units from multiple states. In two days I'm leaving to go observe more units conduct their annual training once again this summer. I say all this because being in this slot for the last 2 years I've been in a position to see lots of different guard units in multiple fields (all combat arms except FA). When I arrived here after being on active duty for 18 years I showed up with a stereotype of a NG Soldier. I wish I could say all of my observations were good, but just like with active duty you have both good and bad. I've seen units where BN leadership is completely apathetic and the results carry down to the lowest level. I've also seen some pretty crazy stuff, but for the most part they have been eager to learn, respond to constructive criticism, and perform just as well as any other unit I've seen within the confines of their training restrictions. On the other hand I was completely blown away by the professionalism of 2-137 of the KS NG. I would rather deploy next to those guys then a LOT of active units I've seen. Just like everything in life most people want to focus on the negative. I wouldn't pay it any attention if I was you.

Response by WO1 Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2017 11:40 AM

WO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 May 2017 11:40:05 -0400

There is also something to be said for the jealousy the active-duty soldiers have for national guardsmen. I have seen the National Guard bring to the table more than their military job. they tend to bring their outside skills as civilians with them on deployments. This is why generals and hire want to see more national guard and reserve soldiers deployed with active duty units. I myself was deployed as a National Guard soldier And worked for a lieutenant colonel that eventually work for me on the outside after his time in service. I agree the opinion is formed based on past years when the Army reserves and National Guard soldiers were a lot more relaxed with the standards.

Response by Destry Parker made May 24 at 2017 11:52 AM

Destry Parker — Wed, 24 May 2017 11:52:39 -0400

I just enlisted in the Army National Guard the 18th of this month don't really know what to expect haven't even went to basic yet

Response by GySgt Craig Averill made May 24 at 2017 11:56 AM

GySgt Craig Averill — Wed, 24 May 2017 11:56:49 -0400

I have been on Active Duty and I have been with the National Guard.
A NG year is only 38 days, while AD years are 365 days. When you hear a guardsman say they have 10 years Time in Grade, they mean 380 days. When you hear an AD person say they have 10 years Time in Grade they mean 3650 days. Now tell me which E6 or O4 is going to have more experience and training, after 10 years in the NG or 10 years on AD.

Unlike an AD military individual when a NG member returns from deployment, they are literally HOME, AD can use only their earned Leave.

An AD Military person is a person who is fully committed to their obligation and not just a weekend a month.

When I first went in the guard it was about 80% past AD personnel, not any more.

I lived in the barracks when I was AD and when we returned from WesPac there were some stories, but mostly silent and the effort to put it all behind you. When the NG comes home, it is like everyone won the Medal of Honor.

After spending over 26 years in the NG and 11 years AD, I would rather share a foxhole with AD as they are fully committed. I did know some really super NG personnel and they mostly all had prior AD.

Response by PVT David Barber made May 24 at 2017 12:14 PM

PVT David Barber — Wed, 24 May 2017 12:14:47 -0400

I don't hate the national guard or the reserves ...... Just think they get the new equipment first

Response by SFC Mario Lopez made May 24 at 2017 1:55 PM

SFC Mario Lopez — Wed, 24 May 2017 13:55:35 -0400

I've been in both sides of the fence, especially being AGR we plan an execute just as much training as active units do in a week in one weekend. We have good units and we have very bad ones as well. I feel the unit is only as good as it's leadership. Just remember once bullets start flying the only thing that matters is the name tag next to your heart.

Response by COL William Oseles made May 24 at 2017 2:47 PM

COL William Oseles — Wed, 24 May 2017 14:47:15 -0400

Have not been Guard but both active and reserve.
After 9-11 I was mobilised and spent 18 months (of 2 1/2) years at CONUS NORAD Region. When the Air Defense for Washington DC stood up for 9-11-2002 I was the Army liason in the Army Ops Center when they brought in the Stingers.
I talked with the NG MP unit guarding the Pentagon when I went in and out at odd hours.
They had been put in condembed buildings with no hot water and sewage backing up periodically but could not get anyone to do anything. The State said the quarters issue was active and the Active was telling them that they should be happy to be under a roof. The property management people would not fix
the issue as the building condemned.
And of course a lot of active people thought they were whiners as the could have been in the sand box and living in tents.
Actually they would have been better off in tents.

Response by MAJ Doug Mattox made May 24 at 2017 5:05 PM

MAJ Doug Mattox — Wed, 24 May 2017 17:05:08 -0400

MSG Steve Wiersgalla said it very well. I have worked with National Guard from all over the US. I saw some very professional units and I saw some that I could not believe they had a patch that said US Army. But, I saw the same for active duty units. I do know for Desert Storm the Pentagon was worried about the desertion rate for the NG units would be a problem. As it turned out the AD had a much higher rate. I know that was true early on in OIF, I do not know about after 2008.

I will share this story of an incident at the NTC at FT Irwin. NG unit was going through a rotation and on one of the exercises a Specialist approached his Company Commander and they had a small conversation. The OC went to the Company Commander and made a comment to the effect of why did you discuss this with him, Just tell him to do it and chew his ass if he doesn't. The Company Commander smiled and called the specialist back over. The CO told the SPC to tell the active duty CPT what he did for a living and how much he made a year. The SPC answered, "I am a partner in an architecture firm, and probably over a 100 thousand a year. The CO dismissed him and looked at the OC. I explained why I wanted it done the way I did so he could see the big picture. I now do not have to worry about it, he is smart enough to figure it all out and handle it on his own. He joined to pay for college and he has stayed because he loves serving. Trust me his NCO will do the yelling if needed. That incident stuck with me my whole career.

Response by SGT Jason Page made May 24 at 2017 6:14 PM

SGT Jason Page — Wed, 24 May 2017 18:14:34 -0400

I have been in both components. I would say first, that hate is a strong word, I think AD soldiers just feel as though the guard is less professional, for example I've seen multiple E-8 fraternizing with lower enlisted in the guard, officers as well. This is mostly because of the different dynamic with the civilian side of their life. Aside from that, when were down range, everyone is doing the same shit.

Response by SGT Paul Bachman made May 24 at 2017 7:18 PM

SGT Paul Bachman — Wed, 24 May 2017 19:18:30 -0400

Both sides have there terds and there high speeds I served 4 years on each side and I will say I preferred active duty. Coming from active makes the adjustment a little tough. But both side have the same goals the guard just has to jam more into a smaller time frame

Response by SPC Mike McKenna made May 24 at 2017 8:15 PM

SPC Mike McKenna — Wed, 24 May 2017 20:15:40 -0400

They don't know what it's like to be a soldier 24-7, having a private fuck up on a weekend and everyone has to come in and do pt because of one shitbag

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2017 8:52 PM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 May 2017 20:52:07 -0400

Actually more national guard are getting deployed than ADs because they're showing more readiness. Now I am not talking shit but they get more training faster.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2017 8:53 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 May 2017 20:53:17 -0400

Walking and smoking, no ground guide in motor pool.

Response by SP5 James Zack made May 24 at 2017 9:19 PM

SP5 James Zack — Wed, 24 May 2017 21:19:20 -0400

They don't have the same discipline as active duty not the same requirements of duty

Response by SP5 Martin DiOrio made May 24 at 2017 9:26 PM

SP5 Martin DiOrio — Wed, 24 May 2017 21:26:55 -0400

In the 1960's the National Guard was yet another way to dodge the draft ala the shooters at Kent State. When I got back from Vietnam, I had to train the NG's known as either No Goods or New Guyz. Either way many of us RA's or US's resented the weekend warriors. Don't know about now and don't care.

