Who is the most honest of the leading politicians?

COL Ted Mc — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 13:48:33 -0500

From the "NY Times"

All Politicians Lie. Some Lie More Than Others.

Washington — I’m a political fact-checker, which is usually an automatic conversation starter at parties. These days, I get two questions repeatedly: “Is it worse than it’s ever been?” and “What’s up with Donald Trump?”

I’ve been fact-checking since 2007, when The Tampa Bay Times founded PolitiFact as a new way to cover elections. We don’t check absolutely everything a candidate says, but focus on what catches our eye as significant, newsworthy or potentially influential. Our ratings are also not intended to be statistically representative but to show trends over time.

Donald J. Trump’s record on truth and accuracy is astonishingly poor. So far, we’ve fact-checked more than 70 Trump statements and rated fully three-quarters of them as Mostly False, False or “Pants on Fire” (we reserve this last designation for a claim that is not only inaccurate but also ridiculous). We haven’t checked the former neurosurgeon Ben Carson as often as Mr. Trump, but by the percentages Mr. Carson actually fares worse.

Carly Fiorina, another candidate in the Republican race who’s never held elective office, does slightly better on the Truth-O-Meter (which I sometimes feel the need to remind people is not an actual scientific instrument): Half of the statements we’ve checked have proved Mostly False or worse.

Most of the professional politicians we fact-check ...

EDITORIAL COMMENT:- Of course it's from the NY Times so it all has to be lies - right?

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/13/opinion/campaign-stops/all-politicians-lie-some-lie-more-than-others.html?_r=0

All Politicians Lie. Some Lie More Than Others.

In a sea of truthiness, fact-checking is a lifesaver.

Response by PO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 14 at 2015 1:55 PM

PO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 13:55:04 -0500

... you do know fact checking is also lying too ... right?

Response by SGT Kristin Wiley made Dec 14 at 2015 1:58 PM

SGT Kristin Wiley — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 13:58:03 -0500

This article is either biased towards the left, or fails to account for the signicance of the lies, especially regarding Hillary Clinton.

Response by Col Joseph Lenertz made Dec 14 at 2015 2:02 PM

Col Joseph Lenertz — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 14:02:34 -0500

LOL. All Media lie. Some lie more than others. According to the NYT, Hillary Clinton is the most truthful politician since Gandhi!

Response by MSG Brad Sand made Dec 14 at 2015 2:09 PM

MSG Brad Sand — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 14:09:22 -0500

Only time will tell.

Response by MSG Brad Sand made Dec 14 at 2015 2:14 PM

MSG Brad Sand — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 14:14:26 -0500

I think someone needs to be checking the checkers? Lately, it seem the checkers are bigger liars than the 'facts' they are checking. It is amazing to me how the fact checkers can be so moved by bias. Facts should be facts, and this has not been the case but this does not really surprise me with politicians and the current batch of reporters.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Dec 14 at 2015 2:44 PM

CPT Jack Durish — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 14:44:48 -0500

This report should win some sort of an award. I have never seen bias so accurately charted before.

Take, for example, the fact that Bill Clinton leads in truthfulness. Really? This is the President who had to surrender his license to practice law as a condition of his admission of perjury.

Many have fallen into the trap of ranking truthfulness using the criteria of their ideological bias. Most famous among these is Snopes.com. The truth is that most "truths" are subjective and the author of this report exposes their criteria for determining truth based on their own ideology. (Did you notice how all of the democrats are gathered together in the ranks of the More/Most honest. What does that tell you?)

The "truth" is that most politician's lies are misstatements of fact based on ignorance. Almost all make promises to get elected, promises that will not be deliverable even if they are elected. In other words, they don't have a clue as to the duties and responsibilities of the office which they seek. (This is why fledgling members of Congress are offered a course in legislation before they are sworn in) Statements of intent are then interpreted as lies when the politician fails to deliver.

However, when you come right down to it, "What difference does it make?" (So says the person currently under investigation for lying and ranked among the most truthful in this report)

Need I say more?

Response by PO1 Brian Austin made Dec 14 at 2015 4:26 PM

PO1 Brian Austin — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 16:26:14 -0500

None of the above.
The word "honest" should never be used in the same sentence with "politician" or "media".
They all have their own agenda, outright lie and distort facts and half-truths to benefit said agenda.

