Posted on May 19, 2017
Can you be barred if you are not ready for the SGT promotion board?
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One of my soliders went to a SOM board in hopes of being ready to go to the monthly promotion board. The SM received a No-Go. The 1SG sitting in told them they had 5 days to retrain and attend the secondary SOM board. If SM receives a second No-Go they were threatened with a Bar to reenlist, as well as declining an EFMP initiated PCS due to Health concerns. Is this possible or is it an IG issue
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Promotion Board
Promotion Board
Posted 7 y ago
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While I don't agree, and believe it to be an intimidation tactic, I also don't know the Soldier and everything surrounding their situation. However, for the sake of knowledge, I've attached a screenshot from AR 601-280, pertaining to Bar to Reenlistment. Read Chapter 8, but particularly the last sentence of Paragraph 8-4a, as well as all of 8-4d(1) through 8-4d(19)(f). Commanders CAN Bar a Soldier for basically anything, with a few exceptions.
While the 1SG isn't the commander, they are the Commander's senior enlisted advisor, and can make strong recommendations for action.
I say all of this to say, do an HONEST assessment of your Soldier, and have him do the same. If it was truly an unwarranted threat against a documented average to stellar Soldier, then pursue IG for clarification. However, if your Soldier is honestly ate up, and you are trying to defend him on the idea of technical "wrongness" by the 1SG, then your time would be better used helping him fix his deficiencies.
That's just my take on it. It's his career, he should do what's best for his future goals.
While the 1SG isn't the commander, they are the Commander's senior enlisted advisor, and can make strong recommendations for action.
I say all of this to say, do an HONEST assessment of your Soldier, and have him do the same. If it was truly an unwarranted threat against a documented average to stellar Soldier, then pursue IG for clarification. However, if your Soldier is honestly ate up, and you are trying to defend him on the idea of technical "wrongness" by the 1SG, then your time would be better used helping him fix his deficiencies.
That's just my take on it. It's his career, he should do what's best for his future goals.
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SFC (Join to see)
I just realized that is a bad screenshot. Not sure why the quality degraded from my phone. For the sake of futures search results, I'll update the image.
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Hells no they can't BAR someone for not passing a SOM board. They can certainly keep them from going to promotion boards, but not BAR someone. And yes, I would say this sounds like an IG complaint.
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MAJ (Join to see)
Two confusing things was this a Soldier of the Month Board or a promotion board? Commanders may bar to reenlist for lack of potential for promotion, so yes they could be flagged for failing a promotion board, but not a SOM board.
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MSG (Join to see)
MAJ (Join to see) - That's what I was thinking, Sir. Barring someone from re-enlistment for NO-GOs at a SOM board just does NOT sound kosher.
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No. They can't do that. I have never heard of someone being barred to reenlist because they didn't pass two Soldier of the Month boards in a row. Those aren't even requirements per AR 600-8-19 to go to a promotion board. Do you mean a compassionate reassignment? Was the compassionate already approved?
Have you talked to your chain of command? This doesn't sound right at all. If that soldier is in the primary zone, they have to get counseled monthly as to why they aren't going to the promotion board.
That just doesn't sound right. I just glanced in AR 600-8-19. Can a unit say you have to pass a SOM board before you can go to the promotion board? Yeah. But I don't think they can do a bar to reenlist when you aren't flagged for UCMJ or APFT or weight failure. That sounds shady.
Have you talked to your chain of command? This doesn't sound right at all. If that soldier is in the primary zone, they have to get counseled monthly as to why they aren't going to the promotion board.
That just doesn't sound right. I just glanced in AR 600-8-19. Can a unit say you have to pass a SOM board before you can go to the promotion board? Yeah. But I don't think they can do a bar to reenlist when you aren't flagged for UCMJ or APFT or weight failure. That sounds shady.
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SGM Erik Marquez
"No. They can't do that. I have never heard of someone being barred to reenlist because they didn't pass two Soldier of the Month boards in a row."
Please cite the regulation that prohibits the commander from barring to reenlist a SM who fails to professionally present them selfs with knowledge, appearance, attitude? (also know as SOM board failure)
That that those failure are only observed because th SM put them self in the spot light at a SOM board has no relevance. http://www.apd.army.mil/epubs/DR_pubs/DR_a/pdf/web/r601_280.pdf
Reason for a commander to bar a SM from reenlistment..(note, this is not an all inclusive list, just examples"
d. Soldiers against whom a bar to reenlistment may be initiated. Soldiers may be barred from reenlistment for one
or a combination of the below listed infractions or reasons. This listing provides examples of the rationale for the
imposition of a bar and is not intended to be all-inclusive.
NOTE 2" #4, 5, 11, 16, 17, 18, 19b, c&f
all are possible observations based on a poor performance at a SOM board.
Examples are—
(1) Lateness to formations, details, or assigned duties.
(2) AWOL for 1- to 24-hour periods.
(3) Losses of clothing and equipment.
(4) Substandard personal appearance.
(5) Substandard personal hygiene.
(6) Continuous indebtedness, reluctance to repay, or late payments.
(7) Article 15(s).
(8) Frequent traffic violations.
(9) An excessive number of sick calls without medical justification.
(10) Lateness returning from pass or leave
(11) Cannot follow orders; shirks responsibilities; takes too much time; is recalcitrant.
(12) Cannot train for a job; apathetic; disinterested.
