When do you go to a first-name basis with people?

2013-12-22T05:17:43-05:00

Let me posit two caveats:1. I ALWAYS address officers (whether commissioned or Warrant) as "Sir", "Ma'am" or by their rank2. I always publicly addressed NCOs by their rank.  In private conversations, it may be another story

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 5:45 AM

2013-12-22T05:45:39-05:00

CSM, I feel that the determination to use a first name with
someone is based off the situation you find yourself in at the time of the
conversation. I agree any time you address an officer Sir ,Ma'am, or rank
should be used regardless of the situation or location. Any time you address
another NCO in a work environment it should always be by rank.

However, if you’re talking to a peer or subordinate there
are times it is appropriate to use his or her first name. An example would be
you have a peer over for a function at your quarters and the setting is small
just his or her family and yours. Now if you have a peer and subordinates over
that is a different situation. Would calling your peer by his or her first name
and the other NCO by rank show a bias toward the him and make your subordinate
feel out of place? This is assuming the
subordinate is able to comprehend the difference between “off time” and “work
time”. If he or she is able to comprehend
the difference than you should be consistent.

Essentially you need to know your surroundings and the
people you’re talking with, and if the person outranks you always use the
appropriate title.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 6:03 AM

2013-12-22T06:03:08-05:00

CSM, "hey man" or "hey..." is used often,
but when we do that and we have subordinates in our AO and he or she observes
leaders doing this he or she assumes that is the standard. Unless we correct
it, and it isn't that hard to do, a "new standard" is set. It is hard
until everyone is onboard. The hard right (basic discipline) vs the easy wrong
(allowing it to go on).

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 6:49 AM

2013-12-22T06:49:05-05:00

CSM Blount,

I personally don't like the first name basis thing at all. But I will add before I was even in the Army all my friends called me by my last name. I will say I have been in a few situations where first name basis may not be the wrong answer. My first duty station was Korea and my first weekend the shop NCO took me and another private out to the town to show us around. You know places to go; places to definitely not go. He told us to call him by his first name. That has always stuck with me and he is not the first person that has wanted it that way out in the civilian world.

When I am in uniform though I don't want to hear it and I don't like to hear other people do it. I have noticed a trend amongst some of the younger Soldiers. They do it in the barracks and when they go out to drink together and then they come to work yelling first names up and down the hall. Its a peeve of mine.

Response by SrA Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 7:29 AM

2013-12-22T07:29:56-05:00

CSM Blount,

In my career field (fire protection) we tend to have a first name basis unless we are in a public environment. While at the station we will call each other by first name, last name, or nicknames (mine being Hurricane) since we spend more time with these guys than with our own family. I personally don't call anyone by their first name, I always call them what they are (Airman, Sergeant, Chief) and their last name, even the civilians I call by their last name. I know a few NCOs that call me by my first name but since I am just an E-3 I respect the NCOs and SNCOs they earned their rank. We don't have much interaction with officers so when there is an interaction with officers so when we do it is always Rank and last name.

Response by SFC Jason Porter made Dec 22 at 2013 8:12 AM

2013-12-22T08:12:29-05:00

CSM B, I personally never used first names during my career, that was something I was taught from day one for the place of business . I believe what ever command that he or she is in steers that breeze so to speak. I know officers use first name basis from the top down quite a bit never bottom to up. I always felt using a Soldiers rank in front of their last name was the standard. Again this varies across the services.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 8:44 AM

2013-12-22T08:44:11-05:00

CSM Blount, I agree with you and the majority of those who responded here. Situation dictates. When I was a SGT, there was a group of SGT's that I hung out with that in private we would call each other by first names but never in public and never around our Soldiers. As a SSG there was a Mortar Section Sergeant that he and I were the same way. As a SFC, not until I was assigned to an AC/RC unit (50 personnel in my BN) we are the same, sometimes in private, never in public. One of our buddies was recently promoted to MSG, the first name thing stopped with him when he put on the rank. It has been, sometimes in private and never in public for my entire NCO career.

