Posted on Mar 30, 2014
CSM Christopher Irwin
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In my 23 years of service, I have never seen leaders MORE afraid of saying things that could be PERCEIVED as offensive to other Soldiers. Our culture is one of closing with and destroying the enemy; I contend that NO successful Army has ever been so on the basis of being polite to every one and carrying themselves in fear that they might say something that offends a particular group of people. Women, men, LGBT, NAMBLA, NCAAP, unions (sic), etc.

My biggest fear is that, as we move forward our Army becomes weaker. I contend that in order for us to be effective, we need to stop kissing the ass of small groups of people and focus on the masses. I am a realist and believe that until we STOP recognizing people for silly things over which they have no control, (i,e, being black, a female, a Jew, and Muslim, etc.) and make then raise to the level of the Army - cut hair, shave face, no head gear other than what's authorized, no dreadlocks, etc., we can't bring the individuals to the standard vice the other way around. In the USASMA's Academy I was made to stand up and clap for all the females, blacks, etc. These things are NOT due to the influence or successes of the individuals being praised.....Just the color of their skin or their sex. Neither of these things deserve laudatory praise in and of themselves. I contend that we should recognize people NOT because of things they can't control (race and sex), rather because of their accomplishments.

What are your thoughts?
Posted in these groups: Eo logo EOEthnicity logo Ethnicity
Edited 10 y ago
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Responses: 13
LTC Jason Strickland
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Well said!  Everyone is paranoid of a negative response and should instead focus on the content of what they say/do/order/etc.  It's too bad that we've succumbed to the interests of small groups that don't have always have a vested interest in our armed forces...
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SSgt Forensic Meteorological Consultant
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10 y
Reminds me of INSOC in the book 1984.    Confusion and paranoia to some big brother entity.
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CSM Christopher Irwin
CSM Christopher Irwin
10 y
Double-plus good comment comrade!
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CPT Student
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CSM Irwin, 


        I agree with you that the culture of the Army has changed thoroughly, and has bred ultra-sensitive soldiers. I believe that is a result of the American Culture changing to a more liberal mindset, as well as political agendas. For conversation's sake (since everyone is leaning one way, I'll lean the other), I contend that the EO push is not the cause of the Army becoming weaker, rather, I believe it is the inconsistent and low standards to which soldiers are held. A limited example, IET soldiers are only required to achieve a 50% on each event on the APFT to graduate from basic. We literally allowed them to accept failing as an acceptable score. Now we have ultra-sensitive, underachieving, and unmotivated soldier being allowed to progress.  



In some cases, I believe some leaders in the Army have allowed the structure and discipline of the Army to erode. Junior enlisted are graduating from basic not knowing how to act and treat NCOs and Officers. I can't count how many PV1s/PV2s have walked by me and given me the, "what's up nod," instead of a salute and the greeting of the day.   



As seen with any build up of force, standards decline in order to satisfy the numbers. We see now, that standards are starting to become more stringent in light of the draw down. I do not agree with the adjustable standard. If we as an institution set a high standard and push our soldiers to exceed those standards, I am convinced our Army will become as strong, if not stronger than it ever was. 

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SFC Bradley Clark
SFC Bradley Clark
10 y
I totally agree with your words. One should now look at and think about war time training, how many we will lose IF we have to really make our money on the battle field. I strongly believe in we train as we fight. So If you're being super friendly then death is what you see on the field. So yes train these soldiers at all cost.
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SFC James Baber
SFC James Baber
10 y

LT,


I am very surprised to see such an enlightened answer from someone as fresh to the Army as yourself, I mean that in a good way, this is along the lines of another forum discussion we have had about corrective training vs. hazing.


I validated and agreed with just about every old school Soldier on the discussion, but my comments became the attack of many young NCOs who felt I was disparaging them as a generational thing when they took my statement to mean as a whole when I clearly stated that many of the enlistees we received after 9/11 were merely for numbers as much as many were for patriotism, the funny thing was just about every up vote I received was from SMs that had come into the Army prior to the millennium, and every down vote I received was from SMs that came in after OIF had kicked off, not post-9/11, but post-OIF beginning.


It is an interesting thread you should check it out, it is indicative of some of the things you speak of and touch on in relation to what some NCOs are allowing to happen, based on what these young NCOs say to me in what many could deem as disrespect to a senior NCO, I took it in stride and gave back as much as I received, but if I was still in uniform and these NCOs were in my units, they would not be happy campers to say the least, some good counseling would be in the works, and to me good counseling is old school, some of fellow seniors and retirees should know what I am referring too.


https://www.rallypoint.com/answers/corrective-actions-vs-hazing?page=1&urlhash=48179#48179

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CPT Student
CPT (Join to see)
10 y
Thanks SFC Baber. I'll be sure to check it out. 
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PO1 William "Chip" Nagel
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Never been a big fan of the phrase "Politically Correct". Most the time I hear it is when someone wants to Ignore Common Decency and is looking for an excuse, "We are being to Politically Correct" (I want to treat others poorly and I'm looking for an excuse). Sorry I'm not jumping on your Bandwagon.
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CSM Christopher Irwin
CSM Christopher Irwin
10 y
Thank you for the comment but I wholeheartedly disagree. No one wants Carte Blanche on being mean, disrespectful, or rude. However, if we continue to force-feed sensitivity training and recognize people for those things over which the have no control, they will never aspire to do great things. If a young person is constantly receiving praise for doing nothing, what do they expect when they actually DO something. Look at our PT "Max"...270 from 290...look at our award system...everyone receives an award just for deploying. I do appreciate your thoughts and comments though, its always good to hear from the opposite side.
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