Response by SPC Casey Denton made May 24 at 2017 9:37 PM

SPC Casey Denton — Wed, 24 May 2017 21:37:29 -0400

Part time shit bags

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2017 10:03 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 May 2017 22:03:33 -0400

I've only been in the NG. Every unit I've been in, in two states, takes pride in the uniform and we don't tolerate inferior performance. While at AT a few years back we had 3rd ID as our OCP's and we out worked them for 3 weeks solid. I even overheard a full-time officer say 'why are our guys falling out in this heat while the part-timers aren't?' At the end of that AT, they were telling us how they'd be glad to work with us any time. Essentially- the stereotypes need to be broken.

Response by PO2 Michael Sayre made May 24 at 2017 10:40 PM

PO2 Michael Sayre — Wed, 24 May 2017 22:40:00 -0400

As someone that went from active Marine to a deployed Guardsman I'd say that discipline is different. I think Guard unit's were more likely to possess buddy systems due to the fact that unit members often stayed in the same unit/location for years at a time whereas active duty folks would've long since PCS'ed.

Response by SFC David Patterson made May 25 at 2017 12:23 AM

SFC David Patterson — Thu, 25 May 2017 00:23:18 -0400

As an OC/T at NTC I have seen all kinds of units. NG units are the best to train. From the most senior leader on down to the lowest ranking Private...they are information sponges. They take the job seriously, and are the most eilling to learn and implement change into thier formation's TTP'S. This is with bery few exceptions. AD units get so ingrained into a set proceedure it is almost impossible to get them to see thier errors and they fail at the same things over and over, and this is across BDE's throughout the AD.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made May 25 at 2017 12:50 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 25 May 2017 00:50:21 -0400

The active duty and reserve component are in constant competition for funding. If the active duty can downplay the role and relevancy of the NG they have a better chance of securing more funding. The mindset needs to change throughout all levels of leadership.

Response by SGT R Parker made May 25 at 2017 6:50 AM

SGT R Parker — Thu, 25 May 2017 06:50:12 -0400

I was in NG Field Artillery in the 70's and I can tell you, our batallion regularly beat out our active duty counterparts at Fort Sill. We were well trained, knew each other, trained hard and had good leaders.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made May 25 at 2017 8:23 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 25 May 2017 08:23:25 -0400

I go fishing about one weekend a month, and I take a two week fishing trip every summer. I am not a professional fisherman, and I would be out of my mind to demand the same respect from the fishing fleet as one of the Captain's from the "Deadliest Catch." That being said, as individuals, there are no greater Americans than our RC brothers. The time and energy they dedicate to their nation is hard to comprehend, and I have personally witnessed brothers from the SCARNG and NYARNG perform incredible acts of personnel courage under fire in Afghanistan. I have also personally witnessed the ugly blot on American history made by the USAR at Abu Ghraib. In summary, our reservists and guardsmen are the greatest Americans of our generation, but as an organization the RC is wanting.

Response by SPC Alan Arnesto made May 25 at 2017 9:02 AM

SPC Alan Arnesto — Thu, 25 May 2017 09:02:51 -0400

Been on both sides. Hell in the NG we beat out a few AD units and got a combat patrol sector in Baghdad. I was AD before NG.

Response by SPC Justin Foster made May 25 at 2017 9:42 AM

SPC Justin Foster — Thu, 25 May 2017 09:42:48 -0400

Ignorance. It's taught and learned in IET phase by some less than intelligent AD cadre, and this goofy mentality just grows from there.

Response by SSG Anderson Friedline made May 25 at 2017 9:46 AM

SSG Anderson Friedline — Thu, 25 May 2017 09:46:09 -0400

As a former active duty Marine and Natuonal Guardsman, here is my 2 cents. I worked as an instructor trainer for General Dynamics when the Stryker Program was hot and heavy. I have immense respect for the Army Infantry, but I would put up any National Guard Infantryman against their AD counterparts when it came to weapons knowledge. They both went to Sand Hill. But the guard bubbas have a finite amount of time to learn their machine guns and mortars and ATGM's after entry level training. I had to show AD SSGs how to head space and time a .50. I never had to show any Nasty girls how to do that. God bless you all. What makes the green grass grow?!!? BLOOD!!!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 25 at 2017 9:46 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 25 May 2017 09:46:51 -0400

After 12 years of service in the ARNG 2 of them spent OCONUS. I have found that given a few months to "spool up" there's is little to recognize a AD unit from an ARNG unit save for the bumper numbers. That being said the two branches have their own struggles and I think that anyone who has a bias or prejudice towards one or the other is simply lacking perspective.

Response by LTC Mathew Beckstead made May 25 at 2017 11:36 AM

LTC Mathew Beckstead — Thu, 25 May 2017 11:36:57 -0400

I can't tell you how many times u was told that I was "just" a Reservist. So just a heads up fff or my Active brothers, RC leadership spends an average of 30 to 40 hrs a week on top of working their regular jobs. I deployed in Jan 2003 and stayed mobilized until 2013. Retiringvwith 19 years active federal service. I am not unique in that respect as many RC Soldiers do the same. Weekend Warrior is a misnomer, I don't know anyone that just did 1 weekend a month and 2 weeks in the Summer. The biggest difference between AC and RC is that after a deployment A.C. Soldiers come home and assume a training cycle, RC Soldiers normally lose thier house, job and or business. RC Warriors deserve a tremendous amount of credit to their Patriotism, willingness to serve and maintain Army standards without all the support systems the A.C. take for granted. I get it A.C. does it all the time, that's great. Newly mobilized RC units are pasty, somewhat overweight, and aren't as fluid with jargon. My experience is that after mob of 21 days they start looking dressing, acting pretty good and after 6 months it is very hard to tell the difference. Can't we all just get along? :)

Response by MSgt Frank Martin made May 25 at 2017 1:31 PM

MSgt Frank Martin — Thu, 25 May 2017 13:31:51 -0400

I was never in the Air National Guard.. and never had a reason to hate or dislike them.

With ONE glaring exception.. I was on a Air Expeditionary Force deployment to Qatar... my replacement and the rest of my shop's replacements was meant to be from a guard unit. They tried to declare that the replacement team was "non deployable", and continued to inform CENTAF that they were not coming or they will be arriving up to six weeks late.

Then CENTAF and Air Combat Command told the ANG unit that they will be coming, no matter what the status... they did eventually come in.. two weeks late. When they got there the team was nice enough folks and the transition was a easy one day affair. But we found out that that the all woman team simply did not want to come.. so they tried to get out of it.

At that one time.. I lost all respect for the Guard.. it lasted about a month after I left the theater..

Response by SGT Lloyd Burge made May 25 at 2017 3:02 PM

SGT Lloyd Burge — Thu, 25 May 2017 15:02:41 -0400

My only contact with NG was to conduct ARTY ARTEP evaluations in 1980. I got the impression that the NG mat be very good at natural disasters, but I would not want them in a combat role.
The ARTEP manual did not have an overall evaluation code of "Pathetic"

Response by A1C Jeff Tippens made May 25 at 2017 3:42 PM

A1C Jeff Tippens — Thu, 25 May 2017 15:42:26 -0400

In the past such as Vietnam the Guard was a way not to be drafted and possibly avoid deployment. Not always but mostly. Then during the Gulf war many guard units were absolutely below standards and had to be brought up to speed. All these issues have been resolved as others have mentioned since 2001 and most Army and Air Guard units are deployment ready at anytime.

