Posted on Jun 4, 2015
"Harrisburg police officer wrongly accuses veteran, 75, of 'stolen valor'"
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This article was originally published on pennlive.com:
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An Army soldier attending Artsfest on Memorial Day thought something was fishy with the Marine uniform worn by 75-year-old Robert Ford, who was strolling along Front Street.
Ford's hat bore some wrinkles, according to the soldier's assessment, and his belt buckle looked too ornate for his rank.
The soldier enlisted the help of a Harrisburg police officer working at the event, who was a Marine, and together, they accused Ford of being a fraud.
"He's not a real Marine!" the officer shouted to the crowd gathered for the PennLive/Patriot-News Artsfest of Greater Harrisburg. "Stolen valor!"
"I was humiliated," said Ford, of Marysville.
The only problem is Ford did serve in the Marines from 1958 to 1964. He earned the rank of lance corporal.
"He's as legit as you can get," said Doug Sterner, a Vietnam veteran and archivist from Pueblo, Colo., who is nationally recognized for detecting military fraud. Sterner confirmed Ford's military service this week through Headquarters Marine Corps.
The incident in Harrisburg, Sterner said, represents a troubling trend across the country of veterans becoming vigilantes.
Veterans are angry, Sterner said, after a federal law about "stolen valor," was struck down in 2012 and a meeker version passed in its place. Under the new law, few cases are being investigated or prosecuted against people who falsely claim military awards or service, Sterner said.
"The veteran community, frustrated and upset, is saying, 'OK. We'll do it ourselves,' " Sterner said. "But what it's leading to is a bunch of hot heads. ... There's a lot of bullying going on in the community now. It's almost like hunting game, going out looking for phonies."
In many cases, veterans or others who spot inconsistences are rewarded for their efforts. In Pennsylvania alone, people outed Jim Moats, of Newville, for his fake Navy Seal story; Brian Khan, of Harrisburg, for pretending to be a Marine; and Mark Kauffman, a veteran who's disabled status became an issue in March.
B.G. "Jug" Burkett, a Dallas-area Vietnam veteran who wrote a book entitled, "Stolen Valor," understands why people get upset at fakes who try to gain respect by claiming they served "shoulder to shoulder with those who gave their lives for America."
Burkett has helped in numerous prosecutions of fake military war heroes. But he said what happened in Harrisburg was a shame.
"I think that cop was out of line, approaching him like that with no evidence," Burkett said. "This is an older guy and maybe they didn't dress the same way 50 years ago."
Sterner agreed.
"I'd rather see a dozen phonies get kudos they don't deserve than besmirch the reputation of one innocent veteran," he said. "Even if I see something totally outlandish, I'm not going to jump. ... You don't just go up and confront people."
Ford asked to file a complaint with the Harrisburg Police Department over the way the officer, Detective John O'Connor, treated him. Capt. Deric Moody promised an investigation.
But as of Wednesday night, no one had contacted Ford or apologized to him. Moody told PennLive he still was trying to confirm Ford's military status.
Anthony Flaynik, the commandant of the local detachment of the Marine Corps League, said his group was doing their own investigation into the police department's actions.
"He gives up his time volunteering for honor guard for veteran funerals every three weeks," Flaynik said of Ford. "He comes out in the rain, shine, hot, cold. We need to do what we can to help him."
The incident
Ford has a tradition on Memorial Day. He dons his dress blue uniform, visits the cemetery, plays "Taps" on his bugle in a wreath-laying ceremony along the Susquehanna River, then attends Artsfest, where he looks for presents for his granddaughter.
But this year, as he was perusing the artware, a uniformed officer approached along with a man in civilian clothes.
The officer asked for Ford's unit and his military occupation specialty.
Ford answered and noted he specialized in machine guns, rockets and flame-throwers.
"I have to investigate for 'stolen valor,' " the officer said, which Ford said he found insulting.
Still, Ford let it pass and recommended the officer attend the wreath-laying ceremony next year. The officer simply walked away.
