Will I need an age waiver to enlist, and how hard is it to get? Would I be able to put in a packet for WO right away, if I choose that route?

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 28 Sep 2019 21:36:31 -0400

I'm glad I found this community (hopefully not too late). My recruiter convinced me to enlist (my decision in the end) opposed to attempting OCS. He advised me that with my work background and degrees I would be a strong candidate for OCS after AIT. Below is my experience and education:

- MS in Cyber security
- DBA in Business Intelligence

I have worked in security roles for the past 10 years.

I'm 32, turning 33 in January - then I will not graduate from AIT until (Aug2020). Will I need an age waiver? (How hard is it to get it if needed)? Would I be able to put in a packet for warrant right away if I choose that route? I'm going in as a 35Q Cryptologic Network Warfare Specialist (bonus got me) I had been able to reserve 17C, but no bonus.

Thanks in advance for any tips/suggestions and feedback.

God bless!

Response by Maj Kim Patterson made Sep 28 at 2019 9:39 PM

Maj Kim Patterson — Sat, 28 Sep 2019 21:39:47 -0400

SPC Private RallyPoint Member tough question. But there are a lot of experienced veterans in here, SP5 Mark Kuzinski Lt Col Stephen Jordan 1stSgt Mac Mastroni MSgt Michael Sterling TSgt Pamela Cleere MRP, SRS, ABR, CRS, GRI, Realtor, RB-22176 Capt Gina Densler MSgt David Heil

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 28 at 2019 9:58 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 28 Sep 2019 21:58:56 -0400

A little more background: I applied for the Cyber Command Direct Commissioning - but was denied (the letter stated that at the time of application they didn't need my skill set) and suggested I enlist, attempt OCS to contribute to the cyber mission etc..

Response by PV2 Robert H. made Sep 28 at 2019 10:01 PM

PV2 Robert H. — Sat, 28 Sep 2019 22:01:49 -0400

Bear one thing in mind with the contract bonus... you will not receive it all in 1 lump sum. It will be ~10,000 upfront after AIT and the rest payed out in monthly installments with your paycheck for the duration of your contract. Learned thatbone the hard way when i was told i was getting a 40k enlistment bonus for 92F.. so dont count on a single penny from that until AIT is complete. And then, with you wanting to reclass so quickly, i dont know if thr Army will force you to payback that enlistment bonus... they pay that inorder to secure soldiers for a contrats length of time in THAT position. If you fail to comolete the required length of service you're then required to pay the FULL bonus amount back to the Army... so if you do receive any amount just be warry of spending any until you get a definant answer from the Army on whether they're gonna make you return it or not.. last thing you need is to be paying your employer in order to work for them.

Best of luck in either OCS or WO board!

Response by CW3(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 28 at 2019 10:45 PM

CW3(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 28 Sep 2019 22:45:39 -0400

For Warrant officer Technician you can apply up to your 46th birthday. You must be pinned before the and even then I had people in my class at 50 years old so at 33 you should be in great shape but I would advise you to do I it now because time flies. Good luck

Response by CPT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 28 at 2019 11:17 PM

CPT(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 28 Sep 2019 23:17:17 -0400

Your recruiter is screwing you. Mine did the same to me. If you are already 32 you will likely not be eligle for OCS after AIT based on age restrictions. Also, I believe you have to be at least one year out of AIT to even apply.

PLEASE do not let your recruiter screw you over. If you plan to take the OCS route do it now!! I promise you will be ineligible if you try later. And age waivers are not a thing for active component.

Your recruiter gets ZERO credit for you if you take OCS route. They have been doing this song and dance for years. I can tell you that firsthand.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 28 at 2019 11:41 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 28 Sep 2019 23:41:06 -0400

From what i understand in order to be a warrant officer you need to at least be an E-5 with two to three ncoers. You have the other prerequisites that are required it seems like. But not the service time.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:25 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:25:55 -0400

https://news.usni.org/2018/06/13/navy-implements-warrant-officer-1-rank-for-cyber-specialists

This is relatively new, if you'd be willing to try intersvc, you might care to ask about it, being masters and doctoral, I should certainly think you could have a reasonable chance at an age waiver...

