Chaplain
Chaplain
Posted on Jun 6, 2018
How would you respond if a soldier used their religion as a reason to take unapproved days off from work?
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So my supervisor mentioned to me that one of our soldiers simply called in today to let him know that he is simply taking the day off today or tomorrow because he is a 7th Day Adventist. We are actually in the middle of an exercise. He didn't really know how to react to the phone call. Curious to hear what your thoughts would be. Aren't they able to have a Chaplain come wherever we are no matter the time? We are on night shift (1800-0600). I'm a Christian as well (Roman Catholic) who tries to go to church every Sunday, but I don't just call in trying to take the entire day off for religious reasons during an exercise. Thoughts?
Religion
Chaplain
Duty
Edited 6 y ago
Posted 6 y ago
Responses: 89
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Disclaimer: I am not an internet 7th Day Adventist, and I did not stay in a Holiday Inn last night.
1) If you know you want a day off, when the unit is working, you don't call in the day of... You let the command know somewhere in the neighborhood of 30 days out, ESPECIALLY if there is a field exercise. Call-ins are for unknowns (I've just been in a collision and am on the way to the Emergency Room... or My wife is in labor...) I don't care who or what you are.
2) 7th Day Adventists observe the Sabbath from sunset Friday evening until sunset Saturday evening. Your post is dated Jun 6th, a Wednesday. Nor does the 7th Day Adventist church have a holiday on June 6th. If the soldier is claiming sabbath or holiday observance, he is not being truthful. If it was in observance of the Sabbath that the conflict arose, where was this soldier on every other Seventh Day Adventist Sabbath. Surely this cannot be the first time a conflict arose.
2a) Has the Soldier claimed a dietary accommodation? As 7th Day Adventists have strict dietary prohibitions, very similar to strict observance of the kosher diet amongst orthodox Jews. If not why not.
2b) What religion is documented in the soldiers Service Record Book (SRB)? If this is a recent conversion, the soldier should meet with the command and layout any religious accomodations required. Those accommodations should be run by the nearest 7th Day Adventist Chaplain or in the absence, an ordained minister of a local 7th Day Adventist Church.
3) The 7th Day Adventist Church feels that military service is incompatible with church dogma and doctrine, but recognizes that it is a personal choice. That said, the church strongly encourages that a military calling be answered as a non-combatant (medic, chaplain, etc.)
Never happened to me, but I heard from the third toilet on the left, that false claims of religious accommodation can run through a unit like crap through a goose. This case needs to be run down. If it is valid, the Command and the soldier need to determine if the soldier's continued military service is in the Army's and the soldiers best interests. If the claim is false... the soldier needs to be crucified on the road to Rome.
1) If you know you want a day off, when the unit is working, you don't call in the day of... You let the command know somewhere in the neighborhood of 30 days out, ESPECIALLY if there is a field exercise. Call-ins are for unknowns (I've just been in a collision and am on the way to the Emergency Room... or My wife is in labor...) I don't care who or what you are.
2) 7th Day Adventists observe the Sabbath from sunset Friday evening until sunset Saturday evening. Your post is dated Jun 6th, a Wednesday. Nor does the 7th Day Adventist church have a holiday on June 6th. If the soldier is claiming sabbath or holiday observance, he is not being truthful. If it was in observance of the Sabbath that the conflict arose, where was this soldier on every other Seventh Day Adventist Sabbath. Surely this cannot be the first time a conflict arose.
2a) Has the Soldier claimed a dietary accommodation? As 7th Day Adventists have strict dietary prohibitions, very similar to strict observance of the kosher diet amongst orthodox Jews. If not why not.
2b) What religion is documented in the soldiers Service Record Book (SRB)? If this is a recent conversion, the soldier should meet with the command and layout any religious accomodations required. Those accommodations should be run by the nearest 7th Day Adventist Chaplain or in the absence, an ordained minister of a local 7th Day Adventist Church.
3) The 7th Day Adventist Church feels that military service is incompatible with church dogma and doctrine, but recognizes that it is a personal choice. That said, the church strongly encourages that a military calling be answered as a non-combatant (medic, chaplain, etc.)
Never happened to me, but I heard from the third toilet on the left, that false claims of religious accommodation can run through a unit like crap through a goose. This case needs to be run down. If it is valid, the Command and the soldier need to determine if the soldier's continued military service is in the Army's and the soldiers best interests. If the claim is false... the soldier needs to be crucified on the road to Rome.
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SGT (Join to see)
SPC Janet Roush - Sure your not thinking about Jehovah witness's? I was raised 7th Day Adventist and we did not put restrictions on service to our country.
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Maj John Bell
SGT (Join to see) -
I repeat my original comment with capitalization to help.
