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David Mamet suggests that most political thought (especially on the left) is the reiteration of recognition symbols (i.e. do you agree with me, are you a part of my tribe). He suggests that for discourse to take place you should be able to re-state your opponents views in such a way as he can say to you "Yes those are my views" and he needs to be able to restate your views to you. Only then can true discourse take place. I've seen this phenomenon play out here on Rally Point and in the main stream press time and again this election season.
Political Correctness
Elections
Election 2016
Hillary Clinton
Donald Trump
Posted 8 y ago
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I agree with him about the decline of civil discourse and how to improve it. But I don't buy based on his anecdote that it's somehow an issue unique to liberals. It's a human nature issue. It's hubris. I'm a South Park Republican myself.
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Right Wing propaganda from a Right Wing site using a talented genius who has been sucked in to the Right Wing Propaganda Machine.
I'll start by saying I understand his views and agree with MSgt James Mullis that true discourse requires understanding the other side. But most of us, most of the time, don't care about true discourse. We want to vent, belittle others, sound superior, and hope that people we admire will agree with us. If you think RP is true discourse, you're fooling yourself.
Except for me. I alone can provide true discourse. /ref Trump
I'll start by saying I understand his views and agree with MSgt James Mullis that true discourse requires understanding the other side. But most of us, most of the time, don't care about true discourse. We want to vent, belittle others, sound superior, and hope that people we admire will agree with us. If you think RP is true discourse, you're fooling yourself.
Except for me. I alone can provide true discourse. /ref Trump
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MSgt Mullis - What you wrote is pretty much spot on except that I disagree that it is confined to the left as David Mamet says. As MSG Chris Callan said it is "human nature".
I feel that Mamet is wrong about affirmative action to a point. It's was not originally a question of intelligence but of opportunity. Affirmative action was put in place because in many parts of the nation, racism still prevailed even if it was "closet" racism. College administrators were not blatantly white pointy hat racists but they could easily deny a black person or Hispanic person or Asian or anyone they did not like a chance to attend a university based off of nothing more than their race, yet claim any sort of reason that on the surface sounded reasonable. Affirmative Action was a block against the denial of opportunity.
Today with administrators from a parts of society, it is doubtful that that type of "closet" racism could still occur. This issue today is that primary school education is still segregated but in a much more insidious way. Through fiscal segregation. The funding for schools comes from mainly local and then state funds. The poor and many minorities live in areas that are fiscally poor and therefore can not afford great schools that allow students to truly achieve and earn the grades necessary to attend the best colleges to set themselves up for success. And it is an insidious circle.
Your family is poor so you have trouble getting a great education because you have poorly paid teachers who don't really care. You can't get a well paying job to make your way out of poverty so the family you start is also poor. Your kids attend a school that is not well funded and in turn do not do well, don't go to college and find menial labor. And the cycle of poverty repeats. Along with the associated crime and violence.
So affirmative action has morphed from giving those who achieved a certain standard equal opportunity to attend college regardless of race to a program that allows many who have not achieved a certain standard to attend college because of race due to a lack of equal opportunity in their primary education. It is an unfortunate set of circumstances but one that calls for the continuation of Affirmative Action until fiscal segregation is solved.
Man, I went way off target. sorry about that. I was on a role.
I feel that Mamet is wrong about affirmative action to a point. It's was not originally a question of intelligence but of opportunity. Affirmative action was put in place because in many parts of the nation, racism still prevailed even if it was "closet" racism. College administrators were not blatantly white pointy hat racists but they could easily deny a black person or Hispanic person or Asian or anyone they did not like a chance to attend a university based off of nothing more than their race, yet claim any sort of reason that on the surface sounded reasonable. Affirmative Action was a block against the denial of opportunity.
Today with administrators from a parts of society, it is doubtful that that type of "closet" racism could still occur. This issue today is that primary school education is still segregated but in a much more insidious way. Through fiscal segregation. The funding for schools comes from mainly local and then state funds. The poor and many minorities live in areas that are fiscally poor and therefore can not afford great schools that allow students to truly achieve and earn the grades necessary to attend the best colleges to set themselves up for success. And it is an insidious circle.
Your family is poor so you have trouble getting a great education because you have poorly paid teachers who don't really care. You can't get a well paying job to make your way out of poverty so the family you start is also poor. Your kids attend a school that is not well funded and in turn do not do well, don't go to college and find menial labor. And the cycle of poverty repeats. Along with the associated crime and violence.
So affirmative action has morphed from giving those who achieved a certain standard equal opportunity to attend college regardless of race to a program that allows many who have not achieved a certain standard to attend college because of race due to a lack of equal opportunity in their primary education. It is an unfortunate set of circumstances but one that calls for the continuation of Affirmative Action until fiscal segregation is solved.
Man, I went way off target. sorry about that. I was on a role.
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Capt Michael Greene
Good roll to be on. My view: White people and our government, including lawmakers, spent from 1609 to 1964 actively and officially trying to destroy black people and break up their families. Now, we complain that there is so much crime because their families are broken, and we blame them for it. There needs to be something better, something more effective than Affirmative Action (but AA was a good start).
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Cpl Mark A. Morris
Good read. I don't agree with everything you wrote. But, good read and we'll thought out.
Capt. Green's rant, not so much. White people and our government... Is that all White folks, or just only White folks?
The tone in which that is written, it smells like, it smells like, self hate.
M. Morris RVT
Capt. Green's rant, not so much. White people and our government... Is that all White folks, or just only White folks?
The tone in which that is written, it smells like, it smells like, self hate.
M. Morris RVT
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CDR (Join to see)
Thank you both for your comments and good discourse. I would have to respectfully disagree with you Capt Greene as not all white people and not everyone in the government has had that agenda. Have there been slave owners and racists in congress, the white house, and the supreme court? Absolutely. Have we also had individuals who fought tooth and nail against these racists and slave owners? Yes as well and some, like President Lincoln, paid the ultimate price. For every bad decision the government has made such a separate but equal, we have also corrected our mistakes with brown vs board of education. The Warren courts was 9 white men who decided unanimously that separate but equal was unconstitutional. It's not a perfect government but it is much better than what could have been.
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