Why does the GOP believe that giving veterans a 25% disability pay increase is too costly and too difficult?

LCpl Timothy McCain — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 13:33:37 -0400

On June 15 spoke with Erik Phelps who works for Senator Rounds and posted a copy of his email reply to me. Erik basically said that it would be too expensive and too difficult to give veterans a 25% disability pay increase. He explained ( as if we didn't already know) that the VA spends $79 billion a year in disability pay and to give veterans a 25% disability pay increase would cost $19 billion to give a pay increase. He compared getting the bill passed to getting the zika virus bill passed. He also said that it would be too hard to get Quality Of Life payments and opening up the VA pension to service connected disability passed, because the cost. I will repost the email so you can read it for your self. But before I go any further here is my justification for asking for those things https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CHRG-110hhrg39461/html/CHRG-110hhrg39461.htm

Now looking at what Erik said it would be disheartening because of the cost. But notice he didn't mention that it would only be a $444.50 increase for the average disabled veteran monthly. Some would say that Veterans'disability pay isn't meant to be lived on. Well they would be wrong. A veteran who qualifies for 100% VA disability may qualify for any other type of disability benefits. Because the criteria are so different. In fact 56% of veterans who are 100% disabled service connected are denied social security benefits. Also the VA cannot consider SsDi when awarding disability benefits and SsDi can't consider VA benefits when awarding disability. VA disability benefits are awarded as sole source income and can only consider military benefits. When the VA disability benefit program started it was meant to replace lost potential earnings that was calculated based on the national median income. Today that is around $52,000.00 a year and VA disability for a veteran with a service connected disability rating of 100% is just under $35,000.00 a year.

Do you think that Veterans deserve a 25% disability pay increase regardless of the additional cost?
Do you think veterans who have a service connected disability rating of 100% or permanent and total and are not receiving any military retirement should be able to draw the maximum amount of VA pension?
Do you think Quality Of Life payments should be made to veterans who have a service connected disability rating of 60% or more?
Do you think the Senators should count the cost before talking about going to war?
How do you think the government should cover the increased cost if it were to give the pay raise?
How would the disability pay increase will effect you?

- FINDINGS OF THE VETERANS' DISABILITY BENEFITS COMMISSION

Response by CPO Frank Coluccio made Jun 16 at 2016 1:36 PM

CPO Frank Coluccio — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 13:36:58 -0400

Why?
Because unlike Democrats, Republicans want to identify where the funding is going to come from before passing bills like this.
Better question would be; Why didn't Democrats identify a source of funding that would allow this bill to pass??

Response by SN Jessica Soler made Jun 16 at 2016 1:40 PM

SN Jessica Soler — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 13:40:03 -0400

I have to agree with you. Instead of the politicians line in their pocket with that 25% increase they should be giving it to the veterans.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2016 1:40 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 13:40:08 -0400

Because it would detract from their own pay raises?

Response by SGM Erik Marquez made Jun 16 at 2016 1:46 PM

SGM Erik Marquez — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 13:46:38 -0400

The VA system is rife with fraud, waste and abuse...and that's just on the Servicemembers part, it is clearly also a mess on the administration side.
I would FIRST like to see the VA administration system as a whole revamped, I would like EVERY VA claim of disability reevaluated, I would like those caught gaming the system, to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, and then I would like to see those that are truly disabled receive a fair amount in relation to thier level of disability.
Only when the system is being used above board and honorably will we be taken justly and seriously for asking for even more.

Response by SPC Zac Long made Jun 16 at 2016 1:51 PM

SPC Zac Long — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 13:51:27 -0400

Rather than a pay raise, how about revamping the notorious "VA math"? Even altering it slightly by rounding up instead of down would equate to hundreds of more dollars to Disabled Veterans. In addition, politicians can technically say that they did not bless off on a pay raise. Both parties win...

Response by SGT Brian Wall made Jun 16 at 2016 2:01 PM

SGT Brian Wall — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 14:01:43 -0400

Look the politicians have already pulled from numerous areas to fund there bills. Most politicians truly don't give a crap about our service members anymore and they say things to get the vote. Social Security haha you mean the money they pulled from to fund bills to help illegals. Service members aren't looked at like they used to be and 9/10 we are the ones that suffer at the greed and power of the politicians.

