Why do you think it is that the Army has a retention problem? What can the Army do to keep good soldiers?

SGT Bradley Dixon — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 08:15:47 -0400

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2020 10:20 AM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 10:20:27 -0400

Morale and taskings.
We have so many taskings that it doesn't ever allow Soldiers to do their job, then we have insane training cycles that burn out the Soldiers rather than effectively train them. When it's a month of gunnery, 2 weeks off, another month in the field, a month off then NTC, in prep to deploy for 9 months...surprise! people don't want to continue to do that because they are worn out. Retention bonuses aren't there for a lot of the jobs like they used to be. Approval authorities treat unit funds like it's their own money, Soldiers aren't sent to special schools unless they meet some ridiculous made up prerequisite, SMs are even denied to attend BSEP to raise their GT to qualify to change jobs and stay in. All that leads to lower retention rates.

No idea why you tagged this post with all of those groups besides Retention too - not relevant to the discussion.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2020 11:07 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 11:07:22 -0400

Taskings. Training. Too many taskings and too little training. Just from the Reserve side of the house, in my unit these two things are the two reasons that give me the most migraines. We are a low density MOS. Progression can be slow because getting the training needed is very hard. It can be done, but it's like pulling teeth with plastic Barbie Doll tweezers. So many taskers that need to be completed both during the weeks before/after Battle Assembly and during Battle Assembly, there is little to no room for job skill training nor Basic Soldier skills. We can do those during our annual training exercises....but it hurts.

These things I listed, along with the large amount of other issues....are the reasons why Retention is can be low.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2020 11:16 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 11:16:47 -0400

I come from a finance/economic background, so I think its straight up dollars.

Until a few years ago the Army had one last carrot to its employees and that was its pension plan. That now has been removed as well. The current retirement plan is much on par what current employers offer. However, the Army operates with a greater level of “complexity” that soldiers do not have to deal with on the outside, and what was the biggest retention tool for the Army (the pension) now gone, and the ability of soldiers to take much of their retirement next egg with them the financial consequences of leaving the Army after a 2nd and 3rd enlistment are greatly lessened.

On the USAR front much is similar, and without the ability to fully vest the GI Bill and the annual tuition assistant plan is no better than anything offered by many employers the questioned is begged, what does the USAR offer the soldier?

The only thing that seems to be left now is the cost effective health care ($100 a month for me as a 40 something male to get health, dental, and $400K life insurance), but at the end of that day that is no longer financial incentive enough to sick around in face of the Army’s “Complexity”.

I don’t believe the Army has fully seen its retention problems. Wait until all the old pension plan soldiers have retired, and everyone is on the new 401K type system.

Response by SSG Ian Fernandez made Aug 18 at 2020 11:20 AM

SSG Ian Fernandez — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 11:20:07 -0400

Compared to other branches, yes. I believe Coast Guard is the highest out of the 5. They want to keep more soldiers they need to show or portray them as needed and appreciated. But thats' from a old grunts point of view.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2020 11:20 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 11:20:33 -0400

The Army doesn’t have a retention problem. I always hear people say “... that’s why we have a retention problem”. Well, we don’t have a Retention problem. The Army and all the other branches constantly make their Retention mission. A couple years ago we retained over 90% of Soldiers who were eligible to reenlist. We meet our Retention mission, and then when recruiting fails to meet their mission, they raise the retention mission halfway through the year and we meet that one as well. The Army sells itself. In fact, the only units that don’t make their retention mission are the ones with extremely bad command teams who actively try to kick everyone out.
So, no we don’t have a retention problem at all. It’s too easy to reenlist to go somewhere cool if you don’t like where you’re at

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Aug 18 at 2020 12:32 PM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 12:32:49 -0400

We generally always make our retention mission, so I'm not seeing the "problem" that you're seeing.

Having said that, the Army and Marines carries the bulk of the load when it comes to our nations defense. That load is heavy, and as a result, our OPTEMPO and quality of life often suffer.
All the branches of service have equal benefits packages, so If you have a choice between a hard life in the Army or Marines, or an easy life by switching to another, softer branch life the Air Force, wouldn't it make sense to switch?
I can't see changing that without a fundamental change i each service's culture and mission set.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2020 1:16 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 13:16:23 -0400

I feel that the biggest issue right now is that the Army lacks purpose and direction. We don't have a "real" mission right now, aside from zombie Afghanistan and other smaller missions.
We should be retooling to get ready for the next war, but I feel like we are spinning our wheels.

Response by SGT Bradley Dixon made Aug 18 at 2020 1:22 PM

SGT Bradley Dixon — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 13:22:52 -0400

I only ask this question, because I do see a problem in retention for the Army in particular. Just because we move the goal post at times, because we don't meet recruitment does not mean we do not have a retention issue. I also believe that it is great to get a perspective from high and low on how to best keep all SMs in the service. Finally, I also agree that the training cycles and deployment cycles need to be better planned so as to give the soldiers -of all ranks- time to breathe.