Response by LTC Bink Romanick made Dec 14 at 2015 5:47 PM

LTC Bink Romanick — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 17:47:32 -0500

COL Ted Mc I can't think of any off hand, Jeeze, I am stumped.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 14 at 2015 7:04 PM

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 19:04:12 -0500

"...focus on what catches our eye as significant, newsworthy or potentially influential. Our ratings are also not intended to be statistically representative but to show trends over time."

To everyone that uses fact checks as the end all be all of a debate, even one misrepresentation can be used for purposes of bias. If someone states 100 things and two of those are a misrepresentation, that is 98% and if on person says 50 things with two of those being misrepresented, that's 96%. If a person has only stated 5 things in public, the fact checker can make the object of the validation a total idiot if anything is misrepresented.

Since they fact checkers are not statistically driven by facts and pick and choose what they use in fact checks, then overwhelming spin can and will be used to shape public opinion.

If you want to use fact checker sites, the best thing to do is research their research without your political blinders.

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Dec 14 at 2015 7:27 PM

Capt Richard I P. — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 19:27:25 -0500

Seems odd that only one member of team R beat only one member of team D, there might be some bias there.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Dec 14 at 2015 9:04 PM

PO1 John Miller — Mon, 14 Dec 2015 21:04:30 -0500

Perhaps you should tag this post under Humor!

Response by Capt Walter Miller made Dec 15 at 2015 2:19 AM

Capt Walter Miller — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 02:19:35 -0500

SecNav Webb resigned under protest in 1989 because the SecDef asked him basically to lie to the Congress.

Walt

Response by Capt Walter Miller made Dec 15 at 2015 2:30 AM

Capt Walter Miller — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 02:30:18 -0500

Let's throw President Lincoln in the mix:

"I know as fully as one can know the opinions of others, that some of the commanders of our armies in the field who have given us our most important successes, believe the emancipation policy, and the use of colored troops, constitute the heaviest blow yet dealt to the rebellion; and that, at least one of those important successes, could not have been achieved when it was, but for the aid of black soldiers. Among the commanders holding these views are some who have never had any affinity with what is called abolitionism, or with republican party politics; but who hold them purely as military opinions."

I don't believe this was true when Lincoln wrote it in August, 1863. The attack on Battery Wagner was 7/18/63, but that was a failure.

Another segment of this fabulous public letter to James Conkling:

"Peace does not appear so distant as it did. I hope it will come soon, and come to stay; and so come as to be worth the keeping in all future time. It will then have been proved that, among free men, there can be no successful appeal from the ballot to the bullet; and that they who take such appeal are sure to lose their case, and pay the cost. And then, there will be some black men who can remember that, with silent tongue, and clenched teeth, and steady eye, and well-poised bayonet, they have helped mankind on to this great consummation; while, I fear, there will be some white ones, unable to forget that, with malignant heart, and deceitful speech, they have strove to hinder it."

http://millercenter.org/president/lincoln/speeches/speech-3510

Don't fail to read this letter. it is really special.

Walt

Public Letter to James Conkling (August 26, 1863)—Miller Center

President Lincoln wrote this letter to his friend James Conkling, and it is read at a rally in Springfield, Illinois, supporting the Union. In this letter, the President vigorously defends his Emancipation Proclamation.

Response by LTC Eric Coger made Dec 15 at 2015 3:24 AM

LTC Eric Coger — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 03:24:31 -0500

I have done a review of Politifact, Snopes and others. Their decisions on what is "fact" or "lie" leaves much to be desired. It's a sad state of affairs when the journalists add to the lies. No surprise that Trump rates poorly, but when you look at who the chart claims as the most honest and compare that to reality... The Clintons seem to be getting a free pass on this.

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Dec 15 at 2015 4:28 AM

PO1 William "Chip" Nagel — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 04:28:27 -0500

Lots of Verbal Gymnastics by Politicians that is true and it is nice that since the failings of modern "Journalism" that some have taken it upon themselves to be Fact Checkers to dig thru all the Crap that Politicians Spew.

Response by Sgt Nick Marshall made Dec 15 at 2015 6:26 AM

Sgt Nick Marshall — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 06:26:03 -0500

It seems to me, the conservatives don't trust independent fact checkers if it doesn't agree with their view and they must have a liberal bias.

