Why does the Army not have as much pride as the Marines?

CSM Carl Cunningham — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 15:55:10 -0400

I have worked with all the services frequently during my career. I see the ups and downs in each service. The Army seems to have the biggest attitude towards itself though. I would like to hear thoughts as to why Soldiers seems to talk bad or dislike the service that I love. Some may disagree this is true, but I do not think I am off base by stating this.

****FOLLOW UP QUESTION****

Do you think it is possible for the Army to ever show the universal pride in service that the USMC does?

Response by SGT Scott Bell made Sep 6 at 2015 3:58 PM

SGT Scott Bell — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 15:58:17 -0400

Becoud we do more work

Response by Capt Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 6 at 2015 4:02 PM

Capt Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 16:02:16 -0400

I think that is part of its culture.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Sep 6 at 2015 4:09 PM

Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 16:09:34 -0400

I don't think it's a comparative lack of pride in so much as it's the way it's "focused."

In the Marine Corps, we are very focused at the "Corps level" when it comes to pride. Just being a Marine. We don't really have "Unit" or "Branch" pride in the same sense that the Army does. But Marines talk smack the same way the Army does. we have our "haters" but being a much smaller service, and being much more geographically isolated also limits that exposure greatly.

But back to the Army. I think the Army tends to be much more "diversive" when it comes to culture. Legs vs Airborne, Ranger vs Ranger Qualified, Cav vs whatever Cav goes against. Then you get into the Units themselves, each with their own DEEP history and traditions. And then Branches, which I really have a hard time wrapping my head around. All we really have is Ground vs Wing... and we still deploy as MAGTFs.

This is just an outsider looking in.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 6 at 2015 4:16 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 16:16:00 -0400

The Army is huge, it is far larger than the USMC in sheer population. We have more room for internal divides to take root. People get bored so that's what ends up happening.

There are divides within the USMC (deployed/fleet Marines vs. stay-at-home Marines, etc) but because it is a smaller service these divides don't take root in the same way, I'd wager.

Response by LTC Yinon Weiss made Sep 6 at 2015 4:24 PM

LTC Yinon Weiss — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 16:24:24 -0400

When I went from the Marines to the Army, I experience many culture shocks. One of the first things I noticed was, as Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS said, much division within the Army. I had not been to Airborne school since few Marines get to go, and as a Captain this immediately differentiated me by my uniform. I also had to get used to the idea of wearing a unit patch on my uniform. In the Marines, you only wear your name, rank, and US Marines. Everybody is a Marine first and foremost. There is no focus on what training the person has been to (no badges, tabs, no unit patches, etc.). This is really only a superficial uniform policy, but I think it's reflective of the culture. I also think it makes sense. The Marine Corps is a lot smaller than the Army, so everybody can focus on "the Corps" -- whereas given the Army size, there may be a need to instill pride at smaller organizational levels.

Driving down Main Street USA, you will always see Marine Corps bumper stickers and Marine Corps flags on people's houses. Rarely will you see an Army flag outside of an Army base. What I believe Army Soldiers fly instead is the American flag - which you see plenty of. More pride in country than pride in the branch of service, per se. The Marine Corps has a great tradition of Marine pride, and it's instilled very effectively into people from the very beginning. In a way, the Marines need it to justify their differentiation.

All the above has to do with how one treats their branch of service with outsiders. From my experience, people in the Army and in the Marine Corps complained internally about their respective service at an equal level.

In response to your follow up question: Yes, I think it's possible for the Army to gain similar (or at least close) levels of pride in the branch of service, but this would probably take decades of effort to build that sort of cultural focus... implementing changes starting in basic training and waiting long enough until today's Privates are CSMs perpetuating the cycle.

Response by CSM Michael J. Uhlig made Sep 6 at 2015 4:31 PM

CSM Michael J. Uhlig — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 16:31:54 -0400

We like to say we empower our Junior Enlisted, the USMC actually empowers theirs....why do we hold back the rank of CPL, while the USMC has it as a normal progression for them....are we scared to trust our subordinates? When is the last time you've trained with a Marine unit or been on a base, it is constant training - all day, whether combatives, weapons, shooting, more weapons......we have to remember what our task is, and when we get away from our mission which is to kill the enemy (not wearing fluffy socks)......

Response by SPC Bill Earley made Sep 6 at 2015 4:37 PM

SPC Bill Earley — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 16:37:17 -0400

Speaking for myself I have nothing but pride to have been a soldier. My platoon and unit were the best! I have nothing but love for my Army brother and sisters Hooah!

Response by SFC Joseph James made Sep 6 at 2015 10:10 PM

SFC Joseph James — Sun, 06 Sep 2015 22:10:43 -0400

We do but it depends on the MOS. My 13F Brothers are way better than the Marines! FISTERS!

Response by Cpl Jeff N. made Sep 9 at 2015 6:09 PM

Cpl Jeff N. — Wed, 09 Sep 2015 18:09:06 -0400

It starts at Parris Island, San Diego and Quantico. The history, esprit de corps and "every Marine a rifleman" (even the air wingers) culture are ingrained early. We all speak the same language, do much of the same training etc. It has been said here but worth repeating is that Marines don't wear badges, patches, gizmos and whizbangs. Being a Marine and having USMC or US Marines on your uniform is more than enough.

The army has MOS's from medical to air, to support to infantry (airborne, ranger, infantry Bn etc) , it is very large and unwieldy compared to the Corps. It is so divergent in jobs and focus it is harder to get the same esprit de corps across so many units, people etc.

The Marine Corps instills the pride and historical reasons for the pride. There is nothing that would bother most Marines more than not meeting the standard (or exceeding it) than those that have come before them. We know their names, their exploits and know we are expected to live up to them, no excuses.

It is harder for the army due to size but it does exist in pockets certainly. (Special Forces, Rangers, Airborne Battalions etc)

Response by SSgt Ben Cavell made Sep 9 at 2015 8:36 PM

SSgt Ben Cavell — Wed, 09 Sep 2015 20:36:52 -0400

I spent time in both The Marine Corps and the Army. It all comes down to the Army's understanding of dicipline and the soldiers understanding of self dicipline. All I can say is I am very proud and glad to have earned the title "Marine" before I was Army.

Response by GySgt Robin Boggs made Sep 10 at 2015 8:37 AM

GySgt Robin Boggs — Thu, 10 Sep 2015 08:37:06 -0400

Marine boot camp is a transformation process. It may seem superficial, but Marines are EXPECTED to project a certain image when wearing the uniform; their success is reflected in their individual evaluations throughout their careers. Does this universal expectation exist in the Army, or is it up to the individual or the unit? I remember seeing a group of loud, chubby young women in BDUs hanging out and thinking to myself they would look just as at home in the ghetto except for the uniform. The transformation (basic training), the organization's expectations, and the image that the service members project all have a part in the input (recruits) and output of a particular branch of service. Maybe the Army just doesn't expect enough, so it's left to the individual soldier--some of whom are superstars.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 10 at 2015 10:01 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 10 Sep 2015 10:01:39 -0400

These soldiers that you mention must be newer soldiers with little time in the Army. I am very proud of my service in the Army, and nobody on the face of this earth can claim otherwise. Just because you hear it from the Marine Corps more does not mean Army pride is not there. Hooah!

Response by GySgt Moses Lozano made Sep 11 at 2015 9:27 PM

GySgt Moses Lozano — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 21:27:56 -0400

Because the Army is not trained from the start to be move and act with speed and intensity. Marines are also all trained to fight regardless of their specialty. Which means that in a time of crisis, I can rely on any Marine to be ready to kill without ever worrying about if they still remember how to use their weapon.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 27 at 2016 7:09 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 27 Jul 2016 19:09:31 -0400

IN EVERY BRANCH OF SERVICE THERE ARE MORALE PROBLEMS, IM SURE THAT BASED ON YOUR EXPERIENCE IN THE UNITS THAT YOU WERE APART OF, THERE WERE PROBLEMS WITH MORALE. I CAN ASSURE YOU THAT JUST LIKE THE OLD SAYING GOES, (BEAUTY IS IN THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER) THE SAME SENTIMENT EXIST FOR YOUR OPINION. I CAN GIVE YOU JUST AS MANY ARMY SOLDIERS AS YOU CAN GIVE ME OF MARINE SOLDIERS WITH DIFFERENT OPINIONS THAT WHAT YOU FEEL. SO THAT BEING SAID, I WOULD ADVISE YOU TO NOT GET SO CAUGHT UP IN YOUR FEELINGS AS IT RELATE TO YOUR OPINIONS OF THIS SUBJECT BECAUSE I GUARANTEE YOU THAT WE ALL HAVE THEM.. CONSTRUCTIVE CRITICISM IS HEATHY, (GET SOME)

Response by SPC James Anderson made Aug 16 at 2016 6:24 PM

SPC James Anderson — Tue, 16 Aug 2016 18:24:16 -0400

The Army and Marines are totally different organizations, its hard to equate the pride in one with the other. A universal feeling of pride in the Army is very hard to achieve. The pride and history is locked away in divisions and to a lesser extent the MOS's. Im more apt to tell people I was in the 1st Armored Division (Old Ironsides) then just saying I was in the Army. Your corp history may be more prevalent but in the Army the story and history of the Division is focused on. Your universal pride is hard to achieve with something so vast and varied as the modern Army.

Response by MSG Dan Castaneda made Aug 16 at 2016 9:29 PM

MSG Dan Castaneda — Tue, 16 Aug 2016 21:29:38 -0400

I personally think they have too much. All the MARSOC guys I've met are cool keep their mouths shut. "Quite Proffessionals." Then there's the ones that think they are tougher than woodpecker lips just because they are Marines knowing damn well they are just cooks. Nothing against soft skill MOSs, but know your roll and act accordingly.

Response by MSG Dan Castaneda made Aug 16 at 2016 9:31 PM

MSG Dan Castaneda — Tue, 16 Aug 2016 21:31:19 -0400

Tha Army does have a lot more fatter Soldiers which is a clear sign of not having respect for themselves.

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 17 at 2016 3:48 PM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 17 Aug 2016 15:48:18 -0400

As a former Marine and a current Soldier, I can say that the pride in service is instilled far better in USMC Bootcamp than it is in Army Basic. You can call it indoctrination, or brainwashing, or esprit de corps... but the premise is the same. The USMC puts a greater focus on it as part of the "every Marine is a rifleman" motto. There is also a progression: in the USMC you have to "earn the title of US Marine" and are treated as less than a "real" Marine until you graduate. In the Army, you are a private from day 1.

Response by LCpl Darrell McGraw made Dec 14 at 2016 1:45 PM

LCpl Darrell McGraw — Wed, 14 Dec 2016 13:45:28 -0500

The few. The proud. The Marines...
The other. The Army.

Response by PFC Kristine Snyder made Nov 17 at 2017 3:23 PM

PFC Kristine Snyder — Fri, 17 Nov 2017 15:23:18 -0500

I loved my time in the WAC from 1968-1970, and cried when handed my discharge.

Response by SFC K. Kopez made Nov 21 at 2017 9:17 PM

SFC K. Kopez — Tue, 21 Nov 2017 21:17:52 -0500

I have to say, the Marines have MUCH more pride in their service than the average soldier. I loved the Army and would tell you my branch is the best all day long to this very day. But the truth is the Marines receive more training than the average soldier. More infantry training no matter what your MOS is, swimming, martial arts, training with other special ops from around the world, etc. The Army just doesn't get this same training because it would put us in debt to train so many soldiers. They are trained to kill, first in, and expected to be the first to die and they know it. Bottom line is a lot of soldiers are in the Army because they had nowhere else to go or no job to go to. Marines CHOSE to be Marines. I hate to say it, but after talking to so many Marines and seeing the immediate difference in branch history and pride, the truth is just the truth! But still.. Soldiers do the hard work in all these combat tours. While you do your 4-6 month rotations, the Army is holding it down for 12-15 every other year. HOOAH!!

Response by SFC K. Kopez made Nov 21 at 2017 9:21 PM

SFC K. Kopez — Tue, 21 Nov 2017 21:21:16 -0500

But to more directly answer the question, there is no lack of pride. I think it's equally there, but there are just a lot more knuckleheads in the Army that don't care and are there to collect a paycheck. The Army is so needy for numbers, that they take anybody at times, and these are the ones with zero pride. The ones that volunteered to serve their country, like myself, have more pride than you know. In the country, unit, branch, and in my case the NCO corps!

Response by SPC Brendon Schaible made Nov 22 at 2017 3:44 PM

SPC Brendon Schaible — Wed, 22 Nov 2017 15:44:05 -0500

Ask any infantryman and he'll tell you he has pride in the infantry. But we will all piss and moan over the bullshit of the big green weenie that same day.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 23 at 2017 10:00 PM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:00:36 -0500

I can't speak for Army because I've never been in the Army. So, if there is more pride in USMC I couldn't verify it. I have been out of the USMC almost 20 years, so I can't speak for pride now. I believe it's as high as it has ever been though. It could be that Army pride is higher than you realize. The Army units I've been around seemed to be proud and professional. One factor could be size of Army vs. USMC. The greater the numbers the larger cross-section to sample. It may be related to basic training also. A slice of USMC boot camp covers the history and achievements. My guess would be that boot camp itself is where it starts. It's a rite of passage and that is reinforced and upheld at every unit thereafter. The esprit de corps is a central theme of all Marines once they get assigned to a unit and stays with them for as long as they serve. I'm sure it exists in the Army as well, but due to the larger numbers it is less apparent in certain units.

Edit: Added 12/23/17 Same idea and didn't realize I had already responded.

I haven't been around enough Army to say, although the ones I have served with were pretty motivated and squared away. It depends on who you ask though. One reason might be larger service = more people = greater odds of finding disgruntled and less than motivated soldiers. If you go to towns around large USMC bases you will find great numbers of "ex" Marines that aren't overly fond of the Corps, as opposed to former Marines and those that live by the "once a Marine, always a Marine" creed. The distinction between "ex" and former being the same as an "ex" wife from a bitter divorce as opposed to a former spouse that is still on good terms with the other spouse, but divorced because they just had irreconcilable differences.

Response by SFC Greg Bruorton made Nov 23 at 2017 10:29 PM

SFC Greg Bruorton — Thu, 23 Nov 2017 22:29:52 -0500

When I was assigned to non-Airborne units it was nothing unusual to hear snide comments such as, "There goes another "lifer" simply because I was an NCO and proudly showed it through my efforts. To be honest, I didn't notice derogatory terms aimed at me while in the 82nd Airborne--or at least, I didn't hear them. But I well understand your concerns, Sergeant Major, because irritating disrespect can become too common in the Army.

Response by LCpl Justin Alexandrea made Nov 24 at 2017 6:33 PM

LCpl Justin Alexandrea — Fri, 24 Nov 2017 18:33:54 -0500

Because they're not Marines.
Not to sound sarcastic, but that sums it up..
The Army is a valiant force, but being too large, means you just can't compare the brotherhood feeling like the corps does.
Perhaps the special forces have a tight brotherhood, similar to the Marines esprit de corps, but overall, the average soldier just doesn't value themselves in uniform or tradition, as measured against a Marine of similar now skill level.

Response by SSgt Dwight Deatherage made Dec 21 at 2017 9:25 PM

SSgt Dwight Deatherage — Thu, 21 Dec 2017 21:25:15 -0500

The Marine Corps is a cult.

Response by SP5 Mark Cassiday made Dec 22 at 2017 8:21 PM

SP5 Mark Cassiday — Fri, 22 Dec 2017 20:21:50 -0500

I held many mos' while in the U.S. Army and pm very proud to have worn the uniforms. Every branch has had another's 6 and saved their ass, so as far as I see it, and experienced it, we are all Brothers and Sisters.

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Dec 22 at 2017 9:07 PM

CW3 Kevin Storm — Fri, 22 Dec 2017 21:07:51 -0500

I know I am going to step on a landmine here, but the Army does this to themselves. We have a long proud history, just ask someone to tell you what is and they can't. We go through goofy uniforms about every decade. We don't listen to input from the field on a uniform replacement. Some one please explain to me why we need felt tabs on a uniform to be designated as a "Leader," Regimental Crests for Regiments that don't exist. Green Uniforms, then Dress Blues which become ASU's which now look like crap because the material is cheap as all get out. The Corp gets a higher allotment for their initial uniform issue, this makes a huge difference. Buy cheap you get cheap.

Our Basic and AIT is pretty much unchanged since WWII. Hell we can't even figure out to train soldiers how to drive the equipment they are going to need to use at AIT, instead we dump that on the gaining unit. The Army is most likely the greatest bunch of safety Nazi's in existence, except we don't send anyone to school to learn the correct way to do things. Why is it that units are told to train the their soldiers how to drive and operate equipment, instead of mandating you get a CDL, and formal training in doing it right. We create a -10 manual that no soldier could ever go through in a single morning to do proper Preventive Maintenance. Reserve and National Guard soldiers are in a worse situation as there is never time for them to learn things at "home station." Compound this with things like rifle marksmanship, a PT test that for the last thirty years has been changing yet hasn't.

Not everything in the world has to be PC, quit trying to destroy any piece of history related to the Army, why designate a National Guard Unit that has been around before the United States ever existed and do away with it, talk about destroying pride? How about allowing those units a historic piece of their history? Instead of crappy looking berets how about the 32nd Infantry Combat Brigade Team wear the Hardee Hat (the black hats of civil war fame), The 69th wear a symbol of the Irish Brigade, and yes make the Stetson a standard for Cav units. Distinctive Unit head gear would make a huge difference in bringing back some of the pride, and history of the Army.

Response by SSG John Mitchell made Dec 23 at 2017 12:08 PM

SSG John Mitchell — Sat, 23 Dec 2017 12:08:32 -0500

I worked with all Branches & served with Prior Service Branches as well. At the end of the day it didn't matter. We all took pride in our Service but all Marines reminded me the most of 82nd & the Pride we felt. When you train to be the best, you take pride in it. Paris Island teaches that from day one. Army leaves it up to whatever Division you end up in. Some are better at it than others.

Response by LT Brad McInnis made Dec 23 at 2017 12:18 PM

LT Brad McInnis — Sat, 23 Dec 2017 12:18:31 -0500

I worked with both... My 2 cents is that the Army is too caught up in "I am", meaning what branch you are in. Regular infantry doesn't like SF, etc. In the Marines, everyone is a Marine first. My 2 cents at least, and I would still serve beside either...

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Dec 23 at 2017 1:12 PM

SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth — Sat, 23 Dec 2017 13:12:02 -0500

I think it depends on how you talk to, I was very proud of my serving , even though it was the Army Guard, 85% or better of the people I served with were proud of the military service.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 23 at 2017 2:40 PM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 23 Dec 2017 14:40:20 -0500

Added to another post below.

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Dec 23 at 2017 4:48 PM

SSG Edward Tilton — Sat, 23 Dec 2017 16:48:41 -0500

1. At some point Senior Enlisted NCOs became management rather than labor. Now they go to meetings and do the jobs officers used to do.
2.Soldier skills, it's soldiering not harassment. Close Order Drill, Formations, raising and lowering the flag. Things that every soldier needs to know. Be there while those under you are doing the training but be an example.
3. Once upon a time E-5 and Above had to go to the NCO Club for Sunday Breakfast. At that breakfast the SMJ would give his operating instruction. https://youtu.be/N1TAfUdlr2o

Monty Python ~ Marching up and down the square Michael Palin

Response by SGT Craig Stimson made Dec 23 at 2017 10:04 PM

SGT Craig Stimson — Sat, 23 Dec 2017 22:04:39 -0500

The army is alot bigger pool of people with it you hear more unhappy people the pride of service ratio is probly as close. I know ask a paratrooper how the feel tgey will tell you greatest job in the world and more pride then anyone. That being said quiet professionalism. Airborne all the way.