I will say that the very first time a fellow NCO asked me what my first name was, I replied "Sergeant". It took me a little while to get out of the conditioning that this was not an acceptable practice. I think that the size of the unit and the closeness of the people in it are really what drive the decision for NCO's to begin to call each other by first names.

Response by SCPO Robert Meeler made Dec 22 at 2013 9:00 AM

2013-12-22T09:00:45-05:00

In the field with E6 and above no junior troops present.

Response by PO2 Tristrem McGinnity made Dec 22 at 2013 10:39 AM

2013-12-22T10:39:59-05:00

In theater to preserve OpSec or on liberty. Never call an Officer by first name. I am a Civ now and still find myself calling old friends Sir, Skipper,Cdr etc.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 10:54 AM

2013-12-22T10:54:30-05:00

In 20+ years of service I have made it a practice to address all superiors by their proper rank and last name. When addressing peers and subordinates I always use their rank and last name or simply their last name. In my opinion when young Soldiers see "old heads" such as myself showing proper respect to superiors and addressing subordinates properly they will do the same. One of the major issues I see in the Army (Active Duty, Reserves and National Guard included) today is lack of dicipline by junior NCO's and lower enlisted Soldiers. In my opinion if we get back to the basic principles that we were taught years ago our Soldiers will follow suit. Well off of my soap box. My answer is simple, there is never a good time to address another Soldier by his/ her first name. I even correct my superiors when they call me "Donne" by simply stating "SFC Cook" and they quickly get the point.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 11:26 AM

2013-12-22T11:26:57-05:00

CSM I have always addressed my soldiers, my peers and my subordinates with their Rank and last name. I believe we need to keep that in a working environment because we know as leaders that everyone is watching. But it is different for me outside work I use first name with my peers

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 11:27 AM

2013-12-22T11:27:22-05:00

SGM from my experience I have a few buddies that we call each other by first names but that is when we are off work when we are at work it is all proper rank and last name. That is the only way to address each other if you want to hold the standards of the Army. Calling each other by first names is not an enlisted thing that is an officer thing I see young soldiers doing it today and I correct them all the time tell them this is a place of work not back on the block hanging with their boys if they want to call each other by first names doing on their own time.

Response by Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 11:28 AM

2013-12-22T11:28:35-05:00

It is a bit context dependent (culture of the unit, culture of the service, culture of the career field, culture of the base). The generic rule, going to back to right after commissioning and I got to my first duty station was with officers, "one up, one down, unless they tell you otherwise. Callsigns if they tell you to. O-6's - never."

I've been in units where I've felt comfortable calling my subordinates by their first names, others where I haven't. It depends on the culture, the esprit, what's going on in the unit. A place where the unit has its stuff pretty wired, you can be a bit more relaxed. A place that's trying to pull itself together and fix itself, not so much.

Response by TSgt Phillip L. made Dec 22 at 2013 11:36 AM

2013-12-22T11:36:48-05:00

Seldom in uniform. Never in mixed company. Until you've got your military bearing dialed in, and know where the line is and when it moves, stick with formal rank and last name. Better to start there.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 22 at 2013 12:01 PM

2013-12-22T12:01:57-05:00

CSM, for the 16 years I was in the Military the ONLY time did I ever use first name(s) were OFF duty to my peers only. During Duty Hours, it was by rank, last name, sir or ma’am, and not by their first name. To this day it still irks me sideways when I hear ALL ranks of Officers “Hi Bob”. What ever happen to Customs and Courtesies (FM 7-21.13, CH 5)? Did we as an NCO Corps keep this one JUST to teach, train and mentor our Soldiers correctly and not share with others? No disrespect to the Officers or Warrants, but RHIP should not and does not apply here. The Standard was set, and by having lower enlisted Soldiers hear Officers use their first names during the Duty Hours, now sets a new Standard. Why? The Soldiers think it’s right due to the fact an/the Officer(s) are doing it. Last, I have approached many Officers and have asked them not to use first names due to what I‘ve listed. Here again, the rank has it’s privileges was dropped and I was given a thank you for the concern.