Response by BG David Fleming III made Dec 15 at 2015 8:55 AM

BG David Fleming III — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 08:55:31 -0500

Trump holds nothing back! Whether I would vote for him is a whole different question.

Response by SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 15 at 2015 11:53 AM

SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 11:53:50 -0500

I love how all I have to do is label my incredibly biased opinion as "fact-checking" and suddenly it becomes more than my opinion. I just browsed a few of the statements "fact-checked" and was pretty amused. I am sure though that it is a coincidence that those who lie the least are BILL CLINTON, Martin O'Malley, Barack Obama, HILLARY CLINTON, and Bernie Sanders...

Problems with this report.

1. The far-left bias is incredibly evident
2. The 'fact checking' doesn't tell you at all what statements they are fact-checking
3. The 'fact-checking' doesn't provide any facts to support their biased claims.

Bottom line, it's an opinion article.

Response by COL Ted Mc made Dec 15 at 2015 12:24 PM

COL Ted Mc — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 12:24:54 -0500

This one might make some people feel better.

From the "Washington Post"

The 12 biggest whoppers of 2015, ranked

The Washington Post's Fact Checker released its list of the 12 biggest Pinocchios of 2015 on Monday morning [ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2015/12/14/the-biggest-pinocchios-of-2015/?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_factchecker-855am%3Ahomepage%2Fstory (link added)] — the 12 least fact-based claims of the year. But they didn't rank them from worst to, well, worster. That's where I come in!

Below I've ranked them all based on how much negative impact and influence the claim had on our body politic. I count them down from No. 12 to No. 1 with the latter being the worst/most egregious. But you probably already knew that.

12. Rand Paul: "A man was put in prison for conspiracy just for having dirt on his land."

Sure, the Kentucky senator was wrong about this. But Paul hasn't been relevant on the national stage for the better part of 2016 — RIP, his presidential ambitions — so I find it hard to get too worked up about dirt.

11. John Kerry: ...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2015/12/14/the-12-biggest-political-falsehoods-of-2015-ranked/

The biggest Pinocchios of 2015

Our annual roundup of the most outlandish claims of 2015.

Response by SFC Pete Kain made Dec 15 at 2015 2:06 PM

SFC Pete Kain — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 14:06:01 -0500

Most honest? The one whose lips are not moving.

Response by SSG Warren Swan made Dec 15 at 2015 5:17 PM

SSG Warren Swan — Tue, 15 Dec 2015 17:17:07 -0500

If you can find a "honest" politician, you need to vote them in for life. If you can find a honest and non biased reporter, you need to hire them with tenure for life. But no matter what, I definitely get laughs when looking at ol Bills show. You can count on him having someone from either side of the spectrum.....either batsh*t crazy, or so intelligent and knowledgeable Bill has to keep changing the subject to get somewhere he can yell at them for. He's about the only thing good on Faux News.

Response by SGT Jose Perdelia-Torres made Dec 18 at 2015 4:06 PM

SGT Jose Perdelia-Torres — Fri, 18 Dec 2015 16:06:18 -0500

This is completely false, Hilary Clinton is not that honest....

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 15 at 2016 1:01 AM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 15 Oct 2016 01:01:37 -0400

I truly believe that none of them are. Look, I'm not a political animal, just a Marine Chief Warrant Officer. I personally vote for the individual who will lead this Nation to the future and quit being an outstanding bank to everyone else. My vote is a no confidence vote for the both of them.

Response by SSgt Harvey "Skip" Porter made Nov 23 at 2017 11:51 PM

SSgt Harvey "Skip" Porter — Thu, 23 Nov 2017 23:51:00 -0500

Honesty and politicians does not go together. lol lol

Peace!

Response by PO3 John Wagner made Dec 5 at 2017 4:32 AM

PO3 John Wagner — Tue, 05 Dec 2017 04:32:27 -0500

Yeah? I see the New York Times didn't do a very good job of fact checking the fact checking.
Hilary Clinton couldn't tell the truth if she tried, She would lie about the time of day.... if she knew what time it was, that is, Obama? He runs his own narrative from a personal cloud nine. Facts are of no consequence to the man, Trump? Rude, crude, and certainly exaggerates but as a business an he is relatively careful with his "lies". Businessmen can't be complete liars like politicians. No one will do business for long with a bullshitter. Lying too much in business doesn't play out well in the long run. "Whoppers" are not too useful except for used car salesmen.