Response by 1SG Leo Leal made Dec 23 at 2017 11:35 PM

1SG Leo Leal — Sat, 23 Dec 2017 23:35:00 -0500

We have great pride. We just don’t go around talking about ho

Response by SPC Stan LaCount made Dec 24 at 2017 9:09 PM

SPC Stan LaCount — Sun, 24 Dec 2017 21:09:01 -0500

Don't be a total ass jarhead

Response by SFC Daniel Spooner made Dec 25 at 2017 7:27 PM

SFC Daniel Spooner — Mon, 25 Dec 2017 19:27:49 -0500

Not sure where you've been looking but for mysrlf, I have always had pride in my branch (Army) since day one. That was 46 years ago, in that time I served both active and reserve for 36 contiguous years, and saw more than enough pride in the branch. I have many friends in all of the branches and most are proud of their branch and their service. To say one is more prideful than the other, I feel, is just looking at negatives when dealing with other branches and missing the pride showing in the job done.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 27 at 2017 3:33 PM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 27 Dec 2017 15:33:02 -0500

The Marine Corps is a cult.

Response by SFC Bryan Johnson made Dec 28 at 2017 10:12 AM

SFC Bryan Johnson — Thu, 28 Dec 2017 10:12:27 -0500

Political correctness , overtaking mission accomplishment .

Response by SSG William Fairbotham made Dec 31 at 2017 1:24 PM

SSG William Fairbotham — Sun, 31 Dec 2017 13:24:05 -0500

The Marine Corps, honors their history and traditions. They don't try to reinvent the wheel every few years like the Army has done. There is a board in the Army called the Sgt Morales board, it's not even after a real person! They have Plenty of heroes they could have named it after and didn't. Audie Murphy board always confused me. He didn't get out a Sgt, so why is the board set up for NCO's? the 15 years I was in the Army, I saw two slogan changes, four different utility uniforms, and 3 different pt uniforms, not to mention two changes in our dress uniform. While some might say that that's a good thing, it was an unnecessary pain in the ass that cost soldiers money and costs taxpayers a shitload of money.

Response by CPL Randy Nuttle made Jan 5 at 2018 12:57 PM

CPL Randy Nuttle — Fri, 05 Jan 2018 12:57:18 -0500

While the Corps, starts instilling the pride, history in boot camp, for the army it's not an emphsis or at least it wasn't back in the day during basic. Although I understand that more of an emphsis is made now days. Mostly in the unit level is where it develops in the army.

Response by CPL Robert Jackson made Jan 6 at 2018 5:26 PM

CPL Robert Jackson — Sat, 06 Jan 2018 17:26:33 -0500

I can't speak for the whole branch, but the Military Police Corp is a very proud brotherhood.

Response by SGT Mark Halmrast made Jan 6 at 2018 6:54 PM

SGT Mark Halmrast — Sat, 06 Jan 2018 18:54:37 -0500

82nd Airborne
'nuff said

Response by SSG Ken Schiffner made Jan 7 at 2018 12:25 PM

SSG Ken Schiffner — Sun, 07 Jan 2018 12:25:10 -0500

From only an Army perspective, i agree with those who say the USMC pride is in the USMC, and the Army pride is unit based. The Army being so large with so many divided missions, I think it's natural to have unit or mos pride. I dont think that's a problem, along with the rivalries. As long as when the S hits the fan, everybody has each other's backs. I was in the infantry and have never been I combat, but I have been in a fight or two, and one was to back up a group of Marines and another was being backed up by a group of guys from the USAF. I've been a cop for almost 25 years, and have been in some extreme high stress situations. As much smack as we would talk about other units or departments we all took care of each other.

Response by Cpl Jeffrey Derkatch made Jan 8 at 2018 8:57 AM

Cpl Jeffrey Derkatch — Mon, 08 Jan 2018 08:57:24 -0500

Because their Americans

Response by JaLena Samuel made Jan 19 at 2018 2:51 PM

JaLena Samuel — Fri, 19 Jan 2018 14:51:17 -0500

I do not believe any of this to be true. I am 46 years old and was in basic in 1991 USARMY...never made it to my MOS, but my younger brother made it to USMC REcon...all I can say is the power is within. When you are born in to a military family, these ideals never go away...I love ALL my brothers in arms and my family. Being a 46 year old female and dealing with a family death that occurred while in basic, it is something you NEVER get over. a tough journey to say the least...

Do not voice opinions that you know nothing about.

I will always know that because of my family, I have made it as far as I have.

The oldest of 5 and a single parent...I will always stand tall toward everyone, but I will not allow myself to be pulled down about the trauma with post-war or deployment.

J

Response by SPC Matthew Birkinbine made Jan 20 at 2018 12:32 AM

SPC Matthew Birkinbine — Sat, 20 Jan 2018 00:32:37 -0500

You must be talking to the wrong soldiers, Sergeant Major, because I love the Army. Marines may be more thoroughly brainwashed collectively, but I feel just as much, if not more pride in the service branch I was a part of (and at heart am still). Go Ordnance!!!

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 20 at 2018 5:07 PM

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 20 Jan 2018 17:07:47 -0500

We have haters too. Exhibit A: "Eat the apple, fuck the Corps."
But seriously, I think the Army pride shows thru in their specialized units, Ranger, SF, Cav, Airborne etc. For whatever reason, the everyday soldier doesn't think of the Army as anything but a job.

Response by CH (LTC) Robert Leroe made Jan 20 at 2018 7:36 PM

CH (LTC) Robert Leroe — Sat, 20 Jan 2018 19:36:58 -0500

We're humble.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Jan 20 at 2018 10:00 PM

SSG (ret) William Martin — Sat, 20 Jan 2018 22:00:55 -0500

CSM Carl Cunningham You don't know me SGM, but I have lots of pride, and I set the standard for my Soldier's to stimulate and while I don't walk around proving anything to anyone, my actions will speak volumes.

Response by Capt Michael Brown made Jan 22 at 2018 10:56 AM

Capt Michael Brown — Mon, 22 Jan 2018 10:56:51 -0500

It starts with perception.
When I enlisted in the USMC I wanted a challenge and to be a part of what I considered the 'toughest' branch. , the brainwashing culture of the USMC that starts day one of bootcamp is part of the answer. The Marine Corps Drill instructors do their job right. They challenge you to become a Marine, to become the best. That impression never left me. Not when I went to Quantico to become an officer and it still reigns in me now that I am out in the pride of 'Once a Marine Always a Marine'.
The USMC attracts quality recruits wanting to be up to the challenge. They are continually trying to measure up to 'Chesty Puller' standards. Every special force unit you run into believes it is the best whether they are SEALs or Delta Force. The Marines believe this too, except it is accepted universally in our branch of the armed forces.

Response by SPC James Nunya made Jan 23 at 2018 12:14 PM

SPC James Nunya — Tue, 23 Jan 2018 12:14:52 -0500

Shit son, that's because we, THE ARMY, care about what we DO. The Marines are glorified Navy pukes. I was... no, AM a 19 kilo. A fucking TANKER. The point of the spear AND the sheild. A Marine tanker? Ask him and he says he is a rifleman first. ??????? Really??? Moron.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 24 at 2018 3:52 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 Jan 2018 15:52:10 -0500

CSM Carl Cunningham I think that because the Marines are taught that they are Marines first and foremost before their MOS they have the pride in their service. Also, their size allows them to do this. In the Army were are very much focused on our MOS or the unit we are assigned to. This causes us to take pride in that. We are proud to be "grunts", "SF", "Airborne", "FA", "Engineers", "Sappers", etc. This also causes us to be competitive or mock others such as Airborne vs. Air Assault or Airborne vs. legs or infantry vs. POGs or even within a unit such as Rakkasans vs. Bastogne. The loyalty lies with the unit and MOS instead of service as we are large.

Response by PVT Mark Brown made Jan 24 at 2018 3:55 PM

PVT Mark Brown — Wed, 24 Jan 2018 15:55:56 -0500

Back in the 1960s things were a bit weird. I found out in basic that the Army has a definite attitude about US vs. RA soldiers. I was RA, we had 60 men in our basic training company, we had 59 RAs and 1 US. That poor lonely US caught hell for 8 straight weeks (basic was only 8 long weeks then.) The Monday after graduation from basic I ran across this poor guy crawling in the dirt at Ft Lewis in infantry AIT.

Response by PO2 Louis Fattrusso made Jan 25 at 2018 5:49 PM

PO2 Louis Fattrusso — Thu, 25 Jan 2018 17:49:01 -0500

The Marines have always been acknowledged as America’s greatest fighting force. The common saying is “Send in the Marines!”

Response by SSgt Bruce Probert made Jan 28 at 2018 5:06 PM

SSgt Bruce Probert — Sun, 28 Jan 2018 17:06:38 -0500

Young men join the Marine corps to prove something to themselves to their families as a rebellion to being told they're not good enough, not tough enough. This is where we all started and once marines we were steeped in the the stories of Dan Daly, Chesty Puller, John Basilone, As marines we were more afraid of not measuring up to the marines who stormed Tarawa or took Tripoli or raised the flag on Iwo Jima. As Marines we have an identity that is real and unmistakable, we are the Few and the Proud. We fight for each other, lose is word we don't know, the best way to get a Marine to do something is to tell him that he can't. I hope this sheds a little light Semper Fi

Response by SFC Jimmy Sellers made Jan 30 at 2018 12:57 PM

SFC Jimmy Sellers — Tue, 30 Jan 2018 12:57:08 -0500

This is a tricky question, but a valid one. I spent 6 years on the Marines, and then switched to the Army and stayed until retirement. Having served in both branches, I know that it is true that the Marines instill a great deal of pride in their recruits during Boot Camp. This is done by making Marines learn about the battle history of the Marines.
The Army also has a great battle history, however the Army does not seem to emphasize it to soldiers. Knowing the linieage of your unit creates pride. Some units in the Army have more pride than others, for example the 82nd Airborne Div. or the 101st. The soldiers in those divisions know that they are part of a long line of great American soldiers.
The Marines is small enough (with only 3 active duty divisions) that all Marines feel like they are part of the same team.
The Army is much larger and suffers from alienation amongst its own people. For example, if you are a soldier and see another soldier wearing a division patch from a unit that you are not part of or never been in there is an unspoken feeling that this soldier is different than you somehow. The nature and culture in one Army division is often very different from other divisions. In the Marines each division is basically the same, just located in different geographical locations.
It boils down to this: in the Army am S1 clerk or a supply officers daily duties are not that much different from an equivalent job in the civilian world. The Marine clerk or supply officer have been taught from day 1 that they are primarily Infantry riflemen, and can be called upon to serve as infantrymen when the situation requires it.

Response by SFC Thomas Butler made Feb 1 at 2018 10:29 AM

SFC Thomas Butler — Thu, 01 Feb 2018 10:29:00 -0500

It's a simple case of numbers. The majority of service/support duties for the USMC is carried out by the USN. The majority of the Army are clerks/civilians in uniform.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 1 at 2018 1:05 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 01 Feb 2018 13:05:23 -0500

It’s a smaller force. It’s also part of the Navy which seems to honestly be more organized and standardized, in my opinion. Of the branches they have the best mix of professionalism and military tradition. The Marines are a department of the Navy and being so are run well. I think the Navy also harps about the Marines (and SEALs too) because there hasn’t been a ocean war in a long time and the Marines are the Navy’s boots on the ground engaging in combat in an era where we haven’t face a sea based enemy (or true air power enemy) in many years. Naval and air power are critical but everyone pays particular attention to who makes up the majority of dead and injured listed in the newspaper and DoD morbidity and mortality lists. Obviously the Army takes the prize for most dead and injured whether it is the total Number or the ratio of injury and death risk per person. Each branch naturally wants to brag about their war fighters. The Navy is no different. It’s understandable and with budget constraints and some politicians suggesting eliminating the Marines and rolling their mission into the Army or back to The Navy, they want to preserve their legacy. The Navy also have the best relentless marketing campaign and uniforms.

Response by MAJ Jimmy M. made Feb 1 at 2018 4:12 PM

MAJ Jimmy M. — Thu, 01 Feb 2018 16:12:22 -0500

Where to begin on the inaccuracy of this view.

Response by LtCol Scott Clifton made Feb 2 at 2018 11:02 AM

LtCol Scott Clifton — Fri, 02 Feb 2018 11:02:22 -0500

Sgt Kennedy is correct; pride in the Marine Corps is for the Corps itself - at that level. You may be an aviator or a grunt, but you are a Marine first. In the Army, and this was stated to me by friends who served in the Army, pride is derived at the Regimental level or the Branch level.
There are plenty of reasons for this, but if I had to guess it is because the Army has different "realities" and entry paths to it that the Marine Corps does not. The Marine Corps only has 2 paths, in two locations to becoming a Marine. All officers go through OCS at Quantico, VA or you go through one of only 2 recruit depots. Once complete, all officers go to The Basic School - literally all officers, without exception, commissioned and Warrant Officers.
The Army is sufficiently large enough that two officers serving side by side may have entered through completely different paths and didn't meet up until they are in their specific unit.
Finally, there is no Big Marine Corps and Special Operations, as there is Big Army and Special Ops - there is just the Marine Corps. So, you can serve in the Big Army and have a completely different reality with regard to gear and funding and support than your friends in Special Operations. All of that adds up to pride in the unit or branch vice the service level.

Response by SSgt Brett Ontiveros made Feb 2 at 2018 11:36 AM

SSgt Brett Ontiveros — Fri, 02 Feb 2018 11:36:11 -0500

I have served in the Army, USMC, and Air Force. I went to Army Basic in 1988, them Marine Boot Camp in 1990. I did an inner service transfer. My wife is still in the Army and since my military retirement we have this discussion often. I found that in Army basic they just teach you the basic skills of combat survival and general military customs and courtesy's. In the Marines, It is a a Cultural change. Personally, I don't think the Army can ever have the Brother/Sisterhood that the Marines have. I often wonder if its because of the sheer #'s of personnel in. I actually was quite impressed with the Air Force, Even they have a stronger bond and service pride to one another than I have ever felt in the Army.

Response by PO1 Ted Woitazek made Feb 6 at 2018 6:38 PM

PO1 Ted Woitazek — Tue, 06 Feb 2018 18:38:33 -0500

All I can say is I believe the pride is projected from the branch of service leadership.

Response by CSM John Ryan made Feb 13 at 2018 8:36 PM

CSM John Ryan — Tue, 13 Feb 2018 20:36:28 -0500

CSM Ryan after 28 years in Us Army I have seen the leadership fall so bad that the junior soldiers are following the leader. Our SGMs and officers. Are losing there edge. I read a book recently about troops in Afghanistan and it made me sick the lack of leadership they had sex party’s and leadership was doing the same thing. So sad.

Response by PO2 David Allender made Feb 14 at 2018 9:38 AM

PO2 David Allender — Wed, 14 Feb 2018 09:38:24 -0500

I have always heard the phrase: "ONCE A MARINE, ALWAYS A MARINE." I've never heard,"ONCE A SOLDIER, ALWAYS A SOLDIER." What more need be said about a MARINE. I was a sailor, but to the CORP I say "SIMPER FI."

Response by MSG John Duchesneau made Feb 15 at 2018 11:21 PM

MSG John Duchesneau — Thu, 15 Feb 2018 23:21:12 -0500

The Army is large and the Marines are small. Marines think they are special because they are Marines. Its that simple.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 16 at 2018 12:04 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 16 Feb 2018 00:04:33 -0500

Individually as a unit they will, not as a whole, Stars Shine brighter in a Galaxy, then within a Universe.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Feb 22 at 2018 12:26 PM

SGM Bill Frazer — Thu, 22 Feb 2018 12:26:25 -0500

The few, the proud- Uncle Sam's Misguided Children!

Response by MAJ Bill Maynard made Feb 23 at 2018 2:05 PM

MAJ Bill Maynard — Fri, 23 Feb 2018 14:05:27 -0500

Why ask such a question? The Army is just that: The Army. The premier ground combat force in the world. The Marine Corps is naval infantry and very small. The USMC does not have the diverse responsibility or scope of mission that the Army has. So in plain speak, the USMC is relatively tiny and assigned a narrow area of responsibility. This allows for more a more oorah atmosphere.

Response by PFC Pamala (Hall) Foster made Feb 25 at 2018 11:35 AM

PFC Pamala (Hall) Foster — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 11:35:12 -0500

I am one Army Soldier that is glad for the Marines. We talk 'smack' to each other, but family does that, and we fight together when we have to, but The Marines are known as the FEW,THE PROUD.I did PT one day with a Marine and my Army tail end was dragging in 15 minutes, but I was glad to see and know I was covered. Each Branch works together so please, put who has the most Pride to rest, cause we are ALL in it AS A TEAM.

Response by SFC John Fourquet made Feb 26 at 2018 8:43 AM

SFC John Fourquet — Mon, 26 Feb 2018 08:43:50 -0500

The problem is leadership. Too many leaders are not qualified to be leaders and this affects a soldier atttitude. The Army promotes people because they have a number of positions to fill at each grade. Promotion is not based on proven ability to handle the additional responsibility that comes with rank. Also leadership has failed to instill pride in being a soldier in the US Army.

Response by SMSgt Diana Pasterchick made Feb 28 at 2018 2:26 PM

SMSgt Diana Pasterchick — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 14:26:57 -0500

This is an odd question. Universal Pride, hmm, I read a couple of the responses--everyone has a right to an opinion but I am very proud of my 26 years of AF service and I know many Airmen who feel the same way. Each service has its mission and culture, and whether you look at each service subjectively or objectively the fact is the US military services collectively form the strongest military in the world.

Response by SSG Donald Gallaway made Mar 3 at 2018 6:41 AM

SSG Donald Gallaway — Sat, 03 Mar 2018 06:41:52 -0500

I was Army .. USAFR... And I am proud of all my service.. I was proud of my service in the AF and Army...I guess that is pride.. So I don't understand why you say the Army doesn't have the amount of 'Pride" that the Marines have.. That being said ....Army all the way...Even the Marines need Heros!!!!

Response by SFC Charles Temm made Mar 4 at 2018 2:58 PM

SFC Charles Temm — Sun, 04 Mar 2018 14:58:33 -0500

The service that I saw that that busted on itself the most was the Navy and then the AF. The AF though did so b/c they knew how the other services looked down on them and they liked to joke about it.

I agree that the Army being larger than the Corp tends to infight more but it's b/c of the different cultures/sub groups. Very bad between combat arms and non combat, less so between combat arms sub groups.

I never would have said the Corp has universal pride either but that's based on what I saw anecdotally. Some are going hate what they do no matter what it is, that's life.

Response by MSG John Duchesneau made Mar 4 at 2018 11:31 PM

MSG John Duchesneau — Sun, 04 Mar 2018 23:31:05 -0500

Marines tell themselves everyday they are the best and they believe it. In the Army the consensus is that people join the Army because they couldn't do anything else. Its good you take pride in being in the Army but its not as big a part of the culture as it is in the Marines. In the Army Soldiers tend to take pride in their branch first and the Army second.

