Where did the rumor come from that "Fall In!" should only to be used for the initial formation of the day?

2018-08-13T10:26:08-04:00

Hello all!

So yesterday evening, we had an interesting situation play out. We were forming up for our final formation, the PSG called "FALL IN". Our MAJ told us that the command "FALL IN" was not correct, and to try it again. So the PSG called "FALL OUT" and we all got together, talked it over, decided that "FALL IN" was, in fact correct, and to do it the same way again and just be confident that we are correct. So the PSG again called "FALL IN" and of course we got dropped for not listening, not learning, etc. So the third time, we just assembled into a formation and the PSG called us to attention, since it was clear that's what he wanted.

So I got home from drill and even though I was about 90% sure that "FALL IN" was correct in that scenario, I wanted to be absolutely sure and check the regs. And of course "FALL IN" is indeed correct, it doesn't say anything about it only being used for the initial formation of the day. Actually the only thing I saw about anything being for only the initial formation was inspection arms.

So (finally) to the question. While it's rare that I hear someone say that FALL IN is only to be used in the initial formation for the day, it's not the first time I've heard it. Does anyone know where this came from? Was it that way in some outdated reg, or just misinformation that has been passed down? TC 3-21.5 doesn't explicitly state that you DO use FALL IN multiple times per day, but it doesn't say that you don't, either.

I'm certainly okay with being wrong on this one, but I don't think that I am. The big thing is that I don't want to just go with it, mainly for the non-prior service folks that we have that may start to think that that's the proper way to do it, then pass it on to their soldiers when they get to their unit.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 13 at 2018 1:45 PM

2018-08-13T13:45:04-04:00

Fall in would be for your element falling into the larger formation. Generally, you would have either not been in a formation at any position (ease, rest, etc.) or something formal was about to occur.

If your platoon was one of numerous and the rest of the company was waiting on you to be at the position of attention, fall in would not be correct.

Response by SGT Joseph Gunderson made Aug 13 at 2018 2:22 PM

2018-08-13T14:22:58-04:00

I've never heard this... and I started D&C as a freshman in high school.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 13 at 2018 2:56 PM

2018-08-13T14:56:49-04:00

hmm.. The Drill Sergeant in me wants to say a lot, but I will only say one thing. "Fall In" is not only used for the initial morning formation. That is all I need to say.

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Aug 13 at 2018 3:04 PM

2018-08-13T15:04:11-04:00

Never heard that even as a rumor holding formations for 31 years active duty. Lots of formations. If the Maj persists provide him with the reg. Thank you for your service.

Response by SFC Ralph E Kelley made Aug 13 at 2018 8:17 PM

2018-08-13T20:17:12-04:00

SSG Private RallyPoint Member -
The major is incorrect and I would add - TC 3-21.5 (FM 3-21.5) January 2012 states unequivocally that "Fall In" is used to assemble a formation or return it to its original configuration (such as when having been told to gather around or U-foramation by teams) AFTER the element identifier is given.
These identifiers are for the element size such as "Platoon", "2nd Squad" or even another name "Commo Section" - so the troops of the element understand WHO is being ordered to assemble.

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made Aug 13 at 2018 10:56 PM

2018-08-13T22:56:49-04:00

Had to chuckle on this one. Aboard ship you'd "fall in" for morning muster obviously. Then there'd be "fall in" for special stuff that required an absolute head count. Man overboard is the most obvious. But we'd have a "fall in" at whatever hour because we're pushing off and want to know who didn't make it back on the liberty boat. So in Navy parlance it was Muster for whatever instead of the fall in thing. If there is a Reg, then it confirms the AR still leads the other services by a large margin on dictating every aspect of everything.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 14 at 2018 8:36 AM

2018-08-14T08:36:17-04:00

The Major was incorrect. You can provide him with the reg or simply ask him what the proper way to get soldier who are not in a formation, into one after the initial one in the morning. I'd probably go with showing him the regulation.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 14 at 2018 9:16 PM

2018-08-14T21:16:08-04:00

I think we're missing the big question. Why is a field grade officer watching and correcting a platoon formation?

Response by SGT Matthew S. made Aug 14 at 2018 9:39 PM

2018-08-14T21:39:01-04:00

I never heard it... but I'm trying to figure out what other formal command you would use. If not already in formation, "Platoon, Attention!" would just bring everyone to attention where they happened to be at.