Response by SPC Doug A. made May 25 at 2017 4:22 PM

SPC Doug A. — Thu, 25 May 2017 16:22:56 -0400

Having served a few years as an active duty cannon crewman in a light infantry division that spent 6 months a year in the field and then as an MP in a Guard unit that deployed to a war zone, I think the AD enjoy a feeling of superiority over NGs because they fell they "live the life" and the NGs are just weekend posers. Until they need relief at a duty station in some sh&thole...then the NGs are a welcome sight! Those who suffer the harshest conditions tend to have the most pride in that suffering and an AD soldier living 24/7 in The Suck is going to have at least a little contempt for anyone who does not, including NGs, despite their equally deep desire to serve and their willingness to hang it all on the line.

Response by 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made May 25 at 2017 5:18 PM

2LT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 25 May 2017 17:18:33 -0400

Often if it's hate, it's due to lack of knowledge, or a need to validate one's own insecurities by hating someone else. If it's distaste or lack of respect? There are a mix of things that can come into play.

When I only had Active Duty time, I was a clown toward Reserve Component guys. I was taught/encouraged to think less of them, didn't know what I was talking about with my assumptions, and there was some confirmation bias, Reserve Component Soldiers are more likely to be older, with a lower PT score.

Since then, I've served in the reserve component both as a traditional part-time member when I was going to college, later as a Full Time/Active Duty member of the Reserve Component, and deployed with a RC unit. I would say that RC component troops are more likely to have a lower PT score, because self starting and working out without a unit is harder than most people think, while maintaining a career. That said, there are plenty of RC Soldiers who rock a PT badge or get a 300. The idea I always remind myself of is that PT score/run time is not actually directly analogous to leadership ability/Soldier quality, despite the culture I was brought up in on Active Duty.

There are plenty of RC soldiers who know their jobs as well if not better than the average AD Soldier, especially those who work in a similar career field. The idea they are poor quality Soldiers is rarely accurate when realistically compared to other normal Active Duty Soldiers.

Reserve Component Soldiers tend to be capable patriots, serving long careers and deploying when needed. They have a wide base of knowledge and perspectives, and overall are an integral part of US national defense needs. No one should hate another component, or other branch of the military.

Response by Sgt Dan Farrand made May 25 at 2017 5:44 PM

Sgt Dan Farrand — Thu, 25 May 2017 17:44:25 -0400

They do not hate them

Response by SGT Stephen Locke made May 25 at 2017 6:54 PM

SGT Stephen Locke — Thu, 25 May 2017 18:54:05 -0400

I was BOTH AD and NG. Only one answer, Ignorance.

Response by CPL Ralph Moschler made May 25 at 2017 10:18 PM

CPL Ralph Moschler — Thu, 25 May 2017 22:18:38 -0400

Very unprofessional , cut reg army vets every change the get , can't shoot or pass a pt test , hurt them selves to get out of being deployed

Response by CPL Ralph Moschler made May 25 at 2017 10:22 PM

CPL Ralph Moschler — Thu, 25 May 2017 22:22:41 -0400

Was getting my cut had a nco from the NG cryin 43percent could pass a pt test , and 49 percent could not pass a weapon qu

Response by SPC Roberto Roche made May 25 at 2017 11:25 PM

SPC Roberto Roche — Thu, 25 May 2017 23:25:51 -0400

Weekend warrios

Response by SSG Eduardo Ybarra Jr. MS Psyc made May 26 at 2017 1:00 AM

SSG Eduardo Ybarra Jr. MS Psyc — Fri, 26 May 2017 01:00:58 -0400

I'll sum up a NG encounter. During a Bradley Table VIII, I had the unfortunate experience of being a BCE (from Benning) for the Georgia National Guard. Upon the crew firing their first round to zero their 25mm, I noticed something long and metal fly downrange with the first shot fired. Yup the whole barrel went flying downrange. So needless to say I had them clear and elevate and go retrieve their barrel. The National Guard IMO "Hot Garbage", in other words more screwed up than a football bat. All I have to say is keep living up to active duty expectations.

Response by TSgt Nick Brydun made May 26 at 2017 7:12 AM

TSgt Nick Brydun — Fri, 26 May 2017 07:12:24 -0400

If u deployed u have no service member. Greatful to all our heros. Those who serve and those who gave all. HUA

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made May 26 at 2017 7:52 AM

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 26 May 2017 07:52:02 -0400

National Guard tank platoon leader here,

I participated in the Enhanced Readiness Model, culminating in an NTC rotation. I can tell you first hand how difficult a task that really was for an armored battalion. To put this in perspective; AD typically conducts crew/section/platoon/company/BN and BDE maneuvers before they reach NTC. They do all of this the same fiscal year.

A NG unit takes 3 years of training to do the same thing. The last training event we did was PLT/company maneuevers with a platoon live fire. THEN we shipped to NTC (decisive action) and we were expected to operate as a fully functional ABCT.

It's not easy for us "nasty girls" but at the end of the day we will accomplish anything the AD can... with less money/equipment/time.

Response by SPC Robert Buchanan made May 26 at 2017 10:16 AM

SPC Robert Buchanan — Fri, 26 May 2017 10:16:32 -0400

AD soilders live the dream NG soilders are just playing it.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 26 at 2017 11:02 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 26 May 2017 11:02:19 -0400

I have been in the army reserve now since 08. I have never deployed but I served with men that have. I was treated different for a long time but you earn respect of your peers with on your actions. I went to drill sergeant school and the active guys turned up there noses at me but if you as any active drill sergeant how they feel about us reserve guys not a damn one of them will have anything bad to say. We are there relief, we help make there days shorter we are knowledgeable of the training schedule and we don't have to be baby sat. So the select active as Sholes that hate us well guess what there is a STRONG chance that you were trained by one of us so stick that in your pipe and smoke it.

Response by PO2 Edward Groody made May 26 at 2017 9:19 PM

PO2 Edward Groody — Fri, 26 May 2017 21:19:01 -0400

All service men & women, from all branches, who perform their jobs to the best of their ability, make our military work properly.

Response by MSgt Randy Sullivan made May 27 at 2017 2:26 AM

MSgt Randy Sullivan — Sat, 27 May 2017 02:26:50 -0400

We don't hate the ANG. However, there is a level of earned respect that has to be reached before you are accepted as a proffessional

Response by 1SG Joseph Crane made May 27 at 2017 11:38 AM

1SG Joseph Crane — Sat, 27 May 2017 11:38:21 -0400

It takes 3 months for NG/Reserves to call up and deploy. Yes, the standards may be the"same," but there's no way the part time soldiers can meet the standard one weekend per month or two weeks a year; impossible!
When deployed (Afghanistan, at least), they have the menial jobs inside the wire while the AD combat soldiers live outside the wire. Maybe that's good as I wouldn't want part time "warriors" covering my six.
Having spent 24 years AD Special Forces, I just haven't seen the killer instinct or professionalism with PT as I had AD.

Response by SGT Harold Seymour made May 27 at 2017 12:45 PM

SGT Harold Seymour — Sat, 27 May 2017 12:45:00 -0400

Two years active Army, twenty-seven years Air Force Reserve, never had a coworker ignorant enough to throw the fact that I was a Reservist at me. Professionalism will always serve you well. There are a few shitbirds everywhere.

Response by SSG Thomas Reidenbach made May 27 at 2017 1:32 PM

SSG Thomas Reidenbach — Sat, 27 May 2017 13:32:38 -0400

I served in both Active Duty and the Guards and was deployed to Iraq in 08-09 with a NG unit. Funny how the AD unit we were under tried to treat us like crap until we corrected them on artillery procedures about 6 or 8 times in the first few months. Then by the end of the deployment they were sad to see us leave.