Response by SGT Kyle Bickley made Mar 10 at 2018 6:55 AM

SGT Kyle Bickley — Sat, 10 Mar 2018 06:55:48 -0500

Your kidding right? Served as a Marine from 78 threw 80. The Army after that. Marines talk a lot of hype. The Army doesn't need to. The Marines fight and win battles, the Army wins wars! The Marines dress blues look great! I thought the Army dress blues were just as nice. The Marines have great Generals, the Army has had War Lord's (Patton). Don't compare a bull dog to a Wolf! I am more proud of my role as a combat engineer in the Army then I was as infantry in the Corp. I don't need to brag how bad ass the Army is! They already know it!

Response by LTC Lewis Cox made Mar 12 at 2018 7:52 PM

LTC Lewis Cox — Mon, 12 Mar 2018 19:52:31 -0400

I, Infantry-Lew, say the Infantry has just as much esprit de corps as the Marine Corps!!!

Response by Sgt Gabriel Rodriguez made Mar 19 at 2018 12:12 PM

Sgt Gabriel Rodriguez — Mon, 19 Mar 2018 12:12:04 -0400

There are only two branches of the Military. The Army and the Navy. The Air Force is a corporation and the Marines are a cult.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 20 at 2018 2:57 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 20 Mar 2018 02:57:17 -0400

Honestly it more has to do with standards with it being the “new army”

Response by LTC Bill Morgan made Mar 20 at 2018 10:27 AM

LTC Bill Morgan — Tue, 20 Mar 2018 10:27:10 -0400

I served in the US Army for over 20 years and had the opportunity to work with all of the services in a joint assignment. The Marines are the smallest of our services and perhaps their smaller size fosters an attitude of elitism that is seen in their fierce loyalty to the Corps. By contrast, I think the loyalty toward the Army as a service is diluted due to its sheer size. The Army has great morale at the large unit level (i.e., 82nd Airborne, 101st Airborne, "Big Red 1", The Cav, "Rock of the Marne (3d ID), 75th Ranger Regiment, Special Forces, etc.) High morale and close unit identification among soldiers is very evident in within battalion and brigade-sized units. Where you see poor morale, you generally find poor leadership. The size and diversity of the Army's missions and focus make it hard to foster intense loyalty to the Army as a whole. Consider the differences between the Army Corps of Engineers, Army Materiel Command and 1st Special Forces Group. All are critical to the Army's overall mission and purpose; all have vastly different mission focus.

Response by SPC Christopher Perrien made Mar 20 at 2018 1:05 PM

SPC Christopher Perrien — Tue, 20 Mar 2018 13:05:39 -0400

Well the Marines have always been a force that has a long history of fighting in non -vital ,Counter-insurgency warfare , small unit warfare , and enforcing Imperialism as they have been doing since fighting the Barbary pirates, the Mexican war, the Bananas wars of late 19th early 20th century and now in this silly GWOT. Always nice to be doing what your mission has always been (wardogs of capitalism and all that LOL)- And I do find it funny the Marines are in places where there is no-water to be seen . The Army being a force that SHOULD be training to fight organize /formal warfare , is seeing that main purpose being destroyed by having to be involved , training for , and now using equipment to fight in counter-insurgency warfare as well . Look at such thing as having units with MRAPS. A useless , expensive vehicle that by design is only because we got army units spreads out in hostile areas with hostile populace and Army units got to worry about mines and IED's. The army should not be doing that or be in those areas doing counter insurgency. If there is no "front" or battle-line the Army should not be there . That is the province of the USMC.

Always nice to be doing the job you are supposed to be doing or were created in the first place. Small unit and counterinsurgency warfare. Really the Marines though now also seem to stuck a lot in thinking about Amphibious Assaults, due to the "freak occurrence " of having to invade islands in WWII. Guess what? That never was the actual mission of the USMC and it won't happen again on a large scale. However in the "banana wars" such as found in this new GWOT the USMC is doing what it was made for. The Army is doing missions now, the Army was not meant for, nor should be doing. So yea, because of that I would expect the USMC to have a higher"Esprit de Corps" than the army. At least in the combats units. I doubt there is much difference in the rear echelons of either. I got out of the Army , when it's mission was completed by winning the Cold War, and witnessed the beginning of the corruption of the army to fight in this bogus "Great war of terror" , . Which basically means killing Moslems , fighting wars and destroying countries for the benefit and security of Israel. Does nothing for America , except to create more Enemies. Osama bin laden, being a case in point.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 21 at 2018 7:25 AM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 21 Mar 2018 07:25:33 -0400

Other than OCONUS I haven't served alongside Army that much. The ones I did serve with 78-98 seemed to be very proud. 10 th Mountain and Aviation TF 4/4 in Somalia, as well as various other units. Some Black Beret Ranger outfit was OPFOR for Gallant Knight/Gallant Eagle for our portion at 29 Palms in 88. I met a Lt from that unit in the Camp Wilson area before the Op kicked off, and he seemed well-grounded.

Response by MAJ Bob Firth made Mar 23 at 2018 1:37 PM

MAJ Bob Firth — Fri, 23 Mar 2018 13:37:40 -0400

Every unit I was in had a great degree of esprit de corps (no pun intended), they were all infantry units which were completely different from any other branch in the Army. Things I saw in POG units would never be tolerated in a line unit. When I was a support platoon leader in an infantry battalion I had a bunch of 88 series truck drivers. They had never run 5 miles before but we worked up to it. Everyone bitched their share but don't dis the unit in front of them if you weren't one of them.

Response by SFC Mike Wilkins made Apr 9 at 2018 9:58 AM

SFC Mike Wilkins — Mon, 09 Apr 2018 09:58:37 -0400

You must be a marine to say the army does not have as much pride as the marines do. That marines are wannabe navy, that’s who pays their checks and who they work for. They train the marines not to fire that’s why they put them at embassies. When they send the army there will be gun fire for sure. Almost all branches have covert ops teams or JTF groups. So no one branch corners the market. I myself am retired army and proud of it and any member of any branch should be proud of their branch if not I feel sorry for them. I have one last thing to say,”GO ARMY”.

Response by CW3 Dan Mackey made Apr 9 at 2018 10:41 AM

CW3 Dan Mackey — Mon, 09 Apr 2018 10:41:00 -0400

I think it has to do with the sizes of the services. In my experience elements of the army combat arms units of similar size ie Airborne units and Rangers, Armor units and air cav. Have equal levels of pride! Special ops units have even more pride than the Marines. I think the pride is based in past present and future combat successes. The army is huge as a whole and has more support units than combat arms. I know all the elements make the whole work and are needed and still the pride of service for most comes from the feeling of being a warrior not support.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2018 11:32 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Apr 2018 23:32:00 -0400

In the Army, I think it's a focus on the division level and your battalion. That's why we do not have the Army pride. We are much bigger and much more divided so our pride is proximity in the Army.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 17 at 2018 8:30 PM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 17 Apr 2018 20:30:06 -0400

Like the Navy, the Marines have a focus on tradition. The Army was never like that for me. That tradition elicits a lot of pride.

Response by 1SG James Kelly made Apr 21 at 2018 12:53 PM

1SG James Kelly — Sat, 21 Apr 2018 12:53:43 -0400

Because they are not Marines.
Follow up: no.

Response by CPL Stan Simmons made Apr 29 at 2018 11:31 AM

CPL Stan Simmons — Sun, 29 Apr 2018 11:31:17 -0400

I have served in both the beloved Marine Corp and The Army. The Marines are all rifleman first then their MOS, They eat, drink, sleep, and work their identity 24 -7. We are instilled with the fact we are few but the elite. It is that Spartan like ideal that all Marines have. The Army in the units I served in has theiir history and a certain amount of pride too. But it seems to be more a unit pride and more of a job than a service. Except for the CAV! Which I was so honored to serve.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 29 at 2018 3:37 PM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 29 Apr 2018 15:37:56 -0400

I think that all of our services have pride in what they do and they do it well. From someone who grew up as an Army brat, then enlisted in the Marine Corps know the difference between both of your Military Combat Warriors. My father served during two wars from 1950 to 1972. I was lucky to serve in one. But to your question about the Army’s attitude toward themselves start with your basic leadership principles and especially your professionalism toward others. The biggest difference between the United States Marine Corps and the United States Army is the size of its components. As I watched our Brave men and women who goes in harms way day after day, its not once that all are equally important than the few. In the Marine Corps it started in Boot Camp and never ends until we see our maker in Heaven. It’s the Pride that we all have. Our motto says it all “Semper Fidelis” Always Faithful!
To Our Corps, Our God, Our Country, and to each Marine. Past, Present and Future. Your Army is Your Army. It will be whatever you want it to be as long as You do your Best to serve others not yourself. Semper Fidelis SGM Carl Cunningham.

Response by CPT Alfred Smiley made May 2 at 2018 8:49 PM

CPT Alfred Smiley — Wed, 02 May 2018 20:49:31 -0400

For one thing, it's taught. I was always impressed about how Marines can tell you that the "blood stripe" on their dress blue pant leg was earned at the Battle of Chapultepec, Mexico in 1848 (the vaunted "Halls of Montezuma"). The Army's history is even more impressive (Concord Bridge, Lexington Green, Bunker Hill, etc.), but it's not taught to our soldiers. I think the Army has long missed an opportunity to inspire its troops by not teaching its history.

Response by CPT Alfred Smiley made May 2 at 2018 8:55 PM

CPT Alfred Smiley — Wed, 02 May 2018 20:55:34 -0400

I don't know if it's true, but I used to hear it said that every Marine squad in the Pacific Theater in WWII was composed of 10 Infantrymen and 1 Cameraman. The point was that the Marines supposedly launched a major PR effort during WWII to publicize their exploits. Come to think of it, you don't hear much in military lore about the Marines until their daring amphibious landings in the Pacific.

Response by CPT Alfred Smiley made May 2 at 2018 10:12 PM

CPT Alfred Smiley — Wed, 02 May 2018 22:12:35 -0400

The Marine Corps Hymn teaches its history in battle. The Army's "Over Hill, Over Dale" does not. I once wrote new words for the Army Hymn in hopes of remedying the shortcoming:
To Lexington and Concord Town
we filed in from all around,
though our Army had yet to be formed.
Minutemen, guns in hand,
rushed in to defend Our Land,
the Militia poured in from their farms.
There the Redcoats formed their ranks
and they fired upon the Yanks,
and attempted to torch the very town!
So we pushed them from the bridge,
and fired from every fence and ridge,
'til back to Boston they fled in alarm.

Response by SFC Harold Schaeffer made May 4 at 2018 7:06 PM

SFC Harold Schaeffer — Fri, 04 May 2018 19:06:18 -0400

Agree the army needs more combat training especially small arms training.

Response by CW3 Chuck Huddleston made May 7 at 2018 6:40 AM

CW3 Chuck Huddleston — Mon, 07 May 2018 06:40:38 -0400

We do have lots of pride, but we just don't run around tooting our horn about it to everyone. We know we are powerful, united and let our history demonstrate our effectiveness. GO ARMY!!!!!!!!

Response by SGT Tim. Wilson made May 8 at 2018 9:58 PM

SGT Tim. Wilson — Tue, 08 May 2018 21:58:38 -0400

After being in the Army for shy of ten years, rushed medical discharge (imo) so I wouldn't get any retirement.
Anyway, in my day basic and AIT were basically all done at one place. I was an MP, during basic there was no reference to our school but we were referred to as soldiers. My son did 8 yrs in the Corps before he had had enough of the BS, his words and got out, but during boot camp for the Corps they are not referred to as marines but as recruits or boots, they earn the title of Marine the day they graduate from boot camp and receive their EGA pin. The Army didn't have anything like this when I was in and we trained as squad and platoon I just don't think it was as tight as is done in the Corps. And from what I hear, at least for awhile Army recruits were given timeout cards so if they got to stressed or they needed a break from training they raised their card and were excused for 15 mins. Yes I have only heard this from a few people, one being mine who witnessed it when he was training to be a tank mechanic, he said it blew his mind. Which kinda made me glad that I got out when I did. We didn't have those and you sure as he'll couldn't use them on ANY battlefield so why allow them? I probably would have been court marshalled if one of my troops held up one these cards, I would have taken him to the sandpit and knocked the crap out of him or rather try and council some sense into him.
And after what 45 did today, going back on the Iranian piece accord, I seriously wonder how long until we are in a really major war again. All because he wanted to undue something the last President helped accomplish. Either that or he saw Infinity War and now considers himself Thanos!

Response by SSG Robert Perrotto made May 9 at 2018 5:37 AM

SSG Robert Perrotto — Wed, 09 May 2018 05:37:50 -0400

I think the difference is that the Marines take pride in being a Marine, plus it is a much smaller force overall - where in the Army, it is more about unit pride - just ask most Rakkasans, both past and present, about the pride they have in being in the 3rd BCT, 187 Infantry, 101st Airborne Division - there are soldiers here in Italy that have a Tori prominently displayed on their vehicle.

Response by SSG Steven Borders made May 9 at 2018 6:58 AM

SSG Steven Borders — Wed, 09 May 2018 06:58:20 -0400

CSM Carl Cunningham SGM, I believe we do show pride but really in a different way. Think of how much bigger the Army as compared to the Marines. No, we don't get an eagle globe and anchor when we graduate. I didn't need that when I graduated Basic and AIT, I felt a sense of pride and honor. Like others have said we know we are the biggest and badest, and really don't need to flaunt that around. I also think we show it in our Dress uniform, compared to other branches we show off a lot more. I am proud of being an Army Soldier, and I believe there is a lot here that are proud too.

Response by 1LT Vance Titus made May 9 at 2018 1:13 PM

1LT Vance Titus — Wed, 09 May 2018 13:13:03 -0400

Not all roses. When the Marines went home in 1970 from I Corps some of them left "presents" for the Army units that moved in to replace them. I was at Cau Viet. The Marine barracks there were booby trapped. Fortunately no one was hurt, but the Marines' parting shot was not their finest showing.

Response by CSM Patrick Durr made May 11 at 2018 1:27 AM

CSM Patrick Durr — Fri, 11 May 2018 01:27:56 -0400

Poorly worded question. You're assuming that the Army doesn't have as much pride as the MC. I've served 32 years in one , as Senior Enlisted advisor to a USMC MG, and along side Marines for years. Pride is just shown in many different ways. Don't confuse conduct with real pride. Judge the individual, not the uniform.

Response by William Oliver made May 11 at 2018 1:39 PM

William Oliver — Fri, 11 May 2018 13:39:48 -0400

With a son in the Marines and nephew leaving the Army...the sentiment is the Marines have not yet been compromised by politics. The Army has dumbed down their standards to accommodate those who would not measure up the the riggers war demands.
They Marines are under attack too, to soften their standards, though a smaller and more cohesive Corp harder to crack. But make no mistake the activist are at work.
Take the Boy Scouts demise. Even leadership is being worn down, often by quilt tripping. Rex Tillerson a good example.

Response by SPC Elisabeth Vinal made May 13 at 2018 6:54 AM

SPC Elisabeth Vinal — Sun, 13 May 2018 06:54:17 -0400

I have seen this too, especially during my time at US Joint Forces Command. One important distinction between the Marines and Army is there are far fewer Marines. This, by definition, makes the Corps unique and distinctive in the Services.

I was Army National Guard, and there was and still is a pervasive "disrespect" of the State Armies National Guard, earned or not. I find myself educating people about Posse Comitatus and the real-world missions and duties of Guardsmen far more often than I think I should.

Greater Army pride is possible, but it is up to our fellow brothers and sisters to be proud of their service, whether they are recognized or not. Finally, we can take lessons from each Service and apply to how we are proud...espirit de corps, loyalty, valor, respect, honor, self-discipline, love of country and each other.

Not every American can claim these character traits built in the experiences of Basic Training, AIR, unit training, deployments, and the crucible of combat. Be proud, Army, always in being part of the relative few in the world who serve or have served, with honor, the greatest Nation on earth!

Response by CPL David Markham made May 14 at 2018 6:45 AM

CPL David Markham — Mon, 14 May 2018 06:45:15 -0400

It's been 50 + years since I was in the Army and I for one have great pride at being in the Army.

Response by MSG Robert Dupes made May 14 at 2018 1:01 PM

MSG Robert Dupes — Mon, 14 May 2018 13:01:34 -0400

Retired Army. It isn’t a lack of pride or unit esprit-de-Corps that is lacking in the Army, it’s that the Army is substantially different, being larger and more diversified. The Corps is smaller and therefore has a much stronger sense of elitism. Marines instill that a Marine is part of a brotherhood, that once a Marine, always a Marine. Marines also, being much smaller, do not have as many units so that when Marines transfer within the Corps, they usually have only a few places they will transfer to, and most likely there will be others in their new unit they served with before. The Army, because of its size and diversity of units, makes
It less likely that a soldier will transfer into a unit he or she previously served in. Also, the Army’s mission is different, with many MOS’s that are not in the Corps. In the Army, there are elite units, some that rival the size of Corps (Airborne).

Response by PFC Paul Alsip made May 14 at 2018 4:56 PM

PFC Paul Alsip — Mon, 14 May 2018 16:56:41 -0400

Wow! What a Condescending statement. Lol. For the sake of an adult conversation, I'll pretend this is a legit and serious question. Even though there is a 99% chance you're just being a douche bag. Haha. I'm guessing you're doing basically what my responseis going to be.

There is a major difference between "pride" and "ego". What you're doing is the average marine thought process (I'm infantry army and my brother is infantry marines), I've had this debate with my brother before, who agreed 100%.

Undoubtedly, marines are very proud and have every right to be. However, the majority of what you're asking about is "ego" and an average military response system from any branch, especially when put in a room together. To be proud, one doesn't have to gloat about their time in service or unzip to see whos bigger. Lol.

Trust me, the army is every bit as proud as the marines. Especially grunts! If you want to go have an army vs marine, "who's bigger" contest, just go look for a Rakksan. Who is every bit as proud as any marine. Rakkasans (the red headed step children of the army), are very outspoken and love a good "ego" contest, like you suggest. They also have every right to be, since we are one of (if not still the #1), most highly decorated unit in the entire u.s.a military. ;-)

In conclusion, your statement is nothing more than a straw man arguement (if you're a marine, you'll probably need to Google that....lol just messing...sort of) and illogical.

I have nothing but love for all branches (especially my brother and all marines). Neverless, this particular debate is senseless. You can't use a blanket statement about "pride" when you're actually discussing "ego". The marines are drilled from the beginning to have a large ego and it continues throughout. Personally I think it's a cool trait to have, but that doesn't make you any more "proud" than the army.

Response by LT Stu Evans made May 14 at 2018 10:49 PM

LT Stu Evans — Mon, 14 May 2018 22:49:15 -0400

The Marines are big on PR...everything seems magnified. The Army just quietly does its job including training some Marine specialties. All the services are superb and deserve any accolades. Being quiet and humble is a great quality.

Response by SGT Lewis Ray Rains made May 15 at 2018 1:20 AM

SGT Lewis Ray Rains — Tue, 15 May 2018 01:20:00 -0400

The Marine's, NOT TO DOWN PLAY THERE IMPORTANCE BY ANY MEANS, are, most times, at the head of the line in all public coverage. They tend to be the ones that you here about all the time. I have to admit, I respect the Marines, as much as I respect All of our Military.
However, it just seems that all other branches of our Military have to take a back seat to them. We ALL serve, fight a common enemy when necessary, bleed the same blood, & when it comes down to it, HAVE EACH OTHETS BACKS , when necessary! Is on branch better than the other? I don't think so. It takes ALL of us to get the whole job done, no matter what role we play. When it comes right down to the shit hitting the fan, we all must remember, no matter what your "job description" we are all trained to be the same, INFANTRY!!!!! WE ALL FIGHT FOR THE SAME RIGHTS & FREEDOMS! JUST BECAUSE WE MIGHT WARE DIFFERENT STYLE UNIFORMS, WE SHOULD TAKE PRIDE IN SERVING OUR COUNTRY ABOVE ALL ELSE!!!

