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Involuntary versus voluntary mobilization, there's a difference in benefits... 1SG (Join to see)
Pentagon holds GI Bill benefits for reservists
Posted from stripes.com
GI Bill
Benefits
Deployment
Reserves
Posted 8 y ago
Responses: 3
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What is at issue here is the authority under which an RC member is mobilized under Title 10. Most of us that got called up were under PERSCU (Presidential Emergency Reserve Call Up) orders under section 12304(b) authorized by Congress in 2001 and commonly used for ONE, OIF, OEF, and OND. Soldiers mobilized under section 12304(d) were volunteers who in the section of law volunteer to serve on Active Duty in times of national emergency. There are notable differences in the two sections - notably for bean counters is the "pot of money" expended for the Soldiers' pay while mobilized. ADOS and ADSW are often done under 12304(d). Notably for Soldiers is not only that it sometimes does not count for Post-9/11 GI Bill, but also that they will not enjoy the same protections under USERRA for their civilian job when they return from duty.
This is not new. In fact, it goes all the way back to 2001 as an issue, albeit mostly for Guardsmen in the immediate aftermath of the attacks.
What is new is that when Congress passed an extension to PERSCU authority, it directed the Service Secretaries to exercise "discretion" under which authority RC personnel were given orders. The direct effect close to home has shown up in short tours to Eastern Europe under 12304(d).
The moral of the story is READ YOUR ORDERS. Because it matters.
This is not new. In fact, it goes all the way back to 2001 as an issue, albeit mostly for Guardsmen in the immediate aftermath of the attacks.
What is new is that when Congress passed an extension to PERSCU authority, it directed the Service Secretaries to exercise "discretion" under which authority RC personnel were given orders. The direct effect close to home has shown up in short tours to Eastern Europe under 12304(d).
The moral of the story is READ YOUR ORDERS. Because it matters.
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1SG (Join to see)
SFC A.M. Drake - "Title" refers to authority under which the member serves, yes. However, as LTC Stephen B. clarifies above, the subsection pertains to "authority". When a Reserve Soldier is mobilized under 12304(d) and not (b), several different triggers occur, as I point out above.
While the decision to cut orders under which authority is indeed echelons above the service member, it is generally made at the orders issuing authority - in the USAR, a RSC or one of the Specialty Commands like USACAPOC or ENGCOM. This is typically well above a Soldier's reach, but not their commander's. The commander will have regular contact with that echelon during the mobilization process. The one where he/she has the most impact is the JAC, where he/she briefs a GO on their mobilization plan. Funding is a core piece of the JAC, and this kind of stuff does indeed come up there.
However, the biggest thing a Soldier can do is realize that in order to be volunteered under 12304(d), they in fact have to sign something saying they volunteer. When that piece of paper shows up, Caveat Emptor.
While the decision to cut orders under which authority is indeed echelons above the service member, it is generally made at the orders issuing authority - in the USAR, a RSC or one of the Specialty Commands like USACAPOC or ENGCOM. This is typically well above a Soldier's reach, but not their commander's. The commander will have regular contact with that echelon during the mobilization process. The one where he/she has the most impact is the JAC, where he/she briefs a GO on their mobilization plan. Funding is a core piece of the JAC, and this kind of stuff does indeed come up there.
However, the biggest thing a Soldier can do is realize that in order to be volunteered under 12304(d), they in fact have to sign something saying they volunteer. When that piece of paper shows up, Caveat Emptor.
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SMSgt Thor Merich
1SG (Join to see) - Its critical for troops to understand how to read orders. Many do not understand the difference between the different title 10 sections. Back in 2001 (when I was in the Guard), I was verbally ordered to my unit to report for duty "by order of the President." I showed up as we all did. However, we became suspicious when it took over a week to get written orders. When the orders finally arrived, they were for volunteer "man days" and not under the "involuntary" Title 10 section as we were told. Needless to say, we all went home shortly after that. Thirty days later, when real orders arrived, we stayed on Title 10 orders for two years.
Sometimes, unit leaders lie. Its imperative that all Reserve and National Guard soldiers (Airmen, Marines, sailors, etc) know the rules and how it can affect them.
Sometimes, unit leaders lie. Its imperative that all Reserve and National Guard soldiers (Airmen, Marines, sailors, etc) know the rules and how it can affect them.
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LTC Stephen B.
1SG Jerry Healy - What gets me is 12304b is still involuntary. There is a lot of confusion around the various authorities (I made one with regard to 12304(b) and 12304b - two completely different sections of law. There is no 12304d, I believe you were referring to 12301(d) which is voluntary and does not specify a tour length limitation. 12301(a) - War/National Emergency involuntary mobilization and 12301(d) voluntary mobilization are both covered under GI Bill. I was on the periphery of the 12304b deliberations and not once was cost associated with benefits ever discussed. It was all about access after the Middle-East settled down and the AC believed they would no longer have the ability to mobilize RC units.