Veterans deserve to be treated better than the illegals. If you are 100% service connected you should be able to use what ever you need to to survive. Quality of life payments should be made for 60%-90% once you are 100% then the pension and retirement should suffice. Senators only care what they can put in there pocket and they don't care what the cost is. There are several programs that could be cut to pay for it, like the money for illegals, welfare, dont give foreign aid to anybody. It will help me greatly.

Response by LCpl Timothy McCain made Jun 16 at 2016 2:12 PM

LCpl Timothy McCain — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 14:12:47 -0400

Here's the post from yesterday https://www.rallypoint.com/status-updates/what-kind-of-response-have-i-gotten-from-senator-rounds-office-on-the-american-heroes-cola-act-and-s-3032

RallyPoint | The Military's Professional Network

Response by CW5 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2016 2:27 PM

CW5 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 14:27:21 -0400

Is it necessary? When I worked at FORSCOM HQ I saw many people with DV plates parking in the handicapped spaces. That in itself is not the issue. The issue is that they are driving extremely nice cars.
I think most are doing just fine. We only see the few that are having financial difficulty due to the proliferation of social media justice.

Response by MGySgt James Forward made Jun 16 at 2016 2:55 PM

MGySgt James Forward — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 14:55:36 -0400

The GOP has it right in my opinion, the Democrats have not officially supported any increase so the GOP part of your question is not really warranted.
Answering Your Questions First:
1) Do you think that Veterans deserve a 25% disability pay increase regardless of the additional cost?
Answer: No
2) Do you think veterans who have a service connected disability rating of 100% or permanent and total and are not receiving any military retirement should be able to draw the maximum amount of VA pension?
Answer: Yes but only for 100% and non employable
3) Do you think Quality Of Life payments should be made to veterans who have a service connected disability rating of 60% or more?
Answer: No. Serves no real purpose and increases the US debt.
4) Do you think the Senators should count the cost before talking about going to war?
Answer: No. Going to War is not connected in any way to VA or future disability payments
5) How do you think the government should cover the increased cost if it were to give the pay raise?
Answer: They would have to find it from another program to cut, I am tired of the increasing debt of the United States. We should live within what we collect every year.
6) How would the disability pay increase will effect you?
Answer: Not much. I am 50% VA, retired mil and working. No impact on me at all.

Excerpt from the humongous Link:
The Commission made 113 recommendations, discussion on the UP TO 25% increase in VA compensation (not %25).
While permanent quality of life measures are developed, studied, and implemented, we recommend that compensation payments be increased up to 25 percent with priority to the more seriously disabled.
***The hypothetical that we put together said that a 100 percent disabled person who is now
receiving $2,393 ($28,716 per year) in individual compensation per month, with a quality of life increase of 25 percent, that would be about $598 and that would raise them to $2,991 ($35,892 per year).
***Going to the other end of the scale, a 10 percent disabled person who is receiving $112 a month, we suggested that the quality of life for that person might be 2\1/2\ percent, which would be an additional $3 a month.

Here is my math and personal dissection:
National Median Income does not subtract taxes, if we subtract Federal Tax and estimated states taxes The USA Median Income of $52,000 and we assume the person is married:
$52,000xSocial Security Tax 7.65%=$3,978
$52,000xfed tax rate 15%= $7,800
$52,000x VA state Tax 5.75%=$2,990
$52,000-$3,978-$7,800-$2,990=$37,232.

So the NET income after taxes is $37,232 for my State of VA. Other states would be more or less. In States with no income tax the amount would be $40,222.

Following this logic for a 100% disabled AND NON EMPLOYABLE person I would agree that this category should be increased. While the number of personnel in this category is probably very low, we could probably justify a full 25% for this category.
For those that are employable at 100%-10% I would not apply anything close to a 25% increase. I would also not apply this by a sliding scale but I would INCREASE all monthly stipends by the same amount say 10%. Each rating category would receive a higher increase based upon the % of disability. Make Sense? sSemper Fi.