Response by SFC David Pope, MBA made May 23 at 2018 10:49 PM

SFC David Pope, MBA — Wed, 23 May 2018 22:49:40 -0400

I worked JTF for much of my career. As an army SPC I stood Guard Post One in a US Embassy under the direction of the Marine Det. I had a Navy Commander for a boss, and answered to Col Mattis for reports(Yes that Mattis). Later in my career I worked with a marine LtCol assigned to my unit as a liaison for the artillery. He called a few of us E-7's "Gunny" as a show of respect for the team he was working with. When you look at the population of the army vs. marines the Army Artillery Branch has as many members as the entire Marine Corps. In the Corps they go to boot camp on the East or West Coast. The Army has boot camps all over the place, however according to the MOS will determine where you do basic and AIT. The marines only have a few places of training. Marines are all Riflemen, and anything else is just additional duty. Army are all Infantry, but once we get sent to MOSQ we tend to stay in that job our whole career with some exceptions. A marine "Commo Dog" may be put in a rifle squad one day, and get promoted and made a presidential security guard the next based on evaluation. Marines have to be tougher, because I have eaten in their chow halls. Anyone that can survive that has my respect. Just like Army Artillery or Signal, the Marines are a branch of the Navy. So in population and training they are similar in that respect. Army soldiers take pride in branch, so do Marines!

Response by GySgt Leo Rochon RETIRED made May 24 at 2018 10:12 AM

GySgt Leo Rochon RETIRED — Thu, 24 May 2018 10:12:59 -0400

I think it’s just a difference in culture. The Marine Corps exists and thrives on a warrior culture. Right from the yellow footprints in bootcamp, Marines are given expectations to live up to. It’s our warrior ethos. You will never see a Marine recruiting ad offering money for college or the like. Marines typically join to be our nation’s warriors. You get some of that from the Army, but it’s just what Marines do, and how they are expected to be.

Response by GySgt Leo Rochon RETIRED made May 24 at 2018 5:31 PM

GySgt Leo Rochon RETIRED — Thu, 24 May 2018 17:31:41 -0400

The Marine Corps instills something intangible in every recruit that is very powerful. Every Marine has a story, and every one of them starts with standing on the yellow footprints at the recruit depot. It is a right of passage to actually EARN the title Marine. A young man will never be called Marine until he earns that title. It's almost like a regal bloodline shared by all who wear the Eagle, Globe, and Anchor. That alone is a part of the lore of the Corps. To this day, and I can speak for thousands of current and former Marines, I get goose bumps every time I hear the Marines Hymn. That doesn't even happen for the national anthem. I can't even stop it, it's automatic. There is something about the Marine experience that is completely transformative. That common experience creates a fraternity that other branches find difficult to duplicate. I wrote the poem below to my son when he was in bootcamp at Parris Island. It may give you an idea of how the ethos of the Marine Corps is perpetuated.

Son Now Brother

Good morning son and brother,
I have something to pass to you,
It was passed to me some time ago,
and now you've earned it too.

It's the symbol of our beloved Corps,
loved, respected, and feared,
Worn by men of strength and honor,
earned with blood, sweat and tears.

I've polished it and kept it shiny
through my tours and all the years,
I've served my best to preserve its honor
for the nation that I hold dear.

Use each day to polish it
through the service to which you're called.
Lead your juniors every day
and its legacy teach them all.

Now it's time to pass the mantle
my Corps now belongs to you.
Protect it, and keep it safe and strong
that is my charge to you.

Good morning beloved son and now brother,
I have something to pass to you,
It's my eagle, globe and anchor,
and now you've earned it too.

Dad, Oct 2012

Response by PV2 Screwderia Ferrari made May 24 at 2018 9:10 PM

PV2 Screwderia Ferrari — Thu, 24 May 2018 21:10:04 -0400

It's called Quiet Confidence. Already stated, go in, work hard, get the job done. No need to call attention. Everyone in my unit had a tremendous amount of pride. Stealth Pride.

Response by MSG Danny Mathers made May 24 at 2018 9:50 PM

MSG Danny Mathers — Thu, 24 May 2018 21:50:51 -0400

I disagree. There are two armys. The regular army or "Big Army" and Special Operations Forces. The SOF Units and personnel love what they do and care about one thing and that is completeing the mission. It doesn't matter if you are an operator or support. You take pride above all the rest. It starts with the Airborne and goes all the way afterwards.

Response by Cpl Doyle McNabb made May 25 at 2018 10:47 PM

Cpl Doyle McNabb — Fri, 25 May 2018 22:47:24 -0400

Pride to me is an individual state of mind, in any branch of service the soldier, sailor, or Marine is a reflection of their respect of self. While in service, deployed to Nam, there was not so much unit pride, or even individual, but pride was who we stood beside, those fought alongside, the dedication and respect to perform top shelf with no thought about it. So i suppose the training, dedication to brothers in arm to me made the difference. Coming back to the world, being stationed at a training school as an instructor, there seemed to be a lack of brotherhood and respect for one another, a loss of pride if you will. So again I say pride comes from inside, the spirit, the love, not from the uniform or the unit.

Response by SGT Donald Howard made May 26 at 2018 2:55 AM

SGT Donald Howard — Sat, 26 May 2018 02:55:20 -0400

C2 SGM, I too still love the Army I once served (even though the girl did try to kill me several times LOL), there is the same kind of pride in the Army that you are speaking about. But (unfortunately) it seems to reside exclusively as a rule in the combat arms side of the house. The Marine Corps. being the smallest branch of the four branches means that even those in traditional noncombat MOS's will have had to fill a short fall as a grunt because !: The Corps. being smaller personal wise, need to be able to draw on anyone from any of it's support units to fight should they find themselves in a tight spot, who have better than average amount of infantry experience than his counterpart in the Army would. The Army being the largest branch (larger than it's three sister services combined) has a greater reservoir of combat arms personal that it has rarely had to pull clerks, mechanics or cooks into every soldier and marines overall job of rifleman. I'm not saying there are no hard core proud soldiers in the noncombat support MOS's, but the combat arms side of the Army house is where you will find that same pride that you spoke of the Corps. having, the same courage and combat proficiency and toughness, the only real difference is that each has a different culture which plays a good part in how the fore mention are expressed by those troops (Soldier or Marine.). I do know from what I myself experienced from the time I enlisted in 1982 at 17 and all the changes I saw in the Army in particular and Marines in general, right up to the end of my last deployment to OIF in 05 I can honestly say that the PC culture that creeped into the Army and Corps. have done harm to overall attitudes of it's members and the harm of the 8 years of the last administration were significant to the moral, culture and psychology of the 2 branches. With the new administration, retooling and a Def. Secretary like Mattis who knows what needs to be fixed, there is reason to be optimistic. The military as you know, is unique as an institution among all the other institutions that make up the moving parts of the federal government in that it exists as a subculture (warrior culture) which concepts of courage, honor, valor and patriotism are not the quasi concept they seem to be in the civilian world, but real, tangible way of believing, conducting ones self and to live by. The last 2 Democrat administration (Clinton, Obama) did serious harm to the military culture by using it as a social engineering experiment.I could write a book, but you are a senior grade NCO, you know what I am saying.

Response by CPT Gurinder (Gene) Rana made May 26 at 2018 6:36 AM

CPT Gurinder (Gene) Rana — Sat, 26 May 2018 06:36:57 -0400

Yes; if the Army quits trying to side-step issues and puts soldiers above the rest, pride in the Army will breach the brim CSM Carl Cunningham. There is a lot of pride for the Army in soldiers, but only if the Army can exploit it by cleaning the old barren wood from its decks to allow soldiers their dues and to cure past errors.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made May 26 at 2018 7:08 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 26 May 2018 07:08:03 -0400

Without reading all the comments, I believe it comes down to discipline. The individual discipline is lacking in the Army.

Response by SFC Dagmar Riley made Jun 4 at 2018 1:58 AM

SFC Dagmar Riley — Mon, 04 Jun 2018 01:58:52 -0400

I’ve actually pondered over this myself on occasion since I truly love the Army myself as you do. I did notice that it had a lot to do with were the complaining ones were located; what commands they fell under and then I remembered one of my earlier duty stations where even I nearly left the Army because of the way we were treated. I loved being a soldier and never expected to be babied but at the unit that had me so feeling down I felt like I wasn’t worth anything and that we all were only numbers/robots and we were made to feel that having families was the greatest burden. While I was assigned to that unit I had 2 days off in my 3 years I spent there beside of the few days leave I took and once I had a week off on Quarters for having a walking pneumonia. This almost caused me my marriage at the time since I left the house before anyone was ever awake and usually didn’t make it home until it was dark out and my kids were already in bed again and we worked 7 days a week because mail has to keep moving; which is understandable. There would have been ways to occasionally give a few people a weekend off but the command didn’t see it that way. For me personally this was the only unit where things were this severe but have heard from others that had comparable stories. For the majority of the soldiers in the Army though I don’t think that they lack in pride of the Army; it often is brought on by exposure to bad leadership for the ones that feel that way. Those Commands that stand behind their soldiers and show that they truly care about their soldiers usually get the same in return. I also understand the craziness of the current Optempo with having more missions than personnel to cover them safely at times it’s easy to forget that inside those uniforms are human beings not robots.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 4 at 2018 11:26 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 04 Jun 2018 11:26:31 -0400

Who says that the Army does not have as much pride as the Marine Corps. I proudly served for 24 years and would not have it any other way. I worked with quite a few "former" Marines during my career so I always ask myself, " If there is so much pride in being a Marine, why do so many of them leave? Seems to me that the Marine Corps tries to brainwash a lot of them. My 2 cents worth. Army Strong.

Response by SGT Steve Burczyk made Jun 8 at 2018 4:58 PM

SGT Steve Burczyk — Fri, 08 Jun 2018 16:58:24 -0400

Apparently you never visited The Tomb of the Unknown Soldier at Arlington. Americas best soldiers protect it not Marines.

Response by SSG Dean Stambaugh made Jun 10 at 2018 9:36 PM

SSG Dean Stambaugh — Sun, 10 Jun 2018 21:36:23 -0400

I do, more than any jarhead could ever have

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 10 at 2018 11:38 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 10 Jun 2018 23:38:51 -0400

I for one have just as much pride in the Army as any Marine has in the Corps. I serve in a joint unit. You can’t say that a service has more pride than another; they just have different cultures.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 11 at 2018 8:30 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 11 Jun 2018 08:30:13 -0400

Who and why

Response by SFC Bill Snyder made Jun 15 at 2018 12:56 PM

SFC Bill Snyder — Fri, 15 Jun 2018 12:56:03 -0400

Back in my Basic Days (mid 50s) our unit were active Divisions. Mine was the 69th Inf Div at Ft Dix. My BCT unit was Battery B, 696 AAA Bm. Every Sat AM, the CO would give us a short history of the unit and Division during Commanders Time. When I got to my AIT unit in Ft Benning (Co A, 69th Engr Bn), again each Sat AM, Commanders Time we got a bit of the Units history. This carried onto my regular assigned unit for several years, until the Army started becoming just a "job." Pride in the Unit was installed from day one in the Army and went on for years. Now, everyone wants to get out of town on Friday Nights until Mon AM. Don't bother me with this mundane stuff. It's just a job. I dare say, the USMC doesn't have this attitude. Now, i've been out since 79 and attitudes have changed, so, this is my opinion.

Response by CPT Timothy Hernandez made Jun 20 at 2018 4:14 PM

CPT Timothy Hernandez — Wed, 20 Jun 2018 16:14:04 -0400

I think all the comments so far are spot on. When I was in Special Operations, in the Army, the profesional expectations were high, like the Marines. When I was in regular army units I noticed a difference.

I often admired the Marine Corps for how well they instilled esprit de corps into their Marines. They not only consider each Marine to be special, as compared to other service members, but their culture compels each Marine to live up to a higher standard.

If you expect more from someone, and show them how to meet a higher standard, they will meet the expectation. In my observations, over 22 years of service, the Marines embody this.

Certain organizations in the Army do as well, specifically Special Forces, Special Operations, and Paratrooper units; but I find it impressive that the Marines do it for their entire Corps.

Response by CMSgt Frank Dailey made Jun 21 at 2018 9:21 AM

CMSgt Frank Dailey — Thu, 21 Jun 2018 09:21:59 -0400

Few understand the transformation that the USMC creates in the developmental process. 1st the USMC is the smallest of the services, they have a special mission and since their inception they were our nations shock troops. Their history has been documented and taught to every marine in spoken and written traditions. 2. There indoctrination is a process of complete breakdown and they only will build up the best and most capable force. Because their numbers are limited they find that this creates the mental picture of strength and honor. When you compare the two services you will find that one is so much smaller than the other it clearly can be more selective. 3. The Marines have a quality control program that ensures only the best are retained. The USMC has a top 25% rule, this is why there are so many who former Marines, 75% only serve one tour of enlistment, only 25% are going to be able to serve as career Marines. This creates and corps that is a cut above, and ensures they are the most qualified. When you look at the reality of how they are created, trained and managed there is a lot to be admired. However when you look at the Braggadocios Smack Talking, and commitment to the USMC, only those who have been tested in fire can truly understand...I am not a Marine but have served beside some of the best and have had Gen Al Gray and Col Jerry Kelly as mentors and I will stand proud for the USMC any time and any place! DY

Response by PO3 Frank Johnson made Jun 24 at 2018 10:44 AM

PO3 Frank Johnson — Sun, 24 Jun 2018 10:44:32 -0400

Mostly it comes down to personal pride. Like Gunney Boggs said, being over weight and UNSAT, it's up to the individual to stay squared away. A superior shouldn't have to tell you to do that. Individual pride leads to unit pride and branch pride. You don't have to be a Marine to be transformed. Transform yourself and you'll inspire others to follow.

Response by CPT Ian Stewart made Jun 27 at 2018 2:25 PM

CPT Ian Stewart — Wed, 27 Jun 2018 14:25:24 -0400

I think the basic reason is that the Marines have a much stronger sense of tradition. Their non-tactical uniforms haven't change much since before WWII. The 1st, 2nd and 3rd Marine Divisions are still made up of the same regiments that fought the Japanese. Many of their support units (transport, supply, etc.) are still on the active rolls. The Corps doesn't putz around with their enlisted ranks, again few or no changes since WWII. I think you get my drift.
The Army on the other hand is in a constant state of flux. Units are constantly changing. Some go, others are converted from one branch to another (i.e. the 33rd Armored Regt (formally belonged to the 3rd Arm Div is now the 33rd Cavalry Regt. and is with the 101st Abn Div), still others are created new.
Since I retired in 1988, the Army's non-tactical uniform is about to go through its third iteration (Greens to Blues to Brown, (again)).
On the subject of enlisted ranks, I could write a book on the subject - the "Tech-ranks" of WWII, gone. The "Specialist" ranks come and except for Specialist (E-4), gone, Sergeant Major > Command Sgt. Maj > Sgt. Maj. of the Army. Oh, I mustn't forget the Warrant Officer ranks - they are now commissioned and have grown to 5 (WO 1 > MWO 5)
I understand the need to adjust and meet the requirements of changing missions and strategic challenges, but the Corps is able to adjust and meet those needs and keep its traditions. The Army would do well to learn from the Corps.

Response by SGT Tim Tobin made Jul 1 at 2018 9:39 AM

SGT Tim Tobin — Sun, 01 Jul 2018 09:39:56 -0400

My basic training took a punk kid and made him a soldier! I was able to concentrate on AIT and become the soldier I needed to become

Response by CWO2 Shelby DuBois made Jul 5 at 2018 8:57 AM

CWO2 Shelby DuBois — Thu, 05 Jul 2018 08:57:35 -0400

Because they aren't Marines.

Response by SPC Sheila Lewis made Jul 5 at 2018 9:12 AM

SPC Sheila Lewis — Thu, 05 Jul 2018 09:12:24 -0400

Unfortunately, that individual who signs to join the Army may little or no pride in themselves...we all bring our baggage from home.

Response by Robert Janisse made Jul 11 at 2018 1:02 PM

Robert Janisse — Wed, 11 Jul 2018 13:02:13 -0400

I think it has more to do with the draft as well. The inherent resentment of being drafted is drummed out of Marine recruits, not so much Army. So the gripe-culture is that much stronger in Army. How often do you hear, "It's a soldier's right to complain."? You never hear that from a Marine.

Response by Sgt Frank Staples made Jul 13 at 2018 12:45 AM

Sgt Frank Staples — Fri, 13 Jul 2018 00:45:42 -0400

When I'd been in for about a year and had two stripes and three ribbons I passed through an airport in North Carolina close to Camp LeJeune and a couple of shavetail enlistees engaged me in conversation while I was waiting for my wife to pick me up. They were absolutely in awe of my ribbons ( Nat. Defense, Marksman, and Outstanding Unit Award, as I recall ) and stated that they couldn't wait to get to Nam so they could kill some Cong and win the war. I was astounded but my wife who was from Pamlico County said that these were simply "the Marines". I never forgot their enthusiasm and hoped that they made it back home.

Response by PO1 Sharon Anderson made Jul 13 at 2018 7:37 AM

PO1 Sharon Anderson — Fri, 13 Jul 2018 07:37:01 -0400

Nope, they are not Marines and they don't adapt and overcome like a Marine...with little budget...and old equipment...but the Marines always get the job done...

A Navy Corpsman (Ret)

Response by PO1 Sharon Anderson made Jul 13 at 2018 7:39 AM

PO1 Sharon Anderson — Fri, 13 Jul 2018 07:39:07 -0400

Nope, they are not Marines...who adapt and overcome...with little budget and old equipment....but they STILL get the JOB DONE....

A Navy Corpsman (RET)

Response by Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen made Jul 15 at 2018 5:24 PM

Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen — Sun, 15 Jul 2018 17:24:15 -0400

Marines just have better PR, Army has just as much, if not more, pride.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jul 15 at 2018 5:42 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Sun, 15 Jul 2018 17:42:27 -0400

I wonder if deployments have an impact on morale.

Response by SSgt Mose Carter made Jul 18 at 2018 1:32 PM

SSgt Mose Carter — Wed, 18 Jul 2018 13:32:24 -0400

Marines are the literal "tip of the spear" of our fighting ground forces and need to exude ultimate pride and confidence needed to be effective. It's a mental state of mind. However, let's not forget all branches of the military exude confidence. I have served in the Air Force, naval Reserve and US Army National Guard. Pride is exhibited in all the units I have been in. Let's face it, it takes all of us working collectively to win a war.

Response by GySgt Mike Grow made Jul 19 at 2018 6:37 PM

GySgt Mike Grow — Thu, 19 Jul 2018 18:37:07 -0400

How each branch views their intangible benefits of service are directly linked to one's pride and service identity. What we see are differences rather than similarities that limit our objectivity.