Navy Brings Back Warrant Officer-1 Rank for Cyber Sailors - USNI News

Navy pay can't keep up with private sector cyber jobs, so the service now offers a quick path to management as a way to keep talent.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:26 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:26:53 -0400

https://www.goarmy.com/army-cyber/cyber-direct-commissioning-program.html

Being Army, you likely know about this, however, I just figured I'd send it anyway....

Cyber Direct Commissioning Program

System admin, web developer, programmer. Put your civilian experience to work and become an officer in the Army through the Cyber Direct Commissioning Program.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:28 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:28:10 -0400

https://www.gocoastguard.com/active-duty-careers/officer-opportunities/programs/direct-commission-engineer-dce

Here's another intersex possibility, I'm unsure if what you'd have would satisfy USCG, again, you might ask, if nothing else....

Direct Commission Engineer (DCE) | GoCoastGuard.com

The direct commission engineer (DCE) program provides engineers and technologists with leadership opportunities in program management, implementing systems that enable and support Coast Guard missions. Experienced C4IT engineers are needed to advance our systems infrastructure in a rapidly modernizing organization.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:28 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:28:35 -0400

http://www.ocsfoundation.org

you might also find the forum pages on here useful....

OCS Foundation

SERVICES FOR: Candidates Alumni Officer Families

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:29 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:29:40 -0400

Elaborate if you can, assocs, bach, grades, GPAs, specific STEM course titles taken, the more you relate, the more I and others can suggest possibly, honest....

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:30 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:30:27 -0400

And don't just think OCS...think OUR direct commission One Of programs, I'd the type of suggested here as well, also, OK?

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:37 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:37:10 -0400

https://www.goarmy.com/careers-and-jobs/current-and-prior-service/advance-your-career/warrant-officer/flight-warrant-officers.html

And regardless.of what a recruiter said, as you'd mentioned, being Army enlisted now, I see no need whatever for you to do what he suggests, you're clearly already oriented on the enlisted side, when I was USAF OTS, many I trained with were prior enlisted, I wasnt, they all generally adjusted to the role far more rapidly than I did...further, any flight interests at all? Army WOCS for rotary or fixed wing maybe? Just because you've gr8 the background you've got doesn't mean you couldn't swtich, with a master's and doctorate, I should certainly think if you'd want flught, whether pilot/aviator, or nav/WSO, your be a comparative slam dunk, if you have inclinations that way at all...Army WOCS for rotary wing only needs high school, assuming you're in age range, I should think you'd have a quite good chance for that, we had a family friend who did it as Army enlisted, got his bach in aviation from Embry Riddle, then Army released him, USCG picked him up, he finished his 20 yrs as a USCG rotary wing O-3....

Flight Warrant Officers

If you have dreamed of becoming a helicopter or fixed-wing pilot, the Army can help you turn that dream into a reality. Warrant Officers fly some of the most exciting, technologically advanced aircraft in the world.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:38 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:38:36 -0400

If you can elaborate as I'd said, I'll try to suggest more, if you'd be interested at all....

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:38 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:38:50 -0400

http://www.crows.org

Look at this....

www.crows.org

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:39 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:39:02 -0400

http://www.afcea.org

And this....

www.afcea.org

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:39 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:39:35 -0400

http://www.mors.org

Ops research is often overlooked as a STEM field, the journal of this group is quite good....

Military Operations Research Society

Bronze BAE Systems CANA Advisors George Mason Volgenau School of Engineering Guidehouse Gurobi Optimization Hartley Consulting Improbable Innovative Decisions JDSAT JMP KaDSci

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:40 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:40:06 -0400

http://www.usni.org

The proceedings of this group should be read reading for all svc mbrs, they're that good...m

United States Naval Institute

The U.S. Naval Institute provides an independent forum for those who seek to advance and strengthen the naval profession.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:40 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:40:14 -0400

Sorry, typo...