On a personal note, I had experienced the retention ascpect and question of re-enlisting to AD or USAR upon my original ETS, however I was so disenchanted by my experience at my last unit that I decided not to reup. I know and I have heard the common saying "Don't let one unit sour your experience." but at the same time, why should we as leaders (at all levels) take that? Why not improve upon that, and ask "What can I do or the unit do to improve the Army in my battle space?"

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2020 1:43 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 13:43:50 -0400

"Rep. Jackie Speier, D-Calif., chairwoman of the panel who recently visited several installations, said servicemembers have four key areas of concern: assignment location, child care, spouse professional employment and help resources for sexual misconduct and domestic violence."

Those are the reasons why a lot of people don't reenlist. The retention goals have been reduced so that it appears the Army is meeting its goals as well.

https://www.stripes.com/military-recruitment-retention-challenges-remain-service-chiefs-say-1.581364

military-recruitment-retention-challenges-remain-service-chiefs-say-1.581364

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2020 5:10 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 17:10:43 -0400

Get rid of the toxic leaders.

Response by SSG Mark Ledford made Aug 18 at 2020 8:27 PM

SSG Mark Ledford — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 20:27:38 -0400

DO AWAY WITH THE NEW PT TEST

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2020 9:46 PM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 21:46:21 -0400

Just like what SFC Private RallyPoint Member said, the Army doesn't have a retention problem in total numbers.

Keeping a good Soldier is more challenging.
The qualities that make that Soldier "good" in our eyes are also many of the same qualities that makes him or her attractive to the private sector, with better salary, better hours and better benefits. And all of that equals more time with the family and more resources to provide for them and send the kids to a good college.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Aug 18 at 2020 11:01 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Tue, 18 Aug 2020 23:01:48 -0400

Because we treat them like shit sometimes. I worked on taking care of soldiers and building up the morale. All those qualified reenlisted.

Response by Lt Col Charlie Brown made Aug 19 at 2020 7:14 AM

Lt Col Charlie Brown — Wed, 19 Aug 2020 07:14:55 -0400

We ask people to do too much with too little time and too few resources

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Aug 19 at 2020 12:06 PM

CW3 Kevin Storm — Wed, 19 Aug 2020 12:06:23 -0400

I have heard this for years. IMHO several things come into play, requirements versus funding versus what we would like to get done, and the reality. I spent 34 years between Active duty (10 years) and the National Guard. Never fails around August the next fiscal year training plan comes out with audacious stuff we are doing. Everyone qualifies on the machine guns we have, funding for schools, funding for this that and the other. Than the reality sets in, you get enough MG ammo for gunner and assistant gunner to familiarize, but we have planned for 6 day training weekend. So we go to the range for 6 days and screw the pooch. What makes this worse, traditional National Guard/Reserve soldiers are only allowed to be excused for drill so many times a year. You blow that number and Snuffy is taking his vacation, or begging for time off.

The smart play would of been to adjust the training schedule to reflect the lack of ammo and shorten the drill. That never happens. The drill is also over a holiday, so now Snuffy's significant other is also ticked off. So Snuffy is pissed because he gave up four days of his annual vacation time to sit his but in the dirt somewhere. Come retention time Snuffy is heading out the door. It is crap like this that kills retention. For the record, in my 34 years of service, I never saw everyone qualify with the Machine Guns, that includes the ramp up for deploying to Iraq. MG Quals for non infantry units is a like looking for a Unicorn.

Response by SSG Watis Ekthuvapranee made Aug 19 at 2020 12:58 PM

SSG Watis Ekthuvapranee — Wed, 19 Aug 2020 12:58:36 -0400

Define good? Social skill good? Combat good? Duty performance good? PT good? Care and compassion good? Weapon gunnery good? In peace time, we are an a-la-carte laborer. In war time, we are a killer with license to kill. In natural emergency, we are rescuer. In world stage, we are an enforcer-- peacekeeper.

The problem is everyone has a breaking point. When I was in the Army, I always make sure that each of my subordinate knows where they want to be in the future. Either staying in or getting out he will have a workable plan. There was the only one Soldier that I could not help because he is literally biologically retard. I wasn't giving up on him, but the chain of command did, untrainable for overweight. I thing he is autism, mild case anyway. I remember that I argued the case for easy way out, but I was reminded that we are Soldiers. We need to be able to count on everyone when we go to war, which we did. I had six other Soldiers that I had to look after. (Yeah, sometimes I use RP as a therapeutic tool for ranting.)

