What should I do if I see a fellow Corporal being singled out and belittled by more senior NCOs, but do not want to create too much conflict?

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 13 Feb 2018 21:55:46 -0500

So what do to if ssgt's and sgt's dislike a cpl in the platoon and constantly belittle and demean the cpl while trying to find a way to fry or burn that cpl from disliking him so much, he doesn't have enough negative paperwork to be charged with an njp, the cpl is been told that he doesn't deserve the rank and should not be one, when junior marines go to that cpl before anyone for help or advice and also the junior marines see how the cpl is treated and the junior marines are always trying to help the cpl even when told not to. When the ones under the cpl say they learned more about their job than anyone else, show more respect to the cpl than the ssgt and Sgt, the cpl has tried to talk to the ones above him and explain things or ask for help/guidance but they won't listen fully or help really. People from all over the unit and people in the platoon think this cpl is mistreated and is singled out way to much while the cpl tries his best and keeps trying to get better and wants to re-enlist but is worried the sncoic will not sign off on it. Plus the cpl is given a hard time when medical appointment comes up, and when family issues comes up but has to beg for a little free time, when the cpl gives up chow and stays late to do what he needs to, the best he can, as someone who sees this ever day what can another cpl do to help withput creating to much conflict ?

Response by CW3 Jeff Held made Feb 13 at 2018 10:02 PM

CW3 Jeff Held — Tue, 13 Feb 2018 22:02:05 -0500

Look - this young Marine needs to keep looking forward and doing the right things. I know this situation makes them feel left out and unappreciated but it’s clear this Marine has had a positive impact on his / her juniors. They should not hesitate to seek re-enlistment and if the SRNCO has an objection then that Marine should run it up the flag pole to higher.

Has this Marine approached these NCO’s individually to ask what the problems are? I would expect that a more senior NCO would provide training and mentoring rather than belittling.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 13 at 2018 10:40 PM

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 13 Feb 2018 22:40:05 -0500

Yes he has asked what the problem was and what could be done to change it, also asking how to be a better nco and more profficiant at his job at the same time, what he could do to improve, asked why and how but all he is told is he needs to unfuck himself or fix it, he went to piss and set his gloves down and within that time his superiors took them and filled and put them in with used oil, constantly press and talk about personal subject and matters that he asked they would please not bring up because they bother him while not having anything to do with work, he does what 1 Sgt tells him to do but the other Sgt doesn't want him to do that, and once again he isn't given time to explain and is in trouble for it.

Response by MSG Charles Turner made Feb 13 at 2018 11:08 PM

MSG Charles Turner — Tue, 13 Feb 2018 23:08:15 -0500

Wow! Where is your Platoon Sergeant / Platoon Leader? I would not Expect True Non Coms to conduct themselves this way. I would report it up the chain of command. Starting with your immediate supervisor...

Response by CPT Richard Fematt made Feb 13 at 2018 11:18 PM

CPT Richard Fematt — Tue, 13 Feb 2018 23:18:25 -0500

Im sure you have a 1stSgt who is usually the senior enlisted leader in the unit. Most have an open door policy and will gladly listen to the concerns of a Marine. If not follow the chain tell your Plt Sgt that you want to address an issue with the 1stSg! You do not have to tell the Sgt the reason for your request. Usually he is a seasoned combat Marine and probably is unaware of this mistreatment of the Corporal! I applaud you for standing up for this Corporal and showing the respect he is entitled to. Sounds like the Sgt and SSgt are jealous of this Corporal. They will get whats coming to them if it is warranted and you have a great leader in the 1stSgt!

Response by Maj John Bell made Feb 14 at 2018 1:29 AM

Maj John Bell — Wed, 14 Feb 2018 01:29:10 -0500

I'm sorry but something here doesn't pass the sniff test. That's not me saying you are lying or misinterpreting, but there is something we don't know from what you have related.

If the problem is as severe and as widely known amongst the junior Marines and the junior NCO's as you have stated, I cannot understand how the Senior SNCO's and Company Grade officers are unaware. If they are aware, some guidance and a solution should be close at hand. If the Senior SNCO's and Company Grade officers are not aware, the command is surely dysfunctional.