Response by PO1 Todd McMillin made Jul 23 at 2018 6:52 AM

PO1 Todd McMillin — Mon, 23 Jul 2018 06:52:48 -0400

Not as "Brainwashed" to be obedient to orders. Ironically the movie "A Few Good Men" opened a lot of people's eyes to the way things were done and why we should have our moral compasses still in working order while in uniform vs blindly following our leaders. There's times when our leaders actions are immoral and unethical going against both the "Rule of Warfare" and "Global Treatise" that the USA signed as standing law. We can't have any leader in or out of uniform all willy-nilly decide to ignore those laws.

The Marines are broken down beyond what the Army, Navy, and Air Force does in rebuilding their people into warriors. While they often forget that unlike decades ago when it was join or go to prison this mostly is no longer the case. Of course that's changed again thanks to the lack of support for the military but also that the fact "Once weapons were manufactured to fight wars, now wars are manufactured to sell weapons"... As the Military has become a booming business of killing our fellow human being rather than helping to lift them up and make the world better.

Response by MSG Frank Kapaun made Jul 23 at 2018 9:19 AM

MSG Frank Kapaun — Mon, 23 Jul 2018 09:19:52 -0400

The major difference between the USMC and Army is that the Army focuses on individual achievement, whereas the USMC focuses on being a part of a group. The USMC also cannot do anything without a camera crew and journalist attached to every platoon.

Response by 1SG Leon Espe made Jul 27 at 2018 5:31 PM

1SG Leon Espe — Fri, 27 Jul 2018 17:31:42 -0400

The US Army I was in had pride in service, a quiet pride, not boastful but reliable even though about half were draftees. MY only experience with Marines was fighting along side of them at the Chosin Reservoir in Korea during late November and up to 10 December 1950 when ALL the Marines were evacuated and we Army Troops were sent back to our assigned units to continue on with the Evacuation of the area. The Marines I met were able fighters but we all were dedicated combat troops when fighting for our own life. The US Army troops were formed into Task Force Units to fight our way up to the Marines surrounded at the Chosin then fight our way back out along with the Marines. I met no Marine or Army Supermen during that battle. Those of us who survived it all gave that extra 10 per cent or we would not be alive today. One thing I do NOT understand. Some authors mention "retreat" at the Chosin. How in hell can you retreat when you are surrounded?

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 6 at 2018 5:08 PM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 06 Aug 2018 17:08:38 -0400

I do think empowerment and trust play a big factor in the pride of Marines. That, and the high expectation of the individule to perform within a small service branch. I think it’s the same with the Coast Guard. So much is expected of each member and we empower our petty officers at a very junior level. It’s not uncommon to have a PO2 as the skipper of his own small boat. We also have an active Chief’s mess to maintain pride and ensure we weed out non-performers and bad apples.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 6 at 2018 5:19 PM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 06 Aug 2018 17:19:37 -0400

I also think that part of the pride of Marines come from being elitist. They say up front that not everyone can do this. Only a few will make it. This is in a day where we don’t want anyone to feel left out. Each service branch has had to allow members into formerly elite units so others can feel good. The Marines have stuck to their guns and if you’re a Marine, you know you’ve passed the same standards as all those who went before you.

Response by AA Larry Kelly made Aug 6 at 2018 7:19 PM

AA Larry Kelly — Mon, 06 Aug 2018 19:19:19 -0400

Because the Army really wishes it were part of the Navy too.

Response by PO2 Steven Michaeli made Aug 9 at 2018 5:45 AM

PO2 Steven Michaeli — Thu, 09 Aug 2018 05:45:13 -0400

The USMC practices what the European militaries do - “Regimental Identity”. Different dress uniforms and unique accrutraments give them a better sense of pride. Even The Royal Green Jackets in England who are required to display a yellow ribbon as punishment for an act of regimental cowardice hundreds of years ago are taught a sense of pride in their unit’s colors and uniforms as they fight to have the yellow streamer removed

Response by SGT Harold Watson made Aug 11 at 2018 1:36 PM

SGT Harold Watson — Sat, 11 Aug 2018 13:36:22 -0400

Serving with an Army combat unit in Vietnam in 1968-69, I witnessed hardly no difference on the battlefield when it came to be a disciplined being a Marine or Army guy. I fought with Marines being with us, and we made one helluva great team! I can honestly say that when I joined the Army just after high school and just turning 18, I was a skinny kid that had hardly any strong muscles in my arms and legs....I could have never passed the physical testing in the Marines in Basic training, so that's why I went into the Army. In the Army, I passed Basic Training with flying colors but I think it was a lot easier compared to taking Basic in the Marines...But war experience sure makes the best of yourself whether Army or Marines....God Bless all of our Armed Services!

Response by MAJ A C made Aug 16 at 2018 10:06 AM

MAJ A C — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 10:06:02 -0400

I've always felt that the more strongly someone self-identifies with something is a reflection of how little they have outside of that identification. In all my dealings with Vets who're homeless, or addicts or jobless, etc, those that most strongly still self-identify with their military branch/service are those that have the least outside of it (and probably should have never left service!)

Though there's no one answer to your overly-broad question, I think this aspect has something to do with it as people who have so little with which to identify themselves as an individual search for that which gives them the strongest "communal" belonging, and the Marines (as well as the military in general) is very strong in that. It's a self-perpetuating principle.
A

Response by Pvt Robert L. Lamoreaux made Aug 17 at 2018 11:07 AM

Pvt Robert L. Lamoreaux — Fri, 17 Aug 2018 11:07:05 -0400

I am probably not "qualified" to give valid feedback on this, but as an Instructor (for two years) with a local Young Marines "detachment" (some 50 years after my "summer vacation" at MCRD PISC) - and I should add that we did not fully follow the organization's guidelines for "basic training" - I think that there is a unique "culture" that the Marine Corps instills. It begins by a couple of seemingly minor things: "tearing down individuality" - that is, "over-sensitivity" or, on the other hand, "arrogance" - and building confidence and pride both in self and in the unit. Some of the "tricks" are learning a new language (Marines use a lot of "naval terms" such as "head", "deck", aye-aye (meaning "I understand and will comply" - a more meaningful term than "yes, sir"). There are a lot of other subtle parts of training that inculcate "recruits" with the Marine Corps culture. Marines generally know, innately, the difference between "leadership" and "management". And, at least 50-years ago, "every Marine is a rifleman". Ultimate, while everyone who has served in our armed forces - God love them all - bleeds, Marines' bleed "Marine Corps green" blood.

Response by CPO Patrick King made Aug 17 at 2018 1:40 PM

CPO Patrick King — Fri, 17 Aug 2018 13:40:38 -0400

That's a good question, Discipline, much respect for how the history and respect is drilled into the Marines. I think I know more Marine corps history than Navy.

Response by SN Daniel Garibay made Aug 17 at 2018 7:48 PM

SN Daniel Garibay — Fri, 17 Aug 2018 19:48:38 -0400

The army has to get more saaured away first

Response by SPC Nick Bittner made Aug 25 at 2018 7:16 AM

SPC Nick Bittner — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 07:16:26 -0400

Yeah the Army doesn't have time to worry that much about itself, it's too busy dealing with everyone elses crap.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 25 at 2018 7:19 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 25 Aug 2018 07:19:34 -0400

Because we let our standards go to shit.

Response by CW4 Russ Hamilton (Ret) made Sep 3 at 2018 2:13 AM

CW4 Russ Hamilton (Ret) — Mon, 03 Sep 2018 02:13:35 -0400

LOL, I've heard Marines say the exact opposite - in private. I also think it's because they are a smaller element our government has tended to abuse due to "appearances." I've only been in one unit in my 40 yrs that didn't have exceptional pride and that was because of piss poor leadership. Overall I think this concept is over exaggerated.

Response by 1SG Clifford Barnes made Sep 9 at 2018 11:38 AM

1SG Clifford Barnes — Sun, 09 Sep 2018 11:38:42 -0400

I think we do we all just show it in different ways

Response by SGT John Lawrence made Sep 13 at 2018 10:22 AM

SGT John Lawrence — Thu, 13 Sep 2018 10:22:45 -0400

I think the answer to this is: do I have pride in myself? We look at the Marines pride and that comes from there training and what they do when it comes to a battle. Today's Army to me is so lax, I mean when I entered the Army in 1971 it was drilled into us that when you travel either by leave or TDY you traveled in your dress greens, sure we took a lot of hits from the public, baby killer to spitting at us and I even was escorted from a airport once because we were considered scum and lower than dirt so for me that made me stronger and more proud of that uniform. I never traveled in civilian clothes so that pride comes from within each individual for your branch of service.

Response by SGT Ronald Audas made Sep 21 at 2018 3:26 PM

SGT Ronald Audas — Fri, 21 Sep 2018 15:26:47 -0400

I grew up watching the Marines glorified on the Movie screen.Though I was drafted into the Army,I never lost the glitter of the Marines. Don't get me wrong.I'm Army all the way. Though all branches teach pride in unit history,I went in at a time when priorities were a little different.In 1966,it was assumed that everyone was going to Nam. Most of our training was by E5's and 6's. that had just returned. Not much talk of Army pride or history.

Response by SPC Jaime Gomez made Sep 26 at 2018 7:48 AM

SPC Jaime Gomez — Wed, 26 Sep 2018 07:48:12 -0400

The size and diversity of missions that the Army is tasked with might have something to do with this issue. Army basic training is about getting the man power levels up to par. Don't get me wrong I love my Army. Just pointing out that from the onset there exists a difference in goals and philosophy.

Response by A1C Joseph Harty made Sep 27 at 2018 7:34 AM

A1C Joseph Harty — Thu, 27 Sep 2018 07:34:30 -0400

It is a civilian question, everyone that serves automatically puts themselves in harm's way for something bigger than themselves with selflessness, civilians cannot comprehend.

Response by 1LT Erin Berg made Sep 27 at 2018 11:19 AM

1LT Erin Berg — Thu, 27 Sep 2018 11:19:29 -0400

Just posing a question; not looking to be rabidly attacked: Are you absolutely certain that just because you hear verbal complaints, that there isn't still a deep core of pride of service running through the Army?

Response by Cpl Greg Rock made Sep 28 at 2018 4:09 AM

Cpl Greg Rock — Fri, 28 Sep 2018 04:09:53 -0400

I'm an "Army brat;" my father was a soldier for 31 years, I spent all but two years of my childhood growing up on a succession of Army bases, surrounded by soldiers and Army culture. I also did 4 years in the Corps; my older brother is a career Marine officer who just started his 31st years in the Corps. And I keep up with my former shipmates through the technological wonder of social media.

For openers: I wouldn't read too much into the 'bitching" thing. Marines bitch about anything and everything, *especially* "field Marines." It's just a "thing" with troops, especially when out on a field op where it seems like everything-- God, fate, Mother Nature-- has it in for you (and that's usually how it feels). Then again, you could send a company of "field Marines" on a Carnival Cruise to Cabo San Lucas, and rest assured, they'd find some s**t to complain about.

But rarely is it grounded in genuine enmity; it's just the only thing you can do. I mean, it's not as if you can just say "F**k this job, I quit!' (Well, you can, but you'll most likely end up in jail for awhile). Bitching, dark humor, and cigarettes are the only coping mechanisms a "field Marine" has, and it's so pervasive, that one of the symptoms of a serious morale problem is when everyone is *NOT* pissing and moaning about everything. Marines who go through the NCO academy are taught "A bitchy Marine is a happy Marine," and if everyone is just moping around silently, then it immediately falls to you to start shaking them up and getting them re-focused.

As for the Army having "less pride," I wouldn't say it's quite that. The Army is a *much* larger service, with a greater breadth of specialties; as such, soldiers tend to be a bit more tribal. Soldiers can have just as much pride in what they do as any Marine, but their sense of identity is usually rooted first in their MOS, and then as soldiers; soldiers see themselves as grunts/tankers/technicians/logisticians/aircraft mechanics first, and members of the Army second. It's further manifested in their uniforms (as it is with the Navy and the Air Force); distinctive collar devices, unit flashes, shoulder patches that ID both MOS *and* unit membership, shoulder braids, and in some cases different boots and headgear (i.e. berets). Army Rangers, when they wear a soft cover in lieu of a beret, have a distinctive way of wearing it called a "Ranger roll."

The Marine Corps is, by virtue of it's role and mandate within the US Armed Forces, is comparatively much smaller; it has the luxury of being selective. It also makes it much easier to establish a common culture and collective identity; Marines aren't tribal, because the Marine Corps *IS* the tribe. From Day #1 of boot camp, all aspiring Marines have it hammered into them they are all grunt riflemen before anything else; I'd say that's a big part of it. Every Marine, whether the tool of his trade is an M-4 or a typewriter, must requalify every year with the rifle, running the same qualification course with the same standards; moreoever, your level of qualification (Marksman, Sharpshooter, Expert) factors significantly into your eligibility for promotion, even if you only touch a rifle once a year (to qualify with it) by virtue of your job.

The Marine uniform-- be it "ODs" or dress blues-- is very spartan, and identical across the Corps; if you look at a Marine in uniform, all you can tell right away is their name, rank, and that they're a Marine-- period. If it's a dress uniform, the only additional things you know is how long they've been in and what they've been doing in that time based on their ribbon bars.

Back when I was in, you didn't even have "name;" your utility uniform had rank insignia and a black iron-on decal denoting your membership in the Corps. If you ever asked some old lifer why the Marine Corps didn't have name tapes on their utilities, the typical answer was "Who gives a s**t what your name is? You're a Marine, that's good enough. If I want you to do something, I'll just say 'HEY!! MARINE!!" and tell you what to do."

If you asked why no Marine units had berets: "Why the f**k would you want to wear some silly-assed French hat? Berets are used in the other services to denote membership in an elite unit; being a Marine *automatically* makes you a member of an elite unit! That ought to be good enough."

I think another significant factor is that the Marine Corps, relative to the other branches, is absolutely *zealous* about preserving and passing on it's lore, history, traditions, great battles, and notable alumni. Marines are given hours and hours of classroom instruction on that stuff during recruit training, and often subjected to "pop quizzes" by their Drill Instructors. At any moment, a DI may ambush a recruit with some trivia question like "Who were the two Marines that were twice awarded the Medal Of Honor?"; woe betide that recruit if he doesn't have the answer in an instant. If you make it into the Corps, you can still be hit with such questions during formal inspections and meritorious promotion boards. Which I'm pretty sure is why I still know the answer to that one, without even have to think about it, 30 years after Parris Island, and 26 years since last I had a compelling reason to even care.

I believe that further reinforces an all-encompassing sense of identity and commonality, not to mention shared history; it practically re-sequences your DNA into some new helix only Marines have. Sometimes, I can meet a guy for the first time, and in a few minutes begin picking up subtle clues-- i.e. how they dress, how they carry themselves, affectations of their speech-- and figure out the guy is a fellow former Jarhead; I've had other former Jarheads read me the same way. Once established, we're often like two brothers who've not seen each other in awhile.

And it can come in quite handy. My favorite example: I was once having dinner at some swank-tacular five-star steak house on the other side of the river from Cincinnati, and the maître d'hôtel asked me about my Marine Corps tie bar; I still have the one I wore with my dress uniform, and usually wear it when I wear a tie. It tends to be a detail that only other Marines pick up on right away.

I told him I'd spent a few years in the Corps, and he produces a "challenge coin" from his pocket emblazoned with the logo for the 5th Marine Regiment.

Yes, that's right: the the maître d'hôtel at the Chez Whitey Frou-Frou steakhouse was a grunt rifleman in the Marine Corps in a previous life. A few amicable words later, and he was hooking us up with a free bottle of wine and creme brulee for dessert. Go figure.

Response by LCpl Sandy Moran made Sep 28 at 2018 3:41 PM

LCpl Sandy Moran — Fri, 28 Sep 2018 15:41:43 -0400

I agree. My son joined the ARMY to make a career for it. Because he was looking for togetherness unity, and pride. What he found is E4s and above not caring using their rank to have fun at the PVTs. expense. He believes they just want the pay check [E6s] The SSGT. He has now will not let the Sgts. take them too the gym oe train in hand to hand on down time, so they sit around waiting for quitting time to go back too quarters. unless the SSGT volunteers them for clean up duty at another work station on base. He has lost his desire to make a career of it. His pride right now is lost.

m

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 28 at 2018 11:17 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 28 Sep 2018 23:17:47 -0400

I. From what I've seen since I left, Army pride seems (from the outside looking back in), to have improved dramatically in the Army since I was in. The Army's marketing/branding seems to have gotten a bit better. I am glad to see it.
II. The USMC seems to have a much higher priority on marketing and branding than the Army, and it seems to me, perhaps out of ignorance on my part, that this is from the USMC being keenly aware of its apparent similarity to the Army and therefore perceiving a need to differentiate and maintain broad-based public support to ward off any attempt to merge the two.
III. The Army is gigantic. So, serving in the Army seems "less unique" than serving in the Marine Corps.

Answer-to-Follow-Up: The Army is so humongous and covers such a wide swath of subject matter in its competencies that it would really had to develop the same sense of identity that the USMC has developed. If I had the job of trying to do it, though, I would draw upon the most clearly resounding periods in U.S. Army history, the most universally-impressive of which I think is probably WW2 in the mind of the public. Even the most left-leaning millennial is likely to agree with fighting the Nazis with great ferocity. The Marines make use of their history of having a good reputation with the public - it's like a reputation based on reputation. By leveraging history, the Army could try to get similar mileage.

UPDATE to Follow-Up: For increasing pride internally, reduce the amount of Soldier time spent doing details unrelated to their unit mission. Soldiers have a special job. Don't use them in peacetime like a landscaping crew that can throw hand grenades in the unlikely event of a war. Train for war, not for landscaping or crossing guard duty or picking up unwanted furniture in the housing areas. If Soldiers are treated like skilled professionals, they will see themselves that way.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 30 at 2018 11:56 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 23:56:27 -0400

I would love to have one dress uniform that we take pride in, for one.

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 4 at 2018 10:14 AM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 04 Oct 2018 10:14:33 -0400

Lack of heritage. Removal of tradition.

Response by PFC Jubal Spencer made Oct 12 at 2018 8:29 PM

PFC Jubal Spencer — Fri, 12 Oct 2018 20:29:40 -0400

The pride is there. Just not exemplified as much. Via the entertainment industry and advertising. We don't see much in way of the common soldier in movies. The Be All You Can Be slogan is weak. But The Few The Proud The Marines. says something the Be All You Can Be is the common Soldier our the Few The Proud are the Special forces ie. Ranger, Airborne, Green beret or Delta Force. All separate within one. but when you hear Air Force we think of Aircraft. Navy In the 80's we we thought of Aircraft Submarines. Now think of the Navy we see Seal Team Six not Battle Ships. all because of ticket sales and television ratings. The Pride is there for all branches but the Marines Advertising is directed to the branch not a particular job/group within the Branch.

Response by CPT Wallace Ward made Oct 31 at 2018 7:49 PM

CPT Wallace Ward — Wed, 31 Oct 2018 19:49:27 -0400

Oh boy. Here comes this old stupid argument. The Army has lots of pride. Deeds Not Words. We are all great Americans. We are all full of pride. We all do our jobs.