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****Edited comment below - my original comment references 12304(b) rather than 12304b****
TITLE 10 / Subtitle E / PART II / CHAPTER 1209 / § 12304b
10 USC 12304b: Selected Reserve: order to active duty for preplanned missions in support of the combatant commands
Text contains those laws in effect on November 29, 2016
From Title 10-ARMED FORCES
Subtitle E-Reserve Components
PART II-PERSONNEL GENERALLY
CHAPTER 1209-ACTIVE DUTY
§12304b. Selected Reserve: order to active duty for preplanned missions in support of the combatant commands
(a) Authority.-When the Secretary of a military department determines that it is necessary to augment the active forces for a preplanned mission in support of a combatant command, the Secretary may, subject to subsection (b), order any unit of the Selected Reserve (as defined in section 10143(a) of this title), without the consent of the members, to active duty for not more than 365 consecutive days.
(b) Limitations.+
-(1) Units may be ordered to active duty under this section only if-
---(A) the manpower and associated costs of such active duty are specifically included and identified in the defense budget materials for the fiscal year or years in which such units are anticipated to be ordered to active duty; and
---(B) the budget information on such costs includes a description of the mission for which such units are anticipated to be ordered to active duty and the anticipated length of time of the order of such units to active duty on an involuntary basis.
-(2) Not more than 60,000 members of the reserve components of the armed forces may be on active duty under this section at any one time.
(c) Exclusion From Strength Limitations.-Members ordered to active duty under this section shall not be counted in computing authorized strength in members on active duty or total number of members in grade under this title or any other law.
(d) Notice to Congress.-Whenever the Secretary of a military department orders any unit of the Selected Reserve to active duty under subsection (a), such Secretary shall submit to Congress a report, in writing, setting forth the circumstances necessitating the action taken under this section and describing the anticipated use of such unit.
(e) Termination of Duty.-Whenever any unit of the Selected Reserve is ordered to active duty under subsection (a), the service of all units so ordered to active duty may be terminated-
-(1) by order of the Secretary of the military department concerned; or
-(2) by law.
(f) Relationship to War Powers Resolution.-Nothing contained in this section shall be construed as amending or limiting the application of the provisions of the War Powers Resolution (50 U.S.C. 1541 et seq.).
(g) Considerations for Involuntary Order to Active Duty.-In determining which units of the Selected Reserve will be ordered to duty without their consent under this section, appropriate consideration shall be given to-
-(1) the length and nature of previous service, to assure such sharing of exposure to hazards as national security and military requirements will reasonably allow;
-(2) the frequency of assignments during service career;
-(3) family responsibilities; and
-(4) employment necessary to maintain the national health, safety, or interest.
TITLE 10 / Subtitle E / PART II / CHAPTER 1209 / § 12304b
10 USC 12304b: Selected Reserve: order to active duty for preplanned missions in support of the combatant commands
Text contains those laws in effect on November 29, 2016
From Title 10-ARMED FORCES
Subtitle E-Reserve Components
PART II-PERSONNEL GENERALLY
CHAPTER 1209-ACTIVE DUTY
§12304b. Selected Reserve: order to active duty for preplanned missions in support of the combatant commands
(a) Authority.-When the Secretary of a military department determines that it is necessary to augment the active forces for a preplanned mission in support of a combatant command, the Secretary may, subject to subsection (b), order any unit of the Selected Reserve (as defined in section 10143(a) of this title), without the consent of the members, to active duty for not more than 365 consecutive days.
(b) Limitations.+
-(1) Units may be ordered to active duty under this section only if-
---(A) the manpower and associated costs of such active duty are specifically included and identified in the defense budget materials for the fiscal year or years in which such units are anticipated to be ordered to active duty; and
---(B) the budget information on such costs includes a description of the mission for which such units are anticipated to be ordered to active duty and the anticipated length of time of the order of such units to active duty on an involuntary basis.
-(2) Not more than 60,000 members of the reserve components of the armed forces may be on active duty under this section at any one time.
(c) Exclusion From Strength Limitations.-Members ordered to active duty under this section shall not be counted in computing authorized strength in members on active duty or total number of members in grade under this title or any other law.
(d) Notice to Congress.-Whenever the Secretary of a military department orders any unit of the Selected Reserve to active duty under subsection (a), such Secretary shall submit to Congress a report, in writing, setting forth the circumstances necessitating the action taken under this section and describing the anticipated use of such unit.
(e) Termination of Duty.-Whenever any unit of the Selected Reserve is ordered to active duty under subsection (a), the service of all units so ordered to active duty may be terminated-
-(1) by order of the Secretary of the military department concerned; or
-(2) by law.