Ford returned to shopping, but 10 minutes later was again confronted by the officer in front of The Patriot-News booth.
"Where did you go to boot camp?" the officer said.
Ford said he couldn't figure out why the officer was questioning his service. Ford hadn't claimed any war heroics and his uniform bore no combat medals.
"What am I trying to do?" Ford said. "Impersonate a lance corporal who never served in combat?"
Things quickly escalated.
"What is your problem?" Ford asked.
The officer reiterated his demand.
Fed up, Ford told the officer to leave him alone in terms that contained an expletive.
That's when the officer started shouting, Ford said.
"You don't know where you went to boot camp," the officer said, according to Ford. "You aren't a Marine."
Ford said the soldier joined in, shouting: "Stolen Valor! This man is a fake!"
Embarrassed, Ford slinked away, but the men followed. When Ford stopped and turned to face them, Ford said the officer waved his hand over his holstered weapon as if he were ready to draw it on Ford.
"I was getting very nervous," Ford said. "I was afraid to reach for my wallet."
A woman working at The Patriot-News booth, who did not want her name published, confirmed Ford's account that the officer followed Ford and yelled that Ford wasn't a Marine.
The woman said the ordeal lasted about 10 to 15 minutes. She described the officer as being antagonistic and said she believed the officer was trying to get Ford to make a move.
Eventually, Ford did retrieve his wallet to show the officer his U.S. Veterans Affairs card. The officer motioned for the soldier to examine it, Ford said.
The soldier concluded that Ford's VA card was a "fake and that anybody can print those out," Ford said.
That's when Ford asked for the officer's supervisor. Ford walked a block or so to meet Capt. Moody, with the officer and soldier trailing.
Moody talked to Ford and inspected his identification cards by holding them up in the air and tilting them, drawing more attention and embarrassing Ford.
The kerfuffle attracted a television news crew.
"People were gawking at the scene," Ford said. "People must have been thinking this was really bad."
Eventually, Moody, also a Marine, reportedly told Ford "it would be best if he just left, to avoid the camera and all the people that were now watching."
Ford refused. He merged back in with the crowd, but noticed the officer lurking nearby, arms folded with his eyes fixed on Ford. Ford said he was disappointed Moody had not instructed the officer to move on.
Ford had hoped Moody would set things right. Instead, Ford said he felt even worse after the encounter.
"I felt their attitude was like, 'So what.' " Ford said. "I've spent almost my whole life working on veterans' issues."
Ford said he has launched programs to help veterans, is active in his local Marine Corp League and occasionally contributes letters about veterans' issues to the Opinion section of The Patriot-News.
Moody said the officer didn't curse nor put his hands on Ford so the incident didn't rise to the level of an internal affairs investigation. Instead, Moody said he was conducting an informal review of the incident.
"There were inconsistencies in his uniform," Moody said of Ford. "If an apology is due, then an apology is due."
Get evidence first
Experts who advocate for veterans and root out military fraud say public humiliation is not the way to go when one suspects something askew about a military uniform.
Older soldiers can forget the proper order of ribbons, but "that doesn't mean they're a phony," said Sterner, who runs a website called Home for Heroes. "Even real heroes make mistakes."
Sterner has accumulated a database of top military war medals as one method to guard against fraudulent claims.
Even with Sterner's background, he said he has only confronted one person in 15 years over "stolen valor" and that's because he knew the names of all the medal recipients for a particular award being claimed.
Sterner recommended that people concerned with military fraud should simply take down a person's information and "get their ducks in a row."
"I'm not going to confront or accost someone," Sterner said. "I'm going to get my evidence first."
Burkett, who lectures FBI agents and government-fraud investigators, advises on his website how people can check their suspicions by requesting the actual military records.
"I'm just surprised at this cop," Burkett said. "Most of the time, a real vet would not do that. ... People should ask questions first, then go check things out later."
http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2015/06/harrisburg_artsfest_veteran_st.html#incart_m-rpt-2
--
An Army soldier attending Artsfest on Memorial Day thought something was fishy with the Marine uniform worn by 75-year-old Robert Ford, who was strolling along Front Street.