Response by SP6 Anthony Castaneda made Nov 4 at 2018 3:02 AM

SP6 Anthony Castaneda — Sun, 04 Nov 2018 03:02:12 -0500

Because the Marines are assault, and the Army is a 9 to 5 meat grinder.
We get up, go to work, shell the fuck out of the enemy, advance, and setup camp.
Lather, rinse, and repeat.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Nov 4 at 2018 6:48 PM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Sun, 04 Nov 2018 18:48:23 -0500

We do, we just don't take it to the "Heaven's Gate" cult like level the Marines do ;o)

Real talk though, I served in the Marines long enough to know the dirty secret... While Marines are amongst the other services, or after they get out, yeah, they're all about espirit de corps, "we love the Marines, Rah, Rah"...
But while they are still in, and only Marines are around? They do nothing but HATE the Marines and shit talk it at every opportunity. I believe the colloquial phrase was "eat the apple, fuck the corps" if I recall correctly? No one hates the Marine Corps more than young Marines ;o)

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 4 at 2018 11:30 PM

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 04 Nov 2018 23:30:30 -0500

My answer to the follow up question is no because our actual objectives and philosophies are not identical while some of our tasks are.

Interestingly I reading This Kind of War about Korea and the author just mentioned the Army receiving criticism after WWII that caused it to compromise for social approval and specifically that the Corps got to stay as it was because the Army was in the crosshairs not the Corps. Unfortunately he did not specify what external pressures he was saying the Army faced.

Response by SGT Ernest Huerta made Nov 6 at 2018 11:32 AM

SGT Ernest Huerta — Tue, 06 Nov 2018 11:32:30 -0500

The Marines, to my knowledge (and with no offense intended to the rest), have always stressed "Esprit de Corps" , their History and the pride and honor of serving in an Elite Assault Branch. Disicpline and self-respect are a requirement and not an expectation. The Army Airborne, Special Forces, Rangers and other such units are to be considered Elite Forces.

Response by COL Bob Hammons made Nov 9 at 2018 1:44 PM

COL Bob Hammons — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 13:44:37 -0500

CSM, I think Soldiers are every bit as proud as any Marine, but I think where you are off track is in the scale of the units you are talking about. The Marine Corps is a corps, about the same size as 18th Airborne Corps, and I don't think there are any Paratroopers less proud than any Marine. The problem with identifying with Big Army (of which you are a part) is the Army is organized at Division level. We wear Division patches, we have Division organizations, we identify as members of a Division, not a Corps or Army, or Unified Command. I am a Marne Man (Third Infantry Division (Mech)), I learned the words to the Division song before I leaned the words to the Army song. Personally, I wouldn't give a bean to be a fancy pants Marine. Divisions are the front line of combat units. HQ (Big Army) is where all the REMFs reside, I identify as an Infantryman in 3ID, not a REMF in Big Army, and that is why you do not see Soldiers identifying with Big Army, but with the Divisions they fight in. I have a son who identifies as a Special Forces Operator and another son who identifies as a Paratrooper. One associates himself with 10th SF Group and the other with 173rd Airborne. Each is extremely proud of who they are and the units they identify with, as I am with Mechanized Infantry and 3ID.

Also, unlike the Marines and some of the other services, we do not train as a general purpose Soldier, you go through Basic Training/Advanced Individual Training, or now called OSUT as an Infantryman, a Tanker, a Signalman, or other specialty for the most part. So while Marine Basic trains Marines, at Fort Benning I trained Infantrymen or as they call them now Warriors.

Response by SSG Doug Terrel made Nov 9 at 2018 7:13 PM

SSG Doug Terrel — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 19:13:48 -0500

No offense, but you're kind of myopic for a senior leader. Maybe you should look at YOUR LEADERSHIP to figure out why your soldiers don't have pride in the Army.

Response by SrA John Monette made Nov 9 at 2018 7:15 PM

SrA John Monette — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 19:15:51 -0500

the real answer is: because neither of them are the Air Force!!!!

Response by SGT Chester Beedle made Nov 21 at 2018 1:17 AM

SGT Chester Beedle — Wed, 21 Nov 2018 01:17:15 -0500

Marine don't have that universal pride though. They put on a solid front when an outsider talks smack, so I guess that that way they do.
But if you talk to some, they will start talking shit about other regiments. And of course 03xx versus everyone else.

Response by LCpl Cody Collins made Nov 21 at 2018 8:11 PM

LCpl Cody Collins — Wed, 21 Nov 2018 20:11:18 -0500

I served in the Marine Corps from 79 to 88 and every single day , That I served in a Marine Corps the Marines constantly promoted the Marine Corps history, Esprit de Corps, Pride in the Marine Corpse in your uniform and in yourself as a Marine . Marine Corps history is constantly talked about and promoted within the rank and file. Motivational signs about the Marines are everywhere on a Marine Corps base in the barracks in the head every office everywhere you go. Also the Marines do not lay Hollywood just make any type of movie or TV show the picketing the Marine Corps a bunch of goof balls with the exception of Gomer pyle USMC. The Marine Corps protects its Image To the Ninth degree. And when a Marine Corps does allow Hollywood to make A TV show such as (jag). Whatever Actor or actress is playing a Marine Corps officer or enlisted personnel . believe me that uniform and Marine Corps attitude is reflected perfectly.
There's this constant training of Marine Corps pride in Marine Corps history and Marine Corps warfare that goes on consciously and sub consciously throughout your tour of duty as a United States marine.
Maybe the army needs to emphasize is history and drill into their soldier the future soldiers and officers so they can have more pride and what though that came before them did for their country. Hollywood make movies at the picket the army as a bunch of buffoons or Undisciplin'd P.O.S. I think people that enlist in the army and the Air Force going with the mentality that the work is not near as hard or doesn't take as much dedication to succeed then it does in the Marine Corps in the navy, Some instances the navy has it over the Marine Corps. Maybe the army needs to rethink its training syllabus and instill more pride in their soldiers and not look to cut back on discipline just to get numbers.

Response by SPC Donn Sinclair made Nov 26 at 2018 6:19 AM

SPC Donn Sinclair — Mon, 26 Nov 2018 06:19:47 -0500

Doubtful, due to the size of the communities in question. When I was in, ('69-'71), we were told that upon completion of BCT, we were qualified to be replacements in a rifle platoon. However, when assigned to support AIT's, the warfighter spirit and attitude was downplayed, even put on the back burner, ("You're not infantry, your MOS is fill-in-the-blank"). Instead of focusing on what the Army's primary function is, it becomes an 8a-5p job, (no weekends or holidays), in BDU's. Every few years, the Army Commandant professes to change all that, reinstill the warfighter spirit throughout the Army. Not holding my breath.

Response by GySgt Richard Morrison made Nov 28 at 2018 12:49 AM

GySgt Richard Morrison — Wed, 28 Nov 2018 00:49:54 -0500

I truly don't think that they care about their branch as much as we Marines do about the Corps. Case in point. When I was stationed at the Marine Detachment, U.S. Disciplinary Barracks, Ft. Leavenworth, KS some of the soldiers from the Army side of the house came to us and asked us for help in setting up their celebration for the Army Birthday. Evidently they had never celebrated it in quite the same style as we Marines and wanted our guidance and expertise. So we gave them our assistance.

Response by CW4 Craig Urban made Dec 9 at 2018 7:18 PM

CW4 Craig Urban — Sun, 09 Dec 2018 19:18:38 -0500

Once a marine always a marine. The army does not take this attitude 100 percent.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 10 at 2018 9:51 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 10 Dec 2018 09:51:37 -0500

The USMC has the best brainwashing and marketing of all branches. The entire Marine Corps is smaller than just the Army Reserve yet USMC merchandise sales (stickers, hats, shirts, mugs, posters, etc.) rivals Army sales and there are far more Army Soldiers (currently serving and veterans), than Marines.

The USMC is so small and the turnover is so high, that it is easier to retell more tales with heroic pride and eliminate things that are unwanted or embarrassing. They are able to stay on message and indoctrinate their members far better than the other services. There is also a personal pride and near universal peer pressure that embraces and emboldens "Semper Fidelis". This is often reinforced daily in their customs, traditions, and service mythology. Marines are often required to memorize and repeat their mythology at various schools and selection boards. It is also a point of individual pride to out do other Marines in being able to recall or recite the more obscure aspects of USMC trivia/lore.

Every service has it's own mythology, legends, and fairy tales, but the extent that Marines as a whole seem to believe the tales appears to be far greater than in the other services. Explaining to a Marine that one of their fairy tales isn't true is sort of like telling a kid that Santa isn't real.

Take the tale of "blood stripes" as an example. Every Marine is taught that the “blood stripe,” commemorates Marines killed in the battle of Chapultepec in 1847. However, the reality is that the wearing of stripes on the trousers pre-dates the battle. In fact, Marine Corps trousers from as far back as the 1790s had red welts and piping down the outer seams. I believe only one Marine NCO was killed in the battle too.

https://www.usmcmuseum.com/lore-of-the-corps.html
https://taskandpurpose.com/everything-know-marine-corps-uniform-wrong/
https://archive.org/stream/MarineCorpsLore#mode/2up

Lore of the Corps

Starting in boot camp, all Marines study the actions of those who have served before them. The history of the Marine Corps is a rich tapestry weaving together the contributions of all Marines. Over...

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 10 at 2018 10:17 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 10 Dec 2018 10:17:05 -0500

"I would like to hear thoughts as to why Soldiers seems to talk bad or dislike the service that I love." The Army is a giant bureaucracy that often hypocritically contradicts itself and can't even agree how to wear a patrol cap. There are numerous Soldiers that don't know regulations or simply ignore the regulations that try to implement "one size fits all" policies that screw over Soldiers in the name of reducing the staff's workload. Slang and obsolete terminology often dominates over official nomenclature and current terminology making it nearly impossible for Soldiers to find information in doctrine. The reasons Soldiers dislike the Army are plenty; not to mention all the BS like this: https://taskandpurpose.com/mattis-niger-ambush-blame/

The Pentagon Scapegoated Junior Officers For The Niger Ambush. Then Mattis Got Involved

The Department of Defense last month did an about-face on the punishments handed down to members of the Green Beret team deemed responsible for the deadly Oct. 4, 2017, ambush in Niger

Response by SSG Jason Trammell made Dec 25 at 2018 2:48 AM

SSG Jason Trammell — Tue, 25 Dec 2018 02:48:58 -0500

By the time I retired, I had already noticed that soldiers dont take pride in their service, they more or less treat it like a job and a place to get off the streets of America. I often seen way to many soldiers who shouldn't have been progressing as fast as they should have, but, when your drinking and hanging out with your NCO'S in your off time... well, I think I am making my point. Either way, their is no Army wide pride in service and NCO's are not upholding standards of the look of soldiers... Hair that is not regulation, uniforms that are to big and sagging, etc. Until soldiers are held to standard there will never be the pride of service like the Marine Corps.

Response by SPC Earl Semler made Dec 27 at 2018 2:57 PM

SPC Earl Semler — Thu, 27 Dec 2018 14:57:48 -0500

Army has pride in their branch and unit especially in the units or branch history. The Army also doesn't have a very inspirational song like the Marines.

Response by 1SG Clifford Barnes made Jan 2 at 2019 7:23 PM

1SG Clifford Barnes — Wed, 02 Jan 2019 19:23:14 -0500

Yes we have the same pride and Hooah the marines do. I have worked with all the services We all have good and bad but I will put my Soldiers against any other service. It’s the attitude and good and bad Hooah

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 3 at 2019 4:53 PM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 03 Jan 2019 16:53:43 -0500

The major difference between the USMC and US Army In pride the difference in the way the marines carry on their daily business on/off work. They have esprit de corps more than any other service it has always been that way. The marines have a very stringent standards on who will “hang out” or be together unless at official functions by rank. They have lines on what ranks will hang out with each other-as you become more senior they expect you to not fraternize with the junior ranks. They have always been that way especially with their enlisted. I am sure that is part of the reasons they do not have the problems when someone even a rank above them tells them to do something at duty there is not a debate about why, let’s talk etc. they do it. Retired Navy loved working with marines rank structure well defined. More services need this. Navy Chiefs are very much life this do not cross a Chiefs mess unless asked in. Love honor and tradition.

Response by PO3 Robert Stoneking made Jan 4 at 2019 8:24 PM

PO3 Robert Stoneking — Fri, 04 Jan 2019 20:24:39 -0500

The honor of the regiment has been an Army thing since at least the Civil War and possibly since it's founding. Elementis Regamus Proelium

Response by PFC Charles Sanders made Jan 9 at 2019 10:36 PM

PFC Charles Sanders — Wed, 09 Jan 2019 22:36:53 -0500

Just because the Army's indoctrination involves less of it's own cheerleading and doesn't promote a cult mentality among it's members doesn't mean we're not proud of our branch.

Response by MSgt Walter Clack made Jan 12 at 2019 2:48 PM

MSgt Walter Clack — Sat, 12 Jan 2019 14:48:05 -0500

Sorry guys, But when You're the Finest it's hard to be humble. Semper Fi

Response by LCpl Michael Cappello made Jan 13 at 2019 2:25 PM

LCpl Michael Cappello — Sun, 13 Jan 2019 14:25:35 -0500

I wrote this response regarding another topic. ("I've always known to salute Warrant Officers. Now I hear that we don't need to. Am I missing something?") I believe it is also appropriate here. Here is that reply.
It never ceases to amaze me. Why oh why is it almost ALWAYS the Army? If there is a question regarding military protocol, uniform regs, basic frigging common sense, etc... it seems like it always has something to do with the Army. I do realize that no other branch of the military is as strict, as rigid, and as uncompromising as the Marine Corps. But, the Army seems to be a glaring example of non conformity. How in the hell do "soldiers" graduate boot camp if they do not possess the "BASIC" knowledge required to exist in the military? Until I joined this site and was exposed to this level of stupidity, I thought making fun of the Army was just Esprit De Corps. It now seems to me that, for the most part, the Army is one huge cluster f**k.

Response by 1SG Patrick Sims made Jan 20 at 2019 4:11 PM

1SG Patrick Sims — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 16:11:10 -0500

I did a stretch in the Marines as a tanker and retired from the Army as a 1st Sergeant in an armor company. When I switched to the Army the first thing I noticed was many needed a haircut, their uniforms weren't as snappy looking as the Corps, and they couldn't march with a shit-----But they had their MOS down cold. They were infinitely better in their field skills than most Marines I knew. So, don't sell the Army short. There may be a lot less ou--rah, but their pretty good at kicking ass.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 27 at 2019 6:55 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 27 Jan 2019 18:55:10 -0500

Absolutely with personal responsibility, from my own experience in the corps if you mess up you mess up not your chain of command in the Army we but blame everywhere but the individual just like the responsibility of accountability it is everyone not the individual adult. (Just my thoughts.)

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 27 at 2019 7:52 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 27 Jan 2019 19:52:32 -0500

With all due respect... I believe this question is disrespectful, prejudice, and uninformed. The premise of the question perpetuates the notion that one area of our service can be better than the others; we all know that's bull. The Marines are a combat arms monoculture type organization where it's realitively easy to get that prejudiced response from their members, without them realizing they have to rely on many others for "their survival". Think about that for awhile. To some degree the answer some gave here: that Marines are a cult, is true. I respectively submit this attitude isn't good for the Country. PS: I have several friends who are Marines, one is deceased, and is my best friend.

Response by SGM Frederic Smith made Jan 28 at 2019 9:05 AM

SGM Frederic Smith — Mon, 28 Jan 2019 09:05:27 -0500

Because...It has become a "mute issue" and treated like a "non-essential" subject because it "interferes" with "mission" goals and purpose!
I have been retired for 6 years, finishing a career from "75 - 13". Even though there was a "moral" issue coming out of a "Vietnam" issue, the "pride" issue was not a problem where I was.
As a "Senior NCO" (E7-9) I pressed for "Heritage, Customs and Courtesy" along with mission, schedules and the "I'm a Combat Soldier" mentality.
Those coming up through the ranks during the last 17 yrs of the "Global War" have repressed the need to "instill Pride in all their subordinates"! The only pride these leaders had or have was the pride they could get pinned on their ASUs!
"If there is not "History, Heritage, Pride and Purpose" given or directed toward those we "Senior NCO" lead, we will not have the "Pride" that is equal to that of the other services! "TEACH THE JUNIOR NCOs"!

Response by Cpl Bernard Bates made Jan 28 at 2019 4:46 PM

Cpl Bernard Bates — Mon, 28 Jan 2019 16:46:15 -0500

No for several reasons. A certain type of person enlists in the Marine Corp. The psychology at Boot Camp is different. You are made tough mentally an physically in Boot Camp. You are taught the History of the corp. All this is taught to every Marine regardless of Mos. Because every Marine is Basically a Rifleman. All Marines are brothers. Even the paratroops and Rangers don't understand Marine Pride When I was stationed at Camp Lejune I would take a bus from my home in Ohio and It would stop at Ft. Bragg and I would have to change Buses. Sometimes I would spend a few hrs. in the Bus Station At Ft. Bragg. I had my Marine Green Uniform on, I was only A PFC., The Guys that were in the paratroops would always ask me a lot of questions about the Corp. They respected the Marines. The Marines only Have one role. They are the tip of the spear. The army was like a 9 to 5 Job for a lot of people. The discipline was lax. People didn't want to go to schools when they were offered. The Army had a specialist rank from E-4 t0 E-9 at one time because they reckonized not everyone is a leader. After the Vietnam war they dropped all the specialists ranks except Sp/4. In the Marine Corp everyone is expected to be a leader, From Pvt.to Pfc. and on up. It always next man up. I was in the Corp from 59 to 63 and in the army from 63 to66. Semper fi.

Response by Robyn Morrow made Jan 29 at 2019 11:34 AM

Robyn Morrow — Tue, 29 Jan 2019 11:34:31 -0500

The army has its rank n file. Anything less than an E5 basically is treated poorly. However each group is definitely a product of leadership. The unit, the squad, the platoon, the battalion. They are broke down into smaller groups. That way the training is more concentrated. Weapons, radios, navigation , etc etc.
The upper leadership does have its dumb asses. The ones with huge attitude in the sense of I am god you are a lowly peon. Retaliation is high especially if a higher rank screws up and the lower ranks shows the error. Instead of hey gee thanks, it’s more of I’ll show you type of attitude. Each group or subgroup either has a leader of sorts that either cares alot about training them really well or others that do nothing to help them improve.
My son is army. I always tell him treat them in a leadership role but you don’t have to be an ass about it. People learn at different rates. Some may need you to go over it a few times. Once you take the time to teach them they will respect you more and work harder for you.

