What should someone do if doctors in the military don’t take your injury seriously?

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 31 Jul 2021 18:05:42 -0400

Hi, I am a SPC with 18 months left in my contract. I’ve been experiencing lower back pain for a year now, went to see my PCM then got referred to chiropractic, then referred to physical therapy, then to pain management, and back to PCM. They all came to the same conclusion that my lower back is really tight and I need to go home and stretch. I’ve been on profile for 9 months now and the pain keep getting worse. It’s affecting my daily routine, my sleep, and even my sexual life. I’ve been telling my doctors that but they keep telling me that lower back pain is a common issue, and that I should keep stretching. The chiropractor and physical therapist that I seen both told me that I shouldnt be on profile because they believe that it’s just a chronic back pain, and I should be actively running / working out to get it better. I told them that I’ve been working out, stretched, and tried to run on the cardio everyday but it only make my back pain worse, but they said it’s normal because that’s how chronic back pain is. I am really stressed out because I’m only 23 and this back pain is negatively affecting my life. I dont know what is the next step in order to escalate my back pain issue since non of my doctors take it serious since they keep trying to make me off my profile and tell me to go home and stretch for nearly a year now.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 31 at 2021 6:09 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 31 Jul 2021 18:09:55 -0400

I’ve been thinking about going to behavior and health for this issue but I’m going to NTC next week, and I think if I go now, they might take me off the list for NTC and that will affect my company’s mission out there. I know for a fact that my back pain will be much worse once I come back from NTC since I’ll be in full gear for the entire month there.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 31 at 2021 7:11 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 31 Jul 2021 19:11:03 -0400

First off, don't ETS. Do not be the dumbass that ETS's with medical issues. Next to AIT marriages and buying V6 Mustangs at 21% interest, that is one of the dumbest mistakes that people make. If you are too broke to be in the Army, don't stay in the Army, but don't ETS either. There is a system called a Medical Evaluation Board that is designed to separate Soldiers with medical issues that are service connected. MEBs are initiated with a Permanent P3 profile.

Your PCM is brushing you off. Your PCM as a civilian may very well brush you off as well, or just prescribe drugs. As a Tricare recipient you are entitled to a second opinion. You are entitled to have a second provider review your case and determine if they see something your PCM does not. Maybe your PCM is new, maybe they are biased. Either way, you have a right under Tricare to request a second opinion and you cannot be denied that.

Now, if everyone you talk to says your back is tight, then maybe they are right. Everyone can't be wrong. Dr Losack, the Chiro at JBLM is an excellent Chiro and a retired LTC Recon Marine, so if he says you need to stretch more, you might want to go into his office and use those hot pads and the inverted table more often.

Good luck, I hope your back pain gets better. 23 is too young to be broke

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Jul 31 at 2021 7:23 PM

CSM Darieus ZaGara — Sat, 31 Jul 2021 19:23:24 -0400

Did you get. Rays, MRI etc. ? Have you asked to see an orthopedist. For the rest follow SFC Boyd

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 31 at 2021 8:09 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 31 Jul 2021 20:09:22 -0400

You have to just keep pushing. I have been dealing with them keep telling me I have nothing more than "patellar femoral syndrome" with my knees. First it was one knee, now it's both. I have had one MRI in 8 years. When I got to where I am now, I asked about MRI and the provider I saw said "Have you injured it recently?" I should have said yes - I said no. "Well it's probably fine."

When I did whatever I did to cause this abdominal pain issue in 2013 (the only logical answer I got was torn abdominal wall muscle), it took months trying to get anything done. First my PA at the time didn't even believe me. Her first question "When's your PT test?" She thought I was just trying to get out of a PT test. Then she did an exam and changed her tune and first thought I might have a hernia. But I didn't. Then I got a run around on referrals not getting put in and having to keep on her ass to get them in. At one point, I got put in for the wrong scan. The hospital off base called to say my PA needed to put in a new referral. She put me in one that is a breast scan - I needed an abdominal scan.

With my back - I got referred to a chiropractor. He told me "You just have a weak core." Sent me to PT. It didn't really help much. I don't have constant back pain but I randomly get back spasms. Or it hurts doing random things.

I just started having hip pain the last couple years.

I mean I feel like I'm falling apart. The only time I stopped going in was when my daughter was 6 weeks to 3 years old because she got diagnosed with a rare kidney disorder and she was in and out of the hospital, infusions, etc, and I've been a single parent since she was 1.

I finally went in and got a permanent profile for my knee because I was on and off temp profile. Luckily I was at a joint unit so people weren't so obsessed with PT. That was the time to get those things taken care of - and was even told that when I got there (actually both joint units I was at).

You are your own advocate. You have to advocate for yourself because no one else will.

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 31 at 2021 8:45 PM

COL Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 31 Jul 2021 20:45:28 -0400

SPC Private RallyPoint Member send me a private message and I will help you navigate the system better.