Response by Cpl John Barker made May 27 at 2017 4:43 PM

Cpl John Barker — Sat, 27 May 2017 16:43:04 -0400

Do you want the guy covering your back in a life or death fire fight to be a professional Marine, or a student who's a Marine one weekend a month? 4th LAR replaced us in Helmand in 2009 and Jesus H Christ these guys were boots, even their guys who had deployed before. I mean looked like a black hawk callander exploded on them when they went out on patrol, guys were also cocky because they had been to Iraq in 2008 after us (The AO by that time was cold) and we kept warning them that Afghanistan ain't Iraq. They had this little asian Navy Corpsman I'll never forget: actually had NO IDEA how to use his ACOG, like had been trained on iron sights and never got additional training. Him and 3 other guys got blown up by some 8 year old with a suicide vest, they didn't listen when we told them not to let the haji kids get close.

Response by SFC William Meharg made May 27 at 2017 6:14 PM

SFC William Meharg — Sat, 27 May 2017 18:14:05 -0400

I have been retired for 15 years from the Army National Guard, I served 36 yrs 9 mo and 20 days during that time I served 15 yrs 4 mo and 21 days inactive in Aug 1981 I reverted to the AGR program served 21 yrs 4 mo and 29 days on AD. I don't think that most AD soldiers hate the Guard. The only difference between AD and Guard is that the Active Duty units, battalions, etc have their personnel on duty 24/7 to maintain missions and task where the Guard has their personnel one weekend out of a month and two weeks annual training to maintain their missions and task. I started full time with the Guard in Apr 1974 as a civilian Administrative Supply Technician (AST) GS-5 me and a GS-7 worked 5 days a week maintaining administrative, supply, and training functions for a Combat Heavy Engineer/Maintenance Company with 160 personnel we had administrative, unit supply, and cook personnel plus Vertical and Horizonal Platoons plus a Direct Support Maintenance Platoon. In Aug 1981 I reverted to AGR SSG/E6 Unit Sup Sgt in Aug 1987 I was assigned to Battalion Headquarters in the S4 section as Bn Sup Sgt E7/SFC I had a CW4 that was the property book officer he was a GS-7 we were responsible for a 600 man Combat Heavy Engineer Battalion with over 33 million dollars of equipment and property to maintain and assign down to 4 units w/ 3 attachment units. In Nov 1989 the CW4 property book officer retired and when he retired their were not a replacement for him so I was assigned as a Additional duty Appointment as the Property Book Officer for two years before a replacement was assigned a CW3 GS-7 replacement took over in 1991 but in three years he transfered to State Headquarters and again I was assigned as PBO and the Battalion was finally given authorization to hire a AGR Spec 4 to help me with daily missions and task was still PBO when I retired in Nov 2001. I feel like if AD soldiers knew how the Guard functioned in their day to day operations they might have a different attitude toward the Guard. I know when I was serving we had some bad apples just like everyone else.

Response by SPC William Jimenez made May 27 at 2017 7:57 PM

SPC William Jimenez — Sat, 27 May 2017 19:57:48 -0400

Never had an issue with active duty

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 27 at 2017 10:44 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 27 May 2017 22:44:12 -0400

I deployed with a guard unit In 2004. I to was former AD. To tell you the truth I am glad I went with the guard. They are more self-sufficient then AD. If an guy has been AD his hole career, then the job he learned at 18 is the only job he knows. But the guard had not only military people, but we bring all sorts of tradesmen with us to. We had carpenters, plumbers,electricians, computer techs, etc. We needed something fixed we didn't need another unit to take care of it.

Response by CSM John Mead made May 28 at 2017 1:20 AM

CSM John Mead — Sun, 28 May 2017 01:20:35 -0400

Weekend warriors

Response by SFC Jan Alvey made May 28 at 2017 1:37 AM

SFC Jan Alvey — Sun, 28 May 2017 01:37:44 -0400

N G's get to go home after NTC.

Response by LCpl Imre Csikany made May 28 at 2017 2:40 AM

LCpl Imre Csikany — Sun, 28 May 2017 02:40:25 -0400

When you call they answer. That's good enough for me. I've heard it all. But there are slackers and professionals in active and reserve. I was in a reserve unit that took their job and training very serious.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 28 at 2017 9:25 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 28 May 2017 09:25:12 -0400

AD joined to see combat. NG and Reserves joined for school and health care

Response by A1C Private RallyPoint Member made May 28 at 2017 10:51 AM

A1C Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 28 May 2017 10:51:37 -0400

I was national guard and the hardest part for me was maintaining my military bearing while living a double life as a civillian working in the refineries and as an airman on the weekends and in training. Had I been active duty and immersed in the military life every single day it would have been so much easier to manage.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 28 at 2017 1:50 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 28 May 2017 13:50:11 -0400

They don't understand them.

Response by SGT Anthony Colby made May 28 at 2017 1:53 PM

SGT Anthony Colby — Sun, 28 May 2017 13:53:28 -0400

I served in the AD AR and NG. I can honestly say this. The NG unit I was in didn't offer any sustainment training. As medics we were offered by the local hospital the chance to take over their ER on drill weekends.
Well the ER deal was shot down with PMCS of age old equipment that never got repaired took preference.
Trying to send medics to schools to advance their skills and knowledge
was impossible.
During our two week AT working on scenarios of different casualties and other emergencies never happened. So then you get called to deploy to Iraq, medics fail to meet standard, have to go to Fort Carlson for months of training before being eligible to deploy.
That was my experience with the NG......

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 28 at 2017 2:22 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 28 May 2017 14:22:33 -0400

I'm not here to come off rude, but coming in as a new soldier, and being with my unit for 5 months, I'm active, work anywhere between 9am-6am and sometimes 9am til 10pm, have already been to one cycle of JRTC, just got back from PTA, and leaving for another cycle of PTA soon. To come back and get ready for a field problem on post, to recover and leave for another cycle of JRTC right after my baby is born. According to our CSM and LTC we are the most deployable brigade in the United States Army. Yes national guards training calander can be hectic, but ours is just the same on top of already being active duty. You can't let those active soldiers that negatively bash on national guard be the reason you think national guard is just as hard working as active. Aside from your hectic training calander, you guys only do normal work one weekend out of the month, and aside from NTC, JRTC, PTA, or whatever other training cycles you guys take part in, and aside from deployments, on a normal day, you guys are off for the rest of the month every month.

Response by SP5 Eric Logan Sr. made May 28 at 2017 5:58 PM

SP5 Eric Logan Sr. — Sun, 28 May 2017 17:58:58 -0400

Used be a difference in the 90's but 911 changed that, its "seemless" to my knowledge in today's military... lots of "part time patriots " are in the mix for real !!

Response by SPC Jeremy Thomas made May 28 at 2017 9:25 PM

SPC Jeremy Thomas — Sun, 28 May 2017 21:25:23 -0400

We don't. Someone's gotta serve chow!

Response by SSG Jimmy Arnold made May 28 at 2017 9:59 PM

SSG Jimmy Arnold — Sun, 28 May 2017 21:59:26 -0400

When I was in Iraq around 70 percent of the soldiers there where guard or reserve my unit did left seat right seat train up for 82 airborne there first mission out on there own they shot up a friendly vechial so ra units are just as screwed up

Response by SGT Scott Smith made May 29 at 2017 6:44 AM

SGT Scott Smith — Mon, 29 May 2017 06:44:13 -0400

Having spent 20 years in the National Guard, your statement rings true. I joined in 1983 and retired in 2003. What a drastic difference from start to end. It was as you said, beer drinking to being deployed. The National Guard has changed so much since the 80's. Completely different.