Ford's hat bore some wrinkles, according to the soldier's assessment, and his belt buckle looked too ornate for his rank.
The soldier enlisted the help of a Harrisburg police officer working at the event, who was a Marine, and together, they accused Ford of being a fraud.
"He's not a real Marine!" the officer shouted to the crowd gathered for the PennLive/Patriot-News Artsfest of Greater Harrisburg. "Stolen valor!"
"I was humiliated," said Ford, of Marysville.
The only problem is Ford did serve in the Marines from 1958 to 1964. He earned the rank of lance corporal.
"He's as legit as you can get," said Doug Sterner, a Vietnam veteran and archivist from Pueblo, Colo., who is nationally recognized for detecting military fraud. Sterner confirmed Ford's military service this week through Headquarters Marine Corps.
The incident in Harrisburg, Sterner said, represents a troubling trend across the country of veterans becoming vigilantes.
Veterans are angry, Sterner said, after a federal law about "stolen valor," was struck down in 2012 and a meeker version passed in its place. Under the new law, few cases are being investigated or prosecuted against people who falsely claim military awards or service, Sterner said.
"The veteran community, frustrated and upset, is saying, 'OK. We'll do it ourselves,' " Sterner said. "But what it's leading to is a bunch of hot heads. ... There's a lot of bullying going on in the community now. It's almost like hunting game, going out looking for phonies."
In many cases, veterans or others who spot inconsistences are rewarded for their efforts. In Pennsylvania alone, people outed Jim Moats, of Newville, for his fake Navy Seal story; Brian Khan, of Harrisburg, for pretending to be a Marine; and Mark Kauffman, a veteran who's disabled status became an issue in March.
B.G. "Jug" Burkett, a Dallas-area Vietnam veteran who wrote a book entitled, "Stolen Valor," understands why people get upset at fakes who try to gain respect by claiming they served "shoulder to shoulder with those who gave their lives for America."
Burkett has helped in numerous prosecutions of fake military war heroes. But he said what happened in Harrisburg was a shame.
"I think that cop was out of line, approaching him like that with no evidence," Burkett said. "This is an older guy and maybe they didn't dress the same way 50 years ago."
Sterner agreed.
"I'd rather see a dozen phonies get kudos they don't deserve than besmirch the reputation of one innocent veteran," he said. "Even if I see something totally outlandish, I'm not going to jump. ... You don't just go up and confront people."
Ford asked to file a complaint with the Harrisburg Police Department over the way the officer, Detective John O'Connor, treated him. Capt. Deric Moody promised an investigation.
But as of Wednesday night, no one had contacted Ford or apologized to him. Moody told PennLive he still was trying to confirm Ford's military status.
Anthony Flaynik, the commandant of the local detachment of the Marine Corps League, said his group was doing their own investigation into the police department's actions.
"He gives up his time volunteering for honor guard for veteran funerals every three weeks," Flaynik said of Ford. "He comes out in the rain, shine, hot, cold. We need to do what we can to help him."
The incident
Ford has a tradition on Memorial Day. He dons his dress blue uniform, visits the cemetery, plays "Taps" on his bugle in a wreath-laying ceremony along the Susquehanna River, then attends Artsfest, where he looks for presents for his granddaughter.
But this year, as he was perusing the artware, a uniformed officer approached along with a man in civilian clothes.
The officer asked for Ford's unit and his military occupation specialty.
Ford answered and noted he specialized in machine guns, rockets and flame-throwers.
"I have to investigate for 'stolen valor,' " the officer said, which Ford said he found insulting.
Still, Ford let it pass and recommended the officer attend the wreath-laying ceremony next year. The officer simply walked away.
Ford returned to shopping, but 10 minutes later was again confronted by the officer in front of The Patriot-News booth.
"Where did you go to boot camp?" the officer said.
