What should the physical requirements for 68 W be?

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 16:57:56 -0400

68 CMF physical requirements just came out for 2017. The 68W has 12 task to complete from skill level 1-4 while skill level 5 has 11 task. Each task involves the medic wearing 98 lbs of gear and typically carrying, dragging or picking up weight around 54 lbs-200 lbs for some distance around 300 feet. Additionally they should be able to travel up to 12 miles with 98 lbs worth of gear
Thoughts?

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2016 4:58 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 16:58:22 -0400

Sounds pretty rough!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2016 4:59 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 16:59:59 -0400

What I want you to keep in mind is 15,000+ Medics are active, 13,000 in National Guard, and 6,000 in the Reserves. They must all be able to complete these task.
There are about 37,000 medics in the force... can we sustain our ranks if this is going to be a strict physical requirement?

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2016 5:00 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 17:00:48 -0400

If anyone wants the whole print out, please PM me with your email address or leave it here.

Response by SGM Billy Herrington made Jun 24 at 2016 5:06 PM

SGM Billy Herrington — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 17:06:26 -0400

I think it's a step in the right direction.

Is it a yearly requirement to be done or is it done during AIT or reclass like a high physical demands test? Infantry proponent started the task testing this year for OSUT and the reclass students. Nothing about having to do it yearly like AWT. Which again, I would certainly not be opposed to.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2016 5:11 PM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 17:11:33 -0400

Good to see that some part of the Army has decided to step up the physical requirements.

Response by LTC Paul Labrador made Jun 24 at 2016 5:36 PM

LTC Paul Labrador — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 17:36:45 -0400

That is good for FORSCOM 68W. A bit overkill for MEDCOM 68W.

Response by 1LT Susan Bailey made Jun 24 at 2016 5:50 PM

1LT Susan Bailey — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 17:50:10 -0400

My first thought: Holy crap! They're going to need their own medics!

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2016 6:00 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 18:00:32 -0400

Is this something that's going to be taking effect in 2017 for the first time? Sounds fun. I know not all our medics can do that.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2016 6:07 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 18:07:32 -0400

As a Line Medic, we owe it to our platoon to be able to perform physically no matter the challenge. As someone above noted, a MEDCOM medic is a whole different job and that's why I'd like to see there be two different MOSs developed. Make hospital personnel accountable to the tasks they need to be able to do best, and leave the Doc's in the platoon to conduct POI medicine.

Short answer? No it's not unfairly diffucult. Every medic should be prepared to find themselves in a line platoon; however the reality is not everyone who holds the MOS 68W is cut out to be a line Doc.

Response by SGT Kristin Wiley made Jun 24 at 2016 6:14 PM

SGT Kristin Wiley — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 18:14:18 -0400

Personally, I think it's too much. I thought it was a little weird that the physical requirements are more strenuous than military police. I'm sure there's valid reasons, but on a day by day basis I don't see it.

Response by SGT Edward Wilcox made Jun 24 at 2016 7:04 PM

SGT Edward Wilcox — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 19:04:08 -0400

24 years I served as a medic. Never, even when I served with the Infantry, did I need to carry 98 lbs worth of gear. EFMB, EIB, Best Warrior, and several other badges and qualifications I can't think of right now, have road march requirements. I know the EFMB is a 12 mile march in under 3 or 4 hours(it's been awhile), but the pack is no where near 98 lbs.

If I had to guess, these new MOS specific physical requirements are nothing more than an other tool to kick good soldiers to the curb.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2016 8:51 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 20:51:28 -0400

In 2003, the Center for Army Lessons Learned (CALL) did an analysis of the loads expected by various aspects of the Modern Warrior. The typical Rifle Platoon Approach Combat Load weighed 91.7lbs. It also noted, that many medics tended to overfill their bags (especially the larger MOLLE Aid Bag), and increased their burden.

I can see why a line combat medic would need to meet these requirements.

The PDF is an interesting and useful read: (I had to disable the link to prevent this site from trying to display the entire 117 page document. If you want to read it, you will need to add the second backslash (/) after the "http:" on the link below.
http:/thedonovan.com/archives/modernwarriorload/ModernWarriorsCombatLoadReport.pdf

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2016 9:05 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 21:05:26 -0400

Sounds like we will breed strong medics, but doesn't always mean smart ones. There are usually enough backs to carry the meat when you need them, but not always the sharpest tool making the plan. I would rather weed out the daft rather than the weak.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2016 10:22 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 22:22:24 -0400

absolutely needed. no one should die over political correctness. strength is an important military attribute. you need to be able to meet the standard not have the standard meet you.

