Posted on Oct 16, 2016
PO1 Leading Petty Officer (Lpo)
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Here's the background. You're a senior E5. Your troops are in formation and you're handing out work for the day. You hand out an assignment to a fresh E2 with less than a year in and only a few months at your command. They blatantly complain and tell you to choose someone else. You calmly tell them they will do this task and they tell you to shove it and give it to someone else. How do you react?
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GySgt Kenneth Pepper
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It must be nipped in the bud quickly and without hesitation. Having had a few minutes to think about it, here goes....
PFC Shitbird and his team leader stand fast. All others fall out and carry on.

Have PFC Dipshit stand by while I ensure his team leader knows what my expectations are; "Instant obedience to lawful orders. Period. Any other answer is unacceptable. The fact that PFC Dipshit thinks it is okay to open his trap is a direct reflection of your leadership. Take a look at how you are leading and determine how this could happen."

To PFC Dipshit; "If you have decided to end your time in the military you have chosen a sure-fire method. If you do not comply with lawful orders, it will eventually end with you on a bus headed for home. But only after spending the next few weeks/months becoming the example of what not to do. If that is what you want, we will go there. If not, get your ass moving on what you were ordered to do."
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LTC Mobilization Planner
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3 mo
Gunny wins.
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AB Edward Mondini
AB Edward Mondini
30 d
Too much talk.........Dipshit’s reply is an automatic kick in the ass out the door.......is the CO going to talk Dipshit to death in a combat zone?
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Sgt Ed Allen
Sgt Ed Allen
28 d
Never had that problem. The Marines under my charge knew what was expected and that there was no discussion. As for that bus ride, it would be after appropriate time in the brig. And suddenly finding out he has lost a few of his rights.
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SGT Mary Martel
SGT Mary Martel
26 d
SSgt Wesley Hunt - Key word there was "we". In the Army E-5 to E-8 is a Sergeant. I understand that you didn't mean any disrespect, neither did the individual you responded to. Each branch has their way of saying things and they don't all say them the same way.
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CPL(P) UH-60 Helicopter Repairer
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Edited >1 y ago
Praise in public, punish in private. "You stand fast after formation." Give him a chance to explain insubordination. Mandatory counseling. If he is defiant in private after getting the chance then burn him. ART15. Sometimes people are defiant because something happened and they feel out of control so they try to take it wherever they can no matter how inappropriate. Sometimes a wife cheated or a parent died. Sometimes the hospital calls and congratulates you on having cancer. To outright burn a Joe without gathering the facts is irresponsible and we would want someone breathing down our neck to take that extra moment to consider what might be going on too. If it's nothing more than attitude and a shitty personality then by all means light that dead Christmas tree and know you probably saved lives downrange.
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SSgt Rifleman
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3 mo
I am completely for getting to the root cause of the issue. However, he is in the military, the United States Military. You know, the country that has been fighting conflicts for the past 18 years. There may be a deeper issue at hand, but there is no excuse whatsoever to openly defy a lawful order in a formation. Punishment in private is not always the proper response. You have to pick and choose that fight. If you have an intrusive leadership style, you should never be caught off guard with situations or personal issue that arise unless the style is not properly used. That intrusive leadership allows you to know your team, squad, or Platoon. That style has a very delicate balance, but done correctly can alleviate a lot of communication problems. Which in turn can reduce the amount of insubordination commonly seen these days in our gun clubs. Some people need to be made an example of. Those people do not belong and slipped through the cracks.

Bottom line, there is no room for this type of behavior, it is a cancer to every organization and needs to be removed immediately in a manner that will shut down most if not all future potential occurrences.
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SrA Chris Forster
SrA Chris Forster
1 mo
I agree with you 99%. It is very situation specific on how to react. Has this troop been a problem before? Has this troop up until now been a model troop that you wish everyone was like? I would definitely pull said troop from formation immediately as to demonstrate that insubordination is taken seriously no matter the circumstances. How it was handled after that however I agree with what you laid out there.
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CPL Michael Moore
CPL Michael Moore
29 d
I disagree you can offer council at the close of business after all missions and tasks have been completed. But while that solder is on Duty he belongs to his leaders.
Insubordination must not and cannot be tolerated. And corrective actions must be backed from the team leader to the Battalion Commander. Lack of discipline is not only disrespectful but deadly.
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MSgt Kerry Lundy
MSgt Kerry Lundy
25 d
When a troop mouths off in formation you make the initial correction on the spot to be followed by the final correction. If he was having personal problems he should have already made some one in his chain aware of them otherwise he faces what is coming to him. I would also be looking at his immediate supervisor/team leader and inquire what led to this breakdown in discipline. If it was me he,his team leader and I would be having a closed door session immediately after formation. Familiarity breeds contempt is just as true today as it was when it was first uttered.
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PO1 David Gibbens
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I can speak from experience on this one. On my first boat( yes I'm a submariner) as an E3 I was made Deck Div LPO, AKA Leading Seaman. While passing out the day's job assignments, I was told "f@#k no" by one of the new seaman. I was shocked to say the least. I went to the 1st LT, a TMCS, and informed him of my situation. He told me in no uncertain terms to take said individual to the back of the work barge and show him the error of his ways. I did so, physically. The young man never questioned me again.
Now, before everyone jumps on me, let me give you my opinion on this matter. This was the late '70s. We were still in the Viet Nam mind set. However; when did the military go from being a gung ho military organization to a job? "Ask him what's wrong". Really?! When you're at 400ft and there's a fire in the Torpedo Room, or you're someplace where people are shooting at you are you really going to take no as an answer?? Or are you going to kick him in his ass, and get him motivated to move in the right direction? I spent 20 years in the Submarine Force and I've seen people come and go. And the ones that went were sent haze gray and underway on surface ships. Which, BTW, was the same as failing. Next time someone tells a senior NCO he doesn't want to do something, point out that the contract he signed doesn't say anything about liking it. He (or she) doesn't have to like it. They just have to do it. STS1(SS) USN, Ret
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AB Edward Mondini
AB Edward Mondini
30 d
There you go! Right answer!
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PO3 Terry Miller
PO3 Terry Miller
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I come from the same era on a destroyer where it would have been handled about the same as you did. Fortunately I never had the problem to have to deal with.
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SGT Mary Martel
SGT Mary Martel
26 d
SP5 Bruce Mori - lmao....my response was, "that little mofo would push until his mouth stopped running"...
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Sgt Ronald Harris
Sgt Ronald Harris
26 d
SGT Mary Martel - Back in the '60's, he'd be shown some "hand to hand combat training", if you get the drift.
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