Will bringing back Drill Sergeants to AIT change the level of discipline in Soldiers?

2017-08-17T23:56:48-04:00

I am currently an AIT Platoon Sergeant and our student to cadre ratios vary from 64:1 to 120:1, and we run back to back classes every 8 weeks. Unless the Army plans on increasing an AIT Unit's MTOE to mirror a BCT company, I feel the level of discipline will remain the same. We don't need a hat and a badge we just need more NCO presence!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2017 9:42 AM

2017-08-18T09:42:59-04:00

When I reclassed to 15T, those mouth breathers could have benefitted from having Drill Sergeants. I enjoyed H Co though, where they sent all the reclasses. As long as you went to class and went to PT formation, the rest of the day was yours and you didn't have anyone breathing down your neck. So if this only effected IET soldiers, I'd be ok with it.. lol

Response by SGT Dave Tracy made Aug 18 at 2017 10:50 AM

2017-08-18T10:50:57-04:00

I definitely think having Drill Sergeants augmenting the cadre in AIT is a great idea for new soldiers to help maintain general soldier knowledge learned in basic, good discipline, and military bearing. I went to OSUT, and then went to my Infantry unit afterward, having not known many non-combat arms people for the longest time. I knew those soldiers had separate AITs for their MOS, but for the longest time didn't know they had no DSs-which turns out, explained a lot. ;-)

For those experienced soldiers who are reclassing its not necessary; if such soldiers don't have general soldier knowledge, discipline, and military bearing in their daily life, having a crusty DS barking at them like new privates will not only not help anyway, but it would probably be counter productive.

Response by 1SG Frank Boynton made Aug 18 at 2017 12:55 PM

2017-08-18T12:55:25-04:00

I did my trail time at Ft Dix between 1981 through 83. There 2 brigades, the 3rd was basic and the 5th was AIT. The drill sgt's in the 5th were pretty much useless. The took the troops to breakfast, marched them to training turned them over to the cadre and picked them up in the evening matches them to dinner. In surge cycles I had as many as 120 trainees in basic training and had one other drill sgt. I ageee with adding to the cadre staff, but not drill sgt's. it would be a waste of their training and talents.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 19 at 2017 12:32 PM

2017-08-19T12:32:24-04:00

A lot of opinions, and even policy, tend to come from people who have never held the position. Which blows my mind.

You're exactly correct, and you know it. But we both know the people actually doing the jobs who will be affected by the change typically aren't consulted.

Senior leaders seem to think Drill Sergeants are a magical discipline infusing tool. Just like AIT PSGs, they're only as useful as the structure allows.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 20 at 2017 2:04 AM

2017-08-20T02:04:06-04:00

Being lower enlisted, I don't think my opinion counts for much, but since I came from AIT about a year ago perhaps I can give some insight on my personal experience. I agree for the most part of what SSG Stampfly is saying. I don't know if I necessarily agree that there was a lack of NCO presence, but rather an inconsistency of NCOs. Drill Sergeants are with the trainees day in, and day out, which personally helped me to develop a healthy level of respect for our leadership. You could basically never escape them. Whereas in AIT, we would only interact with our PSGs during morning PT and after POI times for an evening formation brief. During POI times we would be with an entirely different set of instructors/NCOs. After evening formation, we would receive soldier's time, and then promptly hit the rack after final formation. I still enjoyed getting to learn from the experiences of my PSGs, but it wasn't to the same degree I got to learn from my Drill Sergeants. I think because of that inconsistency, I saw a lot of dumb things take place. Essentially, IET soldiers acting like depraved animals because they can't stand to train for a few more weeks. Pretty pathetic. If discipline is the issue the Army is facing today, a structural re-working of AIT would need to take place so that the PSGs are also the same instructors of our MOS training during POI hours. On a positive note, I do think that AIT PSGs deserve the recognition and extra pay that Drill Sergeants receive.

Response by CW2 Stephen Pate made Aug 20 at 2017 4:17 AM

2017-08-20T04:17:14-04:00

I agree. When I was an AITPSG at Ft Lee we were so undermanned it was ridiculous. It was myself and one other NCO for a company of 300-500 Privates almost the entire two years I was there. 75% manning the MTOE was acceptable in TRADOC according to the leadership at the time.

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Aug 20 at 2017 3:14 PM

2017-08-20T15:14:55-04:00

Drills have not been in AIT for many, many years. Drill Sergeants have a distinct place in Basic training, AIT comes in many forms, this is where young Soldiers must learn how to cary themselves in manner which will be there throughout their career. They must learn what it means to take orders and act appropriately in the absence of orders. The Army needs to fix the ratio of NCO to Soldier in AIT-Teams, Section/Squads and Platoons, to replicate that of regular units.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 22 at 2017 8:45 AM

2017-08-22T08:45:57-04:00

Negative, I don't think so. I did my AITPSG from '13-'15 and the same stuff my Soldiera did, I did as a Private with DS in my AIT. I even ran into my DS when I was an AITPSG and he laughed when he saw my badge and said, "Uh huh, now you know what I had to put up with." My DS didn't have it easy with us.
As an AITPSG, at one time I had 132 Soldiers by myself. So, increasing the presence of NCOs would be extremely beneficial. There aren't enough PSGs to share the load and project leader presence. "The mice will play when the cat is away."

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 22 at 2017 9:48 AM

2017-08-22T09:48:04-04:00

If it was like when I was in AIT, Drill SGT's handled the day to day stuff and MOS instructors handle the class portion, freeing both groups up to focus on their part. I always thought AIT drill SGT's were more angry and picky than Basic Drill SGT's because they had more free time to focus on stupid stuff. I cannot say about all AIT sites but I spend allot of time from 2013 to 2014 at Ft. Lee and I found it to be more like a college campus than a military post.

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 27 at 2018 10:40 PM

2018-01-27T22:40:47-05:00

At least for 35n ait drill sergeants don't really have a place as they did in bct. It's more of there's no NCOs present majority of the time. We are mainly in an office for ait and just having more supervision would be enough to restore discipline. A lot of the time there are so many soldiers you rarely see your psg except in the morning and may not even interact with squad leaders.