Posted on May 28, 2015
SSgt Security Forces
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I have noticed through the years of being in the Air Force (Security Forces member here) that most people in the Air Force are clueless when it comes to M-4/M-16/M-9. This is outrageous! What are they supposed to do if the enemy comes knocking on our door step and everyone needs to fight. I have taught classes on the M-4 with communication airmen and have seen them completely mess up clearing out the weapon, loading it (magazine upside down or rounds the wrong way), and just completely incapable of achieving a zero on target after four rounds of firing. I am a big fan of how the Army and Marines teach that your are always a rifleman first. It almost seems like some of the Airmen don't expect to carry a weapon (ummmm why did you join the military in the first place)? I wish the Air Force would pick up on this to make us a more combat ready force. But, enough of me what are your thoughts?
Edited >1 y ago
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SMSgt Operations Superintendent
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The Air Force was never intended to be a ground fighting unit. Back in the day, AF bases were protected by Army units for that very same reason. The ground fighting component of the AF is SF. Among our many duties, being the infantry of the AF is one of them. I started my military career in the Army and I will tell you that the AF as a whole was never designed to operate like the Army or Marines. The culture is completely different, and for good reason. The AF could not operate under the same culture as the Army or Marines. In SF, weapons are a tool for us. For the majority of the AF, a weapon is not a tool that they use in their day to day duties. ANd frankly, it should not be. I used to be CATM, and I can tell you that keeping an M-4 away from most AF members is a good thing.
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SSG Samuel Kermon
SSG Samuel Kermon
26 d
Sir, with respect, teach them! "Back in the day" the Air Force was in the back areas. Today's asymmetrical warfare shows the enemy is, many times, inside the wire.
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SSG Samuel Kermon
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Maj Wayne Crist
Maj Wayne Crist
25 d
Cpl Howard Dingman - Te job of an airmen shot down is to evade and escape not play John Wayne.
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SGT Wheeled Vehicle Mechanic
SGT (Join to see)
20 d
If I can teach a 18 year old fresh out of basic how to properly handle an M4, then there is no reason people in the Air Force can't figure it out. Sounds like your trainers could use some training.
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PO1 John Miller
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Real_firefight
Completely in jest. I have seen people in all branches who should be permanently downloaded (having their weapons privileges revoked).
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Lt Col Stephen Wood
Lt Col Stephen Wood
1 mo
Hmm...well, I "qualified" as "expert" on pistol and rifle, as an airman (I know, scary thought). And unlike my marine BIA, I can use iron sights, I don't need an ACOG. :-) My firearm of choice though...and I'm VERY good with it...it's the M61. I'm a frickin wizard with that jewel!
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PO1 Kevin Dougherty
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MSgt Beverly Chmelik
MSgt Beverly Chmelik
25 d
SGM Frank Marsh - Never earned any of those except for the divorce one.
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SGM Frank Marsh
SGM Frank Marsh
24 d
MSgt Beverly Chmelik - got that one myself, LOL
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Col Joseph Lenertz
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Everyone sees things through their own experiences. If I were an AF Security Forces officer, I might share your opinion. As a pilot, I was required to qualify annually on my assigned personal weapon, the M-9, because aircrew members deploy more than other AF personnel. So far that makes sense. So why not go to the much bigger effort and expense of making us like the Army or Marine Corps and force every Airman to qualify annually? To put it as simply as possible, because there is a fixed amount of time and money, and there isn't an Air Force base in Afghanistan or Iraq or anywhere else we fight. When deployed, we generally either to deploy to large Airbases in-country with our Army, Navy, and Marine brethren (who are responsible to protect the base) or out-of-country where the threat is much lower (SA, Qatar, Bahrain, etc). I know there are exceptions, especially for our Special Forces community...but then they are qualified on their personal weapons, aren't they? In order to be the best at Our Job as Airmen, we spend our time and money on training aircrew, mechanics, and all the other support functions necessary to keep airpower supporting the Joint Force Commander. If we spent lots of time and money to be like the Army and the Marines, we would be better infantrymen but worse airmen.
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Col Joseph Lenertz
Col Joseph Lenertz
23 d
Capt Mark Miller - Yes, and that additional training is justified for them. And all deploying personnel should be qualified in their assigned small arms, but not necessarily to the level of a marine "rifleman". Not justified for any AFSCs that do not deploy. The question at top referred to ALL members of the AF.
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SPC Earl Semler
SPC Earl Semler
23 d
Col Joseph Lenertz - As long as they are joint bases with infantry on the lines and SPs and other forces as reactionary forces able to get to the scene quickly I don't see the same issue we encountered in Vietnam, especially during the 68 Tet Offensive.
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Capt Mark Miller
Capt Mark Miller
22 d
Col Joseph Lenertz - There is one additional plus. You instill a bit more of the Warrior Mentality in the average Combat Support Person. 30 years in Law Enforcement in hairy situation, it justifies some additional training time.
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LCpl Troy Gwyn
LCpl Troy Gwyn
5 d
Limited money... Lord knows the Chair Force needs it's $2000 toilet seats.
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