Will the Navy really charge LCDR White? If so, how does that make you feel?

2015-08-01T20:34:58-04:00

"Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six." Not sure how a text to Allen West is an official news release, so we'll see if this is actually true. If so, the Navy will take a huge punch to the eye if it proceeds. The backlash will be strong and righteous. "We have reached ludicrous speed." http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2015/08/report-navy-officer-who-fired-on-islamist-during-chattanooga-terror-attack-will-be-charged/

REPORT: Navy to Charge Officer Who Fired on Islamist During Chattanooga Terror Attack - The...

Navy Lt. Commander will reportedly be charged for shooting at the Chattanooga terrorist Lt Commander Timothy White and Islamist killer ...

Response by SN Greg Wright made Aug 1 at 2015 8:39 PM

2015-08-01T20:39:54-04:00

He violated an order. Cut and dried. Therefore, he should be called into a room with his commander, from which loud noises will issue for an extended period of time, and then he should be seen walking out to go have a beer with his buddies, sans any official reprimand other than the one he'd just had.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Aug 1 at 2015 8:57 PM

2015-08-01T20:57:22-04:00

We need more information.

Not to attack the source (as opposed to the messenger CAPT Private RallyPoint Member) , but we're getting "breadcrumbs". We just don't have enough information to form a valid opinion as of yet.

We're still in the "investigation" phase right now. All we know if that the Commander was armed. We know it was against Regs. He violated Regs. Now, they may "charge" him, but charging someone ranges from a p11 (administrative entry) to a full blown Courts Martial, or even Civilian Criminal Action.

I think the source cited may just be jumping to conclusions, and making a mountain out of molehills.

Response by LTC Bink Romanick made Aug 1 at 2015 9:08 PM

2015-08-01T21:08:18-04:00

I hope that cooler heads prevail and that they decide not to charge him. This sends the exact wrong message.

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Aug 1 at 2015 9:14 PM

2015-08-01T21:14:32-04:00

Discussion redundant with https://www.rallypoint.com/answers/should-lcdr-timothy-white-be-disciplined-for-having-a-weapon-on-the-navy-operational-support-center
RallyPoint Team My merge topic function appears non-functional, I tried minutes after this thread started a few times.

Should LCDR Timothy White be disciplined for having a weapon on the Navy Operational Support...

Response by COL Mikel J. Burroughs made Aug 1 at 2015 10:25 PM

2015-08-01T22:25:01-04:00

CAPT Private RallyPoint Member Unfortunately, he broke a regulation, but most likely saved additional lives, so that will be taken into consideration. Hopefully, they will do what they have to do to make sure that discipline is always prevalent in the uniformed services, give him a small slap on the hand, then award him a medal for taking the initiative to think quickly and do what he was trained to do when faced with adversity. Regulations are there for a reason and they must go through the process. Hate to say it and be the bad guy, but it is what it is! Just my opinion.

Response by Sgt Joe LaBranche made Aug 1 at 2015 10:25 PM

2015-08-01T22:25:24-04:00

Would this happen on the watch of any previous administration? When you are sent in to battle you should have every right to protect yourself and come home in one piece. When I hear or read of situations like this my mind thinks back to Vietnam and how we were betrayed. It makes me angry.

Response by COL Mikel J. Burroughs made Aug 1 at 2015 10:26 PM

2015-08-01T22:26:33-04:00

Response by MAJ Matthew Arnold made Aug 1 at 2015 10:42 PM

2015-08-01T22:42:39-04:00

Unbelievable! A Naval Officer defends Naval personnel and is charged with a crime?

Response by Capt Seid Waddell made Aug 2 at 2015 12:53 AM

2015-08-02T00:53:54-04:00

LCDR White clearly violated an equally clearly foolish regulation. The violation was the better part of valor. Think of it as leaning forward.

Response by SGM Steve Wettstein made Aug 2 at 2015 1:08 AM

2015-08-02T01:08:13-04:00

He knowingly broke a federal law. With that being said, give him a good ass chewing.

Response by SSgt Alex Robinson made Aug 2 at 2015 2:54 AM

2015-08-02T02:54:14-04:00

If there's enough outcry from the public they will back down. They don't want to look bad.

Response by CW4 Guy Butler made Aug 2 at 2015 7:11 AM

2015-08-02T07:11:48-04:00

No.

http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/08/navy_denies_reports_sailor_wil.html

Response by SSG Michael O'Malley made Aug 2 at 2015 11:59 AM

2015-08-02T11:59:18-04:00

Navy confirms LT CMD White will NOT be charged.

http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2015/08/navy_denies_reports_sailor_wil.html

Navy denies it is charging sailor who fired weapon

The U.S. Navy is denying reports that it will file charges against a naval officer who used a weapon to return fire against Chattanooga gunman Muhammad Abdulazeez during last month's deadly attack.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 2 at 2015 11:28 PM

2015-08-02T23:28:12-04:00

That attack meets the number one criteria for the use of deadly force: self defense and the defense of others. What message does this send to our junior soldiers and sailors?