Response by SPC Burke Easter made Jan 29 at 2019 10:57 PM

SPC Burke Easter — Tue, 29 Jan 2019 22:57:02 -0500

The U.S. Army and Marine Corps are not like things at all. The Army is massive compared to the Marine Corps, which is literally Naval Infantry and support. The Army is to big and impersonal, and to comprehensive. The Army doesn't just train Soldiers but train all members of all branches, sometimes making it hard to tell where the US Armed Forces ends and the Army begins. But the Army has plenty to be proud of for the educated and informed soldier, a history that can't be matched. But smaller organizations always have a greater sense of identity and brotherhood. That being said, in the Army extreme pride usually comes along the lines of Regimental affiliation, something alien to the Marines. My first Regiment was the 9th Infantry Regiment, Manchus, the Regimental name taken from the fact the Regiment took down the last Chinese Dynasty in history, the Manchu Dynasty, at the turn of the last century. Something every 9th Infantry Regiment Soldier held with special pride. The 9th Infantry Regiment was also deployed along the Korean DMZ as far north and closest to the DMZ southern barrier fence than any other infantry unit in the Army or Marine Corp. It wasn't Marines who patrolled inside the DMZ but Soldiers of the 2ID and 9th Infantry Regiment. Manchu soldiers even had special uniform designs marking them separate from the all other service members in Korea and the 8th Army. Now the 2ID had other Regiments that also patrolled the DMZ as well, and most all soldiers of those regiments felt the same about their regiments as the Manchus did about theirs. What regiment was the best was the kind of thing soldiers would get into bar fights over, again, something other service members outside Army combat arms wouldn't understand. And I can assure you no Army Infantry soldier I ever knew saw the Marines as elite or better than the soldiers of their own regiment, honestly, they would laugh at the very idea. Infantry Soldiers of the Army's 187th Infantry Regiment, Rakassans, would look at Marines as rookies. I know this may come as a shock to many Marines and even AF or Navy veterans but having been a Rakassan as well, I can personally attest to this. Amd this is how it should be, no soldier who didn't think he represented the best fighting ground forces in the world would be worth his salt. And trust me, be they Manchus, or Rakassans, or 504 PIR Devil in Baggy Pants with the 82nd Airborne, they all honestly believed they were the best ground fighting force in the world. I can't speak for all Army Infantry as I was never Mechanized, but I know the Infantry Regiments of those divisions have equally prestigious histories such as The Rock of the Marne Regiment. So it isn't that the Army doesn't have as much pride as the Marines, its just many service members don't understand the Army. As myself an Army Infantry soldier I looked at Marine non-Infantry personnel just like I did Army non-Infantry personnel, that they were weak POGs that couldn't hang with me. And as far as Marine Infantry went, my opinion was, until you can come to my unit and hang, and out road march me, out PT me, out run me and hump more weight than I could, you weren't shit. That was the typical attitude I remember from the units I served in anyway. I know Marines have alot of pride in their Globe and Anchor symbol, but I'd never trade my blue cord or any of my regimental crests for it. That is how alot of Army feels about being Army.

Response by Cpl Reggie McDaniel made Jan 31 at 2019 12:47 PM

Cpl Reggie McDaniel — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 12:47:14 -0500

I believe it comes down to 3 things Military barring, earning your rank and respect, both self respect as well as respect for any rank senior to the individual soldiers current rank. I know a Soldier whom was promoted to Sgt. In only 2 years. I asked this soldier did he feel that he was proficient enough to be able to answer any technical questions pertaining to his MOS and did he feel he had the experience to confidently lead and make difficult decisions in battle. His answer was No. So why are they just giving away rank with out proving that the individual is deserves it and working hard to earn it?
While I was in Iraq with 6th Marines in 2007 my unit transferred some Comm equipment to an Army unit in Baharia. While I as a Corporal was speaking with an Army PFC the Army Sgt Major came walking up, I quickly gave him the proper greeting of the day and acknowledged his rank. The Army PFC walked up to him and gave him a hand shake like boys on back on the block asking him "what's Crackin Sarge" the Sgt Major then engaged this PFC as if they were best friends it blew my mind. I as a Corporal would not even speak to a Staff Sergeant like that. At that point in time my view of the Army was forever obscured.

Response by SGT Scott Henderson made Jan 31 at 2019 4:13 PM

SGT Scott Henderson — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 16:13:18 -0500

Because we aren't brainwashed into thinking we're the greatest thing this side of indoor plumbing?

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 1 at 2019 10:22 AM

CSM Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 01 Feb 2019 10:22:47 -0500

It is a culture of immersion for the Marine Corps. Their basic is all about fundamentals of being a Marine and the history and lineage of the Corps. It’s followed by Combat training. I believe the Army needs to adopt some of the cultural immersion beyond the “prodlfwssion of arms”. As a Garrison CSM I observe Soldiers from all 3 components of the Army training in garrison and the field. I would present my coin to a Soldier if he could tell me the history and lineage of his/her patch. Much to my chagrin few had a clue. Units can help build Army pride by ensuring Soldiers understand what the unit patch represents. It would be a start. Also, The Corps is all about the Corps - no unit patch or DUI.

Response by CPL Christopher Trafnik made Feb 1 at 2019 5:22 PM

CPL Christopher Trafnik — Fri, 01 Feb 2019 17:22:09 -0500

Response by SPC Keith Rayeski made Feb 2 at 2019 1:04 AM

SPC Keith Rayeski — Sat, 02 Feb 2019 01:04:25 -0500

I don't sweat it...what branch any one chooses to join, it's based on that persons mental comprehension of what that branch has to offer. I had a grandfather post WWI that was Army. I had four uncles in WWII...2 marines and 2 Army.....one of the Army uncles lost a leg at the Bulge. There was no competitiveness between the 4 brothers, even after the war. My father was 21 years Navy...three PBR tours in Nam and a destroyer tour during the Korean war. Me, I was Army. I then retired from the NH state police as a trooper with 24 years. And the real pride I have, the real bragging rights I claim, are my three years as a soldier in the United States Army, not the 24 as a state police trooper. That's what Army pride is.

Response by PFC John Shulda made Feb 2 at 2019 6:58 AM

PFC John Shulda — Sat, 02 Feb 2019 06:58:49 -0500

The way the Army treats it's personnel is the biggest contributor that I saw when I was in. They seemed to take pride in beating a person down almost as much as building them up. I believe that both the Marines and the Navy have a much higher esteem and pride that begins from the top. The army lacks that. I got out in 78. Back then, we were treated much differently than today.

Response by Cpl Brian Escobar made Feb 2 at 2019 10:10 AM

Cpl Brian Escobar — Sat, 02 Feb 2019 10:10:52 -0500

I don't know about now with post-p.c. military correctness but when I graduated from bootcamp: MCRD SAN DIEGO, the experience was so life changing (unless you were some brain dead person...) So transformative that I believed and and still do the graduation speech made by Gunny Heartman in Full Metal Jacket "...From now on, until the day you die, every Marine is your brother..." (I still call any former Marine I know and Meet "My Brother" or "Sister" WM's I don't give a rats ass what race or creed I see I don't even care what MOS, Combat or No Combat experience they'be had (I'm an 0300 Combat Vet)...I know what they went through at Perris Island or San Diego...and for that alone they are family.

Response by Maj Ted Mc Neel Sr. made Feb 2 at 2019 10:56 PM

Maj Ted Mc Neel Sr. — Sat, 02 Feb 2019 22:56:44 -0500

Marine Corps 2nd Lts must complete the one year Basic Officer School, Marine Corps Base, Quantico, VA. We were trained to be Platoon and Company Commanders. Training included USMC History, weapons, tactics, organizational structure, ordnance, rifle and pistol range qualifications, and many operational training exercises. We became indoctrinated with love and pride for our Corps! Once this training was complete we could apply for a Military Occupation Specialty. But we were trained to be Grunts, 0302 Infantry Officers. We became a brotherhood and led by example - don't ask any subordinate to do anything you can not accomplish. I was the first to run the obstacle course. Marines by themselves are like most other military service personnel, but in a combat situation a Marine is not going to let down the Marines on his left or right (this also applies when on liberty in civilian clothes)!. Marines take self criticism and self evaluation as methods to improve performance but do not take kindly to outside organizations or personnel giving us criticism, advice, or disrespect! Once a Marine you will always be a Marine whether you are on Active Duty, Retired, or a Marine Veteran. We are The Proud, The Few, The United States Marines. Major USMC Retired. . . Ooh Rah!

Response by SGT James Colbert made Feb 3 at 2019 6:38 PM

SGT James Colbert — Sun, 03 Feb 2019 18:38:11 -0500

I'll give the short answer, it starts with the NCO. Because i dont really know how to answer it.

Response by PO3 Dennis Bullard made Feb 8 at 2019 12:52 PM

PO3 Dennis Bullard — Fri, 08 Feb 2019 12:52:10 -0500

When you sign up for the Marines, you know what you are in for. The basic training for the Marines is unique in that it bonds them to the Corps. The Army has soldiers that are just as prideful. It is just that many people join the Army and Navy thinking it is something that it is not. It is not a travel service, that is all fun and games. Marines typically know it's going to be a hard ride. At least that is how I as an FMF Corpsmen saw the Marines.

Response by SPC Chris Ison made Feb 10 at 2019 3:31 PM

SPC Chris Ison — Sun, 10 Feb 2019 15:31:11 -0500

The Marine corps is a "cult of personality"; they think because their PT test is the hardest that makes them Elite Fighters, they are not, they have a different mission.

Part of this comes from the one marine one corps philosophy, that happened after WWII when the commandant of the marine corps decreed that all unit patches and paraphernalia would no longer be worn on the uniform, as it was one marine, one corps.

It took awhile for the "hollywood marines" and the "Perris Island marines" to view each other as equals.

In the Army our esprit de corps is based around our unit and our unit history. Airborne units have more prestige than leg units, and Rangers have more prestige than any other light infantry or airborne unit.

The marine corps does not have this issue, because they do not have that kind of division among its combat arms teams. Although with MARSOC a thing now, i am interested in seeing how that plays out.

It also comes down to the fact that other services tend to regard the marine corps as legendary too. Stop paying homage to the cult of personality and this shit will stop.

The marine corps currently has three months of Initial Entry training and then 8 weeks of advanced infantry training 20 weeks for its infantry fighters; the Army now has a 22 week OSUT that includes a crucible event too. The new motto in the Army is everyone a rifleman, that started when they put cooks on the line in Iraq, and transportation guys were getting there shit handed to them for not understanding hot to use their weapons.

The ranger battalion is now the toughest special forces capable units in the pipeline, as each time you get promoted you go through RASP (old term RIP) which has been expanded by four weeks. That means leaders in Ranger BN are the best trained leaders in any special forces capable units.

It takes 2 full years to fully train a rifleman in the marine corps and the army and when it is done they have The EXACT SAME SKILL SET; except the Army infantry is more qualified than any Marine as an 11B (infantry) guy i was trained on the M-16, M-4, M-9, Bayonet, grenade, 203 launcher, Mk 19 grenade launcher, M-60 and 240B, M2 BMG, SAW, and M-47 Dragon, AT-4, FGR 17 viper, and the FGM 148 Javelin. If you want to be a machine gunner in the marine corps that is a separate mos, anti armor? yup separate MOS. These are ASI's in the Army, and many of them are granted through OJT.

You want to have esprit de corps? join the Ranger BN and you will feel it. Join the 82nd and you will feel it. If you are not combat arms, then you probably don't have the same Esprit de Corps either, but i have been in MI, Infantry, and Armor in my time in the Army, and the infantry and Armor guys were always gung ho about their job. Tankers love that tank they act just like aviation guys do about their aircraft. And the infantry? well they are the Infantry the queen of battle. Have you ever heard an Infantryman recite the infantryman's creed?

Response by MGySgt Joseph Magyar made Feb 23 at 2019 7:59 PM

MGySgt Joseph Magyar — Sat, 23 Feb 2019 19:59:11 -0500

In many respects our Corps is like a cult. We are believers. Belief in our training, belief in our leaders and belief in each other. That's why we are who we are.

Response by SSgt Richard Kensinger made Feb 28 at 2019 9:30 AM

SSgt Richard Kensinger — Thu, 28 Feb 2019 09:30:23 -0500

One of my brothers was a Marine and the other in the Army. I was an AF medic during the Vietnam Conflict. Other members of my extended family served in the Navy. None served in the Coast Guard. Many Marines I have talked to believe that those in the Army are "wannbe marines and know they are not good enough". As far as the AF they see us as the cub scouts of the military branches. They admit we have better food and facilitates! They do not disparage the Navy.
So the marines are prideful. Yet they are committing suicide at high rates. I have published articles about this dilemma. I highly recommend "Shooting Ghosts" written collaboratively by a marine and photo journalist. So, there is a heavy price they pay to remain "Semper Fi!
Rich, MSW

Response by LTC James McElreath made Mar 11 at 2019 4:23 AM

LTC James McElreath — Mon, 11 Mar 2019 04:23:47 -0400

Unfortunately the Army has no aspire de corp.like aMarine. You can tell when a person has been in the Corp. And it doesn't matter how long ago. They are Marines until they die.

Response by SPC Jackson Stevens made Mar 24 at 2019 5:33 PM

SPC Jackson Stevens — Sun, 24 Mar 2019 17:33:47 -0400

SGM, I have just read your question for the first time. I have not read any responses, so I’m probably going to say what’s already been said.
Advertising. The Few, The Proud. Aim High. Be All Than You Can Be. Why not Be More? An Army of One?
There are almost twice the number of Army, ANG, and Army Reservist than all of the other branches combined. There is almost a 4:1 ratio of Army AD to Marine AD. So my first conclusion is that it is much easier to join the Army, as the Army will take enlistees that have rejected by the other branches. Like being the last one picked for any sport. The Army takes most anyone while the Marines “Only Take Commitments.”
Boot Camp is reportedly the toughest of the Basic Trainings. I can not testify to that, but I’ve never heard valid arguments to the contrary.

Response by SFC Casey O'Mally made Mar 24 at 2019 5:42 PM

SFC Casey O'Mally — Sun, 24 Mar 2019 17:42:20 -0400

Marines are overcompensating, trying to prove that they aren't part of the Navy....

*Ducks and runs for cover*

Response by PFC John Roscoe made Apr 3 at 2019 9:10 AM

PFC John Roscoe — Wed, 03 Apr 2019 09:10:56 -0400

I think it's the sheer volume of troops in the Army. Basic Training is designed to salvage the maximum possible of what they recruit- and if you remember basic training, it's obviously a waste basket for a lot of folks that society doesn't know what to do with. With sheer numbers comes a greater absolute number of slackers, shirkers, cons and criminals- not a greater percentage, but a greater absolute number. Also the Army has more of everything, clubs, bases, chow, vehicles, money. All that being said, I was surprised how proud I was to become a soldier and wear the uniform after finishing Basic. It all depends where you get assigned- I started in a line unit which was much more strac, and after a short-time, because of my specialty MOS and GT scores, I was transferred to the Division HQ company, and all the guys were jealous, saying it was a country club that HQ only went to the field less than a couple of weeks a year. It was true- and it sucked, and after a short time I sucked. We had more field-grade officers than enlisted. Every junior enlisted man worked for his own Captain Major, LTC or Full-Bird who routinely got them off work details and out of PT. I was assigned temporarily to the Division Commandants office, and the Major got me- a E-3, with only 14 months in, BOQ to live off-base. Our Medic section had 6 people and almost no mission, since officers skipped sick call and went directly to the Troop medical clinic. Our barracks was a pig-stye, and the female clerks and other personnel, when we briefly deployed to the field, used to carry around their weapons in plastic-bags so they didn't get dirty. Bad attitudes grew like weeds in this fertile soil, and we all mocked grunts, lifers and other "stupid" folks. With so much time on our hands we sat around looking at each other, or escaped to get high and kill time doing nothing. I remember I had to run an errand to an infantry battalion quad, and when I entered, I remembered what the military was supposed to be about- the barracks were spotless, the facilities perfectly maintained and painted, the CQ was as strac as the First-Soldier in the Home Guard. Later, I was TDY as cadre medic to the Division Recon School- Wow, another world. we ran not only our own troops through there, but also marines and navy personnel. The cadre liked me enough, (or maybe they just wanted to fix a wayward young man) that they tried to convince me to take the course, but by then I was too far gone to become a hoo-rah, plus I was too intimidated by the commitment and sacrifice of the guys that went through- Honestly, I didn't think I had what it took. I was solid-gold REMF, by then.

Response by SSG Mark DeTillion made Apr 7 at 2019 12:23 PM

SSG Mark DeTillion — Sun, 07 Apr 2019 12:23:43 -0400

I had the pleasure of serving in both. In the Marine Corps, we felt like we were one in a million. In the Army we felt like we were one OF a million. As other said, it’s likely due to indoctrination (boot camp). But I also remember in the Army being forced into some unit pride that was a hard sell. Although I enjoyed being in the Marne Division, I could give two shits about who else served or what battle. I was infantry and was proud of that accomplishment.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2019 1:54 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 09 Apr 2019 13:54:23 -0400

They don't have such a need to compensate.

Response by Cpl Mark Gray made May 3 at 2019 12:45 PM

Cpl Mark Gray — Fri, 03 May 2019 12:45:59 -0400

The bended knee has never been a tradition of our Corps. General A.A. Van deGrift , CMC 1942- 1946 Said in a Speech to joint sessoin of congress about the Armys Idea to disban The Marine Corps. This whole idea started afterr the Battle of Belleu Wood, When a Captain from 6th Marines told
a retreating French army, Retreat Hell, we just got here.
Or when the 1st Marine Division was coming out ot the Chosin Resesvoir they were almost in Hagaru re, when someone in the ranks , yelled, "Count cadence, count" and everygody limping from Frostbire fell into step and they were Marching. About a mile from Hagaru re, somebody started singing the Marines hymn, in Hagaru re the Army heard it and somebody there yelled, "those bastards, those magnificent Bastards. '
Once a Marine a Marine for Life , always proud.

Response by SSG Randy Talbot made May 14 at 2019 9:53 AM

SSG Randy Talbot — Tue, 14 May 2019 09:53:32 -0400

I think it's a matter of culture, training and embracing their historic past. Let me give you a couple examples from my time as a army soldier and civilian army historian.

While deployed to Kuwait in 2003, I had to brief our 4-star on the activities I was performing while a historian. While briefing him on our data collection efforts to write a book on what it took to deploy, how we functioned and how we managed many aspects that were unforeseen while deploying. The 4-star looked at me and said, you historians, you do nothing but collect info and do nothing with it. Hell, you guys are still writing about WWII for Christ sake. What the hell do we have to learn from WWII? Since we were running a red ball express to expedite parts into Iraq, I told him we have a lot to learn as we are making the same mistakes as the gulf war and functioning like we were in WWII! That went over good, let me tell you.

I was at a leadership conference looking at how each branch develops leaders. For the army, unlike the marines, army history is only embraced if there is a reason to use it for today's benefit, otherwise, it's an inconvient truth. For the marines, historical embracing begins in boot camp. Young marines are told about the past, their heroes and acts of valor. Young PFCs are training young privates, sergeants are training young corporals etc. the marines embrace their history and wear it on their sleeve and in their uniform. When you see a marine, you see Iwo Jima, chosin, hue and so many other battles and acts of heroism. The army changes their uniforms so often that there is no reference point to gravitate toward. If you look at the new army proposed uniform mirroring the WWII Ike jacket, you can see that the army has yet to learn from WWII, just copies the symbolic and as usual, missing the substance.

Response by LCpl Laurence Puco made May 16 at 2019 3:53 PM

LCpl Laurence Puco — Thu, 16 May 2019 15:53:50 -0400

Interesting question, but I have never met anyone that does...…….

Response by PO1 Kevin Dougherty made May 27 at 2019 12:29 AM

PO1 Kevin Dougherty — Mon, 27 May 2019 00:29:05 -0400

Some good comments already, the thing that jumps out at me when I consider this is size of the service. As a Coastie, I saw & had a similar pride in my service. We were small, and proud of our can do attitude, versatility and ability to do more with less. We even took pervese pride in our lack of funding and recognition. Likewise the Marines are a comparatively small service, and with that comes a certain elite mindset, "The few, the proud the Marines" best illustrates that, though I must confess when I hear it, I also mentally hear, "The fewer, the prouder, the Coast Guard."

Response by SP5 Dennis Loberger made May 27 at 2019 6:09 PM

SP5 Dennis Loberger — Mon, 27 May 2019 18:09:55 -0400

I'm proud of my service and I was Army. I would do it all over again even though my wife and I had 2 kids at the time I went in

Response by Sgt Jackie Pilch made Jun 25 at 2019 10:42 AM

Sgt Jackie Pilch — Tue, 25 Jun 2019 10:42:25 -0400

To the second question: No. It starts with bootcamp and is predicated on "More With Less."