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:40 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:40:30 -0400

http://www.navyleague.org

This group also is good....

www.navyleague.org

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:40 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:40:53 -0400

http://www.ausa.org

Them, you doubtless know about....

Association of the United States Army

Voice for the Army – Support for the Soldier

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:41 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:41:10 -0400

http://www.afa.org

Look at them also....

Home

The Air Force Association is the premier professional military association dedicated to dominant air, space, and cyber power, and a strong national defense.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:41 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:41:22 -0400

http://www.same.org

And them....

www.same.org

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:42 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:42:17 -0400

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Force_Institute_of_Technology

Ask about being faculty here....

Air Force Institute of Technology - Wikipedia

The Air Force Institute of Technology (AFIT) is a graduate school and provider of professional and continuing education for the United States Armed Forces and is part of the United States Air Force. It is located in Ohio at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, near Dayton. AFIT is a component of the Air University and Air Education and Training Command.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:44 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:44:34 -0400

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_Postgraduate_School

Ask about being faculty here also...if wanted this and the other place, this one is had an O-6 recommend from my unit CO, I couldn't get it....

Naval Postgraduate School - Wikipedia

The Naval Postgraduate School (NPS) is a public graduate school operated by the United States Navy and located in Monterey, California. It grants master’s degrees, doctoral degrees, and certificates. Established in 1909, the school also offers research fellowship opportunities at the postdoctoral level through the National Academies’ National Research Council research associateship program.[3]

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:45 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:45:20 -0400

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flight_test_engineer

you might also have a fair chance at this....

Flight test engineer - Wikipedia

The flight test engineer generally has overall responsibility for the planning of a specific flight test phase, which includes preparing the test plans in conjunction with other analytical and/or systems engineers, overseeing the buildup of the aircraft to the proper configuration, working with the flight test instrumentation engineer to ensure the sensors and recording systems are installed for required data parameters, and preparing the...

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:46 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:46:58 -0400

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_House_Fellows

given that you're doctoral, I'd definitely submit for this as well, this is what Gen Colin Powell did, as described in his autobiography, instead of a PhD, it was pretty equiiv, obv...I think you'd stand a pretty fair chance, honest....

White House Fellows - Wikipedia

The White House Fellows program was established via Executive Order by President of the United States Lyndon B. Johnson in October 1964, based upon a suggestion from John W. Gardner, who would eventually become the 6th Secretary of Health, Education, and Welfare.[1] The mission of the program is "to give the Fellows first hand, high-level experience with the workings of the federal government and to increase their sense of participation in...

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 1:48 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 01:48:05 -0400

https://www.bing.com/search?q=homeland+security+academy+monterey+calif&FORM=AWRE

Few have heard of this school, I'd found....

homeland security academy monterey calif - Bing

Sep 17, 2019· On August 23, thirty-one students were honored for successfully completing the Center for Homeland Defense and Security’s Executive Leaders Program (ELP) at Naval Postgraduate School in Monterey, CA.

Response by COL David Turk made Sep 29 at 2019 6:37 AM

COL David Turk — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 06:37:43 -0400

May not need to go to OCS. Check this out:
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/us-army_talentmanagement-activity [login to see] 971319296-IpdC

US Army on LinkedIn: "Would you like to "fast-track" towards a career as an Army Cyber Warrior?...

