Why is there a perception that taking a recruiting company command can hurt your career?

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 21:03:27 -0400

Is there a stigma in the operational Army that taking a company command in recruiting is not as challenging as a regular command? Do you believe that officers who command in recruiting don't learn the competencies that an officer who commands a line unit learns?

Response by SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL made Jun 1 at 2016 9:10 PM

SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 21:10:39 -0400

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member the status quo, I would pay attention to the AAR-board and DA PAM 600-3 to get a better assessment of career progression/development.

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made Jun 1 at 2016 9:23 PM

CPT Mark Gonzalez — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 21:23:53 -0400

It is a command, but as a 70B recruiting is a good way to become a 70F. As long as you are ok with that it shouldn't be an issue. Regarding the entire Army commands are viewed in tiers and of course biases exist and comments about "real commands" are made. However, units are different and the competencies you master will be different based upon your mission. We only know what we know and you cannot become an expert in a craft that isn't within your mission.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 1 at 2016 9:45 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 21:45:38 -0400

I have been told that "they" only pick those that couldn't make it in the operational army as CDRs for those units. I professionally feel that a command is a command. You will still have soldier issues to deal with also meeting your mission. In some ways it is even more challenging because you cam more easily jave your career ruined.

Response by LTC Kevin B. made Jun 1 at 2016 9:46 PM

LTC Kevin B. — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 21:46:36 -0400

The big issues I've always heard about recruiting commands are a) they're not as challenging and b) you're often held accountable for the results of not meeting your recruiting mission. The former is a perception that is not always based in reality. The latter may be a result of an unattainable mission and/or circumstances beyond your control. The bottom line....any command is an honor, and always do well in whatever command you have.

Response by SGM Erik Marquez made Jun 1 at 2016 10:04 PM

SGM Erik Marquez — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 22:04:18 -0400

yes there is, and no they don't
Not that they are not capable, but leading 3, 4 SM and working with a lot of civilians is not going to give you the same experience as leading 120 (or more). that does not mean the Recruiter command officer did not gain experience, valuable experience, but the reality is, its not the same, equal to, nor as good a prep to take a battalion, maybe be an Xo on the way to a battalion

Response by 1SG Brian Adams made Jun 1 at 2016 11:01 PM

1SG Brian Adams — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 23:01:42 -0400

Excuse me for commenting on this subject gentlemen, I was in recruiting for almost 15 years. The Majors or Captains that actually command a recruiting company can be extremely challenging. There is a monthly ARTEP, with a real mission that must be accomplished. It is a different kind of leadership and command that requires the utmost of skills, knowledge, and duress. It is a pressure cooker. Yet all the leadership basics still must be implemented. Awards, UCMJ, training, esprit de corp, health and welfare, PT, etc...still come into play. No, I believe commanding a recruiting company is an advantage not only for promotion, but for experience in a different venue. Not sure why there is a stigma. If you ask officers that have already commanded a recruiting comapany, they will tell you it was rewarding.

Response by Maj John Bell made Jun 1 at 2016 11:11 PM

Maj John Bell — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 23:11:59 -0400

When sabre-toothed hamsters roamed the Earth, Company grade Marine officers that wanted to make Field grade requested assignment to major commands with lots of peers to be rated against. Ticket punching was not that important until you hit field grade.

I always called my monitor and asked what billets did he need to fill that were "unknowns". That's how I got Barracks duty and Embassy duty. Probably not the best career moves but absolutely the best assignments of my working life.

Response by SSG Thomas Gallegos made Jun 1 at 2016 11:43 PM

SSG Thomas Gallegos — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 23:43:35 -0400

In some ways it's harder in my opinion. Having been a recruiter right after my first deployment was very tough. With the onset of a very young war, our company commander faced a lot of hell.