Response by GySgt Charles O'Connell made Feb 14 at 2018 6:25 AM

GySgt Charles O'Connell — Wed, 14 Feb 2018 06:25:14 -0500

Continue to support your fellow Marine, but do be objective. You say this conduct is well known throughout the unit, is it condoned by the Plt, and Co. Commanders, the Plt Sgt, and the 1st Sgt? Are you seeing the same the SSgt's and Sgt's are seeing?

Response by Cpl Eric White made Feb 14 at 2018 8:32 AM

Cpl Eric White — Wed, 14 Feb 2018 08:32:53 -0500

We had an individual in the platoon who was the type that didn't care. He was poor at his job, no leadership skills, no respect or regard for authority, and was overall considered and labelled a turd. The rest of his enlistment he never was able to shake the view of senior marines or peers of being a turd. He was a Lcpl and when it came time for him to be promoted no one caught it in time to non req him so he became a corporal. He tried to turn himself around but unfortunately was never able to redeem himself from previous actions. Sometimes if they have been seen as sub par to the superiors they become "that guy" and it is hard to redeem oneself from it. The best you can do is attempt to prove them wrong and continue to be respectful.

Response by CSM Richard StCyr made Feb 14 at 2018 10:52 AM

CSM Richard StCyr — Wed, 14 Feb 2018 10:52:27 -0500

Sometimes folks see things in others that those who are closest do not see. Some red flags you threw out there:
- "junior marines go to that cpl before anyone for help or advice and also the junior marines see how the cpl is treated and the junior marines are always trying to help the cpl even when told not to"
Why are the junior Soldiers trying to help the Corporal or are so invested in him, is this guy incompetent in some way that the guys have to carry his load, or has he created an atmosphere where he is to familiar with them and lax in enforcement? Is he the nice Corporal?
- "Plus the cpl is given a hard time when medical appointment comes up, and when family issues comes up but has to beg for a little free time," Is this guy having medical issues that prevent him from being a hard charger and cause him to be absent frequently? Same with family issues, does he have sickly children or spouse that draw him away from training or his leadership duties?
- "the cpl gives up chow and stays late to do what he needs to, the best he can" Sounds like he's missing the mark, has time management issues or is challenged in some way.

We had very few Corporals and the ones we did have were absolute hell on wheels because they had been chosen to serve as a SGT/ E5 in the slot on the MTOE at the loss of that SGT/ E5 slot to the command. I do not know how the Marines are manned or if the Corporal slot carries the same weigh , but when I hear Corporal I see in my mind guys like Basillone, Audie Murphy or Paige.
As his peer I would visit with him, see what his deal was, help him if I could, but I'd tell the troops to stay in their lane and out of NCO business. Remember not everyone gets to be a SGT or SSgt and they may be culling the heard.
If you think the guy is being mistreated see Your Squad leader and Your PSG and have a discussion, see if they see the same thing. Then see the 1SG if you aren't happy with the discussion.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 14 at 2018 11:40 AM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 14 Feb 2018 11:40:36 -0500

Your situation I have seen before, and sadly it has always come down to a few specific reasons.

The first time was when a racist E7 started hounding an E3 in her office. He was one of two white people the other being an E6. The E6 refused to put up with her BS, so she targeted the E3. Made this kids life a nightmare. Wrote him up for being late even though she wasn’t there to see and was requiring him to be at work at 0600 while the rest of the shop didn’t have to arrive till 0800. He was only allowed 15 min for lunch the others in his shop got an Hour lunch, he was required to stay till 1700 the others left at 1600. The others would dump their work load on him and he would get written up for not doing their work in a timely manner. The E7 managed to keep most of it under wraps till the kid went to the E6 and they had a long talk. The E6 took it to the Divo and the E7 was firmly slammed in to her place. There was a lot more I’m not putting here for expediency, but you get the point.