(13) Cannot adapt to military life; uncooperative; involved in frequent difficulties with fellow Soldiers.
(14) Failure to manage personal, marital, or Family affairs. This includes failure to respond to duty requirements
because of parenthood or custody of dependents (minor or adult).
(15) Causes trouble in the civilian community.
(16) Personal behavior brings discredit upon his or her unit or the Army.
(17) Failure to achieve individual weapons qualification.
(18) Failure to pass the record APFT.
(19) Noncompetitive for promotion.
(a) Slow rank progression resulting from a pattern of marginal conduct or performance.
(b) No demonstrated potential for future service (repeated counseling statements or other indicators).
(c) No demonstrated ability to keep pace with others of the same CMF.
(d) Declines attendance in professional development courses.
(e) Not recommended for promotion by unit commander.
(f) Lack of potential to become a supervisor or senior technician
Please cite the regulation that prohibits the commander from barring to reenlist a SM who fails to professionally present them selfs with knowledge, appearance, attitude? (also know as SOM board failure)
That that those failure are only observed because th SM put them self in the spot light at a SOM board has no relevance. http://www.apd.army.mil/epubs/DR_pubs/DR_a/pdf/web/r601_280.pdf
Reason for a commander to bar a SM from reenlistment..(note, this is not an all inclusive list, just examples"
d. Soldiers against whom a bar to reenlistment may be initiated. Soldiers may be barred from reenlistment for one
or a combination of the below listed infractions or reasons. This listing provides examples of the rationale for the
imposition of a bar and is not intended to be all-inclusive.
NOTE 2" #4, 5, 11, 16, 17, 18, 19b, c&f
all are possible observations based on a poor performance at a SOM board.
Examples are—
(1) Lateness to formations, details, or assigned duties.
(2) AWOL for 1- to 24-hour periods.
(3) Losses of clothing and equipment.
(4) Substandard personal appearance.
(5) Substandard personal hygiene.
(6) Continuous indebtedness, reluctance to repay, or late payments.
(7) Article 15(s).
(8) Frequent traffic violations.
(9) An excessive number of sick calls without medical justification.
(10) Lateness returning from pass or leave
(11) Cannot follow orders; shirks responsibilities; takes too much time; is recalcitrant.
(12) Cannot train for a job; apathetic; disinterested.
(13) Cannot adapt to military life; uncooperative; involved in frequent difficulties with fellow Soldiers.
(14) Failure to manage personal, marital, or Family affairs. This includes failure to respond to duty requirements
because of parenthood or custody of dependents (minor or adult).
(15) Causes trouble in the civilian community.
(16) Personal behavior brings discredit upon his or her unit or the Army.
(17) Failure to achieve individual weapons qualification.
(18) Failure to pass the record APFT.
(19) Noncompetitive for promotion.
(a) Slow rank progression resulting from a pattern of marginal conduct or performance.
(b) No demonstrated potential for future service (repeated counseling statements or other indicators).
(c) No demonstrated ability to keep pace with others of the same CMF.
(d) Declines attendance in professional development courses.
(e) Not recommended for promotion by unit commander.
(f) Lack of potential to become a supervisor or senior technician
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SFC (Join to see)
I read all that...and I fail to see a commander barring a soldier from reenlistment because they failed two SOM boards in a row. Also not the only person to say this...
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SGM Erik Marquez
You and all those other people that say you can't be bared after failing in SOM board are answering with your emotions not with the bigger picture in mind.
It's not SOM failure it's observable demonstrated lack of qualities or inappropriate qualities the commander or his designated representative may be observing during the board. That is justification for the bar to reenlistment.
If the soldier comes in with his uniform a mess failing to render proper position of attention or hand salute doesn't know his chain of command can't answer any MOS related questions doesn't address board members appropriately gets flustered and frustrated easily because of their lack of knowledge those are all good observable justifications for barring a soldier from reenlistment.
Keeping in mind a bar by definition is supposed to be a temporary rehabilitative incentive to correct your feelings not a punitive measurement.
Those that can't see that as the bigger picture have some issues they may want to resolve
It's not SOM failure it's observable demonstrated lack of qualities or inappropriate qualities the commander or his designated representative may be observing during the board. That is justification for the bar to reenlistment.
If the soldier comes in with his uniform a mess failing to render proper position of attention or hand salute doesn't know his chain of command can't answer any MOS related questions doesn't address board members appropriately gets flustered and frustrated easily because of their lack of knowledge those are all good observable justifications for barring a soldier from reenlistment.
Keeping in mind a bar by definition is supposed to be a temporary rehabilitative incentive to correct your feelings not a punitive measurement.
Those that can't see that as the bigger picture have some issues they may want to resolve
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COL William Oseles
SOM is picking the Best Soldier in the Unit at that rank category, and only the Best Soldiers will go before a SOM Board, and a person Flagged for UCMJ, APFT or Weight Actions will not be allowed in front a SOM Board at all.
Nowhere in what I have read here that the individual came in "observable demonstrated lack of qualities or inappropriate qualities the commander or his designated representative may be observing during the board."
They just did not get selected as the Best of the Best.
Sounds like something smells in the 1SG's office.
Nowhere in what I have read here that the individual came in "observable demonstrated lack of qualities or inappropriate qualities the commander or his designated representative may be observing during the board."
They just did not get selected as the Best of the Best.
Sounds like something smells in the 1SG's office.
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