Why are so many soldiers in Basic Training now having leg, arm, shoulder, and femur injuries? Is the training too physical now?

SPC Richard Skeen — Wed, 18 Dec 2019 21:34:22 -0500

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 18 at 2019 10:51 PM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 18 Dec 2019 22:51:19 -0500

The training is not too physical now. Many of the recruits are in poor physical shape.

https://www.armytimes.com/2016/08/19/army-physical-un-fitness-a-system-that-promotes-injury-and-poor-nutrition/

Army physical (un)fitness: A system that promotes injury and poor nutrition

Never have I seen so many young adults with musculoskeletal injuries until I joined the United States Army. And I’m not referring to basic training where some injuries are expected; I’m speaking of the active Army. Many of these injuries are preventable.

Response by SPC Stewart Smith made Dec 19 at 2019 1:30 AM

SPC Stewart Smith — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 01:30:54 -0500

opinion: kids are less active growing up and eat less healthy choices so they have less dense bones and lower muscle tone lending to greater and more frequent injuries when "thrown" into a highly physical task.

Response by CPT Lawrence Cable made Dec 19 at 2019 7:34 AM

CPT Lawrence Cable — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 07:34:03 -0500

The only difference I see today than in 1982 is that an injury that would have gotten you recycled in 1982 now puts you out of BCT. While I do think that Initial Training soldiers are less physically fit than in 1982, to be honest, most of those in my Infantry OSUT weren't PT Studs the first day either, and that includes me. Most of the injuries are not PT related from my experience, it's accidents that happen when you are zoning out while packing 80's through the woods at 1am.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 19 at 2019 7:53 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 07:53:07 -0500

In my opinion, it's just due to them not being so physical in their life until they joined the Army....Some of them Soldiers have never even ran a quarter mile, done pushups for two minutes straight, or marched several miles. Their bodies just are not used to it, but they adapt over time...Or maybe we just have a new generation of weaklings lol

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 19 at 2019 8:55 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 08:55:24 -0500

It's from kids that played video games their whole life suddenly being thrown into the real world. The training is no harder than it has ever been and Drills cant even give trainees that ol' fashioned smoke show.

Response by SGT Dave Tracy made Dec 19 at 2019 10:01 AM

SGT Dave Tracy — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 10:01:52 -0500

I'll assume your premise is true--I haven't looked--but I will echo what others have said. I doubt training is more physically strenuous today; I'm sure most old timers will say Basic/OSUT is cushy these days compared to when they enlisted, I don't know that's true either, but I'd bet it's certainly not harder. Modern enlistees (as a cohort, not as any individual) are just not as in shape as they used to be in years past. There's plenty of evidence to back this up: obesity rates, an overall decline in youth participation in sports, PE programs being cut in schools, increased sedentary lifestyle--one can Google any of these and see the trends.

Basic/OCUT is difficult, this is true, so taking people who haven't been at such high levels of physical activity, and in a few short months drastically ramp up their physical activity level is bound to have medical consequences. The only difference is that unlike in years past, now there's more people who aren't as physical active than there was before; therefore, more enlistees getting injured.

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 19 at 2019 10:02 AM

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 10:02:42 -0500

The diet of the average American is, to put it nicely, suboptimal. Combine that with our increasing sedentary lifestyles and this is the result.

Response by Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 19 at 2019 1:34 PM

Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 13:34:14 -0500

It’s that most kids nowadays are so soft and physically inactive.

Response by SPC Richard Skeen made Dec 19 at 2019 2:59 PM

SPC Richard Skeen — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 14:59:47 -0500

I Took Basic in 1983 at Ft Leonardwood. It left me breathless. It was very Physical. But I was prepared. I played football and basketball And I Excellent Shape.
But I never saw injuries like you have Know.

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 19 at 2019 4:07 PM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 16:07:53 -0500

Its like going from 0 to 100 immediately. Not just physically, but mentally, emotionally, etc. Of course injuries occurr.