The Sec was a E4 who WAS a dirt bag, chain smoker, refused to shower, spent more time looking for ways to half-ass or not do work than it would take to do the work, had a stack of report chit two inches high and the command STILL would not mast him. They felt we had not done enough to correct his issues. He was eventually Mast’ed for sexual assault. He grabbed a female officer breast after he got out of medical for the beat down she gave him he was sent to the brig to await mast.

The Third involved me, I had several fellow First class’s decide I was raising the bar to high so they spent their days spreading rumors and gossip about me around the Ship. The E7 Club decided that they didn’t need to verify anything and assumed these people were correct. I kept on keeping on and by the time I rotated most of the E7 Club had found out the Truth. After I left and all the work I did stopped, two of them went to mast for Comsec issues, and CoC spent 3 months emailing me at my new command asking for support.

The Cpl in this situation needs to just keep on keeping on, the opinions of the NCO’s shouldn’t matter to anyone. If the Cpl is doing his job, and the mission is accomplished they have nothing on the Cpl.

There is a few things you have said in here though that tell me this is a toxic leadership situation. It is also a Hazing environment and that needs to be corrected.

“he went to piss and set his gloves down and within that time his superiors took them and filled and put them in with used oil” and “please not bring up because they bother him while not having anything to do with work”

These things need to be addressed by senior leadership, as I’m betting they are not isolated to this person or just these two incidents.

Just my two cents.

Response by LCpl Brandon Joseph made Feb 15 at 2018 8:53 PM

LCpl Brandon Joseph — Thu, 15 Feb 2018 20:53:45 -0500

As a junior enlisted I seen this quite a bit too. Good LCpls become Cpls, yet some of the chain of command dislike them. Best thing to do is to (Police your own). Keep by his side and support him as I'm sure he supported you, make it known he's doing his job well and that his hard work is being put it. Keep grinding. Higher ups change over time. Adapt and over come.

Response by Sgt Dale Briggs made Feb 16 at 2018 8:18 AM

Sgt Dale Briggs — Fri, 16 Feb 2018 08:18:09 -0500

Well your promoted on time up to E4 for the most part, but shitbirds will never see that. But that doesn't excuse the Marines above him for their own actions which I find unacceptable. Their job is to help not tear down, they're undermining any chance he has of success With lower enlisted who bypass him because of the Sgts predijuce. That's in general though, there's always someone who's sliding by. You get nothing tearing down another to build yourself up, it's pathetic.

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Feb 16 at 2018 12:07 PM

CW3 Kevin Storm — Fri, 16 Feb 2018 12:07:22 -0500

Someone should point that out to the unit 1SG, he runs the enlisted side, and if there is problem he should talk to the troops under the corporal and find out what is going on. He should talk to the NCO's to find out their bias towards him. If it is unsubstantiated, he should consider actions to take. Move the Corporal, move the NCO's, or something else.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Feb 16 at 2018 8:16 PM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Fri, 16 Feb 2018 20:16:37 -0500

I'm not entirely certain how this suggestion might be viewed, however, I might consider seeking advice from one of the chaplains or their NCOs, if only at least first explain the generality of the problem, to see if chaplain intervention not involving you directly might at least conceivably do any possible good, so fas as possible, just a thought of course, I obviously expect to be disagreed with, I'd also be most eager for any thoughts, many thanks, hope was least of some use.

Response by PFC Sandra Wade made Mar 3 at 2018 5:30 PM

PFC Sandra Wade — Sat, 03 Mar 2018 17:30:51 -0500

I am not sure if it exist now, When I was in Germany, I was being withheld from my duty station while 1st arriving for an extended time just to be used for labor and painting lines by a really nasty SGT. I was surprised when a Capt. and LT. approached me on base with uniform full of paint to ask me how things were going? Apparently checking on Moral. He was also surprised I had been there so long having a job assignment. Next day I was out of there with new uniforms. Maybe they have a unit to check into moral? Like Police Departments have Internal affairs... On the level that you speak of, you must NOT interfere. just offer emotional support to that individual being singled out. You know how it works.... it's the beat down to get you to follow. NCO's and Officers go through training on leadership skills. Some just do it better than others