Response by SSG Ralph Watkins made Dec 22 at 2013 3:11 PM

2013-12-22T15:11:04-05:00

While in Iraq we got matched up with Special Ops people for a long-term mission & the rank system went out the window. We used first names, nick-names, or callsigns even. With them, mission leaders weren't always the highest ranking. To reduce confusion, it was just best to know who was in charge by name. As an E-6, I got into a disagreement with the one in overall charge of a particular job the one day & I started getting nasty with him. He then told me that he was an 0-3, I apologized using his first name & we moved on. I used to go to the one JOC & everybody was first name & this stocky Force Recon guy used to call me by my callsign, I called him by his first name. I later found out he was a Major. The respect was there due to the job & that's what counted.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 23 at 2013 12:52 PM

2013-12-23T12:52:07-05:00

I go both ways if i had to choose, either all in or not at all. I am Aviation and considering the other major Branches in the Army, we are pretty relaxed and i do mean relaxed, we talk directly with our C.O even as junior Soldiers and mostly there are not any issues, but when you allow officers to do it and not the backbone then sets clear lines of segregation amongst the ranks. I know there is in a professional and duty sense but if we allow the people who set the standard to do it, how can we enforce a different by not allowing the enlisted to do it? I have seen some enlisted do it dont get me wrong, peer to peer or peer to subordinate, i think it builds trust, rapport and confidence amongst these people. thats the pro side. The con side is that Soldiers who don't know when to separate the two cuse issues and then when it comes to possible legal action for something a Soldier has done, its harder to justify if those lines are not clearly set, I have had to chapter eight Soldiers out of the Army and half of them where for misconduct or other negative actions, one of the first questions they always asked me is do i associate with them outside of work, do we hang out, etc etc not really a big deal but it would be really easy for a Soldier to twist this into something it is not to benefit his/her needs. Not to mention if you call one SOldier by his/her first name and not another in the same Company or Platoon. Just does not sound like a good idea at all unless we are all on board. Personal time out of work in the local area by all means act like a person and have friends, use first names just not at work.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 23 at 2013 1:27 PM

2013-12-23T13:27:34-05:00

Never, half of the issues that I deal with in the military have to do with a lack of professionalism across all ranks. You serve all day, everyday so just follow the rules, you have to shave everyday and you have to keep your hair cut, why in the hell would you be so unprofessional as to refer to any service member by any thing other than their rank and name. They earned the rank and their parents gave them that name so respect it. It does not matter that you out rank them, in fact that is one of the manifestations of really piss poor leaders, whenever I hear some Officer referring to his or her subordinates or peers by their first name I know right then and there that one is a turd and hopefully won't be around for long.

Response by CW5 Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 23 at 2013 1:37 PM

2013-12-23T13:37:49-05:00

CSM Blount,

I address all Commissioned Officers by their rank and last name.

I address most Warrant Officers by their rank and last name. Exception is made based on situation and the relationship at hand; for the most part usually CW3-CW4 address each other by first name; I will almost never address a CW5 by his or her first name as a CW3--maybe CW4, if he or she directed me to.

I address all NCOs by their rank and last name.

I address all junior enlisted Soldiers by their last name. However, I am getting better at addressing junior enlisted Soldiers w/ their rank as well.

I address most Civilians by Mr. or Ms. Exception is made based on situation and the relationship at hand.

Thank you for the post CSM Blount.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 23 at 2013 1:42 PM

2013-12-23T13:42:57-05:00

CSM Blount,

This is a good question. I two am like you and have noticed others around my unit will call each other by first names at work. I do not believe this to be professional. Though, I am lower enlisted I feel the need to speak out at times. I am corrected by the higher up with a statement which usually goes like, "When you become this rank you can call people what you want." I believe only in a personal setting like a family dinner it is okay to call someone by their first name (as long as they agree to it themselves).

Response by SCPO Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 23 at 2013 1:43 PM

2013-12-23T13:43:18-05:00

"Common sense with respect is always refreshing! Good advice: "Knowing your target audience and adapt to your environment!".... It was always hard when senior officers address you by first name when in a non command function.. eventhough we inform our seniors that they will always be sir or ma'am, in or out of uniform.