September 28, 2019: US Army posted images on LinkedIn

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 9:52 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 09:52:34 -0400

http://www.usphs.gov

I'm not saying you want this, I'd just thought to send it, as their age limits tend to be rather higher...it's not cyber security, though they do have clinical/med informatics, which, if nothing else, is at least comp sci (CS)/IT related...purely food for thought, they have toll free phones to their recruiting offices, if you might have any inclination to try chatting with them at all....

www.usphs.gov

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 9:54 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 09:54:42 -0400

http://www.omao.noaa.gov

NOAA has a 5-yr flight program, they're pure science, now, that being said, it's not your type of science, clearly, however, once again, just purely food for thought, if you might care to try for it...given you're doctoral level, they're quite picky, I've gathered, being the smallest, thus, being at the top of the intellectual food chain as it were, I just figured you might actually stand a pretty fair chance, if you'd care to try their toll-free phone to chat with them also, obv, that's all, honest....

Office of Marine and Aviation Operations |

Learn about the NOAA Diving Program, which trains, certifies, and equips personnel to safely support underwater missions

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 9:56 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 09:56:22 -0400

https://www.iacr.org/

You might also find this useful reading and/or to join, I'd thought....

The International Association for Cryptologic Research

The International Association for Cryptologic Research (IACR) is a non-profit scientific organization whose purpose is to further research in cryptology and related fields. Cryptology is the science and practice of designing computation and communication systems which are secure in the presence of adversaries.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 9:56 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 09:56:58 -0400

https://search.aol.com/aol/search?q=wikipedia%20error%20correcting%20coding&s_it=loki-tb-sb

Look through these also....

wikipedia%20error%20correcting%20coding - AOL Search Results

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 9:58 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 09:58:02 -0400

https://arxiv.org/search/?query=cryptography&searchtype=all&source=header

There are over 13000 free articles on the whole topic as listed here....

Search | arXiv e-print repository

Authors: Mahya Soleimani Jadidi, Mariusz Zaborski, Brian Kidney, Jonathan Anderson

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 9:58 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 09:58:50 -0400

https://arxiv.org/search/?query=cryptology&searchtype=all&abstracts=show&order=-announced_date_first&size=50

This variation gave 136....

Search | arXiv e-print repository

Authors: Kai Chen, Zhongrui Lin, Jian Wan, Lei Xu, Chungen Xu

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 9:59 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 09:59:49 -0400

http://www.ieee.org

Join this, esp their information theory, signal processing, and aerospace electronics societies, they also have comm systems, a host of other stuff, if you've never seen any of their material at all....

IEEE - The world's largest technical professional organization dedicated to advancing technology...

Have you heard? #5G is going to change the world, from everyday communication to the enablement of new, large-scale technologies. Here are 5 ways the network will impact your workplace and beyond from #IEEE Senior member Babak Beheshti and IEEE Member Marcelo Zuffo.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 10:00 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 10:00:12 -0400

http://www.acm.org

This is the comp sci (CS)/IT equiv org....

Association for Computing Machinery

ACM, the world's largest educational and scientific computing society, delivers resources that advance computing as a science and a profession. ACM provides the computing field's premier Digital Library and serves its members and the computing profession with leading-edge publications, conferences, and career resources.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 10:01 AM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 10:01:38 -0400

https://search.aol.com/aol/search?q=ieee%20wcre%20saner&s_it=loki-tb-sb

These are the formal serious groups dealing with decompilation and/or disassembly, not the infantile stuff for kids, the real thing, I've had serious research interests in such topics for a long while....

ieee%20wcre%20saner - AOL Search Results

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 29 at 2019 12:28 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 12:28:12 -0400

At the end of the day, I’m happy to have enlisted to serve and help lead/mentor some of the younger soldiers I will serve with. I will do what I can from the rank and role I possess. Thank you all for taking the time to provide some guidance with great feedback!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 29 at 2019 12:39 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 12:39:59 -0400

Yeah, your recruiter got you on that one....

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 29 at 2019 7:21 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 19:21:01 -0400

Wow, this is crazy. I think he is trying to get you into something that would benefit him more than you. The Army is no different than a corporation when it comes to talent. The best place for you would be as an officer when your background. It is like telling a doctor that he should join to be a medic before trying to work as a doctor. In all honesty what would serve the county the best? Someone with a strong background and degrees to work as a leader or as a follower?