Aside from looking out for your peers and subordinate like you would with your son/daughter or brother/sister, making sure that he/she knows what the next step to where he/she wants to be (exist strategy). There is nothing we can do. If we want someone that want to serve the country, we need to entice their honor and the love of it. If we entice a person with money, then we get a mercenary. What we need to make sure is that for those that serve for 20 or more years we show our gratitude by a decent pension and compensation. Because when there is the need for us, we go to hell and back for our country.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 19 at 2020 9:50 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 19 Aug 2020 21:50:08 -0400

Oh this is too easy, it’s various things that have the Army Retention rate so low, let’s get that right. You have soldiers that don’t receive bonuses when they join or even when they re-enlist. You have a whole bunch of over strength MOS that don’t promote. Who wants to be a 8-10 year SPC? On top of that your depending on a system that is old when it comes to allowing soldiers where to go to PCS, you hear more about soldiers not being able to go to a certain base because of there job and yes that is true but it seems at times that the ARMY is behind on being able to provide more jobs at different bases and units. I think the Army can turn it around but who knows. It definitely starts with the soldiers this is a new Army with a lot of old ways regarding what soldiers want there system for rewarding soldiers with duty stations or bonuses is very outdated.

Response by SGT Jim Ramge, MBA made Aug 20 at 2020 8:04 AM

SGT Jim Ramge, MBA — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 08:04:00 -0400

The term obfuscation comes to mind... And just really what has been the need for uniform changes every 4-yrs, regulation changes every 4-6 years depending on the need, going back 30 years, say Tattoos? Stop meddling with the manner for which your troops work everyday and they might just want to hang around. Morale issues have always led the way for folks departing! Just saying... Troops need to be able to speak to their leadership in a frank and respectful manner, beyond that of a climate survey. Something the military should take to heart is consider performing a BN/CSM’s exit interview for ALL, and one without purgatory for the soldiers duration!

Response by SPC Alexander Correale made Aug 21 at 2020 10:28 PM

SPC Alexander Correale — Fri, 21 Aug 2020 22:28:11 -0400

I do not believe the Army has retention problems, at least they will not tell you, unless they want the civvie to think the Army needs them and they are getting a good deal. Either way the key word here is "good soldiers" which typically are the ones who care about what they are doing. This usually lasts until they run into a leader who does not care which more often than not, I believe, will kill their spirit and they get out or become a soldier who does not care. Then we have the soldier (good or bad) who does not care and keeps going, eventually arriving at a leadership position and the cycle continues. This cycle leaves us with very few leaders who care and many who do not. As some have said, units souring their experience. I wouldn't know how to fix that though.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 27 at 2020 9:35 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 27 Aug 2020 09:35:31 -0400

My MOS has an extreme retention issue, and the reason is two-fold. A) I can go make 6 times as much in the civilian world with the same benefits, and B) the bureaucracy of toxic command teams makes it far too enticing to choose cash over duty. Until the issues at the senior levels are fixed, specialty MOS like mine will continue to ETS after one contract

Response by PO3 Raymond Cunning made Sep 11 at 2020 3:29 PM

PO3 Raymond Cunning — Fri, 11 Sep 2020 15:29:17 -0400

In my case boredom and mis assigment. I spent 8 m0nths in training as a fire control tech
and then assigned to 2 different ships without any modern fire control equip.

Response by SPC Jesse Bisping made Sep 12 at 2020 6:38 PM

SPC Jesse Bisping — Sat, 12 Sep 2020 18:38:52 -0400

It's obvious. Pay them more.

Response by Brady Armistead made Sep 12 at 2020 7:14 PM

Brady Armistead — Sat, 12 Sep 2020 19:14:04 -0400

We are in a transition from a CT mission set to a peer-to-peer, competition. This is always a difficult transition. Add in a generally strong economy, and that doesn’t help.

Response by SSgt William Quinn made Sep 15 at 2020 10:40 AM

SSgt William Quinn — Tue, 15 Sep 2020 10:40:36 -0400

It starts before they get on the bus. Kids today, most of them, have not worked, participated in boy/girl scouts, served selflessly for a higher purpose or community, have horrible communication skills with all the social media platforms and of course the socialist brainwashing that America is a bad country going on in all the schools today. Then couple that with participation trophies, and all the other environmental factors teaching kids they are unique and special thus setting the military up in a no win situation. No mater what they do, they will almost never break the entitled generation coming into service today to accept the program and serve fully, as most of us did, focused on country and self sacrifice. Again, not all but many or most are set up for failure by the time they hit 18. It's not just the military, I see the same attitudes and failures effecting the civilian hiring market as well.

Response by COL Angela Fortune made Sep 16 at 2020 7:15 AM

COL Angela Fortune — Wed, 16 Sep 2020 07:15:29 -0400

Take better care of Soldiers and guard against sexual assault and abuse. Also limit overseas tours to war zones to 12 months max during ones career.

Response by SFC James Corona made Nov 6 at 2020 12:52 PM

SFC James Corona — Fri, 06 Nov 2020 12:52:05 -0500

There are MANY RETENTION ISSUES.

Positive Leadership in rhe Chain of Command is a big one. The Re-up
enhancement benefits and bonus incentives is another one. Today, they are slowly deteriorating; especially the "retirement"
20 year converting into a 401k plan.

Response by SFC Michael Krogmann made Dec 8 at 2021 8:49 PM

SFC Michael Krogmann — Wed, 08 Dec 2021 20:49:48 -0500

Get rid of toxic leadership