Response by SSgt Christophe Murphy made Aug 1 at 2021 1:59 AM

SSgt Christophe Murphy — Sun, 01 Aug 2021 01:59:21 -0400

The medical system requires you to be the squeaky wheel if you want to get the grease. Document everything. If stretching isn't working get it documented. Keep pushing and be your biggest advocate. I was med boarded and had to fight for everything I received in the process. My knee wasn't doing what a knee was supposed to and when they didn't know why I kept pushing. When a resident doctor told me after 12 months of limited duty I should try icing my knee I called him out on a useless comment and kept pushing. It took over 2 years of working with my case worker, peblo, LIMDU coordinator and unit Medical Officer but I received a medical retirement. Don't take "we don't know" as an answer.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 1 at 2021 11:45 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 01 Aug 2021 11:45:25 -0400

I am no doctor, but anytime I hear a Soldier mention back pain, I tell them to get an Inversion Table from Amazon ($130). I fixed my bulging disk with mine. People without disk issues seem to enjoy it too.

Response by SMSgt Bob Wilson made Aug 1 at 2021 4:23 PM

SMSgt Bob Wilson — Sun, 01 Aug 2021 16:23:32 -0400

Keep going to the PCM and get it documented. Just think in a few more months you will be out of the service and may have a disability. Request a specialist to look at your back. Are you overweight, out of shape, or any of a number of reasons which may contribute to your condition? Have you had an MRI or CT Scan to confirm any lower back damage? A damaged lower back should show up on one of these test. No damage, strained muscles, etc. The old "icy-hot" and "hot showers" may be prescription. Good luck.

Response by SGT Chris Stephens made Aug 1 at 2021 5:30 PM

SGT Chris Stephens — Sun, 01 Aug 2021 17:30:47 -0400

Take the advice of some of these guys. I wish I would've taken that advice when I was dealing with the same issues. I have a tethered spinal cord and I'm constantly dealing with lower back pain.

Response by LTJG Sandra Smith made Aug 1 at 2021 6:49 PM

LTJG Sandra Smith — Sun, 01 Aug 2021 18:49:49 -0400

That is a tough issue. "Back pain" without history of injury, is very difficult to prove objectively, & many a "goldbrick" has claimed it, as a means to evade duty. If there is anything you can pinpoint as the cause & when it started, preferably if it can be documented by others somehow, witnesses to an event, an incident report, something of that nature, there might be some more serious consideration. But barring that, it's honestly, a case of "he said, they said". They need objective evidence there is an issue, at this point, & all you're offering is subjective. That doesn't mean you don't have legitimate pain, but in order to get past that loop you describe, subjective won't do it, it'll take something objective.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 1 at 2021 7:14 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 01 Aug 2021 19:14:21 -0400

While it is a basic law of nature that "objects in motion, stay in motion" is true and there is no way we can know exactly what is happening with your back, I suspect the treatment options are not exhausted. Have they considered acupuncture? If not, request it. Do you have access to a pool? If so, get in it. Maybe lower impact and hydrotherapy will help. Massage, sports medicine consult? I suspect a combination of therapies once tested and proven to be effective will be life-enhancing. I think we can do better as a system, but I am hopeful for you. PM if I can help, and outcome on any of my suggestions. You are too damn young to feel that damn old, don't give up!

Response by SPC Erich Guenther made Aug 2 at 2021 4:07 AM

SPC Erich Guenther — Mon, 02 Aug 2021 04:07:52 -0400

I am tall and have had some past issues but was able to fix via targeted exercise and better shoes (podiatrist diagnosed). For lower back the very best thing theruputic for that is a swimming pool because it is more or less a weightless environment for your lower back. I am really surprised nobody has mentioned that to you so far on the medical side for chronic lower back pain. Recommendations on more exercise or stretching are standard. Believe it or not your front abdominal muscles if you focus on building them will alleviate some of the weight that the lower back carries along with a lot of stress. Trick is building your abs without stressing an already stressed lower back. You need to experiment and find out what works best for you to address this problem WITHIN what your doctor or PT says to avoid (in other words you need to consult with them on what to try). I am not a Doctor here just throwing things out based on my experience of the long ago past. This might be a temporary thing as well (it was temporary for me and found out over time it was bad arch support in my shoes). Could be job stress? Could be bad shoe fit? Could be weak front abs? Could be too much sedentary work and not enough exercise? Don't give up on it and definitely try the swimming pool and see if it helps. Cause of lower back issues are among the most difficult to diagnose and thats why so many shammers in the Army try that medical excuse to sham out of PT in the morning. So my point is on that last comment is a LOT of the diagnosis and treatment depends on you trying different things and see what alleviates the pain.

Response by SSG Matthew Koehler made Aug 2 at 2021 11:29 AM

SSG Matthew Koehler — Mon, 02 Aug 2021 11:29:20 -0400

Think back to when your back first flared up. Relate your injury to an incident. Have an LOD completed. Most importantly, get it documented in your medical records.