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Sep 29 at 2019 7:45 PM

Capt Daniel Goodman — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 19:45:44 -0400

Glad you apparently found the stuff I'd sent in here of at least some possible value, I'd gathered...once again, if you'd ever care to elaborate at all, in the fashion I'd mentioned, I'll try to suggest more for you, of course, as well, obv, no rush, whenever you'd want, OK?

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 29 at 2019 10:54 PM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 29 Sep 2019 22:54:01 -0400

I used to be a drill not to long ago and I can say this we had tons of people coming in to go straight to OCS which if that’s your ultimate goal I would have done that. I’m not sure about the age but I’m sure there is a waiver for it. However as long as you had a bachelors we had 09S’s (OCS candidates) come in and as soon as they were done with BCT we shipped them straight to OCS. The same goes for Warrant Officers but mainly street to seat. They came in as 09W’s and unless you were prior service I don’t think you can come in and go straight to tech warrant. But I do know that you can go to WOCS as an E-4 but I think that’s only for the street to seat. Regardless whether it’s street to seat or OCS though if you come in as an 09S or 09W you’ll be an E-4 for BCT then get promoted to E-5 on record (receive E-5 pay) while you are a candidate. This isn’t the first time I heard this. I had SO many soldiers come to be as a drill and tell me their recruiter told them to go enlisted first then put a packet in for OCS later. And in the same class I had others that came in specifically to go to OCS after graduating BCT both of which came in with the same level of education. I’m assuming by what you said you already signed the contract so I would just do what you need to until after AIT while doing research and put your OCS packet together. However if you end up becoming an NCO before you will not only get the perception from both the enlisted and commissioned side but the O-1E pay will also be a nice bonus.

Response by MSgt Michael Smith made Sep 30 at 2019 12:38 PM

MSgt Michael Smith — Mon, 30 Sep 2019 12:38:23 -0400

Your recruiter is BSing you.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 30 at 2019 4:57 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 30 Sep 2019 16:57:04 -0400

you do not need an age waiver; You have until you are 34 if you do not have prior service. If you want OCS or Warrant e mail me, I can get you a packet. The selection board only meets quarterly so, if you want it go for it. Secondly, I do get "credit" if I get an applicant to go OCS, so CPT Everett is incorrect. I'd be happy to process your packet or get you to the closest Battalion for the board. [login to see]

Response by CPT William Jones made Nov 18 at 2019 12:22 AM

CPT William Jones — Mon, 18 Nov 2019 00:22:53 -0500

get everything on enlistment contract if you haven't enlisted yet. No verbal promises are valid. you want OCS make sure there is a slot and you are guaranteed if qualifies.

Response by SSG Aaron Gough made Dec 22 at 2019 6:52 PM

SSG Aaron Gough — Sun, 22 Dec 2019 18:52:57 -0500

You can, 100%, go into OCS out of Basic Training. The MOS code is O9S, Officer Candidate. It doesn't matter if you plan on the active route or reserves. The only difference is you must already have your degree for active duty. If you are going into the National Guard you only need 60 credit hours to go the traditional route through the state based program, which gets the same results, just over a 1 year time frame.

As far as age goes, to go the officer route you only need to be commissioned before you turn the age of 42. If you plan on going pilot warrant, you need to be in warrant school before turning 33. My recruiter told me the opposite. He told me I should go OCS, and not enlisted. I signed up as a O9S, but ultimately went enlisted and took the Intel route. I didn't become an officer because of, believe it or not, recruiter "mishap," meaning my degree, as well as another gentleman's were rejected for reasons we were not sure of. I went on with my service and the other guy opted out. He was 35 when he joined. By the way I was 27 when I joined, and I have served with gentlemen who were former enlisted, but went officer at the age of 40.

Basically, if you want to be an officer, then do it. Talk to an officer retention officer for better information. I hope this information helps you out.