Response by LTC Dale Beasley made May 29 at 2017 11:21 AM

LTC Dale Beasley — Mon, 29 May 2017 11:21:07 -0400

-They don't have the same competitive requirements that the Active and Reserve Soldier has
-they all got "Participation Bronze Stars"

Response by PO2 Fraser Zapoli made May 29 at 2017 1:24 PM

PO2 Fraser Zapoli — Mon, 29 May 2017 13:24:35 -0400

All of the above in my family and circle, all brothers & sisters in our fight to defend freedom.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2017 2:48 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 29 May 2017 14:48:52 -0400

Undisciplined

Response by PO1 Jon A. Poe made May 29 at 2017 5:20 PM

PO1 Jon A. Poe — Mon, 29 May 2017 17:20:06 -0400

I have been on all sides of the fence: National Guard, Active Duty Navy (ADR), National Guard again, Active duty Army (25th Inf. DivArty Aviation), National guard again (Aviation Section chief), Army Reserve (supply Sergeant), and Navy Reserve (Seabee).
Our RNMCB units regularly outperformed the Marines at 29Palms in military maneuvers. As our LT once told a Marine CAPT; "My Bees are all from MT, ID, WY, WA, and AK. They normally track whitetail deer through the woods. Your Marines are EASY!"
During my two active duty tours (Naval Aviation and Army Aviation), I did not notice any adversarial relationship between the active duty folks and the Guard/Reserve, even in 'Nam. We had a job to do, and we all did it the best way we knew how. Perhaps I was lucky enough to be with true professionals who cared more about the job than stupid labels!
When I started drawing retired pay, I had a total time in sefvice of 34 years. Yeah, I been there, did that.

Response by LCpl Donald Faucett made May 29 at 2017 7:27 PM

LCpl Donald Faucett — Mon, 29 May 2017 19:27:26 -0400

They have my respect. The often get called upon without a moments notice to respond to answer their call for duty, on homeland and abroad. They are very important to the stability of our Nation.

Response by TSgt Steve Wheeler made May 29 at 2017 9:36 PM

TSgt Steve Wheeler — Mon, 29 May 2017 21:36:27 -0400

Back in the day, 1980-1994, lack of professionalism. Part time warriors, poor attitudes. Has improved since due to combat tours/requirements.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2017 11:35 PM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 29 May 2017 23:35:29 -0400

I have more of a love hate relationship with them because one they can work wherever they want and can see family anytime they want.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 30 at 2017 4:39 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 30 May 2017 04:39:54 -0400

i know from personal experience coming from guard to active duty as a "specialist" i didn't know a damn thing that any of the AD Specialists knew, let alone some of the PFCs. in the guard i did literally ZERO training, and if i did it wasn't that big of an impact on me. There wasn't really any structure either. yes there were E-1 to E-9s there but if you weren't at least an E-6 or E-7 you were just one of the guys. No one besides a seasoned E-6 and up knew how to take apart a SAW or a M240b. BUT we had 2 guys in the unit who were active duty and just decided to do guard with a CIB and a combat patch who knew level 1 and some of level 2 knowledge that blew us away. "you mean... you can take apart that 240? AND PUT IT BACK TOGETHER?" the last time that guard unit even deployed was in 2005. it was literally a 62% PT fail rate and people failing the UA every drill. In AD fear and discipline aren't instilled in you at basic training and by your TL in your first unit so it's maintained. In the guard it goes away bc you go home back to your normal civilian life telling all your buddies your "high speed" basic training stories and then sit around at your unit 1 weekend a month not doing a damn thing let alone knowing what to do bc everyone there who does know what you should be doing are to high up in the CoC to care bc they're either to busy trying to coast these last 14 months bc they can retire or they don't have the energy to train everyone from the ground up. i know this bc i was that guy to go home and be like yeup i'm a solider. honor me at veterans day, yes i would like my military discount so on so forth

Response by CW4 Harris Smith made May 30 at 2017 10:35 AM

CW4 Harris Smith — Tue, 30 May 2017 10:35:56 -0400

Going into Iraq in 2003 & 1st 6 months after ground war the Army awarded 17,000 Bronze Stars. Less than 1,000 were awarded to NG & USAR soldiers which soldiers made up approximately 50% of the force. CW4 Ret.

Response by LTC Jay Eller made May 30 at 2017 11:53 AM

LTC Jay Eller — Tue, 30 May 2017 11:53:17 -0400

I don't think anyone "hates" the National Guard but in all my years on active duty and working with the round-out units in the Guard I did notice one thing in particular. The Guard is very good in units that require a lot of individual skills that have counterparts in civilian life. Medics, pilots, engineers, or any highly trained individual skill and the Guard forces may actually be better in a lot of cases. BUT once you leave a company or battery and get to battalion and higher where combined arms and collective skills are required, they usually failed. Company commanders, platoon leaders, squad leaders are OK. If they have the right attitude and a little extra pre-deployment training, They can get up to speed pretty quickly. BUT Battalion level and above (especially in the combat arms) is another story. I've personally seen battalion and brigade commanders that didn't have the knowledge of good Lieutenant or Captain.

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made May 30 at 2017 12:32 PM

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 30 May 2017 12:32:43 -0400

They're the same one if offensive and the other is defensive. The guards defend the state's if anyone attacks us, or there a riot or some shit happin.

Response by SFC Jim Ruether made May 30 at 2017 12:40 PM

SFC Jim Ruether — Tue, 30 May 2017 12:40:15 -0400

All of the Active Duty soldiers I met whether they were here to eval our unit for combat readiness or we were on active duty liked us and our work ethic. I never felt that we were looked down on or hated. In fact when I finished Basic and AIT and got my orders to return to my home station and report to my commander that I completed my training my counter parts were getting their orders for Germany, Korea, or other far off places. Since we weren't involved in any conflicts at the time they thought I was the smartest soldier there....ha ha

Response by SPC Joshua Crawford made May 31 at 2017 8:55 AM

SPC Joshua Crawford — Wed, 31 May 2017 08:55:14 -0400

First off any civilian that tries to insult any member of any branch will get a swift throat chop. I live next to a joint reserve post. Yes I know reserves and national guard are different, but most AD sees them as basically the same. I often see soldier's without head gear, sunglasses on their head, earphones in while in uniform, and unargorized sunglasses. So it seems l like the regulations arent taken as serious. Also I have a few friends on fb who turn every holiday with a patriotic background into national change their profile pictures to 5 year old AIT pictures day. Annoying

Response by PFC James Bratcher made May 31 at 2017 11:32 AM

PFC James Bratcher — Wed, 31 May 2017 11:32:32 -0400

I honestly think it's mostly just esprit de corps. My fellow guardsmen and I caught flack from our regular army counterparts in training, but I wouldn't want them to admit equality. I wanna serve next to soldiers who insist that their unit is the best, as we did.

Response by SSG Randy Wise made May 31 at 2017 4:13 PM

SSG Randy Wise — Wed, 31 May 2017 16:13:07 -0400

Misconceptions

Response by CPT Allen Walker made May 31 at 2017 6:03 PM

CPT Allen Walker — Wed, 31 May 2017 18:03:09 -0400

I was in Germany in the RA as a dentist and really looked forward to reserve guys coming in. They had both military and civilian training. I learned a lot and was greatful that they were willing to share the knowledge they gained in both fields of service. All of them out ranked me but none of them treated me with anything other than respect.