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made Jun 16 at 2016 2:55 PM

CPT Mark Gonzalez — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 14:55:52 -0400

Personally this is tough for me as it is an entitlement program and as a nation we are broke. However, if anyone has earned an increase it is a disabled veteran and I would support an increase. With that said though there is too much abuse of the system and it is a huge black eye on us all. I want the money to go to disabled veterans and not someone who is a fraud and I've seen too much of the latter. If they tightened the system up it would allow more money to those that truly need it.

Response by CPT Joseph K Murdock made Jun 16 at 2016 3:13 PM

CPT Joseph K Murdock — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 15:13:06 -0400

We are not national treasure but unwanted expense accounts.

Response by SGM David W. Carr LOM, DMSM MP SGT made Jun 16 at 2016 4:11 PM

SGM David W. Carr LOM, DMSM MP SGT — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 16:11:18 -0400

LCpl Timothy McCain LTC Stephen F. COL Mikel J. Burroughs SMSgt Minister Gerald A. "Doc" Thomas SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL TSgt Hunter Logan I am one of those 100% SC that was denied social security benefits twice (2004&2007) because I had a 1987 college degree in Computer Science and completed in 1981 Army Military Occupational Specilty (MOS) 74F computer programmer/analyst. There is not a lot of call these days for COBAL, FORTRAN, Basic and JCL computer languages.

I asked the supposed expert how much time he spent in the military. His response was 3 years lower enlisted. So I asked him how much interaction he had with his First Sergeant and Battalion CSM/SGM. He responded very little so I commented that those are leadership and management roles and Deal with overall mission operation and not actual physical manual labor.

They determined I could do data entry or guard duty in an office with limited movement. They told me that I was trained in computers be it 20/25 years were little has changed and did not look disabled.
I know of lazy uneducated unwed mothers, criminals and drug addicts that qualified.

They did not care about PTSD, Sleep Apnea, nerve damage surgery to both arms and wrists, Spinal Stenosis w CSpine having a cage for my C6, rods and screw, Prostrate Caner, other Nuerological disorders related to toxins exposures at Fort McClellan, Al adjacent to the Monsanto plant that produced Agent Orange and numerous other deadly toxins.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2016 4:52 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 16:52:27 -0400

hell yes

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2016 8:23 PM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 16 Jun 2016 20:23:00 -0400

Tim - Great discussion! Before I comment let me give the disclaimer that all comments and opinions expressed here are strictly my own and I'm writing here on my own free time as a member of rally point. I'm not sure why you phrased the title of the thread the way you did. If you read my original email response, in no way did I say that I or any Senator or political party believe it is too costly or too difficult to give disabled veterans a raise. What I did do was point out that what you were asking Senators to do - add a $19 billion per year price tag to a non-controversial bill for veterans COLA increase (the Veterans Compensation Cost of Living Adjustment Act of 2016) was a "tough sell" because it would put what should be an easy bill at risk to be voted down. Why? Well for one, in today's government, you just can't pull $19 billion out of thin air, no matter how good the cause is (and believe me, veterans are about the best cause we have in this country!) Democrats and Republicans (along with the President) all came to an agreement last fall called the Bipartisan Budget Agreement of 2015. Google it or check it out here.
http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/house-passes-sweeping-two-year-bipartisan-budget-deal-n453226
or here
https://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2015/10/29/bipartisan-budget-agreement-what-you-need-know
That agreement set spending levels for every branch of government, including DOD and the VA for the next 2 years. Those "caps" are set in law and can't be exceeded. You may have seen in the news last week where Senator McCain tried to get the caps increased for defense spending because he thought DOD needed more money for modernization, troop pay raise, and to fight the wars. His measure failed and was voted down by members of both parties because the Senate voted not to bust the caps. Senators on both sides of the aisle voted to stick to the budget agreement. So back to my point - what you were asking for is AT LEAST $19 billion just for one year, and thats just the 25% pay raise. The other two provisions would add even more cost. Usually the congressional budget office gives "scores" in 10 year increments. So conservatively lets say your measure totals $25 billion for one year - thats $250 billion over 10 years. Thats a big cost and as I said verbatim in my email "something that is going to take a lot more debate." Now, no one says its not a valid cause or can't be done in the future. In fact, I told you its a great cause. I told you if someone in the House proposes it (where most bills originate) or it comes to the Senate, it will be very closely looked at.
The last thing I'll close on is your comments on partisanship, R's vs D's. Go check out the "Veterans First Act." It is sponsored by EVERY SINGLE MEMBER of the Senate Veterans Affairs Committee, both Republican and Democrat. When it comes to taking care of our veterans, there's no such thing as liberal or conservative. In my experience, veterans affairs is one of the least (if not THE least) partisan issues on Capitol Hill and one where there is the most agreement between all political parties. Again, thanks for the great discussion, keep the good ideas coming and keep up the good work!