I might also be misreading (and this is likely an entirely different topic in itself), but in my experience it was... unusual... for an Officer - especially a Major - to drop anyone. Typically, he/she would have a 1SG/CSM take care of that unless it was a ROYAL foul-up. Even then, they typically had other tools at their disposal.

Response by SFC Harry H. made Aug 15 at 2018 12:46 PM

2018-08-15T12:46:11-04:00

"FALL IN", is the first command of the day. It's actually a board question. Throughout the rest of the day, generally speaking, "PLT... Attention", should be called. When forming up throughout the rest of the day, you muster up at a gaggle. PSG may yell, "PLT Attention! Parade Rest!" Then 1SG, once he see's the Company is ready, he yells "Company", the PSGs yell "PLT", 1SG yells "Attention!" Everyone goes to attention. The begging of the day may not be the only time "FALL IN" is called. If I was in the middle of a field with my PLT and I wanted to quickly form them up. I would position myself where I wanted them formed up and yell, "FALL IN" and they would form center on me at attention.

When I showed up to my first National Guard drill, I was just a SPC. We had our first morning formation and I was shocked that everyone was already at attention. I'm like wtf is going on here, so I followed suit. 1SG came out and ordered everyone to attention, but we were already standing at attention.

After formation, I asked what that was all about to my SQD LDR. He replied, "uh? well active duty", which btw was my nickname for about 3 months after leaving active duty 10th mtn. "How are you suppose to fall in to a formation?" I said, "well if we are mustering for first formation, we muster in a gaggle until our PSG squares us away. Normally a lock it up right before the 1SG is about to come out. Then 1SG comes out and yells FALL IN, receive the report". I said, "it doesn't make much sense to call the Company to attention if we are already at attention". His mind was blown.

He said well lets just see and proceeded to try to embarrass me in front of 1SG. I told 1SG what I told my SQD LDR, but to my SQD LDRs surprise, he too agreed that my explanation sounded a little more correct. SQD LDR asked me while standing there with my 1SG, still not convinced and still to prove his point, "at what position do you fall in?" I said, "well, at attention, but fall in is a command, one of which is to be given by the person leading the formation. It's not just an action solely because we are forming up". 1SG then told my SQD LDR if you have so many questions about it, then why don't you research it in FM22-5 for us all.

At the end of the day, plus 1 for me, plus 500 for my SQD LDR. He smoked the shit out of me. And that's when I knew I hated the NG.

Response by 1SG Bill Farmerie made Aug 15 at 2018 5:30 PM

2018-08-15T17:30:15-04:00

Since when did officers really know anything about D&C.

Response by SMSgt Kevin Bishop made Aug 15 at 2018 5:48 PM

2018-08-15T17:48:08-04:00

In my experience, officers don't generally know much about Drill and Ceremony. If you take that to the Army/Air National Guard, it gets even worse. Once for a Change of Command Ceremony, another SrNCO and I had to school the officer in charge and the other officers that were trying to help. They were lost. I would call Fall In to assemble a gaggle. How else would you do it so everyone would clearly understand your intention? Also, I once saw a SFC wax a HMMWV for a Division C of C. People who don't have a clue infest all ranks.

Response by SSG Harry Herres made Aug 15 at 2018 6:04 PM

2018-08-15T18:04:35-04:00

As always someone thinks they are the only one that knows anything. That is why regs are in writing. Some don't know how to read and believe R.H.I.P. is enough to be smart

Response by SPC Patricia K. (Williams) Elliott made Aug 15 at 2018 6:25 PM

2018-08-15T18:25:50-04:00

The command "fall in" was used in every formation I ever attended!! Have no idea where the Maj got his information but it is wrong!

Response by Sgt Dale Briggs made Aug 15 at 2018 9:39 PM

2018-08-15T21:39:27-04:00

I'm not any help here, but I've never heard any officer call a platoon to attention, or to fall in or out. Always the Plt Sgt or ranking Nco. So how would the Major know? Sounds like he doesn't from the responses.

Response by SFC Carlos Cruz made Sep 6 at 2018 5:13 PM

2018-09-06T17:13:37-04:00

SSG Jesse Prescott I am confused, you are a NCO who shut know this like the Bible, chapter two http://www.milsci.ucsb.edu/sites/secure.lsit.ucsb.edu.mili.d7/files/sitefiles/tc3_21x5.pdf
I am sad to know my NCO are not educate when it come to basic Drill & Ceremony omg

tc3_21x5.pdf