Response by Patrick Weeks made May 31 at 2017 9:10 PM

Patrick Weeks — Wed, 31 May 2017 21:10:24 -0400

NG=No Good

Response by SP5 John Kirtley made May 31 at 2017 9:20 PM

SP5 John Kirtley — Wed, 31 May 2017 21:20:21 -0400

There once was a time when joining the Guard was a way out of doing any fighting. ie Vietnam. My older brother convinced me to join the NV nat. guard in Dec 67, he was trying to protect me. I served just under 3 yr, then I volunteered for active duty and Vietnam. Guilt drove my decision mainly. I soon realized it was probably the best thing I did. I Spent 7 yrs on AD 3 as a Crewchief in LOH's & 58"s then 4 as a Nike-Hercules missile launcher section chief. These young guardsmen today being rotated in and out of combat theaters have certainly earned my respect. I didn't know of any animosity of AD soldiers against guardsmen. They are all professional soldiers in my eyes.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 1 at 2017 7:22 AM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 01 Jun 2017 07:22:20 -0400

Because they think they have earned all the respect you have as an active-duty soldier, yet they don't have to put the same amount of dedication into their job. Eventually they go home and live their regular life. We are the first to get called for any kind of deployment and the last to leave. But hey that's our job. But there's nothing worse than somebody who does not have the same requirements coming in your tent and bitching even louder. They are weekend warriors, half of them should not be wearing the uniform their in. Their lack of training is a danger to everybody they are around. They are best used for augmenting lawn force meant within the United States, but they are not a military in my eyes.

Response by MCPO Daniel Vincent made Jun 1 at 2017 7:53 AM

MCPO Daniel Vincent — Thu, 01 Jun 2017 07:53:05 -0400

Probably for the lack of training

Response by LTC Ben Chlapek made Jun 1 at 2017 3:47 PM

LTC Ben Chlapek — Thu, 01 Jun 2017 15:47:56 -0400

I rarely, if ever see animosity between the active component and the USAR/NG. When I entered the service in 1975, the animosity was there for the reasons listed above. However, after 9-11, I saw no evidence of this animosity towards each other. It was a bonus on deployment when we had NG units as part of our Brigade or Task Force. Heavy equipment operators who were subject matter experts on the same in their civilian jobs, physicians, state troopers, CEO's of large companies as commanders, and we even had a school superintendent as a CSM. We had city civil engineers as senior NCO's who helped immensely with construction and public works projects and we had Infantry battalions that were exceptionally skilled in their MOS's from Iowa, Ohio, and Wisconsin NG's. Having a high school principal as a first sergeant is a force multiplier, as well as tractor-trailer drivers to operate your tankers and big trucks while troubleshooting issues when they broke down. We all had a high level respect for each other with the exception of a narcissistic hospital "commander" who was chasing stars and working on his general officer packet when not on boondoggles outside the wire. The active duty guys enjoyed the NG guys sharing their expertise from their civilian occupations and the NG folks appreciated learning about new technology from their active duty counterparts. Hate? It just wasn't a part of the whole thing.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 5 at 2017 10:40 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 22:40:25 -0400

They are lame

Response by SFC William Stephens A. Jr., 3 MSM, JSCM made Jun 16 at 2017 9:54 AM

SFC William Stephens A. Jr., 3 MSM, JSCM — Fri, 16 Jun 2017 09:54:40 -0400

I don't know how you see NG soldiers but I used to see them as weekend warriors until I was assigned to TSBN as an OC/T and now we all wear Green, I mean take it first hand, deploying into theater with a bunch of lazy dirt bags and soldiers who didn't think they had a mission, when the first bullet went down range everything change, these guys and some gals game face came on and these soldiers, NCOs and Officer turned in to real combat warriors, their was no more NG or regular Army they were fighting for one cause. to stay alive. For awhile when I came to the TSBN we would brief the units and they would like take everything as joke and so would we because this to me was like long TDY trip away from home in the states but Shit hit the fan when the units we were training, were soon certifying to deploy to combat and we as combat instructors we were volunteered to deploy with them to see how our training paid off. So now when I see soldiers, I see Green or what ever color uniform they are wearing because you never know if that dirt bag you categorize has seen more shit than you. Most NG or Reservist have seen a lot of action and some have gone back to back because the active duty units can't for fill the mission. So next time you want to point your finger at a NG soldiers and call them out make sure you know were they have been and know your stopping ground.

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Jun 16 at 2017 10:29 AM

Lt Col Jim Coe — Fri, 16 Jun 2017 10:29:11 -0400

I have great respect for the Guard having worked with some Air Guard members who were excellent officers and aviators. Of course having family members in the Reserve Component gives me both respect and familiarity with the Guard and Reserve.

My sentiments toward the Air Guard based on experience and familiarity tend toward giving them great credit for their readiness considering the constraints under which they work. I do know State politics influences the Guard to some degree. Getting into a Guard unit sometimes depends on who you know. Knowing the "right" people in the unit can help Guardsmen get opportunities for training, schools, deployments, and thereby promotions. Unfortunately, who you know can also benefit SNCOs and Officers who don't have the experience and leadership necessary to successfully hold their positions. This aspect of the Guard may be the main issue for Active Duty personnel.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 29 at 2017 2:38 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 29 Jun 2017 14:38:31 -0400

No one on active duty "hates" the National Guard and if they do, they are a moron. It's generally good natured ribbing just like we do between the other services.

My brother is National Guard. I give him crap a lot - especially when he's been in a year longer than me and I out rank him. (I'm active duty). But I know that when we were deployed the same time he did a lot more than I did. He's an 88M - he was out there on the roads in 2005-06 all the time. In fact, a 5 minute difference he could not be with us right now. They changed him out as a driver five minutes before the convoy left and that guy ended up dead after an EFP hit their convoy. Another soldier lost his legs.
I think at the end of the day we all realize we fight for the same team. We just like to give each other crap whether it's active or Guard/Reserve or Army vs Navy vs Air Force vs Marine and so on. There's even the MOS wars. But we get down to it when we all have to.

Response by LTC Ben Chlapek made Jun 29 at 2017 5:28 PM

LTC Ben Chlapek — Thu, 29 Jun 2017 17:28:13 -0400

If an AD soldier hates the NG soldier, it's usually due to lack of education about the National Guard. Since 9/11, the National Guard and Reserve have become like active duty with constant deployments, more home station active duty, and countless nights in the field or unit without seeing their families.
With the Reserve and National Guard, you get a "double bonus" many times. By that, I mean you get people like the First Sergeant who is a high school principal in the civilian world, you get MP's who are civilian law enforcement officers, you get cardio-thoracic surgeons in your Combat Support Hospitals . . . you get the picture. Many in the Guard came from active duty. There are many professionals who are gone for a year or more from our region right now, deployed overseas with an Infantry Brigade for a year plus. You get airline and EMS pilots who get many times the hours they would accrue on active duty, and that experience counts. We had state troopers from four different states on one of my previous deployment, as well as 40 firefighters, EMTs, and Paramedics with our task force.
There's no room for hate or discontent towards Guard and Reserve soldiers or Active Duty soldiers for that matter. Show them the respect you would want to get from them.

