Will the Army succumb to social pressure and change Ranger school standards?

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 17:44:39 -0400

Odierno said the standards for Ranger School will not change.
"We've set standards for Ranger School for a very long time," he said. "I'm adamant about maintaining that. I do believe it's important we maintain the integrity of the Ranger tab."

Opinion: It’s time to reevaluate standards for women in the military
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/checkpoint/wp/2015/04/16/opinion-its-time-to-reevaluate-standards-for-women-in-the-military/

All 8 women fail Ranger School: Some Rangers say standards should change
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Military/2015/0529/All-8-women-fail-Ranger-School-Some-Rangers-say-standards-should-change-video

What are your thoughts?

5 women cut from Ranger School after second try

Five female Ranger School students have been cut from the course, officials from Fort Benning said. Three others get to start over from Day One.

Response by CPO Joseph Grant made Jun 3 at 2015 5:45 PM

CPO Joseph Grant — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 17:45:44 -0400

Keep the standards up. Lives depend on it.

Response by COL Mikel J. Burroughs made Jun 3 at 2015 5:45 PM

COL Mikel J. Burroughs — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 17:45:50 -0400

The standards should be the same across the board. There are many males soldiers that can't meet the standards.

Response by CSM Michael J. Uhlig made Jun 3 at 2015 6:08 PM

CSM Michael J. Uhlig — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 18:08:55 -0400

Standards will not change, at least not for a while. CW2 Private RallyPoint Member, where are we getting the idea that standards will change? Three have the opportunity to restart again....if they pass they continue on "Succeed & Proceed!"

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2015 6:19 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 18:19:57 -0400

I would really like to know which standards we are talking about? There isn't a female standard for leadership. Do people really think RIs will grade women on patrols less strictly? Squad-mates won't put up with a women not carrying her share of the load. You carry your own food, clothes, sleep gear, combat gear, and you share the squad's load of skedco, AT4, radios, ammunition, and crew-served weapons. I nearly went the entire course without carrying the 240.

Are we worried about women not being required to do 42 pushups? What an irrelevant measure of strength. Better tests of the physical abilities required for success in Ranger School (and combat) are the 12 mile road march and the Darby Queen. Eight female Candidates, nearly half of all women to attend the course, passed both of those standards.

We will be better as an Army and a military when we stop hoping for our teammates' failure.

Response by SSG Roger Ayscue made Jun 3 at 2015 6:26 PM

SSG Roger Ayscue — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 18:26:41 -0400

Regrettably so, I think because we are the pawns of politicians that have bumpkus for military experience and even less common sense.

Response by SFC Maury Gonzalez made Jun 3 at 2015 6:33 PM

SFC Maury Gonzalez — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 18:33:18 -0400

They all got ranger haircuts, give them that :-)

Response by CPT Ahmed Faried made Jun 3 at 2015 7:34 PM

CPT Ahmed Faried — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 19:34:46 -0400

No.

Response by SCPO Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2015 10:05 PM

SCPO Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 22:05:56 -0400

I'd believe Ray Odierno first. But he could easily be outflanked by his higher ups...politicians!!!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2015 10:06 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 22:06:41 -0400

I think it is fair to ask if the established standards are, indeed, necessary where they are at. Are the standards truly relevant to the training?

If so, keep them. If not, modify them-- and that may include making them harder, too.

Then, whatever the realistic, relevant standards are, let all who can meet them apply, succeed, and serve.

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2015 11:08 PM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 23:08:59 -0400

Public opinion had a great impact on implementing EO policies, SHARP, repealing DODT, and latest changes in AR 670-1. How will public opinion influence ranger, infantry, and other mostly male schools?

Response by LCpl Mark Lefler made Jun 3 at 2015 11:10 PM

LCpl Mark Lefler — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 23:10:49 -0400

hopefully they will not change the standards, everyone should get a chance at it if they want, but it should be all the same standards.

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2015 11:18 PM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 03 Jun 2015 23:18:08 -0400

Response by SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA made Jun 6 at 2015 6:04 PM

SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA — Sat, 06 Jun 2015 18:04:57 -0400

Will the Army succumb to social pressure and change Ranger school standards?

NO.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 6 at 2015 6:14 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 06 Jun 2015 18:14:36 -0400

With so many changes, including repealing "don't ask don't tell".
Wouldn't doubt it!

Response by CW2 Pamela (Carpenter) Wolf made Aug 10 at 2015 4:28 AM

CW2 Pamela (Carpenter) Wolf — Mon, 10 Aug 2015 04:28:53 -0400

Just as an update to this posting about the women who are now completing Ranger School....

https://www.rallypoint.com/answers/it-appears-the-first-two-females-at-ranger-school-might-graduate-soon-what-questions-does-this-answer?urlhash=874137&cid=676091&utm_campaign=activity&utm_content=notifications&utm_medium=unpaid&utm_source=email

Response by 1SG William T. Wade III made May 20 at 2016 10:34 AM

1SG William T. Wade III — Fri, 20 May 2016 10:34:30 -0400

As a recently retired guy that attended the 1st easy class of Ranger School back in 1996, the standards have changed, and will continue to change to help meet the political agenda. Make the male standard, the only standard in the Army. It is the only way to make sure standards are not lowered to give everyone a participation trophy. The 1st 14 years of my career were in Infantry units. The last 13 years were in Special Operations, and we had females on our teams. We were afforded the ability to maintain the same standards for males and females. The standards got rid of both males and females, but both males and females met the standards. We deployed together, and everyone pulled their fare share of the weight.

All that being said, I don't think there is a need for females in the Infantry, or Ranger Regiments other than some power people that are stuck on political correctness, and don't care about the negative effects. There are places in certain teams with specific missions as in my former unit. I have yet to see one good explanation of why women should be in the Infantry, or Ranger Regiment. Please, someone give me a good, tactical reason for females to be in these units.