Response by Sgt Dale Briggs made Aug 2 at 2021 12:36 PM

Sgt Dale Briggs — Mon, 02 Aug 2021 12:36:57 -0400

Military or not I’d expect very conservative treatment especially at 23. If they take x rays or do an MRI and there’s nothing glaring they’re going to refer you to physical therapy, they’re playing the 90% odds they’re right that it’s muscle spasms. Of course there’s the other 10%, and that just might be you, I have Spinal Stenosis in my L1 to L 3, when it’s inflamed it’s agony, but I got the shots in my back that worked wonders, but it took months of BS before they approved it too. But most of the nonsense is the insurance company, they resist paying as best they can, private or military, so it’s very slow sometimes painful road.

Response by SPC Robert Patrick made Aug 3 at 2021 5:32 AM

SPC Robert Patrick — Tue, 03 Aug 2021 05:32:30 -0400

SPC Private RallyPoint Member I would advise seeking a second opinion. I dealt with chronic lower back pain for 4 years with 2 and a half of them being brushed aside (even with an actual diagnosis). It took me getting sent to Korea and while inprocessing the Doctor looking at my medical file and realizing I was not in good shape and initiate a med board. Do not let your pcm downplay your pain. No one knows your body more than yourself. Work on getting a diagnosis while you are in. If they haven't done an MRI or an x-ray they can't be honestly diagnosing your issue. The muscles tightening in your back could be a result of something worse such as compensating for an actual issue with the spine (as was the case with me). I am seeing a lot of good advice from NCO's and officers on here.

Response by MSG Jacqueline Case made Aug 29 at 2021 5:19 PM

MSG Jacqueline Case — Sun, 29 Aug 2021 17:19:15 -0400

Keep trying to get the treatment you need. Go to the IG if you need to. I had a similar issue…my legs would give out while running and my doctor at the time refused to give me a no running profile. He thought I was preparing to retire; when he realized I had another ten years before retirement he did write the profile
Fight for your health!

Response by PFC David Cox made Sep 19 at 2021 11:05 AM

PFC David Cox — Sun, 19 Sep 2021 11:05:35 -0400

While going through drone electronics school in Fort Huachucha I came down with dysentery and asked the First Sergeant for permission to go to the infirmary. He said I could if I carried my footlocker with me. I could barely stand and was unable to carry the footlocker so didn't go to the infirmary. I ended up having to stand in the showers for hours while ejecting fluids from both ends and then stayed in the rack for two days until I could walk again. A friend called out "here" for me during morning rollcall until I was able to make it myself. I went in to give blood for the Red Cross blood drive a month later and was told my blood was not acceptable because of the presence of dysentery "bugs" in it. That is when I learned that I had had dysentery.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2021 5:43 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 19 Sep 2021 17:43:27 -0400

Request an MRI of your back. Most Military doctors could care less about you. Mine put me on a med and never followed up on its know side effects that impact those on it.

Chronic back pain has a cause and an MRI can diagnose the problem.

Go check your height and see if its the same as when you enlisted. I discovered I had shrunk when my height and weight was checked before my promotion. I had shrunk 2 inches in the Army. Seems my back pain was caused by compressed disks.

Response by SSG Gregg Mourizen made Nov 4 at 2021 1:53 AM

SSG Gregg Mourizen — Thu, 04 Nov 2021 01:53:36 -0400

I was assigned to Irwin Army Community Hospital, at Ft. Riley. I was always amused by how many different ways the Beret was worn. The Army had only just mandated the Black Beret about a year or two before. My section Sgt wore his like Sgt Sluggo from Beatle Bailey. I had seen curves stitched into place. Flash backings cut at weird angles. Flashes broken down to where they were pretty much limp, or sticking practically straight out. Flap either barely curled or all the way down to the shoulder.
Proper way of course is the flash vertical, over the left eye, flap between the top and bottom of the ear, brim parallel to the ground.
One day, I was feeling particularly...uhm..creative.
I moved the flash to the center of my forehead, pushed it straight out and slicked it so far foreword it looked like a golf cap.
I walked all the way around the hospital complex, talked to about a dozen people. Not a word.
I decided to up it a notch and walked through the barracks. No bites.
Walked through every floor of the hospital wearing it (including the command floor), nothing.
I walked out to the flag pole and gave up in disgust.

As I started walking back in, I ran into a friend of mine. She, of course, knew of my odd... uhm ... sense of humor. but only reminded me to take off my cover as I entered the building (finally). I asked her what she thought of the beret, and that was when she finally realized how d-cked up it was, and I told her the whole story.

The Joke was really on me though.
The next day, when I went out, everyone was wearing their berets that way.
Apparently I started a fashion trend. It actually lasted a few of months.