Response by CPL Ralph Moschler made Jun 29 at 2017 10:39 PM

CPL Ralph Moschler — Thu, 29 Jun 2017 22:39:39 -0400

Training , NG don't train like reg army , and here all time how they disrespect reg army troops ,

Response by CPL Ralph Moschler made Jun 29 at 2017 10:47 PM

CPL Ralph Moschler — Thu, 29 Jun 2017 22:47:11 -0400

NG has no respect for reg army ,

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2017 12:04 AM

CW3 Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 07 Jul 2017 00:04:12 -0400

Hate is a strong word. I know that 16+ years ago there was a mentality among Regular Army Soldiers that National Guardsmen weren't as well trained and even referred to them as "Nasty Girls." However this was in the days of few deployments among guardsmen and also different training standards (before the total army system was in place). I really don't think this is so much of an issue anymore (especially after 9/11), and really don't think it was as widespread as some might think even before then. Fact is, every unit (active, guard, or reserve) is different. And when you consider how many Regular Army Soldiers come over to the guard, not to mention the fact the many National Guard units deploy the same--or even more--than many Regular Army units, how can this even be an issue anymore? As a National Guardsmen myself, I have been on active duty with Regular Army units both in garrison and in combat for months or even years at a time. Additionally, I run into Regular Army Soldiers all the time when I go to schools or am on a deployment and see Soldiers that I (as a guardsman) have actually deployed more than. So clearly that is also not an issue. Additionally, we now all go to the same schools/training. So if there is still an problems between the two these days, I rarely see it. When/if I do, its pretty easy to highlight that it is stupid comparison. When it comes down to it, when we both actually end up deployed and/or in a combat situation, we do the same job. Period.

Response by SPC(P) Carlos Santini made Jul 7 at 2017 1:21 AM

SPC(P) Carlos Santini — Fri, 07 Jul 2017 01:21:25 -0400

Because they think they are better trained and are more dedicated but what they do not realize is the majority of the invading force into Iraq 2003 were NG and AR.
http://www.prb.org/Publications/Articles/2005/USMilitarysRelianceontheReserves.aspx

USMilitarysRelianceontheReserves.aspx

Response by SSG Steven Pike made Jul 17 at 2017 8:02 PM

SSG Steven Pike — Mon, 17 Jul 2017 20:02:52 -0400

I do not know. Tried to join the RA, but was told my hearing was not quite up to snuff. The recruiter said that if I really wanted to serve. I should try the NG. So I managed to pass the NG hearing test. Spent the next six years training to engage Soviet tanks in Europe. If you take the oath, no matter who you are. you take the oath.

Response by SPC Anthony Molnar made Jul 17 at 2017 9:50 PM

SPC Anthony Molnar — Mon, 17 Jul 2017 21:50:45 -0400

Generally, from the junior enlisted standpoint, I want to say that it has to do with information or misinformation.

One of the rumors jr joes kick around: They are promoted based on slot availability instead of training and points.
Transferring to NG from AD usually means auto-promotion.
(From NGs own mouths, unit by unit I'm sure) "We don't do that, we just show up, do this or that, then we are done for the month. Hell, sometimes we just call in."

For me, I was weary of wanting to associate with NGs just hearing this and watching them from a distance. I was a medic though, so the less genitals I had to see the better.

I'm sure most of the rumors, like usual, are not true or are being stretched. I can only tell you what I heard on the low end of the totem pole.

Response by MAJ Richard Cheek made Jul 18 at 2017 11:46 AM

MAJ Richard Cheek — Tue, 18 Jul 2017 11:46:55 -0400

I've since changed my mind. But when I was a young troop during Vietnam it was because guys joined the NG to keep from going to Vietnam. Infantry AIT was became pretty testy when the Ohio National Guard fired on the Kent State students half way through my AIT. We had some serious barracks issues. After I did my first 2 years I actually joined the NG .... had to make sure my beer cooler was properly strapped down in my gun jeep. After 6 months of playing soldier I reenlisted and went off to the 101st so I could be a real soldier again. Over the years I changed my mind. As their mission changed my mind changed too. Since 9-11 I've come to respect the guard a lot more.

Response by SSG Robert Perrotto made Jul 18 at 2017 11:54 AM

SSG Robert Perrotto — Tue, 18 Jul 2017 11:54:39 -0400

not hate them, but mock them, sure - just like the services mock each other, no different. In the end, doesn't matter whether you are AD, Guard or reserve, you are a brother/sister in arms and when the SHTF, everyone got each others back.

Response by SPC Tim Weber made Jul 18 at 2017 2:42 PM

SPC Tim Weber — Tue, 18 Jul 2017 14:42:16 -0400

When I went from active to guard I noticed a lot of guardsman acting hot shit and knowing very little about their jobs. As active duty it's a life style, you live breathe eat and fuck this shit. In the guard it's an occasional job.

Response by MAJ Luca Luca made Jul 18 at 2017 5:14 PM

MAJ Luca Luca — Tue, 18 Jul 2017 17:14:27 -0400

I would say that there might not be "hate" from AD troops, especially those who have served in or around the NG. But there is a stereotype or perception by some who have not been around the Guard that they are a bunch of rolly polly good ole boys getting lit and staying at hotels, poured into their uniforms and sporting fumanchu staches. I think that pre-9/11 that may have been true in some instances, now, that stereotype should be changed. Something like 60+% of the troops in the Guard are former AD. The biggest difference is the ability to maintain the standards of the DOA for guys who work it out once a month and 2 weeks a year. But because of the changing world mission, NG is utilized often on deployments and other active operations. The point is, they aren't the same Cold War cats guarding the keg and riding the easy bus to the Merriot. They are a valuable part of the global organization put together to represent the spectrum of the United States Military. I have known some really sqaured away Natty Guard guys and some shitards who made careers out of the Regular Army.
So, that is my thought anyway. It is just a perception of the past. Now, those Air Force Reseve cats, jokers, all of'em.

Response by CW5 Ranger Dave made Jul 22 at 2017 3:18 PM

CW5 Ranger Dave — Sat, 22 Jul 2017 15:18:27 -0400

In 1980, as an OH-58 driver, I had envy for the Guard. They had better maintained equipment and a better Union.

Response by SGT Eric Knutson made Jul 23 at 2017 8:28 AM

SGT Eric Knutson — Sun, 23 Jul 2017 08:28:17 -0400

I think it is actually something that had its genesis a very long time ago, People need to remember that from 1945 up until 2002 the National Guard and Reserves had very few deployments or need for them. (I am not too sure if they were activated for Korea on any kind of scale) But the major formations did not. So prior to GWOT the vast majority of these units have not seen action for longer than the people manning them were even alive. Whereas the Active forces always seemed to have at least 1 or 2 guys who have seen action even if on very limited scale (mostly Airborne or Light Infantry).
This attitude was not helped by the observed actions by SOME units when they were on their Annual Training (also not helped that everyone called this summer camp). When I was at Hohenfels, we would get augmente reenforcements from the Guard and Reserves for some of our heavier training cycles. we had several times where the work performed by NCO's from the augmentees (or signed off by them) was caught by our Junior Enlisted and shown to be substandard or incomplete. Now this was, for me, in the 90's well before the start of our current excitement levels, where the Guard and Reserves are getting a serious workout, and the standards really mean something to them now, that they did not have then. I have heard from several people on both sides of the line that they are holding themselves to the high standards that we expected from regular units which is good. And with the duration of operations, I would expect that they will continue to do so for at least the 25 to 35 years after GWOT is ever concluded. It is not the "old boy network" that it was in the 70's through 90's. which helps a lot.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 24 at 2017 12:00 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 24 Jul 2017 12:00:49 -0400

they think we are not as good as they are, they see us as weaker, as wanna be's . but they fail to notice one thing, that we NG soldiers have better civilian skills which sometimes come to play when deployed. I speak from experience.

Response by SGM Jerry Kastler made Jul 27 at 2017 9:14 PM

SGM Jerry Kastler — Thu, 27 Jul 2017 21:14:45 -0400

I had a lot of experience with guard units during my career. It usually came down to unit leadership and individual motivation. Some guard units were just great with good leaders and soldiers. Others lived up to the stereotype. I agree with what others have posted about them getting better over the years. Going back to the 70's some of them were just horror shows, as were a lot of the active duty units. We all got better. I also think that a good bit of the friction is just people giving other people a hard time for entertainment. Typical inter-service rivalry.