Response by LT Brad McInnis made Dec 19 at 2019 10:06 PM

LT Brad McInnis — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 22:06:34 -0500

What are the #'s ? Is there really a big increase in injuries, or is it barracks talk ? Not saying there may not be more than before, but without actual data, it isn't worth it to spend time worrying about something that isn't outside the norm. Training has always created injuries, mainly from inattention, or poor physical fitness levels.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Dec 19 at 2019 10:12 PM

SGM Bill Frazer — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 22:12:19 -0500

It is no tougher than what they did in 1944,or 1984. Problem is that recruits are more sit on their ass, instead of playing, exercising outside. Hell 2/3 of the youth population can't even make weight Requirements. Maybe 10% in the 70's weretoo fat.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 19 at 2019 10:27 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 22:27:21 -0500

They are more prone to injuries than the generations before them. They have spent most of their childhood inside in front of televisions. They are lazier than ever, because we spoiled them.... Within the last year CIMT instituted a new BCT training plan and they are in the process of facing in a 22 week Infantry OSUT. Below is an article on the culminating field problem for BCT. Just came off the trail November 30th.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjHl-2-o8PmAhWtmuAKHeuPDQoQFjACegQIDBAH&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.army.mil%2Farticle%2F208465%2Ftrainees_forge_into_soldiers_during_basic_combat_trainings_new_exercise&usg=AOvVaw1AkoLNR5EEq4rb-ZXSkp6Y

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Response by MAJ Javier Rivera made Dec 19 at 2019 10:32 PM

MAJ Javier Rivera — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 22:32:46 -0500

Out of shape to begin with. And this problem has been for at least the last 10-15 years. Don’t expect to get any better any time soon.

Response by SPC Michael Oles SR made Dec 19 at 2019 11:05 PM

SPC Michael Oles SR — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 23:05:47 -0500

Today’s recruits are a bunch of sidewalk sissy’s they have been hanging out in front of TV or some other video game yelling Mom bring me a coke. My Grandsons one of them his Mother lets him join all kinds of active sports only to let him quit at the first sighn of sweat. And not proud of it.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 20 at 2019 2:33 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 20 Dec 2019 02:33:39 -0500

Because they are soft and weak!

Response by SSG Eddye Royal made Dec 20 at 2019 7:15 AM

SSG Eddye Royal — Fri, 20 Dec 2019 07:15:10 -0500

I went BT in 1985, broke both legs, and damaged spine they were going to put me out, had 21 year career.

1st each soldier go end knowing they are giving their best, not extend their body.

2nd Right attitude towards the learning and leardership. I give back. I don’t helping a soldier train on his or her weakness but don’t come with that CHIP, I’ll ask you take it off at the gym door, or handle your problem yourself, and when TOP, XO, CO, ask I’ll give a deal assessment.

We have a WAR at hand, no time to play.

Response by LCDR Joshua Gillespie made Dec 20 at 2019 8:53 AM

LCDR Joshua Gillespie — Fri, 20 Dec 2019 08:53:53 -0500

If you compare some of the training from back then (say, that of the First Special Service Force) with that of today... I think it bears out that there's parity. Recently, they even ran a select group of modern soldiers, ranging from Guardsmen to Special Forces through a condensed version of what the "Devil's Brigade" went through in 1942...and the results were apparently equivalent. I think it comes down to the comparatively "easier" physical lives we lead today...rather than any increase in physical demand in modern training. One possible exception may be found in our more elite units...my sense of it is that with decreased casualties among conventional units, higher tasking and optempo placed on non-conventional units, as well as manpower needs/budgeting; they're likely screening out more applicants these days than in the height of World War II...but having not been through it, I can't ever be certain.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 20 at 2019 11:31 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 20 Dec 2019 11:31:31 -0500

A common theme amongst these issues (Legs, hips, wrists, arms shoulders) is bones. Weak bones and supporting muscles. I'm no doctor but Vitamin D is a huge factor in proper calcium absorption. With kids shying away from the outdoors and preferring video games to sports is making a weak skeletal system. Without proper education, these new recruits are joining with weak skeletons, no muscle composition and are eating biscuits with gravy and chocolate milk at BCT. The reason the Vikings were so successful was their ceremony of drinking cod liver juice (high in vitamin D) and would pillage up north (low sun = low vitamin D) so they absolutely destroyed the northers as they had rickets and soft bones and the Vikings had their daily dose of vitamins.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Dec 20 at 2019 12:52 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Fri, 20 Dec 2019 12:52:14 -0500

I believe much is due to their sedentary lifestyle. I wrestled, played soccer, and football. They made me physically fit, toughness, and the desire to win.

Response by PO3 Amanda Elgaen made Dec 20 at 2019 1:46 PM

PO3 Amanda Elgaen — Fri, 20 Dec 2019 13:46:01 -0500

Training isn't harder, in fact it has been altered to be politically correct. To let them have a break if they are in stress. I went to captains Mass just because of a blue card that was presented to me by a SA just out of boot camp. I tore it up and told him to get to work. I was WRONG. Now i here they got rid of the blue stress cards. Good. But, You can't remove a stick and be politically correct at the same time. Which battle are we to correct first?