Ford said he couldn't figure out why the officer was questioning his service. Ford hadn't claimed any war heroics and his uniform bore no combat medals.
"What am I trying to do?" Ford said. "Impersonate a lance corporal who never served in combat?"
Things quickly escalated.
"What is your problem?" Ford asked.
The officer reiterated his demand.
Fed up, Ford told the officer to leave him alone in terms that contained an expletive.
That's when the officer started shouting, Ford said.
"You don't know where you went to boot camp," the officer said, according to Ford. "You aren't a Marine."
Ford said the soldier joined in, shouting: "Stolen Valor! This man is a fake!"
Embarrassed, Ford slinked away, but the men followed. When Ford stopped and turned to face them, Ford said the officer waved his hand over his holstered weapon as if he were ready to draw it on Ford.
"I was getting very nervous," Ford said. "I was afraid to reach for my wallet."
A woman working at The Patriot-News booth, who did not want her name published, confirmed Ford's account that the officer followed Ford and yelled that Ford wasn't a Marine.
The woman said the ordeal lasted about 10 to 15 minutes. She described the officer as being antagonistic and said she believed the officer was trying to get Ford to make a move.
Eventually, Ford did retrieve his wallet to show the officer his U.S. Veterans Affairs card. The officer motioned for the soldier to examine it, Ford said.
The soldier concluded that Ford's VA card was a "fake and that anybody can print those out," Ford said.
That's when Ford asked for the officer's supervisor. Ford walked a block or so to meet Capt. Moody, with the officer and soldier trailing.
Moody talked to Ford and inspected his identification cards by holding them up in the air and tilting them, drawing more attention and embarrassing Ford.
The kerfuffle attracted a television news crew.
"People were gawking at the scene," Ford said. "People must have been thinking this was really bad."
Eventually, Moody, also a Marine, reportedly told Ford "it would be best if he just left, to avoid the camera and all the people that were now watching."
Ford refused. He merged back in with the crowd, but noticed the officer lurking nearby, arms folded with his eyes fixed on Ford. Ford said he was disappointed Moody had not instructed the officer to move on.
Ford had hoped Moody would set things right. Instead, Ford said he felt even worse after the encounter.
"I felt their attitude was like, 'So what.' " Ford said. "I've spent almost my whole life working on veterans' issues."
Ford said he has launched programs to help veterans, is active in his local Marine Corp League and occasionally contributes letters about veterans' issues to the Opinion section of The Patriot-News.
Moody said the officer didn't curse nor put his hands on Ford so the incident didn't rise to the level of an internal affairs investigation. Instead, Moody said he was conducting an informal review of the incident.
"There were inconsistencies in his uniform," Moody said of Ford. "If an apology is due, then an apology is due."
Get evidence first
Experts who advocate for veterans and root out military fraud say public humiliation is not the way to go when one suspects something askew about a military uniform.
Older soldiers can forget the proper order of ribbons, but "that doesn't mean they're a phony," said Sterner, who runs a website called Home for Heroes. "Even real heroes make mistakes."
Sterner has accumulated a database of top military war medals as one method to guard against fraudulent claims.
Even with Sterner's background, he said he has only confronted one person in 15 years over "stolen valor" and that's because he knew the names of all the medal recipients for a particular award being claimed.
Sterner recommended that people concerned with military fraud should simply take down a person's information and "get their ducks in a row."
"I'm not going to confront or accost someone," Sterner said. "I'm going to get my evidence first."
Burkett, who lectures FBI agents and government-fraud investigators, advises on his website how people can check their suspicions by requesting the actual military records.
"I'm just surprised at this cop," Burkett said. "Most of the time, a real vet would not do that. ... People should ask questions first, then go check things out later."
http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2015/06/harrisburg_artsfest_veteran_st.html#incart_m-rpt-2
Posted in these groups: 
Stolen Valor
Stolen Valor
Posted 9 y ago
Responses: 147
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"Ford said the soldier joined in, shouting: "Stolen Valor! This man is a fake!""