"3) The 7th Day Adventist Church feels that military service is incompatible with church dogma and doctrine, BUT RECOGNIZES THAT IT IS A PERSONAL CHOICE. That said, the church STRONGLY ENCOURAGES that a military calling be answered as a non-combatant (medic, chaplain, etc.)"
http://perspectives.adventist.org/en/questions-answers/questions/go/2016-11-18/should-adventists-serve-in-the-military/
I repeat my original comment with capitalization to help.
"3) The 7th Day Adventist Church feels that military service is incompatible with church dogma and doctrine, BUT RECOGNIZES THAT IT IS A PERSONAL CHOICE. That said, the church STRONGLY ENCOURAGES that a military calling be answered as a non-combatant (medic, chaplain, etc.)"
http://perspectives.adventist.org/en/questions-answers/questions/go/2016-11-18/should-adventists-serve-in-the-military/
Should Adventists serve in the military?
Q: Should Adventists go to war to defend their countries, including bearing arms? If not, what is the difference between these wars, and the wars of the people of Israel in the Old Testament?—Marlon, ...
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SPC Thomas Smith
Well I have been out for thirty years but I liked the way the military handle things when I was in. It was voluntary army and therefore you excepted the needs of the army over your own if you wanted to join. One set of rules for everyone. If you could not follow your religious beliefs outside of work you did not have them. How did my Sargent use to tell me. You belong to the army now. Not the army serves you
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MSG Reid Zohfeld
I am a old Army MSGT and I would have a conversation with this troop or should I say a one way conversation (wall to wall counseling)
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As a former commander, this is unacceptable. You cannot make that decision on the spur of the moment. I always arranged ahead of time when I needed to be away for religious reasons and all my troops did the same. Sometimes you can't take off, then you do the best you can, where you are.
SGM Bill Frazer Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth MAJ James Woods Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen LTC John Shaw SGT (Join to see) SPC Douglas Bolton Capt (Join to see) CPT Don Kemp MSgt Don Dobbs Maj William W. 'Bill' Price Maj Bill Smith, Ph.D. MSgt Robert "Rock" Aldi CMSgt (Join to see) Col Robert Wallace Col Joseph Lenertz Lt Col Jim Coe TSgt Joe C. SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL
SGM Bill Frazer Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth MAJ James Woods Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen LTC John Shaw SGT (Join to see) SPC Douglas Bolton Capt (Join to see) CPT Don Kemp MSgt Don Dobbs Maj William W. 'Bill' Price Maj Bill Smith, Ph.D. MSgt Robert "Rock" Aldi CMSgt (Join to see) Col Robert Wallace Col Joseph Lenertz Lt Col Jim Coe TSgt Joe C. SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL
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Maj Marty Hogan Lt Col Charlie Brown 1stSgt Glenn Brackin SGM Erik Marquez MAJ James Woods COL Mikel J. Burroughs
I would let him know that he has an expectation to be on duty unless otherwise previously approved by me. Otherwise he is AWOL and possible failure to go. I would let him know if he didn’t report for duty there would be consequences. Religious accommodation is worked in concert with the mission and is a commanders decision and at the Commanders discretion. If he would have brought it to me in advance I would have heard him out, conferred with the Chaplains, and if possible and it met the regulations and it DID NOT impact the mission I might let him have it but you just don’t not show up for work and claim religious accommodation the day of without prior coordination. I would probably see to it that he has all the time he needs for his religious accommodation as a civilian.
I would let him know that he has an expectation to be on duty unless otherwise previously approved by me. Otherwise he is AWOL and possible failure to go. I would let him know if he didn’t report for duty there would be consequences. Religious accommodation is worked in concert with the mission and is a commanders decision and at the Commanders discretion. If he would have brought it to me in advance I would have heard him out, conferred with the Chaplains, and if possible and it met the regulations and it DID NOT impact the mission I might let him have it but you just don’t not show up for work and claim religious accommodation the day of without prior coordination. I would probably see to it that he has all the time he needs for his religious accommodation as a civilian.
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CPT Robert Kennedy
This is why we have Chaplains, they go to the field as. As already stated this is not a sabbath day. The chaplains job is to provide or perform service out in the field, if they know in advance of the need. Regulations and the law say a soldier is to get a religious service at least once a week. However, 7th day adventist are lumped together with other Protestants and do not get a whole day dedicated to just their group.
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SPC Thomas Smith
I would like to point out one thing in this response. The person making it is or has been a commander and uses the statement "I" repeatedly. Hat is because it is the commander that makes that decision
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Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth
SPC Thomas Smith - You are correct...commander twice at different levels. However, I would not have made that decision in a vacuum. I would have gotten counsel form the JAG, Chaplains, and especially from my NCO's...they know the personnel and the unit better than I would ever have.
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SGT James Woodruff
Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth - A smart man uses the resources around him to his advantage. Well versed!
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