House Passes Sweeping Two-Year Bipartisan Budget Deal

The deal extends the nation's debt limit through 2017 and also sets spending levels through September of that year.

Response by PO2 Robert M. made Jun 17 at 2016 2:50 AM

PO2 Robert M. — Fri, 17 Jun 2016 02:50:33 -0400

I, myself, am a 100% service connected Disabled Veteran - I emphatically state we SHOULD RECEIVE INCREASES in our disability pay!!! Members of Congress get regular increases, and they cannot even get their work done for our nation!!! - being on a LIMITED INCOME, I would greatly appreciate additional funds!
It is sad when we are "encouraged" by the Veteran's Administration to seek Welfare and other funding means so they DO NOT HAVE TO PAY US ADDITIONAL FUNDS!!!!

Response by 1SG Brian Adams made Jun 17 at 2016 5:26 PM

1SG Brian Adams — Fri, 17 Jun 2016 17:26:06 -0400

It"s all politics. The shame is they (government) need to do more for disabled veterans. Non residence in this country get treated better than us veterans in certain situations. In short, it's a mess. It should not matter which major political party proposes the increase, they should be working in unison as Americans to do the right thing and take care of disabled veterans, We are all sacrificing our lives for a bigger cause.

Response by SFC Mamerto Perez made Jun 23 at 2016 9:46 AM

SFC Mamerto Perez — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 09:46:23 -0400

The GOP will always try to denied benefits to our veterans. A 25% increase would not hurt the economy or any other expenses incurred by out National Defense. More money is given away or
spend on useless research.

Response by Jaste Aja made Dec 19 at 2016 9:41 PM

Jaste Aja — Mon, 19 Dec 2016 21:41:19 -0500

Some may talk as if they gaimed the system. That is especially true if they are awarded for mental health. Who wants to be honest about their mental condition. Some of you want these folks to announce to the world that they have ptsd TBI, depression, etc... how many of you have a close friend that is suffering from mental health? Let the proffesionals handle the diagnosis.

Response by Jaste Aja made Dec 19 at 2016 9:48 PM

Jaste Aja — Mon, 19 Dec 2016 21:48:13 -0500

Most mental health sufferers won't be honest about their condition. That explains why they talk about how they garmed the system. Who wants to announce to the world that they have metal health condition. I guarantee you people around you will slowly and surely start to avoid you. How many of you have a best friend that is dealing with severe mental health . Let me answer it for you "none" . So they are afraid of rejection . Let the proffesionals deal with diagnosis

Response by CPL Roma Maro made Apr 4 at 2017 4:28 PM

CPL Roma Maro — Tue, 04 Apr 2017 16:28:20 -0400

A G.I. always meant general issue, which equates to Kleenex, use it and throw it to the dust bin.

Response by SSgt Harvey "Skip" Porter made Nov 16 at 2017 3:10 PM

SSgt Harvey "Skip" Porter — Thu, 16 Nov 2017 15:10:16 -0500

You must understand they only provide lip service. Their concerns are with their wealthy donors not the folks who protect and serve this country. You can tell when they are telling a lie just watch when their lips are moving then you know they lying.

Response by SPC David Willis made Nov 16 at 2017 3:16 PM

SPC David Willis — Thu, 16 Nov 2017 15:16:30 -0500

Frankly because many Vets who claim disability are bullshitting the system. I know several guys from my old units that claim it, and worked the system even though they got out perfectly healthy. And the folks who work at out processing centers even encourage or enable it. When I was getting out a civilian looked at my hearing test and said I could probably get some disability for it even though I can hear things fine 90-95% of the time.