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 3 at 2015 7:56 AM

2015-08-03T07:56:50-04:00

I withheld my initial response (waiting for the cooler side of the brain to kick in). Here's my take-I understand the importance of enforcing regs; without discipline, everything goes out the window. However, what sort of individual would you rather have in command, someone whose instincts are to wait for orders ...or someone who's first instinct is to take immediate action to combat a threat to his sailors? I'm surprised no one has mentioned the Marine Corps major and pilot killed in Kabul some time back during a terrorist raid. That gentleman jumped up from chow with nothing more than his M9, organized what troops he could muster, and hit the enemy on his own initiative. I'd like to know how this situation is any different (as I recall, it wasn't 'per regs' to roll hot at Phoenix either).

More functionally, how long is it going to take the DOD to realize that in today's world, any military installation is a potential target? I say train up the personnel at the Reserve Centers in Force Protection, post an armed watch just like these same sailors and Marines would do anywhere else, and have an OOD with a sidearm and a radio. This HAS been done stateside already, so what's the hold-up? We don't want to show the "wrong image" to the civilians?

I agree with some of the comments here about a "slap on the wrist" only because you have to consider the other half of this issue...the officer was using his own weapon outside of an organized protocol. Don't want every service member with (or without) a carry permit John Wayne-ing a situation and potentially making it worse. Take the existing FP protocols...train the personnel...protect this house.

Response by PO2 Mark Saffell made Aug 3 at 2015 12:34 PM

2015-08-03T12:34:03-04:00

I say proceed with the trial, Find him NOT Guilty. award him a metal and call for the resignation of the Secretary of the Navy and his Boss the President for actions against this country. These two would rather do harm to this country than admit neither one has ANY idea on how to run a military. One last question. Is it a violation of an order when that order is not a legal or in this case a smart order?

Response by Cpl Chris Rice made Aug 3 at 2015 8:50 PM

2015-08-03T20:50:25-04:00

I for one am completely shocked that Former Representative Allen West would not be completely honest (Eye Roll).

http://www.chattanoogan.com/2015/8/2/305393/Roy-Exum-Navy-Denies-Any-Charges.aspx

Roy Exum: Navy Denies Any Charges - Chattanoogan.com

UPDATE: A spokesman for the U.S. Navy on Sunday denied reports that disciplinary charges will be filed against Lt. Cmdr. Timothy White for discharging an unauthorized weapon on federal property.

Response by COL Korey Jackson made Aug 4 at 2015 7:48 AM

2015-08-04T07:48:56-04:00

The inherent right to self-defense should not be abridged.

A Navy officer's oath of office, up front, states that "I will defend....against all enemies, foreign and domestic."

The story is in the Washington Post this morning at http://wapo.st/1DpIJa8.

Extracts from DoD Directive 5210.56:

"It is DoD policy that DoD personnel ....have the inherent right to self-defense."

and
"Deadly force is authorized under the following circumstances:
(1) Inherent right to self-defense. When there is a reasonable belief that a person(s) poses an imminent threat of death or serious bodily harm to DoD persons. Self-defense includes defense of other DoD persons in the vicinity."

Outrage and an officer: The anatomy of a Navy controversy after the Chattanooga attack

Pentagon officials told The Washington Post it is unlikely that Lt. Cmdr. Timothy White will face charges for opening fire on the shooter who initiated the attack.

Response by PO1 Kyle Crippen made Aug 5 at 2015 1:21 PM

2015-08-05T13:21:34-04:00

He did disregard an order, so he he should have a letter of reprimand in his service record. Now WHAT that letter says should be up to the CO.

Response by SPC Michael Tierney made Jan 22 at 2023 3:06 PM

2023-01-22T15:06:33-05:00

No charges were ever brought. The violation is having a weapon in an area other than a war zone. or something like that. Apparently, the military is reviewing the restrictions on weapons. A. West has to be one of the most ridiculous excuses for a politician or soldier ever. A liar and a manipulator.

Response by PO2 Mike Vignapiano made Jun 18 at 2023 5:02 PM

2023-06-18T17:02:57-04:00

These standing orders are their for a reason. However, they’re there to prevent harm & carelessness.
This situation he was in was what was in mind behind for this standing order of not to discharge a firearm an federal land. This LCDR should be rewarded for taking action in the face of adversity, with lives already lost & more could’ve been if he didn’t react!
That would be my defense. Awareness of standing orders but to obey would mean more casualties.