Response by CPT Daniel Walk, M.B.A. made Dec 23 at 2013 1:45 PM

2013-12-23T13:45:10-05:00

With NCOs: Never. I was never comfortable with Officers who called me by my first name. Good NCOs have worked hard for their rank and addressing them as such is respectful of that work. Crappy NCOs (that's a technical term) need to learn the discipline and be reminded of expectations.

LTs: Only behind closed doors and only if they are able to figure out why only behind closed doors.

Peers: Almost immediately, and only when neither sets of our subordinates are in the area. This is subject to a mutual agreement. Some people really like their rank.

Seniors: only when given permission (so....almost never).

Response by CMC Robert Young made Dec 23 at 2013 3:53 PM

2013-12-23T15:53:01-05:00

Officers always by rank and last name; no exceptions. Enlisted people; if it's just the duty section onboard the unit things are more informal and the first names pop out as long as nobody else is around particularly among peer groups. However, in any public setting, rank and last name.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 23 at 2013 8:26 PM

2013-12-23T20:26:31-05:00

While at work I always use rank which is what the reg calls for unless told otherwise (usually in USASOC/JSOC units where 1st names are not uncommon). After work I prefer to be called by my 1st name for the simple fact it helps seperate work from home. As long as you respect your comrades and show them that they are more than another soldier in it'll go a long way.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 23 at 2013 8:30 PM

2013-12-23T20:30:56-05:00

I have always used rank and last name with officers. With enlisted, in a off duty status then I'll use just their last name. I will call peers by the first name.

Response by PO2 Patrick Williams made Dec 25 at 2013 8:08 AM

2013-12-25T08:08:09-05:00

All Depends on the level of respect you have for a person there were some I would call by their rank and others by Mr or Ms. I grew up in the Navy it was hard for me to make transition as I had always called people by first name and they were E7 and above as well as officers.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 9 at 2014 9:51 PM

2014-01-09T21:51:57-05:00

This drove me nuts in line units because there is no need for it especially around Soldiers. I now find myself in the one job (that I have filled) where it makes sense. That is a plain clothes job. When part of your job is to blend in and minimize your military appearance.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 31 at 2014 10:57 AM

2014-03-31T10:57:29-04:00

I've served in many different type units and on some small
unit teams also. I've noticed a change
between working inside small units and large formations. In the small units the Lead or the Chief or
SGM were always address as Sir (even the SGM while working with foreign forces)
and everyone else working were on first name in a deployed area. Even working on OMLT/ETTs/ MiTTs everyone
came to a general choice to go by first names.
It's helped cut down on the BS and we could get to a BLUF much quicker
for mission purpose; then the typically run around as this can happen in MDMP
between officers and enlisted.

In a garrison setting were nothing has been to crazy a few
officers refer to me by my first name, and they do this to get my honest thoughts on matters. I
never address them back by theirs in public forums or really while in
uniform. I currently work in an org that
the slant is 56/9/1/93/12 being O/E/WO/GS/CON.
We still stay very respectful in our organization, as we know we work
for a greater good for the Army as a whole.
I think as long as you act professional and you are able to articulate
on your experience you'll be treated as such no matter how they refer to you. Just one man’s experience in the game.

Response by 1SG David Niles made Mar 31 at 2014 2:27 PM

2014-03-31T14:27:23-04:00

Those in my "lane" by first name in private, by rank in public. Officers "never" unless you are in the "Guard" and off of drill status. Different culture.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 16 at 2015 10:14 AM

2015-10-16T10:14:06-04:00

When both you and they are in civilian status and they ask you to....especially if you're about to be working for the same civilian firm ;)

Response by SGT Michael Glenn made Oct 18 at 2015 7:43 PM

2015-10-18T19:43:11-04:00

When the ice is broken, when out of uniform if offered, otherwise rank should ALWAYS proceed the last name while in uniform, no exceptions.

Response by SGT Richard Anselment made Dec 17 at 2016 3:50 PM

2016-12-17T15:50:37-05:00

Never

Response by SSG Mark Franzen made Dec 21 at 2016 7:57 PM

2016-12-21T19:57:18-05:00

I would say that I would never do I always respect the rank of the person that I am talking to Except if he is the same grade as I am. SSG MARK FRANZEN VET