Response by PO2 Skip Kirkwood made Aug 3 at 2017 8:44 PM

PO2 Skip Kirkwood — Thu, 03 Aug 2017 20:44:17 -0400

"Hate" is a pretty strong word. Is this really an issue, or it it just some inter-organization rivalry and ribbing? Most have been in 2 of the 3 possibilities (regular, reserve, guard).....

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 4 at 2017 6:02 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 04 Oct 2017 18:02:00 -0400

Just a personal opinion but I would attribute it to poor leadership. I spent a lot of my active duty life in various headquarters that included huge levels of roundout support from ARNG units. I spent a huge part of my life in the field with ARNG units doing their rotational duty. Lots of time on ranges, tank tables, and maneuver sites in CPX, FTX, and other training events. It is an easy road to think less of others accomplishments. I have seen some of the stupidest mistakes imaginable but for the life of me cannot find a single discriminator that tells me where the next one will come from, ARNG or Active Duty Units. I have seen active and ARNG leaders that make comments, stage events, or conduct themselves in a manner that promotes negative comments and opinions between the components. I have never tolerated it, though I have occasionally suffered through it.

Response by SFC Joseph Weber made Dec 30 at 2017 10:10 AM

SFC Joseph Weber — Sat, 30 Dec 2017 10:10:44 -0500

I wouldn't say I ever hated the NG. Lot of good guys serving their states and their country both. I did hate the NG recruiters when I was a recruiter. They were evil. Of course most recruiters from all services are evil.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 8 at 2018 10:58 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 08 Jan 2018 22:58:59 -0500

I’ll just put it this way. I’ve been in the NG for almost 15 years and I’ve been in great NG units and some really bad ones. I’m an AGR soldier as well.

I can’t really speak for AD because I’ve been AGR for about 13 years and I’ve spent all my time in the NG.

This is not a knock against AD because I’m NG. I’ve met some great AD soldiers, but there are some great NG soldiers I’ve seen in my career as well. As far as my job field goes here is what I’ve noticed working with AD supply sergeants.

1. Seems that AD supply sergeants strictly deal with Property Management most of the time and that’s really it. I could be wrong, but after working with AD and holding conversations with them it seems that’s what they do.

2. AD has a schedule PT time. Making it easier to keep in shape. I have to juggle with my time to do PT. I do keep myself in shape and I’ve never failed an APFT or Height/Weight. I hold the belief that NG is held to the same standard as AD related to PT and should be, but I also understand the citizen soldier that works 60 hours a week and has a family. I encourage improvement on PT and height and weight.

3. I’ll go back to my point I posted on post number 1. A NG supply sergeant deals with property management, OCIE, Maintenance, Rations and the list goes on and on. I also don’t have Soldiers working under my supervision during the week. Most of the manual labor is done by myself. I’m constantly working with the Readiness NCO as well to ensure we are equipped and ready. Ever heard of State Actice Duty mission? You get a lot of those in a state like Oklahoma.

4. Our CIF building is located in OKC. I remember being a suplly sergeant in Muskogee and driving 150 miles to OKC just to pick up OCIE and sign for it. Then I would drive 150 miles back and issue it to the soldier.

5. Rations- We don’t have dining facilities. I have to call and coordinate with a vendor for rations every drill weekend or sometimes (if your unit has cooks) I have to order a truck load of food and inventory it all myself and place it in the kitchen’s freezer (keep in mind I do most of the manual labor).

6. Maintenance- I don’t have a maintenance section in my unit. Which means nearly every drill weekend I’m the one submitting the work orders and tracking their completion of anything is deadline on a ten level PMCS. Most of the time it’s not even drill weekends I’m working on this. I do most of it throughout the month. I have a meeting once a month with the FMS shop chief and go over my deadlined and completed job orders.

I went to the active duty ALC at Fort Lee And was the only AGR NG soldier there out of like 250 soldiers. I got asked a lot of questions in the class on why we do stuff differently in the NG compared to AD.

I made some friends with the AD folk there and they learned to appreciate everything we did once I explained what a NG Supply Sergeant has to do.

I’ve seen AD Logisticians come to the NG side and get a job as an AGR soldier and just become completely overwhelmed with the amount of work it takes.

I’ve seen my fair share of 7 or 8 o’clock nights as an AGR NG soldier just so I can meet my deadlines.

The AD and NG components (in my opinion) are unique in their own way.

Response by 1SG Brian Emmert made Apr 20 at 2018 11:39 AM

1SG Brian Emmert — Fri, 20 Apr 2018 11:39:24 -0400

I don't think it is hate really. It is more like disbelief that a PT soldier can perform at AD levels in their own MOS that makes them feel threatened. Most people don't react well to being out performed by someone who doesn't appear to train as much.

Response by MG J Brown made Aug 10 at 2018 8:33 PM

MG J Brown — Fri, 10 Aug 2018 20:33:29 -0400

They are generally immature cocky and a liability

Response by SGT George Lamont made Nov 18 at 2018 6:00 PM

SGT George Lamont — Sun, 18 Nov 2018 18:00:31 -0500

I spent 12 years in the US ARMY National Guard in Alaska. The same rules and regulations apply to guardsmen as with the Active Duty Component of the ARMY. We've trained in subzero temperatures and being an Alaskan Native and experienced in cold weather survival our experiences aided us from getting any cold weather casualties in our companies during our winter training excercises. The active duty components on the other hand, had frostbite and hypothermia casualties having no experience in cold weather operations and survival. During extreme cold weather and winter excercises with our counter parts, the active duty components, our side usually had the home court advantage due to knowledge and experience in extreme cold weather survival. There's alot more to US ARMY National Guardsmen than meets the eye. We're still full fledged soldiers and Americans.

Response by CPT Tom Monahan made Feb 7 at 2019 6:34 PM

CPT Tom Monahan — Thu, 07 Feb 2019 18:34:22 -0500

Because they don’t what the Army is. The State Militia, NG, have dual missions that AD folks forget. When Federalized, the NG, along with the Reserve, were often considered follow on or replacement forces. They needed trained up to work at BN, BDE, Div, and Corps levels. Look at all the Army Divisons and Corps there are; most are NG or Reserve. For the last 20 years we have abused the NG and Reserve by not just increasing the size of the active force.

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 26 at 2019 5:26 PM

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 26 Feb 2019 17:26:26 -0500

I honestly don't know why people look down on us. We have gone through basic and AIT... A matter of fact in some ways we are even more honorable, AD soldiers have accepted the full time job of military non stop.... but we on the other hand will leave our High end jobs ( i am a lvl 5 fiber engineer for directv, average about 110k per year) to fight overseas and leave our families. We are held to basically the same PT reqs and only have a fraction of the time AD does to train. We are generally more educated on the civilian side , which directly translates to a unit having more knowledge than Run-N-Gun. I am 25u in the Guard, i envy AD also.

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 8 at 2019 8:27 PM

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 08 Jun 2019 20:27:09 -0400

The guards also there for statewide relief, if we have flooding on the east or west coast or riots that need handled then send a national guard unit that way and it's taken care of

Response by SSG Kenneth Ponder made Jun 14 at 2020 8:24 AM

SSG Kenneth Ponder — Sun, 14 Jun 2020 08:24:53 -0400

During Vietnam very few NG units were called up to to go. That's why so damn many people joined them and stayed in. They started calling them up in the 90's, things changed.
After 9/11 th ed Army used them as cannon fodder. Some were good, most wasn't.