(f) Relationship to War Powers Resolution.-Nothing contained in this section shall be construed as amending or limiting the application of the provisions of the War Powers Resolution (50 U.S.C. 1541 et seq.).
(g) Considerations for Involuntary Order to Active Duty.-In determining which units of the Selected Reserve will be ordered to duty without their consent under this section, appropriate consideration shall be given to-
-(1) the length and nature of previous service, to assure such sharing of exposure to hazards as national security and military requirements will reasonably allow;
-(2) the frequency of assignments during service career;
-(3) family responsibilities; and
-(4) employment necessary to maintain the national health, safety, or interest.
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LTC Stephen B.
Title 38-VETERANS' BENEFITS
PART III-READJUSTMENT AND RELATED BENEFITS
CHAPTER 33-POST-9/11 EDUCATIONAL ASSISTANCE
SUBCHAPTER I-DEFINITIONS
§3301. Definitions
In this chapter:
(1) The term "active duty" has the meanings as follows (subject to the limitations specified in sections 3002(6) and 3311(b)):
(A) In the case of members of the regular components of the Armed Forces, the meaning given such term in section 101(21)(A).
(B) In the case of members of the reserve components of the Armed Forces, service on active duty under a call or order to active duty under section 688, 12301(a), 12301(d), 12301(g), 12302, or 12304 of title 10 or section 712 of title 14.
(C) In the case of a member of the Army National Guard of the United States or Air National Guard of the United States, in addition to service described in subparagraph (B), full-time service-
(i) in the National Guard of a State for the purpose of organizing, administering, recruiting, instructing, or training the National Guard; or
(ii) in the National Guard under section 502(f) of title 32 when authorized by the President or the Secretary of Defense for the purpose of responding to a national emergency declared by the President and supported by Federal funds.
PART III-READJUSTMENT AND RELATED BENEFITS
CHAPTER 33-POST-9/11 EDUCATIONAL ASSISTANCE
SUBCHAPTER I-DEFINITIONS
§3301. Definitions
In this chapter:
(1) The term "active duty" has the meanings as follows (subject to the limitations specified in sections 3002(6) and 3311(b)):
(A) In the case of members of the regular components of the Armed Forces, the meaning given such term in section 101(21)(A).
(B) In the case of members of the reserve components of the Armed Forces, service on active duty under a call or order to active duty under section 688, 12301(a), 12301(d), 12301(g), 12302, or 12304 of title 10 or section 712 of title 14.
(C) In the case of a member of the Army National Guard of the United States or Air National Guard of the United States, in addition to service described in subparagraph (B), full-time service-
(i) in the National Guard of a State for the purpose of organizing, administering, recruiting, instructing, or training the National Guard; or
(ii) in the National Guard under section 502(f) of title 32 when authorized by the President or the Secretary of Defense for the purpose of responding to a national emergency declared by the President and supported by Federal funds.
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LTC Stephen B.
Also, 12304b was requested because under 12301 there has to be a declaration of war or national emergency for involuntary call up the reserves, and there was great uncertainty with Iraq "done" and the belief that we were about to be "done" with Afghanistan, the President would not sign PDoEs, leaving active forces to cover all missions world-wide. Army was certain that the ARNG would balk at future voluntary call-us for missions and needed assurance of "accessibility" before agreeing to redistribution of force structure between AC, USAR and ARNG. It was NOT developed as a way to save money, as seen in the above post, 9-11 GI Bill applies to 12304 duty.
Something is wrong in Denmark...
Something is wrong in Denmark...
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LTC Stephen B.
Must edit my own comments, pulled the trigger too soon.
I referenced 12304(b) rather than 12304b - big difference.
12304b. Selected Reserve: order to active duty for preplanned missions in support of the combatant commands
(a) Authority.-When the Secretary of a military department determines that it is necessary to augment the active forces for a preplanned mission in support of a combatant command, the Secretary may, subject to subsection (b), order any unit of the Selected Reserve (as defined in section 10143(a) of this title), without the consent of the members, to active duty for not more than 365 consecutive days
However, this is still an involuntary call to active duty (without consent). Not sure why the Service would claim this isn't covered since 12304 is specifically mentioned...
I referenced 12304(b) rather than 12304b - big difference.
12304b. Selected Reserve: order to active duty for preplanned missions in support of the combatant commands
(a) Authority.-When the Secretary of a military department determines that it is necessary to augment the active forces for a preplanned mission in support of a combatant command, the Secretary may, subject to subsection (b), order any unit of the Selected Reserve (as defined in section 10143(a) of this title), without the consent of the members, to active duty for not more than 365 consecutive days
However, this is still an involuntary call to active duty (without consent). Not sure why the Service would claim this isn't covered since 12304 is specifically mentioned...
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