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made Jun 2 at 2016 1:17 AM

CAPT Kevin B. — Thu, 02 Jun 2016 01:17:01 -0400

I'll give a little Navy tilt. Most SMs don't understand recruiting if they've never done it. So when someone goes off to be a flesh peddler, they aren't doing a real job in their specialty, hence won't be as good when they finally come back to the real world. Also, having sat boards that had ENL and OFF types who were pulled away for say 3 years got to be a problem if they were lagging in pedigree quals. Additionally, the Evals and Fitreps were typically hard to decipher and correlate to others. I think the "perception" has some basis in seeing the long term result. It got bad enough that officers just go recruiting as a career understanding they are capped at O-4 but can do 15 years out of the same house. It suits some just fine.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 2 at 2016 1:28 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 02 Jun 2016 01:28:26 -0400

I would imagine that recruiting faces different types of challenges. Each command/assignment presents different learning opportunities.
My 2 commands have been very different. There is no set checklists or standards for different commands so without personally experiencing each it is hard to make a comparison.
I can understand why people would believe it's easier in recruiting, due to ignorance about your responsibilities or believing that commanding fewer is easier.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 2 at 2016 1:57 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 02 Jun 2016 01:57:52 -0400

I think the stigma boils down to 600-3.... And your Branch's interpretation of it. In MFE... Every basic branch has a fairly linear opportunity to command in an operational unit. IN, AR, & FA all have linear paths to command twice -

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 2 at 2016 3:01 AM

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 02 Jun 2016 03:01:40 -0400

How about this. A commander in the field has considerable more control over the outcome of a firefight or other trouble. As a Recruiting Company Commander,there is one area of the OER that will never be solely in the hands of the officer. If the general public influences the volunteers that make up a portion of the OER measured by the numbers, hard to overcome bad PR or the spoils of war. I spent 3 months in Philly as a recruiter. It took me that long to conclude that I was not a recruiter and actually didn't want to be one

Response by COL Sam Russell made Jun 2 at 2016 7:47 AM

COL Sam Russell — Thu, 02 Jun 2016 07:47:02 -0400

I was an assignment officer at PERSCOM in the '90s and it was informal policy that we assigned officers to recruiting who had received an adverse or below average OER in their line company command. The thought process was that the only chance for those captains to make major was to excel in a second company command. The result was not surprising, recruiting command had almost a 0% select rate to major.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 2 at 2016 8:14 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 02 Jun 2016 20:14:20 -0400

I've never seen recruiting commands offered to CPTs with no prior command experience. I've always seen it more like a broadening assignment post first guidon. Did you take over without prior command experience?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2016 12:42 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 03 Jun 2016 12:42:41 -0400

We had several Captains relieved in the 3 years I was in recruiting. 2 were relieved for attempting to bribe recruiters to get their gunners badge, and one was for an inappropriate relationship. I'm not sure if there was something in the water or what, but at least 3 Captains in 3 years seems a high turn over rate.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2016 3:32 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 03 Jun 2016 15:32:27 -0400

When I received my HR brief at CCC they stated command is command regardless of where it is, you just need to excel. A strong command OER in recruiting is better than an average one somewhere else. My previous battalion commander had a second command in recruiting in the late 90's early 00's and was recently selected for promotion to Colonel.

Response by SFC Nancy Hawk made Nov 2 at 2019 11:06 AM

SFC Nancy Hawk — Sat, 02 Nov 2019 11:06:20 -0400

Soldiering in recruit command seem to be driven for the numbers. Recruit command escapees are a bit shell shocked.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 4 at 2019 12:05 PM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 04 Nov 2019 12:05:03 -0500

Recruiting may be hazardous to your career. If you are successful it's good and vice versa. Granted, it's not in the same sense as when in the Fleet, but COs are given a monthly mission, same as the NCOICs of each sub-station. They either accomplish the mission or they don't. Their appraisals and career are based on consistent success or failure. The difference, at least in USMC, is that fitreps for enlisted are written by CO and reviewed by a Colonel District Director. The CO's fitrep is written by the Director and reviewed by his next senior, usually a GO, so it's more critical. There are deviations by using XO(s) but the stakes are still higher due to increased responsibility placed on the Commanding Officer. When a Director has to rank his RS COs, performance is mostly what counts. Despite it being outside the Operating Forces, the stigma of being ranked in the middle or other than the top for a Major can lead to difficulty for next step to Lt Col. Mission accomplished is the key.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 4 at 2019 1:24 PM

Cpl Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 04 Nov 2019 13:24:03 -0500

Not making recruitment goals would be the only thing that hurts your career. Be the salesman that beats your stated goals; shine.

Response by 1SG Rick Seekman made Dec 18 at 2020 11:05 PM

1SG Rick Seekman — Fri, 18 Dec 2020 23:05:30 -0500

Oh, its no perception!