Response by SGT Frank Pritchett made Nov 16 at 2017 11:33 PM

SGT Frank Pritchett — Thu, 16 Nov 2017 23:33:48 -0500

Because most of the GOP are college graduates and their only concept of Military Training is Gomer Pyle and he was a good Acting Marine. What should be asked is "what was your experience while going through the MEBD process".

Response by Maj William Raney II made Nov 17 at 2017 12:55 AM

Maj William Raney II — Fri, 17 Nov 2017 00:55:59 -0500

Not going to go into the funding issues or the politics behind them. Way above my pay grade.
What I know, at least when I retired in 2014, is that DoD enlisted the help of Dept of Labor to deliver transition training to military personnel leaving, regardless of retirement or separation under honorable conditions. Required training was a week, and included a fairly extensive session on how to apply for VA disability. Contractors advised us on how to best work the VA. Apnea was brought up, I certainly had a problem with that. I have it, but not as a result of my Marine Corps service so didn't claim it. I used to scratch $1 tickets with a GySgt (Ret infantry Vietnam) who still has shrapnel in his leg. He refuses disability funding to make sure those who need it get what they need to be better. He is a good man, and changed my outlook

Response by SN Keagan Miller made Mar 13 at 2018 12:14 PM

SN Keagan Miller — Tue, 13 Mar 2018 12:14:20 -0400

As someone who works with homeless disabled vets who are trying to live off of their Service Connected Disability, the rising costs of living are not being caught up with. Hell, even myself as a lowly social worker my own SCD claim is needed just to pay my bills. A 25% increase is a drop in the bucket compared to the offset in cost with access to additional resources, less stress which can reduce drug and alcohol dependency not to mention the obvious increase in mood.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Mar 13 at 2018 1:10 PM

SGM Bill Frazer — Tue, 13 Mar 2018 13:10:05 -0400

I would love it- but since the VA can't seem to control it's construction overruns, get rid of dead wood and lousy people- they would just screw it up, and we would suffer a reduction in services.

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Mar 15 at 2018 12:14 AM

SSG Edward Tilton — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 00:14:36 -0400

I'm happy if I don't ground. They gave $1.5 Trillion to the rich

Response by MSG Louis Alexander made Mar 15 at 2018 12:30 AM

MSG Louis Alexander — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 00:30:28 -0400

It would interfere with giving themselves pay raises and spending more government taxes

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 15 at 2018 2:08 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 15 Mar 2018 02:08:10 -0400

One thing that is left out here is that this is tax-free money. That substantially enhances the buying power of the benefit paid to disabled Veterans.
VA Comp is meant to replace a percentage of the earning power that a Veteran might miss out on due to their service-connected injury/illness, not become a sole source of income.
VA Pension is a needs based benefit usually awarded to elderly Veterans with very high medical expenses. Most of the recipients are in a nursing home or receive in-home care.
Paying both is prohibited by law. However, there are situations where a higher amount (sometimes much higher) in Special Monthly Compensation. This is for amputees, paralyzed, or blinded or deafened Veterans. Monthly Compensation for these individuals can approach or exceed $8k per month.

One of the better initiatives in VA is the education and employment assistance offered to Veterans receiving disability compensation. The idea is to help the Veterans find self-worth and fulfilment by training them and matching them with jobs they can do despite their disabilities. Ideally, a Veteran would supplement their income from Comp, and quite possibly prosper and thrive and not just live meagerly from the dole. This is an outstanding program that if I had a magic wand I would see funded even more robustly.

Response by SGT Ivan Mckinney made Apr 25 at 2019 6:51 AM

SGT Ivan Mckinney — Thu, 25 Apr 2019 06:51:18 -0400

It will help me Tremendously for me and my family,the coast of life is going up not Down

Response by Robert Bohrer made Jul 6 at 2019 7:42 PM

Robert Bohrer — Sat, 06 Jul 2019 19:42:50 -0400

An increase would help me make ends meet as a Vietnam disabled vet. I get no retirement so an increase would be wonderful. Stop financing wars and take better care of the vets. That’s my two cents worth.