Unacceptable conduct. What happened to command presence? This looks more like he's trying to stir up a lynch-mob.
Unacceptable conduct. What happened to command presence? This looks more like he's trying to stir up a lynch-mob.
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SGT Glenn E Moody
SMSgt Lawrence McCarter - same thing here I have had 2 sets of veterans plates when I got a new car I wanted new plates for it they made me go home and get my DD214 I said why I already have had 2 sets of veterans plates before one I turned in the other was still active it didn't matter go get my DD214 now 2 weeks before MA REG started putting Veteran on our driver lic. I renewed mine then after the 2 weeks I asked if I could get Veteran on my lic they told me the same thing I needed to bring in my DD214 again luck I had it in my car I do a lot of veterans things so I have my paper work with me I don't have A military ID so to get on base I show my DD214 even with all my veteran membership cards American Legion 26th YANKEE INFANTRY DIVISION 101st INFANTRY VETERAN ASSOC. & NATIONAL INFANTRY ASSOC. sometimes they wont let me on base so I have to have someone with A retired military ID to get on base or sometimes with my DD214 they just changed for the National Guard to get limited Veterans status like on your driver lic and get plates no medical no military ID so no VA card the only other ID that works like at homedepot but lowes I brought my DD214 in so now I just give my phone # to get the 10% veterans discount
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SGT John Graham
1SG (Join to see) I agree completely. In my career I went from the bottom to the top. In doing so I attained Master Police Officer certification. The Chief needs to be a boss in action not just title.
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SGT John Graham
LCpl Donald Friend The bias in the article is apparent. However, the actions and potential misconduct of the Detective (?) and the perceived malfeasance/ omission of duty by the Capitan are not in accordance with standards. At the very least a full public apology is deserved.
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What a POS, both the cop and the Army veteran.
If I were there I would have come to the Marine's aid and defended him. There's a difference between stolen valor and not remembering every little detail about how to properly wear your uniform after 50 years!
If I were there I would have come to the Marine's aid and defended him. There's a difference between stolen valor and not remembering every little detail about how to properly wear your uniform after 50 years!
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SFC Richard Hart
I was given a hard time when someone asked me where I took basic training quite a few years ago. I took basic training at Fort Campbell (no longer happens there) and my AIT was at Fort Ord., CA doesn't exist any more. Unless some of these soldiers, Airmen, seamen and marines were around 50 years ago they will not know what happened where. I keep thinking about all the different uniforms that I wore throughout my career. Any one for Khaki's? how about the lime green shirt worn with or with out the class A's. Our Class A's were a dark green and not the Dress Blue's that are worn as class A's today. I have been retired long enough that people who joined after I retired are retiring already. How can anyone of them possible know what was the proper uniform during my tours of service or which installation I served at. I recently joined a site called together we served, when I tried to input my assignments many of the units no longer exist, having been renamed, deactivated etc. Remember that old saying we used to have "innocent until proven guilty" Now a days its guilty even if you can eventually prove yourself innocent. When you do prove yourself authorized to wear what you have, the damage is done no one remembers the part where you showed you were authorized that uniform they only remember you being called out. Point to remember is how would you feel if someone did that to your family member or even yourself?
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PO2 Whitney Mulberry-Chaplin
SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
I've had to Google the correct ribbon/medal line up a few times. Once you get past 2 or 3 and add 25 yrs the order escapes your tired mind. There's no shame in double checking your rigging before heading out in public for any event.
Funny thing: I still get on my adult kids about their "gig line" I can't stand to see belt buckle And buttons all over the place. Old habits.
I've had to Google the correct ribbon/medal line up a few times. Once you get past 2 or 3 and add 25 yrs the order escapes your tired mind. There's no shame in double checking your rigging before heading out in public for any event.
Funny thing: I still get on my adult kids about their "gig line" I can't stand to see belt buckle And buttons all over the place. Old habits.