Response by SPC Brian Mason made Jun 24 at 2016 11:13 PM

SPC Brian Mason — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 23:13:55 -0400

98 lbs of gear plus the option of moving a human adult weighing around 200lbs with their gear or less/more if a civilian? The unit I went to the ME with was smart. They either brought me to the person(s) or them to me; which we were in a safer place. I'm an easy target trying to move a person into position to pick them up.
All soldiers should be able to ruck with their standard loadout according to to their MOS. I've never carried 100 lbs of gear wherever we went. As a medic: M4, 280 rounds, 9mm w/4 clips, body armor, helmet, Assault bag and 30lb Aid bag. I'm not in anymore, but should a soldier come under fire, he/she needs to take cover or run their a** off. It's harder to do weighed down with un-necessary stuff.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 27 at 2016 11:11 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 27 Jun 2016 11:11:26 -0400

How does the group think this will assist or delay the gender integration that the DoD is pushing now?

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 28 at 2016 2:44 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 28 Jun 2016 02:44:56 -0400

FORSCOM ready medic. Downrange all together for me was about 110-130 so I'd say they got it in a good ballpark

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 28 at 2016 8:24 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 28 Jun 2016 08:24:57 -0400

This exaggerates the outlined requirements. People will have a twisted expectation of the requirement. The requirement is already completed, please wait until then to judge.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 29 at 2016 1:05 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 29 Jun 2016 01:05:42 -0400

Hmmmm, seems a bit unrealistic to me. We are not training super soldiers and we are a little overworked and undermanned to maintain such goals. I would like to believe that all NCO's know how to conduct training and pt but this is not always the case and leaving it up to the Soldier to do on their own you may get about half of them to do it. In the long run this standard will only push people to extremes when needed causing damage to their bodies. Just my thoughts...

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 29 at 2016 9:33 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 29 Jun 2016 09:33:39 -0400

I continue to bring this topic up to everyone that I can: the Army needs to (must and should!) separate "Line Medics" and "Hospital Medics". I brought this up last time I saw CSM Ecker, and he said it was not possible for a number of reasons.
In the ten years I have served in the medical field since leaving the infantry, I have become of the opinion that our medics serving in hospitals are not allowed the scope of practice that they need to maintain their medical skills, nor, given the schedules they work, are they able to devote the necessary time needed to physical fitness, Soldiering skills, and/or continuing education.

Response by PFC Chuck Henry made Jun 29 at 2016 2:29 PM

PFC Chuck Henry — Wed, 29 Jun 2016 14:29:41 -0400

The same as any infantryman. Plus an aid bag and side arm.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 29 at 2016 3:30 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 29 Jun 2016 15:30:52 -0400

So I got a bit more clarification from the people in the know. Two events will be tested for the new 68Ws coming in. These two will be integrated with a skills station and their FTX. With only two being tested, I wonder how it's going to spread throughout the force and if it's just going to be one of those things that are missed. The CRT is supposed to be coming out soon, but no one really knows what all that involves...

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 24 at 2017 6:22 AM

PV2 Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 24 Feb 2017 06:22:29 -0500

As a new medic, it's not that bed in my opinion, you wear your IBA, and you wear your aid bag and quick bag and canteens on either side of you, that amounts to probably 50lbs all together, if you have sapi plates in, which you should, then you have to carry someone who's also got an IBA/IOTV on, in an appropriate carry, to avoid injury, I enjoy it, but it's not meant for everyone

Response by SFC Scott Parkhurst made Mar 10 at 2017 3:12 AM

SFC Scott Parkhurst — Fri, 10 Mar 2017 03:12:58 -0500

My thought's are just do it...I don't mean to sound strong or anything like that. What I mean is at least for me, it was mind over matter, and I "just did it". I'm on the smaller end of it as I'm 5'4" and I weigh about 130'ish at the time. Cause I lost some weight do to a head injury during basic. But I still was able to fireman carry a soldier with his gear and mine (including all my medic gear) for some distance and scanning around too! So I think to be a medic (68 W) you should be able to do anything. A soldier's life is depending on us, you to be able to save his ass and the medic better be in damn good shape to do so and that's just not medically either. Sometimes your under fire and you "might" have to scoop and run and I sure hope that your in shape to do so. Before i went to basic I was running and hiking with a weighted back pack and hiked up thi swell known mountain in Marin County CA. MT.Tam. And I was getting 290 in basic because of it then 300+. My point is that we have to be in best of shape for anything, for any time for any MOS.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 10 at 2017 6:24 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Mar 2017 06:24:19 -0500

There's plenty of talk here about how some sort of test like that would be "too much" for MEDCOM Medics to perform. Currently serving in a MEDDAC, I wouldn't deny that. I'd say that the majority of Medics here, even ones that had previously had years of experience in line units, struggle with the current APFT, never mind the new CMF physical requirements that are being suggested.

It's a sorry sight to behold, and it's one of the many reasons that I would rather that 68Cs be slotted for MEDCOM positions instead. Lord knows I didn't enlist to operate a vital machine and punch keys, and this kind of environment is just less than ideal for Medics. I've done less than four IVs in the past four months, and I've been having to go to the gym during my lunch break just to stay fit. If there's any question to whether Medics could handle these kind of demands, it's only because of places like this.