Response by PFC Bobby Smith made Jun 28 at 2019 4:40 PM

PFC Bobby Smith — Fri, 28 Jun 2019 16:40:58 -0400

it is not drilled into them like the USMC

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jun 28 at 2019 7:23 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Fri, 28 Jun 2019 19:23:28 -0400

I had a lot of pride watching Army Amor divisions destroy Iraqi Infantry and Armor divisions in Desert Storm. To imply the Marines are better at fighting without context is false.

Response by Sgt Peter Schlesiona made Jul 6 at 2019 3:34 PM

Sgt Peter Schlesiona — Sat, 06 Jul 2019 15:34:57 -0400

In my personal experience, the Army tends to be far more “unit” oriented in terms of pride, while Marines are more “Corps” oriented.
A great example of this goes back about 15 years. I had been advised that a young man who served with same battalion as I had in Vietnam was seriously wounded and was being treated at a local hospital. I went to visit, got some idea of what he needed and put out the word to other local Marines. They all jumped in with both feet.
That worked so well that the hospital asked if I could do something like that for two Army guys who were expected shortly. I did not have contacts in the Army but got some names, made some calls. In every case, the person I spoke with asked what unit the soldiers served with. When I said “I don’t know, but why should that matter? They’re Army”, I got one after another telling me that if either of the guys served with such-and-such unit (their unit), they would jump in. Otherwise I should track down veterans of their units. After hearing that once too often, I gave it up and we Marines we’re going to go what we could got them, but found out they were being sent to a Walter Reed (as best I recall now).
I’m not trying to slam Army folks with that story. It is a true story and I offer it only to punctuate my point about “unit” vs “Corps”. I’m sure that if I had found some vets from that unit, they’d have jumped in with both feet, too.

Response by CSM Patrick Durr made Jul 12 at 2019 10:21 PM

CSM Patrick Durr — Fri, 12 Jul 2019 22:21:10 -0400

Pride doesn't have to be demanded or exagerated... nuff said. Hooah.

Response by SGT James Murphy made Aug 8 at 2019 4:39 PM

SGT James Murphy — Thu, 08 Aug 2019 16:39:05 -0400

I disagree with the Question. I believe Everyone has Pride in their Service and as one who also volunteered for the Color Guard and did exactly the same type of presentation as any Marine Unit only in the Army I feel we Represented Just as well. BTW Some of us are Historical representatives as well. https://youtu.be/hp92lJTMHTA

United States Army Old Guard Fife & Drum Corps - USA - Basel Tattoo 2017 vom 16.9.2017

March on: Marshall Lowendahls March Jubilee Gifts Fanfare Simple Gifts Simple Interlude Storm In the Valley Drum Break and Retraite To the End of the Line Fe...

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Aug 8 at 2019 5:06 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Thu, 08 Aug 2019 17:06:57 -0400

We had a lot of pride when our Army Armored Divisions destroyed Saddam's Armor Divisions.

Response by SGT Tim Tobin made Aug 8 at 2019 5:10 PM

SGT Tim Tobin — Thu, 08 Aug 2019 17:10:21 -0400

You know after I think about this I don't agree at all. I think the Army has as much pride and the Marines. We may not have the fancy blues the Marines have but it isn't always about "the look"!!

Response by SGT Lewis Ray Rains made Aug 8 at 2019 7:07 PM

SGT Lewis Ray Rains — Thu, 08 Aug 2019 19:07:09 -0400

Those of us that back our Branches of our military to the fullest, are beginning to be few & far between!!! Our Society is what is at fault!! What do we do about it!! Build a time machine I guess! However, I believe that the respect that is deserved and that is not backed up is due, in Large, to the members of our Government!! They say many things but but don't follow through when it comes to the voting process!!! The is wrong, all the way around.
Look at the overall treatment our Commander in Chief is treated!!! Agree with him or not, He is our Commander in Chief, voted to that Rank by the majority of the people of the United States. Has anyone that has held this "Rank" ever been hated as much as our present CIC??? Not to my knowledge!! I do not & have not agreed with EVERYTHING that he & his predecessor's have/will do. That is my right!!
It doesn't negate the Fact that he is our COMMANDER in CHIEF/PRESIDENT!!!!
EVERYONE SHOULD RESPECT THAT!!!!!!! I DO!!!!

Response by LTJG Richard Bruce made Aug 8 at 2019 9:17 PM

LTJG Richard Bruce — Thu, 08 Aug 2019 21:17:40 -0400

Both the Army and Marines are envious of the Coast Guard. Recruiting waiting lists are miles long. Our recruiting staffs are few and far between. My home state of Indiana no longer has a single recruiter. USCG may not have the bling of the Marines, but our traditions and culture are just as strong. There is a reason recruits wait months to take the oath; Pride in serving this great country.

Response by Cpl James R. " Jim" Gossett Jr made Aug 10 at 2019 5:27 PM

Cpl James R. " Jim" Gossett Jr — Sat, 10 Aug 2019 17:27:41 -0400

I don't quite know what to say...I've always thought it started in Boot Camp, you basically torn down
then made as a MARINE...Always and Forever...The Few, The Proud! I am 70 and STILL a MARINE!
Semper Fi to All my Brothers...

Response by MGySgt Jerry Suarez made Aug 11 at 2019 1:23 AM

MGySgt Jerry Suarez — Sun, 11 Aug 2019 01:23:33 -0400

SGM

I'm a retired Marine and yes while all think all Marines are proud of being a Marine that just is not true. Just like any service each one has its pluses and minuses. However while being on recruiting duty that is when I came to understand that each person joins a particular service for their own reasons and while we have the reputation of being the toughest and the best I have to come to respect all who have the courage to don a uniform and serve the red white and blue without reservation. I have seen plenty of Marines that shoe lack the lack pride that you say you see but I felt it was my duty to take those Marines and mentor them regardless if they wanted it or not. While each branch has its challenges understand the ones that dont appear to be proud of their particular service they probably would have the same attitude even if they served in another branch. So continue to serve proudly and if need be weed out those bad apples or continue to mentor them to change their mindset and/or attitude.

S/F

Response by CPL Sharon Fahey made Aug 11 at 2019 12:16 PM

CPL Sharon Fahey — Sun, 11 Aug 2019 12:16:13 -0400

We do take pride. Just because we aren't used in posters, parades and props doesn't mean we lack pride in our branch of service. Like the Marines, we all work hard and don't look for modeling career opportunities. Mission first!

Response by SFC Robert Walton made Aug 21 at 2019 10:02 AM

SFC Robert Walton — Wed, 21 Aug 2019 10:02:39 -0400

CSM Carl Cunningham I respect all Services their ability to be proud and be the best at what they do. However each and everyone of them are different I am proud for each one and would fight for each one. Now May I remind you the Army is spread far and wide and is a huge collective of individuals with a massive amount of diverse units so the pride sometime flows down individual small units. For the Army to show Army wide the pride and dedication that the other services have would be an entire Mission in its self and would take away from the Army's collective Mission. We have branches that for the most part are unheard of or non existent. How do you show your pride? Well with a plaque you hang on the wall in your man cave after you get out. We have entire branches that are dedicated to just Ordinance, Infantry, Armor, Artillery, Supply, Transportation, just to name a few. We have Army National Gard and Reserves that if someone didn't tell you about you would not know they exist. Now with that said it is simpler for you to have Great pride at a smaller unit level than over all Army. All are proud of the Army but as far as Army being shown I think it is better to keep it on a Smaller level. We just celebrated our 244th Birthday June 14th. For the Marines 244 Yrs Nov. 10th 2019. Navy Oct. 13 2019 244yrs. Air Force Sept. 18th 2019 72yrs. Coast Guard Aug. 4th 2019 227 Yrs. I think we all have tons of pride and for good reason. Last but not least Yes we have some Soldiers that bad mouth the Army as I have heard some of the same things said from all the other branches of the Military that will never change in my opinion because many of the people that enlist are not ready for the real world. JUST MY TWO CENTS

Response by PO1 Curtis Bunnell made Sep 5 at 2019 9:17 AM

PO1 Curtis Bunnell — Thu, 05 Sep 2019 09:17:22 -0400

I don't think any branch of the military has more pride than any other. We may express it in different ways. We all sign that contract, and all take the oath. We all give that blank check to the government that includes our lives to protect our country. We all obey the orders given. I am a Vietnam veteran and got out of the service when I came home. Years later, I went back in the service, wound up involved in the hostage rescue attempt under President Carter, and later was in the Persian gulf. I finally retired under President Clinton.

Response by MSG Lonnie Averkamp made Sep 18 at 2019 12:28 AM

MSG Lonnie Averkamp — Wed, 18 Sep 2019 00:28:14 -0400

Men respond to the standards that are demanded of them. The Marines have, long, had a history of demanding extreme performance, because their lives and success of the mission has always depended on it.

In specialized combat units of the Army (Special Forces, Rangers, Paratroops), you can see a similar Esprit de Corps. The lives of the unit rely on 100% performance by the members. "If you won't give it, get the hell out." As you get farther from the Combat Arms, emphasis gravitates to be more on Job Proficiency, rather than Esprit de Corps.

Now, take the Air Force. They can seem to operate in such an "Office Atmosphere" that I have wondered how they can ever motivate their troops to bust their backs. But if you have ever seen the Proficiency of a Loadmaster in the back end of a C-130, you will soon realize that this is a man who you CAN trust with your cargo, your life, and a multi-million dollar aircraft. So the bottom line is, "No. You will never make a Marine out of a common Soldier or Airman, but we all get the job done in our own ways"

Response by Cpl James R. " Jim" Gossett Jr made Sep 26 at 2019 8:15 PM

Cpl James R. " Jim" Gossett Jr — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 20:15:38 -0400

SGM Carl, I think that would be up to each individual...We basically had it instilled in us...

Response by CPL Linda B. made Sep 30 at 2019 10:06 AM

CPL Linda B. — Mon, 30 Sep 2019 10:06:52 -0400

Taking pride in one's commitment to protect our country at any cost was what I was taught
After all the enemies certainly is -
I was willing to pay the ultimate cost and I knew it when I enlisted.
*perhaps it's something that is part of you before you even enlist.
Basic training was hard and so is serving but I would do it again.
we have freedoms to fight for and none of them are free and if we don't stick together in unity and have pride in what we do then why are we doing it.!?

Response by SSG Ralph Watkins made Oct 3 at 2019 9:34 AM

SSG Ralph Watkins — Thu, 03 Oct 2019 09:34:50 -0400

Having been Army & then assigned to the Marines in Fallujah, there is a huge difference. The Marines breed warriors. They are the pinnacle fighting force. And they maintain that pride. There is very little politics, red tape, & the normal BS one encounters with the Army. The Marines put the mission & nation on top. The Army on the other hand is often used for show. Imagine little toy soldiers. It's filled with red tape, politics, garrison creature comforts, & tons of BS. Marines are constantly training for missions. Army tends to give it's people all kinds of stupid tasks to keep them busy. Looking good in the Army takes precedence over being good. Marines do so much to boost morale in order to maintain the best fighting force int he world. The Army just wants to look good & do an okay job.

Response by SPC Franklin McKown made Oct 5 at 2019 1:31 AM

SPC Franklin McKown — Sat, 05 Oct 2019 01:31:11 -0400

Our pride is found in or numerous victories on the battlefield,we aren't REALLY spit and polish parade boys ,anyway.Some are, take the Old Guard,THEY are better at pride and uniforms,BAT NONE.But victory is synonymous with killing bad guys and right now the kids are whining about that.True we save more than we kill but the Tard Progs only know "War Bad" .

Response by SGT Nickolas Ortiz made Oct 6 at 2019 2:57 PM

SGT Nickolas Ortiz — Sun, 06 Oct 2019 14:57:47 -0400

I cannot comment on the Troops you lead... seems it could be a leadership issue. Usually is a leadership issue when it comes to esprit de corps. In my time, the units with the best leaders had as much pride in their Army as any. Sure, the Marine Dress uniforms looked nicer than our Dress Blues... but that's for show. Marines are drilled into their heads they're the best... and the US Army Cavalry, with our stetson's and spurs, were just as bad ass. I had the misfortune to change my MOS from 19D to 16T... I went from being a well tuned Porche to being part of a wagon train. Leadership determines how well a Unit runs... it's not the Troop... it's the leaders.

Response by SSG George Duncan made Oct 12 at 2019 8:49 PM

SSG George Duncan — Sat, 12 Oct 2019 20:49:26 -0400

has to do with the mission they have to have the trust that close combat requires

Response by MSG Reid Zohfeld made Oct 15 at 2019 7:05 AM

MSG Reid Zohfeld — Tue, 15 Oct 2019 07:05:05 -0400

Of coarse I am very proud of being in the Army
The problem is not the Army as much as politics which use the Army as there own social experiment which has set different standards for different genders race creed and religions
The Marines seem to stick their own set of standards and stand behind them
The Army leadership is so weak the I would fire more the half the Generals and put soldiers who have a backbone and look after their troops instead of being a politician
I loved my 3 plus decades in the Army Hated the politics

Response by GySgt Keith Backus made Oct 16 at 2019 12:10 PM

GySgt Keith Backus — Wed, 16 Oct 2019 12:10:37 -0400

Every Service talks craps about it's own but with the Corps you have to look at our history, we have some of the greatest men to have ever served, followed by the Navy then the Army. We have to live up to that and to what America expects from the Marine Corps. We are respected and feared around the world and no Marine every wants that to change on his or her Watch. Semper Fi!!

Response by SPC Michael Pellegrino made Oct 16 at 2019 9:04 PM

SPC Michael Pellegrino — Wed, 16 Oct 2019 21:04:42 -0400

Says who every unit i was assigned to had pride in everything we did....there's lots of hipe about the toughness of the Corps and I respect that ...i expect the same respect

Response by PO3 Joseph Mcleod made Oct 20 at 2019 4:23 AM

PO3 Joseph Mcleod — Sun, 20 Oct 2019 04:23:53 -0400

The Warrior Ethos and brotherhood that is instilled in each Marine through basic training cannot be duplicated by the other services. As a Navy Hospital Corpsman stationed at MCRD Paris Island i observed how each individual recruit is indoctrinated and immersed in the tradition of honor and service that is exclusive to our fighting Marines. All Marines are first and foremost a rifleman, and a brother/sister to their comrades. In no other service is this bond of family displayed.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 6 at 2019 10:05 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 06 Nov 2019 10:05:03 -0500

Army "Pride" focuses on the unit, USMC focuses on the "The Corps". Makes sense as the Army is much larger and more diverse force. Also in my experience in dealing with junior USMC enlisted and O's they tend to puff their chest out and degenerate other non-USMC forces as a way to make themselves feel better. Professional Officers and NCO's, both USMC and Army treat each other's service with respect.

Response by MAJ Rick Freeman made Nov 29 at 2019 9:48 AM

MAJ Rick Freeman — Fri, 29 Nov 2019 09:48:14 -0500

The marines are light infantry. In the army our light infantry are called rangers. Similar mission same morale.

Response by SPC Bill Miller made Jan 18 at 2020 6:49 AM

SPC Bill Miller — Sat, 18 Jan 2020 06:49:10 -0500

Let me first start out by saying that I loved my time in the Army. Also, never believed that "the corps" was better. Not for one second. That being said, and keep in mind I served mid 90's, my observations. The marines were able to meet recruitment numbers consistently and easily. A. Because their strength number was always low. B. They were allowed to be more selective in recruiting. The Corps would not accept people, for whatever reason, and then send them over to the Army recruiter because they will take them. This did a couple of things. It built up this "fake aura" surrounding the corps about being "the best" just because they were selective. People thought tougher entrance req. then it must be better. It also began a trend of soldiers who enlisted, but if they could, would rather be somewhere else. They were the people who, didn't have a job, needed a career because only GED etc. no prospects, need help paying for college. and the list goes on. Now, compare that with the attitude and mentality of your typical Marine recruit. The marine is there because that's what he wants, being a marine is what he wanted since 5, he can't wait to go to Paris Island (or place out west lol) Anyway, you guys get the picture. You may think I was "nice" to the corps, I was going to be a marine before I enlisted in the Army. Unfortunately, I couldn't pass the physical, they could get my head to fit in that damn jar.... Haha, j/k marines, semper fi.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 7 at 2020 12:35 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 07 Mar 2020 12:35:32 -0500

I am very proud of my service in the Army but I do see that generally speaking the Marines do exhibit more pride in their branch. They are a smaller organization and from Day 1 the drills try to instill that in them. Let's not also for get that the Marine PR is way better than that of the Army. Civilians and even some military personnel view them as elite. The Army experience varies based on unit, MOS, pathway etc. I personally display pride in the 101st Airborne more often than I would with a US Army shirt. A guy in the 82nd or 3rd ID might show more unit pride than say somebody in a TRADOC position. Experiences will differ.

Now from a capability standpoint there's not much that differs between branches. I get annoyed when Marines compare themselves to Rangers or Special Forces. A Marine POG in finance is not anymore elite than an Army POG. A few years before I left Ft. Campbell we trained incoming soldiers to 101st under the IRT program. Many of the Marines that reclassed to the Army had trouble qualifying on the 300M range let alone zeroing their weapon. I had three prior service Marines in my platoon at one point. One of them was an NCO in my squad and all had difficulty passing Air Assault school particularly the 12 miler. They told me that wasn't something they did on a regular basis in the Marines. Maybe it was their experience I don't know but speaking with a retired gunny I worked with as a contractor he confirmed it. Not trying to bash Marines. I have son that's a former Marine and another in the Army. One of the best supervisors I had in a previous job was a Marine and she could make shit happen. My supervisor now is retired Air Force. He's.......eeehn. :-D

Response by LTJG Richard Bruce made Apr 2 at 2020 10:00 PM

LTJG Richard Bruce — Thu, 02 Apr 2020 22:00:22 -0400

You're all wrong. USCG has a recruiting wait list longer than any service. We don't have to advertise continuously, our deeds speak for themselves. USCG has the smallest bases with the smallest crews sparsely placed around the world. We don't have golf courses or housing units, or large exchanges/commissaries, or great special services. Most of the time we look like auto mechanics after a week under a dirty car. We do have sharp looking ships. Nothing compares to sailing aboard the oldest active commissioned ship in the USA (USS Constitution is not truly active); USCGC Eagle.

USCG gets the most done with the fewest men for the least amount of money. Being doing so proudly since 1790. Go Bears.

Response by 1SG Brian Adams made Apr 22 at 2020 11:13 PM

1SG Brian Adams — Wed, 22 Apr 2020 23:13:42 -0400

What kind of a question is this?...Soldiers have great pride and Esprit de corps....

Response by Maj Ron Johnson made Jul 16 at 2020 6:53 PM

Maj Ron Johnson — Thu, 16 Jul 2020 18:53:48 -0400

The only Army units close to the pride of the Marines were the 82nd Airborne and the Special Forces units I fought with. Those guys were professional where most of the other Army units were very undisciplined.

Response by SFC Mike Wilkins made Aug 31 at 2021 12:09 PM

SFC Mike Wilkins — Tue, 31 Aug 2021 12:09:38 -0400

All branches have discontents. The reason you hear from the army is it is twice as big as any other branches. You can add the Navy an Marines together and the Army is still bigger. So we have twice as many discontents. But they all have their own discontents.