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PO2 Whitney Mulberry-Chaplin
SFC Richard Hart
We had an ordinance Chief so E-7 who wore "greens" as a daily working uniform. I'd never seen Navy wear these before. I was a boot...new to it all. It has something to do with Aviation and Ordinance. I'd have to look up regs to quote anything. This was 1986 in Lemoore CA. Huge Air base at one time. Idk what they have now. So many bases are closed out there now.
We had an ordinance Chief so E-7 who wore "greens" as a daily working uniform. I'd never seen Navy wear these before. I was a boot...new to it all. It has something to do with Aviation and Ordinance. I'd have to look up regs to quote anything. This was 1986 in Lemoore CA. Huge Air base at one time. Idk what they have now. So many bases are closed out there now.
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SGT Glenn E Moody
yes I agree what if they saw me out in my uniform no rank on it American Legion patches on the color & a sholder patch my name tapes US ARMY infantry rifle black polished boots & legion on my cover 1981 to 1987 BDU'S some times with the new tan boot's or my dress veterans uniform white shirt black or dark blue pants with all the bling ribbons weapon badges name tag me & the MA GOVERNOR at the first muster in SALEM MA ware it all began the nations first military force 1635 to date I bring the COLORS to this muster every year in APRIL
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Too insult this man and reduce his selfless service to that likened to a thief is ridiculous! However, I am sure this happens much more frequently than we know about, the one thing we learn as Sailors, Soldiers, Airmen, Marines and Coast Guardsmen is to be humble servants, humble servants to our country. Most of us will not boast of our service or brag about our accomplishments and for that reason, during that occasion which might motivate those that served before us to wear something patriotic, it is sure to catch the attention, and ire of the non hacker that will try to tear you down!
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SGT Jim Humphrey
Everyone needs to chill out. Spend some time talking with the veteran before one calls a cop. This all could have been avoided with a conversation. You can quickly figure out his status.
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TSgt David Wittich
SGT Jim Humphrey - I may be wrong but I got the distinct impression that the cop, especially, was looking to start some sort of incident. Hovering your hand over your service weapon, if nothing else, is quite aggressive - possibly bordering on assault, definitely a threat. L.Corporal Ford was faced with the distinct possibility that, when he reached for his ID, he was going to be shot.
The cop was wrong, probably leading to discipline/reprimand IF the matter is ever actually pursued within the police dept, and he owes LCpl Ford a PUBLIC apology.
The original soldier also needs a bit of discipline/reprimand for his public attitude.
The cop was wrong, probably leading to discipline/reprimand IF the matter is ever actually pursued within the police dept, and he owes LCpl Ford a PUBLIC apology.
The original soldier also needs a bit of discipline/reprimand for his public attitude.
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COL Jon Lopey
CSM: Well said - Thank you! We should be humble servants and we need to remember some veterans may not look the part but they may be a heavily-decorated veteran of the highest order. I have seen some former Rangers, Special Forces Soldiers, and Marines from long ago that are not as lean and not as mean as they use to be but nevertheless, they earned their awards, badges, decorations, and rank even though they may not necessarily fit in their old uniform or remember every rule or regulation pertaining to uniforms, ribbons, badges, etc. I once saw a rather small, slight-of-build officer at Fort Bragg wearing a Class B uniform. He had graying hair and my first thought was that he was a non-combatant but he turned around and he was a former Special Forces hero from Viet Nam and he was wearing ribbons and badges with a light blue-colored ribbon with white stars on top - The Congressional Medal of Honor. Some men and women didn't think Audie Murphy was a very imposing figure of a man either (He was something like 115 pounds when he joined the Army after being rejected by the Marines and Navy) but he was reportedly the most-decorated Soldier of WW II (3rd ID). Thanks, COL L
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SFC (Join to see)
Sadly, from what I've seen people who attempt to accuse stolen valor were not much in the military anyway and feel like bullying others enhances their lack of accolades in the military. 10 years retired and have a military retired ID, that's it. I used to have a veterans plate but the extra cost to me was pointless. I know what I did during my military career and don't care if anyone else did/does.
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